Originally posted by Roin Originally posted by apertotes i see so many angry and jealous people this is really entertaining. you can bash the game all you want. it wont change a thing. it is the deepest and most complete MMORPG that you can play now (shame be on SOE ). it has the world record for most players online on the same world. those are oficial figures, so you can say whatever you want. it is a fact.
You can keep saying it's a fact all you want. That still won't make it true. You can think Eve-Online is the deepest, and most entertaining game out there. For you it is, but as soon as someone else doesn't agree. Then it isn't a fact, just another subjective opinion. So keep spouting all the Eve-Online is the great game non-sense you want. Still doesn't make it better then any other game out there.
Exactly. I couldn't agree more with you on this.
It's fine you like EVE and all, but why can you just keep it in your board, and if people ask about EVE or sci-fi, then meantion it. Not saying it's perfect in every single thread.
I'm not putting down EVE by saying this. I'm just critiquing the post.
This is all on one server. The total people playing at one time. That's really not that many. Other games just split the population up on different servers. I'm all for EVE succeeding, as with any other game people are having fun at, but those numbers aren't that impressive. Especially since that's the record.
Originally posted by apertotes i see so many angry and jealous people this is really entertaining. you can bash the game all you want. it wont change a thing. it is the deepest and most complete MMORPG that you can play now (shame be on SOE ). it has the world record for most players online on the same world. those are oficial figures, so you can say whatever you want. it is a fact.
You can keep saying it's a fact all you want. That still won't make it true. You can think Eve-Online is the deepest, and most entertaining game out there. For you it is, but as soon as someone else doesn't agree. Then it isn't a fact, just another subjective opinion. So keep spouting all the Eve-Online is the great game non-sense you want. Still doesn't make it better then any other game out there.
Exactly. I couldn't agree more with you on this.
It's fine you like EVE and all, but why can you just keep it in your board, and if people ask about EVE or sci-fi, then meantion it. Not saying it's perfect in every single thread.
Ditto. What's so great and deep about it? I played and didn't see all that much depth. It was just big gas planets, the same few ships floating by, and people waging war with spread sheets. I can name a lot of games with more depth than that.
I'm not trying to put down your game. I mean if you like it then it's for you. What I'm trying to explain is that you need to accept that people have different opinions than yours and not take that fact so personal.
Originally posted by porgie Originally posted by JackcoltOriginally posted by Roin Originally posted by apertotesi see so many angry and jealous people this is really entertaining. you can bash the game all you want. it wont change a thing. it is the deepest and most complete MMORPG that you can play now (shame be on SOE ). it has the world record for most players online on the same world. those are oficial figures, so you can say whatever you want. it is a fact.You can keep saying it's a fact all you want. That still won't make it true. You can think Eve-Online is the deepest, and most entertaining game out there. For you it is, but as soon as someone else doesn't agree. Then it isn't a fact, just another subjective opinion. So keep spouting all the Eve-Online is the great game non-sense you want. Still doesn't make it better then any other game out there.Exactly. I couldn't agree more with you on this. It's fine you like EVE and all, but why can you just keep it in your board, and if people ask about EVE or sci-fi, then meantion it. Not saying it's perfect in every single thread. Ditto. What's so great and deep about it? I played and didn't see all that much depth. It was just big gas planets, the same few ships floating by, and people waging war with spread sheets. I can name a lot of games with more depth than that. I'm not trying to put down your game. I mean if you like it then it's for you. What I'm trying to explain is that you need to accept that people have different opinions than yours and not take that fact so personal.
oh come on. of course that is my opinion. what is a fact is that it has got the world record for most online playing at the same time. some people just seem to read the first line and then press reply or quote
Yeah, but saying: It's the deepest and most blah blah MMO there is, isn't stating your opinion. It's stating a fact. Which it can't, because you can't really meassure depth, so any review will always be objective.
We are not saying; Well that's just your opinion. We know what. Infact "that's just your opinion" is the world worst argument. You can say: I think, I like and I love and so on, but there's noway when judging a game, you can say: It's the most in-depth.
Originally posted by apertotes i see so many angry and jealous people this is really entertaining. you can bash the game all you want. it wont change a thing. it is the deepest and most complete MMORPG that you can play now (shame be on SOE ). it has the world record for most players online on the same world. those are oficial figures, so you can say whatever you want. it is a fact.
You can keep saying it's a fact all you want. That still won't make it true. You can think Eve-Online is the deepest, and most entertaining game out there. For you it is, but as soon as someone else doesn't agree. Then it isn't a fact, just another subjective opinion. So keep spouting all the Eve-Online is the great game non-sense you want. Still doesn't make it better then any other game out there.
Exactly. I couldn't agree more with you on this.
It's fine you like EVE and all, but why can you just keep it in your board, and if people ask about EVE or sci-fi, then meantion it. Not saying it's perfect in every single thread.
Ditto. What's so great and deep about it? I played and didn't see all that much depth. It was just big gas planets, the same few ships floating by, and people waging war with spread sheets. I can name a lot of games with more depth than that.
I'm not trying to put down your game. I mean if you like it then it's for you. What I'm trying to explain is that you need to accept that people have different opinions than yours and not take that fact so personal.
I don't think Eve's number are impressive at all. Just because the 230480128414812043284x10 to the millionth power doesn't mean that they're all playing the game. So long as you're online, your skills level even if you're just taking a nap with your computer on. Congradulations, you're the proud owners of the world's largest chat-room posing as an MMO! Sorry, the world's largest INACTIVE chat room prosing as an MMO.
^^^ Fact!
