Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Where did VG go WRONG, or should say SOE?

The day VG was put in stores was when I got mine. I was so excited that finally a game would be out that had aspects which interested me as a player. Threw out the months of playing many players where starting to leave, and I too was debateing also. VG had promise... it stood a fighting chance, but broken promises once again by SOE broke the straw for many players. For me watching a promising game slip was too much for me to play any longer.

First mistake by SOE when they combined the servers, and 86ed the faction pvp server. Just a reminder SOE your in the business to "aquire" customers, not shove them out the door!

Second not stopping the Gold dupping in time, and instead capping the amount players could have. That totally messed up you economy!

Thrid not taking 3rd party hack, and programs serious untill it was too late.

Fourth laying off half the DEV team when you took over. Smart players know this is always a bad sign, because the chances of things getting fixed or added become lower, or slowed.

Fith is Lore. I mean can anyone tell me WTF is actually going on story wise in VG? You said you hired in someone to address this issue,  but what ever happened?

Sixth delayed features. If your trying to sell a cake make sure it's a cake, and not a pie!

Seven was ever saying you are taking over! Even though you bought out Sigil, it would of been better that you actually "not" announced it. You could of easily bought out Sigil kept taged as such as a subsidiary company, and players would of never knew the diffrence. You saying that you was taking over was like throwing gas on a fire. NGE bring back any memories of what players think of you guys?

The game has promise, and if it ever get the attension it deserves it could be great. I just think  SOE with poor marketing skills, poor management skill (on the corporate level), and misdirection with product development is costing this company more than what the company deserves to be making. Your so lucky I'm not on the board of directors, because I would really be rasing some intresting questions. I mean for God sake have you ever heard of Game Concept Designers, not Programers trying to conceive the game. This is 2008 not 1998 get a clue.

PS. This was going to be your new flagship huh? I'm sure glad I'm not on it because everything you guys have been touching has been turnning into the Titanic latly with the exception of EQ2.

Comments

  • Death1942Death1942 Member UncommonPosts: 2,587

    how do you go from a pie to a cake?  i am pretty sure (from baking many myself) that you cannot possibly make a pie from the ingredients used in a cake...

    MMO wish list:

    -Changeable worlds
    -Solid non level based game
    -Sharks with lasers attached to their heads

  • sephersepher Member Posts: 3,561

    Well there's Sigil's original sin: believing good ideas translate to good game design; rather than basing game design around the staff''s ability to implement those ideas. 



    A first-time MMO development house CEO in-charge of tens of millions of dollars who tasked it to a bunch of first-time industry workers. 



    Everything that's gone wrong and continues to go wrong is a result of that really.

  • ThillianThillian Member UncommonPosts: 3,156
    Originally posted by sepher

    Well there's Sigil's original sin: believing good ideas translate to good game design; rather than basing game design around the staff''s ability to implement those ideas. 



    A first-time MMO development house CEO in-charge of tens of millions of dollars who tasked it to a
    bunch of first-time industry workers



    Everything that's gone wrong and continues to go wrong is a result of that really.



    Can you please name your source?

    REALITY CHECK

  • TorakTorak Member Posts: 4,905

    Shouldn't this go on the "we are mad at SOE" section?

    I love Front 242!

     

    Im rhythmus bleiben!!!!

     

     

  • M1sf1tM1sf1t Member UncommonPosts: 1,583


    Originally posted by Thillian

    Originally posted by sepher
    Well there's Sigil's original sin: believing good ideas translate to good game design; rather than basing game design around the staff''s ability to implement those ideas.

    A first-time MMO development house CEO in-charge of tens of millions of dollars who tasked it to a bunch of first-time industry workers.

    Everything that's gone wrong and continues to go wrong is a result of that really.


    Can you please name your source?


    Go read some of the posts made by former Sigil staff members on the FOH forums. This has been covered already.

    Games I've played/tried out:WAR, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, AoC, EQ1, EQ2, WoW, Vangaurd, FFXI, D&DO, Lineage 2, Saga Of Ryzom, EvE Online, DAoC, Guild Wars,Star Wars Galaxies, Hell Gate London, Auto Assault, Grando Espada ( AKA SoTNW ), Archlord, CoV/H, Star Trek Online, APB, Champions Online, FFXIV, Rift Online, GW2.

    Game(s) I Am Currently Playing:

    GW2 (+LoL and BF3)

  • NasherUKNasherUK Member UncommonPosts: 480

    SOE probably owned it from the start, they just didn't want to admit it because no one trusts them (with good reason).  I guess this is just the final nail in the coffin really :P

  • MuruganMurugan Member Posts: 1,494

     

    Originally posted by M1sf1t


     

    Originally posted by Thillian


    Originally posted by sepher

    Well there's Sigil's original sin: believing good ideas translate to good game design; rather than basing game design around the staff''s ability to implement those ideas.
     
    A first-time MMO development house CEO in-charge of tens of millions of dollars who tasked it to a bunch of first-time industry workers.
    Everything that's gone wrong and continues to go wrong is a result of that really.

     

    Can you please name your source?


     

    Go read some of the posts made by former Sigil staff members on the FOH forums. This has been covered already.

     

    Wow they were one hell of a group of amateurs then, the game is much more complex in my opinion than oh say:

     

    EQ2, WoW, LoTRO, D&DO, Lineage 2, Saga Of Ryzom, EvE Online, DAoC, Guild Wars, Star Wars Galaxies, Auto Assault, Grando Espada ( AKA SoTNW ), Archlord.

     

    And most likely WAR.

     

    It had its bugs, it has its bugs, but to deny that we are the best game out there well... it's more than a river in Egypt.

