OMG, people may as well talk to a brick wall as try and make a point to you! One person in this thread has already actually done what you say is impossible by being the only healer on an MT run, but still holy is too crap for you to play. You then basically say that you are completely right as you are the only one in this thread that knows what he is talking about and if you can't do it, no-one can (paraphrasing here of course, but that is the general gist), talk about ego! You then go on to condemn the whole game because in your illustrious opinion, one build for one class is screwed up beyond use (because how dare they make you re-spec to adapt). Further still, you are writing off an expansion that no-one knows the details of, so you have no idea what the changes (if any) will be!! IF i had any respect for your opinions at any time during this thread, that has been blown out of the window by your pure lack of any ability to see that others may actually succeed where you have obviously failed! Back on the main subject, at the end of the day if you want to try holy spec then go for it as beyond this guys opinion some people are doing well with the spec regardless and those that don't get on with it (including a member of my own guild) just re-spec to something that they can get along with. Flexability is a useful thing to keep in mind with MMO's, although some would have you believe otherwise.
I did not ask for your respect at any point while posting here. I dont expect ppl here to show any respect when we are talking about individual classes in MMO game. I dont even expect that when we are talking about individual specs within that class.
What I do know is that you have not played holy paladin - and the player that is playing holy paladin has not done heroic MrT yet. And is in Kara content. Your welcome to ignore pages of holy paladins posting about that instance and saying their opinion about it. But that says more about it than what you claim u know about a class that you dont even play. Not to mention a spec.
I've ALREADY done MgT with my Pally as the only healer on normal mode, had no problems whatsoever and I don't even have a full set of Kara gear. I have not done it on heroic, I've heard it's pretty tough, but you are blowing things WAY out of proportion. It's pretty obvious to anyone reading your posts that you are making a huge deal over this. You obviously feel very passionately about your Paladin, I guess that's the only class you play. I have 9 toons, only 1 Pally, guess I just don't know WTF I'm talking about.
Its not my only toon - but its my main - and when my alt in green gear is more viable than a full geared T6 holy paladin then I have a reason to point that out. No - Im not changing class - and IM not changing spec. If Im not viable as a full tier in 5 man or 10 man or 25 man long term (not talking PVP arena cause we all know thats not even an option atm) then its time to change game.
Devs should NOT be able to force players to change specs to be viable. That just not only go for paladins but every single hybrid class ingame. BLizzard has not been able to do that for the past year and that shows that a 3 year old game is worth LESS than nothing when it comes to balanced gameplay.
Im not blowing things out of porportions. Im just a player of one class ingame - just like a priest is a player of one class. And as endgame player - and as 5 man group player - Im just asking for the same viabilty. That is NOT blowing things out of porportion. Thats asking for balanced game. And Blizzard is as far from balanced atm as it ever was.
Basing most of your argument on 1 boss from 1 5 man instance is NOT blowing things out of proportion? You've already as much as admitted that Pally's are fine for most of BC and yet since Pally's can't raid heal on 1 boss of the toughest 5 man in the game, we are obviously underpowered to all other healers. Sorry, but yeah I think that's blowing things out of proportion. Certainly Priests and Paladins are different animals and there are going to be times when situations favor 1 over the other, but that doesn't mean the classes are unbalanced, that means that balance is obtained not through 1 individual boss fight in one instance, but through an entire game's worth of viability. Maybe your just a bit bitter because your guild has relegated you to buff bot status. Maybe it's time to switch guilds. Personally, my guild loves me.
Basing most of your argument on 1 boss from 1 5 man instance is NOT blowing things out of proportion? You've already as much as admitted that Pally's are fine for most of BC and yet since Pally's can't raid heal on 1 boss of the toughest 5 man in the game, we are obviously underpowered to all other healers. Sorry, but yeah I think that's blowing things out of proportion. Certainly Priests and Paladins are different animals and there are going to be times when situations favor 1 over the other, but that doesn't mean the classes are unbalanced, that means that balance is obtained not through 1 individual boss fight in one instance, but through an entire game's worth of viability. Maybe your just a bit bitter because your guild has relegated you to buff bot status. Maybe it's time to switch guilds. Personally, my guild loves me.
Well as a former long term council member and raid leader I think you might be kinda surprised if you think playing a class is all about guilds "loving u" I have full respec t - not only from my guild but also from all of the server - for playing last 3 years and sticking through it all this time.
