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The "Goon Director I'm leaving Thread got deleted" here it is reposted.
PyscoJuggalo
Member UncommonPosts: 1,114
in EVE Online
dited by: eleuthereus on 31/05/2007 21:09:40
I am a Goon -- a director, no less -- about to give everyone an insider's take on:
1) life in 0.0 space;
2) the ongoing war in the South;
3) the BoB/devs/GMs "scandal"; and
4) the recent Goonswarm threadnaught against CCP that resulted in such a flurry of postings, accusations, arguments, name-calling, and all around traumas (see here and here and here).
I am posting in "General Discussion" for the benefit of everyone interested in such matters, especially empire pilots who may want to know a bit more about what it's like to live in 0.0 space as part of a large power block alliance. I am also posting this thread as a kind of cathartic purge, a way of putting behind me what has been a very long year and a half, and hopefully, move on to new adventures in Eve.
Allow me to begin by revealing the fact that I will not be in Goonswarm much longer. My roles have been deleted, my CEO has been notified, and my belongings are safe in empire. Let me further say that at this point that I am actually one of the more impartial/neutral, although by know means most knowledgeable, observers when it comes to the aforementioned issues. Why is that? There are a few reasons:
1. I have fought on both sides of this current war within a relatively short timeframe;
2. I have been in each of my alliances for such short periods of time that my loyalty/allegience has not grown so intense as to cloud my objectivity;
3. I have always prided myself on being as fair as possible -- i.e., I try hard to see where others are coming from.
TO BE CONTINUED -
Le Bon
Gallente
Sybrite Inc.
Posted - 2007.05.31 21:12:00 - [2] - Quote
Edited by: Le Bon on 31/05/2007 21:10:41
ibtcatl
(in before the continuation and the lock) Razz
Guillaume Yu
Freelance Assassins
Posted - 2007.05.31 21:13:00 - [3] - Quote
WOOT o/ second in a Goon thread, and before the lock
Yeah sig would be here.
Ah heck with it Bree time.
Yu
Moraguth
Amarr
Rangers
Posted - 2007.05.31 21:13:00 - [4] - Quote
me too.
/me gets popcorn, flamethrower, and flame-proof suit
good game
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:13:00 - [5] - Quote
Section 1 - Life in 0.0 Space
ALLIANCE #1: ASCN
Time In Alliance = 10 months
I joined Celestial Horizon Corp. under the leadership of the legendary CYVOK on Feb 9, 2006. It was my first player-corp; my first alliance. I was ecstatic. I knew a lot about ASCN. Who didn't? The alliance had been around since early in the game's history. It was powerful, large, respected. I thought it'd be a great place to make great friends and have great experiences, especially in 0.0 -- a place I'd never been. I was an agent-runner in empire back then, and proud of it. I figured I'd have plenty of time to get used to the idea of going to 0.0 before I actually made the trip. I was . . . let's just say, a bit hesitant. Then BoB attacked. The Pendulum War began in Sept. 2006, and I was called "Home" to help make a defense.
The next thing I knew I was in Feythabolis, being thrust into fleet battles when I had never even been on TeamSpeak, seen a dreadnaught (or carrier), flown to a POS, or been in a "gang." It was a real eye-opener. I was actually shaking and sweating, with heart beating almost out of my chest, as I flew toward my first fleet battle. I died - fast. I died rather quickly in the next battle, too. Of course, having no real idea what I was doing, there could harldy be any other outcome. Then, one day, much to my surprise, I survived a fleet engagement, and foud myself struggling back to the POS with 20% armor, hull on fire, smoke everywhere. It was glorious. A day later, I got on my first killmail. Soon afterward I got my first final blow! Then, CYVOK unveiled the first Titan in Eve when I happened to be in the same system. I stayed there floating in space about 50km off from him until he left, just snapping screen shot after screen shot -- WOW -- what a day that was.
For weeks and weeks I fought my heart out -- never ratted a single day. Running missions became a thing of the past. I'd just log in, find a gang, and fight. I thought we'd win. I hoped we'd win.
But as fate would have it, BoB outgunned and outsmarted us, fought under some absolutely incredible FCs, and had in place some highly competent spies. It quickly went from bad to worse, especially when BoB brought out its Titan. We soon lost a key system near our capital AZN, and then another system near AZN fell. Finally, our Titan died -- and down in its flames went ASCN. I was just about to be asked to take a leadership postion, too. Darn. Oh well, too bad for me. All of us were scattered to the furthest corners of Eve. I will always remember with great fondness my days in ASCN and the players with whom I flew -- mature, kind, intelligent, clever, witty, and loyal. I only wish I could have actually spent more time relaxing in 0.0. with them. Although I wonder if that's really the point of 0.0 anyway.
ALLIANCE #2: Lotka Volterra
Time In Alliance = 9 weeks
After fleeing Feythabolis, along with just about everyone else, I found myself flying though Omist, into Tenerifis, with everything I owned in a hauler and BoB hot on my tail. I quickly asked for sanctuary with adeptus gattacus of Lotka Volterra. They were, after all, allies of ASCN. What better way to continue the fight? They said, yes, join us. So I moved into Omist, then quickly into 77s (Detorid).
I met some great guys (and gals) in LV, and hoped I'd be able to kick back with them for a long time in 0.0 -- something I'd wanted to do with ASCN, but hadn't been able to do because of BoB's invasion. I knew LV had been at war with Red Alliance for over a year, but that whole conflict seemed stale-mated. So, I figured it'd just keep going on forever. I hadn't taken Goonswarm into consideration -- my error.
(TO BE CONTINUED)
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:14:00 - [6] - Quote
ALLIANCE #3: Goonswarm PART ONE
Time In Alliance = 3 1/2 months
No sooner had I joined LV in December 2006, I found myself fighting endlessless everyday -- again. Then, oddly, I suddenly found myself allied with none other than Band of Brothers!!! Okay, fine. Whatever. So I fought with BoB, side by side, and was able to see them in action from their side of the frontlines. Say what you will about them cheating, about their arrogance, about their Eve-O propaganda -- blah, blah blah -- but BoB fields some of the most experienced, skilled, intelligent, and crafty pilots and FCs in Eve. And their ships are fitted with wonderous toys. Unfortunately, they couldn't help out LV enough.
Lotka was literally swarmed over by enemies that just kept coming, and coming, and coming. I rememebr one night, during the battle of JV1V, we braced ourselves to fight against a fleet of 1000 enemy ships that were on their way. 1000! Sadly, the node crashed. Most of us in LV were unable to get back in, and well, that was really the beginning of the end. JV1V fell, as did 9-9, and 77s. I hadn't even been in LV for 2 months before my second alliance was already on its way to being destroyed!! Was I cursed?? It sure felt like it. And this time, I hadn't really gotten to know very many of the guys/gals too well. Nor was I tied in that closely with communications, especially because I had some RL projects I had to get out of the way. When I stepped away from the game for only a day or two to take care of RL business, I returned to find all my worldly 0.0 possessions (ships, mods, ammo, everything) nestled in a hostile station now under the control of Goonswarm -- my corpmates were all gone. They had fled in carriers and freightors. The entire alliance, in fact, would not last much longer. What to do? Naturally, join Goonswarm.
I really had no choice but to join Goonswarm, even though I had heard a LOT of bad things about them. I thought to muself, they can't be all that bad." And I had not personally run into them before or had any dealings with them as a player. So why not give them a chance, see what they're like. I'll always give someone a chance. Besides, they were already enemies with BoB, so it would be just like being back in ASCN -- sort of. Well, not really, but I'll get to that.
The night came, finally, when I simply convo'd a random Goon in local and asked about joining. He seemed nice enough, and told me I should convo Lenny Lowcut of Ultrapolite Socialites. I did just that. Lenny in turn asked me a few questions, then requested that we talk further on Teamspeak. "Sure," I said. So we talked - and again, he seemed like a very fine, upstanding guy. He said I could join the swarm -- IF I sang for the alliance on TeamSpeak. Huh? What? Well, okay, a bit odd, but whatever. I just happen to actually be a preofessional singer, so that would be no problem. I plugged in my keyboard and sang "Let It Be." WooHoo! Bravo! They loved it. I was in, and I was known from that day forward as THE SINGING SPY. "Hey," I thought, these guys aren't so bad after all. Kinda fun-loving and light-hearted about everything. Maybe I have a home now."
Alas, it was not to be.
TO BE CONTINUED --
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:15:00 - [7] - Quote
Edited by: eleuthereus on 31/05/2007 21:19:50
ALLIANCE #3: Goonswarm PART TWO
Now, without being too mean-spirited or rude, allow me to give my assessment of Goonswarm -- and moderators, please, this is not trolling (if you read completely, you will see why).
To be blunt, most of the pilots in Goonswarm might best be described as unholy hybrids born via crossbreeding between the orcs in The Lord of the Rings and skinheads. Or, you can just imagine an entire alliance populated with carbon-copies of Terance & Philip from Southpark. Goons are a bunch of uncouth, savage, crass, foul-mouthed, vulgar, immature, racist-epithet-uttering ogres who can't seem to say one sentence or make a single joke without using the worst of the worst profanity (or referring to some body function, bodily fluid, or body part, then giggling like a 10-year-old). Generally speaking, they are a pretty offensive crowd of @%^!@!^&, who are not very nice.
Now, bear inmind, what I have just said is NOT trolling. It's not trolling because what I have said wouldn't even be considered insults by Goons, but rather, compliments -- get the picture? As supportive evidence, I refer to the way they describe themselves as players and individuals. Consider a few of the remarks just from this week's Goonswarm State of the Union Address, as read by Mawg Spawn, May 30, 2007 (see *snip* - Karass). For example, Mawg plainly declared that corporately speaking, they do indeed share in common an "offensive sense of humor." He also made the following statemets, which are quite enlightening:
"We are fundamentally in this game to have fun at the expense of the people that we don't like, and that means 90% of Eve."
