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Interesting video from Mark Kern on why game developers don't listen to armchair developers.

2

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  • UtinniUtinni Member EpicPosts: 1,891
    The fact that this has to be said is pretty sad.
    AlBQuirkytzervoSovrath
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,167
    Amathe said:
    I guess me and my 6 legged rogue vampire idea will continue in anonymity.
    Make it also a Dragon and I'm in.
    AmatheAlBQuirkySovrath

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • cameltosiscameltosis Member EpicPosts: 2,534
    The route to becoming a game designer is just a bit shit right now.

    Like many here, I've often dreamed of being a game designer. I went to uni, got a degree in computer science and became a programmer. I've worked on massive projects (for a military contractor) as well as small ones, so I've a good idea of how software development goes.

    I even worked for a AAA games studio (though, only in QA) and got to speak to actual game designers, senior devs, senior artists etc to get their opinion and advice.

    The advice was not good.

    There appeared to be three routes to becoming a game designer:


    1) Be there at the start.
    By this, I mean that the majority of game designers were there in the 80s and 90s making games in their bedrooms with their mates. Either through skill or luck, their games took off, their businesses grew and they continued to design games.

    They're still there. That original breed of designers are still designing a lot of our games today. This makes it extremely difficult to get in on the action, and if you weren't there (I obviously wasnt) then tough luck.


    2) Be a specialist
    Be a programmer, an artist, an animator, an engine specialist. Whatever. Be a specialist and join a games studio. These careers do at least have a clear progression from beginner to lead. If you are good enough, you can work yourself to the top of that career ladder, which then starts getting you into meetings with the people calling the shots.

    Then, if you are lucky, you can start making design suggestions to the people making the decisions. If you are very lucky, they'll listen to you. If you are very, very lucky, you may be given the opportunity to join the design team.


    3) Build a game yourself
    Emulating the founders of the industry, design and build a game all by yourself. That way, you get to be the designer, and if your game is any good, then you'll have a business to run (or job offers from established companies).

    This route is, in my opinion, the hardest but most direct route to being a game designer. Building a game is extremely difficult (assuming u want to build something good). You need to be a designer. And a programmer. And an artist. And a modeller. And an animator. And a tester. And everythng else. And thats just the technical skills! You'll need to learn about human psychology, fashion, architecture and all that other stuff too.



    What the industry is missing is a clear career path to being a games designer. Everyone I've met who did a degree in games design said it was absolutely worthless as it bears no relation to the real world. There is no junior games designer, leading to middle, senior then lead designer.

    But there really should be. And if there was, I'd be applying for a job immediately :P
    BabuinixRhoklawdelete5230AlBQuirkyKyleranVermillion_RaventhalSovrath
  • RhoklawRhoklaw Member EpicPosts: 7,047
    Gdemami said:
    Rhoklaw said:
    To some perhaps.
    ....apparently not revealing to you, you just proudly keep yourself ignorant.
    Here's some advice @Gdemami... since 99% of your comments are either condescending or insulting when you're not LOLing everyone, perhaps it's best if you just stick to LOLing as it reveals less about your lack of knowing anything. I say that because if I didn't find the video interesting, I wouldn't have created a thread about it. Hell, even my pre video comment should have made it evident that I learned something from the video.

    With that being said, please feel free to see yourself out of the thread unless you can manage to actually find something relevant to comment on. I no longer care to sift through your bullshit anymore. Capisci?
    Gdemamidelete5230

  • RhoklawRhoklaw Member EpicPosts: 7,047
    achesoma said:
    It's kind of a generic "ideas are cheap" speech. He's not wrong but this can be applied to any field, not just gaming industry. The logistical ability to see projects to fruition is the challenging part.
    I think the game industry works a little different than say, what we might see on the TV show Shark Tank. Probably a lot easier to whip up a prototype of something versus making a playable game demo, but that's just my opinion.
    GdemamiAlBQuirky

