Originally posted by EmmaDilo well you obviously have no idea what you're talking about. Each house can have 18 people plus 8 roomies, that makes 25. I'm sure glad you've done your research before critisizing.
Okay so the capacity increased a bit since when i played it in Beta. How are you disproving my point? 25 simultaneous play is nothing. Like i said, even non-mmo games that do NOT charge subscription allow for 40-50 ppl to play at the same time.
All MMOs that I know of allow HUNDREDS of people to play simultaneously without instancing. They have actual WORLDS you TRAVEL through. If TSO were to be a real MMO, you would not zoom out to a view of a suburban sprawl and CLICK to go to another house. You would hop on a bike and ride there.
I'm not saying TSO is a complete waste of time. It is a decent online adaptaion of The Sims, but it's not an MMO and it certainly should NOT be charged a monthly fee as if it is one.
Okay so the capacity increased a bit since when i played it in Beta. How are you disproving my point? 25 simultaneous play is nothing. Like i said, even non-mmo games that do NOT charge subscription allow for 40-50 ppl to play at the same time. All MMOs that I know of allow HUNDREDS of people to play simultaneously without instancing. They have actual WORLDS you TRAVEL through. If TSO were to be a real MMO, you would not zoom out to a view of a suburban sprawl and CLICK to go to another house. You would hop on a bike and ride there. I'm not saying TSO is a complete waste of time. It is a decent online adaptaion of The Sims, but it's not an MMO and it certainly should NOT be charged a monthly fee as if it is one.
Obviously you weren't too well informed in beta. The capacity of the houses has not increased at all. Ever. Aside from that, any number of people can play on a server at the same time. It's just that only 25 people can play on one lot at a time. How many people do you simultaneously interact with at any given time in YOUR games?
Aside from that, traveling has squat-diddly (I'm being polite there) to do with what makes a MMORPG. And there's plenty of MMORPGs which don't have bikes, do those not count either? I already went over what the requirements for something to be a MMORPG are--using the words that make up that acronym, rather than whatever you used to define it. I think you're thinking of MMORPGwVs, Massively Multiplayer Online Role PLaying Games with Vehicles. Yes, I made that up off the top of my head, but you're welcome to make it a genre of your very own.
If you want to argue that it shouldn't have a monthly fee I will give you the only argument you could POSSIBLY use legitimately. There are McDonald's objects and Intel computers.
I coulden't stand it. The game, in my opinion, takes a very certain kind of person to enjoy it... The kind that enjoys playing house over the internet.
To be quite frank, this game deserved the axe, not Earth and Beyond.
A game deserves the axe simply because you're not the type of person who enjoys it?
I just noticed this smiley, and I was trying to come up with an excuse to put it in this post. I couldn't think of one, so I just made a seperate paragraph just for it: Heh, I think that's cool.
Wow.. gj nitpicking details that have nothing to do with the argument.
Originally posted by crayauchtin
Obviously you weren't too well informed in beta. The capacity of the houses has not increased at all. Ever. Aside from that, any number of people can play on a server at the same time. It's just that only 25 people can play on one lot at a time. How many people do you simultaneously interact with at any given time in YOUR games?
Any number of people can play together on a Battle.net server at the same time. However only 8 of them can play in one game instance at the same time. Does Blizzard charge for Battle.net? NO. Any number of people can play on a Battlefield 1942 server at the same time. Only 32 players can play in the same game instance at the same time. Do ppl have to pay a monthly fee to play a multiplayer game of Battlefield 1942? NO.
What did i say? I said hundreds of ppl WITHOUT INSTANCING. A 'lot' in TSO is an instance. It's separated from the rest of the server and is outside the MMO realm. So what 'MMO REALM' does TSO have? A nice aerial view of suburbia and what else?
Two days ago in LineageII (a real MMO) I was at a castle siege where atleast 200 players were playing together simultaneously. It wasn't even instanced, that is, if I were to leave the area of the siege i would not have to wait for data to load, the way you have to in TSO if you want to zoom out to server view.
Like holy shit.. go out and play some other games before running your mouth.
