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Another rumor or Truth? Sigil Employees Terminated?

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  • AbraxosAbraxos Member Posts: 412
    Originally posted by Samuraisword

    Shouldn't Brad be the first one fired?
    I'm wondering if he isn't fired already? I hate to jump on the conspiracy theory bandwagon but now I am wondering if SOE's plan all along was to buy the game and they just kept it quiet to allow as much work to be done as possible by SIGIL before they took the game over and threw two developers at it to keep it alive on the SOE all access pass.
  • MrbloodworthMrbloodworth Member Posts: 5,615
    Sigil Employees Strive to find a new line of work. News at 11.

    ----------
    "Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me

    "No, your wrong.." - Random user #123

    "Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.

    How are you?" -Me

  • LidaneLidane Member CommonPosts: 2,300

    Wow. Just....wow.

    This thread has been a lot to take in. I'm sorry for the Sigil employees who lost their jobs. Getting fired sucks in general, but the way it was done to them is just harsh. Best of luck to them in any future endeavors. Maybe they'll find a better place, with much more competent managers in place.

    As for that post about Brad being an absentee CEO for months, if any of that is true, then he should be ashamed of himself, and he should never be allowed near game development funds again. If you're the CEO, you owe it to your employees to put in some time at the office. WTF?  What kind of goober lets his employees twist in the wind for months, while simultaneously blaming his game's failures on his most devoted fans? He sounds like a total prick if that was the case all along. I always assumed that he was there in the office, working alongside everyone else. If he wasn't there, especially at the most critical time of the game's launch, then screw him.

  • TniceTnice Member Posts: 563
    Originally posted by Abraxos


    We are only hearing part of the tale but in my opinion you can't blame anyone but McQuaid and Butler who sat on their thrones eating grapes while their kingdom burned below. If the blogs are true then they weren't even in the office to see it burn.
    I feel for the people that lost their jobs but alot of good things are coming. Maybe you can get on with SOE to make DC Heroes. At least it will probably be properly managed and have a descent release. Blizzard is hiring and you might could be a part of Starcraft Online. Whatever happens you will be in a better place than VG soon so keep your fingers crossed.
    As for McQuaid he definitely just needs to retire. He has no business going anywhere near another game. If anyone is stupid enough to hire him, at least make him sign a gag contract to keep him from posting his Barnum and Bailey hype all over the place. If he indeed spent the last two to three months riding motorcycles and drinking beer while his staff worked like dogs over a game he had already given up on then I hope he gets to read every negative "I told you so" article and have nightmares about WOW every single night.
    In some sense this feels bad but I believe it is for the best for the MMORPG community. Every game out there right now is paying attention to this trainwreck. AoC and WAR and other MMORPGs to come will have more polish and publishers will have more patience and not rush half done products out the door. One day we will have a 3rd gen game that offers something new and wonderful just like Brad promised over and over. He can at least think that he played a small part in that development by showing them an exact plan of "What not to do".....



    I think you can blame them all.  The Developers had to know this game was screwed.  While they throw roses at the feet of the incompetent Butler and McQuaid and went about their day-to-day screw-ups.

    I would not want anyone associated with such complacency involved on any game in the future.  If they knew what they were doing they would have left the company long before this happened.  Good riddance I say.  Companies that do this in the future should suffer the same way. 

    Also, although they can not be fired, the Vanbois that were so vocal to criticism during beta are to blame.  A lot of people on the beta boards including myself told them this game was crap but the Vanbois continued to praise the game to the bitter end.  They continue to try to spin it even now.  There is no way to spin it.  Vanguard sucks.

  • AcesquaredAcesquared Member Posts: 50

    If someone has the time and energy, could this post that everyone is talking about be cut and pasted to the forums?

    This links are blocked for me :~(

    Peace,

    Aces

  • tetsultetsul Member Posts: 1,020
    Originally posted by Acesquared


    If someone has the time and energy, could this post that everyone is talking about be cut and pasted to the forums?
    This links are blocked for me :~(
    Peace,
    Aces
    The first link:



    The axe finally fell. It was only a matter of time, I suppose. And while many of you may try to spin this to make SOE look bad, apparently this wasn't really their doing. You see, SOE doesn't own Sigil. It doesn't own Sigil now and they won't own them tomorrow. But they do own Vanguard. What fate awaits that game? I don't know. Don't particularly care either.



