Originally posted by sleepyguyftl Originally posted by SnaKey Originally posted by sleepyguyftl You are wrong about Ryzom being PvE Orientated. It is in fact a combination of both PvE and PvP. One of the major content areas of the game are Outpost which are 100% PvP. With each post you are showing that you really know nothing about Ryzom at all.
Oh, you mean those little mini games to take over posts? I heard about those! Sure is a cool distraction from all the PVE. Every game needs PVP mini games.
Mini-games? They are hardly mini-games. 6 hour battles are not mini-games.
With absolutely no repurcussions afterwards. Mini-Games. And the fact that they last 6hrs means that ppl run back before the fighting is over. I'd like to see an EVE fleet battle last 6hrs.
Dude, seriously. What the hell are you arguing for? Nobody was knocking you game, you're just arguing for the sake of arguing. Yeah, SoR doesn't have PVP, but its' still a good game. Yeah it's PVE Oriented, it's still a good game and not a single person in this entire thread said otherwise. So, give it up.
With absolutely no repurcussions afterwards. Mini-Games. And the fact that they last 6hrs means that ppl run back before the fighting is over. I'd like to see an EVE fleet battle last 6hrs.Dude, seriously. What the hell are you arguing for? Nobody was knocking you game, you're just arguing for the sake of arguing. Yeah, SoR doesn't have PVP, but its' still a good game. Yeah it's PVE Oriented, it's still a good game and not a single person in this entire thread said otherwise. So, give it up. I'm argueing because you and other people make statements like "Ryzom doesn't have PvP". Which is not true at all. It has outposts which are PvP content. It has entire large areas that are open PvP. I'm argueing because people are saying that Eve's ability to create custom missions is like Ryzom's editor, which is wrong. Ryzoms editor is far more advanced, and in fact custom missions are a VERY small part of the Ring editor.
And it is simply not true that yhere are no repurcussions afterwards. If you loose the outpost battle, you loose the outpost. Which means that you loose valuable materials that can only be gained from an outpost.
It's not matter if people say that Ryzom is a good or bad game. It's a matter of people saying things about the game that simply are not true.
Once again you missed the point Ryzom depends on NPC content Eve uses Player content THATS where both games dither. Now ive never played Ryzome so i cant comment on that game farly so i wont. But eve is all about the players.
It's clear that you have never played Ryzom becuase the statement of Ryzom depending on NPC content is 100% wrong. The reality is that very little of gameplay depends on NPC interaction.
And I agree that Eve and Ryzom are both decent games. But to argue that Ryzom relies on NPC content, that there is no PvP, that somehow Eve's custom missions are anywhere close to the Ryzom ring editor is wrong. Plain and simple.
You obviously took my comment in the wrong context i was commenting on the player creted mission section in both games in ryzom its players verses player placed NPC's in eve its player verses playwer.
Originally posted by sleepyguyftl Originally posted by SnaKey
With absolutely no repurcussions afterwards. Mini-Games. And the fact that they last 6hrs means that ppl run back before the fighting is over. I'd like to see an EVE fleet battle last 6hrs.Dude, seriously. What the hell are you arguing for? Nobody was knocking you game, you're just arguing for the sake of arguing. Yeah, SoR doesn't have PVP, but its' still a good game. Yeah it's PVE Oriented, it's still a good game and not a single person in this entire thread said otherwise. So, give it up. I'm argueing because you and other people make statements like "Ryzom doesn't have PvP". Which is not true at all. It has outposts which are PvP content. It has entire large areas that are open PvP. I'm argueing because people are saying that Eve's ability to create custom missions is like Ryzom's editor, which is wrong. Ryzoms editor is far more advanced, and in fact custom missions are a VERY small part of the Ring editor.
And it is simply not true that yhere are no repurcussions afterwards. If you loose the outpost battle, you loose the outpost. Which means that you loose valuable materials that can only be gained from an outpost.
It's not matter if people say that Ryzom is a good or bad game. It's a matter of people saying things about the game that simply are not true.
STOP TELLING LIES! Point of fact: Ryzom's PVP is not REALLY PVP if you're talking about the outpost battles. You don't actually fight other players you fight waves of NPC's. Then they fight waves of NPCs. You can't kill each OTHER. You either kill their NPC's or help your NPCs. You never actually combat another player. Unless t hat's changed since Outposts first went in.
Now if you're talking about the roots PVP where you have to go to a PVP Zone yes there is PVP there and it is LEVEL based. You go in and fight a level 100 with your level 20 and you will die... no ifs... no ands... no buts... no equipment or tactics will help you... you will just get oblitterated. Period. End of Story. Why? Because SOR is LEVEL BASED with a Skill System (albeit a half decent one) tacked on top.
Nobody is telling lies about SOR. It's a good game. Get OVER this hatred you have for anyone with anything even remotely negative to say about SoR. You, however, seem to have an insane passion for putting words into other folks' mouths.
Now I will say that Snakey goes um... a bit overboard... and frankly I wish he'd can it too. But both of you are just crazy insane people rabidly attacking anything each other have to say.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
let me put it in simpler words for you: a poor half-hearted attempt at ingame hauling tasks is not worthy of being called "custom mission generation" system. especially when the worst mission system that i know of (ryzom) offers less sterile missions than the courier system.
next, yes, you are as wrong about outpost pvp as you can only be. you could always fight other players in outpost battles and HAD to, as those other players did their best in trying to stop you from killing their dudes or you have to stop them from killing your dudes by killing them. it's EXACTLY the same as a pos battle. people show up, try to kill player property to take it over, player property fights back on it's own, opposing players help it, if possible, player property goes into invulnerability phase to allow a defense round, original owners fight to get it back (either by reloading shields in eve or killing dudes in rzm), while attackers try to not let that happen.
edit: oh yea, repercussions, in ryzom there are very similar repercussions as in eve. in eve POSes allow you to harvest moon materials, needed for T2 production. in ryzom the possession of an outpost enables you to harvest: experience crystals that increase your cp gains, buff items, outpost crafting materials, needed to create the best player-crafted items in the game.
and outpost battles were that way even BEFORE they were released. the earliest demonstrations showed nevrax dev team vs. csr players and they mainly killed each other.
Nobody is telling lies about SOR. It's a good game. Get OVER this hatred you have for anyone with anything even remotely negative to say about SoR. You, however, seem to have an insane passion for putting words into other folks' mouths.
