I've never played This Game. Should I?

Malkavian · May 2004

I know this subject has been asked time and time again. Recently however, there has been some changes in regards to peoples opinions of this game. For the positive.

I've never played this game because of all the negative comments made about the game in these forums alone. I've never even previewed it, looked at a demo or even research it.

I've noticed lately, people are returning back to the game and have had some positive comments about it.

I need some assistance in making a discission.

Should I at least try this game and see what all the hype (negative and positive) is all about?

Please state your reasons why or why not I shouldn't.

- Malkavian

"When you find youself sinking into Madness, dive" - Malkavian Proverb

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Pi-- · May 2004

I recently started it up to see if they had made combat interesting, only to discover that the gameplay hasnt changed much - its still the same old level grinding, with the same boring skills, at least as a character based on combat. SWG is not worse than the other popular mmorpg's on the market, which only focuses on: target the animal, click the attack button, wait, loot. The game is very much like Everquest except for the Star Wars environment, obviously, but the gameplay is very similar. Personally i think its incrdibly boring, and also a shame, because the game really does have potential. I would say that SWG is basically just an upgraded + MOD version of Everquest.

There are some other things i dont like about the game, though. You have 3 pools of "life"; the health, action and mind pools. Some weapons and attacks aims to target one of these pools exclusively. The annoying thing is that if one of your pools are drained, you become incapacitated. most special attacks and ranged weapons drains your pools, which i not only find unrealistic/weird, but also that you are "suiciding" yourself by using special attacks. The missions arent of very much variation. Its either something like: obtaining some items and delivering it to someone, or combat missions: Just destroying a nest of animals. Most ranged comabt professions's skills arent animated e.g. you cant tell teh difference of many of the skills. Also many of the skills you learn are useless - a "lower level" skills is more powerful. The game is also horribly inbalanced, especially since you earn experience according to how much damage you deal.

Besides those things the game is solid and can be very entertaining(you can be an entertainer), but in the long run i would definetly not recommend it.

-Pi

Enigma · May 2004

Here's what I think about it, Malk.

You know I was against this game a lot lol, and I still have reservation for it.

I reactivated my account Friday and have been messing around and you can see my reviews probably a couple threads down from this one.

To be honest, from all them mmorpgs Ive played, SWG is still an "ok" game. So many games suck right now that SWG doesnt look too bad lol.

You can buy the game for about 20-25 bucks now (rather than 50) and I heard there's a trail week. So I would give it a shot.

Yes, there's mindless grinding involved but since I have yet to find a decent mmorpg that does not have mindless grinding, then this game is ok.

Its improved greatly since I had first left. The items they put in Themepark quests are actually useful now, 2 weeks from now they are totally revamping the Jedi Process....instead of grinding out 32 Master Professions, you will be getting Force Sensitive Skill boxes and as your character evolve (even if its one profession), you can get closer to FS slot through quests and such.

Yes, some things ae still broken and the lag is pretty bad in cities. But for the most part the game has improved. I think when all the old subscribers try out the new expansion pack for Jump to Lightspeed, they'll realize the game has had some major improvements.

My wife is still playing CoH, and I am "cautiously" playing SWG for now lol. I would say give it a shot if you have 25 bucks to spare. Besides, I look smashing in my TIE Fighter gear lol

Precursor · May 2004

If you can get your hands on a free trial or a cheap set of the software then I would say yes.... for no other reason than to decide for yourself whether or not it is a game you like or hate.

In general, Galaxies needs major work in the following areas:

GCW (Galactic Civil War)... To put it plainly, it doesn't exist in SWG. There are no perks and no consequences to being Imperial or Rebel. The only thing choosing a side does is it basically signs you up for PvP. Faction points and rank are more or less useless. Sad.
Balance... This has been a major issue since release. Personally I think the sheer complexity of SWG is the problem here. They just cant seem to get it right. The result of the major combat imbalance is the FOTM (flavor of the month) skill templates. Certain professions have become wildly overpowered while the others have become obsolete or over-nerfed.
Crafting... Crafting is somewhat a part of the balance issue. The system itself is quite good, but it is allowing for players to create items that are far too powerful for the combat system. DEV, in answer to the abundance of uber materials and items has modified the high level content and dungeon creatures to be so powerful that it takes very large groups to survive. On top of this, the loot or reward is not worth the risks involoved. This leads to the next major issue:
Loot... The loot table in SWG is a joke. Plain and simple. Nothing more to say.
Grouping... This ties in to the loot issue. SWG has no group loot system so ninja-looters can have a hayday in your group. Distrust is a problem in galaxies and groups are usually composed of those who know each other well.
Jedi... A touchy subject on the main forums. I saw Jedi as an issue way before release. It will remain an issue for the lifetime of this game. Personally I wish they never added them in at all. They do not fit into the chosen timeline and have proven to bring out the worst in the game and forum community.
Content... Remember those days back in development when they told us everything we wanted to hear? Dynamic missions and epic struggles? Player bounties? Sorry. Not in SWG. Jedi bounty missions for bounty hunters is about as dynamic as it gets. One big persistant static universe with nothing going on.
Bugs... One year later, these guys are still trying to iron out bugs from release. Considering the killing they made on release you would think they would have a large enough staff to fix problems they create on a regular publish basis.

