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Something new about Capital Ships and more... Revamps grapevine

http://swg.stratics.com/content/?Cat=264&uid=620

The last House of Commons Chat. Here is a few exerpts...

"Brekkee - *Phaelyn* With the changes coming to Squad Leader and Ranger, can we expect more sweeping changes to professions such as Smuggler, to give each profession a more unique role in the SWG universe?
Neif - Phaelyn, Squad Leader and Ranger are two key professions that we're singled out as needing change to become more compelling and useful professions. That said, we are looking at doing more profession revamps after these two. Expect some great changes to other professions in the future. "

Told you they werent done grapvine. image

"Brekkee - *Anon4881* At this years Fan Fest, a video was shown that strongly hinted at Player Capital Ships. When will more information on these ships be released?
Rogue_5 - The video was a technology test straight from a developer's desk that we decided to share with the Fan Fest attendees. It does not necessarily represent anything we are currently doing with the game. "

Well there went my reason for coming back. Thanks for telling the community early instead of letting them waste months on a pipe dream.....NOT!! SOE back at it again. Nice to see they are, if anything, consistent.

Well there is other stupid stuff in there also. Ranger will have Carb IV and Explore IV as the prereq. Wow real nice.

Kai

 

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Comments

  • ata23ata23 Member Posts: 94

    Hi Kai

    I have lots of disapointment of this game either. I wish to be jedi or Bh or sth else must be quest based.

    But the thing I dont understand about You is if you hate so much about this game why You work on it so much. If u dont like it at all just quit, dont waste your time in this forum.

    I really dont want to be offensive but think about it friend

    Take Care

    Engin

  • grapevinegrapevine Member UncommonPosts: 1,927

    Quite an interesting dev chat.

    Sounds like the next expantion has something major within it, by the statement on the yet to be disclosed game mechanics.  Hopefully people will also now carm down on it being a Jedi expantion, since they clearly state they are avoiding single profession content.

    Yes, Kia now there will be more revamps.  However up until they actually stated so, it was subjective.  Even now, we still don't know if what they end up coding will be a good or bad thing.  We don't even know what they will be doing, or to what degree.  Which is really where I'm coming from.  Reading between the lines is like rolling a dice, odd or even, wrong or right.

    You should try not focusing on what you perceive to be negative all the time.  Many things in that chat sound promising, but you totally ignored them in your post.

    That aside, the pre-req for ranger is a little odd as its biest towards carbines.  However, I can see the logic of a special-ops profession using what are mid range weapons.

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,236

    Here is my personal favorite from the chat :

    >>>>>

    17:40] <Brekkee> *Nerfed_Jedi* Since ROTW contained so much Ep3 content/loot, will we be expecting loot and items from Ep3 in this one also? For example, can I expect to find Anakin's legs and arm near the lava pool? Thanks!

    [17:42] <SpaceRancor> *Nerfed_jedi* There will be lot of different types of loot to be found on Mustafar. Everything from Relics of the Old Republic to items dating from the Clone Wars. But no limbs...

    >>>>>

     

    Have fun

    Erillion

  • kaibigan34kaibigan34 Member Posts: 1,508

    ata23

    I dont hate this game. That is the problem. The true reason I quit isnt because of just jedi. It was because everytime I logged in I could still see what could have been. I could still see the possibilities. The developers lost that. They lost the vision. This game should have been the top. It should have been the one to be getting news feeds announcing 3.5 million subscribers. It should have been the one that lead all other MMOs. It should have been the ruler. To coin a phrase. "One MMO to rule them all."

    But everyday I log in and see just how unStar Wars this game is. How messed up it was. And it upset me no end. However I still feel that the vision is still there. Just under the surface. Lying in the code, below the trees on Dathomir, behind the krayt graveyard, and in the Asteriod field Naboo.... To wax poetic its there. Hiding and waiting. Waiting for the developers stop worrying about the all mighty dollar and start making it Star Wars.