But you are telling lies, like that players can not fight other players in outpost battles. That is simply not true. I don't have a problem with people saying negative things about Ryzom, I certainly have done my fair share of that. However you and others keep saying things that are not true.
another sidenote (this time short, i promise): you are not dealing with a fanboy in sleepyguy, in fact, he is one of the MOST outspoken and critical posters who loves to pick apart and put down ANY part of the game that is only slightly broken. if you get him to defend rzm then it certainly is only because the things you say are not correct. ^^
Originally posted by DemonknightI I've played several MMOs and I really enjoy the thrill of playing online with others to compete and work with. I always like playing a good MMO between school and work.
I've played UO, WoW, Eve Online, FFXI, none of them were satisfying. WoW is a cool game for newbs like i said...It's a great game from 1-59, but has horrible pvp and really no endgame. Eve Online looked like a badass game, but their skill system is so horribly flawed that it's impossible to catch up in.
So I'm just looking to start a thread on what games would be good to try MMO-styles. My favorite online game was Ultima Online Pre-trammel when they pussified it.
If you have similar tastes maybe you could offer some advice. Weblinks welcome.
There are really no good MMO's out at all.
All the good one's have been changed or closed =(
My guess is to wait a few month's for some new stuff..
I am gonna get flamed here but it's the sad thruth.
Playing: Everthing Played: DAoC,AC2,EvE,SWG,WAR,MXO,CoX,EQ2,L2,LOTRO,SB,UO,WoW. I have played every MMO that has ever come out.
Originally posted by xenofur let me put it in simpler words for you: a poor half-hearted attempt at ingame hauling tasks is not worthy of being called "custom mission generation" system. especially when the worst mission system that i know of (ryzom) offers less sterile missions than the courier system.next, yes, you are as wrong about outpost pvp as you can only be. you could always fight other players in outpost battles and HAD to, as those other players did their best in trying to stop you from killing their dudes or you have to stop them from killing your dudes by killing them. it's EXACTLY the same as a pos battle. people show up, try to kill player property to take it over, player property fights back on it's own, opposing players help it, if possible, player property goes into invulnerability phase to allow a defense round, original owners fight to get it back (either by reloading shields in eve or killing dudes in rzm), while attackers try to not let that happen.edit: oh yea, repercussions, in ryzom there are very similar repercussions as in eve. in eve POSes allow you to harvest moon materials, needed for T2 production. in ryzom the possession of an outpost enables you to harvest: experience crystals that increase your cp gains, buff items, outpost crafting materials, needed to create the best player-crafted items in the game. and outpost battles were that way even BEFORE they were released. the earliest demonstrations showed nevrax dev team vs. csr players and they mainly killed each other.
I sit corrected then Every outpost fight I had seen when I played was a bunch of players killing waves of NPC's. Most people didn't attack the other players. Though I do recall now that it is possible to....
However: An example of a Outpost "battle" I witnessed when I was playing: 5 players (yes 5) killing wave after wave of NPC while 2 players on the opposition were healing or whatever. I think someone actually did kill the other guys now that I think of it but that didn't end the fight... nope... we STILL had to deal with the friggin NPC's. That's nothing like a POS battle in EVE. A POS battle is when a corp/alliance or group of alliances gets a few dreadnaughts together (piloted by players) and a support fleet to protect the dreads together (also piloted by players) and moves into position to attack an enemy POS. Which is defended by... players..... If you kill the players (or make them run) the fight generally ends. There is no such thing as 'invulnerability' mode either. Once a POS even STARTS to go up it is vulnerable to attack if someone wants to... 24x7x365. No NPC's are involved. See the fundamental difference? There's no PVE involved at all in a PVP battle in EVE. Also a 'battle' in EVE generally involves a hell of a lot more players... fleets can get up into the hundreds (though hopefully they fix some bugs soon because when they get that big server nodes tend to go kerboom).
Also, since you seem to think they're similar in "cost": How much does the Ryzom outpost cost you to build? I never was involved in 'getting' an outpost but I saw what you're talking about in fighting over them. Typically a POS costs hundreds of millions of ISK to build (an outpost costs billions). It takes an entire corp working together for weeks to generate the revenues to buy 1, let alone the modules needed to make one useful. Then there's the resources and coordination involved in keeping the POS running. Losing a POS in EVE isn't just losing a few bonuses or the ability to manufacture items. You lose hundreds of millions, if not billions, of ISK worth of equipment. In the defense of said ISK players lose hundreds of millions, if not billions, of ISK worth of ships, implants and fittings. Losing a POS in EVE is a huge blow to many corps. Is it that big a deal in Ryzom? (honest question). Last time I checked in Ryzom you don't really 'lose' anything when you lose an Outpost... you lose the ability to MAKE things or you lose some BONUSES but you don't really lose anything tangible. And I don't get where you say that 'player property fights back'. If nobody is at a POS to defend it it goes down quite quickly. Sure the outpost has guns and such but they're there to prevent single players from invading. A POS takedown fleet will quickly wipe an undefended POS off the map. Players don't "try to help the POS defend" they defend the POS. Period. If you leave it up to POS defenses you're toast. Either take down or drive off the enemy dreads or your outpost is history... period.
As to that "poor half hearted attempt at a mission system": It was the first player generated mission system in any MMORPG to date. When it came out it was ground breaking. Now it's being upgraded. And I never ever said it compared in any way to what R2 offers.
I notice you stayed away from my statement that PVP in Ryzom is level based. Which is very true.
Bottom line: They're really not very similar. I don't know why you guys keep comparing them.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
Originally posted by sleepyguyftl Originally posted by SnaKey Originally posted by sleepyguyftl You are wrong about Ryzom being PvE Orientated. It is in fact a combination of both PvE and PvP. One of the major content areas of the game are Outpost which are 100% PvP. With each post you are showing that you really know nothing about Ryzom at all.
Oh, you mean those little mini games to take over posts? I heard about those! Sure is a cool distraction from all the PVE. Every game needs PVP mini games.
Mini-games? They are hardly mini-games. 6 hour battles are not mini-games. Battles are mini games. Month long wars are not.
I sit corrected then Every outpost fight I had seen when I played was a bunch of players killing waves of NPC's. If you can kill other players as well then that's cool.
