Thinking of giving this another try, is it really a grind?

Angelbound · March 2007

Ok well I didnt get to try it very long to do rl issues, anyways from what I did try it was ok but I didnt see much and couldnt get into many groups low levels, I have tried just about every mmo except the pvp based ones which im more of a pve fan personally. I am actually trying myst online atm but I think I need more then that so im wondering whats it really like in this game? Does it really feel like grinding or does it feel pretty differant? Does it get boring after an hour or 2 hours like in cox?

I honestly am not into grind games although my favorite mmo was eq1 mainly because it was my first mmorpg. Also I dont like hardcore games where it takes forever to get a sense of accomplishment, I hear in this game you set your own goals and can create maps and etc and im all for creativity I have one hell of an imagination why not use it in my gaming as well as my writing? And I love games with magic and future technology thats just awesome, I get tired of the typical shield and sword games.

Also I was not impressed with the lowbie fighting skills but when are lowbie levels ever that interesting? Anyways I would appreciate anyone sharing there experience on ryzom thanks everyone:)

dentom · March 2007

As there are no quests to gain experience (on mainland) the only way to advance in all the skilltrees is grinding.

But there are some things you should know about grinding in Ryzom...

First of all Ryzom is not a single player game. Soloing is quite hard I would say. But if you have a nice group you can rush quite fast through the levels to about level 100 in several skills. (250 is max in all skill trees.) So if you try to level alone you'll get frustrated fast. But the very helpful community will help you finding a group - just ask.

Second: you don't choose a class in Ryzom so if you're bored tanking after an hour, just put on your light armor and magic amplifiers and start healing in your group or practice other magical skills. You're very flexible in Ryzom and that makes leveling very diverse.

And if you're fed up with killing mobs you can switch to harvesting wich I find very relaxing and interesting. (Harvesting can be a real science - ask for help if you have problems!)

Creating Maps: Yes there is the scenario editor called "Ryzom Ring" where you can choose between pre-made maps. (No Terrain Editor unfortunately.) You can populate these maps with tents, fences, plants, creatures, NPCs, hidden chests, patrols, traps and so on. You can design quests and invite other players in your scenario and observe them accomplishing your tasks or listening to your stories. You can choose between the "dungeon master" mode where you can take the control over NPCs (to let them speak, walk etc.) or mobs. Or you can set the scenario to "masterless" then you're in the scenario with your own character.

There is a free trial of Ryzom. In this trial you have a lot of quests but I have to say that on the mainland you won't find these type of classical quests any more and are more on your own.

In the free trial you can also test the Ring. But you only have a limited access to the maps and NPCs. (In the free Trial you can only test three or four Maps and low level mobs and npcs - later you have more than 100 maps to choose from!)

After all I would say: Yes, there is grinding but it's much more interesting than in most other games I know. If you love questing you will be disappointed by the game. If you like telling stories and be a dungeon master you should take a closer look to the Ryzom Ring which is totally free and which you get automatically when you download the game.

Angelbound · March 2007

That sounds really awesome, and it sounds like you can play other peoples stories and quests, and personally I love storylines I like reading but quests arent everything if its as diverse as you say it may be pretty good thanks ill give it another shot.

Angelbound · March 2007

Also if anyone could be so kind and answer this main question, does it really feel like a grind to you?

Nevarion · March 2007

Originally posted by Angelbound

Also if anyone could be so kind and answer this main question, does it really feel like a grind to you?

For me, yes it does or rather did. You can get off the grind for sure but the bottom line stays the same in this aspect.

0k21 · March 2007

hmm I think it depends on what kind of game style you like, I agree with the top poster as i'm in the process of grinding now but the thing is about Ryzom, you can keep things interesting, your actually encouraged to branch of and explore, your not limited to the cookie cutter class types we see in more popular games, not only that but I find that the animations in this game are nicely varied, especially with the magic (I think I just stared a few times when I saw someone cast a simple heal spell) they really have put a lot of effort into the game it is easy to see that, but everyone has their own likes. One thing that I love about the game is that it reminds me so much of SWG, yes the skill system isn't like the way they had it where there were professions, but you have skill trees which you can branch off and specialize in depending on how much effort you want to put into the game, everything also has a use in this game, there is no 'loot' that you take off the monsters, no equipment is dropped, you get body parts and such when hunting yes, but these can ALL be used in crafting one way or another and you also can extract resource so this encourages for a player created economy. The interface in particular reminded me of it, particularly with the way the bars were placed and the type of font.

