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Mortal Online 2 Is Aiming To Break A World Record In Next Beta Test | MMORPG.com

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  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,704
    Sovrath said:
    jitter77 said:
    I logged in for about 2mins, had flashing textures and horrible frame rates. I set everything to min made 0 difference. I then checked recommend settings which set alot of stuff to high and i got around 30fps. I walked down a road and was like meh and shut it down. Just didn't seem very exciting to me
    Yeah, there's no content outside the cities... they should have called it a alpha combat.

    When you log in it says "alpha combat" at the bottom.

    This should't have been called beta test. Not sure where the confusion was.
    This is beta test. If it still says Alpha somewhere that's outdated info, because they have officially transitioned into beta.
     
  • Mars_OMGMars_OMG Member EpicPosts: 3,046
    edited November 2020
    crashed for me, every time :|
    - abandoning social media could possibly save the world.  

  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,704
    Result of their world record attempt:

    They sent out 40 000 keys, about 20 000 entered to the game during first day, and they peaked at about 2 000 players.

    Source: https://www.mortalonline2.com/stress-test-day-1-report/


    Between the lines you can read that a huge number of players entered the game (20 000 during a single day), but most of the must have quit just as quickly because they didn't get more than 2 000 online at once.
    KyleranGdemami
     
  • RaagnarzRaagnarz Member UncommonPosts: 316



    Raagnarz said:

    I'll be honest the first game was the biggest brokenest piece of trash I've ever tried. it was truly a bug ridden horrendous clusterfuck of a game. HOWEVER this game, if you enjoy pvp is shaping up to be something special. Its extremely well made and runs and plays better in beta than most launch games nowadays. I wrote this off completely due to the experience of the first one. My buddy said screw it and tried it. I laughed at him. Turns out he was right, they've done a 180 based on everything I've seen and tried based on the first one. Is it a game for everyone? Absolutely not. Its a game for the original UO people, the Shadowbane people. Its full loot and always on pvp so it is more of a niche game. Loot isn't important however and relatively easy to replace. The graphics and some of the tech they've implemented are astounding for a game that handles battles this size. I played Shadowbane back in the day and loved it. I've mostly checked out of PVP centric games since then but this based on what I've played will bring me back.


    What makes it well made?  From what I read, there aren’t even any creatures or AI in game.  What size battles?  Do those include siege engines and destruction of assets?

    What size battles.  The poster above said that even during this “record breaking” test he only saw 25 people at a time.  Are there videos showing massive battles?





    I've been in on about 50 or 60 vs's 50 or 60. Right now there are I think 6 starting towns. So the population is divided. Their approach to alpha/beta whatever phase they are in has been, "sectional" is the best way I can describe it. They target tests for very specific things. They have done specific tests for PVP, PVE, NPC interacting, Magic, Melee etc. They pull out everything but what they want to target in their test gather the data on the specifics then fix it and re-add it in. Its a very interesting way of doing it as when that section test is done they then focus on a different section to test while they correct the issues from the previous section. Then stuff gets added back in. Right now its just how many people can be on the screen fighting each other. Its not a full game at the same time currently however. Its very much log in and test what they want tested. But I had over 100 people fighting on my old pc (new one coming next week) that has an old GTX 1070 in it and 16m ram was running at 143 frames a second with that many people fighting on screen. The game looks amazing and runs exceedingly well thus far. Like I said though its probably not a game for everyone its niche to say the least. Its a shadowbane style game. What shocked me though is it was rampant ganking, unless your weapon was drawn people more or less just passed you by to fight someone who "looked' like they wanted a fight. Also their positional in game voice chat means you can tell where someone is and people can speak in the game in the local environment. For instance 2 people can be on voice chat talking in a house. They get louder the closer I get to the house. I can tell when someone is speaking to my right or left. It feels very much like it has the potential to be a real virtual world.
    Kyleran
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 29,219
    Vrika said:
    Result of their world record attempt:

    They sent out 40 000 keys, about 20 000 entered to the game during first day, and they peaked at about 2 000 players.

    Source: https://www.mortalonline2.com/stress-test-day-1-report/


    Between the lines you can read that a huge number of players entered the game (20 000 during a single day), but most of the must have quit just as quickly because they didn't get more than 2 000 online at once.

