WorldBreaker Stress Test

Slapshot1188

Reminder.. the WorldBreaker Stress Test is today.

Going to pop in and give it a look.

Slapshot1188

Played it with a friend.  It is what it's portrayed as.  It's got an old-school feel.  Combat is definitely a throwback.  Has a map but (so far at least) you do not appear on it.  It opens as you travel but no marker to show you, or group mates.

Can see it being fun with a bunch of friends.  Definitely had a decent time and hope to get some more time in tonight or tomorrow.

That said, this is NOT a game that will be super popular.  Many folks will dislike it's slow paced combat, it's throwback mechanics like darkness, map, etc...  I think some will greatly enjoy it.

It played better than I thought.   But I only made it to level 3 (did I mention leveling is slow?) so only a very small slice of the game was seen.

Cautiously optimistic.

Theocritus

Throw in a mandatory sub on top and that will turn even more away....

Kyleran

Slapshot1188 said:

Played it with a friend.  It is what it's portrayed as.  It's got an old-school feel.  Combat is definitely a throwback.  Has a map but (so far at least) you do not appear on it.  It opens as you travel but no marker to show you, or group mates.

Can see it being fun with a bunch of friends.  Definitely had a decent time and hope to get some more time in tonight or tomorrow.

That said, this is NOT a game that will be super popular.  Many folks will dislike it's slow paced combat, it's throwback mechanics like darkness, map, etc...  I think some will greatly enjoy it.

It played better than I thought.   But I only made it to level 3 (did I mention leveling is slow?) so only a very small slice of the game was seen.

Cautiously optimistic.

From what you've described it's already exceeded many people's expectations who gave it next to no chance of even getting this far.

I'm not a fan due to some of those throwback mechanics you mentioned but for those who don't mind they definitely should be rooting for this game to one day launch.

Theocritus

Watched a gameplay video on it...I dont know....It looks like it has a nice world, but the animations and combat are 1999 bad......I just don't know if this kind of game is going to fly nowadays...It also sounds like you HAVE to have a group and the ywant to charge a sub on top of that? I just dont know if they can get a decent amount of people to make a game like this fly.

Brainy

No this game will definitely not fly in todays market.  Grouping is difficult in this game due to travel times.  Travel is extremely slow, where it can take 1 hour to meet with a group at high level due to run speed and distance of zones.  So you will be spending a lot of time just running around.  No summons, no recall, no portals, no teleports, no mounts, no speed at all except 1 class has a very minor speed buff.

Keeping a 6man group going is practically impossible, if someone needs to leave, then finding a replacement will take 1 hour for them to arrive, by then someone else has to leave, its a constant problem.  Add to that aggro mobs all over the zone, that will chase/kill you until you zone which adds more time.  No compass or map so new people cant find you, more wasted time.

Another problem is loot tables in this game are horrible.  Some games just drop loot all the time in the extreme, but this game loot is extremely rare, and it feels extremely poor.  Loot makes you feel like a commoner, no cool stats or anything, very very boring.

Skills in this game seem pretty weak, your best skills are your starter skills pretty much with a couple of exceptions on a couple of classes regarding CC.

No magic, big turnoff for me.

This game adds tedium for the sake of it.  They say they reviewed the game to respect the players time, yeah that didn't happen at all.  Time wasters on purpose all over the place.  Example they put your shared bank in the middle of nowhere by a gate, just to make your run back and forth from town.  Lack of inventory and lack of merchants to sell your stuff if you are 30 min away from town, expect to run back and forth just to sell.

So many problems, in this game I could go on and on, core is there but missing so much its lackluster.  Maybe in a year things will change who knows.

TLDR this game will not appeal to 99% of mmo'ers out there.  Add a sub to that and forget about it.

Slapshot1188

@Brainy

I could be mistaken but I thought the magic stuff was going to be tied to the Embers concept somehow.  