Originally posted by crayauchtin
Aside from that, traveling has squat-diddly (I'm being polite there) to do with what makes a MMORPG. And there's plenty of MMORPGs which don't have bikes, do those not count either? I already went over what the requirements for something to be a MMORPG are--using the words that make up that acronym, rather than whatever you used to define it. I think you're thinking of MMORPGwVs, Massively Multiplayer Online Role PLaying Games with Vehicles. Yes, I made that up off the top of my head, but you're welcome to make it a genre of your very own.
I only used a bike as an EXAMPLE. What I meant was that you should be able to TRAVEL in the MMO world from instance to instance (if there are such instances). This is the same reason many people don't consider Guild Wars to be an MMO, because travel is a click away. Travelling has nothing to do with MMOs? Name me one MMO that doesn't let you walk from place to place and confines you to a freaking house and a backyard.
If I were to apply your idea of what an MMORPG is to other games, I would have to say DiabloII is one. Which it isn't. It's a multiplayer RPG. Blizzard does not charge monthly for multiplayer play.
The MMO in MMORPG does not fit with TSO. Period. I never said it wasn't an RPG so I'll leave that alone.
Face it. TSO is only MARKETED as an MMO so EA can charge you idiots monthly dough. If Sim type games are what you enjoy and you have no problem paying that fee as a price for playing it with other players, thats fine. But don't throw bullsht arguments in my face when it's obvious you don't know what you're talking about.
Oh, and don't get me started on that corporate sponsor sh*t. I really didn't think EA would steep THAT low even for EA.
Originally posted by DoctorRat I tried the game in Beta, completly unbiased. I coulden't stand it. The game, in my opinion, takes a very certain kind of person to enjoy it... The kind that enjoys playing house over the internet. To be quite frank, this game deserved the axe, not Earth and Beyond.
Interesting statement that TSO "deserved" the axe over E&B. If you refer to Sir Bruce's MMORPG Subscription chart, you will see that E&B never had anywhere near the number of subscribers that TSO had or even currently has. In fact, at E&B's peak, they had less than 50k, whereas TSO at it's peak had 100k and never actually dropped below 50k. Both of EA's major failures in the past few years (E&B and MCO) never even hit 50k.
Gee... TSO must really suck, huh? Especially if the subscription numbers so far outweigh those for "quality" games that were canceled like E&B and MCO...
Since I wasn't in a good mood to start with, and your pissy attitude over my fairly amiable disagreement with you has made it just that much worse, I'm not even going to pretend to be polite and civilized. Obviously, you can't do that, so why should I?
Originally posted by Sputniik
Any number of people can play together on a Battle.net server at the same time. However only 8 of them can play in one game instance at the same time. Does Blizzard charge for Battle.net? NO. Any number of people can play on a Battlefield 1942 server at the same time. Only 32 players can play in the same game instance at the same time. Do ppl have to pay a monthly fee to play a multiplayer game of Battlefield 1942? NO. What did i say? I said hundreds of ppl WITHOUT INSTANCING. A 'lot' in TSO is an instance. It's separated from the rest of the server and is outside the MMO realm. So what 'MMO REALM' does TSO have? A nice aerial view of suburbia and what else? Two days ago in LineageII (a real MMO) I was at a castle siege where atleast 200 players were playing together simultaneously. It wasn't even instanced, that is, if I were to leave the area of the siege i would not have to wait for data to load, the way you have to in TSO if you want to zoom out to server view. Like holy shit.. go out and play some other games before running your mouth.
Like, holy shit, I'm defending a game I've actually played recently instead of being a pathetic jerk who has to get his kicks and giggles in by going onto a forum for a game he doesn't even *like* and bashing it. And when someone disagrees with me, I don't become God's holy wrath and swear to make myself look smarter. Oh, that might because swearing over a GAME makes you look dumb. But, thanks for basically calling me ignorant for having the balls to think you might possibly be wrong. It will never happen again, oh holy master of the universe. Anyhow, I don't see why instancing is such a bad thing. It cuts down on lag so people with dial-up can *actually* play the game.
I only used a bike as an EXAMPLE. What I meant was that you should be able to TRAVEL in the MMO world from instance to instance (if there are such instances). This is the same reason many people don't consider Guild Wars to be an MMO, because travel is a click away. Travelling has nothing to do with MMOs? Name me one MMO that doesn't let you walk from place to place and confines you to a freaking house and a backyard.