I would have to say just try it, mix and mingle and decide whether it's for you, if not, just cancel, you won't have any problems with customer service that's for damn sure, it's one of the best I have found in ANY MMORPG I have seen yet, you'll have to form your own opinions on it obviously but this is what I feel about the game the community is mostly friendly and also the grind does not feel worthless, you do actually feel like your making a unique character and being the sucker for titles like I am, you get those as well so if you specialize in healing you'll eventually get a title like a healer though I haven't even explored a lot of the game yet so I can't really say, I'm quite new to it myself.

Jamela · March 2007

Hmm, grinding. In my opinion, that's just a playstyle.

Each level requires more and more experience points the higher you get in any particular skill, so if it's levels you want then you'd best face up to the fact that higher levels require some degree of work. The most efficient way to get experience very often involves endless repetition of the same tasks, that's what grinding is to me.

There is nothing to say that's what you must do, though. I'd encourage anyone to try letting their character live a lot and work much less. Look around and explore, find a place to camp for a while, get to know the place, the regular residents, passersby, and all that the place has to offer. You'll gain experience naturally by what you do, without grinding, unhurriedly. Then you'll probably decide that there is some particular thing you feel the need to be able to do - maybe make your own jewellery - so you try to focus on that for awhile. However, long before you've learned to make each piece someone shows you a jewellery resource which you want but can't quite reach yet, yourself, so you focus a little on improving your foraging skill too ... then a little on your melee, to better survive your foraging accidents ... then you want to return a favour to that tribe that keeps saving your skin from the dogs ... I hope you get my drift?

Life on Atys is only repetitive hard work if you want it to be. It doesn't feel like a grind to me.

That's probably why there are a number of very long term players still living on Atys without a single Master title.

MaDSaM · April 2007

Exactly Jamela.

I´m on Atys for almost three years now and don´t have a single Master.

Because I don´t grind.

If you insist on getting to 250 ASAP in as many branches as you can manage, then go ahead and grind.

Nobody will stop you.

But just let me just quote a very wise thing that a player once said to me:

"The "winner " in a MMOROG is not he who manages to get to Max-lvl in two month and then does not know what to do anymore,

but he who plays for two years and still enjoys playing."

CU

SaM

Shaikura · April 2007

I tried to get into this game. Its fun for awhile,You really have to stay on newbie isle for a long time. I think thats why the free trial is unlimited. But once you leave, I found it to be a grind on the mainland. The quest are mostly fame based reward. So you really need to form up with other players to farm or become a harvester/crafter. In other words you will be broke most of the time. I give it high marks for trying to be different. It just wasn't for me. Beautiful game world though.

Gilgameesh · April 2007

Originally posted by Jamela

Hmm, grinding. In my opinion, that's just a playstyle.

Each level requires more and more experience points the higher you get in any particular skill, so if it's levels you want then you'd best face up to the fact that higher levels require some degree of work. The most efficient way to get experience very often involves endless repetition of the same tasks, that's what grinding is to me.

There is nothing to say that's what you must do, though. I'd encourage anyone to try letting their character live a lot and work much less. Look around and explore, find a place to camp for a while, get to know the place, the regular residents, passersby, and all that the place has to offer. You'll gain experience naturally by what you do, without grinding, unhurriedly. Then you'll probably decide that there is some particular thing you feel the need to be able to do - maybe make your own jewellery - so you try to focus on that for awhile. However, long before you've learned to make each piece someone shows you a jewellery resource which you want but can't quite reach yet, yourself, so you focus a little on improving your foraging skill too ... then a little on your melee, to better survive your foraging accidents ... then you want to return a favour to that tribe that keeps saving your skin from the dogs ... I hope you get my drift?

Life on Atys is only repetitive hard work if you want it to be. It doesn't feel like a grind to me.

That's probably why there are a number of very long term players still living on Atys without a single Master title.