You dont think I have earned a spot after 270 days playing ? Including leading raids? HOw naive can u be ? ...
MMO games are not about beeing liked and beeing draged around ingame based on that. It is based on the abilites of the classes and specs. And the good players dont play classes that prove out to be crap at ANY stage or play classes or specs that are changed around every patch. WHy ? Basicly because that show them that the developers have NO idea what they are doing and NO idea where they are heading with that class. But most players then go to more vialbe class or spec. But some, like myself is asking for abit more respect from the devs than that. Im asking for respect after playing a spec for 3 years.. Im asking for respect for 270 days played. Im asking for respect for having to go through the torutre of 5 min buffing on 40 man raids. Im asking for respect for trying to keep my viablity up as healer while only having 3 vialbe healing abilites that all are single target heals.
Yes - Im asking for abit of respect. And what I get is smack in the face from the devs.
And Im not he only one. Go ready the paladin forums. See how the class is beeing ignored. Find out why retri paladin class was left without resillincase for over a year. Find out how palaidn were nerfed to obvliion in ONE patch in PVP arena. Find out the facts- ANd THEN claim that paladins are beeing treated fairly compared to other classes.
Then deside to make it your main... in a MMO game... And keep on beeing ignored for a spec of that class for the next year. No thx. Thats not what I pay for.
Maybe its sometimes better to listen to a holy paladin than other class when it comes to advises for that spec...
I suppose that just proves the rule;
Those that can, do; Those that can't, teach!
<couldn't resist>
Yup - and you just proved you were just trolling instead of putting out any reasonable argument.
Keep on doing what you do best as rogue instead of claiming u know about Paladins and their healing abilites
Damn m8 if you were anymore set in your ways you would be a statue...Ok my wow histort (damn cant believe I admit to this)since beta until about 3 weeks ago have done all pre-tbc instances as a priest and upto SSC as healing leader,you are the sort of guy I have seen many times,the 1 that knows it all and wont listen,the 1 that thinks he knows his class the best and the 1 that ends up making an arse of himself!
If someone had came up to me in 1980 when I was on my Atari 2600 and said we will be playing games with thousands of people at the same time.I guess my response would have been,"but I only have 2 joysticks"
Originally posted by Alan0n Yup - and you just proved you were just trolling instead of putting out any reasonable argument. Keep on doing what you do best as rogue instead of claiming u know about Paladins and their healing abilites
Hmmm, i think if you have a look back over the thread i have never actually claimed to know anything about paladins, i have just offered opinions based on my experience with other players and guild members and if you had in any way offered a "reasonable" argument for your stance instead of just "it's not fair, look what they did to my class, i'm not playing anymore" i would have gladly bowed to your experience. Instead you have made outrageous statements and chosen to ignore first hand experience of others in this thread to support your own agenda (whatever that is).
I will make my last statement in this thread to you which sums up what i have said already;
Just because YOU have decided the changes are too much for YOU to take, that does not mean that others cannot take up the challenges before them in the game and that Holy Pally's are no longer a viable option at all. Others will and already have proved that there is a future for the class and build whether you like it or not and as for the future, well no-one knows what that holds as yet so any statement to the contrary is pure speculation at best. You did say in a previous post that it took you a month to get Kara down with two of you healing and this patch has only been out a week, so maybe with a little more time the others that have taken up the challenge will devise their own tactics to see them move forward.
It must be Thursday, i never could get the hang of Thursdays.
Maybe its sometimes better to listen to a holy paladin than other class when it comes to advises for that spec...
I suppose that just proves the rule;
Those that can, do; Those that can't, teach!
<couldn't resist>
Yup - and you just proved you were just trolling instead of putting out any reasonable argument.
Keep on doing what you do best as rogue instead of claiming u know about Paladins and their healing abilites
Damn m8 if you were anymore set in your ways you would be a statue...Ok my wow histort (damn cant believe I admit to this)since beta until about 3 weeks ago have done all pre-tbc instances as a priest and upto SSC as healing leader,you are the sort of guy I have seen many times,the 1 that knows it all and wont listen,the 1 that thinks he knows his class the best and the 1 that ends up making an arse of himself!
I dont expect a healing leader in SSC to listen to players that have finished all content - not only in TBC but pretty much all content ingame in terms of grouping and raiding.