If those reaons are not enough to put you off the game then you might like Galaxies. Overall, IMO it is nothing more than a corporate marketing scam designed to cash in on hungry star wars fans waiting for episode 3. Im almost ashamed to say that I payed SOE for as long as I did.

zide56 · May 2004

The thing is, unless you are highly skilled in one of the elite combat professions, you can't do anything of use. All the themeparks, story arc(s), and events require you to kill something that won't die easily or without a difficult fight. If you are a crafter, entertainer, medic, or even a marksman, you cannot participate in the superficial crapola that SOE uses in an attempt to hide the fact that there really is no content. So, it's not very roleplayer-friendly in the sense that if you want to create a character that specializes in only healing or crafting, you're screwed.

Leveling is extremely boring. To level as a medic or entertainer, you have two options: you can sit there and literally press one button for hours on end, or you can get a mission that tells you where you can go and press a button for hours on end. To level as a crafter, you have two options: you can sit there and press through menu after menu, creating a simple piece of crap that you will just end up deleting, or you can get a mission that gives you the schematic and ingredients of a piece of crap for you to craft by navigating through menu after menu, which you must then travel across the fricking planet to deliver (or you can just delete that, too). To level as a combat specialist, you have two options: you can either wander out and kill anything you see (usually evil bunnies, lizards, or rats), or you can get a mission that gives you a specific location of some evil bunnies, lizards, or rats for you to kill. Regardless of what profession we're talking about, however, everyone uses a macro of some sort to loop their actions so that they can go off and do something else instead of actually playing the game. That is a sign of poor advancement techniques.

The customer service is non-existent. They may respond to your queries quickly, but their answers are useless. Either you get a "I cannot share that information with you, you should ask fellow players about <insert basic problem here>," or a "Your suggestion has been fowarded to the developers, where it will be trashed before it is read, because no one cares about your opinion unless someone starts a riot over it, and we lose our precious cash." I was pushing for a roleplaying server for months, sending customer service tickets and posting in the official forums. I was banned from the official forums because whenever I posted a suggestion, the moderators would lock the topic because it was not "in the right forum", thus causing me to get angry and insult the moderators, which would lead others to flame me, and then I would flame them, etc. The thing is, THERE IS NO FORUM FOR SUGGESTIONS! They force you to post your suggestions where they won't have to be bothered by them (like in the "Roleplaying Forum"--oh yeah, that gets a lot of traffic), which shows just how much they really care about topics being posted in the correct forum. SOE is a hypocritical mess, and I hope that they are reaping what they've sown with poor subscription sales.

The "new" content, as I said above, is there to simply distract players from the overall lack of content. Vehicles, mounts, and "Wookiee Armor" were implemented to cause complainers to look away for a few seconds, so that SOE could piss their pants without anyone looking. It was a very short amount of time, however, because while the mounts were cool, they were soon overshadowed by the vehicles, which ended up being boring trash anyway. Wookiee Armor--please. They also added the infamous "badge locations", which just served to completely trash everyone's biography window with unnecessary badges, which weren't even faithful to the Star Wars story. One of the badges was, "...has visited Ben Kenobi's old home." What the hell?! No one knew or cared who Ben Kenobi was, so no one would be visiting his house and getting a "badge" for it! SOE must hate roleplayers, because they have really kicked us in the ass. The "player citites" were a monstrous mistake, for they ruined basically the only thing that SWG had going for it: the landscape. The once beautiful landscape of SWG is now littered with cities like "NOOBSVILLE" and "jEDI tOWN", which consist of identically ugly buildings with signs that state things such as, "OBIONE'S LUV SHACK". Again, why doesn't SOE just kick us roleplayers square in the ass?!