    I think part of the issue is that, unless I'm mistaken, they said "come on in and test!" but never gave a time frame when people should, there wasn't really enough in there to keep people invested, the game did crash for me and when I tried to get back in I was told that my character was still in the game world so if that happened to others they may have said, "screw it."

    Still, they have some info so that's good.

    It's not a bad looking world and the music is beautiful

    This could be "something" if they can finish it.
    Kyleran
  • Kuroi_TaigaKuroi_Taiga Member UncommonPosts: 29
    Mars_OMG said:
    crashed for me, every time :|

    which error?

    i have a 10y old pc and i can run it even tho at 35fps in towns
    alkarionlog
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,561
    Mars_OMG said:
    crashed for me, every time :|

    which error?

    i have a 10y old pc and i can run it even tho at 35fps in towns
    Curious.  Are you running a NVidia 580?  And an Intel Core 980 or something?

    Impressive if you get 35fps with equipment like that, but let’s just say I’m skeptical.

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,561
    edited November 2020
    For those who are curious or are saying “It’s only Alpha”.  Heinrich the head developer said he expects the game to launch by the end of the year.  He said this in Discord and it’s also on their website.

    So this puppy is headed straight off the same cliff that MO1 did.


    Post edited by Slapshot1188 on
    YashaX

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 37,027
    edited November 2020
    For those who are curious or are saying “It’s only Alpha”.  Heinrich the head developer said he expects the game to launch by the end of the year.  He said this in Discord last week and it’s also on their website.

    So this puppy is headed straight off the same cliff that MO1 did.


    Ten years ago (or whenever) the first game was developed players expected them to "launch" before paying much for them.

    Heinrich should know by now he can do early access, pay for beta, or maybe even sell a few space ships to start bringing in the cash with nary a promised release date in sight.

    Clearly he is still doing everything wrong, including the monetization model.

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 29,219
    For those who are curious or are saying “It’s only Alpha”.  Heinrich the head developer said he expects the game to launch by the end of the year.  He said this in Discord last week and it’s also on their website.

    So this puppy is headed straight off the same cliff that MO1 did.



    Oh I'm sure it's only alpha. But I'm betting it probably releases "in beta."

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,561
    Kyleran said:
    For those who are curious or are saying “It’s only Alpha”.  Heinrich the head developer said he expects the game to launch by the end of the year.  He said this in Discord last week and it’s also on their website.

    So this puppy is headed straight off the same cliff that MO1 did.


    Ten years ago (or whenever) the first game was developed players expected them to "launch" before paying much for them.

    Heinrich should know by now he can do early access, pay for beta, or maybe even sell a few space ships to start bringing in the cash with nary a promised release date in sight.

    Clearly he is still doing everything wrong, including the monetization model.
     No. I will have to say that while I believe he is utterly inept and equally arrogant, he to the best of my knowledge he’s not a scammer.

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • TwistedSister77TwistedSister77 Member RarePosts: 487
    edited November 2020
    This game should not release anywhere near current state, there is almost nothing to do.  The map is empty (besides a few deer near the cities).

    The combat is much to be desired (being nice).

    Ultima Online orginal was my first MMORPG... I was baptistized in sandbox FFA pvp... but darn, you need some content like UO had.


    Sovrath
  • TwistedSister77TwistedSister77 Member RarePosts: 487
    edited November 2020
    It also doesn't surprise me that a screen can handle a bunch of players... there are very basic rpg calculations going on and almost zero particle effects (no casters, no real AOE hits, basic character stats, no explosions, nothing that would stress the systems).
  • Mars_OMGMars_OMG Member EpicPosts: 3,046
    Mars_OMG said:
    crashed for me, every time :|

    which error?

    i have a 10y old pc and i can run it even tho at 35fps in towns
    no error was a ctd.
    event viewer : "The application-specific permission settings do not grant Local Activation permission for the COM Server application with CLSID"
    - abandoning social media could possibly save the world.  