I totally agree

Torak · April 2007

Originally posted by Angelbound

Ok well I didnt get to try it very long to do rl issues, anyways from what I did try it was ok but I didnt see much and couldnt get into many groups low levels, I have tried just about every mmo except the pvp based ones which im more of a pve fan personally. I am actually trying myst online atm but I think I need more then that so im wondering whats it really like in this game? Does it really feel like grinding or does it feel pretty differant? Does it get boring after an hour or 2 hours like in cox?
I honestly am not into grind games although my favorite mmo was eq1 mainly because it was my first mmorpg. Also I dont like hardcore games where it takes forever to get a sense of accomplishment, I hear in this game you set your own goals and can create maps and etc and im all for creativity I have one hell of an imagination why not use it in my gaming as well as my writing? And I love games with magic and future technology thats just awesome, I get tired of the typical shield and sword games.
Also I was not impressed with the lowbie fighting skills but when are lowbie levels ever that interesting? Anyways I would appreciate anyone sharing there experience on ryzom thanks everyone:)

Being a vet of many MMOs I see where you are coming from. Grind is a tricky subject. It all depends on how you play the game. If you are task focused and only concerned/centered on raising to another level, any game is gonna be a grind.

The reason so many new MMO's are trying to filter out the grind and cover them with the illusion of no-grind by adding in "1000's of quest" is because MMO players totally lost sight about what the games are about: COMMUNITY.

Ryzom can be totally different then many other MMO's mainly because its community hasn't forgotten what MMOs are about. If you just hang around for a few weeks and solo grind outside the cities, yeah, its a grind. It all depends on how you play it. I played Lineage II for over a year and never really had a complaint about the "grind", that is a community based game. The grind becomes non-exsistant if you are having fun, to have fun in L2, you need to be part of the community, you need to get into the politics and the drama.

When levels and mechanics becomes the focus of gameplay like WoW or many of the other new games, then yes, it becomes a "grind" because thats the focus. There is no need for community in games like WoW, its not about community and IS about achievment/advancement on an individual level and that means game mechanics have presedence over fun and community. Why "fun" because the game has predetermined goals which tell you, you are not allowed to do certain things until you reach a certain point, again, giving game mechancs the number one slot over community.

Buts that hollow gameplay because you have no impact on anything and everyone else is just like you. The players are 100% reliant on the NPCs and predetermined goals. There is zero freedom and zero opportunity for dynamic player impact. So the trade off is, do you want fast and directed gameplay or depth of gameplay that doesn't necessarly require mechanics as the main priority?

Any MMO is a grind if you treat it as such. So yes, if you are going to go in and rely on the NPCs to keep you entertained over the actual community, its gonna be a grind. If you are willing to look at Ryzom as an actual MMORPG instead of a race to level cap, then no...its not a grind at all. (but that can really apply to any MMO)

frkhot97 · April 2007

Many wise words in this thread.

To enjoy Ryzom as a PVE game there's absolutely no need for grinding. The world is interesting enough from the beginning and it's more about player knowledge than character level - in many ways. Solo hunting is dangerous and interesting but a very slow way to earn your levels.

Levels matter more if you want to PVP, but all guilds will get you double-xp crystals and help you get some XP.

xAlrythx · April 2007

Originally posted by Gilgameesh

Originally posted by Jamela

Hmm, grinding. In my opinion, that's just a playstyle.

Each level requires more and more experience points the higher you get in any particular skill, so if it's levels you want then you'd best face up to the fact that higher levels require some degree of work. The most efficient way to get experience very often involves endless repetition of the same tasks, that's what grinding is to me.

There is nothing to say that's what you must do, though. I'd encourage anyone to try letting their character live a lot and work much less. Look around and explore, find a place to camp for a while, get to know the place, the regular residents, passersby, and all that the place has to offer. You'll gain experience naturally by what you do, without grinding, unhurriedly. Then you'll probably decide that there is some particular thing you feel the need to be able to do - maybe make your own jewellery - so you try to focus on that for awhile. However, long before you've learned to make each piece someone shows you a jewellery resource which you want but can't quite reach yet, yourself, so you focus a little on improving your foraging skill too ... then a little on your melee, to better survive your foraging accidents ... then you want to return a favour to that tribe that keeps saving your skin from the dogs ... I hope you get my drift?

Life on Atys is only repetitive hard work if you want it to be. It doesn't feel like a grind to me.

That's probably why there are a number of very long term players still living on Atys without a single Master title.

I totally agree

I agree 100%, because it's the truth.

Grind is in the mind

It's like when I say to someone, Lineage 2 is no more of a grind than WoW. The games are as casual as you make them. Play what you find enjoyable.