     

    In case someone was wondering what features it has that make it so "complex" in my opinion I would be glad to name them for you, and you can name your game with all of these features, and all the ones that make your games (or even upcoming games wtf not) has that Vanguard doesn't, it will be fun.  This is in no way listed in order of what I think is important about Vanguard:

     

    EDIT: Never mind I don't want to hijack a good thread so I'll start my own.

     

     

     

  • MistickMistick Member Posts: 100

     

    Originally posted by Murugan


     
    Originally posted by M1sf1t


     

    Originally posted by Thillian


    Originally posted by sepher

    Well there's Sigil's original sin: believing good ideas translate to good game design; rather than basing game design around the staff''s ability to implement those ideas.
     
    A first-time MMO development house CEO in-charge of tens of millions of dollars who tasked it to a bunch of first-time industry workers.
    Everything that's gone wrong and continues to go wrong is a result of that really.

     

    Can you please name your source?


     

    Go read some of the posts made by former Sigil staff members on the FOH forums. This has been covered already.

     

    Wow they were one hell of a group of amateurs then, the game is much more complex in my opinion than oh say:

     

    EQ2, WoW, LoTRO, D&DO, Lineage 2, Saga Of Ryzom, EvE Online, DAoC, Guild Wars, Star Wars Galaxies, Auto Assault, Grando Espada ( AKA SoTNW ), Archlord.

     

    And most likely WAR.

     

    It had its bugs, it has its bugs, but to deny that we are the best game out there well... it's more than a river in Egypt.

    I won't say VG is  bad, but it is being treated pretty poorly. Personally I like a lot of the orginal concepts. The problem is the game has no soul, no depth, no real purpose compared to it's competitors. If you like the game good, but lets not fool ourselves with how SOE is handling this product.

     

    To consider the statement that this was going to be an "SOE flagship", but still lacking the adequate resources it needs to succeed in todays market is like that rver in Egypt you so well pointed out. I agree the game has issuses, and ever game does. However this is no excuse for the poor executive decisions by SOE of an already launched product. Sorry to say SOE is just taking what they can get at this point in time.

    From my stand point SOE is minamizing product development to increase profitability for the sole purpose of recouping the initial investment. There are no real signs by SOE of actually " investing" any further funding into VG beyond it's current sub numbers to propel this game into the state it deserves to be in. Even if SOE was to make that investment to consider the marketing it would take to increase it's numbers would be a gamble to the some of the SOE figure heads. SOE never was good at marketing their products anyway compared to other development companies with the exception of trials, but that will only get you so far without advertisement of some sort.

    This is why SOE as a company is looked at poorly by many gamers. It's not the games or the ideas that fail so much as the company managing those products. Yes SOE will always be known for what it did for MMORPGs (good or bad), but in todays market expectations are high, and that is a demand in todays times that SOE is limited in suppling.

  • AnofalyeAnofalye Member, Newbie CommonPosts: 7,433

    For me, it was simply when they decide that in order to master anything, you have to do everything.

     

    Incompatible on the most core design.  If all I want is to be good at X, then I should only have to do X to progress.  If I also want to be good at Y, then I should just have to also do Y activities.

     

    Somehow, they believe that they could expect a player to play EVERYTHING or to just accept to be a second class character.  I don't mind been a second class character in activities I don't do, but I sure wouldn't accept been a second class character in what I do.  I am not a monk in RL.

     

    PS: That same reason also apply for most MMOs, althought it might need to be formulated against a specific gameplay.

    - "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren

  • sephersepher Member Posts: 3,561
    Originally posted by M1sf1t


     

    Originally posted by Thillian


    Originally posted by sepher

    Well there's Sigil's original sin: believing good ideas translate to good game design; rather than basing game design around the staff''s ability to implement those ideas.
     
    A first-time MMO development house CEO in-charge of tens of millions of dollars who tasked it to a bunch of first-time industry workers.
    Everything that's gone wrong and continues to go wrong is a result of that really.

     

    Can you please name your source?


     

    Go read some of the posts made by former Sigil staff members on the FOH forums. This has been covered already.

    My favorite being: http://www.fohguild.org/forums/retard-rickshaw/31593-vg-producers-letter-49.html#post945201



    "Anyway, enough of my blabbering. The most shocking reality that I don't think anyone really ever understood is that Vanguard was made (exclusively the design staff, I should say) COMPLETELY by amateurs. People who had been hired less than a week with 0 prior experience were tasked with designing entire newbie areas that shipped. People who had never produced a game in their life were asked to fix a 40 million dollar fuck up. People with no experience were asked to fix the item, diplomacy, ability, content, quest and pretty much every system in the game."



    'course the overly defensive will call it a lie, but I don't care. No better source than people who were actually in the office day-to-day creating the game. Even Brad McQuaid addresses the epidemic of the mass hiring of friends and family "vouched" for in his f13 interview.

  • VultureSkullVultureSkull Member UncommonPosts: 1,774

    After the release and the SOE take over, VG should have been updated and patched very quickily.

    I magine if VG was in its current state ater 3 months of release, then by November they released the Island of trials to attract all those that were bored with their MMOs and ready for Xmas holidays.

    My point is that if SOE had put in the resources to quickly bring VG up to sratch, ie fix all broken things, they could have then cut the staff to work on updates and expansions.This would have attracted a lot of players who were desperatly looking for a new game and boosted the population which is essential for an enjoyable MMO.

    But unfortuantly that did not happen and staff were cut instead of increased.

    Now there are quite a few MMOs coming out this year and VG will find it hard to compete, sadly.

     

Sign In or Register to comment.