  • immolatuzimmolatuz Member UncommonPosts: 14
    Tried it, uninstalled it. Just not my style. But might be for someone else.
  • PsyckedPsycked Member UncommonPosts: 92
    edited November 2020
    You can tell by the comments there's a lot of salty dudes that were disappointed in the first game. Sure, why not? On paper and up till launch it looked/sounded very promising.... Until it launched. For us hardcore folks there was this or Darkfall so I know there was a lot of disappointment going around at this time =)

    Well at least the developer had the balls to admit they bit off more than they could chew. With that harsh reality check you HOPE they gained valuable experience over the years to put into their new product.

    Like many I was a bit disappointed in MO on how unfinished and rough it was. Am I skeptical of MO2? Probably not. Why? Simple, I'm not the one making it or am I sitting here drooling over it's final release.

    Optimistically we hope these guys take all of what they learned over the 10+ years of MO and put that experience to good use, and pull off what they originally set out to all those years ago. Only time will tell. No use wasting time how good or bad it is now when it's not even out.

    One last thing I'll add. Over the years so many developers have made "cash grab" games or put out marketing schemes to pull in quick revenue, we all know this. Are people going to sit here and say the same for this developer? Oh I'm sure; some comments already say it. I will throw my opinion in the mix here that I find it a little silly to think these guys are just here for a quick cash grab. Why? Well it is VERY obvious hardcore games are only for a very small group of players. Seems real silly to put all this effort into trying to generate quick revenue from what is already a small community of players.

    I am the Cannon Fodder God

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,561
    edited November 2020
    Psycked said:
    You can tell by the comments there's a lot of salty dudes that were disappointed in the first game. Sure, why not? On paper and up till launch it looked/sounded very promising.... Until it launched. For us hardcore folks there was this or Darkfall so I know there was a lot of disappointment going around at this time =)

    Well at least the developer had the balls to admit they bit off more than they could chew. With that harsh reality check you HOPE they gained valuable experience over the years to put into their new product.

    Like many I was a bit disappointed in MO on how unfinished and rough it was. Am I skeptical of MO2? Probably not. Why? Simple, I'm not the one making it or am I sitting here drooling over it's final release.

    Optimistically we hope these guys take all of what they learned over the 10+ years of MO and put that experience to good use, and pull off what they originally set out to all those years ago. Only time will tell. No use wasting time how good or bad it is now when it's not even out.

    One last thing I'll add. Over the years so many developers have made "cash grab" games or put out marketing schemes to pull in quick revenue, we all know this. Are people going to sit here and say the same for this developer? Oh I'm sure; some comments already say it. I will throw my opinion in the mix here that I find it a little silly to think these guys are just here for a quick cash grab. Why? Well it is VERY obvious hardcore games are only for a very small group of players. Seems real silly to put all this effort into trying to generate quick revenue from what is already a small community of players.
    I largely agree with you.  It’s not a traditional cash grab.  It is however a publicly traded company and Heinrich is probably still the holder of the most shares.  Events like this “World Record” IMHO are squarely aimed at getting investors to bump up the stock price. 


    I’m pretty sure their public financial statements show a loss quarter after quarter that he just funds by diluting stock and selling more.  Could be wrong but anyone can go and look as it’s a public company 

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • ReizlaReizla Member RarePosts: 4,091
    edited November 2020


    40,000 keys... I think the goal is 5,000 concurrent 1 server.  Is my math off here?  

    Either they have more servers, or queues are going to be a bitch.

    I'm going to try.





    Only 5K to aim for?

    Lineage II in their prime (subscription) days hit that every other weekend during the castle sieges easily. If I am correct at one time NCWest upped the cap to 7.5K with the launch of the EU servers.

    Having that said - WHO in their right mind would even want to play Mortal online 2 after what the dev have pulled off for the last decade? Players have been screwed over in every way possible.

    ...on the other hand...
    They MIGHT hit the record if NONE has been recorded so far, making that one lonely player on the beta server the record holder?
  • ReizlaReizla Member RarePosts: 4,091


    I doubt they will beat Eve Online. I actually doubt they will beat anything except in their minds. Their game is just another gank fest like the first one.