    But I do know that at approximately 4:30PM today, Sigil employees were told to meet outside. At which point they were terminated. On the spot. By whom? Doesn't seem to have been Brad McQuaid, if it was, nobody is talking. But that doesn't seem like something he'd do. But I suppose the executioner is irrelevant since most folks secretly want it to be SOE and it wasn't. As it stands, people were told to come back tomorrow to do their paperwork and some may get hired by SOE.



    I contacted SOE since I'm not in the business of burning bridges or spinning news and they had this to say:



    "...an announcement is forthcoming tomorrow."



    Update: There's some debate over this being ALL employees or just some of them. Obviously, it's not ALL of them - after all, someone had to do the firing. Let's just say that - from what I've heard - they don't have enough employees left to update a casual game... like Snood.
  • LidaneLidane Member CommonPosts: 2,300
    Originally posted by Acesquared


    If someone has the time and energy, could this post that everyone is talking about be cut and pasted to the forums?
    This links are blocked for me :~(
    Peace,
    Aces



    Paragus1 posted both of them in a thread here: www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/130020

     

  • ShaydeShayde Member Posts: 4,529
    Some info HERE for those blocked by netnanny.



    Damn, that's a cold shot. I hope all the employees find a better gig.



    While I hope $OE goes to corporate hell, I do hope all the employees get better jobs. Except for Smed and the morons.  That goes the same for Sigil... except for Brad. Bastard.

    Shayde - SWG (dead)
    Proud member of the Cabal.
    image

    imageimage
    It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled :( - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me.
    I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
    09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0

  • premiereboripremierebori Member Posts: 249
    Even though I understand that VG is not a very good game, I still feel bad for Brad, Sigil and its employees.
  • arctarusarctarus Member UncommonPosts: 2,581
    Brad should resign, to be responsible for what he have done! All the best to the rest of sigil's staff

    RIP Orc Choppa

  • LidaneLidane Member CommonPosts: 2,300
    Originally posted by premierebori

    Even though I understand that VG is not a very good game, I still feel bad for Brad, Sigil and its employees.



    I feel bad for Sigil's employees, but not for Brad. He's the CEO, and as such, it's all on his shoulders in the end.

    And if that post about him not even being in the office for the past few months is true, then he doesn't deserve any sympathy. What kind of leader leaves their team in a lurch like that? If there's any credence at all to that post, then he only deserves contempt for selling out his employees like that. The gunts at Sigil? Yeah. They got shafted in a big way, and it sucks. The guy in charge? Sounds like he did most of the shafting.

  • joeyfishcakejoeyfishcake Member Posts: 57
    I feel much worse about myself getting scammed out of 50 dollars than I do brad losing his job.
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 33,592
    Originally posted by Lucifrank

    Does this make Brad the George Dubya of the gaming world?

    Naw... George still has his job.... 



    Brad probably doesn't......


    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing POE at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

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    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • KenzeKenze Member UncommonPosts: 1,217

    LINK

    Message from Asquinol
    Sigil Games Online
    QA Tester


    I just want to take a few minutes to thank all of you that played on Test the past few months.

    It was an amazing experience. You are the best. I will always look back on this small but tight-knit community and feel a great sense of pride. We couldn't have gotten as far as we did without you.

    I have been around this industry since 2 weeks after EQ1 launch when I packed up and moved my butt across the country to take a job at a little game company called Verant Interactive...

    Throughout that whole time I thought EQ1 was tops on my list for the passion players had for the game itself, but you guys redefined my thinking. This community on Test is unique and amazing in so many ways and you all helped more than you could ever know in our attempt at making a fun game.

    I am sorry that Vanguard is not what we wanted it to be. We did our best and so did you.

    Thanks again for all the great help and I really wish you all the best in finding that "Golden Game" that we are all so desperately looking for as gamers.

    Q

    Watch your thoughts; they become words.
    Watch your words; they become actions.
    Watch your actions; they become habits.
    Watch your habits; they become character.
    Watch your character; it becomes your destiny.
    —Lao-Tze

  • sephersepher Member Posts: 3,561
    Originally posted by Kenze


    LINK
    Message from Asquinol

    Sigil Games Online

    QA Tester


    I just want to take a few minutes to thank all of you that played on Test the past few months.