    I truly believe if they made jedi rare like they originally planned, fixed the GCW, fixed the profession, and added more content this game would get those news feeds announcing 3.5 million subscribers. But the developers need to stop following the flock.

    grapevine

    But I knew they werent done. There is no speculation. They have even said many times in chats and in forums that the CU will take around a year. Said after the release there will be several months of tweaking and many more of revamps. Plus a few months back they said after the combat professions is finalized, around first quarter 2006, they will be doing a huge massive crafter revamp to fix them and their schems to the CU. Lastly is the big GCW revamp to finish off the CU. We are looking at a full year of work. And its only been what? 3 months. So still along way to go there Skippy. I tried to tell you all this but you didnt listen. You were too busy trying to prove me wrong. I just decided to let you go with it. Because I knew this would happen. Oh by the way.....

    OWNED!!!!!!!

    And my post wasnt entirely negative since I did mention the revamps. In fact I put them first. A very good thing if you ask me. Or do you want to play The Musical Semantics Arguement on that too?

    Kai

     

  • grapevinegrapevine Member UncommonPosts: 1,927

    I can't comment on what the devs said between October 2004 and May 2005, as that was the period I had quit.  That being the majority of the CUs development period, which has now been live for 5-6 months (not 3).  I can only comment on what they have said since.

    I didn't even say there wasn't going to be no more revamps.  I said they havn't annoucned any, other than Squad Leader and Ranger, while you called me a liar while you depicted already (old) implement changes as things to come (e.g. Smuggler's becoming mezzers).  Just bacuase they have now stated they are going to revamp some more, doesn't mean my statements were wrong.  They were right, for that moment in time, from the information available.  In fact I even stated I'd not be surprised if Commando got one.  So not OWNED!!!!  If you want to check out an OWNED thread, may point you to the fuss you made over the next expantion's pricing.  Besides this isn't a competition, in who's right or wrong, trying to make it so is quite childish.

  • kaibigan34kaibigan34 Member Posts: 1,508



    Originally posted by grapevine

    I can't comment on what the devs said between October 2004 and May 2005, as that was the period I had quit.  That being the majority of the CUs development period, which has now been live for 5-6 months (not 3).  I can only comment on what they have said since.
    I didn't even say there wasn't going to be no more revamps.  I said they havn't annoucned any, other than Squad Leader and Ranger, while you called me a liar while you depicted already (old) implement changes as things to come (e.g. Smuggler's becoming mezzers).  Just bacuase they have now stated they are going to revamp some more, doesn't mean my statements were wrong.  They were right, for that moment in time, from the information available.  In fact I even stated I'd not be surprised if Commando got one.  So not OWNED!!!!  Besides this isn't a competition, in who's right or wrong, trying to make it so is quite childish.



    So because you didnt know they had said all that about the CU before hand that means your right and I am wrong? Ever see the movie Midnight Run with Robert De Niro? There is a scene where the guy is trying to argue that a lie De Niro told after his lie was worse because the De Niro didnt know he had lied to De Niro before. This sounds alot like that. "I didnt have all the information at the time so I was right in my mind." Nah you were still wrong you just wouldnt allow yourself to see it. That is basically what your trying to avoid.

    And if it wasnt a competition then why do you keep going on about it? I just said there were more plans for the revamp but you had to play Musical Semantic Arguement again about speculation to try to avoid saying "Ok you were right. Nevermind.".

    In the end all that matters is OWNED!!!! heh image

    Kai

  • grapevinegrapevine Member UncommonPosts: 1,927

    Kai, you were out and out lieing (or extremely misinformed) during that discussion.  You clearly told someone who was interested in SWG lies about furture changes that were infact already in the game and had been for sometime.  So yes, you were wrong.  100% wrong, because you didn't base anyting you said on the current state of the game or the cards currently being dealt by the devs.   What you baised your comments on were from old information said during CU development (which I can't verify) and anything you could think of to put the game down.  You know as well as I do that if you don't base what you say on what SoE are currently doing you become subjective, as they change their minds.   They also said Jedi would be rare and become glowies when they die.  That the CU would be occuring in Janurary 2004, sortly after the CH revamp and my more things.  Things change!!!