I think they at minimum need a compass.  Maybe have every player start with one in their inventory or something.  Even if you have to stop to use it.  Something…

And dark is DARK in some places.  Without a compass it’s tough to get around especially as a newbie.  I can see people logging in for the first time,  seeing darkness and quitting 30 minutes later in frustration.

But I think those are things that can be tweaked in the months to come before release.

The general feel from my group was one of cautious optimism.  There were definitely roots here that could take hold. 

It definitely is a work in progress and definitely needs some tweaks… but it was much more playable than I expected given the team size and budget. I would say it
most reminded me of Project:Gorgon
 

Theocritus

Brainy said:

No this game will definitely not fly in todays market.  Grouping is difficult in this game due to travel times.  Travel is extremely slow, where it can take 1 hour to meet with a group at high level due to run speed and distance of zones.  So you will be spending a lot of time just running around.  No summons, no recall, no portals, no teleports, no mounts, no speed at all except 1 class has a very minor speed buff.

Keeping a 6man group going is practically impossible, if someone needs to leave, then finding a replacement will take 1 hour for them to arrive, by then someone else has to leave, its a constant problem.  Add to that aggro mobs all over the zone, that will chase/kill you until you zone which adds more time.  No compass or map so new people cant find you, more wasted time.

Another problem is loot tables in this game are horrible.  Some games just drop loot all the time in the extreme, but this game loot is extremely rare, and it feels extremely poor.  Loot makes you feel like a commoner, no cool stats or anything, very very boring.

Skills in this game seem pretty weak, your best skills are your starter skills pretty much with a couple of exceptions on a couple of classes regarding CC.

No magic, big turnoff for me.

This game adds tedium for the sake of it.  They say they reviewed the game to respect the players time, yeah that didn't happen at all.  Time wasters on purpose all over the place.  Example they put your shared bank in the middle of nowhere by a gate, just to make your run back and forth from town.  Lack of inventory and lack of merchants to sell your stuff if you are 30 min away from town, expect to run back and forth just to sell.

So many problems, in this game I could go on and on, core is there but missing so much its lackluster.  Maybe in a year things will change who knows.

TLDR this game will not appeal to 99% of mmo'ers out there.  Add a sub to that and forget about it.

This game sounds so much what Everquest was like early in its career.....and while it is still chugging along with 28 or so expansions, trying to do it all over again will be a great challenge....Personally, I dont know if I can play this way ever again...especially not on a sub....We had the same isseus in old EQ where it took a long time to get a group going and maintain it...do people even have that kind of time in 2022? I dont think so...Too many other things to do now and too many other gaming options.

Slapshot1188

Theocritus said:

Brainy said:

No this game will definitely not fly in todays market.  Grouping is difficult in this game due to travel times.  Travel is extremely slow, where it can take 1 hour to meet with a group at high level due to run speed and distance of zones.  So you will be spending a lot of time just running around.  No summons, no recall, no portals, no teleports, no mounts, no speed at all except 1 class has a very minor speed buff.

Keeping a 6man group going is practically impossible, if someone needs to leave, then finding a replacement will take 1 hour for them to arrive, by then someone else has to leave, its a constant problem.  Add to that aggro mobs all over the zone, that will chase/kill you until you zone which adds more time.  No compass or map so new people cant find you, more wasted time.

Another problem is loot tables in this game are horrible.  Some games just drop loot all the time in the extreme, but this game loot is extremely rare, and it feels extremely poor.  Loot makes you feel like a commoner, no cool stats or anything, very very boring.

Skills in this game seem pretty weak, your best skills are your starter skills pretty much with a couple of exceptions on a couple of classes regarding CC.

No magic, big turnoff for me.

This game adds tedium for the sake of it.  They say they reviewed the game to respect the players time, yeah that didn't happen at all.  Time wasters on purpose all over the place.  Example they put your shared bank in the middle of nowhere by a gate, just to make your run back and forth from town.  Lack of inventory and lack of merchants to sell your stuff if you are 30 min away from town, expect to run back and forth just to sell.

So many problems, in this game I could go on and on, core is there but missing so much its lackluster.  Maybe in a year things will change who knows.

