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Well gang, im stuck
I found this forum earlier today, and i've been surfing it for maybe an hour now. I'm on the hunt for a new MMO, currently playing WoW of course (i know, everyone here is a WoW hater, but it doesnt have 10 million members for nothin). I like WoW's gameplay, but it's depth is about as shallow as a kiddie pool. Im tired of Pvping, or raiding for gear. crafting is pointless, and you can get nothing useful from solo questing.
Now i've played quite a few mmo's. Daoc, FFXI, Vanguard, LOTRO, and warcraft. WoW is definitely the longest i've ever played an mmo, but this is also the only mmo i've had a decent group of RL friends to play with, which always makes it more fun.
Basically what i'm posting for, is some help, or some opinions i guess. I'm looking for a game that has a decent pace, similar to wow, but i'm looking for a game with much more depth. I'm looking for MUCH more single player content, and maybe some professions that arent laughable? i mean cmon, it's takes a few hours to get a profession maxed out, if you're lvl 70 of course.
I'm going to continue to surf the site, and see what i can find, i see alot of free mmos, some of which i've played, most of which are very cookie-cutterish.
Thanks in advance for any advice, or opinions you guys and gals can give me.
Comments
With a post like that you might be inviting flames, everyone will be selling you his favourite MMO and accusing everyone else. Lol, hope it does not come to that.
First a disclaimer, I do not play much any more. So I have no favourite game.
Second, you mentioned maxing out a profession in a few hours, you mean crafting? If you mean crafting, you will be grinding hours for materials, unless you are a super rich player who can buy all his way to the end. Even then finding the recipes (many of which are no drop and requires a lot of reputation, dungeon runs ...) will be a hassle in WoW, and it will be more than a few hours.
If you mean fun in crafting, I think EQ2 will be an option. Its not just a snap to complete, auto success with recipe/ingredients. Its a minigame, in which you have to make decisions and work on your luck. I find it more "involving". Some people find it frustrating. Try it out in the free trial, you can craft in the tutorial island (zone). Collecting the rare mats will drive you crazy, unless you are super rich.
EQ2 provides a lot of classes. Are they meaningful? Well High elves are high elves and clerics are clerics. How unique are they? Try them out before judging, don't rely on my views. If you want a total break from WoW mechanics, try City of Heroes/Villains. Its almost a totally different gameplay, even the healing profession works differently (you cannot heal yourself, hehe). It is also a casual fancy looking game with a lot of new twist different from the traditional elf/orc strangling. Unfortunately, the game has less elaborate end game content, and raiding is not a rampant activity there. Worth a shot. The game is definitely soloable all the way to the end, and grouping is not mandatory. Actually, most quests scales to your level and the size of your team, you can do it with anyone and any number of people and the mobs just spawn themselves at the appropriate level and herdsize.
Eve is another totally different game, its so controversial, you either love it or hate it. Respect it for being a great effort to stay different, but you have to love it to play it. I know many people may laugh at this, but: give LOTRo a try. It is very similar to WoW, so you have no problem picking it up. The pace to max level is very nice, and the graphics superb when compared to WoW. Unfortunately, the end game content is still a bit weak.
Good luck finding a different game, or maybe take a break as I am doing now. You might find the next batch of games very refreshing after moving away from the computer for a few months. I hope I will.
From what your saying, I would also suggest Everquest 2 since you like crafting.
Try City of Heroes. Read the boards first to find the depth though. Its not immediately apparent. Unlike many MMO boards CoX are not that much of a cesspit. Quite good really.
You might not like the dynamic generation, but then again you might.
Unfortunately, like myself, you are out of luck. I played WoW since beta and tired of it (many times) due to the same issues.
Problem is, the quality level and "fun factor" is just not there in other MMO's - yet.
Wait for WAR or AOC. I believe only they are going to answer the quality question. Also keep an eye out for TCoS.
Edit: I have pretty much played or trialed them all.
My best game after playing all of them is D&D Online by far it had come a long way and in well populated just check out the forums on it on this site and you will see, However it is all about grouping, but its real easy to get groups.
Be carefull with EQ2, everyone gets fooled by the free trial, when you buy the game you will see the population drops fast and the vets don't help much. Its hard to solo after around lv. 15. I'm gonna get my but kicked for this but it's a FACT.
