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Why wow will continue to rule all others!
Warblaze
Member UncommonPosts: 178
Okay, i'm hearing all this talk about how World of Warcraft is going to lose its position as the number one mmo of all times because of games such as Age of Conan and Warhammer. To be honest, i find that statement to be absolutely ridiculous.
Blizzard is a company just like any other, it needs to be able to compete with other games that developers are releasing, their reason of existence is profit, period. If we look at games such as WAR and AOC, we can see that those games have some very neat feautures like mounted combat, player housing, Ships, etc etc. Blizzard knows damn well that they will have to keep up with this to stay in the loop so they undoubtly will add some of these features into WOW. That's not copying, it's called the evolution of the genre (and business strategy).
As a matter of fact, i'm sure that the BC wasnt such a big deal because of this. Blizzard is aware of the coming competition and they didnt want to shoot all of their gunpowder at once.
Seriously, everyone who's into marketing knows that big companies simply wont let go of a proven, money making concept. Simply dropping WoW would be the most stupid thing blizzard could ever do, they are making hundreds of millions of dollars with this game, be real! Instead, they will come up with a new expansion pack that not only would add new lands to explore, it will add a lot of new gameplay features like playerhousing, mounted combat, new area's, a graphical update, maybe even guild pvp, the works. Heck, they might even open up the sea for naval combat!
So in closing: Blizzard wont be dethroned. In order to compete with the others they will create a new expansion pack that will add most of the things that i have written above. Thus, creating a game that has just as much (if not more) to offer then AOC and Warhammer combined!
*reaches into his pocket and takes out a Large Shield of Forum Protection: +20 flameresistance
+20 Mental Strength
+40 forum invincibility *
Comments
Generally I would agree with some of the points made. It is true that Bliz would have to be daft to just roll over to AoC and WAR without a fight. However neither of those games have even been released yet, Bliz can not start kicking out the mother of all expansions everytime the new great white hope pops up, (and instantly dissapears) if they did they would be on about their 6th big expansion by now with WoW killers such and DnL and the mighty VSoH.
Also creating a patch of that nature takes a loooong time especially the way bliz beta things and it wwould have to have been in the works for a heck of a while and with the phenomenon that has become WoW there's no way they'd be able nor want to keep it under wraps, yet we have heard nothing of a new expansion.
Blizzard have proven themselves to be very wise devs and marketeers and I agree with your statment that WoW will be at the top for a very good time yet but I don't see them popping out any new expansions for a good while yet, apart from anything else they have their new project in the works.
Edit: It should also be noted on the 2 games currently being labeled asthe next WoW. AoC is going for a mature rating, yes this could be a ploy but either way it will reduce it's potential playerbase at release, also it will be in direct competition with WoW in most ways it is another fantasy MMO it will have to survive upon its merits in comparison to WoW, thats not easy WoW has had a long time to evolve. WAR on the other hand, imo at least, will be a more niche game. Primarily a PvP game have traditionally always remained fairly low in their sub numbers, there are a whole heap of people out there who upon hearing that the game is PvP will not give it a second glance. Ffa PvP'ers have always been a minority, with WoW making the registration pool that much larger they have become more in numbers but percentage wise they are still a very small slice of the cake, look how many people moved from PvP to PvE servers on WoW!
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The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
By the way... just to be clear on this, i am not a fanboi. I'm not playing this game annymore. Instead, i am waiting for Fallen Earth to be released
That sounds like a reasonable argument mrw0lf, and to some extend you are correct. But keep in mind that it is not necesarry to implement new gameplay features every single time some other mmo comes along with something new. It would be just as easy to wait a while and bundle the various new things into one single expansion. And i do agree that for most Studios this would be undoable, but Blizz has a déép pocket. They already are the mother of all mmo's... in the end it just comes down to adding new stuff.
I think Blizzard is not dumb..
If they dont upgrade WOW it will be, because they are getting SC mmo ready. to take over the market that way, and actually that would be the smarter move really.
