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High Fantasy PVP game?

comitroncomitron Member UncommonPosts: 37
Why do we not see a pvp game based on high fantasy elements? it would seem to be a no brainer to me. Imagine Call of Duty but high fantasy instead of guns. You would create a character... Mage, Fighter, Healer, Rogue, and level them up the same way as Call of Duty. The more you level up the, more skills you unlock, the more money you make, the more armor/swords/spells you have access to. You can even create a progression system where you build your own class/loadouts, based on how many skill points you spend in a tree etc. Maybe mix in elements of fortnight, where you loot chests with armor/weapons. There used to be a game(cant recall the name now) where there were three teams i believe, and there were objectives that needed to be completed in order to own the tunnels, and allow you to get more resources etc.. anyway idea being that there is a ton of ideas that can be wrapped around this and would never have to play typical pve go quest, level up.. but level up while playing in PVP ala' Call of Duty Style.
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Comments

  • NycteliosNyctelios Member EpicPosts: 4,039
    So... Spellbreak?
    tzervoUngood
    Discord ID: Night # 6102
    Current playing: 
    Elite Dangerous

    "There is a fine line between consideration and hesitation. The former is wisdom, the latter is fear." Izaro Phrecius, Holy Emperor of the Eternal Empire, Last of Royal Phrecius Family.
  • GorweGorwe Member Posts: 636
    Warhammer Online(via Return of Reckoning server)? It can be a full PvP game if that's what you wish.
  • Po_ggPo_gg Member EpicPosts: 5,660
    Spellbreak is third-person and battle royale, not really CoD-like... i'd say Hexen/Hexen2 deathmatch :)
    Old (in years), but original fps never gets old.
    Gorwetzervo
  • tzervotzervo Member EpicPosts: 1,291
    Po_gg said:
    Spellbreak is third-person and battle royale, not really CoD-like... i'd say Hexen/Hexen2 deathmatch :)
    Old (in years), but original fps never gets old.
    They added a Dominion game mode recently. But yeah it was originally only BR.
  • NycteliosNyctelios Member EpicPosts: 4,039
    Po_gg said:
    Spellbreak is third-person and battle royale, not really CoD-like... i'd say Hexen/Hexen2 deathmatch :)
    Old (in years), but original fps never gets old.
    I know but it was the first thing that came to mind.

    Also, he asked for progression. I don't remember progression in old FPS arenas.
    Discord ID: Night # 6102
    Current playing: 
    Elite Dangerous

    "There is a fine line between consideration and hesitation. The former is wisdom, the latter is fear." Izaro Phrecius, Holy Emperor of the Eternal Empire, Last of Royal Phrecius Family.
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 15,274
    Scott441 said:
    comitron said:
    Why do we not see a pvp game based on high fantasy elements? it would seem to be a no brainer to me. Imagine Call of Duty but high fantasy instead of guns. You would create a character... Mage, Fighter, Healer, Rogue, and level them up the same way as Call of Duty. The more you level up the, more skills you unlock, the more money you make, the more armor/swords/spells you have access to. You can even create a progression system where you build your own class/loadouts, based on how many skill points you spend in a tree etc. Maybe mix in elements of fortnight, where you loot chests with armor/weapons. There used to be a game(cant recall the name now) where there were three teams i believe, and there were objectives that needed to be completed in order to own the tunnels, and allow you to get more resources etc.. anyway idea being that there is a ton of ideas that can be wrapped around this and would never have to play typical pve go quest, level up.. but level up while playing in PVP ala' Call of Duty Style.

    Dark age of Camelot. Give it a try, it has an amazing PvP system - or rather RvR realm vs realm as it is called. RvR is the endgame, which means that the whole game is designed around it. There is still the levelling process of course, it is a mmorpg after all, but it's not too grindy.

    Don't play live servers though, the game is old and it has lost its charm over the years thanks to bad management. There is an awesome freeshard called Phoenix created by the community based on the classic version of the game and its first expansion, basically the golden era of the game.