Now for my opinion: Freelancer's multiplayer owns Eve.
The OP was about the numbers of people online simultaneously on the Eve Cluster.
If people aren't impressed, don't read the post it was well marked as an Eve thread.
WoW fans can still go to their little world and grobble over things that will never change unless Blizzard moves it's magic stick and allows for changes.
The fact that I don't have to wait an hour to log into Eve is enough for me to realize that someone created their servers with high populations in mind while another company didn't.
If you want to get down to the nitty gritty here goes.
You can debate what a server does and what it doesn't do untill you are red in the face as most of you probably are by now.
But in Eve I can store thousands of things at different stations throughout this huge universe and guess what, when I come back it's all still there.
WoW you can store a very small amount of things and have to create mule chars and mess with the mailbox system to allow you to store all your goodies.
I think that Eves accomplishment and dedication to their game really shows how they feed off of the community.
Wow shows that they listen to fans, but then do what they want. We could look at the failed BG's that were put in because people complained that it should have been a feature at launch, we could also look at the balance issues they are having for their factions and realize that there is also problems there.
Blizzard knew they were going to have tons of subscribers at launch yet did very little to increase server architecture and ran around for a good week setting up servers and servers and servers.
If they took a page from CCP they would have designed their game to handle massive server loads from the start and wouldn't have had such a problem.
Originally posted by Saftwear I need to get in here. The OP was about the numbers of people online simultaneously on the Eve Cluster. If people aren't impressed, don't read the post it was well marked as an Eve thread. WoW fans can still go to their little world and grobble over things that will never change unless Blizzard moves it's magic stick and allows for changes. The fact that I don't have to wait an hour to log into Eve is enough for me to realize that someone created their servers with high populations in mind while another company didn't. If you want to get down to the nitty gritty here goes. You can debate what a server does and what it doesn't do untill you are red in the face as most of you probably are by now. But in Eve I can store thousands of things at different stations throughout this huge universe and guess what, when I come back it's all still there. WoW you can store a very small amount of things and have to create mule chars and mess with the mailbox system to allow you to store all your goodies. I think that Eves accomplishment and dedication to their game really shows how they feed off of the community. Wow shows that they listen to fans, but then do what they want. We could look at the failed BG's that were put in because people complained that it should have been a feature at launch, we could also look at the balance issues they are having for their factions and realize that there is also problems there. Blizzard knew they were going to have tons of subscribers at launch yet did very little to increase server architecture and ran around for a good week setting up servers and servers and servers. If they took a page from CCP they would have designed their game to handle massive server loads from the start and wouldn't have had such a problem.
I think I'm done
Very well said..
To add some fact for those who doesn't know how servers handle information:
Servers doesn't render any 3d-object at all, and all they simply do is to read/send cordinates to clients connected to the server at that time.
That is why EVE simply has the record as off the 3d world you actually play in doesn't matter att all.. The only stuff that matters are actually the cordinates of players, equipment, mobs, and so on, so that all people can se the same objects in the same place as an other player does. Every thing else is rendered to the clients PCs. And Eve does surely have alot more cordinates that any WoW server has to read/send to the clients.
Sorry for my bad english, haven't typed in english for months..
25k is quite an accomplishment,but depends how they achieve this.
Tons of instances?
graphics scaled back to very short views?Sometimes games scale them to such a short distance you can actually see a fog line to where the view changes.
Is there like next to none animated textures being used?
It's been so long since i tried this game so i just can't remember what the world looked like.Video cards can only handle so many bytes/bandwidth at one time,so if the game doesn't chug there scaling back something to do it.You can achieve anything on a server but at what price.
Still no doubt the users would be happy knowing there are so many players on one server to hangout with...good job.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Originally posted by Saftwear I need to get in here. The OP was about the numbers of people online simultaneously on the Eve Cluster. If people aren't impressed, don't read the post it was well marked as an Eve thread. WoW fans can still go to their little world and grobble over things that will never change unless Blizzard moves it's magic stick and allows for changes. The fact that I don't have to wait an hour to log into Eve is enough for me to realize that someone created their servers with high populations in mind while another company didn't. If you want to get down to the nitty gritty here goes. You can debate what a server does and what it doesn't do untill you are red in the face as most of you probably are by now. But in Eve I can store thousands of things at different stations throughout this huge universe and guess what, when I come back it's all still there. WoW you can store a very small amount of things and have to create mule chars and mess with the mailbox system to allow you to store all your goodies. I think that Eves accomplishment and dedication to their game really shows how they feed off of the community. Wow shows that they listen to fans, but then do what they want. We could look at the failed BG's that were put in because people complained that it should have been a feature at launch, we could also look at the balance issues they are having for their factions and realize that there is also problems there. Blizzard knew they were going to have tons of subscribers at launch yet did very little to increase server architecture and ran around for a good week setting up servers and servers and servers. If they took a page from CCP they would have designed their game to handle massive server loads from the start and wouldn't have had such a problem.
I think I'm done
That's just it though. No MMORPG out now currently needs the same kind of server setup Eve-Online uses. Most of Eve-Online is alot of empty space, but there is alot of it. WoW over-all world size is pretty much set in stone. Anything else they need to do can pretty much be instanced if need arises. I think it's honestly safe to say that WoW entire world could fit in maybe one or two Eve-Online zones. Now imagine if WoW did support roughly 10,000 to 15,000 people per server. Could you imagine the overcrowding?
