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Blizzard killed WOW

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  • CuddleheartCuddleheart Member UncommonPosts: 189
    I really like LOTRO's gameplay and world.  I also really like my kins and tribes and people I've met.  That said, I really can't see the fantastic community that I hear everyone rave about.  LOTRO World chat is like reading a BBS board from the 90s.  Just people waiting around to one-up each other and correct their grammar...

    I can't play at all with world chat on without logging out in minutes.
  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,461
    WoW is definitely dead...


    xpsyncAsheramNanfoodletzervoKyleran
    "The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn in Star Wars.
    After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that neither does the ability to write.
    CPU: Intel Core I7 9700k (4.90ghz) - GPU: ASUS Dual GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER EVO 8GB DDR6 - RAM: 32GB Kingston HyperX Predator DDR4 3000 - Motherboard: Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Ultra - PSU: Antec TruePower New 750W - Storage: Kingston KC1000 NVMe 960gb SSD and 2x1TB WD Velociraptor HDDs (Raid 0) - Main display: Samsung U32J590 32" 4K monitor - Second display: Philips 273v 27" monitor - VR: Pimax 8K headset - Sound: Sony STR-DH550 AV Receiver HDMI linked with the GPU and the TV, with Jamo S 426 HS 3 5.0 speakers and Pioneer S-21W subwoofer - OS: Windows 10 Pro 64 bits.


  • xpsyncxpsync Member RarePosts: 1,563
    WoW is definitely dead...



    I feel most people can not grasp just how popular, i mean even i forgot while i'm off on a swg or retail run, and then pop back into classic and say to myself WHOLLY F'ing SHIT this game is popular.

    Everyone got so used to "(insert game here) releases and a month later the locust feeding frenzy is over" A year later still as popular af.
    There are two ways of arguing with a woman, and neither one works. - John Marston

    Currently Playing; SWG:Legends, Wow r/c, DoS2
  • JeroKaneJeroKane Member EpicPosts: 6,440
    Tokken said:
    You need to find a guild that talks.  Try different guilds, it's not that hard. Some guilds are better than others......  I prefer the family guilds that are not concerned about gear scores.
    Exactly. I am in such a guild and there is plenty of chatter every single day. Nothing has changed.


  • JeroKaneJeroKane Member EpicPosts: 6,440
    Rhoklaw said:
    When I play WoW these days, it is a very lonely experience.  I have a couple of characters in different guilds for the guild perks, and that's about it.  No one in the guilds even talks.

    If I want socialization in an MMO, I play LOTRO and chat with my friends or kin, or on world chat, or go to a concert or party.

    I couldn't agree more, when it comes to community, LOTRO has THEE BEST community out there, hands down. Is it because of the IP? Does the game itself promote a good community? World aesthetics? music? the fact players can create their own music? Who knows, but whatever it is, it works and it works damn well.
    I think it's a combination of just good-natured people being attracted to the IP, and that it seems to be an older, more mature group of players.
    Yeah that is what I always liked about LOTRO and kept me coming back.
    But the gameplay is such garbage these days, that a good community alone can't convince me to come back anymore. I have tried time and again, but gave up after few days. Since the Isengard expansion everything went quickly downhill from there with each expansion release.
    Rohan expac was ok, but then it quickly followed by one of the worst expacs, Helmsdeep. That's the time I threw the towel in the ring and quit.
  • k61977k61977 Member RarePosts: 1,336
    Wizardry said:
    Here is a question i doubt any Wow fanbois could answer.
    What exactly were you doing in Wow that made it so good before as both a MMO and a RPG that it is not doing now?

    So far i have seen the mention of "community'"talking".Fair enough,a community does matter and talking in a MMO does matter.However i would argue the game never did either of those  very well before.

    There is little reasoning for millions of players to all start spamming world chat with "listen to me topics".So you have a better platform for that and it is the guild.You learn and grow together as a guild,they become your friends,did something change there?Perhaps the problem is that it was never a good guild structure?

    "community"again this leans more towards your guild,th small community that you might actually interact with most everyday.No different than how we operate in real life.

    So where has any of this changed within Wow?You see my argument all along is that Wow was NEVER a good MMO nor a good rpg.So there never was a good game to ruin,it is the SAME game.I actually feel that at this point it is too late for the game to make meaningful change because nobody cares about 1-90 anymore,nobody cares about 95% of the game anymore.





    When you actually had to work together to do things it was a good game and rpg.  At the beginning you had to use CC as an example to run anything that was group related.  If you didn't sap that guard, or freeze trap one then you wiped.  It took groups knowing what to do with their individual classes that made it a good game and rpg.  When they just made everything an AOE fest all need for any communication stopped.  I would have loved to see the modern players do a full BRD run without any of the things they have now.  That instance alone took hours to complete.  Classic isn't even close to the original experience. 