    Welcome to the forums! :)
  • Vermillion_RaventhalVermillion_Raventhal Member EpicPosts: 4,166
    I am amazed there isn't a fantasy looter shooter or FPS.  Heretic and Hexen were pretty awesome in my opinion.
    Po_ggBrainy
  • UngoodUngood Member LegendaryPosts: 5,815
    So.. like SMITE?
    tzervoYashaX
    Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
  • NycteliosNyctelios Member EpicPosts: 4,039
    I am amazed there isn't a fantasy looter shooter or FPS.  Heretic and Hexen were pretty awesome in my opinion.
    Vermintide is the closest to it I think
    tzervoYashaX
    Discord ID: Night # 6102
    Current playing: 
    Elite Dangerous

    "There is a fine line between consideration and hesitation. The former is wisdom, the latter is fear." Izaro Phrecius, Holy Emperor of the Eternal Empire, Last of Royal Phrecius Family.
  • cameltosiscameltosis Member EpicPosts: 2,998
    I've often thought this sort of game would be a good idea.


    I mean, you're basically describing a MOBA in the broad sense, just more like the CoD / Battlefield style of MOBA, rather than the RTS style we're all more familiar with. It is certainly something I'd be interested in trying out if it was done well.


    I know Mythic attempted to create a game like this when WAR was tanking. The scenarios (battlegrounds) were the most popular feature, so they tried to create a spinoff game which was nothing but scenarios. Don't think it ever launched. I also believe there was a MOBA that came close, I can't remember it's name but it wasn't the usual isometric view, it was 3rd person behind the character view.
  • Po_ggPo_gg Member EpicPosts: 5,660
    Nyctelios said:
    Po_gg said:
    Spellbreak is third-person and battle royale, not really CoD-like... i'd say Hexen/Hexen2 deathmatch :)
    Old (in years), but original fps never gets old.
    I know but it was the first thing that came to mind.

    Also, he asked for progression. I don't remember progression in old FPS arenas.
    The truest progression of pvp, raising the killcount number :) 
    (kidding)

    Kinda that's the point of OP, there's no game checking all the requirements... Vermintide is FPS but team-focused co-op, Chivalry is FPS and pvp but no magic/fantasy, just medieval, etc.

    Heretic/Hexen/2 could be a fit, just no progression besides picking up better weapons.

    How about DMoM&M? Man, that looks stupid that way...
    I mean Dark Messiah (of Might&Magic)

    FPS, high fantasy with plenty of magic besides melee, and with team-based pvp beyond the regular deathmatches.
    tzervo
  • NycteliosNyctelios Member EpicPosts: 4,039
    Po_gg said:
    Nyctelios said:
    Po_gg said:
    Spellbreak is third-person and battle royale, not really CoD-like... i'd say Hexen/Hexen2 deathmatch :)
    Old (in years), but original fps never gets old.
    I know but it was the first thing that came to mind.

    Also, he asked for progression. I don't remember progression in old FPS arenas.
    The truest progression of pvp, raising the killcount number :) 
    (kidding)

    Kinda that's the point of OP, there's no game checking all the requirements... Vermintide is FPS but team-focused co-op, Chivalry is FPS and pvp but no magic/fantasy, just medieval, etc.

    Heretic/Hexen/2 could be a fit, just no progression besides picking up better weapons.

    How about DMoM&M? Man, that looks stupid that way...
    I mean Dark Messiah (of Might&Magic)

    FPS, high fantasy with plenty of magic besides melee, and with team-based pvp beyond the regular deathmatches.
    From the old school FPS Hexen/Heretic are my favorites by far solely due the theme.