2500 to 5000 people per server fits game worlds like WoW perfectly. They don't have need for huge server clusters that support tens of thousands of people. That much server power for worlds the size of WoW, and EQ2 are pretty useless. The only game currently that i'm aware of in development that would have need for such an extensive setup is Dark and Light. That game should be proof enough that it's easier to get 25,000 concurrent users in a space setting. As opposed to one that is seamless and has actually terrain to be dealt with.
As for yoru comments about BG's, Mailboxes, Mules, and the other stuff. I'm not going to really touch on those. As I feel that's just more stuff that lands in the field of personal opinion. You feel that people shouldn't be limited in bank space (Just an analogy not saying you do). While on the other hand I feel that bank space in WoW is just fine. As for the complaints about Queue's. I've never been in one so I can't comment. The 3 servers I use to play on never had a problem with Queues. (Lightning Blade, Eldre Thas, and Wildhammer)
In War - Victory. In Peace - Vigilance. In Death - Sacrifice.
I do not understand why people are so shocked that EVE is growing again.
WoW trickle down is making almost every MMO grow as the WoW folks grow bored and move on to "real" MMORPG's.
Then there's the fact that EVE's only competition in the Sci-Fi arena just shot itself in the head, yes I'm talking about SWG.
Half my PA is playing EVE now. The other half are scattered amongst half a dozen other MMO titles, myself included. EVE is the only solid Sci-Fi mmo on the market. A 250k player base just got totally alienated by the game they loved so they're out looking for new ground. A good solid chunk of them are landing in EVE.
Once again EVE is benefiting from the death of another game in the Sci-Fi genre. Before E&B was cancelled they only had about 30k users. Then E&B collapsed and most of it's 37k players went ot EVE, jumping EVE to around 70k players. Then WoW came along and wow trickle-down probably gave them another 15-20k users.
Now SWG collapses and 250k players are looking for a new skill based sci-fi fix.
EVE is the only one. All the others are level based or FPS. I don't even LIKE EVE and I've been tempted to re-sub to it for my sci-fi fix. Thank god BattleTech: Inner Sphere Wars went into Beta I don't have to force myself to suffer the boredom that is EVE for my sci fi fix.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online. Sig image Pending Still in: A couple Betas
Originally posted by Saftwear I need to get in here. The OP was about the numbers of people online simultaneously on the Eve Cluster. If people aren't impressed, don't read the post it was well marked as an Eve thread. WoW fans can still go to their little world and grobble over things that will never change unless Blizzard moves it's magic stick and allows for changes. The fact that I don't have to wait an hour to log into Eve is enough for me to realize that someone created their servers with high populations in mind while another company didn't. If you want to get down to the nitty gritty here goes. You can debate what a server does and what it doesn't do untill you are red in the face as most of you probably are by now. But in Eve I can store thousands of things at different stations throughout this huge universe and guess what, when I come back it's all still there. WoW you can store a very small amount of things and have to create mule chars and mess with the mailbox system to allow you to store all your goodies. I think that Eves accomplishment and dedication to their game really shows how they feed off of the community. Wow shows that they listen to fans, but then do what they want. We could look at the failed BG's that were put in because people complained that it should have been a feature at launch, we could also look at the balance issues they are having for their factions and realize that there is also problems there. Blizzard knew they were going to have tons of subscribers at launch yet did very little to increase server architecture and ran around for a good week setting up servers and servers and servers. If they took a page from CCP they would have designed their game to handle massive server loads from the start and wouldn't have had such a problem.
I think I'm done
I need to get in here. Don't post in the Pub for news clearly only dedicated for those who care, EVE players.
Even though you have to wait an hour for logging into wow, you have wait 3 for your travelling to end.
Originally posted by Elnator I do not understand why people are so shocked that EVE is growing again.WoW trickle down is making almost every MMO grow as the WoW folks grow bored and move on to "real" MMORPG's.
And what I have quoted is a prime example of why no one likes Eve-Online fans. According to them if you aren't playing Eve-Online you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. If you are playing WoW, then you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. I hear all to often the Eve-Online community bragging about how mature their community is. So far, i'm not seeing any more maturity from any of you Eve-Online fans then I have in the many other MMO's i've tried.
You all want everyone to respect Eve-Online and it's accomplishments. Yet won't hesitate to take pot shots at every other MMO. At every chance you get. Don't you think you should try giving respect, if you are going to ask for it?
In War - Victory. In Peace - Vigilance. In Death - Sacrifice.
Originally posted by Wizardry 25k is quite an accomplishment,but depends how they achieve this. Tons of instances? graphics scaled back to very short views?Sometimes games scale them to such a short distance you can actually see a fog line to where the view changes. Is there like next to none animated textures being used? It's been so long since i tried this game so i just can't remember what the world looked like.Video cards can only handle so many bytes/bandwidth at one time,so if the game doesn't chug there scaling back something to do it.You can achieve anything on a server but at what price. Still no doubt the users would be happy knowing there are so many players on one server to hangout with...good job.
What does graphics card have to do with server load at all? And what does fog have to do with server load? The ammount of interpretations and missinterpretations is amazing. There is no real need for an uber cluster since Eve is not a real time/ real control game, alot of actions are easily predictable and with that in mind protocol can be squized by a huge margin. Also the comment about having large number of users in space as opposed to landscape has no standing. People should realize that what you see on the screen has nothing to do with client/server complexity. It is about game style, point and click -> minimum traffic, fps -> alot of traffic, fps + physics -> even more traffic, independently where you game is set. I'd also like to add that CCPs real achievement is in making a great game so many people are enjoying.
Originally posted by Jackcolt Originally posted by WARCRYtm if you didnt liked wow players flaming GW,dont flame EVE,cause i see you dont understand it,or you didnt get deep in game to see how good it is.