Cause not only will they have base code to have stuff like sweet gfx or player housing.
they will be hitting the compition with Sci Fi which will take'em by storm, and dominate the MMO industry for both Fantasy and Sci fi
Thats what I think will happen
Miataka (+many sub variation of that)
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MiaTaka
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Miataki Valeinca
~EQ 2 (everfrost)
MiaTaka Soyinka
~Second Life
I know most of them moved to PvE server because world PvP was nothing more than griefing and there is no incentive to do world PvP in WoW. However, those going PvE wanted to hurry to max level, gear up, and do instanced PvPas proven by the numbers after cross realm bg was implemented but I don't know what those numbers are like now since I don't play anymore. Some friends still play WoW only for the instanced PvP and arenas but they are tired of the grind and want meaningful world PvP like WAR which is the game they are most anticipating even though they are not familiar with the lore and neither am I but I want to play it. If WAR PvP delivers as intended they could take a lot of the PvP base players from other games not just WoW. I suspect this is the reason why Blizz is offering incentives to do arenas with better rewards then PvP bg rewards because they have been hyping up their PvP system through marketing heavily through the arena matches. Hopefully through thsee competitve game development we will see MMOs get better and better!!
Regarding AOC, i would also consider reading something i wrote in another thread. It's post #26 on page 3:
www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/138300/page/3
players will just leave because they get bored and want something diffrent not because of WoW killers it happens to all games and it will happen to WoW to. just the way it is its still #1 now but no one and I mean no one will no for how long.
Also, this thread is not about wether World of Warcraft is horrible or not. It's about how long WoW will be the #1 game, a totally different subject. Learn to read.
Wow will gradually fall downhill a lot of people left after xpac. A lot of people left with LotRO, WoW continued to be the number 1 selling game in the market for box sales the second month of LotRO being released selling around 122k boxes in WoW and BC, also in the same note they banned over 100k accounts that same month. I'm curious to see if they continue with there current xpac every two years or are going with every year as they promised last year.
Im so so on the game myself soon as I can find something me and all my friends can enjoy im moving on. I've done so like three times now my rl friends keep coming back to WoW though. I think I'll finally be finished with the release of Warhammer but we shall see.
That is not possible, plain and simple.
Both AoC and WAR will feature entirely different combat dynamics, and Combat is what MMORPGs are all about. Further on, both AoC and WAR are built from second one with PvP as a central Point. WoW's PvP will always be and feel tacked onto it, because it is. You can't add proper PvP to a PvE Game.
So yeah, maybe WoW will feature capturable Orgrimmar and Ironforge, maybe WoW will feature Naval Combat, Mounted Combat, maybe WoW will feature Guild Houses and Fights (though I doubt so, because WoW is a Faction vs. Faction vs. Monster Setup, GvG doesn't fit into it), but matter of the fact is: They won't completely revamp their game (SWG, anyone?), and unless they do so, their PvP won't NEARLY reach AoC or WAR levels.
Instead, I believe it would be most intelligent to stay true to the WoW the Devs built, they should add more PvE Instances, Raids, Epic Gear. They should focus on their PvE, because the PvP crowd will largely leave WoW, wether they focus on PvP or PvE (for above reasons), so they should at least give the PvE crowd enough reason to stay at their Game.
WoW will lose quite some Subscribers, that's pure Nature, WoW isn't a God or anything, it's just a Game, and Games outdate at some time, and shrink in Playerbase. However, it's yet to be seen if AoC and WAR alone will dethrone WoW, I doubt so. (Not to forget neither one was made in order to dethrone WoW, both are simply made to be new, fun MMORPGs, one evolutionary, one revolutionary)
But in the End, who cares? I left WoW already because it was no fun to me anymore, play what is the most fun to you, and if someone has more fun playing another game, wish them the best and let'em go, who cares?
Hmmm, I would bet serious money that other games (you know, those ugly old games that are "realy better" than WoW) will lose far more subscribers than WoW.
People who don't play WoW will actualy be the people flocking to AoC and WAR, not the peope playing it.
That is not possible, plain and simple.
Both AoC and WAR will feature entirely different combat dynamics, and Combat is what MMORPGs are all about. Further on, both AoC and WAR are built from second one with PvP as a central Point. WoW's PvP will always be and feel tacked onto it, because it is. You can't add proper PvP to a PvE Game.