    It was an amazing experience. You are the best. I will always look back on this small but tight-knit community and feel a great sense of pride. We couldn't have gotten as far as we did without you.
    I have been around this industry since 2 weeks after EQ1 launch when I packed up and moved my butt across the country to take a job at a little game company called Verant Interactive...
    Throughout that whole time I thought EQ1 was tops on my list for the passion players had for the game itself, but you guys redefined my thinking. This community on Test is unique and amazing in so many ways and you all helped more than you could ever know in our attempt at making a fun game.
    I am sorry that Vanguard is not what we wanted it to be. We did our best and so did you.
    Thanks again for all the great help and I really wish you all the best in finding that "Golden Game" that we are all so desperately looking for as gamers.
    Q


    Yeesh, he makes it sound like the game is dead.
  • MX13MX13 Member Posts: 2,489
    Originally posted by sepher

    Originally posted by Kenze


    LINK
    Message from Asquinol

    Sigil Games Online

    QA Tester


    I just want to take a few minutes to thank all of you that played on Test the past few months.

    It was an amazing experience. You are the best. I will always look back on this small but tight-knit community and feel a great sense of pride. We couldn't have gotten as far as we did without you.
    I have been around this industry since 2 weeks after EQ1 launch when I packed up and moved my butt across the country to take a job at a little game company called Verant Interactive...
    Throughout that whole time I thought EQ1 was tops on my list for the passion players had for the game itself, but you guys redefined my thinking. This community on Test is unique and amazing in so many ways and you all helped more than you could ever know in our attempt at making a fun game.
    I am sorry that Vanguard is not what we wanted it to be. We did our best and so did you.
    Thanks again for all the great help and I really wish you all the best in finding that "Golden Game" that we are all so desperately looking for as gamers.
    Q


    Yeesh, he makes it sound like the game is dead.

    Without the Sigil Dev Team, and in the hands of SOE, it is...

    I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!

    In fact, forget the SWG!!!!

    image
    image
    image

  • KedoremosKedoremos Member UncommonPosts: 435

    I just read the comments to that Grouchy Gamer spot and I don't know if its true or not but there are two comments that said some interesting stuff about McQuaid.

    "This is completely true.

    His communications usually involved inviting people to play Hero-Clix with him, or having others bring stuff from his office to his house because he couldn't show his face. One of his most recent emails to the company was a private message he got from a fan telling him how awesome he is. As if that was supposed to cheer us all up, that nerds online still think he's a cool guy. Ironically, the last time I saw him in the office, he parked in the guest parking."

    and

     

     "Jeremy Mautz said...

    This isn't the first time Sigil has done this either. I was working for Microsoft Game Studios on the internal test team. Moved to Redmond, WA. and signed a 12 month lease to be closer to my job. 2 months into the project Sigil pulled the plug on Microsoft Game studios and left all of us without jobs. Not only did they leave us high and dry but didn't even credit anyone on the testing team in the shipped product. So, not only did they screw us but we can't even prove we were on the project for future jobs. "
     

     

    image
    Life of an MMORPG "addict"
    For 7 years, proving that if you quote "fuck" you won't get banned.

  • AlienovrlordAlienovrlord Member Posts: 1,525

     

    It is unfortunate that others (the employees and the players) have to pay the price for the incompetence of a few. 

    Originally posted by Abraxos

    In some sense this feels bad but I believe it is for the best for the MMORPG community. Every game out there right now is paying attention to this trainwreck. AoC and WAR and other MMORPGs to come will have more polish and publishers will have more patience and not rush half done products out the door. One day we will have a 3rd gen game that offers something new and wonderful just like Brad promised over and over. He can at least think that he played a small part in that development by showing them an exact plan of "What not to do".....

    EXACTLY.  

    I've been trying to bring this point up earlier this week only to get dismissed by the Vanboi contingent on these forums.    They're always the same people who have been constantly trying to convince people to return to the game or make excuses for Brad M.    Funny how the rest of us could see what was happening, maybe now these others will stop hiding behind weak excuses and and face reality.

    Originally posted by Baikal



    Originally posted by Baikal



    Just kind of makes me wonder, and you'd have to buy into it to start....but anyone think he started losing interest when he realized that Vanguard was not going to be the game he originally envisioned? That the feedback during that period of beta was negative, the game was not close to ready, and that in order to make it more popular, he'd have to make fundamental changes to his ideal game?

     

     I think that's the first time he probably started to pay attention to what people were saying was wrong. It was easy for him to dismiss the earlier complaints, because there were so few people playing. He could rationalize things, but all of a sudden, there were far more people saying the same things, and I'd wager reality set it.



    It was going to release, it was going to release incomplete, and if it was going to be successful, it wasnt even going to look remotely like the game he envisioned and set out to design. As in, the boat sailed, and he wasnt on it.