If I were to apply your idea of what an MMORPG is to other games, I would have to say DiabloII is one. Which it isn't. It's a multiplayer RPG. Blizzard does not charge monthly for multiplayer play.
The MMO in MMORPG does not fit with TSO. Period. I never said it wasn't an RPG so I'll leave that alone.
Face it. TSO is only MARKETED as an MMO so EA can charge you idiots monthly dough. If Sim type games are what you enjoy and you have no problem paying that fee as a price for playing it with other players, thats fine. But don't throw bullsht arguments in my face when it's obvious you don't know what you're talking about.
Oh, and don't get me started on that corporate sponsor sh*t. I really didn't think EA would steep THAT low even for EA.
Diablo II is not an MMORPG because it's got a single-player mode. An MMORPG can't, because that wouldn't be MMO, would it?
Actually, you *can* travel between instances. For those of us who have actually played the game since beta..when you go to a job a car comes to get you and you travel to the instance that your job is at. Who's the ignorant one now?
Well, yeah, I agree that the whole thing with the ads is a little bit dumb.
Let's see, in the response to my non-offensive post, you've called me ignorant, an idiot and all sorts of other things. Meanwhile, you're the one who's so determined to make TSO fall(even though you technically don't need to even acknowledge its existence anymore) and has so much spare time on their hands that you moronically bash it on a TSO message board and you can't abide people having different opinions than you. Who's the ignorant idiot here? Because I don't think it's me, after all.
No, hun, you're the one that is refusing to admit that you're wrong and giving me bullshit arguments. I can't stand bullshit, fair and simple. But you're right, I should just stop arguing with you because it's obvious that you don't want to see beyond your limited viewscope of games in general, but I'm a real b*tch and I just have to get the last word in everything.
So if we were to combine the single player Sims with TSO in one game package, and have TSO be the multiplayer option, as it is done in most games these days because multiplayer is commonplace, then would you say TSO would no longer be an MMO? See the hole in your argument there?
Um.. getting in a car in a TSO lot is the same as clicking on a lot in zoomed out mode. There's no time or space involved in the travel so it's not travel at all. Car != travel. Right?
After all, I think you're the one dragging on this argument when I've proven point by point exactly why I'm right and you're.. well.. not. Just admit it and make me happy. Like i said, i'm not bashing TSO in general. I'm just saying it's not an MMO.
MMOGs host a large number of players in a single game world where all those players can interact. It is debatable what is "large", but most gamers would agree that it is at least greater than 64 players.. Popular MMOGs might have thousands of players online at any given time.
- Only 25 ppl can interact at the same time in TSO
To support all those players, MMOGs need large-scale game worlds. In MMOGs, large areas of the game are interconnected within the game such that a player can traverse vast distances without having to switch servers manually. For example, Tribes comes with a number of large maps the server plays periodically but in the MMOG PlanetSide all map-like areas of the game are accessible via flying, driving, or teleporting.
- "large scale game world" .. where is this game world in TSO? The aerial view house-map?
I wouldn't say it's not debatable whether TSO is an MMO or not. It is listed in this website after all..lol. There are some arguments I can think of that support the TSO=MMO view. For example, the lots, although frustratingly small, are 'persistent' .. as in, they don't disappear when you log out..
But I think generally TSO is missing that key social element - multiplayer interaction on a massive scale. Imagine what Maxis COULD have done with TSO.. and look at what they gave us. Hopefully there will be a TSOII at somepoint.. preferably developped somewhere else.
I don't play this game but what I am noticing is a definition problem here. Let's face facts the world of MMORPG is changing and some people seem stuck on the old definitions of what a MMORPG is...I hear this alot from people waiting for Guild Wars to come out. The game would not be on this site if it weren't fitting the definition.
Massive - hundreds of people have the chance to interact together (Maybe they are not all in the same area but they can eventually)
Multiplayer - There are multiple players in the system/game
Online - well we can agree that it is online right?
Role playing game - People are role playing an alter ego to themselves
MMORPG's are changing everyday, swords, magic, and laser rifles are not the only things that will make up this genre in the future. TSO is just the begining of many like it to come no doubt in the future, look at the glut of MMORPG's coming out on the market in the next year alone. Start opening your minds up more on this subject it is bound to change in the future, just because TSO is the start, does not mean it's the end. Deal with it...
