They said AT LEAST 1000 people per server. Once you see the map and understand the scope of the battlefields you'll understand why that makes sense. It's an open world, they need to be able to manage all these people heading to a war if they have to.
Nope. They are limited by a poor engine not because they are doing it for "reasons".
Or they want to keep it organized instead of everything turning into zerg guilds. 50 vs 50 is more than enough to make for a good battle.
But not enough for a decent war.
I want to re-fight the Battle for Helms Deep, 50 on 50 just won't do.
In Wushu I remember the days when our alliance ours was 3 guilds where fighting multiple alliances for are keeps hundreds of people battle across the game world. Winning one then arriving in the final moments to save another, great times.
That is just it, in Dark Age of Camelot (DAOC) had epic scale battles in the Old Frontier, ranging from three realms having anywhere from 200-500 players times three. I remember many battles at the Hibernian Frontier Gates having well over 1000 bodies in line of sight from a player perspective. Of course, with over 1000 players on screen, most servers will shudder and players will begin complaining about it.
It's funny watching folks cry and complain about how they took the sandbox out because there is no forced PvP and less survival. That's not what makes a sandbox game, it's what makes a survival game. This game is still a sandbox, you can still craft, pvp, pve, own a house built stuff. Just because you can't gank unsuspecting people as they log in doesn't mean it's no longer a sandbox.
I don't like blaming ARK for this but I will. You can still toggle it it on or off. Sounds a lot like SWG to me. Having a toggle imho keeps stuff dynamic since you never really know who is just gonna stand there and who might flag up. Love the mystery.
You can blame U0 and probably some MUDs before it) for setting the expectation a sandbox style game "must " permit "player enforcement" of the civil order which of course has pretty much resulted in numerous failed gankboxes over the years.
As you noted, SWG is a great idea of a sandbox style game which never went with the gank box model, though unfortunately the game failed for other reasons.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Or they want to keep it organized instead of everything turning into zerg guilds. 50 vs 50 is more than enough to make for a good battle.
But not enough for a decent war.
I want to re-fight the Battle for Helms Deep, 50 on 50 just won't do.
50 vs. 50 are the castle siege numbers - with 50 being the current company limit. So maybe it comes from 1 company vs. 1 company?
There is also the "open world" PvP - which still, it seems, exists in whatever form. Presumably this could be more in terms of player numbers; albeit some different form of PvP.
You can blame U0 and probably some MUDs before it) for setting the expectation a sandbox style game "must " permit "player enforcement" of the civil order which of course has pretty much resulted in numerous failed gankboxes over the years.
As you noted, SWG is a great idea of a sandbox style game which never went with the gank box model, though unfortunately the game failed for other reasons.
People are acting like they completely removed pvp because they added a toggle; it's so asinine lol. Obviously it effected gameplay for enough people in beta they changed it. Most likely it's small vocal group of asshats and sploiters who loose their wad ganking low levels all day. They still have large scale pvp battles and that's all I would need to get my pvp fix, plus I'm sure you can still sneak around looking for flagged people if you need your adrenaline fix.
Originally I thought the setting and theme really made for something interesting, but what I saw during the Alpha process left me feeling like it was a rehash of things that had been done before. Sure, it may try some different combinations. Unfortunately I think it'll be a niche game, and I'm sure people will enjoy it, but based on what I experienced, definitely not for me.
You can blame U0 and probably some MUDs before it) for setting the expectation a sandbox style game "must " permit "player enforcement" of the civil order which of course has pretty much resulted in numerous failed gankboxes over the years.
As you noted, SWG is a great idea of a sandbox style game which never went with the gank box model, though unfortunately the game failed for other reasons.
People are acting like they completely removed pvp because they added a toggle; it's so asinine lol. Obviously it effected gameplay for enough people in beta they changed it. Most likely it's small vocal group of asshats and sploiters who loose their wad ganking low levels all day. They still have large scale pvp battles and that's all I would need to get my pvp fix, plus I'm sure you can still sneak around looking for flagged people if you need your adrenaline fix.
If there are no systems designed to support pvp, systems that give reasons to kill, and deterrence to indescriminant sure through your toggle in there. It will be a shit pvp game anyways.
Here’s the thing tho pvp was made to deal with people who talk about other gamers like you.
You can blame U0 and probably some MUDs before it) for setting the expectation a sandbox style game "must " permit "player enforcement" of the civil order which of course has pretty much resulted in numerous failed gankboxes over the years.
As you noted, SWG is a great idea of a sandbox style game which never went with the gank box model, though unfortunately the game failed for other reasons.
People are acting like they completely removed pvp because they added a toggle; it's so asinine lol. Obviously it effected gameplay for enough people in beta they changed it. Most likely it's small vocal group of asshats and sploiters who loose their wad ganking low levels all day. They still have large scale pvp battles and that's all I would need to get my pvp fix, plus I'm sure you can still sneak around looking for flagged people if you need your adrenaline fix.
If there are no systems designed to support pvp, systems that give reasons to kill, and deterrence to indescriminant sure through your toggle in there. It will be a shit pvp game anyways.
Here’s the thing tho pvp was made to deal with people who talk about other gamers like you.
You sound like you just started playing MMOs at WoW. I really don't care if other folks who play a game don't want to PvP. It really doesn't bother me or effect my ability to do so or take away from anything for me because I actually like a real fight. Flagging never ruined it for me in SWG, wouldn't here either.
PvP toggle flags ruin a game for me. I much prefer the DAOC model where you have plenty of safe areas, but when you enter the Frontier you are fair game. Man I loved that game...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
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One of the things I have learned as a player that went from "PvE Only" to "PvE and some PvP" to a player that now enjoys BR's and Arena games, the one thing, and this is a huge thing about a PvP game, is Balance.