TLDR this game will not appeal to 99% of mmo'ers out there.  Add a sub to that and forget about it.

This game sounds so much what Everquest was like early in its career.....and while it is still chugging along with 28 or so expansions, trying to do it all over again will be a great challenge....Personally, I dont know if I can play this way ever again...especially not on a sub....We had the same isseus in old EQ where it took a long time to get a group going and maintain it...do people even have that kind of time in 2022? I dont think so...Too many other things to do now and too many other gaming options.

The sub for me is a non-issue.  But yes, I understand that many people will not look at it due to that.

That said, they do not need to even approach EQ numbers.  I believe they have a staff of around a dozen.  I think Tim once tossed out a number of subs they would need to be profitable.  I honestly do not recall the number but I know it wasn't very much.  10k? 15k?   Something like that.

Far more challenging IMHO is the gameplay.  Will people want to play a game that is a throwback with things that @Brainy described?  I do not know.   I know that I had fun over the weekend as did the folks I game with.   We are certainly not the majority.   the question is whether a large enough sliver of people would find it fun an/or can they make some tweaks to the game that do not change the fundamentals but do make the small QOL adjustments that might widen the audience just enough?

I don't know.  We shall see.

I think they need to be a bit more aggressive in their PR as we get closer.  Have more open test days.  Listen to feedback.  Act on the right requests while ignoring the others.  I think they will do something like that, but time will tell.
  

Sovrath

Slapshot1188 said:

Theocritus said:

Brainy said:

No this game will definitely not fly in todays market.  Grouping is difficult in this game due to travel times.  Travel is extremely slow, where it can take 1 hour to meet with a group at high level due to run speed and distance of zones.  So you will be spending a lot of time just running around.  No summons, no recall, no portals, no teleports, no mounts, no speed at all except 1 class has a very minor speed buff.

Keeping a 6man group going is practically impossible, if someone needs to leave, then finding a replacement will take 1 hour for them to arrive, by then someone else has to leave, its a constant problem.  Add to that aggro mobs all over the zone, that will chase/kill you until you zone which adds more time.  No compass or map so new people cant find you, more wasted time.

Another problem is loot tables in this game are horrible.  Some games just drop loot all the time in the extreme, but this game loot is extremely rare, and it feels extremely poor.  Loot makes you feel like a commoner, no cool stats or anything, very very boring.

Skills in this game seem pretty weak, your best skills are your starter skills pretty much with a couple of exceptions on a couple of classes regarding CC.

No magic, big turnoff for me.

This game adds tedium for the sake of it.  They say they reviewed the game to respect the players time, yeah that didn't happen at all.  Time wasters on purpose all over the place.  Example they put your shared bank in the middle of nowhere by a gate, just to make your run back and forth from town.  Lack of inventory and lack of merchants to sell your stuff if you are 30 min away from town, expect to run back and forth just to sell.

So many problems, in this game I could go on and on, core is there but missing so much its lackluster.  Maybe in a year things will change who knows.

TLDR this game will not appeal to 99% of mmo'ers out there.  Add a sub to that and forget about it.

This game sounds so much what Everquest was like early in its career.....and while it is still chugging along with 28 or so expansions, trying to do it all over again will be a great challenge....Personally, I dont know if I can play this way ever again...especially not on a sub....We had the same isseus in old EQ where it took a long time to get a group going and maintain it...do people even have that kind of time in 2022? I dont think so...Too many other things to do now and too many other gaming options.

The sub for me is a non-issue.  But yes, I understand that many people will not look at it due to that.

That said, they do not need to even approach EQ numbers.  I believe they have a staff of around a dozen.  I think Tim once tossed out a number of subs they would need to be profitable.  I honestly do not recall the number but I know it wasn't very much.  10k? 15k?   Something like that.

Far more challenging IMHO is the gameplay.  Will people want to play a game that is a throwback with things that @Brainy described?  I do not know.   I know that I had fun over the weekend as did the folks I game with.   We are certainly not the majority.   the question is whether a large enough sliver of people would find it fun an/or can they make some tweaks to the game that do not change the fundamentals but do make the small QOL adjustments that might widen the audience just enough?

