Why is it subtitled: Shadows of Angmar?

ironore

Why do they have the subtitle for LOTRO as "Shadows of Angmar"?

Are they setting it back in that time in the third age when the witch-king was ruler of the vast domain of Angmar in the north?  I was under the impression the game was set in the few years at the end of the story of the Lord of the Rings.

What then does this subtitle mean?  What is the significance.  Anyone with some insight, please post here.

Slaggg

The Witch-King's reign was indeed well before the War of the Ring.  Even though he took up residence in Minas Morgul, Angmar still exists in ruins and perhaps more usable fashion.

I can't specualte too much, since most of it will be revealed in the Epic Storyline, but I would venture to guess that Turbine chose Angmar as a focus, for a couple of reasons:

It lends a way to create an Epic Story, one with a terrible enemy at the end ala Sauron, helping the players feel as if they too are involved in a serious, world-changing adventure.

Not much is really known about Angmar.  The Witch-King's history is fleshed out to a certain extent.  We know that he made war with the Numenoreans that settled in the area south and west of Angmar, in the area known as Arnor.  But not having detailed info gives Turbine a bunch of creative room to expand the story. 

Since the Launch will include only Eriador, the story's focus needed to be central to that area.  And there's not much else in Eriador that lends itself to conflict.

That's the way I see it.

DemonAts

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Originally posted by Slaggg

The Witch-King's reign was indeed well before the War of the Ring.  Even though he took up residence in Minas Morgul, Angmar still exists in ruins and perhaps more usable fashion.
I can't specualte too much, since most of it will be revealed in the Epic Storyline, but I would venture to guess that Turbine chose Angmar as a focus, for a couple of reasons:
It lends a way to create an Epic Story, one with a terrible enemy at the end ala Sauron, helping the players feel as if they too are involved in a serious, world-changing adventure.
Not much is really known about Angmar.  The Witch-King's history is fleshed out to a certain extent.  We know that he made war with the Numenoreans that settled in the area south and west of Angmar, in the area known as Arnor.  But not having detailed info gives Turbine a bunch of creative room to expand the story. 
Since the Launch will include only Eriador, the story's focus needed to be central to that area.  And there's not much else in Eriador that lends itself to conflict.
That's the way I see it.

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Yeah that about sums it up, though I would think that LOTRO has a lot more in store than just the threat of the Angmar. A lot of people don't realise this but all of Middle-Earth is having internal conflicts. I suspect that the focus on the game will change with each race, but basically stick with the basic princables.

Humans = Fight agianst Bandits, Removal of Orc and Troll Clans and Remants of Angmar

Dwarves = Finding more resources, Removal of Orc and Troll Clans and Reglorification of the Dwarven Race.

Elves =  Removal of Orc and Troll Clans and Remants of Angmar

Hobbits = I really think that Turbine has just added this race just for the small precentage who want a good RPing and Relaxed Adventure. Probably solving everyday promblems and minor threats.

Slaggg

Oh, I'm sure that Turbine has a load up it's sleeve.  There's the whole War to deal with.  There's been hints about the Expansion focusing on revealing Rohan to players, and that will also require some type of Epic storyline.  Helm's Deep anyone?

ironore

Well I guess I understand it as you have mentioned remnants of Angmar, as it was clearly long gone by the time of the War of the Ring.  Still it seems strange to subtitle it regarding the remnants of a once terrible and vast kingdom.

At any rate, I still hold to my view that it would be much cooler to actually start back at that earlier time in the 3rd age when Angmar was wearing away at the northern Kingdom of Arnor and destroyed much of it, sending its people into exile as straggling remnants or the mysterious Dunedain rangers.  Of course there were epic events that led up to the defeat of the Witch King at that time, and the subsequent re-ordering of things in the north, although the old kingdom never arose there again until after the One Ring was destroyed.

Well, that would be EPIC, but alas, they will probably just make something else up out of the air in order to 'fill-in-the-gaps' despite the VAST and RICH backstory that Tolkien actually DID create in great detail.

As to revealing Rohan, that would be nice, and there were other fronts of the War such as at Dale and Erebor (The Lonely Mountain).  Sure Helm's Deep is cool, but the events there only encompass a mere number of DAYS.  Even that great stronghold has a history during the earlier 3rd age when the hill-folk attacked or in the days of the formation of Rohan when the terrible Wain-Riders came out of the east and the evetns that led up to the age old alliance of the Rohirim to Gondor.

Like I said, Epic.  I mean, of course the LOTR events are epic but they don't cover that much time, and if they started further back, we would get to that good stuff eventually, right?

Slaggg

Yeah, and it's that good stuff that builds the foundation.

I think if the game Launched in a setting other than WotR, the game would fail, because people do ultimately want to experience the period they know best.  Not to say that expansions regarding the other periods wouldn't work, I'm sure they would, but not as Launch products.

It's unfortunate, but these companies use an approach that they feel will appeal to the most people, and that often leaves some people out, because they are already so far ahead.

Trust me, I'm right there with you in wanting to explore those other periods that aren't described in anything but the most minute detail.

But I'll take what Turbine gives me, and probably love it.