Tabula Rasa pulled me out of WoW since it was released. The crafting system was a little difficult to understand at first (due to lack of tutorial) but once you understand the idea behind schematics you can make some truly great items/gear for yourself and others.
Gameplay in TR is fun as hell. There is no going afk in the middle of the bush because you never know where an enemy party is going to be dropped. Base assault/defense is highly addictive and gives a great feeling of accomplishment and personal satisfaciton. Tons of quests too...
Character Creation is pretty unique. Everyone starts off as a recruit. At various levels you chose a career path and earn a clone credit which allows you to clone your existing character at the same level and chose an alternate career path (while avoiding tedious repetitive questing you've already completed with your main).
I needed something to break the fantasy mold and I'm glad I bought Tabula Rasa. Sci-fi MMO is done real well in this game. I've found so far the community is helpful and the game doesn't (currently) require hours of free time for you to feel like you've accomplished something. I find I can jump into the game, be hunting in seconds, and leave the game at any time. Whether you have 20 min free or 4 hours, TR can probably keep you entertained.
Of course the end game has yet to materialize...
[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/28371832@N02/2648951313/[/url]
Well now, I think you've hit on some of the major reasons that there are so many "WOW-haters" here on MMORPG.com. Maybe you're one of us?
Not much out there with as much soloing as WOW, LotRO has a lot, but the upper levels do encourage you to group up, especially the storybook missions.
As other folks mentioned, EQ 2 might be a great choice for you, as long as you're not looking for much in the way of PVP.
I left WOW and did a short return to DAOC, then a few months with VG/LotTRO, then found EVE about 8 months ago. I'm one of the folks who like it, so I'll hang here until AOC or WAR comes out.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
im just tired of having to do either PVP or Raiding to get gear worth anything. I dont mind doing that, but i dont always want to play with a bunch of other people, sometimes i want to go by myself, or hell, even battle next to some npcs! wow has NO npc v npc interactions. But I dont mind spending days on a quest for a sick piece of gear. Like DAOC:TOA had those relics or whatever, and you had to lvl the item. some people hated that but i didnt mind it because when you lvled that item, you looked different than everyone else. On wow my warrior looks like every other warrior .
i'm not hating on wow, i'm just no longer impressed, in fact, i'm bored.I just got my brother into it like 6 months ago, and we just rolled alliance, because we're bored and we wanna do something new.
I appreciate you guys all being mature btw, thats awesome. I was hoping this wouldnt turn into a flame fest, so far so good. thanks for the tips n stuff, lets keep the discussion goin
There are a number of games where you can solo to max level like WoW, but most of them do the "solo can't be well rewwarded or no one will group" crap that WoW does.
Even CoX with its group size-scaling instances does do a few things that are Group only at the highest. But for the most part you can get or craft most any of the uber Invention enhancments and buy HO/SHO.
But no matter what you don't have to raid for anything. Every single thing that is worth while can be soloed or small grouped. And when you consider the IO system the complexity of builds is about as high as you can get.
I guess Tabula Rasa has not done any raids yet. So maybe that is a third. But they have not really fleshed out their endgame so its hard to say.
There really just aren't that many options, if you don't feel like being forced into the second tier for PvE. I know it sucks. Some people will say EQ2 but raids have the best gear in that game, even if you do not really need to raid you will be second class in equipment if you don't.
Eve is complex but its different than other games. You can get most things if you make money. But you certainly won't be able to do some of the premire things if you don't PvP in extremely large fleets or support a corp that does so. But EvE is very different you may be fine never entering 0.0 and being part of a small corp. There are many paths you can follow in EvE with very different goals, unlike WoW or most other EQ clones. However EvE has very slow gameplay.
well, WoW ruined my raiding experience. I was the Main tank of a MC / BWL guild back in the day, and HATED It, i quit for a year because of it. I just dont like having to schedule myself for an instance. I was late coming home from work once and got DKP docked from me, it's just so silly. I dont mind instances at all, i enjoy grouping for quests, but when it's the only means by which i can get the top of the line gear, i just get annoyed.
Just for the record... what do you do exactly in EVE? i tried a demo and was so unbelievably bored.
You could always take a look at pirates of the burning sea,it seems to be taking a pretty different approach to MMOs,yet retains some of the WoW/EQ design. Only thing is,whether its population will continue to grow or bomb massively after the first month.