So yeah, maybe WoW will feature capturable Orgrimmar and Ironforge, maybe WoW will feature Naval Combat, Mounted Combat, maybe WoW will feature Guild Houses and Fights (though I doubt so, because WoW is a Faction vs. Faction vs. Monster Setup, GvG doesn't fit into it), but matter of the fact is: They won't completely revamp their game (SWG, anyone?), and unless they do so, their PvP won't NEARLY reach AoC or WAR levels.
Ah, i can certainly see where you are comming from... and from your point of view i would agree. But im not talking about a total pvp revamp. I'm just talking about adding additional pvp content within the already existing frameset of pvp mechanics. I dont see how that would be a problem since most people who are currently playing Warcraft dont seem to have major issues with the current way. Otherwise they would not still be there, playing it... a satisfied playerbase means a playerbase who sticks around. And in the end that's all that matters when it comes to mmorpg's.
So i am not talking about a total revamp of dynamics, its just about adding lots of new gameplay features without changing the core basics of the game. It simply doesnt need that change... WoW will be WoW. Glad you brought it up though, that was one point i missed in my opening post.
Yeah well...
As I already stated: I don't believe just adding additional PvP Content into the existing PvP Mechanics of WoW will do the trick. I see the WoW Playerbase divided into three to four Groups:
PvE Players: Those Players play WoW because they like the PvE, the raiding, the Dungeons, the Tier 5 loot. They like to chase the carrot on a stick.
PvP Players: Those Players play WoW because they like the PvP. They like the fluidity of gameplay, the Battlegrounds, the Arena. They play for the Thrill of PvP.
Mixed Players: Those Players play WoW, because they like the mix of both. Getting into the Dungeons, to obliterate the enemy Players with uber gear afterwards, so to speak. They PvP during the day, and in the evening they start the raids with their guilds or whatever.
(PvE Players who play PvP for the difference: Those Players are basically PvE Players, but who get bored over raids and farming all day. They play PvP from time to time to break the gameplay up a little)
Now two to three scenarios, what I believe could happen, IF Blizzard concentrated on X or Y in the next Expansion:
PvP focus: They add more Battlegrounds, more different Arenas, but only 1 or 2 new Dungeons, maybe a Tier 6. The PvE Players will eventually reach the Carrot, and find themselves with nothing to do in WoW anymore, and eventually go on to another MMORPG, or leave the MMORPG market completely for a while. Of course the "First MMO, best MMO"-Rule applies to many, so a rather big core playerbase will remain anyway. The PvP Players will test out the new PvP Stuff, probably find that it's only more of the same stuff they've already seen, and leave for more challenges, like WAR and AoC.
PvE focus: They add many more dungeons, maybe two new Tier 6 and 7 Sets. PvE Players will gladly chase the now golden carrot, and stay at WAR. PvP Players will whine at the lack of new content, and leave.
In the end... what remains is either a happy PvE Crowd, or a smaller, not really happy PvE crowd and maybe a small PvP crowd.
Just my assumption.
Didn't a guy post a message titled:
EQ will continue to be the main MMO! ... in 2003 or 2004?
The age of WoW is coming at an end eventually. Not sure WAR or AoC can even fit as a PH until BioWare come to claim pole position, but maybe they can. I also believe BioWare will ninja-release on us, whenever they are ready. This will reduce the initial lagfest and spread population a little over time.
I expect Blizzard to release another MMO to claim it back from BioWare about 5 years after the release of BioWare MMO! (No idea if Blizzard will succeed, they unlearn many thing with Furor and FoH).
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
Its a pretty safe bet WOW will suffer from some attrition just as a part of the natural aging of the game. Whether AOC or WAR will hasten this remains to be seen, but WOW will remain at the top of the sub list until the casual players tire of it and some other game comes along and catches their eye.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I remember seeing a video of a Blizzard Dev talking about the BC xpac before it was released. And he made it sound like BC will be the precursor or the groundwork for all the rest of the expansions. So I am assuming the rest of the expansions will be similar to BC.
More Faction to grind.
More Instances to Farm
More Battlegrounds to PvP in
Higher level caps
I loved WoW and played for a couple years but I am getting to a point where I need something more in an MMO to keep me resubbing. WoW's continuous faction, level grind and the over top need for the best loot in PvP turned me away.
Also, I love PvP. I will not play any MMO's for very long if they don't have a PvP system. WoW PvP can be fun in short bursts but after you log out you realize that you made no real impact.