The bugs are awful, too. I won't go into details, but I'll tell you that even the Christmas gifts were bugged. Some got one holocron, some got two, and some got none. SOE then tried to cover up their guilt by giving everyone two holocrons. Heh. Yeah right.

Ah, yes...the Jedi. What a disgusting ploy from SOE. I am positive that if it weren't for the Jedi, no one would be playing this game. The hope of eventually becoming a Jedi is, I'm sure, the thing that is keeping people from doing what is stated in Paragraph 2. However, they will be sorely pissed when they reach Jedi (that is, if they don't give up first), and realize that it is just the Fencer profession with a glowing blade and a broken skill tree. The path to the Jedi has also been one paved with crap. I'm sure even those of you who haven't played the game are aware of the whole "Holocron Craze". What a racket! Christmas turned out to be nothing but a chance for dupers and thieves to have their holiday. I won't even go into the tricks that some people played, because it would take too long. Basically, though, the "Holocron Craze" was again, something that only elite combat specialists could ever hope to participate in without having to spend $100 on eBay for a stupid bunch of pixels, and it served, again, only to distract people from the overall suckage that SWG has to offer for a whopping $15 a month.

So, in conclusion, do not buy this game. It SUXXXX!!111111!~!!1

zide56 · May 2004

Oh, and I forgot to comment on the Galactic Civil War, because it doesn't even exist. Sorry.

zide56 · May 2004

Originally posted by En1Gma

Its improved greatly since I had first left. The items they put in Themepark quests are actually useful now, 2 weeks from now they are totally revamping the Jedi Process....instead of grinding out 32 Master Professions, you will be getting Force Sensitive Skill boxes and as your character evolve (even if its one profession), you can get closer to FS slot through quests and such.

No, En1Gma. The Jedi Revamp Stage I only affects Jedi. You'll have to wait for Stage II if you want to try the "quests". Heh. What a joke. I bet the quests are just a reincarnation of the holocrons--you do a bunch of crap for some NPC, just for him to tell you what profession you need to master.

You put too much faith in SOE, my friend.

Enigma · May 2004

Originally posted by zide56
The thing is, unless you are highly skilled in one of the elite combat professions, you can't do anything of use. All the themeparks, story arc(s), and events require you to kill something that won't die easily or without a fight. If you are a crafter, entertainer, medic, or even a marksman, you cannot participate in the superficial crapola that SOE uses in an attempt to hide the fact that there really is no content. So, it's not very roleplayer-friendly in the sense that if you want to create a character that specializes in only healing or crafting, you're screwed.

Lol, thats not true at all. I am a marksmen (not even that high) and Im wearing Ubesse armor (not even sliced) with a fwg5 I bought in the bazaar for 5000 credits (i.e., the gun sucks and it hasnt been sliced yet) and I managed to go all the way through the Imperial Themepark quite well...true, there are a couple hard missions but why would you wanna do all missions that gives you little xp? I found two "red" conned enemies in the entire themepark, so your anaylsis of the parks are currently wrong. Plus I managed to kill the red cons without little worry of death.

Leveling is extremely boring. To level as a medic or entertainer, you have two options: you can sit there and literally press one button for hours on end, or you can get a mission that tells you where you can go and press a button for hours on end. To level as a crafter, you have two options: you can sit there and press through menu after menu, creating a simple piece of crap that you will just end up deleting, or you can get a mission that gives you the schematic and ingredients of a piece of crap for you to craft by navigating through menu after menu, which you must then travel across the fricking planet to deliver (or you can just delete that, too). To level as a combat specialist, you have two options: you can either wander out and kill anything you see (usually evil bunnies or rats), or you can get a mission that gives you a specific location of some evil bunnies or rats for you to kill. Regardless of what profession we're talking about, however, everyone uses a macro of some sort to loop their actions so that they can go off and do something else instead of actually playing the game. This is a sign of poor advancement techniques.

Actually, this is the sign of all modern mmorpgs these days. The main reason why I decided to give SWG another chance was because evry single game I played since SWG had utterly sucked (for the exception of CoH...but I find that grinding as well). When I looked at SWG again and tried to imagine what it would be like if it was the same game but without the SWG name, people would actually think this game was pretty decent. Plus, Im a marksmen and I dont go out and kill evil bunnies or rats lol...Im a imperial...I actually infiltrate enemy bases and wipe them out for faction, fun, and roleplaying.
True, its a grinding game Ill admit that, but u know what...so is virtually every single damn 2nd generation mmorpg out there...yes, CoH too.