    EVE online's 55K+ record is not one server but a cluster of servers. Still, those were some pretty impressive numbers they had
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 29,219
    Vrika said:
    Sovrath said:
    jitter77 said:
    I logged in for about 2mins, had flashing textures and horrible frame rates. I set everything to min made 0 difference. I then checked recommend settings which set alot of stuff to high and i got around 30fps. I walked down a road and was like meh and shut it down. Just didn't seem very exciting to me
    Yeah, there's no content outside the cities... they should have called it a alpha combat.

    When you log in it says "alpha combat" at the bottom.

    This should't have been called beta test. Not sure where the confusion was.
    This is beta test. If it still says Alpha somewhere that's outdated info, because they have officially transitioned into beta.

    This can't be a beta.

    Beta means "feature complete." This can't be feature complete.
  • PsyckedPsycked Member UncommonPosts: 92
    edited November 2020
    I largely agree with you.  It’s not a traditional cash grab.  It is however a publicly traded company and Heinrich is probably still the holder of the most shares.  Events like this “World Record” IMHO are squarely aimed at getting investors to bump up the stock price. 


    I’m pretty sure their public financial statements show a loss quarter after quarter that he just funds by diluting stock and selling more.  Could be wrong but anyone can go and look as it’s a public company 

    Agree'd Slapshot1188 putting aside the mentality of "cash grab" This is a business and like any business they need revenue to operate. I was on the twitch event Friday and Henrik was the host and he did make mention of being CEO. So I understand he needs to find ways to still bring in revenue to fund the game. 

    This got me wondering if this game is being privately funded or through a publisher. We all know how both ways can go. Privately funded can run out of money and far far far under deliver. While a publisher can push their own agenda on the game and end up ruining it. All will be reveled in time =) 

    Like you mentioned a quick search and right from their company page does actually show Henrik is not the majority owner. Interesting:

    Largest owners

    FRÅN HOLDINGS**

    NamnKapital %Röster %Datum
    William N. Nock7,926,822018-12-31
    Avanza Pension7,146,782020-03-31
    Nordnet Pensionsförsäkring6,606,272020-03-31
    Henrik Wydeen Nyström4,058,902019-05-10
    Joakim Heving2,872,732020-03-31
    Safet Memisahovic1,671,582020-03-31
    Jan Griffin1,621,542020-03-31
    Aktiebolaget Lutea1,381,312020-03-31
    Thomas Svanefalk1,211,152020-03-31
    Megetgod Invest Aps1,131,072020-03-31
     

    I am the Cannon Fodder God

  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,704
    Psycked said:
    You can tell by the comments there's a lot of salty dudes that were disappointed in the first game. Sure, why not? On paper and up till launch it looked/sounded very promising.... Until it launched. For us hardcore folks there was this or Darkfall so I know there was a lot of disappointment going around at this time =)

    Well at least the developer had the balls to admit they bit off more than they could chew. With that harsh reality check you HOPE they gained valuable experience over the years to put into their new product.

    Like many I was a bit disappointed in MO on how unfinished and rough it was. Am I skeptical of MO2? Probably not. Why? Simple, I'm not the one making it or am I sitting here drooling over it's final release.

    Optimistically we hope these guys take all of what they learned over the 10+ years of MO and put that experience to good use, and pull off what they originally set out to all those years ago. Only time will tell. No use wasting time how good or bad it is now when it's not even out.

    One last thing I'll add. Over the years so many developers have made "cash grab" games or put out marketing schemes to pull in quick revenue, we all know this. Are people going to sit here and say the same for this developer? Oh I'm sure; some comments already say it. I will throw my opinion in the mix here that I find it a little silly to think these guys are just here for a quick cash grab. Why? Well it is VERY obvious hardcore games are only for a very small group of players. Seems real silly to put all this effort into trying to generate quick revenue from what is already a small community of players.
    They call Mortal Online 2 at its current state a beta, and their FAQ states they're planning to launch by the end of this year.

    So even if we ignore problems with Mortal Online 1, at this point we should be realistic and call them out for releasing unfinished trash.
     
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,561
    Psycked said:

    I largely agree with you.  It’s not a traditional cash grab.  It is however a publicly traded company and Heinrich is probably still the holder of the most shares.  Events like this “World Record” IMHO are squarely aimed at getting investors to bump up the stock price. 