I have soloed 2 classes over 50 lvls in eq2, so it depends on which one you play. It sounds like you picked the wrong server in regard to community help. It's a crowded, helpful, solo friendly game, where I play.
Wars. Huge, Epic wars. Alliances of 2000+ members trying to conquer each others territories.
Economic Wars. Trying to get more share on the market and making more cash, mostly to finance wars against enemy alliances or other traders who are ruining your bussines if not taken care of.
It's not very traditional. "Think big!" does apply there.
The PvE is merely decoration, though. Some seem to like it, but i find PvE extremely boring..
Well, you just described the very reasons I quit my raiding guild... I'm a college student and there are obviously times that real life events will take precedence over the next scheduled raid. While I tried to inform people in advance that I might be a "no show," they were very unsympathetic. I ended up joining a more casual guild and have never regretted it. Now, mind you, most of the time I stick to playing with some of my real life friends, but I do have a guild there when I need them.
Do you like PvPing? I would recommend making a few close friends and using premades as your primary method to obtain gear -- I love it.
EVE is a bit deceptive on the surface; you should get to know some people who have played it for some time and let them give you a tour, so to speak. While I don't personally like playing as a space craft (I liked SWG's method for space a bit better ), you may like it more as you get into the game. I have several friends who are addicted to that game. The player economy is probably the most intriguing factor about the game for me.
As you said, WoW is extremely shallow in contrast to some games. EQ2 and EVE both possess more depth; however, WoW is the median in the respect that all of my friends will actually play it together. Besides, it's a much more viable game when it comes to time management.
My recommendations would be Guild Wars or EQ2 if you don't like EVE. Also, EQ2 IS solo friendly now. Every update has aided in achieving this feat. It's a great game overall. If all else fails, AoC and/or WAR will most likely compensate for the crappy games we're having to deal with right now.
To be honest, participating in battlegrounds is heaps more interesting than raiding.
Taken what I've said back.
To OP, I know you said you played Vanguard, but I don't think you really played, and if you did it was a long time ago and obviously not very long if you are still playing WoW. It has a great crafting, tons of depth, lots of classes that are all interesting, and people are very helpful. I soloed all the way up, not exclusively, but you could if you wanted to.
Also, Guild wars is shallow as it comes and only fun is PvP, so I don't think people read your post, they just suggested games they played. And while we all want AoC and WAR to be the next best thing, we've all been filled with the same empty promises dozens of times so don't get your hopes up, what games are there are what games are there, don't get caught up in the grandeure that the grass is going to be greener soon, because it probably won't be.
Final note, I just played EVE yesterday to try it and I quit the same day. Though I'm sure its intriguing and I've heard it a million times, you coming from WoW... I can almost assure you its a waste of your time. Its the opposite of shallow in a bad way. It's like starting a new job that you sort of lied on your resume about what you know how to do for the job, and on top of that you are paying them to do the job. But I'm sure its great once you learn your job, and obviously some people like it, but I don't think its a good suggestion for the OP.
Actually, Guild Wars' PvE content is very enjoyable to some people. Just as you may not have liked EVE when many others do, some people do in fact like Guild Wars. I've never PvPed in GW, and I've found that all three campaigns -- while certainly not for the hardcore -- serve to provide a nice break between MMORPGs. Guild Wars provides a story campaign that does possess some depth, which is rare in an online game. Armor choices are limited, but the entire game is soloable thanks to the ability to have henchmen NPCs. There's no crafting, but once again, if the OP just wants a nice break, GW would suit that purpose. Also, it's not difficult to obtain a trial pass for GW, and the OP might want to give it a shot while he waits for another MMO. It costs nothing but a little time, after all. In addition, I would really recommend playing as many free trials as possible to get a feel for each individual game.
WAR and AoC may suck for all we know, but what else is there to wait for? If you like PvP, WAR will most likely suit your purposes; I'm a bit skeptical about AoC, however.
Finally, if the OP enjoyed WoW, he might want to take a look at Perfect World. It certainly has some issues, but the game does have more depth than WoW from what I've seen. It will have player housing at a later date, player characters can fly, and crafting is in the game already. Not to mention the music and graphics are pretty good, although that's a more subjective term.