I dont claim I know my class the best - Heck I dont know jack shit about retri paladins. But what I know that you as SSC priest healer has no understanding of what Holy paladins are about. As leading healer I know you think as Priest but not as paladin. Try to use your flash and single heal only and then you might get the point of beeing a paladin - and then you might actually understand what good paladins are conpared to bad ones. Cause we can't throw groupheals around - we actually have to priorites.
No - m8. U talking down to me and my experience as a player says more than what you are saying about the holy paladins. Cause you would just love if we got nerfed even more. Dont you ?
Hmmm, i think if you have a look back over the thread i have never actually claimed to know anything about paladins, i have just offered opinions based on my experience with other players and guild members and if you had in any way offered a "reasonable" argument for your stance instead of just "it's not fair, look what they did to my class, i'm not playing anymore" i would have gladly bowed to your experience. Instead you have made outrageous statements and chosen to ignore first hand experience of others in this thread to support your own agenda (whatever that is). I will make my last statement in this thread to you which sums up what i have said already; Just because YOU have decided the changes are too much for YOU to take, that does not mean that others cannot take up the challenges before them in the game and that Holy Pally's are no longer a viable option at all. Others will and already have proved that there is a future for the class and build whether you like it or not and as for the future, well no-one knows what that holds as yet so any statement to the contrary is pure speculation at best. You did say in a previous post that it took you a month to get Kara down with two of you healing and this patch has only been out a week, so maybe with a little more time the others that have taken up the challenge will devise their own tactics to see them move forward.
Holy paladins build their future on the past. We build it on the last year of how retribution paladins have been treated. We know what is in store for us. We know its time for the holy spec to take the fall in the paladin class. Cause there is no way they can make all 3 specs as viable? Is that to much to ask for ?
I dont think so... In TBC alot of paladins were FORCED to play holy cause other specs were not good. Hell for the past 3 years our class has been forced to play holy cause other were not viable in endgame content or even in 5 man (as prot for example). Holy paladins that are pointing out the obvious and have been doing for the past months know what is happening. THey knew was this coming and they see where it is going. We know there is gonna be a year until we even will be getting attention from BLizzard to make us as viable as other healers. Other healers that now all have multiple ways of healing - all have haste gear - and all got new healing talent in their TBC tree. We dont expect those 3 healing classes to be nerfed with their new tree. But we do know that holy paladins will not be buffed to compensate either. We base that on history of the treatment of our class. We know what is coming...
You can look at it as a challenge to play a holy paladin - But you might also want to think like most MMO players that are looking to progress their character and be given fair chance to do so - compared to other characters of simulare spec.
The future has been determined. But if not then you might want to ask BLizzard why the paladins forums have not had single answer from a dev for past 3 months to do anything else than lock posts. THen you might actually know what it is to be ignored. Then you might know what it is to be paladin.
Well as a former long term council member and raid leader I think you might be kinda surprised if you think playing a class is all about guilds "loving u" I have full respec t - not only from my guild but also from all of the server - for playing last 3 years and sticking through it all this time. You dont think I have earned a spot after 270 days playing ? Including leading raids? HOw naive can u be ? ... Yes - Im asking for abit of respect. And what I get is smack in the face from the devs. And Im not he only one. Go ready the paladin forums. See how the class is beeing ignored. Find out why retri paladin class was left without resillincase for over a year. Find out how palaidn were nerfed to obvliion in ONE patch in PVP arena. Find out the facts- ANd THEN claim that paladins are beeing treated fairly compared to other classes. Then deside to make it your main... in a MMO game... And keep on beeing ignored for a spec of that class for the next year. No thx. Thats not what I pay for.
Council member is it? Former? Did you step down or were you asked to resign?
270 days played? Earned it? So you think because you've played a video game for 270 days you're entitled to something? I've played 146 days myself, what does that entitle to me? What respect have I earned?
Ah the Paladin forums, yes the great thinkers of our time all in one place. Sorry, no I have not visited them lately. Do tell what wisdom they have dispatched. Found a cure for cancer have they? Cured world hunger? Or maybe just found a way to cut the gas prices back to $2 a gallon? Fantastic!!!
Look, I'm sure you mean well and all and like I've said, I'm not questioning your dedication to the game. On the contrary, I think it's possible that maybe you're a little too close to the situation to see things objectively. You have invested quite a bit of time and energy into playing this game and this particular class and obviously are very well informed, however that doesn't necessarily make you the voice of reason. I think you might just be taking things a bit too seriously.
