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Can you get the best items in game with a small group?
gurthgor
Member Posts: 279
I played EQ and i didnt like raids, you need tons of ppl and in the end just a very few get the items, so i dont see the point of raids but helping a few to be happy.
So, i would like that they ones playing beta could just tell me if its possible or not.
Blade with whom i have lived, blade with whom I now die. Serve right and justice one last time. Seek one last heart of evil. Still one last life of pain. Cut well old friend. Then farewell!
Comments
Short answer: Yes.
Long Answer: While you will have access to a full array of High-End Gear, you will not have as many options as those who also do Larger Groups (4-8) and Raiding (8+). A majority of High-End Items (from what I understand) are avilable to Solo Play & Small Groups, although ALL require a long investment in play, and are not handed out easily.
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
So i cant have the best gear in game, just some items. So i need to go to raids if i want to be able to pvp ( duels or whatever is in game ) and win the best guys doing raids. What a pity the game looked great.
Blade with whom i have lived, blade with whom I now die. Serve right and justice one last time. Seek one last heart of evil. Still one last life of pain. Cut well old friend. Then farewell!
No.
There are THOUSANDS of pieces of top end gear. You could could make HUNDREDS of complete sets without ever going on a Large Group or Raid Quest. 60% of all highend loot is Solo / small group specific.
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
The NDA will be lifted fairly soon, and then words will be flying from all sides... There are good and bad parts of this game, let us hope the good previel over the bad...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
You should read what BMQ says in its entireity but for a summary:
80% of best gear is from solo and grouping.
20% of best gear is from raiding
My understanding is "best" means roughly equivalent quality, ie. top tier.
The question will be is having access to the 20% extra stuff from raiding actually advantagous?
If all the functional combiantions of raid+group gear gear can also be done by group gear alone, but in a different configuration then there may be equivlance.
If it is simply impossible to obtain everything you would need to be uber and must make significant time and gear management choices it could also turn out ok. For example if no group setting requires much fire resistance and no PvP requires much fire resistance but some raid mobs do require high FR. And if the best FR items are in raids that require a very long time to aquire such that it would impinge on other stuff you could get from other instances (ie. force you too choose between FR and some other stat a grouper is more likely to match) then that may also may result is parity although that is not really equialence. Obviously this one is very shaky and each content addition or skill change could seriously affect it.
So it depends on whether you think one or both of the above condistion will be met by Sigil. It also depends on how badly you think things will be off kilter if they are not met 100%. Either way you have the hard and fast 80/20 guideline.
You should read what BMQ says in its entireity but for a summary:
80% of best gear is from solo and grouping.
20% of best gear is from raiding
My understanding is "best" means roughly equivalent quality, ie. top tier.
The question will be is having access to the 20% extra stuff from raiding actually advantagous?
If all the functional combiantions of raid+group gear gear can also be done by group gear alone, but in a different configuration then there may be equivlance.
If it is simply impossible to obtain everything you would need to be uber and must make significant time and gear management choices it could also turn out ok. For example if no group setting requires much fire resistance and no PvP requires much fire resistance but some raid mobs do require high FR. And if the best FR items are in raids that require a very long time to aquire such that it would impinge on other stuff you could get from other instances (ie. force you too choose between FR and some other stat a grouper is more likely to match) then that may also may result is parity although that is not really equialence. Obviously this one is very shaky and each content addition or skill change could seriously affect it.
So it depends on whether you think one or both of the above condistion will be met by Sigil. It also depends on how badly you think things will be off kilter if they are not met 100%. Either way you have the hard and fast 80/20 guideline.
This is the case. For example, as I read, to get one High-End item that is gained through Diplomacy can take Hundreds of Dip quests to open the quest line, then weeks of questing to get to the Quest itself. That is for one item. Now, considering it would take both a High Dip & CL to get this item, and weeks & weeks of play, it will not be a handout.
To get an item raiding may also take weeks to get. Another item may take weeks plus a great Harvesting LVL & a Great Crafter. And be sure to notice it takes 4 different High Levels (CL / Dip / Harv / Craft).
Simply put, multipy that by the 20 Slots available to each toon (actual, it's more considering some items are made of several high-end-loots put together) and you can see the math. Raiders just won't have an advantage. Sure, they'll have certian Loot, but they won't have the other Elite Loot they haven't had time to work to.
I'll give you this: After 4-5 years, if they add no content or high-end loot, a Raider could have an advantage assuming they pick the right stuff to wear Vs. a non-Raider, but it is beyond impossible...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
You should read what BMQ says in its entireity but for a summary:
80% of best gear is from solo and grouping.
20% of best gear is from raiding
My understanding is "best" means roughly equivalent quality, ie. top tier.
The question will be is having access to the 20% extra stuff from raiding actually advantagous?
If all the functional combiantions of raid+group gear gear can also be done by group gear alone, but in a different configuration then there may be equivlance.