Originally posted by JBO1 I don't play this game but what I am noticing is a definition problem here. Let's face facts the world of MMORPG is changing and some people seem stuck on the old definitions of what a MMORPG is...I hear this alot from people waiting for Guild Wars to come out. The game would not be on this site if it weren't fitting the definition. Massive - hundreds of people have the chance to interact together (Maybe they are not all in the same area but they can eventually) Multiplayer - There are multiple players in the system/game Online - well we can agree that it is online right? Role playing game - People are role playing an alter ego to themselves
MMORPG's are changing everyday, swords, magic, and laser rifles are not the only things that will make up this genre in the future. TSO is just the begining of many like it to come no doubt in the future, look at the glut of MMORPG's coming out on the market in the next year alone. Start opening your minds up more on this subject it is bound to change in the future, just because TSO is the start, does not mean it's the end. Deal with it...
It's true, there's a fine line between MMORPGs and Multiplayer games in general. TSO and Guildwars fit somewhere in between I suppose.
Still, there is one business trend involved that matters here, and that's the monthly fee. TSO and Guildwars.. guess which one charges monthly and which doesnt?
Ths only 'massive' interaction in TSO, and I know this much because I played in beta, is their msging system and their ranking system. I can get that kind of interaction on MSN..lol.
Originally posted by Sputniik Originally posted by JBO1 I don't play this game but what I am noticing is a definition problem here. Let's face facts the world of MMORPG is changing and some people seem stuck on the old definitions of what a MMORPG is...I hear this alot from people waiting for Guild Wars to come out. The game would not be on this site if it weren't fitting the definition. Massive - hundreds of people have the chance to interact together (Maybe they are not all in the same area but they can eventually) Multiplayer - There are multiple players in the system/game Online - well we can agree that it is online right? Role playing game - People are role playing an alter ego to themselves MMORPG's are changing everyday, swords, magic, and laser rifles are not the only things that will make up this genre in the future. TSO is just the begining of many like it to come no doubt in the future, look at the glut of MMORPG's coming out on the market in the next year alone. Start opening your minds up more on this subject it is bound to change in the future, just because TSO is the start, does not mean it's the end. Deal with it... It's true, there's a fine line between MMORPGs and Multiplayer games in general. TSO and Guildwars fit somewhere in between I suppose. Still, there is one business trend involved that matters here, and that's the monthly fee. TSO and Guildwars.. guess which one charges monthly and which doesnt? Ths only 'massive' interaction in TSO, and I know this much because I played in beta, is their msging system and their ranking system. I can get that kind of interaction on MSN..lol.
The interaction maybe true...don't know I don't play...Goes back to what I said before the genre is changing and the definition is changing with it...to be honest I accept it because change can be good and who knows where games like TSO and Guild Wars will thake us?? Games with low to no fees? More social interaction where players are not chasing eachother with sword intending to kill them? (Hehe) Who knows?? But I'll defend TSO it's got more content and things to do than some of the MMORPG's that have failed, from what I know of the game...
The interaction maybe true...don't know I don't play...Goes back to what I said before the genre is changing and the definition is changing with it...to be honest I accept it because change can be good and who knows where games like TSO and Guild Wars will thake us?? Games with low to no fees? More social interaction where players are not chasing eachother with sword intending to kill them? (Hehe) Who knows?? But I'll defend TSO it's got more content and things to do than some of the MMORPG's that have failed, from what I know of the game...
Oh I'm ALL FOR change and variety in MMOs. That's why I hope they make TSOII and make it good. In fact, I find TSO to be a fair rendition of multiplayer Sims.. it's just not MMO enough.
But let me kick in my glass-half-empty view. Imagine 'change' came the other way around.. imagine they started charging monthly fees for multiplayer modes in non-mmo games (as I believe TSO is close to) instead of having MMOs go free (which I believe Guild Wars is closer to). That would royally suck.
Wow.. gj nitpicking details that have nothing to do with the argument.
Originally posted by crayauchtin
Obviously you weren't too well informed in beta. The capacity of the houses has not increased at all. Ever. Aside from that, any number of people can play on a server at the same time. It's just that only 25 people can play on one lot at a time. How many people do you simultaneously interact with at any given time in YOUR games?