Council member is it? Former? Did you step down or were you asked to resign?
270 days played? Earned it? So you think because you've played a video game for 270 days you're entitled to something? I've played 146 days myself, what does that entitle to me? What respect have I earned? Ah the Paladin forums, yes the great thinkers of our time all in one place. Sorry, no I have not visited them lately. Do tell what wisdom they have dispatched. Found a cure for cancer have they? Cured world hunger? Or maybe just found a way to cut the gas prices back to $2 a gallon? Fantastic!!! Look, I'm sure you mean well and all and like I've said, I'm not questioning your dedication to the game. On the contrary, I think it's possible that maybe you're a little too close to the situation to see things objectively. You have invested quite a bit of time and energy into playing this game and this particular class and obviously are very well informed, however that doesn't necessarily make you the voice of reason. I think you might just be taking things a bit too seriously. That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
Well - My voice of reason told me to quit the game and look for another game that shows more respect to players than ignore obvious flaws that are coming up after 3 years of the game. Thats how involved I am. If the way of BLIzzard to "fix" the paladin class is to actually not fix the broken spec (like Retris have been for whole of TBC) - but instead just nerf another spec more than the retris, then something is really wrong.
Yes I have moved on to new game. I have played mmos for past 9 years and I always play them with one main charater and try to enjoy the most of the content (including endgame content). This "new" way of Blizzard, telling the game is intented to play multiple characters is not what Im after. Why ? Cause I have wife and kid and full time job. And when Im forced to do things like respec or play through the SAME content again with new character - then its time to say no thx.
Again - for the past 3 patches holy paladins have been trying their very best to point out that the current nerfs to one healing class and continuing buffing other healing classes will lead to what we are now in for. And to top it off. Holy paladins are probably the least selfish of all classes - and thats why they are very easy to stamp down instead of actually fixing the retri palas to make them viable.
Im now playing a healing class in another game that is in beta and Im really loving it. And its a game that has CLEARLY stated the focus of every class in the game. That something blizzard has NOT done with paladins. And that why they find it just fine to FLIPFLOP the class around whenever they please.
There have been many good qoutes about the state of the paladins ingame atm. Prots are working fine atm while others are beeing ignored. But new Tanking class is coming next patch - Another plate wearing class that can do more dmg and still tank. And it's two way class so in terms of the great logic of saying that 2 way classes should be better than 3 ways - this mean ofc that it will be better tank to - with 2 handed sword....
But why not make all specs of our class equally viable ? No... thats something Blizzard will not do. They will keep swinging our class back and forth without stating clear role for the class as 3 way viable hybrid. Cause its good for them to "balance" the game by throwing hybrids into nerf buff cicle whenever they want.
There is only one thing that you need to be to play paladin in WoW atm. You need to be very stupid. Stupid to think that things will get fixed. Stupid cause paladins are the "easy" class of WOW. That has been stated OFFICIALLY from the person in charge of class balance. We are SUPPOSED to be like this. So - no thx. If a game can not give ALL classes and ALL specs the same change to prove how good of a player you are then its best to get out before you get burned. I got burned - but I wont do the same mistake again.
Im happy in new game that will be coming out shortly. It will have more of stable longterm gameplay and it has already stated the role of each class ingame. Like I said- I quit on the eve of patch 2.4. And Im really happy about that disission. Cause Im not gonna play the fool thinking Blizzard actually cares about players that dont play exactly like they intend and are suffering because of it.
I loved playing a holy paladin. There were alot of players that didn't want to play as such. One solution to get those that dont want to play holy is to nerf the spec. But when you nerf a spec to the stage where players that ACTUALLY like to play that way are quitting after long term high endgame content - then something is seriously wrong.
NO - Im not the only holy paladin who has quit in the last 3 months. Many very good holy palas have left. And alot more will be quitting in the next few months. And that is the sad part. Players that WANT to play as healers - one of 4 healing classes ingame are simply not given that chance any more. You see that if you compare MrT as healing priests or Paladin. Cause noone needs to tell me the diffrence.
You can say Im to involved and objective. But actually Im not. I've been watching what is going on and I see where its heading. And so do many other good holy paladins. Players that are now FORCED out. Thats sad - But it shows incompident devs that have no respect to players that are playing the game. No - we dont expect that to change.