If it is simply impossible to obtain everything you would need to be uber and must make significant time and gear management choices it could also turn out ok. For example if no group setting requires much fire resistance and no PvP requires much fire resistance but some raid mobs do require high FR. And if the best FR items are in raids that require a very long time to aquire such that it would impinge on other stuff you could get from other instances (ie. force you too choose between FR and some other stat a grouper is more likely to match) then that may also may result is parity although that is not really equialence. Obviously this one is very shaky and each content addition or skill change could seriously affect it.
So it depends on whether you think one or both of the above condistion will be met by Sigil. It also depends on how badly you think things will be off kilter if they are not met 100%. Either way you have the hard and fast 80/20 guideline.
This is the case. For example, as I read, to get one High-End item that is gained through Diplomacy can take Hundreds of Dip quests to open the quest line, then weeks of questing to get to the Quest itself. That is for one item. Now, considering it would take both a High Dip & CL to get this item, and weeks & weeks of play, it will not be a handout.
To get an item raiding may also take weeks to get. Another item may take weeks plus a great Harvesting LVL & a Great Crafter. And be sure to notice it takes 4 different High Levels (CL / Dip / Harv / Craft).
Simply put, multipy that by the 20 Slots available to each toon (actual, it's more considering some items are made of several high-end-loots put together) and you can see the math. Raiders just won't have an advantage. Sure, they'll have certian Loot, but they won't have the other Elite Loot they haven't had time to work to.
I'll give you this: After 4-5 years, if they add no content or high-end loot, a Raider could have an advantage assuming they pick the right stuff to wear Vs. a non-Raider, but it is beyond impossible...
Well we will see. I personally do not think this a good solution and would not design something this way. But if you have faith in it that is certainly your perogative.
Either way if they stick to the 80/20 thing one would hope it would at least not get too out of hand. There are ways to sabotage such a thing but that would take pretty severe incompetence or almost willfull neglect. So one would hope it stays fairly soild.
Mmmm It seems Vanguard is going to be very interesting if it finally there are just 20% raid items and they are not more powerful than other items. I think i will try Vanguard, it looked to me as a great game but i thought it was raid based and that kept me away from it. It is nice that you can get uber items in different ways. Those uber items in raids were made by npc crafters so its logic players can make uber items too
Blade with whom i have lived, blade with whom I now die. Serve right and justice one last time. Seek one last heart of evil. Still one last life of pain. Cut well old friend. Then farewell!
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
I am the Cannon Fodder God
80% of best gear is from solo and grouping.
20% of best gear is from raiding
My understanding is "best" means roughly equivalent quality, ie. top tier.
The question will be is having access to the 20% extra stuff from raiding actually advantagous?
If all the functional combiantions of raid+group gear gear can also be done by group gear alone, but in a different configuration then there may be equivlance.
If it is simply impossible to obtain everything you would need to be uber and must make significant time and gear management choices it could also turn out ok. For example if no group setting requires much fire resistance and no PvP requires much fire resistance but some raid mobs do require high FR. And if the best FR items are in raids that require a very long time to aquire such that it would impinge on other stuff you could get from other instances (ie. force you too choose between FR and some other stat a grouper is more likely to match) then that may also may result is parity although that is not really equialence. Obviously this one is very shaky and each content addition or skill change could seriously affect it.
So it depends on whether you think one or both of the above condistion will be met by Sigil. It also depends on how badly you think things will be off kilter if they are not met 100%. Either way you have the hard and fast 80/20 guideline.
This is complete misinformation, more lies to con soloers and small group oriented players to buy the game and a couple months of subscription until they learn the truth.
No where on the Vanguard site does it say only 20% of the best items will come from raiding.
Just because 20% of the content is raiding does not correlate to 20% best items coming from raiding. The reality is that 100% of the best items can come from 20% content, especially if it's considered the most difficult content by the designers and therefore should offer the best rewards.
Vanguard is raid centric, soloers and small group oriented players will never have the best gear and will therefore be second class citizens.
I know I sound like an elitist but, I just don't get how people don't like raids. They usually put a lot of time into the content surrounded within a raid and a long line of cool quests leading up to that finale. I truly believe that it is people who can't seem to get into a decent guild, play well with others (larger than an average size group), or mind taking a few orders for the betterment of the team. You guys always want your cake and eat it too. Make a few friends to go out and raid with for Pete's sake and quit complaining about not being able to have the good items because you will probably buy the items from auctions anyway.
So, its true that the best items are from raids or not? I dont understand how some say one thing and others the opposite... this is fustrating. I think i will wait until they make a free trial.
Blade with whom i have lived, blade with whom I now die. Serve right and justice one last time. Seek one last heart of evil. Still one last life of pain. Cut well old friend. Then farewell!
When Brad says not all of the best items will come from raiding, he is speaking the truth I am sure, but all it takes is one item not to, for that statement to be valid. I expect most best items to be dropped or awarded in raid content, otherwise raiders won't be happy, which makes the game raid centric regardless of percentages.
I, as a mainly soloer could live with that, as long as all the raid items are tradeable so I can earn them ingame that way, but they won't be, because developers who support raiding have nothing else to offer non raiders and therefore need to force everyone down that linear path.
"We feel gold selling and websites that promote it damage games like Vanguard and will do everything possible to combat it."
Brad McQuaid
Chairman & CEO, Sigil Games Online, Inc.
Executive Producer, Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
www.vanguardsoh
Some people dont like raiding because they simply dont have the time to devote 2-9 hours per night playing a videogame. I have done that and finally realized I am wasting my life playing a game. There is a balance, play for 1-2 hours then get on with real life. For those of us who did break the addiction, we still like to play, just not obsessed with it. For us raiding is not feasible, to get nice gear would be a bonus. If we are willing to devote our measly 1-2 hours a day over a month to get a few pieces of top gear, what is wrong with that? Hardcore powergamers will get the same gear in a week or less. (insert whatever timeframe you want, point being it will take ALOT longer for a soloer to get the gear, but they should still be able to get it).
Just because us small group or soloers dont have the time or the addiction to raid, doesnt mean we dont like it, it just means we know how to balance our lives.
80% of best gear is from solo and grouping.
20% of best gear is from raiding
My understanding is "best" means roughly equivalent quality, ie. top tier.
The question will be is having access to the 20% extra stuff from raiding actually advantagous?
If all the functional combiantions of raid+group gear gear can also be done by group gear alone, but in a different configuration then there may be equivlance.
If it is simply impossible to obtain everything you would need to be uber and must make significant time and gear management choices it could also turn out ok. For example if no group setting requires much fire resistance and no PvP requires much fire resistance but some raid mobs do require high FR. And if the best FR items are in raids that require a very long time to aquire such that it would impinge on other stuff you could get from other instances (ie. force you too choose between FR and some other stat a grouper is more likely to match) then that may also may result is parity although that is not really equialence. Obviously this one is very shaky and each content addition or skill change could seriously affect it.
So it depends on whether you think one or both of the above condistion will be met by Sigil. It also depends on how badly you think things will be off kilter if they are not met 100%. Either way you have the hard and fast 80/20 guideline.
This is complete misinformation, more lies to con soloers and small group oriented players to buy the game and a couple months of subscription until they learn the truth.
No where on the Vanguard site does it say only 20% of the best items will come from raiding.
Just because 20% of the content is raiding does not correlate to 20% best items coming from raiding. The reality is that 100% of the best items can come from 20% content, especially if it's considered the most difficult content by the designers and therefore should offer the best rewards.
Vanguard is raid centric, soloers and small group oriented players will never have the best gear and will therefore be second class citizens.
This is complete misinformation. If 20% of content is Raiding, and 80% from other adventures, and each has a High-End reward, it's completely resonable to suggest approximatly 20% of High-End Loot is from Raiding. They term the Dev's used was "20% of High-End Content" which clearly points to a correlation with rewards, since each end "Content" has a High-End reward, as WAS said by the Dev's.
Your information is completely misleading at best. Are these %'s correct? No, they will vary some, but not much.
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
So, its true that the best items are from raids or not? I dont understand how some say one thing and others the opposite... this is fustrating. I think i will wait until they make a free trial.
He's trying to mislead you. As SAID by the Dev's, and you can read about in the Official FAQ (see the Resources Thread Stickied above) If there are 100 "adventures" that are high-end content, 20% of those will be raiding, and all will have High-End Loot. Since there are litteraly Hundreds of High-End Adventures & Thousands of High-End Loots, even if you never raided you will probably not even come close to doing all of the High-End non-Raid content, there's just that much to do...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
This is complete misinformation, more lies to con soloers and small group oriented players to buy the game and a couple months of subscription until they learn the truth.
No where on the Vanguard site does it say only 20% of the best items will come from raiding.
Just because 20% of the content is raiding does not correlate to 20% best items coming from raiding. The reality is that 100% of the best items can come from 20% content, especially if it's considered the most difficult content by the designers and therefore should offer the best rewards.
Vanguard is raid centric, soloers and small group oriented players will never have the best gear and will therefore be second class citizens.
So, its true that the best items are from raids or not? I dont understand how some say one thing and others the opposite... this is fustrating. I think i will wait until they make a free trial.
Just read what brad's quotes are you can choose to bleive him or not. M yreading of brad's quote siffer from this guys and i have no intention of playing this game and am not a Vanboi.
40vs40 is fun for me, 40vs1 is the stupidest thing ever created in all of computer gaming. Just complete crap.
40vs40 is fun for me, 40vs1 is the stupidest thing ever created in all of computer gaming. Just complete crap.
That's why I LOVED Raiding in DDO, especially Low Level Raiding. Although the boss had a TON of HP's, there was always a "way" to beat him that wasn't about dealing an hour of damage...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
EW that crap turd game DDO? that game made me puke.