Unless this was the first time someones followed the development of a video game, I don't see how they saw "Oh, 2019, seems perfectly reasonable to me!" -Snip- Also, calling someone an inept/incompetent person because they make a mistake here or there is extreme since that's generally used for people who show an absurd/far beyond normal degree of inability.
See... this is what I find absurd.
Read the first part. Then the second. How can you NOT apply the first part to Stephen as well? He not only thought they were reasonable, but he also had the best information to make that statement.
Its totally absurd for you to say the fans should have known better and then blow off Stephen's part as "a mistake here or there".
At least be consistent.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Looking good, ofc the jaded old farts still need to throw shade at everything because they still have trouble accepting that the only constant of game development is change and they're unable to adjust their expectations based on knowledge so they hold on to "promises" as gospel to cry "but he said" over and over.
They love eating cake they can't stand waiting for it to bake or learn and apreciate anything about how it's made.
Hey, I am having my cake and eating it, thank you!
Looking good, ofc the jaded old farts still need to throw shade at everything because they still have trouble accepting that the only constant of game development is change and they're unable to adjust their expectations based on knowledge so they hold on to "promises" as gospel to cry "but he said" over and over.
They love eating cake they can't stand waiting for it to bake or learn and apreciate anything about how it's made.
Hey, I am having my cake and eating it, thank you!
Jaded old farts are used to having the baker honestly and accurately predict when he can deliver the wedding cake.
Doesn't do much good if it arrives 3 years later no matter how amazing it tastes.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Unless this was the first time someones followed the development of a video game, I don't see how they saw "Oh, 2019, seems perfectly reasonable to me!" -Snip- Also, calling someone an inept/incompetent person because they make a mistake here or there is extreme since that's generally used for people who show an absurd/far beyond normal degree of inability.
See... this is what I find absurd.
Read the first part. Then the second. How can you NOT apply the first part to Stephen as well? He not only thought they were reasonable, but he also had the best information to make that statement.
Its totally absurd for you to say the fans should have known better and then blow off Stephen's part as "a mistake here or there".
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Looking good, ofc the jaded old farts still need to throw shade at everything because they still have trouble accepting that the only constant of game development is change and they're unable to adjust their expectations based on knowledge so they hold on to "promises" as gospel to cry "but he said" over and over.
They love eating cake they can't stand waiting for it to bake or learn and apreciate anything about how it's made.
Here is one tiny detail you love to miss. I get that we should not hold on to promises devs make, things change constantly and although they are the ones making these predictions and promises for whatever reasons (never funding related of course) the chance of them being wrong is huge. If they are wrong that is totally cool and not a big deal.
But, sometimes they are right and things do get delivered on time as promised. And when that happens the likes of various fanboys can’t wait to throw that in everybody’s faces as proof of quality and progress, repeatedly. Being wrong is no big deal, ever, everything changes constantly. But being right? Ohh man, screw you haters and suck it. In all this constant change, isn’t being right just as coincidental as being wrong? No big deal right? Prove of absolutely nothing right?
/Cheers, Lahnmir
'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
Looking good, ofc the jaded old farts still need to throw shade at everything because they still have trouble accepting that the only constant of game development is change and they're unable to adjust their expectations based on knowledge so they hold on to "promises" as gospel to cry "but he said" over and over.
They love eating cake they can't stand waiting for it to bake or learn and apreciate anything about how it's made.
Pretty much...You'd think they'd be used to it by now and would have a more thorough understanding of how game development actually works at this point. Sure, Steven made a bad estimation, but seriously believing a game that existed in nothing other than a 1 zone prototype with a 5-man team (at the time) would be completed in under 1 year is foolish. Unless this was the first time someones followed the development of a video game, I don't see how they saw "Oh, 2019, seems perfectly reasonable to me!"
Also, calling someone an inept/incompetent person because they make a mistake here or there is extreme since that's generally used for people who show an absurd/far beyond normal degree of inability. Sure, be annoyed at him for making that estimation but also if you didn't request a refund, get over it, and if you did then why are you still mad?
Jaded gamers, many of them are oltimers (in gaming) so might have a harder time to accept the new ways of doing mmorpgs.
They're still used to take anything a developer or studio says as gospel because that's how they grew up with, with kickstart they've got a earlier look into game development and studios and developers sharing the process more than ever but they still haven't been able to transition their old school line of thought into the simple reality of what game development entails.
They have trouble understanding that estimates made at a certain time are made with the information dev's have at that precise moment, which is incomplete so based on a lot of best guesses and wishes and prone to be missed. In fact dev's know they will be missed as anything more than one year away is very hard to predict acurately.
Which is why traditionally games are only announced in the later stages of development and definitive gameplay aspects and features can remain secret until launch.
With kickstart we get inside look and tag along the process (feedback / hype / funding). Some can adapt to it other's don't. In the end, all that matters is that games that otherwise wouldn't be attempted are being developed.