    I would kill for a new Dark Messiah and I would burn you all for a game like OP is describing. yeah xD
    Po_gg
    Discord ID: Night # 6102
    Current playing: 
    Elite Dangerous

    "There is a fine line between consideration and hesitation. The former is wisdom, the latter is fear." Izaro Phrecius, Holy Emperor of the Eternal Empire, Last of Royal Phrecius Family.
  • kitaradkitarad Member LegendaryPosts: 6,568
    Scot said:
    Scott441 said:
    comitron said:
    Why do we not see a pvp game based on high fantasy elements? it would seem to be a no brainer to me. Imagine Call of Duty but high fantasy instead of guns. You would create a character... Mage, Fighter, Healer, Rogue, and level them up the same way as Call of Duty. The more you level up the, more skills you unlock, the more money you make, the more armor/swords/spells you have access to. You can even create a progression system where you build your own class/loadouts, based on how many skill points you spend in a tree etc. Maybe mix in elements of fortnight, where you loot chests with armor/weapons. There used to be a game(cant recall the name now) where there were three teams i believe, and there were objectives that needed to be completed in order to own the tunnels, and allow you to get more resources etc.. anyway idea being that there is a ton of ideas that can be wrapped around this and would never have to play typical pve go quest, level up.. but level up while playing in PVP ala' Call of Duty Style.

    Dark age of Camelot. Give it a try, it has an amazing PvP system - or rather RvR realm vs realm as it is called. RvR is the endgame, which means that the whole game is designed around it. There is still the levelling process of course, it is a mmorpg after all, but it's not too grindy.

    Don't play live servers though, the game is old and it has lost its charm over the years thanks to bad management. There is an awesome freeshard called Phoenix created by the community based on the classic version of the game and its first expansion, basically the golden era of the game.

    Welcome to the forums! :)
    What happened to Scot441? The post is missing.
    NycteliosYashaX

  • NycteliosNyctelios Member EpicPosts: 4,039
    kitarad said:
    Scot said:
    Scott441 said:
    comitron said:
    Why do we not see a pvp game based on high fantasy elements? it would seem to be a no brainer to me. Imagine Call of Duty but high fantasy instead of guns. You would create a character... Mage, Fighter, Healer, Rogue, and level them up the same way as Call of Duty. The more you level up the, more skills you unlock, the more money you make, the more armor/swords/spells you have access to. You can even create a progression system where you build your own class/loadouts, based on how many skill points you spend in a tree etc. Maybe mix in elements of fortnight, where you loot chests with armor/weapons. There used to be a game(cant recall the name now) where there were three teams i believe, and there were objectives that needed to be completed in order to own the tunnels, and allow you to get more resources etc.. anyway idea being that there is a ton of ideas that can be wrapped around this and would never have to play typical pve go quest, level up.. but level up while playing in PVP ala' Call of Duty Style.

    Dark age of Camelot. Give it a try, it has an amazing PvP system - or rather RvR realm vs realm as it is called. RvR is the endgame, which means that the whole game is designed around it. There is still the levelling process of course, it is a mmorpg after all, but it's not too grindy.

    Don't play live servers though, the game is old and it has lost its charm over the years thanks to bad management. There is an awesome freeshard called Phoenix created by the community based on the classic version of the game and its first expansion, basically the golden era of the game.

    Welcome to the forums! :)
    What happened to Scot441? The post is missing.
    Wow, thats weird
    Discord ID: Night # 6102
    Current playing: 
    Elite Dangerous

    "There is a fine line between consideration and hesitation. The former is wisdom, the latter is fear." Izaro Phrecius, Holy Emperor of the Eternal Empire, Last of Royal Phrecius Family.
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 15,274
    edited May 28
    Nyctelios said:
    kitarad said:
    Scot said:
    Scott441 said:
    comitron said:
    Why do we not see a pvp game based on high fantasy elements? it would seem to be a no brainer to me. Imagine Call of Duty but high fantasy instead of guns. You would create a character... Mage, Fighter, Healer, Rogue, and level them up the same way as Call of Duty. The more you level up the, more skills you unlock, the more money you make, the more armor/swords/spells you have access to. You can even create a progression system where you build your own class/loadouts, based on how many skill points you spend in a tree etc. Maybe mix in elements of fortnight, where you loot chests with armor/weapons. There used to be a game(cant recall the name now) where there were three teams i believe, and there were objectives that needed to be completed in order to own the tunnels, and allow you to get more resources etc.. anyway idea being that there is a ton of ideas that can be wrapped around this and would never have to play typical pve go quest, level up.. but level up while playing in PVP ala' Call of Duty Style.

    Dark age of Camelot. Give it a try, it has an amazing PvP system - or rather RvR realm vs realm as it is called. RvR is the endgame, which means that the whole game is designed around it. There is still the levelling process of course, it is a mmorpg after all, but it's not too grindy.

    Don't play live servers though, the game is old and it has lost its charm over the years thanks to bad management. There is an awesome freeshard called Phoenix created by the community based on the classic version of the game and its first expansion, basically the golden era of the game.

    Welcome to the forums! :)
    What happened to Scot441? The post is missing.
    Wow, thats weird
    He must have deleted his account, maybe thought their were too many Scot's or something? :)

    He did an insightful first post, I have to say we don't get that as often as I would like so hopefully he will return.
    tzervoYashaXNyctelios
  • KnightFalzKnightFalz Member EpicPosts: 1,869
    Gorwe said:
    Warhammer Online(via Return of Reckoning server)? It can be a full PvP game if that's what you wish.

    Would you characterize Warhammer as high fantasy? From what I've seen of it looked pretty low fantasy to me, especially in the table top RPG book I had a chance to look through. I've haven't had much exposure to it though, so it could what I saw just featured that aspect.
  • cameltosiscameltosis Member EpicPosts: 2,998
    Gorwe said:
    Warhammer Online(via Return of Reckoning server)? It can be a full PvP game if that's what you wish.

    Would you characterize Warhammer as high fantasy? From what I've seen of it looked pretty low fantasy to me, especially in the table top RPG book I had a chance to look through. I've haven't had much exposure to it though, so it could what I saw just featured that aspect.

    It's got a ton of non-human races, loads of monsters, demons from other realms and loads of magic.

    Its about as high-fantasy as you can get.
    tzervo
  • GorweGorwe Member Posts: 636
    Gorwe said:
    Warhammer Online(via Return of Reckoning server)? It can be a full PvP game if that's what you wish.

    Would you characterize Warhammer as high fantasy? From what I've seen of it looked pretty low fantasy to me, especially in the table top RPG book I had a chance to look through. I've haven't had much exposure to it though, so it could what I saw just featured that aspect.

    It's got a ton of non-human races, loads of monsters, demons from other realms and loads of magic.

    Its about as high-fantasy as you can get.

    Not necessarily. I have to think about this one, but. Colloquially? Yes, it can be seen as such.
  • cameltosiscameltosis Member EpicPosts: 2,998
    Gorwe said:
    Gorwe said:
    Warhammer Online(via Return of Reckoning server)? It can be a full PvP game if that's what you wish.

    Would you characterize Warhammer as high fantasy? From what I've seen of it looked pretty low fantasy to me, especially in the table top RPG book I had a chance to look through. I've haven't had much exposure to it though, so it could what I saw just featured that aspect.

    It's got a ton of non-human races, loads of monsters, demons from other realms and loads of magic.

    Its about as high-fantasy as you can get.

    Not necessarily. I have to think about this one, but. Colloquially? Yes, it can be seen as such.

    The scale of low-to-high fantasy is about how near or far you are from Earth's reality and history.


    The closer you are to reality, the more low fantasy you are. The further away from reality, the higher the fantasy (i.e. there is a high level of fantasy).


    Warhammer is pretty damn far away from reality, most of the IP is pure fantasy. 40k could be viewed differently given that Earth is included as the birthplace of humans and Earth's history is vaguely included in the IP. But Warhammer Fantasy is definitely, 100%, high fantasy.



    Low-to-high is just one scale through which you can view the fantasy. Light-to-dark is another scale, and Warhammer is definitely closer to dark than light, so this may be where the uncertainty comes from.




    I've been trying to find examples of low fantasy MMORPGs but I really can't think of any! Mid or High Fantasy seems to be the rule. Darkfall is probably closest to low fantasy, but it still seems to have plenty of non-human races and magic.

    If you're into books, then something like The Mistborn series by Brandon Sanderson is a good example of low fantasy. The Abhorsen Chronicles by Garth Nix or the Raven's Shadow series by Anthony Ryan are also good examples.
  • JemcrystalJemcrystal Member UncommonPosts: 1,943
    Ark Survival Evolved is fantasy.  It has pvp.  It is on sale on Steam atm 80% off.  


  • tzervotzervo Member EpicPosts: 1,291

    I've been trying to find examples of low fantasy MMORPGs but I really can't think of any! 
    Gloria Victis. Life Is Feudal (no longer operating). I think Wurm Online is low-fantasy too.
    YashaX
  • KnightFalzKnightFalz Member EpicPosts: 1,869
    edited May 30
    Gorwe said:
    Gorwe said:
    Warhammer Online(via Return of Reckoning server)? It can be a full PvP game if that's what you wish.

    Would you characterize Warhammer as high fantasy? From what I've seen of it looked pretty low fantasy to me, especially in the table top RPG book I had a chance to look through. I've haven't had much exposure to it though, so it could what I saw just featured that aspect.

    It's got a ton of non-human races, loads of monsters, demons from other realms and loads of magic.

    Its about as high-fantasy as you can get.

    Not necessarily. I have to think about this one, but. Colloquially? Yes, it can be seen as such.

    The scale of low-to-high fantasy is about how near or far you are from Earth's reality and history.


    The closer you are to reality, the more low fantasy you are. The further away from reality, the higher the fantasy (i.e. there is a high level of fantasy).


    That's not the definition I've seen and tend to personally go by, but I'm sure there are others that define it as you and it may well be the common interpretation.

    What I consider is the degree of fantasy, which I mainly equate to the level of magic in a world. The more common it is, the more convenient, the greater the degree of power that can be commanded, the higher the level of fantasy I attribute to it.

    Tons of non-human races, monsters, and planar interlopers are all unnatural, but not necessarily all that fantastical.

    An orc is largely like a brutish, human warrior would be, at least in most of the settings I'm familiar with. Many monsters come down to what would be an odd collection of natural creatures.

    Demons from other planes would normally qualify as high magic, but there is also a large number of them depicted as marginally better than humans, which would be extremely underwhelming if it required a continuous ritual lasting a week to first penetrate the veil between realms before one could be brought over.

    So basically, I'm wondering if Warhammer is a world of common magic easily cast to grand effect or it is one where magic is rare, difficult to cast, and even then moderate in effect without the benefit of extended ritual and the like.
  • KnightFalzKnightFalz Member EpicPosts: 1,869
    tzervo said:

    I've been trying to find examples of low fantasy MMORPGs but I really can't think of any! 
    Gloria Victis. Life Is Feudal (no longer operating). I think Wurm Online is low-fantasy too.

    Gloria Victis certainly seemed so when I tried it, but I didn't play for long. I've had no experience with the others.
  • GorweGorwe Member Posts: 636
    edited May 30
    Gorwe said:
    Gorwe said:
    Warhammer Online(via Return of Reckoning server)? It can be a full PvP game if that's what you wish.

    Would you characterize Warhammer as high fantasy? From what I've seen of it looked pretty low fantasy to me, especially in the table top RPG book I had a chance to look through. I've haven't had much exposure to it though, so it could what I saw just featured that aspect.

    It's got a ton of non-human races, loads of monsters, demons from other realms and loads of magic.

    Its about as high-fantasy as you can get.

    Not necessarily. I have to think about this one, but. Colloquially? Yes, it can be seen as such.

    The scale of low-to-high fantasy is about how near or far you are from Earth's reality and history.


    The closer you are to reality, the more low fantasy you are. The further away from reality, the higher the fantasy (i.e. there is a high level of fantasy).


    That's not the definition I've seen and tend to personally go by, but I'm sure there are others that define it as you and it may well be the common interpretation.

    What I consider is the degree of fantasy, which I mainly equate to the level of magic in a world. The more common it is, the more convenient, the greater the degree of power that can be commanded, the higher the level of fantasy I attribute to it.

    Tons of non-human races, monsters, and planar interlopers are all unnatural, but not necessarily all that fantastical.

    An orc is largely like a brutish, human warrior would be, at least in most of the settings I'm familiar with. Many monsters come down to what would be an odd collection of natural creatures.

    Demons from other planes would normally qualify as high magic, but there is also a large number of them depicted as marginally better than humans, which would be extremely underwhelming if it required a continuous ritual lasting a week to first penetrate the veil between realms before one could be brought over.

    So basically, I'm wondering if Warhammer is a world of common magic easily cast to grand effect or it is one where magic is rare, difficult to cast, and even then moderate in effect without the benefit of extended ritual and the like.

    It all depends on a lot of factors.

    First is the scale we are using. And whether it contains "mid fantasy"(very important). Warhammer is known to straddle quite a lot of lines here and, if using this scale, it'd probably indeed fall into the "MID FANTASY". But it also depends on WHERE and WHEN Warhammer takes place. Nuln, Stirland etc would most likely be "Low Fantasy", while Ulthuan is most likely to be "High Fantasy". Big battles(and such, like the End Times) are "Epic Fantasy". That is the SECOND point.

    Finally, it all depends on how distant from this world, Earth, the setting is(and other accompanying factors). Warhammer Fantasy is probably like Conan, a fictional version of our history. Factions and even geography looks awfully Earth like(say...Norsca? Like NorSca? North Scandinavia?). Also, Magic is rather rare and dangerous, not every schmuck can use it(and even fewer safely)...quite anti High Fantasy.

    Conclusion: Warhammer Fantasy is a very rich setting where most everyone can find what he is looking for(a bit more of typical good vs evil adventures wouldn't be amiss). However, most of time, it is a Nobledark Midfantasy setting. That's my evaluation, discussion appreciated.
  • AmarantharAmaranthar Member EpicPosts: 4,421
    Gorwe said:
    Gorwe said:
    Warhammer Online(via Return of Reckoning server)? It can be a full PvP game if that's what you wish.

    Would you characterize Warhammer as high fantasy? From what I've seen of it looked pretty low fantasy to me, especially in the table top RPG book I had a chance to look through. I've haven't had much exposure to it though, so it could what I saw just featured that aspect.

    It's got a ton of non-human races, loads of monsters, demons from other realms and loads of magic.

    Its about as high-fantasy as you can get.

    Not necessarily. I have to think about this one, but. Colloquially? Yes, it can be seen as such.

    The scale of low-to-high fantasy is about how near or far you are from Earth's reality and history.


    The closer you are to reality, the more low fantasy you are. The further away from reality, the higher the fantasy (i.e. there is a high level of fantasy).


    That's not the definition I've seen and tend to personally go by, but I'm sure there are others that define it as you and it may well be the common interpretation.

    What I consider is the degree of fantasy, which I mainly equate to the level of magic in a world. The more common it is, the more convenient, the greater the degree of power that can be commanded, the higher the level of fantasy I attribute to it.

    Tons of non-human races, monsters, and planar interlopers are all unnatural, but not necessarily all that fantastical.

    An orc is largely like a brutish, human warrior would be, at least in most of the settings I'm familiar with. Many monsters come down to what would be an odd collection of natural creatures.

    Demons from other planes would normally qualify as high magic, but there is also a large number of them depicted as marginally better than humans, which would be extremely underwhelming if it required a continuous ritual lasting a week to first penetrate the veil between realms before one could be brought over.

    So basically, I'm wondering if Warhammer is a world of common magic easily cast to grand effect or it is one where magic is rare, difficult to cast, and even then moderate in effect without the benefit of extended ritual and the like.
    I pretty much agree with this. 
    I consider the degree of "fantasy" to be about how much magical aspects pervades the world. 
    So a world where the magical aspects is commonplace (not just among the players, but also among the NPC's side of things) is what I consider "high fantasy." 
    A look at daily life in the cities and it's NPCs is a good place to make a judgement call. 

    Still, the middle ground can be very hard to judge in an MMORPG. It's probably another one of those things that's best left to individual opinion. 


    Once upon a time....

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