Then I just get called an idiot. Makes no sense really does it? How can one game be more of a grind than another? It all comes down to what you enjoy doing in the game, or working towards and how much you do of that.

Torak · April 2007

Originally posted by xAlrythx

Originally posted by Gilgameesh

Originally posted by Jamela

I totally agree

I agree 100%, because it's the truth.

Grind is in the mind

It's like when I say to someone, Lineage 2 is no more of a grind than WoW. The games are as casual as you make them. Play what you find enjoyable.

Then I just get called an idiot. Makes no sense really does it? How can one game be more of a grind than another? It all comes down to what you enjoy doing in the game, or working towards and how much you do of that.

I agree with that. In fact I would say WoW was MORE of a grind it was just in a different place. The grind was hidden in the endgame. (like there should be an endgame in an MMO lol)

xAlrythx · April 2007

Originally posted by Torak

I agree with that. In fact I would say WoW was MORE of a grind it was just in a different place. The grind was hidden in the endgame. (like there should be an endgame in an MMO lol)

Oh yeah I agree, I just didn't want to say it haha.

I think WoW is the biggest grind of them all, if your not doing endgame which consists of PvP gear assumption or PvE gear assumption, then you are pointlessly re-rolling toons. Either way is technically a grind. Sure you have fun doing both (well not me), but if people want to talk grind then WoW is the king in my eyes.

EggFtegg · April 2007

Other than the outpost battles, there's pretty much the same enjoyment in playing at any level in Ryzom. Having no end game, means that there's really no particular reason or need to rush your levels, so you can concentrate on other aspects of the game.

Having said that, the level cap is so high, and the skills split in so many ways, that if you want your game to be about grinding levels, you have the scope to keep grinding for literally years before you max everything out.

Torak · April 2007

Originally posted by xAlrythx

Originally posted by Torak

I agree with that. In fact I would say WoW was MORE of a grind it was just in a different place. The grind was hidden in the endgame. (like there should be an endgame in an MMO lol)

Oh yeah I agree, I just didn't want to say it haha.

I think WoW is the biggest grind of them all, if your not doing endgame which consists of PvP gear assumption or PvE gear assumption, then you are pointlessly re-rolling toons. Either way is technically a grind. Sure you have fun doing both (well not me), but if people want to talk grind then WoW is the king in my eyes.

Exactly my point...WoW is not a virtual world at all, its a video game with more in common with Super Mario Brothers or any other console game then MMORPG's. L2 on the other hand, while grind was a primary aspect it was not the point or catalyst of the game, the sieges are. Castles provided economic control of an area and taxation. Grinding is just one aspect of many in L2 the community is what drives the game, they totally control the gameworld JUST LIKE Ryzom. In WoW the mechanics drive the game and the community is meaningless as they have no impact on anything other then collecting a piece of loot. (same situation in LotR and most other MMOs)

WoW players have more in common with puppy dogs, eager to please, run out and play fetch and come back for a pat on the head and maybe a shiny loot treat by the master NPC.

xAlrythx · April 2007

Originally posted by Torak

Originally posted by xAlrythx

Originally posted by Torak

I agree with that. In fact I would say WoW was MORE of a grind it was just in a different place. The grind was hidden in the endgame. (like there should be an endgame in an MMO lol)

Oh yeah I agree, I just didn't want to say it haha.

I think WoW is the biggest grind of them all, if your not doing endgame which consists of PvP gear assumption or PvE gear assumption, then you are pointlessly re-rolling toons. Either way is technically a grind. Sure you have fun doing both (well not me), but if people want to talk grind then WoW is the king in my eyes.

Exactly my point...WoW is not a virtual world at all, its a video game with more in common with Super Mario Brothers or any other console game then MMORPG's. L2 on the other hand, while grind was a primary aspect it was not the point or catalyst of the game, the sieges are. Castles provided economic control of an area and taxation. Grinding is just one aspect of many in L2 the community is what drives the game, they totally control the gameworld JUST LIKE Ryzom. In WoW the mechanics drive the game and the community is meaningless as they have no impact on anything other then collecting a piece of loot. (same situation in LotR and most other MMOs)

WoW players have more in common with puppy dogs, eager to please, run out and play fetch and come back for a pat on the head and maybe a shiny loot treat by the master NPC.

That's pretty much it isn't it? WoW is not a virtual world, so simple and truthful, best thing I have heard on these forums, portrays my views so simply. I don't like being told what to do, where to go, what to kill almost 100% of the time and I can't really understand why anyone else would frankly. I hate the feeling of being on a track.