    I’m pretty sure their public financial statements show a loss quarter after quarter that he just funds by diluting stock and selling more.  Could be wrong but anyone can go and look as it’s a public company 

    Agree'd Slapshot1188 putting aside the mentality of "cash grab" This is a business and like any business they need revenue to operate. I was on the twitch event Friday and Henrik was the host and he did make mention of being CEO. So I understand he needs to find ways to still bring in revenue to fund the game. 

    This got me wondering if this game is being privately funded or through a publisher. We all know how both ways can go. Privately funded can run out of money and far far far under deliver. While a publisher can push their own agenda on the game and end up ruining it. All will be reveled in time =) 

    Like you mentioned a quick search and right from their company page does actually show Henrik is not the majority owner. Interesting:

    Largest owners

    FRÅN HOLDINGS**

    NamnKapital %Röster %Datum
    William N. Nock7,926,822018-12-31
    Avanza Pension7,146,782020-03-31
    Nordnet Pensionsförsäkring6,606,272020-03-31
    Henrik Wydeen Nyström4,058,902019-05-10
    Joakim Heving2,872,732020-03-31
    Safet Memisahovic1,671,582020-03-31
    Jan Griffin1,621,542020-03-31
    Aktiebolaget Lutea1,381,312020-03-31
    Thomas Svanefalk1,211,152020-03-31
    Megetgod Invest Aps1,131,072020-03-31
     
    There used to be class A and class  B stock if I recall correctly.  And At the time (years ago) Heinrich had most of the voting power.   But maybe he diluted himself down by now.

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,704
    Psycked said:

    I largely agree with you.  It’s not a traditional cash grab.  It is however a publicly traded company and Heinrich is probably still the holder of the most shares.  Events like this “World Record” IMHO are squarely aimed at getting investors to bump up the stock price. 


    I’m pretty sure their public financial statements show a loss quarter after quarter that he just funds by diluting stock and selling more.  Could be wrong but anyone can go and look as it’s a public company 

    Agree'd Slapshot1188 putting aside the mentality of "cash grab" This is a business and like any business they need revenue to operate. I was on the twitch event Friday and Henrik was the host and he did make mention of being CEO. So I understand he needs to find ways to still bring in revenue to fund the game. 

    This got me wondering if this game is being privately funded or through a publisher. We all know how both ways can go. Privately funded can run out of money and far far far under deliver. While a publisher can push their own agenda on the game and end up ruining it. All will be reveled in time =) 

    Like you mentioned a quick search and right from their company page does actually show Henrik is not the majority owner. Interesting:

    Largest owners

    FRÅN HOLDINGS**

    NamnKapital %Röster %Datum
    William N. Nock7,926,822018-12-31
    Avanza Pension7,146,782020-03-31
    Nordnet Pensionsförsäkring6,606,272020-03-31
    Henrik Wydeen Nyström4,058,902019-05-10
    Joakim Heving2,872,732020-03-31
    Safet Memisahovic1,671,582020-03-31
    Jan Griffin1,621,542020-03-31
    Aktiebolaget Lutea1,381,312020-03-31
    Thomas Svanefalk1,211,152020-03-31
    Megetgod Invest Aps1,131,072020-03-31
     
    There used to be class A and class  B stock if I recall correctly.  And At the time (years ago) Heinrich had most of the voting power.   But maybe he diluted himself down by now.
    Based on latest yearly report there still are A and B shares. Each A share gives 10 times as many votes as B share, and Henrik is the only one who owns them.

    But that still gives him only 8,90% of votes. Psycked's chart is correct.

    Source: https://news.cision.com/se/star-vault/r/arsredovisning-star-vault-ab--publ---org-nr-556709-1169--rakenskapsaret-2019,c3125281
     
  • oldspice24oldspice24 Newbie CommonPosts: 8
    For those who are curious or are saying “It’s only Alpha”.  Heinrich the head developer said he expects the game to launch by the end of the year.  He said this in Discord and it’s also on their website.

    So this puppy is headed straight off the same cliff that MO1 did.


    Aktchually, the game is in Open Beta phase.  That's why all those keys got sent out. Still, Heinrich and his team worked hard on this game for the past 6-7 months and I'm proud to be one of the few paying 45 dollars for it, and 15/month after.
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