"We are not here to be nice. We are here to be a**holes that make the rest of the galaxy p**s themeselves when they contemplate being invaded by us. We accomplish this by being the meanest, cruelest, most sadistic group in the game."
"And we are proud of our pariah status. It is a badge of our warped honor."
"Griefing Pranks - We're jerks, we've always been jerks. When we try not to be jerks, we stop having fun. . . . We have had our most fun in this game when we have been at our cruelest. When we are nice, we get bored"
"Our focus in this game is wrecking people we don't like."
Aaaannnywho, that's Goonswarm -- plain and simple. Needless to say, not long after joining GS, I had pretty much had my fill of hearing Nig**** this and Nig*** that, Co***ucker this,********-that, and really sick of the word rape, rape, *****(as well as all possible permutations of rape). Don't get me wrong. I'm not a prude, by no means. But geez people, alright already! A male's sexual appendage, along with various holes and smells, can only be so funny so often. But I digress. The fact is -- I just never fit into Goonswarm. I am not a jerk. Not an a**hole. Not cruel. And I don't want to be around pilots who are. That's not why I come into this game. I get enough of that in RL with people I have to endure everyday. It was only a matter of time. And now that time has been fulfilled. I'm outta here. (TO BE CONTINUED)
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:16:00 - [8] - Quote
ALLIANCE #3: Goonswarm PART THREE
Time In Alliance = 3 1/2 months
I leave the Goons today, not only because of what I have already mentioned, but also because of their overall philosophy of game playing with which I disagree (this is not a problem with ALL Goons, only some of them, but from what I have seen, too many of them for my taste):
1. GS pilots engage in acts of piracy. I prefer an anti-pirate corp/alliance. Nothing against all of you pirates out there. It's just not what I want to be a part of. Pirating, of course, is well within game bounds and is a personal choice. And just not my choice.
2. GS pilots regularly scam noobs, trusting pilots/corps/alliances, and pubbies. I don't want to be a part of that.
Scamming, of course, like pirating, is well within game bounds and is a personal choice. And just not my choice.
However, I must also add on this issue that unbelievable fact that Goons have actually scammed noobs/pubbies seeking to join Goonswarm! The scam is to interview the pilot and tell them that there has been a problem with corp spies, theives, etc. and that in order to join goons there is a XXX million ISK collateral fee that is paid up front, which is then returned after X amount of days. I have seen this amount be as high as 400million ISK. The unsuspecting wannabe-Goon hands over the ISK, and is then told to f*** off. Ha Ha Ha. As one Goon posted on the forums: "goonfleet has never and will never recruit from pubbies, and has stated this time and time and time again, also there is a long and storied history of goons scamming pubbies looking to join goonfleet" (Telefishopolis, April 26, 2007, Post #31). The miost recent example of this that I found being guffawed at in the fourms occured in April. The chat between the pubbie and two Goonswarm members (Khefron and Dionysus Davinci) and a pilot seeking to join Goonswarm (dardwonder) was posted by Remedial on April 22, 2007 under the subject "A Great Corp Has 2 Cheaters." SO PUBBIES BEWARE - DO NOT TRY TO JOIN GOONFLEET OR GIVE THEM ANY ISK.
There was actually a time when even empire corps/alliances who wanted to join the Goonswarm Free Trade Zone were seen as potential victims of this kind of scamming. If memory serves me correctly, one corp was indeed scammed in this way. This, however, was stopped by The Mittani because it would have eventually ruined the GS plan to set up the FTZ. Oddly, The Mittani did NOT say stop scamming allies!!!! he simply said stop scamming them in this way using GS mains -- in other words, use alts and scam them other ways! I quote his post: "Don't do either [scam non-GS pilots trying to join the Free Trade Zone or the Swarm], it'd undoubtedly confuse pubbies about the FTZ. Scam them for other things that don't negatively impact our strategic interests (and thus make me want to stab you in the face)" (The Mittani, April 26, 2007, Post #1
TO BE CONTINUED
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:17:00 - [9] - Quote
ALLIANCE #3: Goonswarm PART FOUR
Time In Alliance = 3 1/2 months
3. GS pilots attack noobs in high sec. The most recent action of this kind being committed by Cardian, who used his raven to smartbomb noobs in Empire's Perimeter system (.95) at a popular station, resulting in numerous ships and pods destroyed (at least 1 hauler, 8 kestrels, 11 pods). These were not war targets. These were not enemies. They were simply pilots enjoing the game in hi-sec. Destroyed in the hauler was about 100-115million ISK worth of Dysporite -- hard earned, I am sure, by the pilot. Not funny, at least not to me. It's not what I want to be a part of, unlike many other Goons who thought it was funny:
"that is amazing honestly this man is a hero" (horace friendly, May 28, 2007, Post #12)
"If at least one of these newbies decides not to convert to a paying account because of this than you have more than made up for the $15 you paid CCP for this month" (Academion, GS director, May 28, 2007, Post #13)
"oh god this is the best way of protesting CCP, bone them out of new players. then, work standing back up, do it again" (Cymoro, May 28, 2007, Post #14)
4. And finally, in close connection to the last to posts I quoted in #3 above, there has indeed been talk about trying to ruin Eve gameplay or Eve-O forums for others. This is wrong, wrong, wrong. It is akin to some idiot shooting a bunch of people in McDonalds because they are angry at corporate America. I submit the following posts from Goon forums as examples of such negative aspiration:
"The easiest way to 'fix' Eve is to ruin CCP's credibility in the industry, and totally ******* ruin the launch and first few months of their White Wolf RPG by epic degrees of****gotry and griefing, so that the only thing they have left is Eve. Eventually someone will see them as a profitable takeover target, and a company that isn't run by ******s will buy them out. The headquarters for game development will be moved to a country that isn't populated by unprofessional ice nig***s." (Dawnfiend, post #1880)
"Trolling BoB threads on eve-o is universally encouraged" (Sesfan QuLah, GS CEO, "Standing Orders 5/30/2007")
So, now I leave Goonswarm. And, unlike the times I left ASCN and LV, I am glad to go. I posted all of this information about GS so that EVE can see what kind of alliance it is. Those of you who wish to join this kind of group of players, now know where you can go to sign up. Those of you NOT wishing to join this kind of group of players, now know which alliance to avoid. I have, in other words, by these posts, to my last day in Goonswarm, been faithful to my position as RECRUITMENT DIRECTOR - fulfilling my role. I have pointed people both to, and away from, Goonswarm -- depending on what kind of person you are.
TO BE CONTINUED
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:18:00 - [10] - Quote
ALLIANCE #3: Goonswarm PART FIVE
Conclusions
For all of you empire pilots, 0.0 can be very, very fun. It is a dangerous place to live, but it is also filled with vast riches and adventures. And its daily grind, although harsh, can bring together pilots in a way found nowhere else in EVE -- much the same way that adversity forges friendships in RL. Life in 0.0 is extremely different than in empire -- from having to constantly monitor local, to the need for cooperation with others, to the willingness to help out when needed, to the desire to put the needs of your alliance ahead of your needs. Hmmm, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few." Now who who said that? Hmm. : - )
My bottom lines from these first two posts are as follows:
ASCN = A tragic loss to Eve.
LV = I wish I could have gotten to know all of you better. You were a great bunch of guys/gals.
GOONS = No further comments.
UltraPolite Socialtes (my Goon corp) = You are all much to good for Goonswarm. Lenny, take your best pilots and leave GS for a more honorable, nicer, more mature, intelligent, level-headed, civilized alliance. You always treated me and our corpies with respect and honor. get out while you can. Goonswarm's days are numbered. They will be huddled in Scalding Pass, hated by Eve, and the forces of Eve will come to destroy you. Don't be caught there.
You will find all of the corp's BPOs I had access to, still sitting in the corp hangar where they belong, still tucked away nice and neat where I found them. See, I told you when I joined up that I wasn't a thief or a spy -- and that I never would be, not for you, not for anyone, because that was not how I played.
I want to point out, however, and this is important, that had I chosen to play my game according to the Goon philosphy -- i.e., "not be nice," play "to be a**holes," play to be "the meanest, cruelest, most sadistic" pilot I could be, play as a jerk, and be my "cruelest" -- then, my friend, you would no longer have any of your BPOs. I could have taken all of them in the true spirit of being a Goon -- an a**hole.
But instead, I leave you, and Ultrapolite Socialites, having been true to my promises. I leave with my integrity and loyalty intact.Good luck. Fly safe.
Threads to be Posted:
Section 2 (Current State of the Southern War - Why Bob Has Already Won);
Section 3 (The BoB/devs/GMs "scandal");
Section 4 (The Goonswarm Threadnaught)
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:18:00 - [11] - Quote
SECTION 2 - Current State of the Southern War
BOTTOM LINE on the Southern War -- It's over. Well, at least insofar as Goonswarm continuing to take space goes, and also when it comes to them holding Tenerifis, Omist, and Detorid. Goons are pulling out. They simply conquered too much space for them to maintain. They swept through 0.0 like they were . . . . BoB. But unlike BoB, they did not have the ISK, the experience, the leadership, or the advanced pilot skills/ships of general players to hold all that 0.0 space. So, now, after wrecking various empires, they are retreating back into their hole called Scalding Pass -- this, according to the GS most recent State of the Union speech (May 30, 2007).
My prediction is that Goonswarm will not be around much longer. If BoB destroyed ASCN, which had better leaders, better pilots, better discipline, far more isk, and wildly greater industrial backbone, well, the fate of Goons is fairly obvious if BoB ever said, "Time to kill GoonSwarm once and for all." It would not be difficult. GS is too disorganized, noobish, immature (on so many different levels), and undisciplined to hold together as a cohesive unit. Leadership is absolutely dismal at this point. No one knows what to do, where to go, how to proceed -- except, of course, to run back to Scadling Pass now and hunker down. ISK is short, very short at the moment in GS. The even featured a "We're Broke" thread posted last week or so, although Goons are about 80%-90% away from having enough materials/funds to build a Titan. Main CEO Remedial is gone. The Mittani, his successor, has quit. Our new CEO, or so it seems, is a fairly good FC, but a CEO? Who knows. I suppose he can't be any worse than The Mitanni, who ordered the now infamous threadnaught of this last weekend, then quit. A brilliant move. Some goons are angry. Others are just plain confused. Many of them are still just joking around and have no idea of what's really going on. And a few, to be honest, are too high or drunk to even realize they are still logged into the game.
Something happened between the week that GS took over the 9-9 and 77s area and now. Everything came to a grinding halt about 1-2 weeks after 77s fell. GS leadership seemd to simply run out of ideas and plans -- It was like, "Well, uhm, uhm, what do we do now?" GS went on a colossal rampage through the universe conquering system after system, with apparently no real plan that covered exactly how they were going to hold those systems. Ooops - big time. The GS forums quickly digressed into reveling about 1 or 2 BoB T2 ships blown up here or there at the expense of a two dozen frigates and cruisers. I kept thinking, "You guys have got to be kidding. THIS is how you're going to defeat BoB?" The war has actually been over for weeks now. And this week's GS State of the Union speech just made that official.
So, BoB, congratulations. You're basically mopping up now.
LV folks, if you're still out there, you'll prolly be getting back your systems real soon. Hold tight. It won't be long.
Threads to be Posted:
Section 3 (The BoB/devs/GMs "scandal");
Section 4 (The Goonswarm Threadnaught)
Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Sparta Alliance Posted - 2007.05.31 21:19:00 - [12] - Quote
IITMOAMP! o/
(In in the middle of a multipost!)
Also: TL;DR.
I mean I started too, then I saw how long it already was and realised I don't care THIS much..........
--------
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:19:00 - [13] - Quote
Section 3 - The BoB/devs/GMs "scandal"
Okay, I'll make these points short and sweet --
1.The main issue: It is the consensus among Eve players that: No alliance, corp, or player should receive in-game preferential treatment, expedited requests for information, or accelerated assistance with in-game problems via MSN, cellphones, email, or anyother means of direct communication with any devs/GM's/ISD members just because they enjoy friendships with such individuals. This is not an unreasonable position for Eve players to hold. Kinda simple actually. CCP should listen to their concerns.
2. And the corollary: Given the widespread mistrust of CCP due to the t20 scandal, and evidenced by the many posts in response to the GS threadnaught, it would be wise for CCP to implement and announce some new policies designed to prevent any CCP employee/volunteer from giving in-game preferential treatment, expedited requests for information, or accelerated assistance with in-game problems to any pilot, corp, or alliance via MSN, cellphones, email, or any other means of communication. Again, fairly simple.
3. A tertiary point: Any CCP employee/volunteer should be able to be friends with whomever they want to be friends with -- not only in the game, but also outside the game. And should, IMHO, be able to talk to those friends in-game whenever they want to talk to them. The problem to many players, of course, is when that in-game or out-of-game communication gives any degree of unfair advantage to a certain pilot, corp or alliance.
4. Furthermore: As has been pointed out by CCP, employees/volunteers need to play the game under a wide variety of circumstances on tranquility, in different areas of space, in different situations -- some of which can only be replicated during things like actual manufacturing of items, warfare between alliances, fleet battles, etc. Such scenarieos can only be experienced, obviously, by being in the thick of things to see what is going on. This allows not only continued improvements to gameplay, but expansion of content where needed, and the squashing of bugs. Most players probably understand and accept this, but probably just want CCP to assure them that it can/will be done without violating #1 above.
5. Finally -- After this controversy, it seems that CCP has to make some kind of an announcement, show of good faith, change in policy -- something -- to indicate to the player base that they can be trusted, and that everyone is indeed playing on a level field. I have no idea how they might do this. No one is paying me to think up a solution.
TO BE CONTINUED --
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:20:00 - [14] - Quote
Section 3 - The BoB/devs/GMs "scandal" - PART 2
To my mind, we still have several statement by BoB members that seem to indicate SOME Band of Brothers pilots not only enjoy friendships with CCP employees/volunteers (not wrong), but that these same Band of Brothers pilots use their friendships in-game to receive assistance, favors, help, and other perks. I submit the following three statements that suggest as much, all posted by Dianabolic, Reikoku, Chief Diplomat of Band of Brothers Alliance:
"You do realise that, in a previous witch hunt, the fact that many of us speak to the devs / gm's / employees of CCP on a regular basis as friends is already common knowledge? And you're now complaining thatw e speak to these people, who are also our friends, about stuff in-game?" (5/26/07 01:15:00 Post #335)
"We have a 'special' line (if you want to call msn that) to our FRIENDS. Even devs need friends, you know, they're not robots" (5/26/07 01:20:00 Post #347)
IN RESPONSE TO THE QUESTION: "So basically you do have a special line straight to the devs and presumably get special favors because of that?" [asked by Azerrad InExile]
"tbf guys, if you're all so offended by the fact that we've built up a relationship with the makers of this game over FOUR YEARS of playing it, perhaps you shoudl start acting your age and, instead of looking to sacrifice them for your own gains at every opportunity, engage with them to make this game what we all want it to be?"
(5/26/07 02:11:00 Post #510)
TO CCP - Clearly, these issue need to be dealt with ASAP to regain the trust of your player base. Forget about Goons for now. Time and other allinces will probably take care of them. Think about the rest of the corps/alliances that are troubled by the comments such as those uttered by Dianabolic (and BTW, dude, I hold nothing against you, personally)..
TO BoB - I know, I know, I know. Not all of you have direct contacts with devs/GM's/ISD/whoever - only a select few of you do. 1? 2? 3? 4? 5? Who knows? THEY are the ones everyone is, or rather SHOULD BE, screaming at and ticked off at. To the rest of you - keep being the finest pilots you can be. Keep your integrity, maturity, and training at the highest levels. Stand for what you know is right. To those BoB pilots who may be using their friendships to help BoB win -- you might want to reconsider such actions. I mean, really, it's not like you actually need it, mmkay? So, if you can see your way clear to it, just stop using inside channels of communiucation to CCP in order to gain an advantage -- even though, technically, it may not be cheating, using any such means of assistance in-game kinda goes against the spirit of fairplay. If you want to report a bug, or problem, or glitch, or whatever - I want to be the first to say, THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU. But beyond that, I think the other pilots in the game are asking you to please don't do it.
TO everyone else - Try to have fun. Now drop it and go have fun. CCP knows how you feel. If they didn't before this last weekend, they sure do now. Either they will, or they either will, or they won't do something about it. If you can't hang with that - then quit. If you can -- I'll see you in space.
Threads to be Posted:
Part 4 (The recent Goonswarm Threadnaught)
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:20:00 - [15] - Quote
Edited by: eleuthereus on 31/05/2007 21:21:13
Part 4 - The Goonswarm Threadnaught
I begin this final post with what I wrote in the offical thread that CCP opened regarding the charges leveled against CCP by Goonswarm (here). In Post #4227, May 27, 2007, I stated: "Do I agree with how this whole thing was handled by Goons? In all honesty, I just don't know. I can really see both sides of that debate. It was indeed an extreme action. Maybe too extreme. Perhaps far more dramatic that was needed. At the same time, many folks in GS just saw no other alternative. They truly did not. SO, they did what they felt they HAD to do to HELP the game -- not hurt it. As for me, personally, would I have done it this way? No. That's why I didn't participate in the threadnaught. I have only posted in this thread. And now I have said all I have to say."
Alow me to elaborate.
First, it is true that general speaking, most of the Goons, if not all of them, did actually believe that something nefarious had gone on with Sharkbait -- and they did actually believe that launching a threadnaught would help them, as well as the game. Believe me, or don't believe me. Whatever. That's the impression I got from most rank-n-file Goons.
Second, I saw NOTHING in the GS forum posts leading up to the threadnaught that indicated to me that there was some deliberate, planned, coordinated-with-the-holidays kind of assault planned as a way of bringing down CCP, EVE, or the Eve-O forums. This does not mean that no such plan was hatched by leadership -- i.e., the ones who gave the order, specifically, The Mittani. However, that kind of plot did not come through on the forums, in chats, or personal messages I received. And again, I couldn't see any rank-n-file Goons viewing the threadnaught as anything other than "hey, this will get CCP's attention. They're gonna HAVE to listen to our fears now." Also, the threadnaught was only released after The Mittani posted a fairly sedate thread on Eve-O asking about the perceived problems. It was quickly deleted (the worst thing that could have been done). Everyone saw one recourse as a response -- threadnaught. At the same time, however, I must say that the issues raised by GS should have DEFINITELY been persued for much longer through various other channels before going into siege mode -- in my opinion.
Third, I am not sure if anyone could have foreseen the ferocity of response from Goons when ordered to post on Eve-O. I certainly didn't. I mean, I thought maybe, you know, a dozen or so posters, maybe a few more, might post a couple times to a few different areas. But OMG! It shut down the Eve-O forums. That surprised me. And I am not sure that shutting down Eve-O was actually what the majority of Goons were after. So, I don't think that particular act -- threadnaught -- was designed to intentionally do anything malicious from what I saw/heard.
And now, I am done. I am sure that most of you are glad of that -- I am, too. I am off to run missions, buy, sell, salvage, and trade. I am worn out. The drama over this last weekend was the last straw. I am heading back to empire to have some fun again. Run some missions. Play in COSMOS. Maybe make a ship or two. Perhaps one day, join another corp/alliance. For now, though, I am on combat leave.
TO BE CONTINUED ---
TrevorReznik
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys Posted - 2007.05.31 21:21:00 - [16] - Quote
Originally by: eleuthereus A male's sexual appendage ... can only be so funny so often.
You take that back! It's always funny.
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:23:00 - [17] - Quote
Part 4 - The Goonswarm Threadnaught - LAST
I conclude with something I posted a few days ago when this whole mess started: "To all you BoB members who have been playing your guts out honestly, fighting hard with integrity, following orders, honing your skills, and becoming uber T2 pilots in the way that fairplay in this game offers -- I have nothing but respect to you and your accomplishments. And I am sure it's probably MOST of you in BOB. At least, I am hoping it is. Keep it up. I really have NOTHING against BOB per se. I have said this before. I am simply against cheaters and and disheartened by how cheating gives advantages to one alliance, while others are denied those same advantages. Any group that wins anything by those means receives, IMHO, a hollow victory" (Post #4227, May 27, 2007).
And again, I quote myself, "I have notihng against BOB as an alliance per se. Heck, I fought with you while I was in LV -- AGAINST Goons. I've even had several chats with Blacklight, who I very much enjoyed speaking with, and who I actually like quite a bit from what I know about him and my interaction with him. So, to me, at least, this is all JUST about fair play -- period. FOR ALL OF US -- you included. I would also add that BNC is actually my favorite BOB corp. From what I have seen, you are a great bunch of guys and I have often found myslef agreeing with much of what you from BNC have had to say. And I certainly respect Blacklight. If said to me, which BOB would you ever want to be part of, it would have to be BNC. Sooo, clearly, I have nothing against you, or BNC, or BOB per se. It's just all about getting to what is ture and having a balanced playing field for all of us to enjoy.
I have tried to be fair, impartial, honest, loyal, truthful, kind, firm, balanced to all sides. Flame me if you must. But as Winston Churchill said, "The truth is incontrovertible, malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end; there it is."
END/OUT
I am a Goon -- a director, no less -- about to give everyone an insider's take on:
1) life in 0.0 space;
2) the ongoing war in the South;
3) the BoB/devs/GMs "scandal"; and
4) the recent Goonswarm threadnaught against CCP that resulted in such a flurry of postings, accusations, arguments, name-calling, and all around traumas (see here and here and here).
I am posting in "General Discussion" for the benefit of everyone interested in such matters, especially empire pilots who may want to know a bit more about what it's like to live in 0.0 space as part of a large power block alliance. I am also posting this thread as a kind of cathartic purge, a way of putting behind me what has been a very long year and a half, and hopefully, move on to new adventures in Eve.
Allow me to begin by revealing the fact that I will not be in Goonswarm much longer. My roles have been deleted, my CEO has been notified, and my belongings are safe in empire. Let me further say that at this point that I am actually one of the more impartial/neutral, although by know means most knowledgeable, observers when it comes to the aforementioned issues. Why is that? There are a few reasons:
1. I have fought on both sides of this current war within a relatively short timeframe;
2. I have been in each of my alliances for such short periods of time that my loyalty/allegience has not grown so intense as to cloud my objectivity;
3. I have always prided myself on being as fair as possible -- i.e., I try hard to see where others are coming from.
TO BE CONTINUED -
Le Bon
Gallente
Sybrite Inc.
Posted - 2007.05.31 21:12:00 - [2] - Quote
Edited by: Le Bon on 31/05/2007 21:10:41
ibtcatl
(in before the continuation and the lock) Razz
Guillaume Yu
Freelance Assassins
Posted - 2007.05.31 21:13:00 - [3] - Quote
WOOT o/ second in a Goon thread, and before the lock
Yeah sig would be here.
Ah heck with it Bree time.
Yu
Moraguth
Amarr
Rangers
Posted - 2007.05.31 21:13:00 - [4] - Quote
me too.
/me gets popcorn, flamethrower, and flame-proof suit
good game
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:13:00 - [5] - Quote
Section 1 - Life in 0.0 Space
ALLIANCE #1: ASCN
Time In Alliance = 10 months
I joined Celestial Horizon Corp. under the leadership of the legendary CYVOK on Feb 9, 2006. It was my first player-corp; my first alliance. I was ecstatic. I knew a lot about ASCN. Who didn't? The alliance had been around since early in the game's history. It was powerful, large, respected. I thought it'd be a great place to make great friends and have great experiences, especially in 0.0 -- a place I'd never been. I was an agent-runner in empire back then, and proud of it. I figured I'd have plenty of time to get used to the idea of going to 0.0 before I actually made the trip. I was . . . let's just say, a bit hesitant. Then BoB attacked. The Pendulum War began in Sept. 2006, and I was called "Home" to help make a defense.
The next thing I knew I was in Feythabolis, being thrust into fleet battles when I had never even been on TeamSpeak, seen a dreadnaught (or carrier), flown to a POS, or been in a "gang." It was a real eye-opener. I was actually shaking and sweating, with heart beating almost out of my chest, as I flew toward my first fleet battle. I died - fast. I died rather quickly in the next battle, too. Of course, having no real idea what I was doing, there could harldy be any other outcome. Then, one day, much to my surprise, I survived a fleet engagement, and foud myself struggling back to the POS with 20% armor, hull on fire, smoke everywhere. It was glorious. A day later, I got on my first killmail. Soon afterward I got my first final blow! Then, CYVOK unveiled the first Titan in Eve when I happened to be in the same system. I stayed there floating in space about 50km off from him until he left, just snapping screen shot after screen shot -- WOW -- what a day that was.
For weeks and weeks I fought my heart out -- never ratted a single day. Running missions became a thing of the past. I'd just log in, find a gang, and fight. I thought we'd win. I hoped we'd win.
But as fate would have it, BoB outgunned and outsmarted us, fought under some absolutely incredible FCs, and had in place some highly competent spies. It quickly went from bad to worse, especially when BoB brought out its Titan. We soon lost a key system near our capital AZN, and then another system near AZN fell. Finally, our Titan died -- and down in its flames went ASCN. I was just about to be asked to take a leadership postion, too. Darn. Oh well, too bad for me. All of us were scattered to the furthest corners of Eve. I will always remember with great fondness my days in ASCN and the players with whom I flew -- mature, kind, intelligent, clever, witty, and loyal. I only wish I could have actually spent more time relaxing in 0.0. with them. Although I wonder if that's really the point of 0.0 anyway.
ALLIANCE #2: Lotka Volterra
Time In Alliance = 9 weeks
After fleeing Feythabolis, along with just about everyone else, I found myself flying though Omist, into Tenerifis, with everything I owned in a hauler and BoB hot on my tail. I quickly asked for sanctuary with adeptus gattacus of Lotka Volterra. They were, after all, allies of ASCN. What better way to continue the fight? They said, yes, join us. So I moved into Omist, then quickly into 77s (Detorid).
I met some great guys (and gals) in LV, and hoped I'd be able to kick back with them for a long time in 0.0 -- something I'd wanted to do with ASCN, but hadn't been able to do because of BoB's invasion. I knew LV had been at war with Red Alliance for over a year, but that whole conflict seemed stale-mated. So, I figured it'd just keep going on forever. I hadn't taken Goonswarm into consideration -- my error.
(TO BE CONTINUED)
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:14:00 - [6] - Quote
ALLIANCE #3: Goonswarm PART ONE
Time In Alliance = 3 1/2 months
No sooner had I joined LV in December 2006, I found myself fighting endlessless everyday -- again. Then, oddly, I suddenly found myself allied with none other than Band of Brothers!!! Okay, fine. Whatever. So I fought with BoB, side by side, and was able to see them in action from their side of the frontlines. Say what you will about them cheating, about their arrogance, about their Eve-O propaganda -- blah, blah blah -- but BoB fields some of the most experienced, skilled, intelligent, and crafty pilots and FCs in Eve. And their ships are fitted with wonderous toys. Unfortunately, they couldn't help out LV enough.
Lotka was literally swarmed over by enemies that just kept coming, and coming, and coming. I rememebr one night, during the battle of JV1V, we braced ourselves to fight against a fleet of 1000 enemy ships that were on their way. 1000! Sadly, the node crashed. Most of us in LV were unable to get back in, and well, that was really the beginning of the end. JV1V fell, as did 9-9, and 77s. I hadn't even been in LV for 2 months before my second alliance was already on its way to being destroyed!! Was I cursed?? It sure felt like it. And this time, I hadn't really gotten to know very many of the guys/gals too well. Nor was I tied in that closely with communications, especially because I had some RL projects I had to get out of the way. When I stepped away from the game for only a day or two to take care of RL business, I returned to find all my worldly 0.0 possessions (ships, mods, ammo, everything) nestled in a hostile station now under the control of Goonswarm -- my corpmates were all gone. They had fled in carriers and freightors. The entire alliance, in fact, would not last much longer. What to do? Naturally, join Goonswarm.
I really had no choice but to join Goonswarm, even though I had heard a LOT of bad things about them. I thought to muself, they can't be all that bad." And I had not personally run into them before or had any dealings with them as a player. So why not give them a chance, see what they're like. I'll always give someone a chance. Besides, they were already enemies with BoB, so it would be just like being back in ASCN -- sort of. Well, not really, but I'll get to that.
The night came, finally, when I simply convo'd a random Goon in local and asked about joining. He seemed nice enough, and told me I should convo Lenny Lowcut of Ultrapolite Socialites. I did just that. Lenny in turn asked me a few questions, then requested that we talk further on Teamspeak. "Sure," I said. So we talked - and again, he seemed like a very fine, upstanding guy. He said I could join the swarm -- IF I sang for the alliance on TeamSpeak. Huh? What? Well, okay, a bit odd, but whatever. I just happen to actually be a preofessional singer, so that would be no problem. I plugged in my keyboard and sang "Let It Be." WooHoo! Bravo! They loved it. I was in, and I was known from that day forward as THE SINGING SPY. "Hey," I thought, these guys aren't so bad after all. Kinda fun-loving and light-hearted about everything. Maybe I have a home now."
Alas, it was not to be.
TO BE CONTINUED --
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:15:00 - [7] - Quote
Edited by: eleuthereus on 31/05/2007 21:19:50
ALLIANCE #3: Goonswarm PART TWO
Now, without being too mean-spirited or rude, allow me to give my assessment of Goonswarm -- and moderators, please, this is not trolling (if you read completely, you will see why).
To be blunt, most of the pilots in Goonswarm might best be described as unholy hybrids born via crossbreeding between the orcs in The Lord of the Rings and skinheads. Or, you can just imagine an entire alliance populated with carbon-copies of Terance & Philip from Southpark. Goons are a bunch of uncouth, savage, crass, foul-mouthed, vulgar, immature, racist-epithet-uttering ogres who can't seem to say one sentence or make a single joke without using the worst of the worst profanity (or referring to some body function, bodily fluid, or body part, then giggling like a 10-year-old). Generally speaking, they are a pretty offensive crowd of @%^!@!^&, who are not very nice.
Now, bear inmind, what I have just said is NOT trolling. It's not trolling because what I have said wouldn't even be considered insults by Goons, but rather, compliments -- get the picture? As supportive evidence, I refer to the way they describe themselves as players and individuals. Consider a few of the remarks just from this week's Goonswarm State of the Union Address, as read by Mawg Spawn, May 30, 2007 (see *snip* - Karass). For example, Mawg plainly declared that corporately speaking, they do indeed share in common an "offensive sense of humor." He also made the following statemets, which are quite enlightening:
"We are fundamentally in this game to have fun at the expense of the people that we don't like, and that means 90% of Eve."
"We are not here to be nice. We are here to be a**holes that make the rest of the galaxy p**s themeselves when they contemplate being invaded by us. We accomplish this by being the meanest, cruelest, most sadistic group in the game."
"And we are proud of our pariah status. It is a badge of our warped honor."
"Griefing Pranks - We're jerks, we've always been jerks. When we try not to be jerks, we stop having fun. . . . We have had our most fun in this game when we have been at our cruelest. When we are nice, we get bored"
"Our focus in this game is wrecking people we don't like."
Aaaannnywho, that's Goonswarm -- plain and simple. Needless to say, not long after joining GS, I had pretty much had my fill of hearing Nig**** this and Nig*** that, Co***ucker this,********-that, and really sick of the word rape, rape, *****(as well as all possible permutations of rape). Don't get me wrong. I'm not a prude, by no means. But geez people, alright already! A male's sexual appendage, along with various holes and smells, can only be so funny so often. But I digress. The fact is -- I just never fit into Goonswarm. I am not a jerk. Not an a**hole. Not cruel. And I don't want to be around pilots who are. That's not why I come into this game. I get enough of that in RL with people I have to endure everyday. It was only a matter of time. And now that time has been fulfilled. I'm outta here. (TO BE CONTINUED)
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:16:00 - [8] - Quote
ALLIANCE #3: Goonswarm PART THREE
Time In Alliance = 3 1/2 months
I leave the Goons today, not only because of what I have already mentioned, but also because of their overall philosophy of game playing with which I disagree (this is not a problem with ALL Goons, only some of them, but from what I have seen, too many of them for my taste):
1. GS pilots engage in acts of piracy. I prefer an anti-pirate corp/alliance. Nothing against all of you pirates out there. It's just not what I want to be a part of. Pirating, of course, is well within game bounds and is a personal choice. And just not my choice.
2. GS pilots regularly scam noobs, trusting pilots/corps/alliances, and pubbies. I don't want to be a part of that.
Scamming, of course, like pirating, is well within game bounds and is a personal choice. And just not my choice.
However, I must also add on this issue that unbelievable fact that Goons have actually scammed noobs/pubbies seeking to join Goonswarm! The scam is to interview the pilot and tell them that there has been a problem with corp spies, theives, etc. and that in order to join goons there is a XXX million ISK collateral fee that is paid up front, which is then returned after X amount of days. I have seen this amount be as high as 400million ISK. The unsuspecting wannabe-Goon hands over the ISK, and is then told to f*** off. Ha Ha Ha. As one Goon posted on the forums: "goonfleet has never and will never recruit from pubbies, and has stated this time and time and time again, also there is a long and storied history of goons scamming pubbies looking to join goonfleet" (Telefishopolis, April 26, 2007, Post #31). The miost recent example of this that I found being guffawed at in the fourms occured in April. The chat between the pubbie and two Goonswarm members (Khefron and Dionysus Davinci) and a pilot seeking to join Goonswarm (dardwonder) was posted by Remedial on April 22, 2007 under the subject "A Great Corp Has 2 Cheaters." SO PUBBIES BEWARE - DO NOT TRY TO JOIN GOONFLEET OR GIVE THEM ANY ISK.
There was actually a time when even empire corps/alliances who wanted to join the Goonswarm Free Trade Zone were seen as potential victims of this kind of scamming. If memory serves me correctly, one corp was indeed scammed in this way. This, however, was stopped by The Mittani because it would have eventually ruined the GS plan to set up the FTZ. Oddly, The Mittani did NOT say stop scamming allies!!!! he simply said stop scamming them in this way using GS mains -- in other words, use alts and scam them other ways! I quote his post: "Don't do either [scam non-GS pilots trying to join the Free Trade Zone or the Swarm], it'd undoubtedly confuse pubbies about the FTZ. Scam them for other things that don't negatively impact our strategic interests (and thus make me want to stab you in the face)" (The Mittani, April 26, 2007, Post #1
TO BE CONTINUED
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:17:00 - [9] - Quote
ALLIANCE #3: Goonswarm PART FOUR
Time In Alliance = 3 1/2 months
3. GS pilots attack noobs in high sec. The most recent action of this kind being committed by Cardian, who used his raven to smartbomb noobs in Empire's Perimeter system (.95) at a popular station, resulting in numerous ships and pods destroyed (at least 1 hauler, 8 kestrels, 11 pods). These were not war targets. These were not enemies. They were simply pilots enjoing the game in hi-sec. Destroyed in the hauler was about 100-115million ISK worth of Dysporite -- hard earned, I am sure, by the pilot. Not funny, at least not to me. It's not what I want to be a part of, unlike many other Goons who thought it was funny:
"that is amazing honestly this man is a hero" (horace friendly, May 28, 2007, Post #12)
"If at least one of these newbies decides not to convert to a paying account because of this than you have more than made up for the $15 you paid CCP for this month" (Academion, GS director, May 28, 2007, Post #13)
"oh god this is the best way of protesting CCP, bone them out of new players. then, work standing back up, do it again" (Cymoro, May 28, 2007, Post #14)
4. And finally, in close connection to the last to posts I quoted in #3 above, there has indeed been talk about trying to ruin Eve gameplay or Eve-O forums for others. This is wrong, wrong, wrong. It is akin to some idiot shooting a bunch of people in McDonalds because they are angry at corporate America. I submit the following posts from Goon forums as examples of such negative aspiration:
"The easiest way to 'fix' Eve is to ruin CCP's credibility in the industry, and totally ******* ruin the launch and first few months of their White Wolf RPG by epic degrees of****gotry and griefing, so that the only thing they have left is Eve. Eventually someone will see them as a profitable takeover target, and a company that isn't run by ******s will buy them out. The headquarters for game development will be moved to a country that isn't populated by unprofessional ice nig***s." (Dawnfiend, post #1880)
"Trolling BoB threads on eve-o is universally encouraged" (Sesfan QuLah, GS CEO, "Standing Orders 5/30/2007")
So, now I leave Goonswarm. And, unlike the times I left ASCN and LV, I am glad to go. I posted all of this information about GS so that EVE can see what kind of alliance it is. Those of you who wish to join this kind of group of players, now know where you can go to sign up. Those of you NOT wishing to join this kind of group of players, now know which alliance to avoid. I have, in other words, by these posts, to my last day in Goonswarm, been faithful to my position as RECRUITMENT DIRECTOR - fulfilling my role. I have pointed people both to, and away from, Goonswarm -- depending on what kind of person you are.
TO BE CONTINUED
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:18:00 - [10] - Quote
ALLIANCE #3: Goonswarm PART FIVE
Conclusions
For all of you empire pilots, 0.0 can be very, very fun. It is a dangerous place to live, but it is also filled with vast riches and adventures. And its daily grind, although harsh, can bring together pilots in a way found nowhere else in EVE -- much the same way that adversity forges friendships in RL. Life in 0.0 is extremely different than in empire -- from having to constantly monitor local, to the need for cooperation with others, to the willingness to help out when needed, to the desire to put the needs of your alliance ahead of your needs. Hmmm, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few." Now who who said that? Hmm. : - )
My bottom lines from these first two posts are as follows:
ASCN = A tragic loss to Eve.
LV = I wish I could have gotten to know all of you better. You were a great bunch of guys/gals.
GOONS = No further comments.
UltraPolite Socialtes (my Goon corp) = You are all much to good for Goonswarm. Lenny, take your best pilots and leave GS for a more honorable, nicer, more mature, intelligent, level-headed, civilized alliance. You always treated me and our corpies with respect and honor. get out while you can. Goonswarm's days are numbered. They will be huddled in Scalding Pass, hated by Eve, and the forces of Eve will come to destroy you. Don't be caught there.
You will find all of the corp's BPOs I had access to, still sitting in the corp hangar where they belong, still tucked away nice and neat where I found them. See, I told you when I joined up that I wasn't a thief or a spy -- and that I never would be, not for you, not for anyone, because that was not how I played.
I want to point out, however, and this is important, that had I chosen to play my game according to the Goon philosphy -- i.e., "not be nice," play "to be a**holes," play to be "the meanest, cruelest, most sadistic" pilot I could be, play as a jerk, and be my "cruelest" -- then, my friend, you would no longer have any of your BPOs. I could have taken all of them in the true spirit of being a Goon -- an a**hole.
But instead, I leave you, and Ultrapolite Socialites, having been true to my promises. I leave with my integrity and loyalty intact.Good luck. Fly safe.
Threads to be Posted:
Section 2 (Current State of the Southern War - Why Bob Has Already Won);
Section 3 (The BoB/devs/GMs "scandal");
Section 4 (The Goonswarm Threadnaught)
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:18:00 - [11] - Quote
SECTION 2 - Current State of the Southern War
BOTTOM LINE on the Southern War -- It's over. Well, at least insofar as Goonswarm continuing to take space goes, and also when it comes to them holding Tenerifis, Omist, and Detorid. Goons are pulling out. They simply conquered too much space for them to maintain. They swept through 0.0 like they were . . . . BoB. But unlike BoB, they did not have the ISK, the experience, the leadership, or the advanced pilot skills/ships of general players to hold all that 0.0 space. So, now, after wrecking various empires, they are retreating back into their hole called Scalding Pass -- this, according to the GS most recent State of the Union speech (May 30, 2007).
My prediction is that Goonswarm will not be around much longer. If BoB destroyed ASCN, which had better leaders, better pilots, better discipline, far more isk, and wildly greater industrial backbone, well, the fate of Goons is fairly obvious if BoB ever said, "Time to kill GoonSwarm once and for all." It would not be difficult. GS is too disorganized, noobish, immature (on so many different levels), and undisciplined to hold together as a cohesive unit. Leadership is absolutely dismal at this point. No one knows what to do, where to go, how to proceed -- except, of course, to run back to Scadling Pass now and hunker down. ISK is short, very short at the moment in GS. The even featured a "We're Broke" thread posted last week or so, although Goons are about 80%-90% away from having enough materials/funds to build a Titan. Main CEO Remedial is gone. The Mittani, his successor, has quit. Our new CEO, or so it seems, is a fairly good FC, but a CEO? Who knows. I suppose he can't be any worse than The Mitanni, who ordered the now infamous threadnaught of this last weekend, then quit. A brilliant move. Some goons are angry. Others are just plain confused. Many of them are still just joking around and have no idea of what's really going on. And a few, to be honest, are too high or drunk to even realize they are still logged into the game.
Something happened between the week that GS took over the 9-9 and 77s area and now. Everything came to a grinding halt about 1-2 weeks after 77s fell. GS leadership seemd to simply run out of ideas and plans -- It was like, "Well, uhm, uhm, what do we do now?" GS went on a colossal rampage through the universe conquering system after system, with apparently no real plan that covered exactly how they were going to hold those systems. Ooops - big time. The GS forums quickly digressed into reveling about 1 or 2 BoB T2 ships blown up here or there at the expense of a two dozen frigates and cruisers. I kept thinking, "You guys have got to be kidding. THIS is how you're going to defeat BoB?" The war has actually been over for weeks now. And this week's GS State of the Union speech just made that official.
So, BoB, congratulations. You're basically mopping up now.
LV folks, if you're still out there, you'll prolly be getting back your systems real soon. Hold tight. It won't be long.
Threads to be Posted:
Section 3 (The BoB/devs/GMs "scandal");
Section 4 (The Goonswarm Threadnaught)
Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Sparta Alliance Posted - 2007.05.31 21:19:00 - [12] - Quote
IITMOAMP! o/
(In in the middle of a multipost!)
Also: TL;DR.
I mean I started too, then I saw how long it already was and realised I don't care THIS much..........
--------
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:19:00 - [13] - Quote
Section 3 - The BoB/devs/GMs "scandal"
Okay, I'll make these points short and sweet --
1.The main issue: It is the consensus among Eve players that: No alliance, corp, or player should receive in-game preferential treatment, expedited requests for information, or accelerated assistance with in-game problems via MSN, cellphones, email, or anyother means of direct communication with any devs/GM's/ISD members just because they enjoy friendships with such individuals. This is not an unreasonable position for Eve players to hold. Kinda simple actually. CCP should listen to their concerns.
2. And the corollary: Given the widespread mistrust of CCP due to the t20 scandal, and evidenced by the many posts in response to the GS threadnaught, it would be wise for CCP to implement and announce some new policies designed to prevent any CCP employee/volunteer from giving in-game preferential treatment, expedited requests for information, or accelerated assistance with in-game problems to any pilot, corp, or alliance via MSN, cellphones, email, or any other means of communication. Again, fairly simple.
3. A tertiary point: Any CCP employee/volunteer should be able to be friends with whomever they want to be friends with -- not only in the game, but also outside the game. And should, IMHO, be able to talk to those friends in-game whenever they want to talk to them. The problem to many players, of course, is when that in-game or out-of-game communication gives any degree of unfair advantage to a certain pilot, corp or alliance.
4. Furthermore: As has been pointed out by CCP, employees/volunteers need to play the game under a wide variety of circumstances on tranquility, in different areas of space, in different situations -- some of which can only be replicated during things like actual manufacturing of items, warfare between alliances, fleet battles, etc. Such scenarieos can only be experienced, obviously, by being in the thick of things to see what is going on. This allows not only continued improvements to gameplay, but expansion of content where needed, and the squashing of bugs. Most players probably understand and accept this, but probably just want CCP to assure them that it can/will be done without violating #1 above.
5. Finally -- After this controversy, it seems that CCP has to make some kind of an announcement, show of good faith, change in policy -- something -- to indicate to the player base that they can be trusted, and that everyone is indeed playing on a level field. I have no idea how they might do this. No one is paying me to think up a solution.
TO BE CONTINUED --
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:20:00 - [14] - Quote
Section 3 - The BoB/devs/GMs "scandal" - PART 2
To my mind, we still have several statement by BoB members that seem to indicate SOME Band of Brothers pilots not only enjoy friendships with CCP employees/volunteers (not wrong), but that these same Band of Brothers pilots use their friendships in-game to receive assistance, favors, help, and other perks. I submit the following three statements that suggest as much, all posted by Dianabolic, Reikoku, Chief Diplomat of Band of Brothers Alliance:
"You do realise that, in a previous witch hunt, the fact that many of us speak to the devs / gm's / employees of CCP on a regular basis as friends is already common knowledge? And you're now complaining thatw e speak to these people, who are also our friends, about stuff in-game?" (5/26/07 01:15:00 Post #335)
"We have a 'special' line (if you want to call msn that) to our FRIENDS. Even devs need friends, you know, they're not robots" (5/26/07 01:20:00 Post #347)
IN RESPONSE TO THE QUESTION: "So basically you do have a special line straight to the devs and presumably get special favors because of that?" [asked by Azerrad InExile]
"tbf guys, if you're all so offended by the fact that we've built up a relationship with the makers of this game over FOUR YEARS of playing it, perhaps you shoudl start acting your age and, instead of looking to sacrifice them for your own gains at every opportunity, engage with them to make this game what we all want it to be?"
(5/26/07 02:11:00 Post #510)
TO CCP - Clearly, these issue need to be dealt with ASAP to regain the trust of your player base. Forget about Goons for now. Time and other allinces will probably take care of them. Think about the rest of the corps/alliances that are troubled by the comments such as those uttered by Dianabolic (and BTW, dude, I hold nothing against you, personally)..
TO BoB - I know, I know, I know. Not all of you have direct contacts with devs/GM's/ISD/whoever - only a select few of you do. 1? 2? 3? 4? 5? Who knows? THEY are the ones everyone is, or rather SHOULD BE, screaming at and ticked off at. To the rest of you - keep being the finest pilots you can be. Keep your integrity, maturity, and training at the highest levels. Stand for what you know is right. To those BoB pilots who may be using their friendships to help BoB win -- you might want to reconsider such actions. I mean, really, it's not like you actually need it, mmkay? So, if you can see your way clear to it, just stop using inside channels of communiucation to CCP in order to gain an advantage -- even though, technically, it may not be cheating, using any such means of assistance in-game kinda goes against the spirit of fairplay. If you want to report a bug, or problem, or glitch, or whatever - I want to be the first to say, THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU. But beyond that, I think the other pilots in the game are asking you to please don't do it.
TO everyone else - Try to have fun. Now drop it and go have fun. CCP knows how you feel. If they didn't before this last weekend, they sure do now. Either they will, or they either will, or they won't do something about it. If you can't hang with that - then quit. If you can -- I'll see you in space.
Threads to be Posted:
Part 4 (The recent Goonswarm Threadnaught)
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:20:00 - [15] - Quote
Edited by: eleuthereus on 31/05/2007 21:21:13
Part 4 - The Goonswarm Threadnaught
I begin this final post with what I wrote in the offical thread that CCP opened regarding the charges leveled against CCP by Goonswarm (here). In Post #4227, May 27, 2007, I stated: "Do I agree with how this whole thing was handled by Goons? In all honesty, I just don't know. I can really see both sides of that debate. It was indeed an extreme action. Maybe too extreme. Perhaps far more dramatic that was needed. At the same time, many folks in GS just saw no other alternative. They truly did not. SO, they did what they felt they HAD to do to HELP the game -- not hurt it. As for me, personally, would I have done it this way? No. That's why I didn't participate in the threadnaught. I have only posted in this thread. And now I have said all I have to say."
Alow me to elaborate.
First, it is true that general speaking, most of the Goons, if not all of them, did actually believe that something nefarious had gone on with Sharkbait -- and they did actually believe that launching a threadnaught would help them, as well as the game. Believe me, or don't believe me. Whatever. That's the impression I got from most rank-n-file Goons.
Second, I saw NOTHING in the GS forum posts leading up to the threadnaught that indicated to me that there was some deliberate, planned, coordinated-with-the-holidays kind of assault planned as a way of bringing down CCP, EVE, or the Eve-O forums. This does not mean that no such plan was hatched by leadership -- i.e., the ones who gave the order, specifically, The Mittani. However, that kind of plot did not come through on the forums, in chats, or personal messages I received. And again, I couldn't see any rank-n-file Goons viewing the threadnaught as anything other than "hey, this will get CCP's attention. They're gonna HAVE to listen to our fears now." Also, the threadnaught was only released after The Mittani posted a fairly sedate thread on Eve-O asking about the perceived problems. It was quickly deleted (the worst thing that could have been done). Everyone saw one recourse as a response -- threadnaught. At the same time, however, I must say that the issues raised by GS should have DEFINITELY been persued for much longer through various other channels before going into siege mode -- in my opinion.
Third, I am not sure if anyone could have foreseen the ferocity of response from Goons when ordered to post on Eve-O. I certainly didn't. I mean, I thought maybe, you know, a dozen or so posters, maybe a few more, might post a couple times to a few different areas. But OMG! It shut down the Eve-O forums. That surprised me. And I am not sure that shutting down Eve-O was actually what the majority of Goons were after. So, I don't think that particular act -- threadnaught -- was designed to intentionally do anything malicious from what I saw/heard.
And now, I am done. I am sure that most of you are glad of that -- I am, too. I am off to run missions, buy, sell, salvage, and trade. I am worn out. The drama over this last weekend was the last straw. I am heading back to empire to have some fun again. Run some missions. Play in COSMOS. Maybe make a ship or two. Perhaps one day, join another corp/alliance. For now, though, I am on combat leave.
TO BE CONTINUED ---
TrevorReznik
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys Posted - 2007.05.31 21:21:00 - [16] - Quote
Originally by: eleuthereus A male's sexual appendage ... can only be so funny so often.
You take that back! It's always funny.
eleuthereus
Gallente
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm Posted - 2007.05.31 21:23:00 - [17] - Quote
Part 4 - The Goonswarm Threadnaught - LAST
I conclude with something I posted a few days ago when this whole mess started: "To all you BoB members who have been playing your guts out honestly, fighting hard with integrity, following orders, honing your skills, and becoming uber T2 pilots in the way that fairplay in this game offers -- I have nothing but respect to you and your accomplishments. And I am sure it's probably MOST of you in BOB. At least, I am hoping it is. Keep it up. I really have NOTHING against BOB per se. I have said this before. I am simply against cheaters and and disheartened by how cheating gives advantages to one alliance, while others are denied those same advantages. Any group that wins anything by those means receives, IMHO, a hollow victory" (Post #4227, May 27, 2007).
And again, I quote myself, "I have notihng against BOB as an alliance per se. Heck, I fought with you while I was in LV -- AGAINST Goons. I've even had several chats with Blacklight, who I very much enjoyed speaking with, and who I actually like quite a bit from what I know about him and my interaction with him. So, to me, at least, this is all JUST about fair play -- period. FOR ALL OF US -- you included. I would also add that BNC is actually my favorite BOB corp. From what I have seen, you are a great bunch of guys and I have often found myslef agreeing with much of what you from BNC have had to say. And I certainly respect Blacklight. If said to me, which BOB would you ever want to be part of, it would have to be BNC. Sooo, clearly, I have nothing against you, or BNC, or BOB per se. It's just all about getting to what is ture and having a balanced playing field for all of us to enjoy.
I have tried to be fair, impartial, honest, loyal, truthful, kind, firm, balanced to all sides. Flame me if you must. But as Winston Churchill said, "The truth is incontrovertible, malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end; there it is."
END/OUT
I don't like BoB, I don't like the Goons, and this post will not be responded to by myself for personal reasons that do not have to do with Eve. I am only posting this here because I like the Eve community and I know a large section of it posts here.
Thank You and good day.
--When you resubscribe to SWG, an 18 yearold Stripper finds Jesus, gives up stripping, and moves with a rolex reverend to Hawaii.
--In MMORPG's l007 is the opiate of the masses.
--The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence!
--CCP could cut off an Eve player's fun bits, and that player would say that it was good CCP did that.
Comments
It was a very good read.
It is being cleaned up and should be back in the eve forum soon, but it has been locked. So don't know how long it will last on the 1st page. I was luck to read it before the goon spam started.
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience"
CS Lewis
Actually read almost the entire thread. Pretty much describes the goons in a nutshell, a bunch of unorganized juveniles out for the themselves.
But of course all their silly antics this weekend just cements this thread.
Not to say that BoB is any angel in this, CCP is going to eventually rein in their power, just that the clueless goons were too impatient.
Well, the original thread didn't go anywhere. Its still on the front page of the E-O forums...
GOON DIRECTOR RESIGNS - MY STORY
I do not know too much about this war other than the T20 event that started it. I know there is hatred between both sides past that event, but I do not know what they are or how they begun.
After joining up with RISE (yes, an ally of BoB) it was nice to be able to read this. It is nice to be able to have something to compare my corp and alliance to. I must say, I'd much rather be part of RISE than Goons. Like the author of that post, I would not be able to take part in those such activities either.
(btw, before RISE I was a part of ASCN. Even though I miss them, I see alot of their positive points in RISE.)
You don't think the playerbase isn't utterly irritated with Goons? Or that we don't come into contact with their griefing, smacking or talk to people who've left?
No batphone, just an email address and no partisan ties other than wanting rid of a cancerous blight on the game.
why wouldn't ccp want it on the front page? i'll be surprised if it doesn't get a sticky.
so you have someone who jumped ship how many times? from one side to another in one huge war after another. yes, very reliable indeed.
i do like the quote from the bodders about how they're good buds with all the devs cuz they've been hanging with them for the past 4 years.
seriously, at this point, if you play eve, you get EXACTLY what you deserve. the one-sided cheating can't be laid out any plainer.
like i've said before, gamers need to speak with their wallets. griping and complaining about things only go so far. mass exodus from ANY game, speaks worlds more than anyone "working with" devs with their own agendas.
if goonswarm IS truly irked by the bodders; then, they'd leave, all of them, all at once. 5000+ accounts speak worlds more than anything else they could do.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Lol what did you expect from people, that call them self "Goon" jesus its in the corporation name ~~. Well maybe it would be more obvious when they call them self "Thugswarm".
Old ASCN pal Eleuthereus ... he would have never fitted in the Goonies. Its not in his character.
Basically he joined the group who controlled the territory where he (still) has his stuff. While most of the rest of us put the bulk of our things into NSC stations and/or relocated to a different part of the galaxy (usually The New Regions) to continue the fight against BoB.
And yes, its one hell of a game. After 3+ years one is still a noob .... highly complex, highly addictive .... strangely enough its a game you can play 12 hours a day or 5 min per month ...
Have fun
the below quote comes from http://vnboards.ign.com/eve_general_board/b22281/102815027/p5/?67
note - i do not make any money or profit from posting the contents of this post, if there are any ads on that site, they're not mine, nor is the site mine. i put this here because it was partially represented in the op. so please...
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Registered: May '02
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"You do realise that, in a previous witch hunt, the fact that many of us speak to the devs / gm's / employees of CCP on a regular basis as friends is already common knowledge? And you're now complaining thatw e speak to these people, who are also our friends, about stuff in-game?" (5/26/07 01:15:00 Post #335)
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"We have a 'special' line (if you want to call msn that) to our FRIENDS. Even devs need friends, you know, they're not robots" (5/26/07 01:20:00 Post #347)
IN RESPONSE TO THE QUESTION: "So basically you do have a special line straight to the devs and presumably get special favors because of that?" [asked by Azerrad InExile]
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"tbf guys, if you're all so offended by the fact that we've built up a relationship with the makers of this game over FOUR YEARS of playing it, perhaps you shoudl start acting your age and, instead of looking to sacrifice them for your own gains at every opportunity, engage with them to make this game what we all want it to be?"
(5/26/07 02:11:00 Post #510)
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[edit for CCP's double standards addition]
Now lets compare THREE DIAMONDS with following:
"I will now tell you the story of a GM, GM Eldini. Several members of GoonFleet attended the FanFest in 2006 and while there they befriended a GM by the name of 'Eldini'. This GM possessed the same sarcastic humor and wit that appeals to Goons and was invited to join our forums and partake in discussions that take place on our forums of which only a small percentage actually deals with EVE directly. After the to be expected period of "hey, a GM, cool" question and answer round, he settled in and was readily accepted as just another 'goon'. From the beginning it was made clear by the directorate that GM Eldini was just there to socialize and that any goon attempting to get any special treatment from the association, even in jest, would be banned. We wanted to protect both ourselves and GM Eldini from any possible accusations of bias. This relationship lasted for about a week before GM Eldini indicated that he was forced to remove himself from the Goon community and, while it was never stated, it was implied that his employment was threatened over the relationship. Apparently BoB can socialize with CCP employees but heaven forbid that another corporation or alliance create a friendship with a CCP employee."