    When having different skills for different things actually had a purpose, that made it a decent rpg.  You played a distinct class with skills that only your class could do.  When they removed the entire idea and made all classes everything it destroyed the rpg part of the game in reality.

    The difference now is that a persons time is more important than the game, so that is what they go with.  People don't have hours to do things now, everyone is always online and have other things to do.  Being more connected in the world actually made the world a lonelier place in reality because everyone's time is so spread out that no one has time for anything.  So it is hop on do a 10 min thing and move on to whatever else you have to get done.  This isn't necessarily all bad but it changes the entire dynamic of the game.
  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Member EpicPosts: 4,848
    edited September 2020
    I really like LOTRO's gameplay and world.  I also really like my kins and tribes and people I've met.  That said, I really can't see the fantastic community that I hear everyone rave about.  LOTRO World chat is like reading a BBS board from the 90s.  Just people waiting around to one-up each other and correct their grammar...

    I can't play at all with world chat on without logging out in minutes.

    F2P changed it drastically.  But it still has a pretty solid community overall.  You are just seeing the vocal minority at times.
  • Cybersig211Cybersig211 Member UncommonPosts: 145
    edited November 2020
    xpsync said:
    WoW is definitely dead...



    I feel most people can not grasp just how popular, i mean even i forgot while i'm off on a swg or retail run, and then pop back into classic and say to myself WHOLLY F'ing SHIT this game is popular.

    Everyone got so used to "(insert game here) releases and a month later the locust feeding frenzy is over" A year later still as popular af.

    For all the hate this game got over the years for its look and "approach" to mmorpgs.  It always was and continues to be the most active mmorpg by a long shot.

    I actually regret my time here in the past lol'ing at wow and playing countless mmorpgs that failed.

    As interesting as FFXIV is, and how nice ESO is for its story.  Nothing is even close to how huge and how much content, and items that wow has.

    It may have peaked long ago but the game is in another world vs others, even before the new xpac at the end days of a much hated xpac.  Its the only place left where you can get the old days mmorpg feel community being all over the place included.

    So for what its worth, you really cant get the same experience anywhere.  Keeps the old mmorpg feel that FFXIV and ESO lack.
    GregorMcgregorKyleran
  • TokkenTokken Member RarePosts: 2,582
    They took the reason to chat (outside of trivial town chat) out of the game. Heck even guilds don't talk much anymore.
    They took the reason to talk to group members out of the game.
    They took the reason to group (outside of instances) out of the game.
    They took the reason to play carefully out of the game (death has no sting).
    They took the reason to explore and the mystery out of the game with icons, mini-map, etc...

    They took the heart out of the game.

    The game is boring. Nothing matters. No one cares.

    Blizzard did this.
    People keep saying this but there are millions that still care about the game,  Wow is very much STILL ALIVE! LOL
    tzervoGregorMcgregor
    Make PvE GREAT Again!
  • remsleepremsleep Member EpicPosts: 1,718
    Tokken said:
    They took the reason to chat (outside of trivial town chat) out of the game. Heck even guilds don't talk much anymore.
    They took the reason to talk to group members out of the game.
    They took the reason to group (outside of instances) out of the game.
    They took the reason to play carefully out of the game (death has no sting).
    They took the reason to explore and the mystery out of the game with icons, mini-map, etc...

    They took the heart out of the game.

    The game is boring. Nothing matters. No one cares.

    Blizzard did this.
    People keep saying this but there are millions that still care about the game,  Wow is very much STILL ALIVE! LOL
    While it is very much alive- we can't confirm the millions claim.
  • TheocritusTheocritus Member EpicPosts: 7,862
    I don't necessarily agree with your reasons, but yeah they started killing it by trying to please everyone and also by manufacturing chores for people to do to keep them subbed.  People used to sub because they had fun.

    There are many here that think subs are the greatest thing to ever happen in gaming.....To me this is why I despise them.....They build games like this just to keep that income coming in...it doesn't make it a better game, it makes it a time and money sink.
    Palebane
  • kitaradkitarad Member LegendaryPosts: 6,270
    I don't necessarily agree with your reasons, but yeah they started killing it by trying to please everyone and also by manufacturing chores for people to do to keep them subbed.  People used to sub because they had fun.

    There are many here that think subs are the greatest thing to ever happen in gaming.....To me this is why I despise them.....They build games like this just to keep that income coming in...it doesn't make it a better game, it makes it a time and money sink.
    Oh how I wish we could go back to subs instead of this misbegotten F2P shit we have today. No, subs were more honest and never had you spend money just so you can have a chance at upgrading you gear with the hidden 3% chance and oh my goodness you can increase that to 10% every time you get a cash shop item. Please give me back subscriptions every day and twice on Sundays.
    tzervoGregorMcgregorIselinScotKyleran

  • GregorMcgregorGregorMcgregor Member UncommonPosts: 256
    I don't necessarily agree with your reasons, but yeah they started killing it by trying to please everyone and also by manufacturing chores for people to do to keep them subbed.  People used to sub because they had fun.