I don't know.  We shall see.

I think they need to be a bit more aggressive in their PR as we get closer.  Have more open test days.  Listen to feedback.  Act on the right requests while ignoring the others.  I think they will do something like that, but time will tell.
  

If that's all that they need (I find that hard to believe) I think they should be ok provided that they can deliver on what is expected.

Slapshot1188

Sovrath said:

Slapshot1188 said:

Theocritus said:

Brainy said:

No this game will definitely not fly in todays market.  Grouping is difficult in this game due to travel times.  Travel is extremely slow, where it can take 1 hour to meet with a group at high level due to run speed and distance of zones.  So you will be spending a lot of time just running around.  No summons, no recall, no portals, no teleports, no mounts, no speed at all except 1 class has a very minor speed buff.

Keeping a 6man group going is practically impossible, if someone needs to leave, then finding a replacement will take 1 hour for them to arrive, by then someone else has to leave, its a constant problem.  Add to that aggro mobs all over the zone, that will chase/kill you until you zone which adds more time.  No compass or map so new people cant find you, more wasted time.

Another problem is loot tables in this game are horrible.  Some games just drop loot all the time in the extreme, but this game loot is extremely rare, and it feels extremely poor.  Loot makes you feel like a commoner, no cool stats or anything, very very boring.

Skills in this game seem pretty weak, your best skills are your starter skills pretty much with a couple of exceptions on a couple of classes regarding CC.

No magic, big turnoff for me.

This game adds tedium for the sake of it.  They say they reviewed the game to respect the players time, yeah that didn't happen at all.  Time wasters on purpose all over the place.  Example they put your shared bank in the middle of nowhere by a gate, just to make your run back and forth from town.  Lack of inventory and lack of merchants to sell your stuff if you are 30 min away from town, expect to run back and forth just to sell.

So many problems, in this game I could go on and on, core is there but missing so much its lackluster.  Maybe in a year things will change who knows.

TLDR this game will not appeal to 99% of mmo'ers out there.  Add a sub to that and forget about it.

This game sounds so much what Everquest was like early in its career.....and while it is still chugging along with 28 or so expansions, trying to do it all over again will be a great challenge....Personally, I dont know if I can play this way ever again...especially not on a sub....We had the same isseus in old EQ where it took a long time to get a group going and maintain it...do people even have that kind of time in 2022? I dont think so...Too many other things to do now and too many other gaming options.

The sub for me is a non-issue.  But yes, I understand that many people will not look at it due to that.

That said, they do not need to even approach EQ numbers.  I believe they have a staff of around a dozen.  I think Tim once tossed out a number of subs they would need to be profitable.  I honestly do not recall the number but I know it wasn't very much.  10k? 15k?   Something like that.

Far more challenging IMHO is the gameplay.  Will people want to play a game that is a throwback with things that @Brainy described?  I do not know.   I know that I had fun over the weekend as did the folks I game with.   We are certainly not the majority.   the question is whether a large enough sliver of people would find it fun an/or can they make some tweaks to the game that do not change the fundamentals but do make the small QOL adjustments that might widen the audience just enough?

I don't know.  We shall see.

I think they need to be a bit more aggressive in their PR as we get closer.  Have more open test days.  Listen to feedback.  Act on the right requests while ignoring the others.  I think they will do something like that, but time will tell.
  

If that's all that they need (I find that hard to believe) I think they should be ok provided that they can deliver on what is expected.