The game itself might not be meaningless, because that could be argued for all games, but the community certainly is. As meaningless as you could get. No effect upon the world at all.

0k21 · April 2007

That's so true, in WoW I always felt i had nothing to do except grind simply because of the way the levelling was introduce to me and I felt very much my hand was being held all the way to level 60 and there was nothing else to explore or different things to do. A game even though it is offline did the exact opposite for me, Elder Scrolls Oblivion is something I still find myself playing because of it's sheer scale, size and just all round fun, when I get bored or just want to do something different, even while in that game, I actually go out and explore the different areas in the game and it's practically limitless in where you walk not to mention when you've got a really good computer the graphics are just drop dead brilliant.

Ryzom has that same kind of flavor to it which is why I'm sticking to it for now, I also feel that I'm not needed as much in the game as I was with WoW since the levelling is very casual, but I just wish someone would create something like Oblivion except online, not only would it be just amazing, but it would actually be fun to play and wouldn't feel much like a grind.

Torak · April 2007

I agree again, I have no issues with taking that nasty grind out of MMO's, it pretty much goes against what an "RPG" is.

Morrowind and Oblivion succeed in one aspect many MMO's fail, they create a pretty good virtual world that participate in. If that was build on, yes they would be great MMO's. The focus of Oblivion for example is not grinding out levels, in fact the removal of concern about level is sort of what set the game apart. You got to be heroic and do the story without having to worry about grinding up as the game leveled to you. It was an interesting idea.

I am guessing that your feeling "needed" in Ryzom will grow as you get more involved with the community, otherwise you will feel isolated and alone and will eventually get bored of just grinding on mobs, like any other game.

naturethings · April 2007

It sounds like there are some really cool features in this game, but will people really grind for that long? Also, if you don't already have a group to play with, going solo the first few levels could make the game hard to get into.

Jamela · April 2007

Sorry, but did you only read the original post? In fact, countless people have already ground out multiple Masters, but most people replying to this thread would encourage you not to do the same - if you find grinding tedious - there's no need to.

Ryzom is almost entirely soloable, and with the exception of foraging the first levels fly by like the wind as you run through the training missions.

Ryzzen · April 2007

This game sounds pretty interesting i may have to give it a try.

Torak · April 2007

Originally posted by Ryzzen

This game sounds pretty interesting i may have to give it a try.

You may as well, it has an unlimited free trial. Play as long as you want, you are just stuck on the starter island. If you do give it a try, just stay there awhile and work your skills up and do as many of the island quest as you can take. Don't be scared to talk in this game, there are no "WoW" types in it lol. Ask questions if you have them.

Here is the download

http://www.ryzom.com/

kabana · April 2007

I'm not sure how I ended up on this thread, but it has encouraged me to try out this game. I was not only impressed by the responses given, but also by the overwhelming coherence of the responses!

Beowulf2005 · May 2007

Ryzom's more open-ended than most other MMO's I've seen. In fact, I found Ryzom by specifically searching here for it. I missed pre-CU Star Wars Galaxies, and every new game I tried felt like WoW. So I went looking for a game that:

1.   Had complex harvesting and crafting.

2.   Didn't lock me into a predefined role as a tank, healer, etc.

2.   The best weapons and armor are made by players, not given out as quest rewards.

3.   The game structure encourages people to team up, including with newer players.

4.   Guilds actually make a difference, rather than just being "raiding groups".

5.   Has player-owned housing.

6.   Wasn't Eve. Sorry, Eve-fans. I tried it. Twice. I just can't emotionally connect with an avatar who's merely a still picture.

I printed out the first page of this site's game list sorted by rank. Then I went through the reviews and forums for each game, one by one, rating them the best I could by the criteria above. Ryzom was the clear winner.

I'm in my second month there now, and am happy. Player-owned housing was a disappointment, turning out to be merely a pre-furnished apartment where you can drop your loot. But otherwise it's living up to my wishes.

Written online documentation is minimal, but the in-game community more than makes up for it, both in peer support and from official CSRs. If you try Ryzom out, don't be shy asking questions in the "Region" and "Universe" chat channels. I've never yet seen anyone insulted for asking a noob question.

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Thinking of giving this another try, is it really a grind?

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Thinking of giving this another try, is it really a grind?

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