Any number of people can play together on a Battle.net server at the same time. However only 8 of them can play in one game instance at the same time. Does Blizzard charge for Battle.net? NO. Any number of people can play on a Battlefield 1942 server at the same time. Only 32 players can play in the same game instance at the same time. Do ppl have to pay a monthly fee to play a multiplayer game of Battlefield 1942? NO.
What did i say? I said hundreds of ppl WITHOUT INSTANCING. A 'lot' in TSO is an instance. It's separated from the rest of the server and is outside the MMO realm. So what 'MMO REALM' does TSO have? A nice aerial view of suburbia and what else?
Two days ago in LineageII (a real MMO) I was at a castle siege where atleast 200 players were playing together simultaneously. It wasn't even instanced, that is, if I were to leave the area of the siege i would not have to wait for data to load, the way you have to in TSO if you want to zoom out to server view.
Like holy shit.. go out and play some other games before running your mouth.
Originally posted by crayauchtin
Aside from that, traveling has squat-diddly (I'm being polite there) to do with what makes a MMORPG. And there's plenty of MMORPGs which don't have bikes, do those not count either? I already went over what the requirements for something to be a MMORPG are--using the words that make up that acronym, rather than whatever you used to define it. I think you're thinking of MMORPGwVs, Massively Multiplayer Online Role PLaying Games with Vehicles. Yes, I made that up off the top of my head, but you're welcome to make it a genre of your very own.
I only used a bike as an EXAMPLE. What I meant was that you should be able to TRAVEL in the MMO world from instance to instance (if there are such instances). This is the same reason many people don't consider Guild Wars to be an MMO, because travel is a click away. Travelling has nothing to do with MMOs? Name me one MMO that doesn't let you walk from place to place and confines you to a freaking house and a backyard.
If I were to apply your idea of what an MMORPG is to other games, I would have to say DiabloII is one. Which it isn't. It's a multiplayer RPG. Blizzard does not charge monthly for multiplayer play.
The MMO in MMORPG does not fit with TSO. Period. I never said it wasn't an RPG so I'll leave that alone.
Face it. TSO is only MARKETED as an MMO so EA can charge you idiots monthly dough. If Sim type games are what you enjoy and you have no problem paying that fee as a price for playing it with other players, thats fine. But don't throw bullsht arguments in my face when it's obvious you don't know what you're talking about.
Oh, and don't get me started on that corporate sponsor sh*t. I really didn't think EA would steep THAT low even for EA.
EQ has instants zones where only 6 people can be , and in the case of some zones in GoD only 54 people can be , and they still make you pay for the game. Why should it be any different for TSO?
~Relica~ Played: EQ, Shadowbane, SWG, Horizons Playing: EQ2 (on release)
Originally posted by Relica EQ has instants zones where only 6 people can be , and in the case of some zones in GoD only 54 people can be , and they still make you pay for the game. Why should it be any different for TSO?
Because in TSO there is nothing other than these instanced zones. The entire game consists of many zones, each zone housing 25 people as Cray says.
Furthermore, the instanaces aren't navigable. You have to zoom out to a map view and then click on a house to get there, even if the house you're trying to get to is supposedly next door, eliminating any sense of space on a server-wide scale.
Nearly every MMo I've played had instanced zones. In fact L2 is the only game I've played that is without it. But only in TSO are these instances completely segregated from other instances where even spatial connection between them aren't taken into account.
All this matters in that there is no 'world' in TSO only a list of lots, or instances.
In relation to the 10 dollars vs 15 dollars I pay 15 dollars Australian to play sims or there abouts which would equate to 10 dollars American or there abouts it dosn't mean they havn't played they just use a different money
Believe it or not Americans arn't the only people in the world.
I think that depends on how you play it...for some people it is probably a simulation, where they try to simulate an actual life of a person. Then, for others, it's not as strict/serious. For those people it's a game.
And then there's the middle ground, where people treat life as a game and simulate life. (And that was true nitpicking! Yay!)
you know... arguing online is really pathetic. where does it get you? does it make you feel better about yourself?
if people enjoy TSO then great! so they do. why bash the game and players for something that has nothing to do with the ones NOT playing the game? it's rediculous and childish.
aren't people above the "i know you are but what am i?" mentality yet?
makes me wonder how most people react to others in a real life setting. eesh...
time for a coffee and away from the computer for me.
mmmm... coffee...