Plus, I beta tested WoW....if you dont think that game has grinding..lol..well, you'll be in for a shock

The customer service is non-existent. They may respond to your queries quickly, but their answers are useless. Either you get a "I cannot share that information with you, you should ask fellow players about <insert basic problem here>," or a "Your suggestion has been fowarded to the developers, where it will be trashed before it is read, because no one cares about your opinion unless someone starts a riot over it, and we lose our precious cash." I was pushing for a roleplaying server for months, sending customer service tickets and posting in the official forums. I was banned from the official forums because whenever I posted a suggestion, the moderators would lock the topic because it was not "in the right forum", thus causing me to get angry and insult the moderators, which would lead others to flame me, and then I would flame them, etc. The thing is, THERE IS NO FORUM FOR SUGGESTIONS! They force you to post your suggestions where they won't have to be bothered by them (like in the "Roleplaying Forum"--oh yeah, that gets a lot of traffic), which shows just how much they really care about topics being posted in the correct forum. SOE is a hypocritical mess, and I hope that they are reaping what they've sown with poor subscription sales.

True, the customer service sorta is bad, but my last ticket was answered in 3 hours...thats technically not too bad since before it would take weeks. Also, when I called SOE for a problem I had (Friday night) I was on hold for about 15 minutes...long? Yes. But not like it was before where u were on the phone for an hour.

Plus, when I compare it to other games, the only other mmorps I know of that had better CS was FFXI and AO. AO has the best I had ever seen period.

The "new" content, as I said above, is there to simply distract players from the overall lack of content. Vehicles, mounts, and "Wookiee Armor" were implemented to cause complainers to look away for a few seconds, so that SOE could piss their pants without anyone looking. It was a very little amount of time, however, because while the mounts were cool, they were soon overshadowed by the vehicles, which ended up being boring trash anyway. Wookiee Armor--please. They also added the infamous "badge locations", which just served to completely trash everyone's biography window with unnecessary badges, which weren't even faithful to the Star Wars story. One of the badges was, "...has visited Ben Kenobi's old home." What the hell? No one knew who Ben Kenobi was, so no one would be visiting his house and getting a "badge" for it! SOE must hate roleplayers, because they have really kicked us in the ass. The "player citites" were a monstrous mistake, for they ruined basically the only thing that SWG had going for it: the landscape. The once beautiful landscape of SWG is now littered cities like "NOOBSVILLE" and "jEDI tOWN", which consist of identically ugly buildings with signs that state things such as, "OBIONE'S LUV SHACK". Again, why doesn't SOE just kick us roleplayers square in the ass?!

I personally liked the changes that has occured so far and like the idea of badges..it shows people you're an explorer. Plus it really doesnt mess up the bio window...just scroll down an 8th of an inch. I'm on Chilstra server and I have never seen "Noobsville or Jedi Town" they all had pretty nice names. Plus, while many of the cities are deserted, the vendors are still stocked so I know people are still there, Im just missing them. Plus, I would consider myself an avid roleplayer....but this game runs into the same problem as every other mmorpg...its easy not to RP...But my PA roleplays all the time. So We're not having a problem with that. Also, I love my speederbike..it gets me to the far away places quite nice. I dont see that as the DEVS putting a covering over their customers eyes...I see that as them fulfilling a promise back in March 03 when they said they couldnt put them in right now buit they will soon.

The bugs are awful, too. I won't go into details, but I'll tell you that even the Christmas gifts were bugged. Some got one holocron, some got two, and some got none. SOE then tried to cover up their guilt by giving everyone two holocrons. Heh. Yeah right.