    Just because they make what is escentially a passing statesment about further revamps doesn't make you a guru.  You are also still missing the fact that I didn't say there wasn't going to be anymore revamps, so I'm not really sure where you are trying to get the ego trip from.  In the past you've made major fuss over the new expantion and with each statement SoE make on it you are proved more and more wrong about it, but yet you ignore that.

  • suupaabakasuupaabaka Member Posts: 17

    They didn't say the cap ships aren't coming. They said that what we saw in the video may not be representative of what may make it to live. In other words, they're still fiddling around with it and seeing how it may be implemented.

  • kaibigan34kaibigan34 Member Posts: 1,508



    Originally posted by grapevine
    Kai, you were out and out lieing (or extremely misinformed) during that discussion.  You clearly told someone who was interested in returning lies about furture changes that were infact already in the game and had been for sometime.  So yes, you were wrong.  100% wrong, because you didn't base anyting you said on the current state of the game or the cards currently being dealt by the devs.   What you baised your comments on were (which I can't verify) from old information said during CU development and anything you could think of to put the game down.  You know as well as I do that if you don't base what you say on what SoE are currently doing you become subjective, as they change their minds.  They also said Jedi would be rare and become glowies when they die.  That the CU would be occuring in Janurary 2004, sortly after the CH revamp and my more things.  Things change!!!


    Did I say they were not done with the CU? Yes I did.

    Was I correct? Yes

    So you can sit there and argue semantics all you want but I was right. PERIOD. I know its hard to accept but just try. You will find in life your not always right. Its a crushing blow, I know grape, but its something you will face someday.

    I didnt check smuggler out when I came back. Oh no dear god hang me. I used what information I had at the time.

    Oh and I remember someone in this thread trying to point out how they were right because they didnt have all the information at the time. Got one word for you. Starts with "HYPO". Think you can get the rest. I told you life was a chess game. You just tipped your king.

    And we arent talking about smuggler or are you so shaky now in your defense now you gotta try to bring up other things to dissuade the conversation? Sound like SOE and TH now. We are talking about the CU being unfinished and more professions being revamped.

    Lastly saying smuggler isnt finished with the revamp is like saying a car isnt getting fixed because you are just replacing the alternator and changing the tires. THEY ARE DELETING A WHOLE FREAKING LINE!!!! They gotta replace it with something. From what I can tell it will be the mission stuff. Opps looks to me like they are still in their revamp. "Sorry Mr. Richards but the car still needs a new fan belt and carberator but hey its completely fixed now." Excuse me? Sounds like an oxymoron there. They are already mezzers fine. But they are still getting fixed. And hence revamp is still hanging.

    Now can we please get off this or do you want to keep this going?

    Kai


     

  • kaibigan34kaibigan34 Member Posts: 1,508



    Originally posted by suupaabaka

    They didn't say the cap ships aren't coming. They said that what we saw in the video may not be representative of what may make it to live. In other words, they're still fiddling around with it and seeing how it may be implemented.



    "It does not necessarily represent anything we are currently doing with the game."

    You may be right but I am sorry that just screams "We arent doing player controlled Capital Ships"

    Kai

     


     

  • TookyGTookyG Warhammer Online CorrespondentMember UncommonPosts: 1,115



    Originally posted by kaibigan34
    "It does not necessarily represent anything we are currently doing with the game."
    You may be right but I am sorry that just screams "We arent doing player controlled Capital Ships"
    Kai




    If you take that quote literally that doesn't mean they're not doing them.  It means they may or may not be.  Myself I'm leaning towards them not being worked on currently but may make it in someday.

    Besides, back before this game was even in alpha there were screenshots with fighters zipping around star destroyers and AT-ATs stomping around.  Didn't seem to be a huge deal then.

    Until you cancel your subscription, you are only helping to continue the cycle of mediocrity.

  • grapevinegrapevine Member UncommonPosts: 1,927

    Kia, I'm not going to get back into that discussion as to what is a revamp and what is a change.

    The CU (as it stands) is however done and dusted, tweeks aside.  Think of it as a layer.  The CU is the underlieing changes.  Just because a profession (or some) receives another revamp, it doesn't make the CU incomplete.