However: An example of a Outpost "battle" I witnessed when I was playing: 5 players (yes 5) killing wave after wave of NPC while 2 players on the opposition were healing or whatever. I think we actually did kill the other two now that I think of it but that didn't end the fight... nope... we STILL had to deal with the friggin NPC's. That's nothing like a POS battle in EVE. A POS battle is when a corp/alliance or group of alliances gets a few dreadnaughts together (piloted by players) and a support fleet to protect the dreads together (also piloted by players) and moves into position to attack an enemy POS. Which is defended by... players..... If you kill the players (or make them run) the fight generally ends. No NPC's are involved. See the fundamental difference? There's no PVE involved at all in a PVP battle in EVE. Also a 'battle' in EVE generally involves a hell of a lot more players... fleets can get up into the hundreds (though hopefully they fix some bugs soon because when they get that big server nodes tend to go kerboom).
I notice you stayed away from my statement that PVP is level based. Which is very true.
Bottom line: They're really not very similar. I don't know why you guys keep comparing them.
@ level-based: Things I don't touch are things I agree with or have no opinion on. I haven't tried what happens when a noob-squad tries to take down a high-level player, so I can't really say, but i'd dare wager that similar pairings like in Eve are possible, when matching ship classes to levels.
I think you were only at the early fights, fights for low-levle outposts or fights on Cho, which is still a very young server. Usually outpost battles are fought with a crapton of players, see here: http://exekutor1.ex.funpic.de/futallaby/ryzom/src/1147113139966.jpg http://exekutor1.ex.funpic.de/futallaby/ryzom/3.htm? (Need to scroll down a bit, also: magic effects look weird, due to using a non-standard method to get over-size screenshots.) Additionally, Ryzom does support hundreds of players without any lag at all and op battles about lvl 250 OPs usually do need that. Regarding your argument that POS battles involve no npcs... Exactly what are the pos shields? Or the guns? Do I need to remind you of battles where RA dropped cans with loads of BMs in order to lag out players so the POS turrets had easy work of their dreads? Tell me, who defended the POS there? The players or the npcs?
My bottom line: they're both good and very much comparable, once one strips away the fluff they're coated in.
Originally posted by GunnyFisher Battles are mini games. Month long wars are not.
Trust me, there ARE month-long wars in ryzom too. The highest-quality materials, needed to craft the most powerful equipment are only available in the roots, which is a free-for-all pvp zone and the source spots for those mats are usually fought about, as the supply is limited. Additionally you have guilds and alliances that are constantly battling for outposts in whatever way conceivable, heck, on the German server one could even write a good-sized book about what happened around the outposts. Keep this in mind: EVERYONE wants the stuff that comes out of outposts. People usually have three allegiances: 1. their religion 2. their country 3. their friends Short story to give an idea of what's happening: When the outposts came out the positions could already be scouted on the test server, which an alliance called "Ally of Four" took to their advantage, securing at least one third of all outposts, simply through declaring war on them, as they only had to kill npcs. Add to that a few disjointed Karavan Matis guilds, a strong Matis pvp guild, a Kami Fyros guild, various other Fyros guilds, a neutral Tryker guild and a few more Tryker/Zorai guilds. The ally of four was, due to previous politicking part of another alliance called "The Voice of Reason", which was an alliance that was mainly against war and thought for mutual protection. When the outposts came out and the Matis realized what the Ally of Four did, they formed another alliance, the Community of Interests of Matis, which was meant to secure Matis for Karavan-loyal Matis guilds. They disregarded the Alliance of Four as such, due to them working together with Fyros guilds, since they were members of the voice of reason. The main battles thus happend between the CIM and the Ao4, with additional interludes from the hardcore-pvp guilds to keep things interesting, side-attacks of Matis guilds on Tryker to secure provincial properties, terror attacks on zorai outposts and the ousting of Matis outposts from Fyros. Later the VoR split due to the missing of a strong leadership, leaving the Ao4 to fend for themselves and leading to the creation of a Fyros defense pact. I could go on like this for hours and describe lots of details and only scratch the surface of the outpost wars that happened since their introduction and that is only on the German server, which is the smallest of the three.
P.S.: Everyone can freely decide to take part in either side of the combat in outpost battles, making them even less of a minigame and more like a stratego-political tapdance. oO
Xenofur: If you are going to reply to me then reply to me. Don't attribute quotes to me that I did not write. Till you stop doing this our discussion is over.
I never said anything about battles being a mini game. I never said that the mission system in EVE was comparable to R2. I never said Ryzom was a bad game.
As to the dropping cans of BM's... it's an exploit. Not a game mechanic. You're arguing about RA exploiting a game flaw not a true POS battle. I'm willing to concede that my experience of outpost battles in Ryzom may be incomplete but your trying to state that a POS battle is anything like a Outpost battle is just outright insane. Bottom line, barring exploiting a game flaw a POS without defenders is a POS that will die to any force that organizes to take it down.
When all is said and done Ryzom is a PVE game primarily and is level based while EVE is a PVP game primarily and is a non-linear open skill system. Both are sandboxes and both are very fun for those who enjoy them. But they are VASTLY different games.
Oh... one more thing: Bring 10 utter noob players in T1 frigs up against anything but a capitol ship and the opposite player WILL die... some of the noobs may or may not die but that T2 fitted ship that the vet is flying is toast. Ask folks how effective Goonsquad was with exactly those kinds of tactics. Or ask anyone who's attended an Agony Unleashed PVP course how successful a group of pilots, even newbies, in T1 frigates can be against just about any opponent. 1 on 1 a n00b in a frig isn't going to take down a vet in a battleship. then again that noob may catch said vet flying in his cruiser or in his frig and manage to kill him in a fair fight. That just can't happen in a level system.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
Originally posted by Taram Xenofur: If you are going to reply to me then reply to me. Don't attribute quotes to me that I did not write. Till you stop doing this our discussion is over.
I never said anything about battles being a mini game. I never said that the mission system in EVE was comparable to R2. I never said Ryzom was a bad game.
Dude, chill. My first post in the thread wasn't even remotely directed at you, but at the quote of snakey, as i explained in my second post. (By which time you already implicated that i repeatedly attributed stuff to you, which i didn't and which i find hilarious.) Then, due to an edit, and the forum software here being the definition of shitty a few quote tags got eaten, so the part about mini battles was also not even remotely directed at you. Try to be bit smarter while reading and realize the world isn't revolving around you. Also, when i DO answer to a post of yours, i do it to what is written and nothing else, i never attribute anything you didn't write to you.
Now, to the meat:
Originally posted by Taram As to the dropping cans of BM's... it's an exploit. Not a game mechanic. You're arguing about RA exploiting a game flaw not a true POS battle. I'm willing to concede that my experience of outpost battles in Ryzom may be incomplete but your trying to state that a POS battle is anything like a Outpost battle is just outright insane. Bottom line, barring exploiting a game flaw a POS without defenders is a POS that will die to any force that organizes to take it down.