As far as anything new in WoW's upcoming expacs? I would be surprised if they added a new class because the Devs already mentioned how it could throw off the established balance and they hinted to the idea that there is really no need for another class, all the classes you will every need are already represented. Plus, I think it would take them a long time to completely create a brand new class from the ground up all the way from lvl 1-80 (Im sure the level cap will be increased). Also, an all new skill progression and talent tree and epic class quests could take them along time.
I honestly think they will take a very standardized approach to churning out their expacs. New zones, factions and dungeons but I doubt they will dramatically change any certain aspect or add anything major because it would seem tacked on and superficial and possibly game breaking.
They will stick to the tried and true method of game design, the same approach that gained them 8 mill subs.
However, my personal opinion is that they will need to add some new innovative gameplay aspects for me to resubscribe.
They add more Battlegrounds, more different Arenas, but only 1 or 2 new Dungeons, maybe a Tier 6. The PvE Players will eventually reach the Carrot, and find themselves with nothing to do in WoW anymore, and eventually go on to another MMORPG, or leave the MMORPG market completely for a while. Of course the "First MMO, best MMO"-Rule applies to many, so a rather big core playerbase will remain anyway. The PvP Players will test out the new PvP Stuff, probably find that it's only more of the same stuff they've already seen, and leave for more challenges, like WAR and AoC.
Well, i really think it speaks for itself that a expansion pack should be fair and balanced. I dont see how this would be impossible to do... Also i'm not talking about the simple implementation of more of the same, like a few new battlegrounds or two extra dungeons. I am talking about adding totally new gameplay experiences (again, within the already existing game dynamics ofc). This game still has só much potential for new and original content!
WoW will definately have an impact when AoC and WAR come out because they are a good competition, from what we know anyways. WoW can afford to loose some people though they still have alot of subscribers and WoW has made tons and tons of money for Blizzard, I seriously doubt they will revamp their game, I would like to think that they know better, once you revamp a game you simply destroy it (SWG for ex) and loose your fan base who has come to love the game for what it is. If you still have some faith that Blizzard will all of a sudden throw a pvp expansion to compete with WAR and AoC it just isnt going to happen and here is why I think that its not going to happen. WoWs majority of subscribers and by majority I mean about 80% of the people subscribed to it are PvErs, some of you may call them carebears or whatever other retarded words you made up to make yourself feel better. It simply wouldnt make sense for Blizzard to worry about their pvp when their game is PvE oriented, and their subscribers want more pve. Those hardcore pvpers in WoW will leave once they get a 14 day key trial for WAR or AoC or any other game that they have been waiting on because WoWs pvp is weak and doesnt offer as many options and varieties as AoC or WAR but thats fine because WoW has created a huge fan base and they have alot of costumers to support them.
Btw we owe Blizzard more than a few thank you's for raising the MMO standard and simply making MMOs more popular in our society.
A man dies daily, only to be reborn in the morning, bigger, better and wiser.
-Playing AoC
-Playing WoW
-Retired- SWG
-Retired- EVE
-Retired- LotR
Computer (- Phenom 9600 Black Edition @ 2.81 Ghz (Quad Core CPU)- Gigabyte MA790FX-DS5 - 4 Gigs of PC 8500 ram (1066)- EVGA GeForce 8800 GTS PCI Express 2.0 - WD 500GB 7500RPM - Zalman CPU cooler (air cooled)
- 24" Widescreen 1080P HD display).
Like others have stated, WoW will no doubt feel some pain when the coming MMOs are released. But it definantly won't be "Killed" not for a little while at least.
All great things will eventually come to an end, and although i'm no World of Warcraft addict or as put 'fanboi' i do know a behemoth when i see one. WoW is a pretty damn good MMO and i can't lie.. the subscription numbers speak for themselves. However, like stated in the first sentence.. all huge and great things have an ending.. just like everything else. It will continue to float, but i'm sorry to say i believe it has already hit the iceberg. However, unlike the Titanic.. WoW will sink at a very much slower pace.. Its just going to take some time.