    It wasn't just Smuggler you used, you've had the entire CU profession chart on display.  So based on you knowing very little about what is fundamental to the game post CU, I take any claims of you knowing what's going on as highly doubtful.

    Also the offical statement on Smuggler is they aren't getting a revamp, just with some attention.  Now if they make a new statement then fine, but you are basing what you say on what you perceive to be coming (not factual).  One line is not a revamp and do you honetly think they will replace it with something new.  No, it will probably be filled by tweeking some other boxes.  However even then, that's not a profession revamp as the smuggler is the same as before (exlucing spice) just with the contents of a few boxes shifted around. 

  • ata23ata23 Member Posts: 94

    Hi Kai

    I am very happy thank  u make ur self clear...

    I have the same feelings about the current game with u . I always know what to do nothing new. Better weapons , better armour, more npc but always the same thing. I read the manual of Dark age of camelot. As I understand RvR system much more effective then PvP.

    Theres some PvP and guild war at SWG but its not enough besides empire and rebels are not fighting each other. lol.

    I am a rebel Bh I hunt down rebel Jedi holy crap.

    The sprit is missing its true but we can do nothing to change it, people make the last group xp nerf get back, but this situation is all about the policies of SOE.

    If u like the game play if U dont dont play thats the way of SOE.(and most of the other companies)

    I met a guy who says he is nearly get his second Jedi. He is a grinder he likes it no right to judge him.

    I ll quit the gamei I play it for fun only and it has no fun for me in it anymore.

    I ll try DAoC. Its promising. Lets look.

    Take care

    Engin ata23  

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,236



    Originally posted by TookyG

    Besides, back before this game was even in alpha there were screenshots with fighters zipping around star destroyers
    --> Well, thats what we do in Deep Space. Its in the game.
    and AT-ATs stomping around. 
    --> We had those for a while in our large scale planetary PvP battles on Naritus (the event team placed them for us). But the movement animation was unsatisfactory for the devs and they were vulnerable to knockdowns (which was REALLY a nasty bug when the TKMs were KDing the AT ATs :-) So they stopped using them and only deployed a "deco" style non moving non fighting version of it for later events. I think at the moment the event team does not place any of them.
    --> Have fun, Erillion



  • kaibigan34kaibigan34 Member Posts: 1,508



    Originally posted by ata23

    Hi Kai
    I am very happy thank  u make ur self clear...
    I have the same feelings about the current game with u . I always know what to do nothing new. Better weapons , better armour, more npc but always the same thing. I read the manual of Dark age of camelot. As I understand RvR system much more effective then PvP.
    Theres some PvP and guild war at SWG but its not enough besides empire and rebels are not fighting each other. lol.
    I am a rebel Bh I hunt down rebel Jedi holy crap.
    The sprit is missing its true but we can do nothing to change it, people make the last group xp nerf get back, but this situation is all about the policies of SOE.
    If u like the game play if U dont dont play thats the way of SOE.(and most of the other companies)
    I met a guy who says he is nearly get his second Jedi. He is a grinder he likes it no right to judge him.
    I ll quit the gamei I play it for fun only and it has no fun for me in it anymore.
    I ll try DAoC. Its promising. Lets look.
    Take care
    Engin ata23  



    To think there is nothing we can do to change it is wrong. In fact there is. Gamers have alot of power. The Wookie Revolts showed me that. In fact if people would get together on the same page and do something big to show they will no longer be ignored, you will start seeing a major turn around in regards to making this game more Star Wars.

    Ata23, I gauruntee you, if 50k players walked out tomorrow all at the sametime, after SOE finished wiping themselves, they would get a compromise on jedi. Heck if the quitters asked they might even get Mustafar changed to Bespin or Ord Mandell or whatever.

    But SOE is setting themselves up also. They are dooming themselves. They have outlawed protests in game and on the forums. Any attempt will get you banned. They made the forums into SOEstapo HQ. Even a true constructive critique can get you banned if Garva is having a bad day again. And when SOE does this they are insuring only one outcome......