I cant vouch for that...but Christmas was almost 6 months ago

Ah, yes...the Jedi. What a disgusting ploy from SOE. I am positive that if it weren't for the Jedi, no one would be playing. The hope of eventually becoming a Jedi is, I'm sure, the thing that is keeping people from doing what is stated in Paragraph 2. However, they will be sorely pissed when they reach Jedi (that is, if they don't give up first), and realize that it is just the Fencer profession with a glowing blade and a broken skill tree. The path to the Jedi has also been one paved with crap. I'm sure even those of you who haven't played the game are aware of the whole "Holocron Craze". What a racket! Christmas turned out to be nothing but a chance for dupers and thieves to have their holiday. I won't even go into the tricks that some people played, because it would take too long. Basically, though, the "Holocron Craze" was again, something that only elite combat specialists could ever hope to participate in without having to spend $100 on eBay for a stupid bunch of pixels, and it served, again, only to distract people from the overall suckage that SWG has to offer for a whopping $15 a month.

lol, I reached Jedi as did my wife...it would not be accurate to say Jedi are Fencers with a glowing sword....we had a lot more power than that..even as a Padawan. The Jedi is getting totally revamped and not nerfed. As much as I hated this game in the past...logging back on tells me that these DEVs are really trying now (even if they werent before)...maybe the lack of customers scared them..who knows? All I know is the DEVs are making an effort, IMO.

Also, the Holocraze is no more. Those things will be worthless in two weeks so you can buy them if you want for like 2000 credits for house decorations.

So, in conclusion, do not buy this game. It SUXXXX!!111111!~!!1

In conclusion for me, you should get this game and give it a chance. Hell, look at all my formal posts and see how bad I didnt like it. Its still not the best, but theyve done a lot to change it for the better.

Enigma · May 2004

Originally posted by zide56

No, En1Gma. The Jedi Revamp Stage I only affects Jedi. You'll have to wait for Stage II if you want to try the "quests". Heh. What a joke. I bet the quests are just a reincarnation of the holocrons--you do a bunch of crap for some NPC, just for him to tell you what profession you need to master.

You put too much faith in SOE, my friend.

Ive put enough faith to try out the game again...and as much as I hated it before, Im gald I gave it another chance. You may still hate it and thats totally cool...nothing at all against you. All I know is Im having fun in ammorpg again.

zide56 · May 2004

Originally posted by En1Gma

Lol, thats not true at all. I am a marksmen (not even that high) and Im wearing Ubesse armor (not even sliced) with a fwg5 I bought in the bazaar for 5000 credits (i.e., the gun sucks and it hasnt been sliced yet) and I managed to go all the way through the Imperial Themepark quite well...true, there are a couple hard missions but why would you wanna do all missions that gives you little xp? I found two "red" conned enemies in the entire themepark, so your anaylsis of the parks are currently wrong. Plus I managed to kill the red cons without little worry of death.

Sure, if you buff for hours, you might have a chance. But you never addressed the crafters, medics, or entertainers. What about them? They're screwed, aren't they?

Actually, this is the sign of all modern mmorpgs these days. The main reason why I decided to give SWG another chance was because evry single game I played since SWG had utterly sucked (for the exception of CoH...but I find that grinding as well). When I looked at SWG again and tried to imagine what it would be like if it was the same game but without the SWG name, people would actually think this game was pretty decent. Plus, Im a marksmen and I dont go out and kill evil bunnies or rats lol...Im a imperial...I actually infiltrate enemy bases and wipe them out for faction, fun, and roleplaying.
True, its a grinding game Ill admit that, but u know what...so is virtually every single damn 2nd generation mmorpg out there...yes, CoH too.

I'm not saying any other game isn't like SWG. The thing is, the whole "grinding" thing needs to stop--in all MMORPGs. It's just not fun.

I personally liked the changes that has occured so far and like the idea of badges..it shows people you're an explorer. Plus it really doesnt mess up the bio window...just scroll down an 8th of an inch. I'm on Chilstra server and I have never seen "Noobsville or Jedi Town" they all had pretty nice names. Plus, while many of the cities are deserted, the vendors are still stocked so I know people are still there, Im just missing them. Plus, I would consider myself an avid roleplayer....but this game runs into the same problem as every other mmorpg...its easy not to RP...But my PA roleplays all the time. So We're not having a problem with that. Also, I love my speederbike..it gets me to the far away places quite nice. I dont see that as the DEVS putting a covering over their customers eyes...I see that as them fulfilling a promise back in March 03 when they said they couldnt put them in right now buit they will soon.

Well, I believe I was on the Intrepid server, and there were towns like "Funkytown" and BS like that. And even though you may roleplay in your PA guild, it still doesn't defeat the fact that roleplaying has to be confined to small pockets. That's not the way it should be. I should be able to walk into Anchorhead and not have to worry about all the uber-l33t garbage.