So much QQing .. just like on the other WOW forums. I will give my 2 cents on the OP question. Just to give you some perspective .. my main is a L70 mage with tailoring epics and my alt pally is only L23. So I know the mage class a lot better than the pally class. I am not into raiding yet so I can't comment on end game raiding content but I have done MgT with my mage (actually first day it came out).
My pally is specced prot. I think prot is a nice way to go for the following reason.
- ret is dps and it is difficult to compete with true dps class
- holy is healing and it is difficult to complete with priest
- prot is tanking and while there are multiple tank class (warrior/druid), prot pally is the best to handle tanking of multiple mobs (so we have our own unique place), and we are pretty difficult to kill with multiple mitigation.
- prot is also nice for leveling once you can do AOE grinding.
AlanOn, sorry to hear that you're leaving the game, but this might be a good thing for you. Take a bit of time away from the game and play something else for a while. A lot of times people get a different perspective on things after trying something else for awhile. You got 270 days out of the game, that's not a bad run.
So much QQing .. just like on the other WOW forums. I will give my 2 cents on the OP question. Just to give you some perspective .. my main is a L70 mage with tailoring epics and my alt pally is only L23. So I know the mage class a lot better than the pally class. I am not into raiding yet so I can't comment on end game raiding content but I have done MgT with my mage (actually first day it came out). My pally is specced prot. I think prot is a nice way to go for the following reason. - ret is dps and it is difficult to compete with true dps class - holy is healing and it is difficult to complete with priest - prot is tanking and while there are multiple tank class (warrior/druid), prot pally is the best to handle tanking of multiple mobs (so we have our own unique place), and we are pretty difficult to kill with multiple mitigation. - prot is also nice for leveling once you can do AOE grinding.
Retribution spec is one of 9 dps classes ingame
Holy Paladins are one of 4 healing classes ingame
Prot is oneof 3 tanking classes ingame.
THing is WOTLK will give the 4th tanking class - and the 10th dmg class.
Still there will be just 3 healing classes. Just mark my words and see what will happen
AlanOn, sorry to hear that you're leaving the game, but this might be a good thing for you. Take a bit of time away from the game and play something else for a while. A lot of times people get a different perspective on things after trying something else for awhile. You got 270 days out of the game, that's not a bad run.
Considering I got 5 years and probably over 400 days in EQ ye
BUt I dindn't quit that game cause of class balance. Actually I still pay for my account there and play casual with long term m8ts.
That will not happen in WOW even tho I have many very good friends there to. I talk to them on MSN now instead. I dont have to pay for that And hopefully I can convince them to join me in the new game. ANd I can help them to get into it very fast
Nope - Im not coming back to WoW. The new game is the future of MMOs anyway so I will continue to pay for EQ and then the sub for that game. its my money - and THATS how it is INTENEDED to be. Its not only Blizzard that can use that prahse
I've been pushed to far and there is no turning back. Thats just how it is. IF thats intended it says everything about the devs and how they behave towards longterm players. No respect works both ways.
Comments
What I do know is that you have not played holy paladin - and the player that is playing holy paladin has not done heroic MrT yet. And is in Kara content. Your welcome to ignore pages of holy paladins posting about that instance and saying their opinion about it. But that says more about it than what you claim u know about a class that you dont even play. Not to mention a spec.
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=3404800849&sid=1
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=5640665137&sid=1
Maybe its sometimes better to listen to a holy paladin than other class when it comes to advises for that spec...
Devs should NOT be able to force players to change specs to be viable. That just not only go for paladins but every single hybrid class ingame. BLizzard has not been able to do that for the past year and that shows that a 3 year old game is worth LESS than nothing when it comes to balanced gameplay.
Im not blowing things out of porportions. Im just a player of one class ingame - just like a priest is a player of one class. And as endgame player - and as 5 man group player - Im just asking for the same viabilty. That is NOT blowing things out of porportion. Thats asking for balanced game. And Blizzard is as far from balanced atm as it ever was.
Basing most of your argument on 1 boss from 1 5 man instance is NOT blowing things out of proportion? You've already as much as admitted that Pally's are fine for most of BC and yet since Pally's can't raid heal on 1 boss of the toughest 5 man in the game, we are obviously underpowered to all other healers. Sorry, but yeah I think that's blowing things out of proportion. Certainly Priests and Paladins are different animals and there are going to be times when situations favor 1 over the other, but that doesn't mean the classes are unbalanced, that means that balance is obtained not through 1 individual boss fight in one instance, but through an entire game's worth of viability. Maybe your just a bit bitter because your guild has relegated you to buff bot status. Maybe it's time to switch guilds. Personally, my guild loves me.