____________________ -Retired- SWG: TKM & Master Dancer L2: Female Orc Raider - Erica Female Dwarf Scavenger/Female DE Dark Wizard/Female Human Cleric - Hindemith PristonTale: Valkyrie lvl 35 Anarchy Online: Opifex Female MA lvl 61 - Rubi-Ka 1
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Now Playing: EQ2 Prior Games (in no order): SWG, L2, RO, PT, ROSE, CoH/CoV, AO, UO, EVE, WoW and a bunch of others. _______
Comments
Okay so the capacity increased a bit since when i played it in Beta. How are you disproving my point? 25 simultaneous play is nothing. Like i said, even non-mmo games that do NOT charge subscription allow for 40-50 ppl to play at the same time.
All MMOs that I know of allow HUNDREDS of people to play simultaneously without instancing. They have actual WORLDS you TRAVEL through. If TSO were to be a real MMO, you would not zoom out to a view of a suburban sprawl and CLICK to go to another house. You would hop on a bike and ride there.
I'm not saying TSO is a complete waste of time. It is a decent online adaptaion of The Sims, but it's not an MMO and it certainly should NOT be charged a monthly fee as if it is one.
From what all you guys have been saying, at least now we know why Sims Online turned out into a such big disappointment...
*anticipating WoW*
*anticipating WoW*
Obviously you weren't too well informed in beta. The capacity of the houses has not increased at all. Ever. Aside from that, any number of people can play on a server at the same time. It's just that only 25 people can play on one lot at a time. How many people do you simultaneously interact with at any given time in YOUR games?
Aside from that, traveling has squat-diddly (I'm being polite there) to do with what makes a MMORPG. And there's plenty of MMORPGs which don't have bikes, do those not count either? I already went over what the requirements for something to be a MMORPG are--using the words that make up that acronym, rather than whatever you used to define it. I think you're thinking of MMORPGwVs, Massively Multiplayer Online Role PLaying Games with Vehicles. Yes, I made that up off the top of my head, but you're welcome to make it a genre of your very own.
If you want to argue that it shouldn't have a monthly fee I will give you the only argument you could POSSIBLY use legitimately. There are McDonald's objects and Intel computers.
I tried the game in Beta, completly unbiased.
I coulden't stand it. The game, in my opinion, takes a very certain kind of person to enjoy it... The kind that enjoys playing house over the internet.
To be quite frank, this game deserved the axe, not Earth and Beyond.
A game deserves the axe simply because you're not the type of person who enjoys it?
I just noticed this smiley, and I was trying to come up with an excuse to put it in this post. I couldn't think of one, so I just made a seperate paragraph just for it:
Heh, I think that's cool.
Interesting statement that TSO "deserved" the axe over E&B. If you refer to Sir Bruce's MMORPG Subscription chart, you will see that E&B never had anywhere near the number of subscribers that TSO had or even currently has. In fact, at E&B's peak, they had less than 50k, whereas TSO at it's peak had 100k and never actually dropped below 50k. Both of EA's major failures in the past few years (E&B and MCO) never even hit 50k.
Gee... TSO must really suck, huh? Especially if the subscription numbers so far outweigh those for "quality" games that were canceled like E&B and MCO...
~FG };^>
What can I say? No one ever went broke underestimating the taste or intelligence of the american public.
Or... Any public.
Diablo II is not an MMORPG because it's got a single-player mode. An MMORPG can't, because that wouldn't be MMO, would it?
Actually, you *can* travel between instances. For those of us who have actually played the game since beta..when you go to a job a car comes to get you and you travel to the instance that your job is at. Who's the ignorant one now?
Well, yeah, I agree that the whole thing with the ads is a little bit dumb.
Let's see, in the response to my non-offensive post, you've called me ignorant, an idiot and all sorts of other things. Meanwhile, you're the one who's so determined to make TSO fall(even though you technically don't need to even acknowledge its existence anymore) and has so much spare time on their hands that you moronically bash it on a TSO message board and you can't abide people having different opinions than you. Who's the ignorant idiot here? Because I don't think it's me, after all.