WoW has matured, its got an expansion pack, and is well known. Thousands upon thousands upon thousands have hit 70 and played over the origional game and the expansion pack. its been exploited and farmed. its base *horde* content (har har) has been seen time and time again. At this point.. its fair to call World of Warcraft a golden-aged game. Its seen its rounds, and is in the best days of its life. A nice subsctiption level, a good cash flow, an easy life, and calm waters on development... but just as we human beings retire and live the easy life from the hub of the busy work-life... soon we get older... and older.. and become too old to attract the gaming base's attention.
World of Warcraft was the right game for the right time. When there was little else to play and SWG was on the down-fall.. Blizzard launched WoW and took the MMO market by a sweeping kick. A perfect business move, whether they knew it or not. Its what put the game at the top, and with Blizzards help and work... it stayed there...
Soon though... soon.. just not right now.
Everquest - 2000 - '02
Anarchy Online - '01-'02
Earth and Beyond - '02-'04
Star Wars Galaxies - '03-'06('07)
World of Warcraft - '04-'07
Age of Conan - '08 - shelved.
-Waiting on-
Star Trek Online
SW: The Old Republic
Okay, it seems some people are mistaken about what i had to say.
I am not talking about revamping anything folks
I am all about the adding of new gameplay elements !
There's a major difference between those two
A cool new expansion wont bring back players that quit the game, they'll be busy playing something else.
Most players that have quit WoW hate a particualr aspect of the game, its an aspect that that lies at the core of WoW. I for one hate the rep-grinds for keys, the casual/hardcore debacle, pvp boringness, class-balance issues.
If an expansion perhaps fixed BG PVP, it might give me reason to play again but its doubtful. if they.....
-add 10 or more new battle grounds, 5v5,25vs25 more 40v40s. new game types.
-with epic rewards, epic quests and reputations for each
-new epic PVP sets and weapons
-old ranking except based on skill
-but no rank based gear[except for maybe a mount and tabard/cloak/title]
Blizzard killed BGs in BC.
Honestly, people will come back when an xpac releases..for about 6 months if there isn't another good game out to play. But the simple truth is..once people leave the first time..they are on their way out. The game got old, stale, boring, been there done that.
No matter how many cool expansions you add, eventually nobody will care anymore. There will be a core base of players that will stay for years...those who are easily satisfied, or those who finally see their chance to rise because the big dawgs have moved on.
What eventually kills a game, is when enough people become disenchanted and leave that the general player base visibly sees it....no players in the nooby areas, no friends left to group with. Some people will adapt, recruit new guildies, join a different guild, etc. But many more will simply take a break and wait for the next game their guild and their friends jump in to.
Also what happens is that the "oldschool" guys have their clicks, new people are shut out, so there's no one for them to group with, no fun to be had, so they'll move on after their 14 day free trial, not even having seen the vast majority of the games content. They'll say the game blows and they don't see why anyone ever played it, because they only see the first 20 levels of it before they get tired of playing by themselves. At that point they will go play the newest game out, because they know there will be people in the noob areas to group with, and/or kill.
Thats pretty much how it goes for any game. WoW isn't going anywhere soon, but its starting its slow fall into yesteryear.
Everyone knowing Blizz also knows that whenever a new game is about to launch, they'll toss out something faptastic.
The whole new singleplay end-game experience was announced a day before Lotro went open beta, wasn't it?
I hope they announce fantastic things with AoC and WAR,
might give me a reason to play again.
I like the WoW universe and what's in it. However I've "won" WoW (Per say) and have nothing else to do so, well, here's to WoW
*crosses fingers*
And, hey, if not, I'll be jumping onto WAR like a rabid squirrel on an old mans bag of nuts.
Win-win
But, to sum it up, yes, I do believe OP is onto something.
The juggernaught is well paid and intelligent ..
Played so far: 9Dragons, AO, AC, AC2, CoX, DAoC, DF, DnL, DR, DDO, Ent, EvE, EQ, EQ2, FoMK, FFO, Fury, GW, HG:L, HZ, L1, L2, M59, MU, NC1, NC2, PS, PT, R:O, RF:O, RYL, Ryzom, SL, SB, SW:G, TR, TCoS, MX:O, UO, VG, WAR, WoW...
It all sucked.
WoW will continue to win because it will always be the most mediocre game appealing to the most "center of the road" mediocre gamers... and azn grinders.
Of all that is written, I love only what a person has written with his own blood. -Nietzsche