So just because I'm exaggerating, I'm suddenly a flamer? Just because I don't agree with you on how good EVE is. That's a subjective opinion.
The travel is very long and dull. That's a fact. And I don't like that.
And to whoever said it was the top 500 server, I would like to see a link for that. You can't make such claims without being able to document it.
Again, as some people say, EVE has minimal server traffic because of the games nature. You don't have any enviroment. You don't have coalition versus enviroment/objects, you don't have real-time control whatsoever, EVE doesn't have to render anything for. Just tell with wallpaper must be spread out on the gigantic sphere, which I actually accuse of being a sqaure because they can just "cheat" with the wallpaper. If you don't what I'm talking about, don't comment.
WARCRY did you see my post about EVE fanbois? No you didn't cause I wasn't such a prick to make one, because I actually can respect other peoples opinion.
The top 500 supercomputer list will be updated on April 16 at the ISC2006 in Dresden. You'll find the CCP server on the list then.
Originally posted by Elnator I do not understand why people are so shocked that EVE is growing again.
WoW trickle down is making almost every MMO grow as the WoW folks grow bored and move on to "real" MMORPG's.
And what I have quoted is a prime example of why no one likes Eve-Online fans. According to them if you aren't playing Eve-Online you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. If you are playing WoW, then you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. I hear all to often the Eve-Online community bragging about how mature their community is. So far, i'm not seeing any more maturity from any of you Eve-Online fans then I have in the many other MMO's i've tried.
You all want everyone to respect Eve-Online and it's accomplishments. Yet won't hesitate to take pot shots at every other MMO. At every chance you get. Don't you think you should try giving respect, if you are going to ask for it?
Elnator isn't a EVE fan, he's a DAOC fan atm. He doesn't like EVE, i guess he respects some of it's features though.
Tbh i think WOW is too shallow to be a RPG, wheres the customisation? Wheres the crafting? Wheres the RP? Wheres anything?
It's just missiong out on everything IMO, its a fun game for a couple of hours but after that you find out it's as shallow as CS.
I haven't read all 10 pages . Amazing how fast these Eve made xxk threads grow
Well here are my thoughts:
First of all I'm ashamed of being a Wow player sometimes. When you see what some Wow fans post (I read some of the pages ) Amazing how full of shit some of you are. What does it matter if Wow has 6 million subs, when the thread is about simultaneous players. Wow has about 4000-5000 players per server. Because the nature of the game (Gameworld, gameplay) is so that you don't need more players. This allows for certain things you can't achieve in Eve. And it's not a bad thing (Eve fanbois.)
Every developer needs to find out what they want with their game, and do what they want good. Blizzard chose smaller amount of players for nice questing, casual gameplay and a "noob" friendly mmo.
CCP chose a different approach. They knew that they wouldn't have 2 million subscribers so they made everything on 1 server cluster. It still feels abit empty (Because of the big space), but atleast it's not 30 min between each time a word is written in the chat They managed it quite well. Although some things aren't perfect. The first 15k record was very laggy. And fleet battles tend to lag.
Like every thread about this, it seems like it ends with the "My games gameplay is better then yours!"
Here are my cents about that :
World of Warcraft:
is: Great pve. Casual friendly/hardcore (endgame). Great quests, deep lore (Yes). Easy to learn.
is not: Great pvp. Dynamic. Playerrun. Great crafting. Scifi.
Eve online:
is: Fun Dynamic Playerun Big Advanced Scifi. Mature.
is not: Easy to learn Jump in and Win. Quests. Pve. Deep lore. Fantasy. Star Wars (YEEEES!)
I play both. Why? Because both of them have something I love Why can't someone make a game with something from both
Originally posted by Phoenixs ..is not: ... Deep lore. ....
Have to disagree on this one, the chronicles and stories available on the main site are great background and give huge amounts of detail (obviously not as much as those games based in an existing franchise, but they are great reads, even if you don't play)
Beating 25K simultanious online on one server is a big thing, I dare the WOW fanbois to even attempt getting half of that on one of their servers.
It is truly amazing how such announcements quickly degenerate in a "my game is far better than yours" mud-wrestling. Fact is that EVE had over 25.000 accounts logged in at once on the server, and save for a few places (mainly highly popular agent systems) lag was minimal to non-existent. Congrats to CCP and that's it. The Nth thread comparing WoW(or any other game) and EvE is not really needed.
------------------------------------------------------ Originally posted by Mandolin
Designers need to move away from the old D&D level-based model which was never designed for player vs player combat in the first place.
Originally posted by scaramoosh Originally posted by RoinOriginally posted by ElnatorI do not understand why people are so shocked that EVE is growing again.WoW trickle down is making almost every MMO grow as the WoW folks grow bored and move on to "real" MMORPG's.And what I have quoted is a prime example of why no one likes Eve-Online fans. According to them if you aren't playing Eve-Online you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. If you are playing WoW, then you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. I hear all to often the Eve-Online community bragging about how mature their community is. So far, i'm not seeing any more maturity from any of you Eve-Online fans then I have in the many other MMO's i've tried. You all want everyone to respect Eve-Online and it's accomplishments. Yet won't hesitate to take pot shots at every other MMO. At every chance you get. Don't you think you should try giving respect, if you are going to ask for it? Elnator isn't a EVE fan, he's a DAOC fan atm. He doesn't like EVE, i guess he respects some of it's features though. Tbh i think WOW is too shallow to be a RPG, wheres the customisation? Wheres the crafting? Wheres the RP? Wheres anything?