I suppose that just proves the rule;
Those that can, do; Those that can't, teach!
<couldn't resist>
It must be Thursday, i never could get the hang of Thursdays.
Well as a former long term council member and raid leader I think you might be kinda surprised if you think playing a class is all about guilds "loving u" I have full respec t - not only from my guild but also from all of the server - for playing last 3 years and sticking through it all this time.
You dont think I have earned a spot after 270 days playing ? Including leading raids? HOw naive can u be ? ...
MMO games are not about beeing liked and beeing draged around ingame based on that. It is based on the abilites of the classes and specs. And the good players dont play classes that prove out to be crap at ANY stage or play classes or specs that are changed around every patch. WHy ? Basicly because that show them that the developers have NO idea what they are doing and NO idea where they are heading with that class. But most players then go to more vialbe class or spec. But some, like myself is asking for abit more respect from the devs than that. Im asking for respect after playing a spec for 3 years.. Im asking for respect for 270 days played. Im asking for respect for having to go through the torutre of 5 min buffing on 40 man raids. Im asking for respect for trying to keep my viablity up as healer while only having 3 vialbe healing abilites that all are single target heals.
Yes - Im asking for abit of respect. And what I get is smack in the face from the devs.
And Im not he only one. Go ready the paladin forums. See how the class is beeing ignored. Find out why retri paladin class was left without resillincase for over a year. Find out how palaidn were nerfed to obvliion in ONE patch in PVP arena. Find out the facts- ANd THEN claim that paladins are beeing treated fairly compared to other classes.
Then deside to make it your main... in a MMO game... And keep on beeing ignored for a spec of that class for the next year. No thx. Thats not what I pay for.
I suppose that just proves the rule;
Those that can, do; Those that can't, teach!
<couldn't resist>
Yup - and you just proved you were just trolling instead of putting out any reasonable argument.Keep on doing what you do best as rogue instead of claiming u know about Paladins and their healing abilites
I suppose that just proves the rule;
Those that can, do; Those that can't, teach!
<couldn't resist>
Yup - and you just proved you were just trolling instead of putting out any reasonable argument.Keep on doing what you do best as rogue instead of claiming u know about Paladins and their healing abilites
Damn m8 if you were anymore set in your ways you would be a statue...Ok my wow histort (damn cant believe I admit to this)since beta until about 3 weeks ago have done all pre-tbc instances as a priest and upto SSC as healing leader,you are the sort of guy I have seen many times,the 1 that knows it all and wont listen,the 1 that thinks he knows his class the best and the 1 that ends up making an arse of himself!
If someone had came up to me in 1980 when I was on my Atari 2600 and said we will be playing games with thousands of people at the same time.I guess my response would have been,"but I only have 2 joysticks"
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/235780/page/8
Hmmm, i think if you have a look back over the thread i have never actually claimed to know anything about paladins, i have just offered opinions based on my experience with other players and guild members and if you had in any way offered a "reasonable" argument for your stance instead of just "it's not fair, look what they did to my class, i'm not playing anymore" i would have gladly bowed to your experience. Instead you have made outrageous statements and chosen to ignore first hand experience of others in this thread to support your own agenda (whatever that is).
I will make my last statement in this thread to you which sums up what i have said already;
Just because YOU have decided the changes are too much for YOU to take, that does not mean that others cannot take up the challenges before them in the game and that Holy Pally's are no longer a viable option at all. Others will and already have proved that there is a future for the class and build whether you like it or not and as for the future, well no-one knows what that holds as yet so any statement to the contrary is pure speculation at best. You did say in a previous post that it took you a month to get Kara down with two of you healing and this patch has only been out a week, so maybe with a little more time the others that have taken up the challenge will devise their own tactics to see them move forward.
It must be Thursday, i never could get the hang of Thursdays.
I suppose that just proves the rule;
Those that can, do; Those that can't, teach!