I cant vouch for that...but Christmas was almost 6 months ago

And yet it still hurts...

lol, I reached Jedi as did my wife...it would not be accurate to say Jedi are Fencers with a glowing sword....we had a lot more power than that..even as a Padawan. The Jedi is getting totally revamped and not nerfed. As much as I hated this game in the past...logging back on tells me that these DEVs are really trying now (even if they werent before)...maybe the lack of customers scared them..who knows? All I know is the DEVs are making an effort, IMO.

The fact that losing money is the only thing that gets the devs off their ass is pretty pathetic. People have been crying out about stuff since launch day, and the game still sucks (in my opinion).

Malkavian · May 2004

Enigma, yes I was following your daily review of the game in the other thread. Nice write ups.

I appreciate both zide's opinion and yours.

Has anyone else gone back to SWG with a conclusion of its new value?

- Malkavian

"When you find youself sinking into Madness, dive" - Malkavian Proverb

- MMORPG.COM Staff -
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Pi-- · May 2004

As zide56 also mentions, the customer support is horrible. I send in a request in hope of some problem solving, regarding billing. The problem was that the global collet payment method, which makes you able to pay in the currency you want to, didnt work. I had to pay in US$ the credit card way, i described the problem into the smallest details, a step-by-step guide of how to encounter the error. A few days later i recieved an email, with nothing but a link to one of their FAQ's, that had nothing to do with the problem.

TookyG · May 2004

This is definitely a game that you have to try yourself to know whether or not you're going to like it. With the 14 day trial I don't see how you can go wrong with trying it, provided you're a FP subscriber.

TookyG · May 2004

Originally posted by zide56

The fact that losing money is the only thing that gets the devs off their ass is pretty pathetic. People have been crying out about stuff since launch day, and the game still sucks (in my opinion).

Which I'm sure you have the SOE books right in front of you where you can see that SWG is in the red right?

zide56 · May 2004

Originally posted by TookyG

Which I'm sure you have the SOE books right in front of you where you can see that SWG is in the red right?

I think it's rather obvious that they're going down the tubes. Even if they're getting new people, the veterans are leaving, and if it continues to keep going, it's going to be a constant turnover.

Hrnac · May 2004

Originally posted by zide56

I'm not saying any other game isn't like SWG. The thing is, the whole "grinding" thing needs to stop--in all MMORPGs. It's just not fun.

And what exactly would you replace the "grinding" with? If you speed up leveling like Shadowbane has done then your dilema is that you run the risk of having a top heavy game too quickly and the complaints will quickly focus on the lack of "High level content". I am not a huge fan of the "Grind", but I am at least aware of why it exists. that alone makes it a bit easier to deal with.

"Grinding" will always be a part of all MMORPGs because they need it to sustain themselves. A game that one could 'beat" in a few weeks wouldn't last too long would it? Single player games are for defeating. MMORPGs are mainly for playing. How you disguise the "Grinding" is what really should be discussed.

-Hrnac

zide56 · May 2004

Originally posted by Hrnac

And what exactly would you replace the "grinding" with? If you speed up leveling like Shadowbane has done then your dilema is that you run the risk of having a top heavy game too quickly and the complaints will quickly focus on the lack of "High level content". I am not a huge fan of the "Grind", but I am at least aware of why it exists. that alone makes it a bit easier to deal with.

"Grinding" will always be a part of all MMORPGs because they need it to sustain themselves. A game that one could 'beat" in a few weeks wouldn't last too long would it? Single player games are for defeating. MMORPGs are mainly for playing. How you disguise the "Grinding" is what really should be discussed.

-Hrnac

I'm not necessarily saying that grinding is a bad thing. But at least provide a reward for those who do it. SWG and basically every other MMORPG that I have played offers nothing but maybe a little useless piece of crap and the opportunity for more grinding! It's ridiculous.

Malkavian · May 2004

Please give an example of "a little useless piece of crap".

- Malkavian

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Hrnac · May 2004

Perhaps the "useless little pieces of crap" might be things like new abilities, new skills, etc. I think he wants a bigger carrot on the end of the stick. I can't disagree with that since any game that requires advancement through grinding should give the players something to strive to attain even if it is only an illusion.

-Hrnac

Enigma · May 2004

Originally posted by zide56

I'm not necessarily saying that grinding is a bad thing. But at least provide a reward for those who do it. SWG and basically every other MMORPG that I have played offers nothing but maybe a little useless piece of crap and the opportunity for more grinding! It's ridiculous.