    There are many here that think subs are the greatest thing to ever happen in gaming.....To me this is why I despise them.....They build games like this just to keep that income coming in...it doesn't make it a better game, it makes it a time and money sink.

    I only like them (subs) because it tends to keep the asshats away because they either can't afford it or don't want to loose money once they are banned for being a ..well, a asshat! ;)
    Scot

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  • klash2defklash2def Member EpicPosts: 1,794
    It's funny that wow players love posting pictures of "population" after a major xpac release.. ofc people are playing right now... even fair-weather people just to see the new content but it does not reflect retention.

    Check back in 30 days lol 
    "Everything that happens is a political act, and the only people that get to pretend otherwise are those privileged enough to not have politics impact them at all." ~Taliesin

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  • SandmanjwSandmanjw Member UncommonPosts: 326
    edited December 2020
    klash2def said:
    It's funny that wow players love posting pictures of "population" after a major xpac release.. ofc people are playing right now... even fair-weather people just to see the new content but it does not reflect retention.

    Check back in 30 days lol 
    Does it matter what the pop is in 30-60 days if they make millions upon millions on the expac sales?

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/370010/world-of-warcraft-expansion-pack-sales/

    Oh ya, they are saying that this expac has outsold all the others in pre-sales so there ya go, still killing it on expac sales.

    The store sales (pets/mounts) and the subs are just gravy.... 
  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,461
    klash2def said:
    It's funny that wow players love posting pictures of "population" after a major xpac release.. ofc people are playing right now... even fair-weather people just to see the new content but it does not reflect retention.

    Check back in 30 days lol 

    Is funny that some people are unable to read the date of a post...
    Kyleran
    "The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn in Star Wars.
    After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that neither does the ability to write.
    CPU: Intel Core I7 9700k (4.90ghz) - GPU: ASUS Dual GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER EVO 8GB DDR6 - RAM: 32GB Kingston HyperX Predator DDR4 3000 - Motherboard: Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Ultra - PSU: Antec TruePower New 750W - Storage: Kingston KC1000 NVMe 960gb SSD and 2x1TB WD Velociraptor HDDs (Raid 0) - Main display: Samsung U32J590 32" 4K monitor - Second display: Philips 273v 27" monitor - VR: Pimax 8K headset - Sound: Sony STR-DH550 AV Receiver HDMI linked with the GPU and the TV, with Jamo S 426 HS 3 5.0 speakers and Pioneer S-21W subwoofer - OS: Windows 10 Pro 64 bits.


  • Mars_OMGMars_OMG Member EpicPosts: 3,039
    edited December 2020
    They took the reason to chat (outside of trivial town chat) out of the game. Heck even guilds don't talk much anymore.
    They took the reason to talk to group members out of the game.
    They took the reason to group (outside of instances) out of the game.
    They took the reason to play carefully out of the game (death has no sting).
    They took the reason to explore and the mystery out of the game with icons, mini-map, etc...

    They took the heart out of the game.

    The game is boring. Nothing matters. No one cares.

    Blizzard did this.
    3/5th of that discords fault.
    Kyleran
    - abandoning social media could possibly save the world.  

  • UngoodUngood Member EpicPosts: 4,830
    kitarad said:
    I don't necessarily agree with your reasons, but yeah they started killing it by trying to please everyone and also by manufacturing chores for people to do to keep them subbed.  People used to sub because they had fun.

    There are many here that think subs are the greatest thing to ever happen in gaming.....To me this is why I despise them.....They build games like this just to keep that income coming in...it doesn't make it a better game, it makes it a time and money sink.
    Oh how I wish we could go back to subs instead of this misbegotten F2P shit we have today. No, subs were more honest and never had you spend money just so you can have a chance at upgrading you gear with the hidden 3% chance and oh my goodness you can increase that to 10% every time you get a cash shop item. Please give me back subscriptions every day and twice on Sundays.
    I could do without horse-shit mechanics in games, but, of the games I have really enjoyed that were F2P, only one played that kind of BS on me, and that was Trove, and that did not kick in till well into the end game.

    Games like DDO, have a very honest Cash Shop, which is honestly where all MMO's should be.

    GW2 has those stupid Black Lion chests, but, those are purely cosmetic fluff, so it has no impact on my game play itself.

    However, given players themselves have been into RMT since UO and EQ regarding selling game items and even whole accounts for a profit, and thus have shown they are more than willing to make bank on a game, as such, I can't blame a game company for wanting to make bank on their own game directly.