They might fail, they might succeed but developers and gamers are uniting efforts into bringing something they feel passionate about enough to spend money and time upfront with the common goal of making their "dream" game, or something closer to that than what the traditional market and old established producers have managed to bring.
Looking good, ofc the jaded old farts still need to throw shade at everything because they still have trouble accepting that the only constant of game development is change and they're unable to adjust their expectations based on knowledge so they hold on to "promises" as gospel to cry "but he said" over and over.
They love eating cake they can't stand waiting for it to bake or learn and apreciate anything about how it's made.
Pretty much...You'd think they'd be used to it by now and would have a more thorough understanding of how game development actually works at this point. Sure, Steven made a bad estimation, but seriously believing a game that existed in nothing other than a 1 zone prototype with a 5-man team (at the time) would be completed in under 1 year is foolish. Unless this was the first time someones followed the development of a video game, I don't see how they saw "Oh, 2019, seems perfectly reasonable to me!"
Also, calling someone an inept/incompetent person because they make a mistake here or there is extreme since that's generally used for people who show an absurd/far beyond normal degree of inability. Sure, be annoyed at him for making that estimation but also if you didn't request a refund, get over it, and if you did then why are you still mad?
Jaded gamers, many of them are oltimers (in gaming) so might have a harder time to accept the new ways of doing mmorpgs.
They're still used to take anything a developer or studio says as gospel because that's how they grew up with, with kickstart they've got a earlier look into game development and studios and developers sharing the process more than ever but they still haven't been able to transition their old school line of thought into the simple reality of what game development entails.
They have trouble understanding that estimates made at a certain time are made with the information dev's have at that precise moment, which is incomplete so based on a lot of best guesses and wishes and prone to be missed. In fact dev's know they will be missed as anything more than one year away is very hard to predict acurately.
Which is why traditionally games are only announced in the later stages of development and definitive gameplay aspects and features can remain secret until launch.
With kickstart we get inside look and tag along the process (feedback / hype / funding). Some can adapt to it other's don't. In the end, all that matters is that games that otherwise wouldn't be attempted are being developed.
They might fail, they might succeed but developers and gamers are uniting efforts into bringing something they feel passionate about enough to spend money and time upfront with the common goal of making their "dream" game, or something closer to that than what the traditional market and old established producers have managed to bring.
Okay, taking your argument at face value, sure, back in 2012 predicting the future was full of uncertainty and unknowns.
But it's 10 years later and they can't provide a target release date for either game?
When do you think they will be able to predict with any degree of certainty, in the first half of this decade or the second?
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Looking good, ofc the jaded old farts still need to throw shade at everything because they still have trouble accepting that the only constant of game development is change and they're unable to adjust their expectations based on knowledge so they hold on to "promises" as gospel to cry "but he said" over and over.
They love eating cake they can't stand waiting for it to bake or learn and apreciate anything about how it's made.
Pretty much...You'd think they'd be used to it by now and would have a more thorough understanding of how game development actually works at this point. Sure, Steven made a bad estimation, but seriously believing a game that existed in nothing other than a 1 zone prototype with a 5-man team (at the time) would be completed in under 1 year is foolish. Unless this was the first time someones followed the development of a video game, I don't see how they saw "Oh, 2019, seems perfectly reasonable to me!"
Also, calling someone an inept/incompetent person because they make a mistake here or there is extreme since that's generally used for people who show an absurd/far beyond normal degree of inability. Sure, be annoyed at him for making that estimation but also if you didn't request a refund, get over it, and if you did then why are you still mad?
Jaded gamers, many of them are oltimers (in gaming) so might have a harder time to accept the new ways of doing mmorpgs.
They're still used to take anything a developer or studio says as gospel because that's how they grew up with, with kickstart they've got a earlier look into game development and studios and developers sharing the process more than ever but they still haven't been able to transition their old school line of thought into the simple reality of what game development entails.
They have trouble understanding that estimates made at a certain time are made with the information dev's have at that precise moment, which is incomplete so based on a lot of best guesses and wishes and prone to be missed. In fact dev's know they will be missed as anything more than one year away is very hard to predict acurately.
Which is why traditionally games are only announced in the later stages of development and definitive gameplay aspects and features can remain secret until launch.
With kickstart we get inside look and tag along the process (feedback / hype / funding). Some can adapt to it other's don't. In the end, all that matters is that games that otherwise wouldn't be attempted are being developed.
They might fail, they might succeed but developers and gamers are uniting efforts into bringing something they feel passionate about enough to spend money and time upfront with the common goal of making their "dream" game, or something closer to that than what the traditional market and old established producers have managed to bring.
TLDR: "Everything I know about game development I learned from Father Chris."
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Anyone else a bit concerned about the audio for this? Usually with teasers and trailers its really high quality but everything sort of fell flat with this, it failed to tell the mystery or threat perceived visually. When the big GW2 Devourer-esque monster comes out it sounds like it has two legs thumping instead of multiple.