I found a quote from Tim... its a few years old and applies to Saga of Lucima.. which recently became Embers.. so it certainly could have changed:


"We can't speak to size just yet. We're confidant of a 5k playerbase to start, split between two servers, and we're estimating at least 1.2-1.5k players per night, per server, which would be a fairly active and large enough community. We've had some people tell us we should expect 10k-15k subs, but we're lowballing and going with what we know we can achieve, and then we'll see how it goes from there. "

Sovrath

Slapshot1188 said:

Sovrath said:

Slapshot1188 said:

Theocritus said:

Brainy said:

No this game will definitely not fly in todays market.  Grouping is difficult in this game due to travel times.  Travel is extremely slow, where it can take 1 hour to meet with a group at high level due to run speed and distance of zones.  So you will be spending a lot of time just running around.  No summons, no recall, no portals, no teleports, no mounts, no speed at all except 1 class has a very minor speed buff.

Keeping a 6man group going is practically impossible, if someone needs to leave, then finding a replacement will take 1 hour for them to arrive, by then someone else has to leave, its a constant problem.  Add to that aggro mobs all over the zone, that will chase/kill you until you zone which adds more time.  No compass or map so new people cant find you, more wasted time.

Another problem is loot tables in this game are horrible.  Some games just drop loot all the time in the extreme, but this game loot is extremely rare, and it feels extremely poor.  Loot makes you feel like a commoner, no cool stats or anything, very very boring.

Skills in this game seem pretty weak, your best skills are your starter skills pretty much with a couple of exceptions on a couple of classes regarding CC.

No magic, big turnoff for me.

This game adds tedium for the sake of it.  They say they reviewed the game to respect the players time, yeah that didn't happen at all.  Time wasters on purpose all over the place.  Example they put your shared bank in the middle of nowhere by a gate, just to make your run back and forth from town.  Lack of inventory and lack of merchants to sell your stuff if you are 30 min away from town, expect to run back and forth just to sell.

So many problems, in this game I could go on and on, core is there but missing so much its lackluster.  Maybe in a year things will change who knows.

TLDR this game will not appeal to 99% of mmo'ers out there.  Add a sub to that and forget about it.

This game sounds so much what Everquest was like early in its career.....and while it is still chugging along with 28 or so expansions, trying to do it all over again will be a great challenge....Personally, I dont know if I can play this way ever again...especially not on a sub....We had the same isseus in old EQ where it took a long time to get a group going and maintain it...do people even have that kind of time in 2022? I dont think so...Too many other things to do now and too many other gaming options.

The sub for me is a non-issue.  But yes, I understand that many people will not look at it due to that.

That said, they do not need to even approach EQ numbers.  I believe they have a staff of around a dozen.  I think Tim once tossed out a number of subs they would need to be profitable.  I honestly do not recall the number but I know it wasn't very much.  10k? 15k?   Something like that.

Far more challenging IMHO is the gameplay.  Will people want to play a game that is a throwback with things that @Brainy described?  I do not know.   I know that I had fun over the weekend as did the folks I game with.   We are certainly not the majority.   the question is whether a large enough sliver of people would find it fun an/or can they make some tweaks to the game that do not change the fundamentals but do make the small QOL adjustments that might widen the audience just enough?

I don't know.  We shall see.

I think they need to be a bit more aggressive in their PR as we get closer.  Have more open test days.  Listen to feedback.  Act on the right requests while ignoring the others.  I think they will do something like that, but time will tell.
  

If that's all that they need (I find that hard to believe) I think they should be ok provided that they can deliver on what is expected.

I found a quote from Tim... its a few years old and applies to Saga of Lucima.. which recently became Embers.. so it certainly could have changed:


"We can't speak to size just yet. We're confidant of a 5k playerbase to start, split between two servers, and we're estimating at least 1.2-1.5k players per night, per server, which would be a fairly active and large enough community. We've had some people tell us we should expect 10k-15k subs, but we're lowballing and going with what we know we can achieve, and then we'll see how it goes from there. "

I suppose if they do a sub, but don't make it too high, that could work. Even if it's 10 dollars and they have 10k people that's 100k per month. Not awesome but probably workable.

svann

I dont think it could be like original eq and survive.  Even original eq had to change or die, and that was almost 20 years ago.

Nanfoodle

They do have some updates. They did add a travel system. One per zone and it needs to be discovered to use it. It's free to use now but will cost amber essence at launch.