    I mean.. really can you blame them?

    I just think they should take more direct and honest approaches about selling their product. Right now, a lot of games feel like I am walking into a rip off casino.

    The RNG bs they play, and what you said about gear, yah, that got me to finally quit Trove, and in BDO, that just kind of BS flat out killed the game for me, just shady crap like that, huge turn off.

    Make it honest, sell legit items, like a store, and people will buy stuff.

    Selling content honestly is the best way to do things, that is what a sub and Expansions were anyway, buying access to content. If they sell the game in DLC's or Piecemeal, same difference in my book, but, selling content also motivates them to make more content, so the game always expands, which is ideally the best for the players as well.
    Palebane
    Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 14,175
    Mars_OMG said:
    They took the reason to chat (outside of trivial town chat) out of the game. Heck even guilds don't talk much anymore.
    They took the reason to talk to group members out of the game.
    They took the reason to group (outside of instances) out of the game.
    They took the reason to play carefully out of the game (death has no sting).
    They took the reason to explore and the mystery out of the game with icons, mini-map, etc...

    They took the heart out of the game.

    The game is boring. Nothing matters. No one cares.

    Blizzard did this.
    3/5th of that discords fault.
    Primarily down to changing the game to suit solo players and then going down the "ever easier mode" route which had become design philosophy in wider gaming. But I too think Discord has had an effect, it has made text chat channels somewhat redundant. Indeed in my last guild in BDO the leadership wanted to change all guild chat to chat in Discord, but the guild was so against that it never happened.

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  • cheyanecheyane Member LegendaryPosts: 7,536
    edited December 2020
    klash2def said:
    It's funny that wow players love posting pictures of "population" after a major xpac release.. ofc people are playing right now... even fair-weather people just to see the new content but it does not reflect retention.

    Check back in 30 days lol 
    This is an old thread the image he showed was way before an expansion. During the launch of an expansion you get to stare at the launch queue instead.
    Jean-Luc_PicardKyleranScotUngood
    Chamber of Chains
  • PalebanePalebane Member RarePosts: 3,973
    edited December 2020
    They killed a lot more than WoW. They ruined the entire MMORPG genre as far as I’m concerned. WoW has never even been about Warcraft. It’s more like Diablo than Warcraft. It’s become Sheepcraft Online.

    Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.

  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Member EpicPosts: 4,848
    Rhoklaw said:
    When I play WoW these days, it is a very lonely experience.  I have a couple of characters in different guilds for the guild perks, and that's about it.  No one in the guilds even talks.

    If I want socialization in an MMO, I play LOTRO and chat with my friends or kin, or on world chat, or go to a concert or party.

    I couldn't agree more, when it comes to community, LOTRO has THEE BEST community out there, hands down. Is it because of the IP? Does the game itself promote a good community? World aesthetics? music? the fact players can create their own music? Who knows, but whatever it is, it works and it works damn well.
    Marvel Heroes had about the same type of community as LOTRO.  I think population size helps a lot as does the very casual nature of both games. 

    LOTRO probably smartly chose to prevent real time DPS meters that could be used to shame players.  I personally wish they had them, as a way to measure your improvement.  But I understand why they didn't.

    Both games were filled with fans of the IP and could talk endlessly about them.  F2P changed things in LOTRO for sure, but I'm sure there were kins and servers for those that wanted community over content.
  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Member EpicPosts: 4,848
    Blizzard has and always will care about one thing: money...as long as people are paying, they are selling.
    Not exactly true.  They used to use internal quality control for the most part.  Blizzard North helped put the kibosh on Warcraft Adventures, not because of money but because of quality.  It simply didn't make sense to put their name on a completely generic product at the time.

    Starcraft Ghost would have been pushed out if all they cared about was money.  Same for Project Titan.

    The ownership group who refused to give Blizzard North design autonomy was definitely the first blow to old Blizzard ways.  Activision's eventual takeover slowly seeped into blizzard products and strategy until the founders bowed out one by one.

    But yes, modern Blizzard is simply Activision with a puppet named J Allen Brack doing Activisions bidding.  Their most recent adventure is pissing off the Hearthstone players with their greed.
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 18,364
    edited December 2020
    Yes because seeing a million nameplates plastered on the screen gives great amazing visuals..lmao.It looks like absolute rubbish.Then again Blizzard never knew how to deliver a proper rpg from day 1.They might know how to make money and cater to non rpg gamers but how to make the game,not a chance in hell,they ruined Wow from day 1.

    One of the first things you do is sit down and think>>>immersion,well i guess Blizzard skipped over that part,let's just make it EASIER,stick all kinds of crap on the screen on maps and have auto warps to instances....sigh,no clue wtf they are doing except making money.

    Hint...news at 11,iDC one iota how much money they make,i only care about games.
    Palebane

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

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