It's just missiong out on everything IMO, its a fun game for a couple of hours but after that you find out it's as shallow as CS.
*pulls up a chair*
Ok so please enlighten me. Exactly how is WoW disfunctional in those area's... compared to say Eve-Online? AO? DAOC? You do the same task in all of the above mentioned games. So I would please like you to elaborate on just how those games are actually different from one another.
In War - Victory. In Peace - Vigilance. In Death - Sacrifice.
Originally posted by Elnator I do not understand why people are so shocked that EVE is growing again.
WoW trickle down is making almost every MMO grow as the WoW folks grow bored and move on to "real" MMORPG's.
And what I have quoted is a prime example of why no one likes Eve-Online fans. According to them if you aren't playing Eve-Online you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. If you are playing WoW, then you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. I hear all to often the Eve-Online community bragging about how mature their community is. So far, i'm not seeing any more maturity from any of you Eve-Online fans then I have in the many other MMO's i've tried.
You all want everyone to respect Eve-Online and it's accomplishments. Yet won't hesitate to take pot shots at every other MMO. At every chance you get. Don't you think you should try giving respect, if you are going to ask for it?
Erm Roin you need a serious lesson in reading comprehension. It's also patently obvious that you did not read my entire post. I don't even LIKE EVE. And I clearly stated as such in my post. YOU however, in your hatred of "EVE FANS" chose not to finish reading my post and knee-jerked a reaction post without thinking.
EVE is growing rapidly for 2 simple reasons: 1- People tired of WoW looking for other games to play. EVERY MMO I have played recently has large numbers of new players who are 'coming from wow'. EVE, EQ2, DAOC and others as well. Visit game forums for any of the popular (and some not so popular) sites and there are plenty of people posting "I am coming from WoW" or something to that effect. Not saying WoW is a bad MMO, it's not. But it IS simplistic by comparison to the other titles out there.
2 - SWG was the only other MAJOR Sci Fi MMORPG in the classic sense. It had over 250,000 players. SOE made a HUGE blunder and the population is now estimated (since SOE won't fess up to it) at about 50k-75k players. That's a LOT of people who enjoy a skill-based system in a sci-fi genre. And, low and behold, only 1 other MMO offers a skill based system in a sci-fi genre: EVE
Those two factors have caused EVE's recent explosive growth, guaranteed. MANY former SWG players went to EVE. Just look at the SWG forums here and you can see that many of the people posting there are now playing EVE after having left SWG.
Just exactly how you equate my statements, which are based in factual data that you can easily verify, to being an "EVE FAN" baffles me. I don't much like the rabid EVE fans either. But I like EVE bashers who do so simply because they hate the rabid EVE fans even less.
WOW is a decent MMORPG but it does not have a detailed player driven economy. It's crafting system is a complete joke. It has no player owned housing whatsoever. That's without going into the community issues it has (which is one of the worst I've experienced in any MMO, ever) the graphics being very old tech (which is nice in it's own way) and cartoony (which is a turn-off for many). It's a DECENT MMO. It's a great MMO to bring new people into the Genre, as witnessed by the fact that it's brought so many in. But it also lacks end-game content (don't deny it, everyone here who's played to 60 knows this is true) which means that eventually people grow bored with it and move on to other games with more depth.
Nothing wrong with WoW. Blizzard did a FANTASTIC job with making it exactly what it is. WoW does EXACTLY what Blizzard designed it to do. But anyone who argues that WoW has more depth than EVE or DAOC or even EQ2 is smoking some really good weed and needs serious help.
I give respect where it is due. I don't like EVE myself but it's a very well done game and is in a major growth phase since it's only major competition is in the process of collapsing (SWG) and WoW is bringing so many people in to the Genre who now, a year later, are starting to look for new ground to play in.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online. Sig image Pending Still in: A couple Betas
Originally posted by scaramoosh EVE is growing because of them reasons yes but mainly because of the features it gives, otherwise people wouldn't touch it.
I agree it would grow regardless. But at a much more sedate rate. The reason for the explosion in growth was simple: WoW attrition SWG implosion
Otherwise EVE would still be slowly climbing towards 100k subs. I suspect at this point that they're probably knocking on the 150k subscribers door. 25k players online simo would generally indicate well over 100k actual subscribers.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online. Sig image Pending Still in: A couple Betas
Comments
You can keep saying it's a fact all you want. That still won't make it true. You can think Eve-Online is the deepest, and most entertaining game out there. For you it is, but as soon as someone else doesn't agree. Then it isn't a fact, just another subjective opinion. So keep spouting all the Eve-Online is the great game non-sense you want. Still doesn't make it better then any other game out there.
Exactly. I couldn't agree more with you on this.
It's fine you like EVE and all, but why can you just keep it in your board, and if people ask about EVE or sci-fi, then meantion it. Not saying it's perfect in every single thread.
I'm not putting down EVE by saying this. I'm just critiquing the post.
This is all on one server. The total people playing at one time. That's really not that many. Other games just split the population up on different servers. I'm all for EVE succeeding, as with any other game people are having fun at, but those numbers aren't that impressive. Especially since that's the record.
You can keep saying it's a fact all you want. That still won't make it true. You can think Eve-Online is the deepest, and most entertaining game out there. For you it is, but as soon as someone else doesn't agree. Then it isn't a fact, just another subjective opinion. So keep spouting all the Eve-Online is the great game non-sense you want. Still doesn't make it better then any other game out there.
Exactly. I couldn't agree more with you on this.
It's fine you like EVE and all, but why can you just keep it in your board, and if people ask about EVE or sci-fi, then meantion it. Not saying it's perfect in every single thread.