<couldn't resist>
Yup - and you just proved you were just trolling instead of putting out any reasonable argument.Keep on doing what you do best as rogue instead of claiming u know about Paladins and their healing abilites
Damn m8 if you were anymore set in your ways you would be a statue...Ok my wow histort (damn cant believe I admit to this)since beta until about 3 weeks ago have done all pre-tbc instances as a priest and upto SSC as healing leader,you are the sort of guy I have seen many times,the 1 that knows it all and wont listen,the 1 that thinks he knows his class the best and the 1 that ends up making an arse of himself!
I dont expect a healing leader in SSC to listen to players that have finished all content - not only in TBC but pretty much all content ingame in terms of grouping and raiding.I dont claim I know my class the best - Heck I dont know jack shit about retri paladins. But what I know that you as SSC priest healer has no understanding of what Holy paladins are about. As leading healer I know you think as Priest but not as paladin. Try to use your flash and single heal only and then you might get the point of beeing a paladin - and then you might actually understand what good paladins are conpared to bad ones. Cause we can't throw groupheals around - we actually have to priorites.
No - m8. U talking down to me and my experience as a player says more than what you are saying about the holy paladins. Cause you would just love if we got nerfed even more. Dont you ?
Holy paladins build their future on the past. We build it on the last year of how retribution paladins have been treated. We know what is in store for us. We know its time for the holy spec to take the fall in the paladin class. Cause there is no way they can make all 3 specs as viable? Is that to much to ask for ?
I dont think so... In TBC alot of paladins were FORCED to play holy cause other specs were not good. Hell for the past 3 years our class has been forced to play holy cause other were not viable in endgame content or even in 5 man (as prot for example). Holy paladins that are pointing out the obvious and have been doing for the past months know what is happening. THey knew was this coming and they see where it is going. We know there is gonna be a year until we even will be getting attention from BLizzard to make us as viable as other healers. Other healers that now all have multiple ways of healing - all have haste gear - and all got new healing talent in their TBC tree. We dont expect those 3 healing classes to be nerfed with their new tree. But we do know that holy paladins will not be buffed to compensate either. We base that on history of the treatment of our class. We know what is coming...
You can look at it as a challenge to play a holy paladin - But you might also want to think like most MMO players that are looking to progress their character and be given fair chance to do so - compared to other characters of simulare spec.
The future has been determined. But if not then you might want to ask BLizzard why the paladins forums have not had single answer from a dev for past 3 months to do anything else than lock posts. THen you might actually know what it is to be ignored. Then you might know what it is to be paladin.
270 days played? Earned it? So you think because you've played a video game for 270 days you're entitled to something? I've played 146 days myself, what does that entitle to me? What respect have I earned?
Ah the Paladin forums, yes the great thinkers of our time all in one place. Sorry, no I have not visited them lately. Do tell what wisdom they have dispatched. Found a cure for cancer have they? Cured world hunger? Or maybe just found a way to cut the gas prices back to $2 a gallon? Fantastic!!!
Look, I'm sure you mean well and all and like I've said, I'm not questioning your dedication to the game. On the contrary, I think it's possible that maybe you're a little too close to the situation to see things objectively. You have invested quite a bit of time and energy into playing this game and this particular class and obviously are very well informed, however that doesn't necessarily make you the voice of reason. I think you might just be taking things a bit too seriously.
That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
Well - My voice of reason told me to quit the game and look for another game that shows more respect to players than ignore obvious flaws that are coming up after 3 years of the game. Thats how involved I am. If the way of BLIzzard to "fix" the paladin class is to actually not fix the broken spec (like Retris have been for whole of TBC) - but instead just nerf another spec more than the retris, then something is really wrong.
Yes I have moved on to new game. I have played mmos for past 9 years and I always play them with one main charater and try to enjoy the most of the content (including endgame content). This "new" way of Blizzard, telling the game is intented to play multiple characters is not what Im after. Why ? Cause I have wife and kid and full time job. And when Im forced to do things like respec or play through the SAME content again with new character - then its time to say no thx.
Again - for the past 3 patches holy paladins have been trying their very best to point out that the current nerfs to one healing class and continuing buffing other healing classes will lead to what we are now in for. And to top it off. Holy paladins are probably the least selfish of all classes - and thats why they are very easy to stamp down instead of actually fixing the retri palas to make them viable.
Im now playing a healing class in another game that is in beta and Im really loving it. And its a game that has CLEARLY stated the focus of every class in the game. That something blizzard has NOT done with paladins. And that why they find it just fine to FLIPFLOP the class around whenever they please.