I was merely highlighting how even POS battles revolve around NPCs by using an extreme case. In the following i explain the basics of both while assuming there are no defending players around. Fact is, killing other players doesn't win you the battle, killing the shield and not getting killed by it's guns do. Both the shield and the guns are in fact NPCs. Bottom line: In order to win a POS battle you need to kill an NPC. In game mechanic terms: You win the battle by inflicting enough damage on a non-player entity, while avoiding getting too much damage by it. Acceptable? Now, regarding Ryzom outposts it's the same exact thing. You need to kill the defense squads while ensuring you do not get killed by them. Kill a sufficient amount of them and you win the battle. Game mechanics: Inflict enoug damage on non-player entities while avoiding getting killed by them.
Now, you say in Eve an undefended POS can be taken out by anyone with at least a bit of organization. True, i almost did it myself once with a gimped RA POS. Problem is, you seem to assume that is not the case in Ryzom, which it is. Even a L250 outpost is EASILY taken by a small team of experienced players if undefended. In fact, in the worst case it would be enough to kill 3 squads to win the attack round. It's in fact easier to do so than in eve.
It can become insanely hard though if there are any players around, which is the same in Eve. In the end it's both the same: Reach DPS and tank advantage over non-player entity while fending off defending players.
Originally posted by Taram When all is said and done Ryzom is a PVE game primarily and is level based while EVE is a PVP game primarily and is a non-linear open skill system. Both are sandboxes and both are very fun for those who enjoy them. But they are VASTLY different games.
I do wonder why you ride so much on the fact that they are not the same. Would it hurt you if they were? If i had the boredom and time to do so i could write a full document, stripping BOTH games of all "fluff", examining the concepts of the game mechanics and proving how they are, in fact, equal, but merely of differing appearance.
P.S.: A request, please refrain from editing larger paragraphs into your posts, i find it highly annoying and rude.
P.P.S.: I have written entirely too much already and won't bother to answer all of the edits you add to your posts after the fact, but this one is a matter of base understanding: Invulnerability mode. In Ryzom you have an attack and defense phase, between those are 24-48 hours of invulnarability. In Eve you have the reinforced mode, this can last from anywhere between 0 and 48 hours (iirc) depending on the Strontium you put in. Same exact thing in both games. Complete invulnerability over a vertain time period to allow the defending players to mount an actual defense in case they were too weak during the initial attack or not even present.
Originally posted by fizzle322 The content in Eve is not NPC's.
You can do missions till you're blue in the face, if thats all you've done, you haven't played Eve.
The content in Eve is other players. To experience that content you need to seek out others, gang with them, and seek out the enemy. It can be done solo, but its really best in a group.
If nobody's around, you can undock and go kill rats for a few hours, make some money, do some missions, trading, whatever. That's the "solo" part of the game as it pertains to NPC's.
As far as "custom missions" that's anti-sandbox.
There shouldn't be NPC missions at all. The NPC's can't provide a dynamic story or dynamic world, only other players can, and that's where Eve delivers.
The ongoing saga of BoB vs ASCN, the ongoing saga of Celes in Fountain, the ISS, the ongoing RP war between UK and CVA.
You can't get any of this anywhere else, because there is no other PVP MMORPG, so there are no stories.
You don't see any GMHC heists in WoW, because in WoW nobody cares about anybody else, each player is a god unto himself.
In Eve nobody is God, you are navel lint, nothing, nobody. The only time you become somebody is as part of a corp.
SirMolle as the head of BoB? The most powerful player in the game.
SirMolle alone? Nobody. Zero. Mission Runner. Noob. A member of John Q Public.
Same goes with Cyvok, at the head of his alliance, he's badass. Without his alliance and without his corp, he is nothing, just some random guy.
That's what people don't understand. They run missions, make billions, and they're still nobodies in highsec, not even part of the story, then they wonder why they're not having fun.
The fun in Eve is the story. The story comes from having power. Having power comes from corp/alliance.
Not from having skillpoints. Not from having Navy Raven. But from having FRIENDS.
Friends = Power
Why do lots of people hate Eve?
Because they have been spoiled by the games industry that simply gives them what they want.
People want easy levels, easy mobs, easy money, easy everything, WoW delivered, now people expect easy everything from every MMORPG, and Eve is not easy.
Sometimes your first impulse as to what you want is counterproductive to your higher needs.
You want easy everything, but you also want deeper gaming.
If you can exercise some self-control and not demand everything be easy, you can struggle and sweat and play hard and find yourself having that deep gaming experience that has been missing from every MMORPG out there.
That's why people play Eve, it is a deeper experience, at the expense of ease and convenience.
I played wow for 2 months, someone kills you, you just spawn 2 minutes away and run back. What the heck is the point ?
I don't play games to have humdrum experiences.
I want deeper gaming experience, I want to meet cool people and have good friends, I'm willing to give up easy gaming to get it.
That's why Eve > WoW for me.
Your mileage may vary.
Very well said! I agree 100%.
Unfortunately, I haven't had much corp luck yet. But I'm still trying
Try sending Banlish an eve-mail, tell her what you expect in a corp and she'll tell you enough about ours so you can judge wether you would like it or not.
Originally posted by xenofur P.S.: A request, please refrain from editing larger paragraphs into your posts, i find it highly annoying and rude. Editing a post to make it clearer is now rude? Get over yourself.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
OP: I agree with all you said there. And it is true. No matter how many who probably flamed you in this post (I don't even wanna read the other posts so I'm replying to you here and now instead).
WoW is MMO easy-mode. And countless grinding and a non rewarding/risky PvP. EVE is pure hardcore style and incredibly hard to learn to play. But we all gotta agree is's ONE HELL of an amazing game though. I still can't understand how the hell they managed to do it all They must truly LOVE to similate space...
If you want a RPG MMO that you can play whenever you want, that you don't really need to feel tied up to, like WoW where you must play very regularly, you can play Guild Wars! That's the best advice I can give.
I'm gonna be neutral in my own perspective to GW towards you.
I like GW because I can play it casually and still get tons of enjoyment. It's not item noir level based so it always feels good that "the person who just beat me is actually more skilled than me and not some 1337-geek who spend 10 hours per day playing the game so that I simply just could not do anything to beat him due to his stats being to high or his gear being too good for me".
Since you like to co-op with people I definitly say GW is your choise. GW also doesn't cost anything per month. It's a one-time buy. The only thing you are going to have to deal with is buying new expansions whenever they come out. So far 2 expansions has been released. I have none of them and do fine without them, but the newest one "Factions" is something I definitly is going to buy.
$OE lies list http://www.rlmmo.com/viewtopic.php?t=424&start=0 " And I don't want to hear anything about "I don't believe in vampires" because *I* don't believe in vampires, but I believe in my own two eyes, and what *I* saw is ******* vampires! "
Originally posted by Taram Originally posted by xenofur P.S.: A request, please refrain from editing larger paragraphs into your posts, i find it highly annoying and rude. Editing a post to make it clearer is now rude? Get over yourself.
Editing to make it more clear - fine.
Increasing the post-size by over 40%, thus making it seem like people who answered to your unedited posts ignored part of your post or forcing them to edit their own in term just to answer your additions, rude.
If you have so much to add, do it in a new post or think through your posts more thoroughly before posting.
Anyways, i see you are out to vilify my now that you've run out of arguments, so: Goodbye. (Unless you DO still feel like adding something worthwhile to the dicussion.)
Actually I wanna add something to the "player driven story"-praises that are given towards EvE. Frankly guys, how much do you have to play to get involved in such a player-driven-drama? I bet my shorts that it is NOT the unwillingness of the "normal", lazy-ass player that keeps him away from games like EvE, its the fact that mostof the newly aquired MMOG customers actually dont have infinite time resources.
I myself am studying medicine and I have played EvE for a while, with the effect that I could not get anywhere; I got engaged in a corp, tried to get involve but failed miserably, because I simply can not cut a block of 4 or more hours out of my day.
I think THIS is the point why people are disappointed in EvE, you cant play the game if you dont have time, BECAUSE the big stories happen with people involved that contribute 40, 60 or 80 hours a week in this game. It is as simple as that. Believe me, I do not lack discipline or ambition to achieve something I want, the one thing I dont have, when it comes to hobbies, is plenty of time...
So, what gives for me is a game like WoW, not because its easy mode or because PvP is painless... Its simply because I dont have time to waste in a stupid timesink to achieve something. Often, I have blocks of 30 minutes to play a game, I just cannot spend this time travelling between stars, doing nothing.
So, to get to the point: Drop the assumption that everyone hating sandbox games is a spoiled wow-kiddie, that is just not true
Originally posted by Meridion So, what gives for me is a game like WoW, not because its easy mode or because PvP is painless... Its simply because I dont have time to waste in a stupid timesink to achieve something. Often, I have blocks of 30 minutes to play a game, I just cannot spend this time travelling between stars, doing nothing.
I take it you're not even close to being max level then?
I probably play EVE for about 6-10hrs a WEEK. My XFire sig says the time it does because I usually have EVE running while I'm in school, so when I get back from class I don't have to log back in to train a different skill. Like right now, I have it running... but I'm not playing. I'm just waiting for this 30min skill to finish training and after that it's gonna keep running till I get this skill up to lvl 3, because 3-4 will take 5hr.
That's the great part about EVE. It's made for the casual player, because unlike games like WoW you don't have to play to actually achieve something. You can become more skilled (skill points wise) and not even play at all.
You just picked the wrong corp is all. A corp involved in political BS. Don't get me wrong, politics make EVE great.... but just aren't my thing.
Originally posted by Meridion So, what gives for me is a game like WoW, not because its easy mode or because PvP is painless... Its simply because I dont have time to waste in a stupid timesink to achieve something. Often, I have blocks of 30 minutes to play a game, I just cannot spend this time travelling between stars, doing nothing.
I take it you're not even close to being max level then?
I probably play EVE for about 6-10hrs a WEEK. My XFire sig says the time it does because I usually have EVE running while I'm in school, so when I get back from class I don't have to log back in to train a different skill. Like right now, I have it running... but I'm not playing. I'm just waiting for this 30min skill to finish training and after that it's gonna keep running till I get this skill up to lvl 3, because 3-4 will take 5hr.
That's the great part about EVE. It's made for the casual player, because unlike games like WoW you don't have to play to actually achieve something. You can become more skilled (skill points wise) and not even play at all.
You just picked the wrong corp is all. A corp involved in political BS. Don't get me wrong, politics make EVE great.... but just aren't my thing.
Why people consider that a good thing is truly beyond me.
Comments
Oh, you mean those little mini games to take over posts? I heard about those! Sure is a cool distraction from all the PVE. Every game needs PVP mini games.
Mini-games? They are hardly mini-games. 6 hour battles are not mini-games.
With absolutely no repurcussions afterwards.
Mini-Games.
And the fact that they last 6hrs means that ppl run back before the fighting is over. I'd like to see an EVE fleet battle last 6hrs.
Dude, seriously. What the hell are you arguing for? Nobody was knocking you game, you're just arguing for the sake of arguing. Yeah, SoR doesn't have PVP, but its' still a good game. Yeah it's PVE Oriented, it's still a good game and not a single person in this entire thread said otherwise. So, give it up.
A Work in Progress.
Add Me
Mini-Games.
And
the fact that they last 6hrs means that ppl run back before the
fighting is over. I'd like to see an EVE fleet battle last 6hrs.Dude, seriously. What the hell are you arguing for? Nobody was knocking you game, you're just arguing for the sake of arguing. Yeah, SoR doesn't have PVP, but its' still a good game. Yeah it's PVE Oriented, it's still a good game and not a single person in this entire thread said otherwise. So, give it up.
I'm argueing because you and other people make statements like "Ryzom doesn't have PvP". Which is not true at all. It has outposts which are PvP content. It has entire large areas that are open PvP. I'm argueing because people are saying that Eve's ability to create custom missions is like Ryzom's editor, which is wrong. Ryzoms editor is far more advanced, and in fact custom missions are a VERY small part of the Ring editor.
And it is simply not true that yhere are no repurcussions afterwards. If you loose the outpost battle, you loose the outpost. Which means that you loose valuable materials that can only be gained from an outpost.
It's not matter if people say that Ryzom is a good or bad game. It's a matter of people saying things about the game that simply are not true.
STOP TELLING LIES!
Once again you missed the point Ryzom depends on NPC content Eve uses Player content THATS where both games dither. Now ive never played Ryzome so i cant comment on that game farly so i wont. But eve is all about the players.
It's clear that you have never played Ryzom becuase the statement of Ryzom depending on NPC content is 100% wrong. The reality is that very little of gameplay depends on NPC interaction.
And I agree that Eve and Ryzom are both decent games. But to argue that Ryzom relies on NPC content, that there is no PvP, that somehow Eve's custom missions are anywhere close to the Ryzom ring editor is wrong. Plain and simple.
You obviously took my comment in the wrong context i was commenting on the player creted mission section in both games in ryzom its players verses player placed NPC's in eve its player verses playwer.
Mini-Games.
And the fact that they last 6hrs means that ppl run back before the fighting is over. I'd like to see an EVE fleet battle last 6hrs.Dude, seriously. What the hell are you arguing for? Nobody was knocking you game, you're just arguing for the sake of arguing. Yeah, SoR doesn't have PVP, but its' still a good game. Yeah it's PVE Oriented, it's still a good game and not a single person in this entire thread said otherwise. So, give it up.
I'm argueing because you and other people make statements like "Ryzom doesn't have PvP". Which is not true at all. It has outposts which are PvP content. It has entire large areas that are open PvP. I'm argueing because people are saying that Eve's ability to create custom missions is like Ryzom's editor, which is wrong. Ryzoms editor is far more advanced, and in fact custom missions are a VERY small part of the Ring editor.
And it is simply not true that yhere are no repurcussions afterwards. If you loose the outpost battle, you loose the outpost. Which means that you loose valuable materials that can only be gained from an outpost.
It's not matter if people say that Ryzom is a good or bad game. It's a matter of people saying things about the game that simply are not true.
STOP TELLING LIES!
Point of fact:
Ryzom's PVP is not REALLY PVP if you're talking about the outpost battles. You don't actually fight other players you fight waves of NPC's. Then they fight waves of NPCs. You can't kill each OTHER. You either kill their NPC's or help your NPCs. You never actually combat another player. Unless t hat's changed since Outposts first went in.
Now if you're talking about the roots PVP where you have to go to a PVP Zone yes there is PVP there and it is LEVEL based. You go in and fight a level 100 with your level 20 and you will die... no ifs... no ands... no buts... no equipment or tactics will help you... you will just get oblitterated. Period. End of Story. Why? Because SOR is LEVEL BASED with a Skill System (albeit a half decent one) tacked on top.
Nobody is telling lies about SOR. It's a good game. Get OVER this hatred you have for anyone with anything even remotely negative to say about SoR. You, however, seem to have an insane passion for putting words into other folks' mouths.
Now I will say that Snakey goes um... a bit overboard... and frankly I wish he'd can it too. But both of you are just crazy insane people rabidly attacking anything each other have to say.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
let me put it in simpler words for you: a poor half-hearted attempt at ingame hauling tasks is not worthy of being called "custom mission generation" system. especially when the worst mission system that i know of (ryzom) offers less sterile missions than the courier system.
next, yes, you are as wrong about outpost pvp as you can only be. you could always fight other players in outpost battles and HAD to, as those other players did their best in trying to stop you from killing their dudes or you have to stop them from killing your dudes by killing them.
edit: oh yea, repercussions, in ryzom there are very similar repercussions as in eve. in eve POSes allow you to harvest moon materials, needed for T2 production. in ryzom the possession of an outpost enables you to harvest: experience crystals that increase your cp gains, buff items, outpost crafting materials, needed to create the best player-crafted items in the game.it's EXACTLY the same as a pos battle. people show up, try to kill player property to take it over, player property fights back on it's own, opposing players help it, if possible, player property goes into invulnerability phase to allow a defense round, original owners fight to get it back (either by reloading shields in eve or killing dudes in rzm), while attackers try to not let that happen.
and outpost battles were that way even BEFORE they were released. the earliest demonstrations showed nevrax dev team vs. csr players and they mainly killed each other.
But you are telling lies, like that players can not fight other players in outpost battles. That is simply not true. I don't have a problem with people saying negative things about Ryzom, I certainly have done my fair share of that. However you and others keep saying things that are not true.
you are not dealing with a fanboy in sleepyguy, in fact, he is one of the MOST outspoken and critical posters who loves to pick apart and put down ANY part of the game that is only slightly broken.
if you get him to defend rzm then it certainly is only because the things you say are not correct. ^^
Tarem...
Man u are good. Im Speechless.
U keep on taking the words out of my mouth.
Even Though I haven't played Eve.
Now I try EVE now and already tryed Ryzom.
All the good one's have been changed or closed =(
My guess is to wait a few month's for some new stuff..
I am gonna get flamed here but it's the sad thruth.
Playing: Everthing
Played: DAoC,AC2,EvE,SWG,WAR,MXO,CoX,EQ2,L2,LOTRO,SB,UO,WoW.
I have played every MMO that has ever come out.
However: An example of a Outpost "battle" I witnessed when I was playing:
5 players (yes 5) killing wave after wave of NPC while 2 players on the opposition were healing or whatever. I think someone actually did kill the other guys now that I think of it but that didn't end the fight... nope... we STILL had to deal with the friggin NPC's. That's nothing like a POS battle in EVE. A POS battle is when a corp/alliance or group of alliances gets a few dreadnaughts together (piloted by players) and a support fleet to protect the dreads together (also piloted by players) and moves into position to attack an enemy POS. Which is defended by... players..... If you kill the players (or make them run) the fight generally ends. There is no such thing as 'invulnerability' mode either. Once a POS even STARTS to go up it is vulnerable to attack if someone wants to... 24x7x365. No NPC's are involved. See the fundamental difference? There's no PVE involved at all in a PVP battle in EVE. Also a 'battle' in EVE generally involves a hell of a lot more players... fleets can get up into the hundreds (though hopefully they fix some bugs soon because when they get that big server nodes tend to go kerboom).
Also, since you seem to think they're similar in "cost":
How much does the Ryzom outpost cost you to build? I never was involved in 'getting' an outpost but I saw what you're talking about in fighting over them. Typically a POS costs hundreds of millions of ISK to build (an outpost costs billions). It takes an entire corp working together for weeks to generate the revenues to buy 1, let alone the modules needed to make one useful. Then there's the resources and coordination involved in keeping the POS running. Losing a POS in EVE isn't just losing a few bonuses or the ability to manufacture items. You lose hundreds of millions, if not billions, of ISK worth of equipment. In the defense of said ISK players lose hundreds of millions, if not billions, of ISK worth of ships, implants and fittings. Losing a POS in EVE is a huge blow to many corps. Is it that big a deal in Ryzom? (honest question). Last time I checked in Ryzom you don't really 'lose' anything when you lose an Outpost... you lose the ability to MAKE things or you lose some BONUSES but you don't really lose anything tangible. And I don't get where you say that 'player property fights back'. If nobody is at a POS to defend it it goes down quite quickly. Sure the outpost has guns and such but they're there to prevent single players from invading. A POS takedown fleet will quickly wipe an undefended POS off the map. Players don't "try to help the POS defend" they defend the POS. Period. If you leave it up to POS defenses you're toast. Either take down or drive off the enemy dreads or your outpost is history... period.
As to that "poor half hearted attempt at a mission system": It was the first player generated mission system in any MMORPG to date. When it came out it was ground breaking. Now it's being upgraded. And I never ever said it compared in any way to what R2 offers.
I notice you stayed away from my statement that PVP in Ryzom is level based. Which is very true.
Bottom line: They're really not very similar. I don't know why you guys keep comparing them.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
Oh, you mean those little mini games to take over posts? I heard about those! Sure is a cool distraction from all the PVE. Every game needs PVP mini games.
Mini-games? They are hardly mini-games. 6 hour battles are not mini-games.
Battles are mini games. Month long wars are not.
Have faith in God, believe in antimatter.
I haven't tried what happens when a noob-squad tries to take down a high-level player, so I can't really say, but i'd dare wager that similar pairings like in Eve are possible, when matching ship classes to levels.
I think you were only at the early fights, fights for low-levle outposts or fights on Cho, which is still a very young server. Usually outpost battles are fought with a crapton of players, see here:
http://exekutor1.ex.funpic.de/futallaby/ryzom/src/1147113139966.jpg
http://exekutor1.ex.funpic.de/futallaby/ryzom/3.htm? (Need to scroll down a bit, also: magic effects look weird, due to using a non-standard method to get over-size screenshots.)
Additionally, Ryzom does support hundreds of players without any lag at all and op battles about lvl 250 OPs usually do need that.
Regarding your argument that POS battles involve no npcs...
Exactly what are the pos shields? Or the guns? Do I need to remind you of battles where RA dropped cans with loads of BMs in order to lag out players so the POS turrets had easy work of their dreads? Tell me, who defended the POS there? The players or the npcs?
My bottom line: they're both good and very much comparable, once one strips away the fluff they're coated in.
Trust me, there ARE month-long wars in ryzom too.The highest-quality materials, needed to craft the most powerful equipment are only available in the roots, which is a free-for-all pvp zone and the source spots for those mats are usually fought about, as the supply is limited. Additionally you have guilds and alliances that are constantly battling for outposts in whatever way conceivable, heck, on the German server one could even write a good-sized book about what happened around the outposts.
Keep this in mind: EVERYONE wants the stuff that comes out of outposts. People usually have three allegiances:
1. their religion
2. their country
3. their friends
Short story to give an idea of what's happening: When the outposts came out the positions could already be scouted on the test server, which an alliance called "Ally of Four" took to their advantage, securing at least one third of all outposts, simply through declaring war on them, as they only had to kill npcs. Add to that a few disjointed Karavan Matis guilds, a strong Matis pvp guild, a Kami Fyros guild, various other Fyros guilds, a neutral Tryker guild and a few more Tryker/Zorai guilds.
The ally of four was, due to previous politicking part of another alliance called "The Voice of Reason", which was an alliance that was mainly against war and thought for mutual protection.
When the outposts came out and the Matis realized what the Ally of Four did, they formed another alliance, the Community of Interests of Matis, which was meant to secure Matis for Karavan-loyal Matis guilds. They disregarded the Alliance of Four as such, due to them working together with Fyros guilds, since they were members of the voice of reason.
The main battles thus happend between the CIM and the Ao4, with additional interludes from the hardcore-pvp guilds to keep things interesting, side-attacks of Matis guilds on Tryker to secure provincial properties, terror attacks on zorai outposts and the ousting of Matis outposts from Fyros.
Later the VoR split due to the missing of a strong leadership, leaving the Ao4 to fend for themselves and leading to the creation of a Fyros defense pact.
I could go on like this for hours and describe lots of details and only scratch the surface of the outpost wars that happened since their introduction and that is only on the German server, which is the smallest of the three.
P.S.: Everyone can freely decide to take part in either side of the combat in outpost battles, making them even less of a minigame and more like a stratego-political tapdance. oO
xenofur, learn to use capitals before posting anymore, thank you.
Xenofur:
If you are going to reply to me then reply to me. Don't attribute quotes to me that I did not write. Till you stop doing this our discussion is over.
I never said anything about battles being a mini game.
I never said that the mission system in EVE was comparable to R2.
I never said Ryzom was a bad game.
As to the dropping cans of BM's... it's an exploit. Not a game mechanic. You're arguing about RA exploiting a game flaw not a true POS battle. I'm willing to concede that my experience of outpost battles in Ryzom may be incomplete but your trying to state that a POS battle is anything like a Outpost battle is just outright insane. Bottom line, barring exploiting a game flaw a POS without defenders is a POS that will die to any force that organizes to take it down.
When all is said and done Ryzom is a PVE game primarily and is level based while EVE is a PVP game primarily and is a non-linear open skill system. Both are sandboxes and both are very fun for those who enjoy them. But they are VASTLY different games.
Oh... one more thing: Bring 10 utter noob players in T1 frigs up against anything but a capitol ship and the opposite player WILL die... some of the noobs may or may not die but that T2 fitted ship that the vet is flying is toast. Ask folks how effective Goonsquad was with exactly those kinds of tactics. Or ask anyone who's attended an Agony Unleashed PVP course how successful a group of pilots, even newbies, in T1 frigates can be against just about any opponent. 1 on 1 a n00b in a frig isn't going to take down a vet in a battleship. then again that noob may catch said vet flying in his cruiser or in his frig and manage to kill him in a fair fight. That just can't happen in a level system.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
My first post in the thread wasn't even remotely directed at you, but at the quote of snakey, as i explained in my second post. (By which time you already implicated that i repeatedly attributed stuff to you, which i didn't and which i find hilarious.) Then, due to an edit, and the forum software here being the definition of shitty a few quote tags got eaten, so the part about mini battles was also not even remotely directed at you.
Try to be bit smarter while reading and realize the world isn't revolving around you.
Also, when i DO answer to a post of yours, i do it to what is written and nothing else, i never attribute anything you didn't write to you.
Now, to the meat:
I was merely highlighting how even POS battles revolve around NPCs by using an extreme case. In the following i explain the basics of both while assuming there are no defending players around.Fact is, killing other players doesn't win you the battle, killing the shield and not getting killed by it's guns do. Both the shield and the guns are in fact NPCs. Bottom line: In order to win a POS battle you need to kill an NPC. In game mechanic terms: You win the battle by inflicting enough damage on a non-player entity, while avoiding getting too much damage by it. Acceptable?
Now, regarding Ryzom outposts it's the same exact thing. You need to kill the defense squads while ensuring you do not get killed by them. Kill a sufficient amount of them and you win the battle. Game mechanics: Inflict enoug damage on non-player entities while avoiding getting killed by them.
Now, you say in Eve an undefended POS can be taken out by anyone with at least a bit of organization. True, i almost did it myself once with a gimped RA POS. Problem is, you seem to assume that is not the case in Ryzom, which it is. Even a L250 outpost is EASILY taken by a small team of experienced players if undefended. In fact, in the worst case it would be enough to kill 3 squads to win the attack round. It's in fact easier to do so than in eve.
It can become insanely hard though if there are any players around, which is the same in Eve. In the end it's both the same: Reach DPS and tank advantage over non-player entity while fending off defending players.
I do wonder why you ride so much on the fact that they are not the same. Would it hurt you if they were? If i had the boredom and time to do so i could write a full document, stripping BOTH games of all "fluff", examining the concepts of the game mechanics and proving how they are, in fact, equal, but merely of differing appearance.P.S.: A request, please refrain from editing larger paragraphs into your posts, i find it highly annoying and rude.
P.P.S.: I have written entirely too much already and won't bother to answer all of the edits you add to your posts after the fact, but this one is a matter of base understanding: Invulnerability mode.
In Ryzom you have an attack and defense phase, between those are 24-48 hours of invulnarability. In Eve you have the reinforced mode, this can last from anywhere between 0 and 48 hours (iirc) depending on the Strontium you put in. Same exact thing in both games. Complete invulnerability over a vertain time period to allow the defending players to mount an actual defense in case they were too weak during the initial attack or not even present.
Very well said! I agree 100%.
Unfortunately, I haven't had much corp luck yet. But I'm still trying
http://www.TheGamersAssociation.com
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
I agree with all you said there. And it is true. No matter how many who probably flamed you in this post (I don't even wanna read the other posts so I'm replying to you here and now instead).
WoW is MMO easy-mode. And countless grinding and a non rewarding/risky PvP.
EVE is pure hardcore style and incredibly hard to learn to play. But we all gotta agree is's ONE HELL of an amazing game though. I still can't understand how the hell they managed to do it all
If you want a RPG MMO that you can play whenever you want, that you don't really need to feel tied up to, like WoW where you must play very regularly, you can play Guild Wars! That's the best advice I can give.
I'm gonna be neutral in my own perspective to GW towards you.
I like GW because I can play it casually and still get tons of enjoyment. It's not item noir level based so it always feels good that "the person who just beat me is actually more skilled than me and not some 1337-geek who spend 10 hours per day playing the game so that I simply just could not do anything to beat him due to his stats being to high or his gear being too good for me".
Since you like to co-op with people I definitly say GW is your choise. GW also doesn't cost anything per month. It's a one-time buy. The only thing you are going to have to deal with is buying new expansions whenever they come out. So far 2 expansions has been released. I have none of them and do fine without them, but the newest one "Factions" is something I definitly is going to buy.
$OE lies list
http://www.rlmmo.com/viewtopic.php?t=424&start=0
"
And I don't want to hear anything about "I don't believe in vampires" because *I* don't believe in vampires, but I believe in my own two eyes, and what *I* saw is ******* vampires! "
Editing to make it more clear - fine.
Increasing the post-size by over 40%, thus making it seem like people who answered to your unedited posts ignored part of your post or forcing them to edit their own in term just to answer your additions, rude.
If you have so much to add, do it in a new post or think through your posts more thoroughly before posting.
Anyways, i see you are out to vilify my now that you've run out of arguments, so: Goodbye. (Unless you DO still feel like adding something worthwhile to the dicussion.)
that are given towards EvE. Frankly guys, how much do you have to play
to get involved in such a player-driven-drama? I bet my shorts that it
is NOT the unwillingness of the "normal", lazy-ass player that keeps
him away from games like EvE, its the fact that mostof the newly
aquired MMOG customers actually dont have infinite time resources.
I myself am studying medicine and I have played EvE for a while, with
the effect that I could not get anywhere; I got engaged in a corp,
tried to get involve but failed miserably, because I simply can not cut
a block of 4 or more hours out of my day.
I think THIS is the point why people are disappointed in EvE, you cant
play the game if you dont have time, BECAUSE the big stories happen
with people involved that contribute 40, 60 or 80 hours a week in this
game. It is as simple as that. Believe me, I do not lack discipline or
ambition to achieve something I want, the one thing I dont have, when
it comes to hobbies, is plenty of time...
So, what gives for me is a game like WoW, not because its easy mode or
because PvP is painless... Its simply because I dont have time to waste
in a stupid timesink to achieve something. Often, I have blocks of 30
minutes to play a game, I just cannot spend this time travelling
between stars, doing nothing.
So, to get to the point: Drop the assumption that everyone hating sandbox games is a spoiled wow-kiddie, that is just not true
Meridion
I take it you're not even close to being max level then?
I probably play EVE for about 6-10hrs a WEEK. My XFire sig says the time it does because I usually have EVE running while I'm in school, so when I get back from class I don't have to log back in to train a different skill. Like right now, I have it running... but I'm not playing. I'm just waiting for this 30min skill to finish training and after that it's gonna keep running till I get this skill up to lvl 3, because 3-4 will take 5hr.
That's the great part about EVE. It's made for the casual player, because unlike games like WoW you don't have to play to actually achieve something. You can become more skilled (skill points wise) and not even play at all.
You just picked the wrong corp is all. A corp involved in political BS. Don't get me wrong, politics make EVE great.... but just aren't my thing.
A Work in Progress.
Add Me
I take it you're not even close to being max level then?
I probably play EVE for about 6-10hrs a WEEK. My XFire sig says the time it does because I usually have EVE running while I'm in school, so when I get back from class I don't have to log back in to train a different skill. Like right now, I have it running... but I'm not playing. I'm just waiting for this 30min skill to finish training and after that it's gonna keep running till I get this skill up to lvl 3, because 3-4 will take 5hr.
That's the great part about EVE. It's made for the casual player, because unlike games like WoW you don't have to play to actually achieve something. You can become more skilled (skill points wise) and not even play at all.
You just picked the wrong corp is all. A corp involved in political BS. Don't get me wrong, politics make EVE great.... but just aren't my thing.
Why people consider that a good thing is truly beyond me.