Ditto. What's so great and deep about it? I played and didn't see all that much depth. It was just big gas planets, the same few ships floating by, and people waging war with spread sheets. I can name a lot of games with more depth than that.
I'm not trying to put down your game. I mean if you like it then it's for you. What I'm trying to explain is that you need to accept that people have different opinions than yours and not take that fact so personal.
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</OBAMA>
oh come on. of course that is my opinion. what is a fact is that it has got the world record for most online playing at the same time. some people just seem to read the first line and then press reply or quote
Yeah, but saying: It's the deepest and most blah blah MMO there is, isn't stating your opinion. It's stating a fact. Which it can't, because you can't really meassure depth, so any review will always be objective.
We are not saying; Well that's just your opinion. We know what. Infact "that's just your opinion" is the world worst argument. You can say: I think, I like and I love and so on, but there's noway when judging a game, you can say: It's the most in-depth.
You can keep saying it's a fact all you want. That still won't make it true. You can think Eve-Online is the deepest, and most entertaining game out there. For you it is, but as soon as someone else doesn't agree. Then it isn't a fact, just another subjective opinion. So keep spouting all the Eve-Online is the great game non-sense you want. Still doesn't make it better then any other game out there.
Exactly. I couldn't agree more with you on this.
It's fine you like EVE and all, but why can you just keep it in your board, and if people ask about EVE or sci-fi, then meantion it. Not saying it's perfect in every single thread.
Ditto. What's so great and deep about it? I played and didn't see all that much depth. It was just big gas planets, the same few ships floating by, and people waging war with spread sheets. I can name a lot of games with more depth than that.
I'm not trying to put down your game. I mean if you like it then it's for you. What I'm trying to explain is that you need to accept that people have different opinions than yours and not take that fact so personal.
I don't think Eve's number are impressive at all. Just because the 230480128414812043284x10 to the millionth power doesn't mean that they're all playing the game. So long as you're online, your skills level even if you're just taking a nap with your computer on. Congradulations, you're the proud owners of the world's largest chat-room posing as an MMO! Sorry, the world's largest INACTIVE chat room prosing as an MMO.
^^^
Fact!
Now for my opinion: Freelancer's multiplayer owns Eve.
I need to get in here.
The OP was about the numbers of people online simultaneously on the Eve Cluster.
If people aren't impressed, don't read the post it was well marked as an Eve thread.
WoW fans can still go to their little world and grobble over things that will never change unless Blizzard moves it's magic stick and allows for changes.
The fact that I don't have to wait an hour to log into Eve is enough for me to realize that someone created their servers with high populations in mind while another company didn't.
If you want to get down to the nitty gritty here goes.
You can debate what a server does and what it doesn't do untill you are red in the face as most of you probably are by now.
But in Eve I can store thousands of things at different stations throughout this huge universe and guess what, when I come back it's all still there.
WoW you can store a very small amount of things and have to create mule chars and mess with the mailbox system to allow you to store all your goodies.
I think that Eves accomplishment and dedication to their game really shows how they feed off of the community.
Wow shows that they listen to fans, but then do what they want. We could look at the failed BG's that were put in because people complained that it should have been a feature at launch, we could also look at the balance issues they are having for their factions and realize that there is also problems there.
Blizzard knew they were going to have tons of subscribers at launch yet did very little to increase server architecture and ran around for a good week setting up servers and servers and servers.
If they took a page from CCP they would have designed their game to handle massive server loads from the start and wouldn't have had such a problem.
I think I'm done
Very well said..
To add some fact for those who doesn't know how servers handle information:
Servers doesn't render any 3d-object at all, and all they simply do is to read/send cordinates to clients connected to the server at that time.
That is why EVE simply has the record as off the 3d world you actually play in doesn't matter att all..
The only stuff that matters are actually the cordinates of players, equipment, mobs, and so on, so that all people can se the same objects in the same place as an other player does. Every thing else is rendered to the clients PCs. And Eve does surely have alot more cordinates that any WoW server has to read/send to the clients.
Sorry for my bad english, haven't typed in english for months..
25k is quite an accomplishment,but depends how they achieve this.
Tons of instances?
graphics scaled back to very short views?Sometimes games scale them to such a short distance you can actually see a fog line to where the view changes.
Is there like next to none animated textures being used?
It's been so long since i tried this game so i just can't remember what the world looked like.Video cards can only handle so many bytes/bandwidth at one time,so if the game doesn't chug there scaling back something to do it.You can achieve anything on a server but at what price.
Still no doubt the users would be happy knowing there are so many players on one server to hangout with...good job.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
That's just it though. No MMORPG out now currently needs the same kind of server setup Eve-Online uses. Most of Eve-Online is alot of empty space, but there is alot of it. WoW over-all world size is pretty much set in stone. Anything else they need to do can pretty much be instanced if need arises. I think it's honestly safe to say that WoW entire world could fit in maybe one or two Eve-Online zones. Now imagine if WoW did support roughly 10,000 to 15,000 people per server. Could you imagine the overcrowding?
2500 to 5000 people per server fits game worlds like WoW perfectly. They don't have need for huge server clusters that support tens of thousands of people. That much server power for worlds the size of WoW, and EQ2 are pretty useless. The only game currently that i'm aware of in development that would have need for such an extensive setup is Dark and Light. That game should be proof enough that it's easier to get 25,000 concurrent users in a space setting. As opposed to one that is seamless and has actually terrain to be dealt with.