LOTRFreak

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Originally posted by ironore

Well I guess I understand it as you have mentioned remnants of Angmar, as it was clearly long gone by the time of the War of the Ring.  Still it seems strange to subtitle it regarding the remnants of a once terrible and vast kingdom.
At any rate, I still hold to my view that it would be much cooler to actually start back at that earlier time in the 3rd age when Angmar was wearing away at the northern Kingdom of Arnor and destroyed much of it, sending its people into exile as straggling remnants or the mysterious Dunedain rangers.  Of course there were epic events that led up to the defeat of the Witch King at that time, and the subsequent re-ordering of things in the north, although the old kingdom never arose there again until after the One Ring was destroyed.
Well, that would be EPIC, but alas, they will probably just make something else up out of the air in order to 'fill-in-the-gaps' despite the VAST and RICH backstory that Tolkien actually DID create in great detail.
As to revealing Rohan, that would be nice, and there were other fronts of the War such as at Dale and Erebor (The Lonely Mountain).  Sure Helm's Deep is cool, but the events there only encompass a mere number of DAYS.  Even that great stronghold has a history during the earlier 3rd age when the hill-folk attacked or in the days of the formation of Rohan when the terrible Wain-Riders came out of the east and the evetns that led up to the age old alliance of the Rohirim to Gondor.
Like I said, Epic.  I mean, of course the LOTR events are epic but they don't cover that much time, and if they started further back, we would get to that good stuff eventually, right?

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I would love for the game to be set in an earlier time but to get the Tolkien Society to give up rights on The Simarilion, would be a serious pain, and to set the game in a Earlier time in the 3rd age that barely was mentioned at all would lose a large population of only movie watchers. That although aren't the most preferable are needed to raise the population of those who play the games themselves.

You forget Thranduils Hall, I look foward to fighting alongside them. Their so much more ruthless and aren't like a lot of the other elves that we see. They remind me of Doritah a secret and mysterious kingdom that can hold up its own on the threats of the Evil Ones.

I hope that the expansion packs will split the world into 4. I hope that their will only be 3 expansion packs.

1-Rohan, Lonely Mountain, Dale, Thrandil's Hall, Rohvanion
2-Gondor                                                                                                                                      3-Harad and Mordor                                         

 

 

 

 

 

 

ironore

Well these are good posts, and I appreciate them, but there seems to be a reoccuring idea that setting the game at the time of the movie will make it more appealing to the many that are only familiar with that part of Tolkien' story, but I still don't understand how this game is going to take the couple of years of story surrounding this very small and select fellowship and make that part of the everyday play experience of the customers.  Personally I wouldn't want them too, but all those that are only familiar with the storyline will just be saying, "HEY where's frodo and merry and SAM?  Where is this ONE ring?" 

Even if they get to participate in the 3 or so battles from the movies that won't be much content.  If they go into the other battles that weren't depicted in the films, those people will be just as lost as if it were earlier in the 3rd age.  I suppose the draw is to go to the locations in the movies and to play those races, but that was all much the same ealier in the 3rd age, at least just a LITTLE earlier.  I think those that know very little about anything could be happy when told they were fighting against an evil realm (Angmar) that one of the NAZGUL set up years earlier than the war of the ring and that they could be an ELF and go shoot their arrows.   Even so I think a good game would be designed with decent enough gameplay that it would stand on it's own 2 feet and not just cash in on all those fanKIDZ of the movies, but I suppose that's not the way the coorporate sector works.

Besides it would all come down to the war of the ring eventually, and THAT would be something for everyone to be looking forward to.

Slaggg

But there is plenty of content to be had.

We after all, won't be following the Fellowship or trying to re-create the trilogy.  The players are meant to be heroes in their own right, forging their own histories.  Hence using Angmar as a focus for the Launch.  Lots of stuff to go on there.

I look at it like this:

The Main story arc, of the path of the Fellowship is a big broad trunk, with many many branches depicting so many avenues of lore to explore.  There are so many things only hinted at in the trilogy that can offer 5yrs + of content. 

I understand your argument, about the period prior to The Hobbit being rich in story ideas, but Turbine has obviously decided that they have enough material to last a while in the Trilogy alone.  Besides, I'm fairly confident that the Tolkien Estate just wouldn't give rights to use anything outside of the The Hobbit/LotR.

I agree with you and would really like to see those periods visualized.  I also see the other side of the coin.  And right now, I'll take what Turbine is giving me, because they are doing a fantastic job....so far.

ironore

Right. THat's all I'm saying, if they are using content aside from the Ring Quest it is much the same as earlier content that many aren't familiar with. I am sure it will be fun and interesting nonetheless. MOst of the stuff I was talking about, however, is contained in the Appendix of the Return of the King, which I suppose they must have rights to as well. Do they have rights to the Hobbit? They could at least start back then and do the whole Smaug thing with the battle of 5 armies.

I suppose it doesn't have to be linear in time-line layout. Maybe a later expansion could be from an earlier date. Anyway, I'll stop ranting. Let me know how the game is when it comes out, because I, of course, will be far too poor to play it.

Namarie!

royalty5734

Maybe the game will focuse on an alternate storyline where the goal will be to get to angmar and kill the witch king or something like that.

ironore

Perhaps, but I was under the impression that the time of the game would be during the war of the ring, when all 9 of the Nazgul were based out of Minas Morgul on the borders of MORDOR.