    "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." JFK

    And I think that is what is about to happen. The last few months I played I could feel something big about to happen. And still I can feel it growing on the forums. The community is getting very frustrated about some areas of the game. If SOE doesnt straighten up soon I think they will be in for a big surprise. Not saying its going to happen for sure or what will happen. Just that I can feel alot of tension on the boards and in game when I played and its growing.

    Like you said right now the GCW is gone. Its jedi versus non-jedi for the most part. People ganking each other because one thinks being a jedi makes him god or another is sick of jedi. And that is not what you do to base a PVP system on. That is just wrong on so many levels. I dont mean the attacking jedi from a game point of view. But doing it because you personally are of sick of em or think you should be worshipped.

    Kai

  • grapevinegrapevine Member UncommonPosts: 1,927

    I agree, players can do a lot if they put their minds to it and it has happened a few times in SWG.  Even recently with the brief XP nerf.

    SoE are heavy handed when it comes to such things, which usually only seems to make the situation worse.

    Actually on Jedi, which I agree are out of hand.  I know it wasn't intended, but don't you think RP wise that how people feel about Jedi in this game is exactly what the Empire's lies would depict them as.  Well aside from their numbers and visibilty.

  • kaibigan34kaibigan34 Member Posts: 1,508



    Originally posted by grapevine

    I agree, players can do a lot if they put their minds to it and it has happened a few times in SWG.  Even recently with the brief XP nerf.
    Its just sad how quick players forget about those incidents though isnt it? Two days after the big XP nerf problem, I had someone tell me there is nothing we can do to make SOE change.
    SoE are heavy handed when it comes to such things, which usually only seems to make the situation worse.
    Yes I agree. They ignore a problem continously and when the players get fed up and do something drastic, SOE corrects the problem but also shoves a boot in the communities' face for their troubles.
    Actually on Jedi, which I agree are out of hand.  I know it wasn't intended, but don't you think RP wise that how people feel about Jedi in this game is exactly what the Empire's lies would depict them as.  Well aside from their numbers and visibilty.
    Hmm never thought about it like that but your right. Everyday more and more people, even jedi, are becoming more jedi'd out so to speak.



    While I will be the first to say jedi should be in this game, its just to bg and encompassing not to have them, I will say there are way too many of them.

    I remember the astromech stats Tiggs posted about the professions and which ones are played more and I laughed at it. SOE put the 3 jedi trees in the middle. Like saying there arent that many. But supposedly politicians outnumber jedi. That is laughable to say the least. Oh and they made sure to seperate the 3 trees. At least their marketing department has learned a lesson on propoganda eh?

    Kai

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,236



    Originally posted by kaibigan34


     But supposedly politicians outnumber jedi.
    --> Politician does not cost any skill points. Everyone and his mother has Novice Politician and votes for themselves in order to slowly get Poli XP in their player city of choice. Of COURSE there are more politicians than Jedi :-)
    That is laughable to say the least. Oh and they made sure to seperate the 3 trees. At least their marketing department has learned a lesson on propoganda eh?
    --> Sure has. And I am seeing more of that learning recently. Many more interviews, massaging of MMORPG related webmasters with presents. They(SOE)  dont necessarily tell much news, but at least they DO talk more to the media, which the media likes.  
    --> Have fun, Erillion

    Kai




  • kaibigan34kaibigan34 Member Posts: 1,508

    Too bad most of the talk to the media is lies. Like the interview done for this site. SOE basically lied its rump off.

    I have also noticed another new trend. Something very interesting to say the least. They have began to put a spin on edi. There is small hinting in some developer comments. They are basically starting to say the huge number of jedi was a mistake and not intended. Its not a full blown reversal yet but they are putting little comments here and there.

    Add up the 3 jedi trees and I bet jedi outnumber any profession in this game. Which shows me alot.

    Kai

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,236



    Originally posted by kaibigan34


    Add up the 3 jedi trees and I bet jedi outnumber any profession in this game.