Well, I tend to think they do reward you. For example, if you are a armorsmith you can make different and better armor when u hit the next grinding level. All four sections of all Master Artisan skills gives you a reward whether the item you make has been significantly improved or you are open to make newer and better items.

Same thing with Marksmen or fighting professions...each level of grind can unlocked the use of a higher weapon, better accuracy, higher damage, stat increases, etc.

True, a lot of mmorpg do offer grind and many others offer the opposite but whatever way you look at it, all "good" mmorpgs do have grinding involved whether they suck or not. SWG does offer some type of incentive, The only thing I would stay away from in SWG is the bounty Hunter until they get that fixed. But other than that, all professions I can think of gives you some sort of reward when u hit the next level; Architechts (sp) allows you to make bigger, better homes, PA halls, city halls, etc per grinding level.

So I am not to sure either what you are refering to as "no reward"

Pi-- · May 2004

Originally posted by Hrnac

And what exactly would you replace the "grinding" with? If you speed up leveling like Shadowbane has done then your dilema is that you run the risk of having a top heavy game too quickly and the complaints will quickly focus on the lack of "High level content". I am not a huge fan of the "Grind", but I am at least aware of why it exists. that alone makes it a bit easier to deal with.

"Grinding" will always be a part of all MMORPGs because they need it to sustain themselves. A game that one could 'beat" in a few weeks wouldn't last too long would it? Single player games are for defeating. MMORPGs are mainly for playing. How you disguise the "Grinding" is what really should be discussed.
-Hrnac

They could replace the grinding, with some variation. If they had made a different animation for all the combat skills, it would certaintly make combat interesting.

About the skillsystem, i started as a marksman in the goal of becoming a master carbineer. Along the way i acquired about 10-15 special attacks, where most of them were were completely useless - for example there is the action shot, which mainly drains the creature's action pool, but i found the lower level skill "overcharge shot" more effective overall, because it simply dealt more damage distributed over the 3 pools, thus i got more experience.

Basically as an almost complete carbineer, i was bound to run around using the same special attack(cripple shot, because it deals more damage) on the same creature type, in the same area, with the same combat animation, over and over, because it simply is the best/fastest way to level.

Makane · May 2004

I recently went back to SWG and am having a blast. They've added many cool new things and seem to be pumping out new stuff on a regular basis.

Also, someone mentioned that there are still bugs in the game from release...can you please tell us what they are? I played from beta to four months after release, then reactivated in March and haven't seen any of the many, numerous bugs that were in at release.

mack10 · May 2004

it is a fun game but you have to find something you like to do and have fun with it it got boring cause ppl were grinding profs to become jedi and that pissed a lot of ppl off. but for me i enjoy playing the game

TookyG · May 2004

Originally posted by zide56
I think it's rather obvious that they're going down the tubes. Even if they're getting new people, the veterans are leaving, and if it continues to keep going, it's going to be a constant turnover.

What proof do you have that veterans are leaving? Because they say they're leaving? I've played SWG from day 1 and I've seen posts from people that say that they're leaving but you know what...they're still there. In fact...they're still there to say that they're leaving multiple times but never do. Do some people leave of course, but the dooms day theories about SWG are getting really tiring considering that it's a vocal minority that broadcast them all over the net.

There were theories that L2 and CoH would crush SWG, well combined CoH and L2 have 180,000 subscribers. Two combined games have less than SWG did a week after launch and still have less than it does almost a year later.

Malkavian · May 2004

It is interesting to see what "vet" players think of the game from when it first launched to where it is now. It is quite obvious from reports and feedback that there is improvement in the game since the release. Are these enough to spark new interest? Will the continued efforts (or there lack of) from the dev's to repair a broken cart, carry its weight once more?

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TookyG · May 2004

Malkavian, I can say with all honesty that, in all the MMOs I've played or beta'd I've never seen this level of communication and real results. The game needed quite a lot of work when it was released, and still needs some work yet. However, the dev team does a big Publish, two weeks later we get a mini-publish (with revamps/fixes), and two weeks after that we get a new Dungeon or other such quest. Then the cycle begins again. Naturally things may get a small push back for one reason or another but since they're implemented that cycle they've never pushed anything back more than a week.

With 2 Jedi publishes, followed by 2 combat balance publishes, followed by the Galactic Civil War publish and Jump to Lightspeed on the horizon it's a very exciting time to be playing.

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