They also added a Celestial body in the night sky that's always true North to help direct you and it a light source at night, so the night time is no longer pitch black.

Also they have made it so team is optimal but any class can solo but not all content can be soloed. Pick your battles like EQ1 days but you can progress.

Crafting has a 3rd iteration to make it more n depth with lots of progression. Best in slot for some slots it crafted items and best in slot for some slots will be dropped items. 

KnightFalz

Nanfoodle said:

They do have some updates. They did add a travel system. One per zone and it needs to be discovered to use it. It's free to use now but will cost amber essence at launch.

They also added a Celestial body in the night sky that's always true North to help direct you and it a light source at night, so the night time is no longer pitch black.

Also they have made it so team is optimal but any class can solo but not all content can be soloed. Pick your battles like EQ1 days but you can progress.

Crafting has a 3rd iteration to make it more n depth with lots of progression. Best in slot for some slots it crafted items and best in slot for some slots will be dropped items. 

It's still too dark at night to be adequately playable.

Knowing that a huge celestial body vaguely signifies north only allows you to vaguely establish the other directions as well. That knowledge is all but useless as it provides no precision. If there was a large number of landmarks easily visible at night the two combined might be serviceable but there is not.

As a result my play is substantially crippled at length for each stretch of night and as of yet there is no adequate way to mitigate that. Roughly a third of my playtime is essentially wasted due to that or at least greatly compromised.

In short, as is the game doesn't respect my time compared to virtually everything else I play and that has grown tiresome to the point of waning my interest.

Nanfoodle

Ya games like this is not for everyone. I loved in EQ1 creeping around the Ogre jungles late at night. Not seeing more then 10 feet and hearing a shrill sound coming from the dark and worried I was feet from death as I did not know what was out there.

Daskness can add a depth if done right. But EQ1 back in 1999, death alone was something to fear for many reasons. I don't count that as not respecting my game time. I want more from a MMO then worrying about how much progression I got tonight. I just want an experience. 

Cybersig211

Nanfoodle said:

Ya games like this is not for everyone. I loved in EQ1 creeping around the Ogre jungles late at night. Not seeing more then 10 feet and hearing a shrill sound coming from the dark and worried I was feet from death as I did not know what was out there.

Daskness can add a depth if done right. But EQ1 back in 1999, death alone was something to fear for many reasons. I don't count that as not respecting my game time. I want more from a MMO then worrying about how much progression I got tonight. I just want an experience. 

Sadly this game isnt even for people who like EQ1, which was a well made game, with lots of progression, cool group interactions for fun group farming, awesome classes with tons of variety and toolsets, and raids and an endgame.

This has boring melee classes.  boring simplistic skills.  boring combat overall (even for a game like this), it runs poorly.  There is no endgame.  None of the classes are cool and dont progress in a satisfying way.  The gear and itemization is restrictive by class for no reason, and super basic and boring.

I seasonally will necro solo grind in EQ, alone, for as far as i can get typically, and move on having had a good time.  Im not even going back to this game for the free weekend.

This isnt about "oh well kids today just dont get old school mmos"....its a bad game thats effectively scamming old school mmo enjoyers as they wait for anything other than Everquest 1 or p1999.

Ok ill give embers adrift has a good starting area and second zone experience, however, most of what makes those areas cool, is that you havent figured out there isnt a fun or enjoyable reason to keep going yet.  Group play is so boring and simple too....which is the hallmark of this game, but no endgame raids?

The only reason people whine about darkness is that its too much and too long.  Ive had entire play sessions where im looking at a black screen with nameplates fighting.  Cool its dark, but the game doesnt use darkness in a good way, and it looks ugly AF for the like hour it lasts...every other hour.....

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Brainy

Sovrath said:

I suppose if they do a sub, but don't make it too high, that could work. Even if it's 10 dollars and they have 10k people that's 100k per month. Not awesome but probably workable.

10k people turns out to be a bit to ambitious.  By at least 10-100 times over projected.  Best they can hope for is 10k dollars a month.