Where the developer goes on a long Twitter posting about the issues of developing MMO's, announcing early, estimates, uncertainty, changes during development and so on.
It's not so much about dates but about accomplishing the needed technological feets that enable the making of a special game.
Riot doesn't just want to "release a mmo" they want it to be as good as it can be. Just like Rockstar doesn't want to "just release" their next GTA, they want it to be as good or better than the last one. They have the money to back the funding of those games so that's why they can take their time developing them for many years and there's no release date yet despite them being established and experienced companies with multiple successfully released games they aren't yet ready to share anything about their games development much less give any estimate of delivery.
Crowdfunded games seem to take longer because they communicate their intents even before the development began, even before having studios or even knowing if it will be viable. It's all filled with fog of war so estimates are bound to miss their mark as it's mostly based on best wishes and lot of guess work. Only as things start falling into place can the estimatives become more accurate. This is true for every studio when they go for big, ambitious games, which is why most of them keep their work and intentions very secret until the game is practically done.
Where the developer goes on a long Twitter posting about the issues of developing MMO's, announcing early, estimates, uncertainty, changes during development and so on.
It's not so much about dates but about accomplishing the needed technological feets that enable the making of a special game.
Riot doesn't just want to "release a mmo" they want it to be as good as it can be. Just like Rockstar doesn't want to "just release" their next GTA, they want it to be as good or better than the last one. They have the money to back the funding of those games so that's why they can take their time developing them for many years and there's no release date yet despite them being established and experienced companies with multiple successfully released games they aren't yet ready to share anything about their games development much less give any estimate of delivery.
Crowdfunded games seem to take longer because they communicate their intents even before the development began, even before having studios or even knowing if it will be viable. It's all filled with fog of war so estimates are bound to miss their mark as it's mostly based on best wishes and lot of guess work. Only as things start falling into place can the estimatives become more accurate. This is true for every studio when they go for big, ambitious games, which is why most of them keep their work and intentions very secret until the game is practically done.
Well, until they decide to cancel development, at least seems to be true for Activision/Blizzard lately.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Where the developer goes on a long Twitter posting about the issues of developing MMO's, announcing early, estimates, uncertainty, changes during development and so on.
It's not so much about dates but about accomplishing the needed technological feets that enable the making of a special game.
Riot doesn't just want to "release a mmo" they want it to be as good as it can be. Just like Rockstar doesn't want to "just release" their next GTA, they want it to be as good or better than the last one. They have the money to back the funding of those games so that's why they can take their time developing them for many years and there's no release date yet despite them being established and experienced companies with multiple successfully released games they aren't yet ready to share anything about their games development much less give any estimate of delivery.
Crowdfunded games seem to take longer because they communicate their intents even before the development began, even before having studios or even knowing if it will be viable. It's all filled with fog of war so estimates are bound to miss their mark as it's mostly based on best wishes and lot of guess work. Only as things start falling into place can the estimatives become more accurate. This is true for every studio when they go for big, ambitious games, which is why most of them keep their work and intentions very secret until the game is practically done.
The difference of course is that RIOT has not charged customers a penny with a No Refund policy. They are using their own money so they just answer to themselves. If RIOT had opened "pre-orders" based on a release in 2022, and 2030 came around and they hadn't released... they would be crucified. And rightly so. Especially if they won't give the money back.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
It's up to the consumer to do their homework about crowdfunding & game development if they want to partake in such ventures they should be aware of the risks.
If they aren't confortable with uncertainty just stick with "finished" and "released" games.
It's up to the consumer to do their homework about crowdfunding & game development if they want to partake in such ventures they should be aware of the risks.
If they aren't confortable with uncertainty just stick with "finished" and "released" games.
Also CIG has a 30 day refund period.
If you want to toss out RIOT as a comp then you cant be cherry-picking what parts get compared. It was a silly comparison to make. For the reasons I described.
PS: 30 Day refund when a project is around a decade late... wow that's fantastic.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Comments
Read the first part. Then the second. How can you NOT apply the first part to Stephen as well? He not only thought they were reasonable, but he also had the best information to make that statement.
Its totally absurd for you to say the fans should have known better and then blow off Stephen's part as "a mistake here or there".
At least be consistent.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Doesn't do much good if it arrives 3 years later no matter how amazing it tastes.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
/Cheers,
Lahnmir
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
Nope, in 2018..
They are too busy milking mmorpg community with useless videos and newsletters.
But it's 10 years later and they can't provide a target release date for either game?
When do you think they will be able to predict with any degree of certainty, in the first half of this decade or the second?
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
However, Im not a big fan of isometric view.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
If they aren't confortable with uncertainty just stick with "finished" and "released" games.
Also CIG has a 30 day refund period.
PS: 30 Day refund when a project is around a decade late... wow that's fantastic.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018