No, hun, you're the one that is refusing to admit that you're wrong and giving me bullshit arguments. I can't stand bullshit, fair and simple. But you're right, I should just stop arguing with you because it's obvious that you don't want to see beyond your limited viewscope of games in general, but I'm a real b*tch and I just have to get the last word in everything.
So if we were to combine the single player Sims with TSO in one game package, and have TSO be the multiplayer option, as it is done in most games these days because multiplayer is commonplace, then would you say TSO would no longer be an MMO? See the hole in your argument there?
Um.. getting in a car in a TSO lot is the same as clicking on a lot in zoomed out mode. There's no time or space involved in the travel so it's not travel at all. Car != travel. Right?
After all, I think you're the one dragging on this argument when I've proven point by point exactly why I'm right and you're.. well.. not. Just admit it and make me happy. Like i said, i'm not bashing TSO in general. I'm just saying it's not an MMO.
Listen guys, I'm with Cray. TSO definetly qualifies as a MMORPG - it's simply untraditional.
Sputnik...would you like to make a list of what makes a game qualify as an MMORPG? How many people per whatever? Do we have to have travel?
My personal opinon is that a lot of people make snap judgements about TSO and don't give it a chance because it's different.
You have given many reasons why TSO is not an MMO, but where in massive multiplayer online role player game are there clauses about travel and such?
It seems like you're making a lot of assumptions, if you look at the literal definition of the acronym, TSO is by all means an MMORPG
http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Massively_multiplayer_online_game
- Only 25 ppl can interact at the same time in TSO
- "large scale game world" .. where is this game world in TSO? The aerial view house-map?
I wouldn't say it's not debatable whether TSO is an MMO or not. It is listed in this website after all..lol. There are some arguments I can think of that support the TSO=MMO view. For example, the lots, although frustratingly small, are 'persistent' .. as in, they don't disappear when you log out..
But I think generally TSO is missing that key social element - multiplayer interaction on a massive scale. Imagine what Maxis COULD have done with TSO.. and look at what they gave us. Hopefully there will be a TSOII at somepoint.. preferably developped somewhere else.
I don't play this game but what I am noticing is a definition problem here. Let's face facts the world of MMORPG is changing and some people seem stuck on the old definitions of what a MMORPG is...I hear this alot from people waiting for Guild Wars to come out. The game would not be on this site if it weren't fitting the definition.
Massive - hundreds of people have the chance to interact together (Maybe they are not all in the same area but they can eventually)
Multiplayer - There are multiple players in the system/game
Online - well we can agree that it is online right?
Role playing game - People are role playing an alter ego to themselves
MMORPG's are changing everyday, swords, magic, and laser rifles are not the only things that will make up this genre in the future. TSO is just the begining of many like it to come no doubt in the future, look at the glut of MMORPG's coming out on the market in the next year alone. Start opening your minds up more on this subject it is bound to change in the future, just because TSO is the start, does not mean it's the end. Deal with it...
It's true, there's a fine line between MMORPGs and Multiplayer games in general. TSO and Guildwars fit somewhere in between I suppose.
Still, there is one business trend involved that matters here, and that's the monthly fee. TSO and Guildwars.. guess which one charges monthly and which doesnt?
Ths only 'massive' interaction in TSO, and I know this much because I played in beta, is their msging system and their ranking system. I can get that kind of interaction on MSN..lol.
The interaction maybe true...don't know I don't play...Goes back to what I said before the genre is changing and the definition is changing with it...to be honest I accept it because change can be good and who knows where games like TSO and Guild Wars will thake us?? Games with low to no fees? More social interaction where players are not chasing eachother with sword intending to kill them? (Hehe) Who knows?? But I'll defend TSO it's got more content and things to do than some of the MMORPG's that have failed, from what I know of the game...
Oh I'm ALL FOR change and variety in MMOs. That's why I hope they make TSOII and make it good. In fact, I find TSO to be a fair rendition of multiplayer Sims.. it's just not MMO enough.
But let me kick in my glass-half-empty view. Imagine 'change' came the other way around.. imagine they started charging monthly fees for multiplayer modes in non-mmo games (as I believe TSO is close to) instead of having MMOs go free (which I believe Guild Wars is closer to). That would royally suck.