As for yoru comments about BG's, Mailboxes, Mules, and the other stuff. I'm not going to really touch on those. As I feel that's just more stuff that lands in the field of personal opinion. You feel that people shouldn't be limited in bank space (Just an analogy not saying you do). While on the other hand I feel that bank space in WoW is just fine. As for the complaints about Queue's. I've never been in one so I can't comment. The 3 servers I use to play on never had a problem with Queues. (Lightning Blade, Eldre Thas, and Wildhammer)
In War - Victory.
In Peace - Vigilance.
In Death - Sacrifice.
I do not understand why people are so shocked that EVE is growing again.
WoW trickle down is making almost every MMO grow as the WoW folks grow bored and move on to "real" MMORPG's.
Then there's the fact that EVE's only competition in the Sci-Fi arena just shot itself in the head, yes I'm talking about SWG.
Half my PA is playing EVE now. The other half are scattered amongst half a dozen other MMO titles, myself included. EVE is the only solid Sci-Fi mmo on the market. A 250k player base just got totally alienated by the game they loved so they're out looking for new ground. A good solid chunk of them are landing in EVE.
Once again EVE is benefiting from the death of another game in the Sci-Fi genre. Before E&B was cancelled they only had about 30k users. Then E&B collapsed and most of it's 37k players went ot EVE, jumping EVE to around 70k players. Then WoW came along and wow trickle-down probably gave them another 15-20k users.
Now SWG collapses and 250k players are looking for a new skill based sci-fi fix.
EVE is the only one. All the others are level based or FPS. I don't even LIKE EVE and I've been tempted to re-sub to it for my sci-fi fix. Thank god BattleTech: Inner Sphere Wars went into Beta
I don't have to force myself to suffer the boredom that is EVE for my sci fi fix.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
I need to get in here. Don't post in the Pub for news clearly only dedicated for those who care, EVE players.
Even though you have to wait an hour for logging into wow, you have wait 3 for your travelling to end.
And what I have quoted is a prime example of why no one likes Eve-Online fans. According to them if you aren't playing Eve-Online you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. If you are playing WoW, then you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. I hear all to often the Eve-Online community bragging about how mature their community is. So far, i'm not seeing any more maturity from any of you Eve-Online fans then I have in the many other MMO's i've tried.
You all want everyone to respect Eve-Online and it's accomplishments. Yet won't hesitate to take pot shots at every other MMO. At every chance you get. Don't you think you should try giving respect, if you are going to ask for it?
In War - Victory.
In Peace - Vigilance.
In Death - Sacrifice.
WoW isnt a "real" mmorpg.
What you do in WoW means nothing what-so-ever to the "world". You cant even be unique in it at all.
Its a mmofps, or mmonewbieworld, whichever you want to call it.
The definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over expecting different results.
What does graphics card have to do with server load at all? And what does fog have to do with server load? The ammount of interpretations and missinterpretations is amazing. There is no real need for an uber cluster since Eve is not a real time/ real control game, alot of actions are easily predictable and with that in mind protocol can be squized by a huge margin. Also the comment about having large number of users in space as opposed to landscape has no standing. People should realize that what you see on the screen has nothing to do with client/server complexity. It is about game style, point and click -> minimum traffic, fps -> alot of traffic, fps + physics -> even more traffic, independently where you game is set. I'd also like to add that CCPs real achievement is in making a great game so many people are enjoying.
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Emperium Online
So just because I'm exaggerating, I'm suddenly a flamer? Just because I don't agree with you on how good EVE is. That's a subjective opinion.
The travel is very long and dull. That's a fact. And I don't like that.
And to whoever said it was the top 500 server, I would like to see a link for that. You can't make such claims without being able to document it.
Again, as some people say, EVE has minimal server traffic because of the games nature. You don't have any enviroment. You don't have coalition versus enviroment/objects, you don't have real-time control whatsoever, EVE doesn't have to render anything for. Just tell with wallpaper must be spread out on the gigantic sphere, which I actually accuse of being a sqaure because they can just "cheat" with the wallpaper. If you don't what I'm talking about, don't comment.
WARCRY did you see my post about EVE fanbois? No you didn't cause I wasn't such a prick to make one, because I actually can respect other peoples opinion.
The top 500 supercomputer list will be updated on April 16 at the ISC2006 in Dresden.
You'll find the CCP server on the list then.
And what I have quoted is a prime example of why no one likes Eve-Online fans. According to them if you aren't playing Eve-Online you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. If you are playing WoW, then you aren't playing a 'real' MMO. I hear all to often the Eve-Online community bragging about how mature their community is. So far, i'm not seeing any more maturity from any of you Eve-Online fans then I have in the many other MMO's i've tried.
You all want everyone to respect Eve-Online and it's accomplishments. Yet won't hesitate to take pot shots at every other MMO. At every chance you get. Don't you think you should try giving respect, if you are going to ask for it?
Elnator isn't a EVE fan, he's a DAOC fan atm. He doesn't like EVE, i guess he respects some of it's features though.
Tbh i think WOW is too shallow to be a RPG, wheres the customisation? Wheres the crafting? Wheres the RP? Wheres anything?
It's just missiong out on everything IMO, its a fun game for a couple of hours but after that you find out it's as shallow as CS.
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Don't click here...no2
25665, nice one. Pity a good percentage of that are macro miners. "NO Chinese in Rookie channel. Final warning!"
Will this topic come up again when "EVE got a new record 25666 people online simultanious!". Probably.