    I don't want to misinterpret you but this sounds much like making yet more excuses for  Brad M because he 'lost interest' when people started to tell him that his 'Vision' was garbage.

    A competent developer would have paid attention to the negative feedback much sooner.  A competent developer would never have 'dismissed earlier complaints'.   He would have been prepared to make changes based on feedback rather than sticking to what he felt was the only answer and he would not have continued to spout about his failing game like it was the best thing since sliced bread. 

    If you're not trying to rationalize his incompetence then I'm sorry I implied such.  It's just the post sort of reads that way. 

     

  • KairBareKairBare Member Posts: 65

    This is great news actually, now I won't be getting temp bans every week for getting into it with those delusionally optimistic, a drop in a glass means the glass is full fanboys.  Also since the staff was let go I assume that includes the viral marketing team, you guys can come back and join us in the reality based community now.

    image

  • terrorantulaterrorantula Member Posts: 174

    Tbh all these rumours happened with SWG but none of them were true  lol, there will be a announcement soon as Smed said but tbh we'll have to wait and see, however i'm not going to believe anything until i see it. Even if SOE bought in their developers theres no quick fix for the mess Sigil created.

    Hopefully they'll just announce Forums or something and their future content patches and plans for the game.

  • MacroPlanetMacroPlanet Member UncommonPosts: 1,084
    I know this is saying alot..........







    but I hope SOE can turn this game around.  Brad is a loser and I hope he reads everysingle word everyone says about him.  Brad your a bum, I bet you don't even know how to turn on your PC.
  • terrorantulaterrorantula Member Posts: 174
    Maybe it's just a free trial
  • TniceTnice Member Posts: 563
    Originally posted by MX13

    Originally posted by sepher

    Originally posted by Kenze


    LINK
    Message from Asquinol

    Sigil Games Online

    QA Tester


    I just want to take a few minutes to thank all of you that played on Test the past few months.

    It was an amazing experience. You are the best. I will always look back on this small but tight-knit community and feel a great sense of pride. We couldn't have gotten as far as we did without you.
    I have been around this industry since 2 weeks after EQ1 launch when I packed up and moved my butt across the country to take a job at a little game company called Verant Interactive...
    Throughout that whole time I thought EQ1 was tops on my list for the passion players had for the game itself, but you guys redefined my thinking. This community on Test is unique and amazing in so many ways and you all helped more than you could ever know in our attempt at making a fun game.
    I am sorry that Vanguard is not what we wanted it to be. We did our best and so did you.
    Thanks again for all the great help and I really wish you all the best in finding that "Golden Game" that we are all so desperately looking for as gamers.
    Q


    Yeesh, he makes it sound like the game is dead.

    Without the Sigil Dev Team, and in the hands of SOE, it is...

    With the Sigil Dev Team they failed; in a big way.  Sigil had no track record outside of an overrated Game Designer named Brad McQuaid and his incompetent Lackey, Jeff Butler.

    SOE has a proven track record of cleaning up Brad's mess in Everquest1 and changing course on Everquest2 to make it a fine game.  They will not put millions of dollars into it because they would never get that money back with VG's 35k Subscribers (and decreasing).

    However, it is good to see that the spin from the Vanbois continues.  Keep the ball rolling.  I am still waiting to hear more how the Subs are increasing.  That one is my favorite.

  • KedoremosKedoremos Member UncommonPosts: 435

    No one would ever accuse me of being a Vanboi. That being said, I think it is more than possible for SOE to resurrect Vanguard and turn it in to a pretty good game. Why? Because it can attract a lot of players that EQ2 cannot.

     

    1. Remove Brad.

    2. ???

    3. Profit!

    image
    Life of an MMORPG "addict"
    For 7 years, proving that if you quote "fuck" you won't get banned.

  • AlienovrlordAlienovrlord Member Posts: 1,525
    Originally posted by KairBare


    This is great news actually, now I won't be getting temp bans every week for getting into it with those delusionally optimistic, a drop in a glass means the glass is full fanboys.  Also since the staff was let go I assume that includes the viral marketing team, you guys can come back and join us in the reality based community now.

    Delusions were the only thing supporting those posts.   Anyone else noticed how that 'These are just rumors' thread started by one of that crowd has mysteriously disappeared?

    Nice to see a refreshing dose of reality. 

    It's still unfortunate about the employees.  There was mention that some might be hired back and if SOE rids themselves of the Most Deluded One of all, maybe they can get rid of the black mark on Vanguard's name.   But it will be an uphill battle, Brad M dug a pretty darn deep pit for them to crawl out.

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