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
http://vnboards.ign.com/eve_general_board/b22281/102815027/p1
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Registered: Dec '03
1. Continued use/profiting from known T20 BPOs (10 only 6 of which publicly admitted). Sabre BPO not worth much fumblerina? keep trying
http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=473335
Clearly if they can get away with it they will.
2. DB Preacher and Judicator(still BoB/Reikoku members) selling/transfering characters and ISK on Ebay for rl cash.
"Originally Posted by Judicator
Quote:
Originally Posted by db preacher
Hey bud... I got me new account.
It's called Jud1000
Gimmie a shout when you are good to do the transfer
cheers,
dbp
lol the Jud1000
Well, it seems the only really easy/free way per se is paypal. Was reading their site and its kinda confusing, their free account seems as if you cannot recive cash via credit card/debit card, but I think it's just that you cannot use it to sells stuff via EBay and ppl use their cc etc. PP and EBay are so entwined now it's not even funny.
Gonna hve to make an account.
"
http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?t=18
3. BoB account sharing rampant and in the open (violates the EULA but is selectively enforced only on non-BoB people).
http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?t=156
4. BoB's CEO posts real life information on a whistleblower player and that player has all accounts banned while Sir Molle continues being CEO.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/68611-Jumpgate-EVE-Devs-Update-Another-Chat-with-Kugutsumen
"If CCP is indeed banning him for these reasons, Kugutsumen told me they should ban Sir Molle, BoB's leader, for posting Kugutsumen's personal information as well. "He posted my name, company and told people to call
my office. Luckily, I own the company, but still." He also claims he never revealed any player's personal info, only the identities of the corrupt developers. "
5. BoB's current players and previous allies account sharing the Titan pilot account:
http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?t=369
"From the LV CEO Forum... director fags don't have access.
LV Lallante: "Hardly. Ghost or I will be on on Chow."
Someone want to petition Chowdown, Lallante & Ghost for account sharing?
Note: Lallante petitioned Remedial for sharing his carrier."
6. BoB Developers give BoB leadership inside-only intel on upcoming game events and exact locations etc. so BoB can amass it's forces exactly where needed minutes before the patch and make sure they get the rewards.
http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?t=73
""Originally Posted by Dianabolic
CCP are going to run an event in Fountain that lasts 6 monthts, including building a serpentis outpost, utilitising npc dreadnoughts and titans, installing npc POS that we're expected to take down, etc. This will coincide with NPC factions teaming up with player factions to fight other npc factions, for various rewards of whatever type.
Why haven't I blurted this out to all and sundry? You're all pissed off that I haven't immediately made a post on here saying OMG OMG OMG LOOK WHAT CCP ARE GOING TO DO, yet I was sworn to absolute secrecy BY CCP.
You think I WANTED to keep this from you?
You're all acting as if you've been mortally wronged. This event was meant to be a fucking SURPRISE. Molle ruined it.
Now I have to put up with Haze saying stuff that I absolutely fucking despise:
"Do this, or I leave".
Whatever guys.""
7. BoB developers use their GM accounts to safely scout out enemies moons and PoS's prior to invasions ... this has happened multiple times vs. multiple opponents.
http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=473335&page=2
"Posted - 2007.02.09 20:47:00 - [39]
Beyond all the things that have been brought up, I'd like to bring up an issue that came up yesterday.
A GM was spotted in a Polaris Frigate in 28y, warping from moon to moon. This was a day before BoB declared that they would attack us. We have screenshots, and the GM's name.
Frankly, I don't mean to be paranoid or accuse anyone of improper conduct without proof, but perhaps given the circumstances, some tinfoil hattery is justified.
Was there a reason for that GM to be checking out our moons? Is this going to be a regular feature of this war?"
8. Rigging the BPO lottery so it's hard to know of the 260+ BPOs that BoB has which were truely "won via lottery" by it's members over the developers tenure at BoB and which are legit? I'm sure BoB has a great revenue and could buy many of the BPOs. I'm sure BoB has researchers w/ lots of research points/ aka "lottery tickets". But if you can rig a lottery... wouldn't you only confess to the 1 transgression you are caught for and not the previous ones? especially in light of the velvet gloves treatment you can expect IF you're a member of BoB.
But alas Drabbz said it best:
http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=473335&page=105
"BoB is just another athlete caught using steroids and T20 is just another corrupt politician who will probably be (viciously) promoted for his efforts. Art reflects life!
Cheaters will never understand that the only ones they can really cheat are themselves; they would need a conscience to think that. "
-----signature-----LGM6 cap'd Retired
http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=Zatarra2 -- ML9 & ML10 vids new
grp end redux, 2.0 spec pts, Friar OR Pally dmg, 1k celerity
maybe we win vs paper bag
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
edited:
just to appease those deluded folks who still think ccp isn't corrupt to the core, here's another little tidbit. i'd like to know what exactly, that is owned by ccp, did K "hack" into? are bob's boards now ccp owned? because OF COURSE exposing devs cheating would "cause ccp staff work". every last one of you that's talked about K being a hacker, give me a list of everything that ccp owns that he hacked, or STFU forever for using that as a reason K was banned, because if it wasn't ccp property, then they just proved they don't jump from alliance to alliance (like someone without proof said), and they are best buds and bod leaders.
Lleu posted:
He broke the EULA. He was banned
wrong, he did not break the EULA. He didn't touch CCP's servers in any which way. He was however banned, a curious action since none of it was on CCP's servers but instead on BoB's - they banned him without direct reason, instead under vague spirit of game rules which anyone else would tell you is something BoB and the devs did, not this guy. It was damage control and coverup.
The guy you want to call a hacker is an MMO hero, plain and simple. He caught the worst thing that can happen in a player driven MMO; dev cheating. That guy should be given a free lifetime account and awarded a medal. Any MMO veteran who has seen GM and dev corruption in their gaming past would back me up on that.
From Lead GM Grimmi to our hero:
"Now, the accounts were banned, amongst other things, due to serious concerns regarding the alleged method used to collect the information you have posted on your forums. Hacking is a very serious matter and such issues cannot be taken lightly. However, our investigations have not turned up concrete proof of such criminal behavior and there is no reason for us to take action against you for that."
(to admit that they have proof would be to admit they have access to BoB servers)
now for the real reason this guy was banned:
"16. You may not engage in any activity that increases the difficulty and/or expense of CCP in maintaining the EVE Online client, server, web site or other services for the benefit and enjoyment of all its users."
In other words, this guy was banned for exposing the dev corruption, which was admitted. That's what it comes down to.
"It can be said with some fairness that the posts you made have caused quite the uproar and created an atmosphere that makes all our lives that much more harder. CCP does not condone cheating, for sure, but dealing with matters such as this one is not made any easier with all the ruckus."
Now obviously any reasonable person would tell you the dev cheating is what caused an uproar. CCP launched an internal private investigation, gave T20 a slap on the wrist at best, and banned the whistle blower -for exposing the cheating-. CCP is sending a clear message through this that anyone who tries to expose BoB & dev cheating will be perma-banned for causing an "uproar". That creates an atmosphere for corruption.
and now you know.
and i'd like to close with the following quote, made by CCP Arkanon
taken from http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=429 :
"I believed, and still believe that we owe our player community the right to be the focus of EVE, without paid employees using dirty tricks to swing our universe in their favor. Even playing by the rules, I frown on employees being power players to the extent that their gameplay results in any sort of domination over others. I don't believe CCP employees should run the EVE universe; that spot is reserved for the paying customer. EVE is a sandbox, but it's not our sandbox. We're here to keep it clean and provide the sand."
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Why are you causeing trouble? That post and all 28 pages of replies are on page two of GD as of one minute ago. Goons are lieing through their teeth cause they could'nt win against BoB
if eve would be 100% english speaking it would be like 1 or 2 corps controlling all of eve space, you know like what's happening in eve china.
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
if I were to kill a titan tomorrow and no CCP employees showed up to say grats I would petition it.
Waiting for: the next MMO that lets me make this macro
if hp < 30 then CastSpell("heal") SpellTargetUnit("player") else CastSpell("smite") end
Why would CCP help one alliance over another. Sure, I can see a developer doing it, but I can't imagine the entire firm helping just one team. At the very least, you'd think we'd see different developers helping different sides.....
Unless there's some sort of reason to favor BOB.... like to act as in game peacekeepers or trash haulers to take out corps that CCP thinks are detrimental to the gameplay....
or maybe, just to set up one major empire that everyone can fight back against.
Guess we'll never really know... but it is something to think about.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I suggested one reason the Devs may be working together in " The Solution" thread. Eve corps, players, and allainces can make tons of isk. Like it or not their is always a exchange rate from game money to real world money. Thier is honestly way to much money to be made playing eve. Ships worth 10k-15k amnerican dollars. How much does a Dev get paid a hr? How much can a alliance make a week? If you look at the numbers, do the math then take human nature into account well it starts to look like somthing that needs regulation if you ask me. Check my post out " the solution"
Nicely written OP. If you have ever been in the same sector with a Goon Fleet you would understand the level that they stoop to. Calling them uncouth barbaric pigs unfit to live in a sewer buried in maggot excrement would be rating them a bit high. Eve will be a better place once they are gone.
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