I haven't read all 10 pages
. Amazing how fast these Eve made xxk threads grow 
Well here are my thoughts:
First of all I'm ashamed of being a Wow player sometimes. When you see what some Wow fans post
(I read some of the pages 
) Amazing how full of shit some of you are. What does it matter if Wow has 6 million subs, when the thread is about simultaneous players. Wow has about 4000-5000 players per server. Because the nature of the game (Gameworld, gameplay) is so that you don't need more players. This allows for certain things you can't achieve in Eve. And it's not a bad thing (Eve fanbois.)
Every developer needs to find out what they want with their game, and do what they want good. Blizzard chose smaller amount of players for nice questing, casual gameplay and a "noob" friendly mmo.
CCP chose a different approach. They knew that they wouldn't have 2 million subscribers so they made everything on 1 server cluster. It still feels abit empty (Because of the big space), but atleast it's not 30 min between each time a word is written in the chat
They managed it quite well. Although some things aren't perfect. The first 15k record was very laggy. And fleet battles tend to lag.
Like every thread about this, it seems like it ends with the "My games gameplay is better then yours!"
Here are my cents about that
:
World of Warcraft:
is:
Great pve.
Casual friendly/hardcore (endgame).
Great quests, deep lore (Yes).
Easy to learn.
is not:
Great pvp.
Dynamic.
Playerrun.
Great crafting.
Scifi.
Eve online:
is:
Fun
Dynamic
Playerun
Big
Advanced
Scifi.
Mature.
is not:
Easy to learn
Jump in and Win.
Quests.
Pve.
Deep lore.
Fantasy.
Star Wars (YEEEES!)
I play both. Why? Because both of them have something I love
Why can't someone make a game with something from both 
Have to disagree on this one, the chronicles and stories available on the main site are great background and give huge amounts of detail (obviously not as much as those games based in an existing franchise, but they are great reads, even if you don't play)
Beating 25K simultanious online on one server is a big thing, I dare the WOW fanbois to even attempt getting half of that on one of their servers.
It is truly amazing how such announcements quickly degenerate in a "my game is far better than yours" mud-wrestling. Fact is that EVE had over 25.000 accounts logged in at once on the server, and save for a few places (mainly highly popular agent systems) lag was minimal to non-existent. Congrats to CCP and that's it. The Nth thread comparing WoW(or any other game) and EvE is not really needed.
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Originally posted by Mandolin
Designers need to move away from the old D&D level-based model which was never designed for player vs player combat in the first place.
*pulls up a chair*
Ok so please enlighten me. Exactly how is WoW disfunctional in those area's... compared to say Eve-Online? AO? DAOC? You do the same task in all of the above mentioned games. So I would please like you to elaborate on just how those games are actually different from one another.
In War - Victory.
In Peace - Vigilance.
In Death - Sacrifice.
Erm Roin you need a serious lesson in reading comprehension. It's also patently obvious that you did not read my entire post. I don't even LIKE EVE. And I clearly stated as such in my post. YOU however, in your hatred of "EVE FANS" chose not to finish reading my post and knee-jerked a reaction post without thinking.
EVE is growing rapidly for 2 simple reasons:
1- People tired of WoW looking for other games to play. EVERY MMO I have played recently has large numbers of new players who are 'coming from wow'. EVE, EQ2, DAOC and others as well. Visit game forums for any of the popular (and some not so popular) sites and there are plenty of people posting "I am coming from WoW" or something to that effect. Not saying WoW is a bad MMO, it's not. But it IS simplistic by comparison to the other titles out there.
2 - SWG was the only other MAJOR Sci Fi MMORPG in the classic sense. It had over 250,000 players. SOE made a HUGE blunder and the population is now estimated (since SOE won't fess up to it) at about 50k-75k players. That's a LOT of people who enjoy a skill-based system in a sci-fi genre. And, low and behold, only 1 other MMO offers a skill based system in a sci-fi genre: EVE
Those two factors have caused EVE's recent explosive growth, guaranteed. MANY former SWG players went to EVE. Just look at the SWG forums here and you can see that many of the people posting there are now playing EVE after having left SWG.
Just exactly how you equate my statements, which are based in factual data that you can easily verify, to being an "EVE FAN" baffles me. I don't much like the rabid EVE fans either. But I like EVE bashers who do so simply because they hate the rabid EVE fans even less.
WOW is a decent MMORPG but it does not have a detailed player driven economy. It's crafting system is a complete joke. It has no player owned housing whatsoever. That's without going into the community issues it has (which is one of the worst I've experienced in any MMO, ever) the graphics being very old tech (which is nice in it's own way) and cartoony (which is a turn-off for many). It's a DECENT MMO. It's a great MMO to bring new people into the Genre, as witnessed by the fact that it's brought so many in. But it also lacks end-game content (don't deny it, everyone here who's played to 60 knows this is true) which means that eventually people grow bored with it and move on to other games with more depth.
Nothing wrong with WoW. Blizzard did a FANTASTIC job with making it exactly what it is. WoW does EXACTLY what Blizzard designed it to do. But anyone who argues that WoW has more depth than EVE or DAOC or even EQ2 is smoking some really good weed and needs serious help.
I give respect where it is due. I don't like EVE myself but it's a very well done game and is in a major growth phase since it's only major competition is in the process of collapsing (SWG) and WoW is bringing so many people in to the Genre who now, a year later, are starting to look for new ground to play in.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
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Don't click here...no2
I agree it would grow regardless. But at a much more sedate rate. The reason for the explosion in growth was simple:
WoW attrition
SWG implosion
Otherwise EVE would still be slowly climbing towards 100k subs. I suspect at this point that they're probably knocking on the 150k subscribers door. 25k players online simo would generally indicate well over 100k actual subscribers.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas