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The future of mmos is rental servers.

RungarRungar Member RarePosts: 473
edited April 30 in The Pub at MMORPG.COM
I believe well see less and less big mmos, as its already trending this way and instead we will see the rise of the rental server. 

1) Its cheaper for the players as only one person has to rent the server. 
2) worlds can be more personalized in terms of rulesets
3) people are generally tired of people they dont know and mmo management in general. They want smaller better communities with some control over who is there. 
4) allows the use of mods to personalize the worlds to players liking on a server basis
5) Is easier for developers as we go back to just making the games that can support a couple of hundred players at a time. 

I can see a company like microsoft leading this providing top notch server technology at rental cost that can apply to multiple games. If they were smart it would be part of their windows store strategy. If they make all their games to leverage server rental they not only get to sell the games but also rent the server space. This will be the biggest incentive possible for online games sold by microsoft. Steam cannot compete with that directly. 
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Comments

  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,727
    I don't see this as the future.
    No mmorpgs other than Koran cash shop ones.  
    ChampieScot
  • AAAMEOWAAAMEOW Member RarePosts: 1,447
    you mean like minecraft.  It's already happening.  Or roblox, whatever that is.  
  • RungarRungar Member RarePosts: 473
    AAAMEOW said:
    you mean like minecraft.  It's already happening.  Or roblox, whatever that is.  
    yes like that. There are other games as well. The exception being that it wont be random server provider but a specific host like microsoft or even steam. 

    games go to steam so they can get exposure but they cant be hosted by steam at least not at the moment. Integrated server space rental will become part of the selling features of the platform for multiplayer games. 
    Champie
    .33 of a second to midnight
  • NeblessNebless Member RarePosts: 1,544
    While that idea works for some games (Conan Exiles for one) I don't see it being very effective for the majority.

    The biggest sticking point I see is when a game does a hot fix or update to the code.  All those mods you talked about are generally broken until the mod owners can get in and adapt the mod to the new code which can't happen until the game company puts out the 'mod kit' for that patch they just did.
    Mendel

    SWG (pre-cu) - AoC (pre-f2p) - PotBS (pre-boarder) - DDO - LotRO (pre-f2p) - STO - GnH (beta tester) - SWToR - Neverwinter

  • RungarRungar Member RarePosts: 473
    Nebless said:
    While that idea works for some games (Conan Exiles for one) I don't see it being very effective for the majority.

    The biggest sticking point I see is when a game does a hot fix or update to the code.  All those mods you talked about are generally broken until the mod owners can get in and adapt the mod to the new code which can't happen until the game company puts out the 'mod kit' for that patch they just did.
    thats sort of why it has microsoft or steam backing deployment rather than random server provider. The integrated structure helps with updates. Obviously modded servers will have to fix their mods. 

    for instance steam automatically updates all my games. You rent the server space from steam and that gets updated as well.  
    Champie
    .33 of a second to midnight
  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,825
    Rental servers are not really for MMOs. For games with 50 people online at once, rental servers are often great. But once you go to MMO scale and have 1 000 online at once the amount of GM and customer support work grows so large that it's best handled by professionals.
    ScotKyleranMendelcameltosisChampie
     
  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,825
    Rungar said:
    Nebless said:
    While that idea works for some games (Conan Exiles for one) I don't see it being very effective for the majority.

    The biggest sticking point I see is when a game does a hot fix or update to the code.  All those mods you talked about are generally broken until the mod owners can get in and adapt the mod to the new code which can't happen until the game company puts out the 'mod kit' for that patch they just did.
    thats sort of why it has microsoft or steam backing deployment rather than random server provider. The integrated structure helps with updates. Obviously modded servers will have to fix their mods. 

    for instance steam automatically updates all my games. You rent the server space from steam and that gets updated as well.  
    Automatically updating servers would just make the problem raised by Nebless worse: It would just mean that modded servers would become instantly unplayable instead of being able to run the old server version that was compatible with their collection of mods.
    Champie
     
  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,756
    edited April 30
    For multiplayer games with a small number of players, it already exists.

    It's not new by the way, Neverwinter Nights in 2002 could already host up to 64 players as a soft limit, but in reality it became quickly unplayable over 10 players back then because of the poor Internet speed, now it may be possible with modern hardware and fiber Internet.

    But for MMORPGs (real ones, with massive number of players), it's not that simple, and I doubt it's the immediate future.
    ScotKyleranMendelChampie
    "The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn in Star Wars.
    After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that neither does the ability to write.
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  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 37,697
    edited April 30
    What I think we'll see is in five years is the "big six" or so MMORPGS will still be the dominant players in their space.

    There really isn't many promising games on the near horizon unless one of the many asian games in development becomes a surprise hit.

    Possible sure, but unlikely to appeal to me regardless.

    I also see myself playing smaller MMO alikes such as FO76 and such but not on private or rental servers, I prefer more stable management and service.

    MendelJean-Luc_PicardChampieUngood

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

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    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

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  • MendelMendel Member EpicPosts: 4,478
    Rental servers may be the future of games, but not really the games I want to play.  Big, massive games with huge worlds and complex activities requiring intense computing power doesn't really sound like something that the 'average' gamer would be able to support.  (Or afford).



    KyleranSovrathJean-Luc_PicardChampie

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • cameltosiscameltosis Member EpicPosts: 2,950
    Vrika said:
    Rental servers are not really for MMOs. For games with 50 people online at once, rental servers are often great. But once you go to MMO scale and have 1 000 online at once the amount of GM and customer support work grows so large that it's best handled by professionals.

    Gotta agree with Vrika here: rental servers are not for MMORPGs.


    A rental server is perfect for when you already have a pre-established group of friends who all want to play the same game together. So, something like ARK, or Valheim, games built around small scale cooperation, rental servers are perfect.


    But who the hell has 500 friends that all want to play the same game? So, a private, rented MMO server will either never reach capacity, or you'll have to invite in randoms which then means a lot of hassle in terms of administration and support.




    Now, you have inspired an interesting thought, a new type of business model. Rather than private servers for the general public, could we have private servers for businesses? So, for example, lets say Blizzard made WoW, but would then let other distributers rent/hire their code to run their own servers with their own modifications?

    Such a business model could take the pressure off inexperienced studios - they could still design / develop the core code, but others could handle live operations. Also, if you had 5 or 6 separate companies all running their own versions of the code, presumably (with a little cooperation) more bugs could be fixed, more optimisations found and more interesting ideas explored.
    Jean-Luc_PicardGdemamiChampie
  • AAAMEOWAAAMEOW Member RarePosts: 1,447
    I think the future is already here.  I presume most of the online games are hosted on Amazon or Google cloud server.

    And people are already hosting minecraft, ark, rust etc etc on rental server.  

    As for private server, Legend of Aria is doing that.  They let people hosting their own private server.  But I don't think the developer is enthusiastic about it since if people are playing on private server less people would play on official server...  Which could mean they potentially make less money.  
    TwistedSister77
  • CuddleheartCuddleheart Member UncommonPosts: 341
    AAAMEOW said:
    I think the future is already here.  I presume most of the online games are hosted on Amazon or Google cloud server.

    And people are already hosting minecraft, ark, rust etc etc on rental server.  

    As for private server, Legend of Aria is doing that.  They let people hosting their own private server.  But I don't think the developer is enthusiastic about it since if people are playing on private server less people would play on official server...  Which could mean they potentially make less money.  
    So, unless things changed, the only way you can host a server is if you contributed to the $200 tier or above for their crowd funding. and you would get the tools and access to hosting a server.  You were hosting it on your own server set up.  This was when it was shards.  I thought the idea of having people able to host their own servers was great.  They were even talking about a way to connect them.  The reality was you got tools to map edit and Lua script in unity.

    I was really bummed(okay, super salty) about this as this was my lesson in crowd funding...
    tzervo
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 18,926
    edited May 2
    Large entities like Steam Microsoft would charge way too much money.
    It might be cheap for players but not for the person running the server.

    Yes individual servers offer the best experience and offers more choice to the players.

    ALL and i mean ALL of the studios are looking for ways to monetize and get the most money for their game so it is unlikely they do anything for we the gamer.

    We have been typically seeing this movement from the low budget or early access games  that don't have cash shops and or because they don't want to run servers.

    Most always i can't stand how developers setup their servers,i find the setting to be atrocious.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • RungarRungar Member RarePosts: 473
    edited May 2
    A steam or microsoft etc rental server isnt really the same as a private one. It would be more of a rental world. 

    I think what were seeing is that the bigger games get the dumber they also get due to scale issues. Less cool features, less interesting things offered. Less specific to how you want to play. Trying to please everyone pleases no one. 

    a steam ( for example) based world might offer you tools to trick out the world and your friends could come play there. It really just shifts the subscription(or most of it) to steam from the developers and lets developers work on the game itself. Expansions etc. 

    Since large scale server farms operated by microsoft and amazon etc are much more efficient, scalable and offer game platform loyalty it seems like a win win for developers and the big game hosts like microsoft and steam. 

     


    GdemamiChampie
    .33 of a second to midnight
  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,825
    Rungar said:
    A steam or microsoft etc rental server isnt really the same as a private one. It would be more of a rental world. 

    I think what were seeing is that the bigger games get the dumber they also get due to scale issues. Less cool features, less interesting things offered. Less specific to how you want to play. Trying to please everyone pleases no one. 

    a steam ( for example) based world might offer you tools to trick out the world and your friends could come play there. It really just shifts the subscription(or most of it) to steam from the developers and lets developers work on the game itself. Expansions etc. 

    Since large scale server farms operated by microsoft and amazon etc are much more efficient, scalable and offer game platform loyalty it seems like a win win for developers and the big game hosts like microsoft and steam. 
    The devs already use cloud services provided by companies like Amazon. They can buy those themselves whenever they think it's more efficient than running their own servers, and even a lot of the large devs like Epic, Ubisoft and Sony use Amazon's cloud services at least in some form.

    They don't need to have players running their servers to do that. And in fact when it's running on cloud it's often more effective to not have players running or modding the servers. The cloud isn't that effective tool for having 1000 people who run 1 000 differently modded server configurations. It's much more effective when you have 1 dev who can use it to run all 1 000 servers at once.
    tzervoGdemami
     
  • CuddleheartCuddleheart Member UncommonPosts: 341
    I hope the OP is right.  I have always been shocked that nobody had made an accessable MMO engine that allowed people to create their own games.  I mean the possibilities with asset stores and server hosting would be a great revenue source.  Look at rpg maker.  Ive seen small scale attempts at this like Eclipse and Intersect engines, but nothing with resources behind it.  I donated to shards online because I thought that was what it was going to be.
  • SandmanjwSandmanjw Member RarePosts: 388
    Kind of here now and not. What the emulators all do now. Keep games going on private servers for small groups.

    But the future of MMO's, I think will look just like we have now for the foreseeable future.  Until the tech is there for something that will really change how we play games.
  • MendelMendel Member EpicPosts: 4,478
    I hope the OP is right.  I have always been shocked that nobody had made an accessable MMO engine that allowed people to create their own games.  I mean the possibilities with asset stores and server hosting would be a great revenue source.  Look at rpg maker.  Ive seen small scale attempts at this like Eclipse and Intersect engines, but nothing with resources behind it.  I donated to shards online because I thought that was what it was going to be.

    The problem with buying an engine is that the engine determines how everything works.  If you want a Ultima VI style slot-less bag, and the engine supports bags with slots, you're limited.  If you want detailed character models and the engine only supports WoW level models, you're limited.  If you only want to build a WoW clone using the art assets that come with the engine or are readily available, you're good.

    An engine is a decision that determines what you can build on it.



    Gdemami

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • CuddleheartCuddleheart Member UncommonPosts: 341
    Mendel said:
    I hope the OP is right.  I have always been shocked that nobody had made an accessable MMO engine that allowed people to create their own games.  I mean the possibilities with asset stores and server hosting would be a great revenue source.  Look at rpg maker.  Ive seen small scale attempts at this like Eclipse and Intersect engines, but nothing with resources behind it.  I donated to shards online because I thought that was what it was going to be.

    The problem with buying an engine is that the engine determines how everything works.  If you want a Ultima VI style slot-less bag, and the engine supports bags with slots, you're limited.  If you want detailed character models and the engine only supports WoW level models, you're limited.  If you only want to build a WoW clone using the art assets that come with the engine or are readily available, you're good.

    An engine is a decision that determines what you can build on it.



    Sure.  This is generally the case with any pre-made game creation tool.  It still never ceases to amaze me what people will come up with...

    Things like the MOBA and BR genres were created by visionary people within the confines of another game engine.
    tzervo
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,727
    edited May 3
    The worst idea yet !!!

    Put the burden of populations in ONE PERSONS HANDS. 

    Who will pay the bills ?.... Will this player always pay the bill ?
    How does he charge others, paypal ?
    How will he advertise to get 1,000 players to join his server ?
    How does he prove his server is reliable to strangers ?
    Is he reliable ?
    How does he deal with one or more assholes ?
    When the population drops, how does he re-advertise ?
    How does he distribute his code ?
    Can other people keep the code a secret ?
    Many large populations play tricks on payments
    What incentive would the renter have to do this ?

    Best you can hope for is 10/20 good friends.


    For the OP... Think before making a topic !





    Arglebargle
  • RungarRungar Member RarePosts: 473
    The worst idea yet !!!

    Put the burden of populations in ONE PERSONS HANDS. 

    Who will pay the bills ?.... Will this player always pay the bill ?
    How does he charge, paypal ?
    How will he advertise to get 1,000 players to join his server ?
    How does he prove his server is reliable to strangers ?
    How does he deal with one or more assholes ?
    When the population drops, how does he re-advertise ?
    How does he distribute his code ?
    Can other people keep the code a secret ?

    For the OP... Think before making a topic !





    i guess what i'm trying to say is that mmos don't really have a much of a future, based on current development. Smaller and easier to develop ( with better features) multiplayer games ~200 players does. 

    All that's required to go in this direction is a large "storefront" company like microsoft or steam to provide automated hosting services and a company like unity to improve their network handling a bit. 

    Im not saying I necessarily like that but mmos have stagnated and failed. The lack of real development is proof of this. They have gone into the abyss way ahead of the rest of us. 




    Champie
    .33 of a second to midnight
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,727
    Rungar said:
    The worst idea yet !!!

    Put the burden of populations in ONE PERSONS HANDS. 

    Who will pay the bills ?.... Will this player always pay the bill ?
    How does he charge, paypal ?
    How will he advertise to get 1,000 players to join his server ?
    How does he prove his server is reliable to strangers ?
    How does he deal with one or more assholes ?
    When the population drops, how does he re-advertise ?
    How does he distribute his code ?
    Can other people keep the code a secret ?

    For the OP... Think before making a topic !







    All that's required to go in this direction is a large "storefront" company like microsoft or steam to provide automated hosting services and a company like unity to improve their network handling a bit. 

     




    You just made the topic worst !

    Large "storefront" company ?
    Is this not the same as non rental servers.... Same as it had always been ?  You just went full circle and beck to original server design. 



    Even more worst..... Introducing another 3rd party to get involved (Microsoft and Steam), to complicate even more..... The logistics would be amazingly hard, not to mention the un-needed cost.  
    Champie
  • RungarRungar Member RarePosts: 473
    right now on steam i have a messenger, voice chat, all my games automatically update as needed and i can easily connect to games with other people on steam or even watch their games. 

    its only a matter of time before they add server space to this platform.  All you'll have to do is "start/restart" if you have the game and space rented. Its just a way to make smaller games persistent without all the hassles for the player. 
     
    There is big money in this so it will be done. 
    GdemamiChampie
    .33 of a second to midnight
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,727
    Rungar said:
    right now on steam i have a messenger, voice chat, all my games automatically update as needed and i can easily connect to games with other people on steam or even watch their games. 

    its only a matter of time before they add server space to this platform.  All you'll have to do is "start/restart" if you have the game and space rented. Its just a way to make smaller games persistent without all the hassles for the player. 
     
    There is big money in this so it will be done. 
    So you use the word "rental" as in a person or individual is paying for it. 

    You would expect Steam or other major company to be a go-between for this RENTAL PERSON and other players, and expect steam to coordinate all these efforts and manage every anomaly involved with it.

    Add that every individual game would have it's own non-standard way of providing servers, and steam will tailor their services to cater to each game ?


    Again,
    Who will pay steam for this service ?  
    Will they sign a contract so they don't back out of this service. 


    Their are a million holes in this idea.... AND FOR WHAT ?.... How does this benefit anyone ? 
    ChampieMendel
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