  • TheocritusTheocritus Member EpicPosts: 7,577
    edited May 24
    I have played in a few betas where the devs did listen....and those games ended up bouncing around all over the place....The devs just have to make a decision and say that is the way it is going to be.......Even here, if we took a dozen different topics from death penalties to PVP or PVE, you'd get a hundred different responses from a hundred different people.
    RhoklawAlBQuirky
  • ChildoftheShadowsChildoftheShadows Member EpicPosts: 1,830
    I have played in a few betas where the devs did listen....and those games ended up bouncing around all over the place....The devs just have to make a decision and say that is the way it is going to be.......Even here, if we took a dozen different topics from death penalties to PVP or PVE, you'd get a hundred different responses from a hundred different people.
    The common scenario I see is a group agreeing they don't like x, but never agreeing on a solid solution. Then you get, "Why are you not listening?" ignoring the fact nothing suggested was universally liked.
    AlBQuirky
    "Wake up, It's RNG, there is no such thing as 'rare'"
    - Ungood
  • tzervotzervo Member RarePosts: 324
    The common scenario I see is a group agreeing they don't like x, but never agreeing on a solid solution. Then you get, "Why are you not listening?" ignoring the fact nothing suggested was universally liked.
    Liking or not liking an existing feature is real, useful information a studio can get from its playerbase though, given a well chosen sample. Everything else is hopes and dreams.
    AlBQuirky
  • ChildoftheShadowsChildoftheShadows Member EpicPosts: 1,830
    tzervo said:
    The common scenario I see is a group agreeing they don't like x, but never agreeing on a solid solution. Then you get, "Why are you not listening?" ignoring the fact nothing suggested was universally liked.
    Liking or not liking an existing feature is real, useful information a studio can get from its playerbase though, given a well chosen sample. Everything else is hopes and dreams.
    The focus was on a solution or change and could be applied to any idea in general.
    "Wake up, It's RNG, there is no such thing as 'rare'"
    - Ungood
  • PalaPala Member UncommonPosts: 313
    edited May 24
    Tried LOTRO recently, dear god, play it solo all the way and with your face resting on the keyboard. Now thats some genious game design.

    Tried GW2 for something different, 3 hours later I am still running from zone to zone killing everything on sight. 

    They should hire some paper designers, I cant tell the difference its all the same. 
    mmolou
  • ChildoftheShadowsChildoftheShadows Member EpicPosts: 1,830
    Pala said:
    Tried LOTRO recently, dear god, play it solo all the way and with your face resting on the keyboard. Now thats some genious game design.

    Tried GW2 for something different, 3 hours later I am still running from zone to zone killing everything on sight. 

    They should hire some paper designers, I cant tell the difference its all the same. 
    The market has spoken. 
    tzervo
    "Wake up, It's RNG, there is no such thing as 'rare'"
    - Ungood
  • Ancient_ExileAncient_Exile Member RarePosts: 1,303
    Seems like he's mainly addressing people who think they will be able to get into the game industry or make money by sharing their ideas.

    People who post their ideas on an internet forum probably aren't trying to make money.  Obviously, it's a public domain and it would be practically impossible to prove that anyone read your ideas and decided to use them in a game.
    IselinRhoklawAlBQuirky
    "If everything was easy, nothing would be hard."


    "Show me on the doll where PVP touched you."


    (Note:  If I type something in a thread that does not exactly pertain to the stated subject of the thread in every, way, shape, and form, please feel free to send me a response in a Private Message.)

  • RhoklawRhoklaw Member EpicPosts: 7,047
    Seems like he's mainly addressing people who think they will be able to get into the game industry or make money by sharing their ideas.

    People who post their ideas on an internet forum probably aren't trying to make money.  Obviously, it's a public domain and it would be practically impossible to prove that anyone read your ideas and decided to use them in a game.
    When your main focus as a game developer is how you can make the most money out of a game, you're no longer a game developer, you're a suit. There's a clear difference between making games because it's what you love to do versus those who make games simply to try and cash in.

    I'm a passionate gamer and I know I'd be a passionate developer. I'm not concerned about being rich and never will be. I just like the idea of making something fun that people enjoy. In fact, as simple as Minecraft is, it's still a masterpiece. It draws on the basic elements of what a game should be. Probably why Microsoft paid $2.5 billion for it.
    Ancient_ExileAlBQuirky

  • AAAMEOWAAAMEOW Member RarePosts: 1,346
    Rhoklaw said:
    Seems like he's mainly addressing people who think they will be able to get into the game industry or make money by sharing their ideas.

    People who post their ideas on an internet forum probably aren't trying to make money.  Obviously, it's a public domain and it would be practically impossible to prove that anyone read your ideas and decided to use them in a game.
    When your main focus as a game developer is how you can make the most money out of a game, you're no longer a game developer, you're a suit. There's a clear difference between making games because it's what you love to do versus those who make games simply to try and cash in.

    I'm a passionate gamer and I know I'd be a passionate developer. I'm not concerned about being rich and never will be. I just like the idea of making something fun that people enjoy. In fact, as simple as Minecraft is, it's still a masterpiece. It draws on the basic elements of what a game should be. Probably why Microsoft paid $2.5 billion for it.
    The thing is you might loss money.  In fact it is very likely to loss money that is why so many get shut down.

    People are bashing the guy for failing on firefall, but 50% of blizzard game get canceled.  Many of those old mmorpg developer go on making new games but mostly failed to deliver.

    It is easy for people to talk about money when it is not their money they are risking.  If people are so sure of their idea, would they risk their own money?  How many people are willing to make a prototype of their game.  Even if it a text base mud?






  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 17,666
    Oh but wait,are these not the same people who say "WE LISTEN"  give us your feedback because we want it and we listen ...lol.
    You have never heard me state they listen,the exact opposite.It wouldn't make sense anyhow,you get 1500 different ideas,what are you going to do make 1500 different games?

    The truth is and always will be they aim for a market and a timeline and a budget,NONE of those three options equal >>HQ game.
    The game industry is pretty much like the PC industry,all you need to do is 1% better than the last guy to stay relevant.


    You know how confident these guys are,look at their marketing approaches.They NEVER sell a game on it's own merit,it is always something like so and so from this or that game is making this game.The critically acclaimed,from the top goty series ,the SAME people are making this game...lol.Then when they get LUCKY,they NEVER tell you WHY or the good qualities of the game,they simply tell you "how many players" or how much in sales.

    I live by a simple rule,if your game is any good,you better have 50 paragraphs worth of things to say that does not sound like "WE made 20 million in sales" "We have 10 million players".
    AlBQuirkyRhoklaw

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,465
    Pala said:
    Tried LOTRO recently, dear god, play it solo all the way and with your face resting on the keyboard. Now thats some genious game design.

    Tried GW2 for something different, 3 hours later I am still running from zone to zone killing everything on sight. 

    They should hire some paper designers, I cant tell the difference its all the same. 
    People here are oblivious to this... I don't understand how a massive amount of people are so blind. 
    mmolou
  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 6,158
    Rhoklaw said:
    Seems like he's mainly addressing people who think they will be able to get into the game industry or make money by sharing their ideas.

    People who post their ideas on an internet forum probably aren't trying to make money.  Obviously, it's a public domain and it would be practically impossible to prove that anyone read your ideas and decided to use them in a game.
    When your main focus as a game developer is how you can make the most money out of a game, you're no longer a game developer, you're a suit. There's a clear difference between making games because it's what you love to do versus those who make games simply to try and cash in.

    I'm a passionate gamer and I know I'd be a passionate developer. I'm not concerned about being rich and never will be. I just like the idea of making something fun that people enjoy. In fact, as simple as Minecraft is, it's still a masterpiece. It draws on the basic elements of what a game should be. Probably why Microsoft paid $2.5 billion for it.

    Remember when developers said, "Thanks for playing my game!" and meant it?
    Rhoklawtzervo

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 6,158
    AAAMEOW said:
    Rhoklaw said:
    Seems like he's mainly addressing people who think they will be able to get into the game industry or make money by sharing their ideas.

    People who post their ideas on an internet forum probably aren't trying to make money.  Obviously, it's a public domain and it would be practically impossible to prove that anyone read your ideas and decided to use them in a game.
    When your main focus as a game developer is how you can make the most money out of a game, you're no longer a game developer, you're a suit. There's a clear difference between making games because it's what you love to do versus those who make games simply to try and cash in.

    I'm a passionate gamer and I know I'd be a passionate developer. I'm not concerned about being rich and never will be. I just like the idea of making something fun that people enjoy. In fact, as simple as Minecraft is, it's still a masterpiece. It draws on the basic elements of what a game should be. Probably why Microsoft paid $2.5 billion for it.
    The thing is you might loss money.  In fact it is very likely to loss money that is why so many get shut down.

    People are bashing the guy for failing on firefall, but 50% of blizzard game get canceled.  Many of those old mmorpg developer go on making new games but mostly failed to deliver.

    It is easy for people to talk about money when it is not their money they are risking.  If people are so sure of their idea, would they risk their own money?  How many people are willing to make a prototype of their game.  Even if it a text base mud?







    "Making Money" isn't the issue for me. It's more about the difference between keeping the lights on and pleasing stockholders.

    I'm all for paying for my entertainment. But I don't feel like putting stockholders kids' through college.

    You see this a lot with "internet artists." Most of them have stopped drawing for pleasure and won't lift a tool until they see cash offered. I feel sorry for them because they've lost their love of art. The same goes for too many game developers and programmers.
    Tuor7Rhoklaw

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • ChildoftheShadowsChildoftheShadows Member EpicPosts: 1,830
    AlBQuirky said:
    AAAMEOW said:
    Rhoklaw said:
    Seems like he's mainly addressing people who think they will be able to get into the game industry or make money by sharing their ideas.

    People who post their ideas on an internet forum probably aren't trying to make money.  Obviously, it's a public domain and it would be practically impossible to prove that anyone read your ideas and decided to use them in a game.
    When your main focus as a game developer is how you can make the most money out of a game, you're no longer a game developer, you're a suit. There's a clear difference between making games because it's what you love to do versus those who make games simply to try and cash in.

    I'm a passionate gamer and I know I'd be a passionate developer. I'm not concerned about being rich and never will be. I just like the idea of making something fun that people enjoy. In fact, as simple as Minecraft is, it's still a masterpiece. It draws on the basic elements of what a game should be. Probably why Microsoft paid $2.5 billion for it.
    The thing is you might loss money.  In fact it is very likely to loss money that is why so many get shut down.

    People are bashing the guy for failing on firefall, but 50% of blizzard game get canceled.  Many of those old mmorpg developer go on making new games but mostly failed to deliver.

    It is easy for people to talk about money when it is not their money they are risking.  If people are so sure of their idea, would they risk their own money?  How many people are willing to make a prototype of their game.  Even if it a text base mud?







    ...

    You see this a lot with "internet artists." Most of them have stopped drawing for pleasure and won't lift a tool until they see cash offered. I feel sorry for them because they've lost their love of art. The same goes for too many game developers and programmers.
    You lost me here.
    "Wake up, It's RNG, there is no such thing as 'rare'"
    - Ungood
  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,343
    AlBQuirky said:

    You see this a lot with "internet artists." Most of them have stopped drawing for pleasure and won't lift a tool until they see cash offered. I feel sorry for them because they've lost their love of art. The same goes for too many game developers and programmers.
    That's not always about losing your love. Once you become good enough that you're getting paid serious money for the work you love, it becomes a question of professional pride that your work has your price attached to it.
    ChildoftheShadowstzervoalkarionlogKyleranAlBQuirkyUngood
     
  • RhoklawRhoklaw Member EpicPosts: 7,047
    AAAMEOW said:
    Rhoklaw said:
    Seems like he's mainly addressing people who think they will be able to get into the game industry or make money by sharing their ideas.

    People who post their ideas on an internet forum probably aren't trying to make money.  Obviously, it's a public domain and it would be practically impossible to prove that anyone read your ideas and decided to use them in a game.
    When your main focus as a game developer is how you can make the most money out of a game, you're no longer a game developer, you're a suit. There's a clear difference between making games because it's what you love to do versus those who make games simply to try and cash in.

    I'm a passionate gamer and I know I'd be a passionate developer. I'm not concerned about being rich and never will be. I just like the idea of making something fun that people enjoy. In fact, as simple as Minecraft is, it's still a masterpiece. It draws on the basic elements of what a game should be. Probably why Microsoft paid $2.5 billion for it.
    The thing is you might loss money.  In fact it is very likely to loss money that is why so many get shut down.

    People are bashing the guy for failing on firefall, but 50% of blizzard game get canceled.  Many of those old mmorpg developer go on making new games but mostly failed to deliver.

    It is easy for people to talk about money when it is not their money they are risking.  If people are so sure of their idea, would they risk their own money?  How many people are willing to make a prototype of their game.  Even if it a text base mud?






    Minecraft was developed by 1 person over a 2 year period, so it's quite possible to do it. As for the cost to develop a game, that is entirely questionable. I see a lot of mismanaged game companies spending money on stuff they really don't need to. Such as Chris Roberts, who spent $15k on a Star Citizen sliding door replica, or EA BioWare who spent, what was it, $200 million on voice acting in SWTOR? Seriously? Do in house voice acting or something. You don't need to spend that much on voice overs.

    Then you have all those amazing CGI trailers game companies put out. You know how much those cost to make and do NOTHING to improve game quality? Yeah, it costs a lot to make an MMO, but apparently money is no object with how some of the game companies like to spend ( waste ) money.
    alkarionlogAlBQuirky

  • anemoanemo Member RarePosts: 1,891
    Rhoklaw said:
    AAAMEOW said:
    Rhoklaw said:
    Seems like he's mainly addressing people who think they will be able to get into the game industry or make money by sharing their ideas.

    People who post their ideas on an internet forum probably aren't trying to make money.  Obviously, it's a public domain and it would be practically impossible to prove that anyone read your ideas and decided to use them in a game.
    When your main focus as a game developer is how you can make the most money out of a game, you're no longer a game developer, you're a suit. There's a clear difference between making games because it's what you love to do versus those who make games simply to try and cash in.

    I'm a passionate gamer and I know I'd be a passionate developer. I'm not concerned about being rich and never will be. I just like the idea of making something fun that people enjoy. In fact, as simple as Minecraft is, it's still a masterpiece. It draws on the basic elements of what a game should be. Probably why Microsoft paid $2.5 billion for it.
    The thing is you might loss money.  In fact it is very likely to loss money that is why so many get shut down.

    People are bashing the guy for failing on firefall, but 50% of blizzard game get canceled.  Many of those old mmorpg developer go on making new games but mostly failed to deliver.

    It is easy for people to talk about money when it is not their money they are risking.  If people are so sure of their idea, would they risk their own money?  How many people are willing to make a prototype of their game.  Even if it a text base mud?






    Minecraft was developed by 1 person over a 2 year period, so it's quite possible to do it. As for the cost to develop a game, that is entirely questionable. I see a lot of mismanaged game companies spending money on stuff they really don't need to. Such as Chris Roberts, who spent $15k on a Star Citizen sliding door replica, or EA BioWare who spent, what was it, $200 million on voice acting in SWTOR? Seriously? Do in house voice acting or something. You don't need to spend that much on voice overs.

    Then you have all those amazing CGI trailers game companies put out. You know how much those cost to make and do NOTHING to improve game quality? Yeah, it costs a lot to make an MMO, but apparently money is no object with how some of the game companies like to spend ( waste ) money.

    Minecraft was from an expert that previously worked on producing dozens of flash games in very short periods of time, went on to develop WurmOnline (an actual MMO) with a small team, and also found time to utterly dominate in Java4K contests (pulling top prize multiple years in a row, to the point people would choose to not attempt if they found out Notch was participating).   Before deciding to work on Minecraft, and jump starting Minecraft's popularity from their previous work.

    Even other Solo Indy Treasures like Stardew Valley, Undertale, or similar.  Are going to have an actual story of that person having a massive support network, that could keep them going for years.
    KylerantzervoRhoklaw

    Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.

    "At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."

  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 6,158
    anemo said:
    Rhoklaw said:
    AAAMEOW said:
    Rhoklaw said:
    Seems like he's mainly addressing people who think they will be able to get into the game industry or make money by sharing their ideas.

    People who post their ideas on an internet forum probably aren't trying to make money.  Obviously, it's a public domain and it would be practically impossible to prove that anyone read your ideas and decided to use them in a game.
    When your main focus as a game developer is how you can make the most money out of a game, you're no longer a game developer, you're a suit. There's a clear difference between making games because it's what you love to do versus those who make games simply to try and cash in.

    I'm a passionate gamer and I know I'd be a passionate developer. I'm not concerned about being rich and never will be. I just like the idea of making something fun that people enjoy. In fact, as simple as Minecraft is, it's still a masterpiece. It draws on the basic elements of what a game should be. Probably why Microsoft paid $2.5 billion for it.
    The thing is you might loss money.  In fact it is very likely to loss money that is why so many get shut down.

    People are bashing the guy for failing on firefall, but 50% of blizzard game get canceled.  Many of those old mmorpg developer go on making new games but mostly failed to deliver.

    It is easy for people to talk about money when it is not their money they are risking.  If people are so sure of their idea, would they risk their own money?  How many people are willing to make a prototype of their game.  Even if it a text base mud?






    Minecraft was developed by 1 person over a 2 year period, so it's quite possible to do it. As for the cost to develop a game, that is entirely questionable. I see a lot of mismanaged game companies spending money on stuff they really don't need to. Such as Chris Roberts, who spent $15k on a Star Citizen sliding door replica, or EA BioWare who spent, what was it, $200 million on voice acting in SWTOR? Seriously? Do in house voice acting or something. You don't need to spend that much on voice overs.

    Then you have all those amazing CGI trailers game companies put out. You know how much those cost to make and do NOTHING to improve game quality? Yeah, it costs a lot to make an MMO, but apparently money is no object with how some of the game companies like to spend ( waste ) money.

    Minecraft was from an expert that previously worked on producing dozens of flash games in very short periods of time, went on to develop WurmOnline (an actual MMO) with a small team, and also found time to utterly dominate in Java4K contests (pulling top prize multiple years in a row, to the point people would choose to not attempt if they found out Notch was participating).   Before deciding to work on Minecraft, and jump starting Minecraft's popularity from their previous work.

    Even other Solo Indy Treasures like Stardew Valley, Undertale, or similar.  Are going to have an actual story of that person having a massive support network, that could keep them going for years.

    And then you have Richard Garriott who worked alone (or was it with one other person?) on Akalabeth (Ultima's predecessor). He sold them in the backs of magazines and personally shipped them in plastic baggies with a floppy and instruction sheet. No one is saying they had zero experience beforehand, but you still have one person making the game they dreamed about.

    Today, the distribution part is MUCH easier. Google Drive or other file servers are easier (and cheaper) than taking out magazine ads. You don't "ship" anything, just a link to download. Steam is also available today where it was not... 15(?) years ago.

    The programming aspect today is much more difficult, though. So much to learn in all aspects of game design compared to decades ago :)

    Sometimes it works. Sometimes (most?) it doesn't.
    tzervoTuor7

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • AAAMEOWAAAMEOW Member RarePosts: 1,346
    Rhoklaw said:
    AAAMEOW said:
    Rhoklaw said:
    Seems like he's mainly addressing people who think they will be able to get into the game industry or make money by sharing their ideas.

    People who post their ideas on an internet forum probably aren't trying to make money.  Obviously, it's a public domain and it would be practically impossible to prove that anyone read your ideas and decided to use them in a game.
    When your main focus as a game developer is how you can make the most money out of a game, you're no longer a game developer, you're a suit. There's a clear difference between making games because it's what you love to do versus those who make games simply to try and cash in.

    I'm a passionate gamer and I know I'd be a passionate developer. I'm not concerned about being rich and never will be. I just like the idea of making something fun that people enjoy. In fact, as simple as Minecraft is, it's still a masterpiece. It draws on the basic elements of what a game should be. Probably why Microsoft paid $2.5 billion for it.
    The thing is you might loss money.  In fact it is very likely to loss money that is why so many get shut down.

    People are bashing the guy for failing on firefall, but 50% of blizzard game get canceled.  Many of those old mmorpg developer go on making new games but mostly failed to deliver.

    It is easy for people to talk about money when it is not their money they are risking.  If people are so sure of their idea, would they risk their own money?  How many people are willing to make a prototype of their game.  Even if it a text base mud?






    Minecraft was developed by 1 person over a 2 year period, so it's quite possible to do it. As for the cost to develop a game, that is entirely questionable. I see a lot of mismanaged game companies spending money on stuff they really don't need to. Such as Chris Roberts, who spent $15k on a Star Citizen sliding door replica, or EA BioWare who spent, what was it, $200 million on voice acting in SWTOR? Seriously? Do in house voice acting or something. You don't need to spend that much on voice overs.

    Then you have all those amazing CGI trailers game companies put out. You know how much those cost to make and do NOTHING to improve game quality? Yeah, it costs a lot to make an MMO, but apparently money is no object with how some of the game companies like to spend ( waste ) money.
    That's probably the point of the video and the follow up video.  If you look at Legend of Aria or Fractions Online which is in development now.  They seemed to only have a few programmer, or might be just 1 programmer at the initial stage.

    Heck, if that is too hard you can make your own mud.  If you can't even make your own mud no one is going to listen to you.

    And it is cheap to take SWTOR or star citizen as example because you are taking 2 examples to the extreme.  The opposite is games like legend of aria or factions online which have limited budget.


  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,180
    I love when in a beta test people weigh in with ideas that seem to assume nothing has been done so far. Like if the game is set in ancient Rome, and some guy says there really ought to be guns and automobiles - something GTA like. They seem to think the developers will just start over from scratch.
    AlBQuirkyTuor7

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

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