There have been many good qoutes about the state of the paladins ingame atm. Prots are working fine atm while others are beeing ignored. But new Tanking class is coming next patch - Another plate wearing class that can do more dmg and still tank. And it's two way class so in terms of the great logic of saying that 2 way classes should be better than 3 ways - this mean ofc that it will be better tank to - with 2 handed sword....
But why not make all specs of our class equally viable ? No... thats something Blizzard will not do. They will keep swinging our class back and forth without stating clear role for the class as 3 way viable hybrid. Cause its good for them to "balance" the game by throwing hybrids into nerf buff cicle whenever they want.
There is only one thing that you need to be to play paladin in WoW atm. You need to be very stupid. Stupid to think that things will get fixed. Stupid cause paladins are the "easy" class of WOW. That has been stated OFFICIALLY from the person in charge of class balance. We are SUPPOSED to be like this. So - no thx. If a game can not give ALL classes and ALL specs the same change to prove how good of a player you are then its best to get out before you get burned. I got burned - but I wont do the same mistake again.
Im happy in new game that will be coming out shortly. It will have more of stable longterm gameplay and it has already stated the role of each class ingame. Like I said- I quit on the eve of patch 2.4. And Im really happy about that disission. Cause Im not gonna play the fool thinking Blizzard actually cares about players that dont play exactly like they intend and are suffering because of it.
I loved playing a holy paladin. There were alot of players that didn't want to play as such. One solution to get those that dont want to play holy is to nerf the spec. But when you nerf a spec to the stage where players that ACTUALLY like to play that way are quitting after long term high endgame content - then something is seriously wrong.
NO - Im not the only holy paladin who has quit in the last 3 months. Many very good holy palas have left. And alot more will be quitting in the next few months. And that is the sad part. Players that WANT to play as healers - one of 4 healing classes ingame are simply not given that chance any more. You see that if you compare MrT as healing priests or Paladin. Cause noone needs to tell me the diffrence.
You can say Im to involved and objective. But actually Im not. I've been watching what is going on and I see where its heading. And so do many other good holy paladins. Players that are now FORCED out. Thats sad - But it shows incompident devs that have no respect to players that are playing the game. No - we dont expect that to change.
So much QQing .. just like on the other WOW forums. I will give my 2 cents on the OP question. Just to give you some perspective .. my main is a L70 mage with tailoring epics and my alt pally is only L23. So I know the mage class a lot better than the pally class. I am not into raiding yet so I can't comment on end game raiding content but I have done MgT with my mage (actually first day it came out).
My pally is specced prot. I think prot is a nice way to go for the following reason.
- ret is dps and it is difficult to compete with true dps class
- holy is healing and it is difficult to complete with priest
- prot is tanking and while there are multiple tank class (warrior/druid), prot pally is the best to handle tanking of multiple mobs (so we have our own unique place), and we are pretty difficult to kill with multiple mitigation.
- prot is also nice for leveling once you can do AOE grinding.
AlanOn, sorry to hear that you're leaving the game, but this might be a good thing for you. Take a bit of time away from the game and play something else for a while. A lot of times people get a different perspective on things after trying something else for awhile. You got 270 days out of the game, that's not a bad run.
Holy Paladins are one of 4 healing classes ingame
Prot is oneof 3 tanking classes ingame.
THing is WOTLK will give the 4th tanking class - and the 10th dmg class.
Still there will be just 3 healing classes. Just mark my words and see what will happen
Considering I got 5 years and probably over 400 days in EQ ye
BUt I dindn't quit that game cause of class balance. Actually I still pay for my account there and play casual with long term m8ts.
That will not happen in WOW even tho I have many very good friends there to. I talk to them on MSN now instead. I dont have to pay for that
And hopefully I can convince them to join me in the new game. ANd I can help them to get into it very fast 
Nope - Im not coming back to WoW. The new game is the future of MMOs anyway so I will continue to pay for EQ and then the sub for that game.
its my money - and THATS how it is INTENEDED to be. Its not only Blizzard that can use that prahse 
I've been pushed to far and there is no turning back. Thats just how it is. IF thats intended it says everything about the devs and how they behave towards longterm players. No respect works both ways.
question of the day:
How can one person ( Alan0n) write so much but have nothing to say?
Well - thats your opinion
Not like your post said much - did it ?
Maybe u can reply to this one if u want to say something
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/165389