    I very much doubt that. After the respec (no need to do the long investigation grind) the number of Bounty Hunters will be MUCH higher than anything else. Not the least because usually every Jedi has a Bountyhunter alt (to check if (s)he is on the terminals). Not the least because the best loot at the moment is to be gained from BH marks. Not the least because BH plus something else is the strongest "normal" fighter profession in the game. Not the least because many people dont want to do the endless Jedi grind and settle for BH as the natural Jedi killer instead.

    Have fun

    Erillion

  • kaibigan34kaibigan34 Member Posts: 1,508



    Originally posted by Erillion



    Originally posted by kaibigan34


    Add up the 3 jedi trees and I bet jedi outnumber any profession in this game.



    I very much doubt that. After the respec (no need to do the long investigation grind) the number of Bounty Hunters will be MUCH higher than anything else. Not the least because usually every Jedi has a Bountyhunter alt (to check if (s)he is on the terminals). Not the least because the best loot at the moment is to be gained from BH marks. Not the least because BH plus something else is the strongest "normal" fighter profession in the game. Not the least because many people dont want to do the endless Jedi grind and settle for BH as the natural Jedi killer instead.

    Have fun

    Erillion


    I dont mean jedi outnumber every profession together. I mean I think they outnumber any one profession.

    Kai

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,236



    Originally posted by kaibigan34

    I dont mean jedi outnumber every profession together. I mean I think they outnumber any one profession.
    Kai



    I know. And I think you are wrong.

    Almost every Jedi has an alternative BH toon to check if he is on the forum. So number of BH (part1)  almost equal to number of Jedi. Now add all the non Jedi bounty hunters  (= number of BH part2) ... of which there are MANY - especially those who dont like Jedi and/or the Jedi grind.

    Number of BH ( part 1 ) + ( part 2 ) is significantly greater than the number of Jedi IMHO.

    Have fun

    Erillion

     

    PS: in that context .. question of definition .. do we call someone a jedi that just made his force sensitive quests to get a free second toon and technically became a Padawan (aka Jedi), but immediately stopped his Jedi grind there and never wants to become a Jedi ? I think most people will aim for their free second toon, but dont see themselves as Jedi although technically they COULD wield a lightsaber.

  • kaibigan34kaibigan34 Member Posts: 1,508

    I doubt most jedi alts are BH. Because most jedi have BH friends. The biggest jedi guild and player city on my main server had at least 50 jedi. And they also had BHs in the guild not alt BH. They would go with the BH to hunt Dark Jedi. One reason dark jedi were few and far between there.

    And in my old guild there were 7 jedi and their alts were all crafters. They had the three BH in the guild check terminals for them.

    I am willing to bet the alts have a more spread out range. Maybe the loner jedi have BH alts. But most jedi I have seen are in guilds. So they usually have no need to waste an alt just to check a terminal.

    Kai

  • grapevinegrapevine Member UncommonPosts: 1,927

    It would be interesting to see where Jedi numbers really do fit, if all three had been combinded.   Although I can see why they have done it that way.  If you look at a character they aren't just one profession, when leveled.  At the very least they will be two, with a max of three masters.   So classing a full template Jedi under one banner, would be biased and inaccurate.  For example, not all Riflemen are the same because of the other professions they choose.  Just like all Jedi aren't the same, as there are different Jedi (only) professions.  There are also hybrids, Jedi and standard professions mixed.

    I do however don't believe you will see them at the top.  Simply because of two facts.  Firsty the player gains a second character slot.  So assuming the norm is to use that alt to create a common template, it escentially negatates alongside the Jedi.  The other being the hybrids, whether that be by choice or simply because the Jedi is still being leveled.  Just a wild guess, but I'd put them (as a group) in the top 1/3, but below common professions.

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,236



    Originally posted by kaibigan34

    I doubt most jedi alts are BH. Because most jedi have BH friends. The biggest jedi guild and player city on my main server had at least 50 jedi. And they also had BHs in the guild not alt BH.



    Kai .. your experience is from before or after Combat Revamp ? Since the CU and the respec period and the BH loot revamp we have MANY  MANY  (did I already say MANY  ?) more BH than before.

    Have fun

    Erillion

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