Any number of people can play together on a Battle.net server at the same time. However only 8 of them can play in one game instance at the same time. Does Blizzard charge for Battle.net? NO. Any number of people can play on a Battlefield 1942 server at the same time. Only 32 players can play in the same game instance at the same time. Do ppl have to pay a monthly fee to play a multiplayer game of Battlefield 1942? NO.
What did i say? I said hundreds of ppl WITHOUT INSTANCING. A 'lot' in TSO is an instance. It's separated from the rest of the server and is outside the MMO realm. So what 'MMO REALM' does TSO have? A nice aerial view of suburbia and what else?
Two days ago in LineageII (a real MMO) I was at a castle siege where atleast 200 players were playing together simultaneously. It wasn't even instanced, that is, if I were to leave the area of the siege i would not have to wait for data to load, the way you have to in TSO if you want to zoom out to server view.
Like holy shit.. go out and play some other games before running your mouth.
Originally posted by crayauchtin
I only used a bike as an EXAMPLE. What I meant was that you should be able to TRAVEL in the MMO world from instance to instance (if there are such instances). This is the same reason many people don't consider Guild Wars to be an MMO, because travel is a click away. Travelling has nothing to do with MMOs? Name me one MMO that doesn't let you walk from place to place and confines you to a freaking house and a backyard.
If I were to apply your idea of what an MMORPG is to other games, I would have to say DiabloII is one. Which it isn't. It's a multiplayer RPG. Blizzard does not charge monthly for multiplayer play.
The MMO in MMORPG does not fit with TSO. Period. I never said it wasn't an RPG so I'll leave that alone.
Face it. TSO is only MARKETED as an MMO so EA can charge you idiots monthly dough. If Sim type games are what you enjoy and you have no problem paying that fee as a price for playing it with other players, thats fine. But don't throw bullsht arguments in my face when it's obvious you don't know what you're talking about.
Oh, and don't get me started on that corporate sponsor sh*t. I really didn't think EA would steep THAT low even for EA.
EQ has instants zones where only 6 people can be , and in the case of some zones in GoD only 54 people can be , and they still make you pay for the game. Why should it be any different for TSO?
~Relica~
Played: EQ, Shadowbane, SWG, Horizons
Playing: EQ2 (on release)
-In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08-
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RISING DRAGOON ~AION US ONLINE LEGION for Elyos
sims online.....zZz
Because in TSO there is nothing other than these instanced zones. The entire game consists of many zones, each zone housing 25 people as Cray says.
Furthermore, the instanaces aren't navigable. You have to zoom out to a map view and then click on a house to get there, even if the house you're trying to get to is supposedly next door, eliminating any sense of space on a server-wide scale.
Nearly every MMo I've played had instanced zones. In fact L2 is the only game I've played that is without it. But only in TSO are these instances completely segregated from other instances where even spatial connection between them aren't taken into account.
All this matters in that there is no 'world' in TSO only a list of lots, or instances.
In relation to the 10 dollars vs 15 dollars I pay 15 dollars Australian to play sims or there abouts which would equate to 10 dollars American or there abouts it dosn't mean they havn't played they just use a different money
Believe it or not Americans arn't the only people in the world.
I think that depends on how you play it...for some people it is probably a simulation, where they try to simulate an actual life of a person. Then, for others, it's not as strict/serious. For those people it's a game.
And then there's the middle ground, where people treat life as a game and simulate life.
(And that was true nitpicking! Yay!)
you know... arguing online is really pathetic. where does it get you? does it make you feel better about yourself?
if people enjoy TSO then great! so they do. why bash the game and players for something that has nothing to do with the ones NOT playing the game? it's rediculous and childish.
aren't people above the "i know you are but what am i?" mentality yet?
makes me wonder how most people react to others in a real life setting. eesh...
time for a coffee and away from the computer for me.
mmmm... coffee...
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-Retired-
SWG:
TKM & Master Dancer
L2:
Female Orc Raider - Erica
Female Dwarf Scavenger/Female DE Dark Wizard/Female Human Cleric - Hindemith
PristonTale:
Valkyrie lvl 35
Anarchy Online:
Opifex Female MA lvl 61 - Rubi-Ka 1
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Now Playing:
EQ2
Prior Games (in no order):
SWG, L2, RO, PT, ROSE, CoH/CoV, AO, UO, EVE, WoW and a bunch of others.
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