And I am going to be honest, I never liked MMO PvP, because the balance was always ass off. The games were all about mixing the right class/race/gear, and if you follow some meta formula, you were going to have a direct better than P2W advantage in a fight, and if I didn't want to play that style of build, I was flat out SOL.
Every MMO was like this, there was always going to be that one build that was going to just have the advantage over everyone else, and any claims of "Oh it's rock-paper-scissors" was total crap, and what it was, "This one Scissor build kicks the crap out of everything else, and if you wanted to play a Rock, you're basically screwed, as you will never beat this build, even if you think you are supposed to, you won't"
But then, OMG, I played Fortnight, and that whole idea of everyone starts on an even footing was some sweet dope game play. Yah, I sucked, I mean like. OMG, I was bad, but at least, we were balanced, they beat me because they were better than I was, and that is such a better feeling than some putz using a munchkin build to give themselves a stupidly OP edge in a fight.
So from there I started to get into Arena games, and learned to really enjoy PvP, and one thing I also learned.. I hated dealing with PvE in my PvP games. When I played Arena games, we all walked in realy to kick ass and die trying, there was no ganking, there was just a front on fight, and there was a beautiful respect in that.
So yah.. anyway.. New World, if they manage to somehow merge Arena/BR style balanced combat with an MMO, this game could be amazing, but I am going to bet, it will fall into the same traps many other MMO's have fallen into with huge balance issues.
We shall see.. but this topic did get me to look into the game, and it looks.. well.. to be honest, I haven't seen any gameplay, and the Trailer was, well not really informative. So.. for now, I can't say I am excited, but I can say, I am going to keep an eye on this game and see what becomes of it.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
One of the things I have learned as a player that went from "PvE Only" to "PvE and some PvP" to a player that now enjoys BR's and Arena games, the one thing, and this is a huge thing about a PvP game, is Balance.
And I am going to be honest, I never liked MMO PvP, because the balance was always ass off. The games were all about mixing the right class/race/gear, and if you follow some meta formula, you were going to have a direct better than P2W advantage in a fight, and if I didn't want to play that style of build, I was flat out SOL.
Every MMO was like this, there was always going to be that one build that was going to just have the advantage over everyone else, and any claims of "Oh it's rock-paper-scissors" was total crap, and what it was, "This one Scissor build kicks the crap out of everything else, and if you wanted to play a Rock, you're basically screwed, as you will never beat this build, even if you think you are supposed to, you won't"
But then, OMG, I played Fortnight, and that whole idea of everyone starts on an even footing was some sweet dope game play. Yah, I sucked, I mean like. OMG, I was bad, but at least, we were balanced, they beat me because they were better than I was, and that is such a better feeling than some putz using a munchkin build to give themselves a stupidly OP edge in a fight.
So from there I started to get into Arena games, and learned to really enjoy PvP, and one thing I also learned.. I hated dealing with PvE in my PvP games. When I played Arena games, we all walked in realy to kick ass and die trying, there was no ganking, there was just a front on fight, and there was a beautiful respect in that.
So yah.. anyway.. New World, if they manage to somehow merge Arena/BR style balanced combat with an MMO, this game could be amazing, but I am going to bet, it will fall into the same traps many other MMO's have fallen into with huge balance issues.
We shall see.. but this topic did get me to look into the game, and it looks.. well.. to be honest, I haven't seen any gameplay, and the Trailer was, well not really informative. So.. for now, I can't say I am excited, but I can say, I am going to keep an eye on this game and see what becomes of it.
You're talking about 2 different things. Fortnite and all games like that have their even start roots in the old shooters from the late '90s. Shooters always were all about that as well as having disposable characters. Everyone accepts that form of PvP because it's casual, you lose nothing and everyone has a shot at it.
Good MMO PvP was never about that and it's why it's best suited to large scale engagements where the individual class, level and build disparities are secondary to group strategy and tactics.
No one would have confused the two types of PvP until WOW decided to import shooter game play into small scale arenas that have always and will always suck precisely because small scale emphasizes all those class, level and build disparities.
But since WOW did it and practically everyone else followed suit, some players now associate that type of PvP with MMOs. Real MMO PvP as done in DAoC, GW2 WvWvW, ESO Cyrodiil AvAvA, etc. is still just as much fun now as it was 20 years ago.
All the other types of MMO PvP, arenas with scoreboards, OW PvP ganking and all that small scale stuff is still just shit like it always was for the reasons you stated.
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Real MMO PvP as done in DAoC, GW2 WvWvW, ESO Cyrodiil AvAvA, etc. is still just as much fun now as it was 20 years ago.
We do agree on this point, but then again, I thought the PvP in DAOC sucked 20 years ago, and true to forum, I think that kind of PvP still sucks today.
So.. kudos, we have something we agree upon.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
I'm hyped with the recent changes to the game (i.e., not forcing PVP on PVE folks) and hyped that Amazon is behind this (they're not idiots). I'm hoping this is the hardcore PVE game I've been looking for. It's time to leave WOW behind and to jump on something else.
May I ask how you define hardcore pve? It may mean different things to different people, I think.
I am also asking because I am curious what it is you are expecting from this game. I am still kinda trying to figure out this game’s identity.
This is me as well, i cant figure out what this game is even about or the direction of it lol
It's a real shame they backed away from open pvp. Hopefully they will at least do open pvp servers. There are currently 0 open pvp games in operation with any sort of budget behind them, and there is, in fact, a market for this type of game. Crowfall and CU are the only other 2 on the horizon with any sort of hope behind them, but New World had the survival/crafting aspect which would have made things interesting.
And before someone accuses me of being some noob ganking savage, I like to do my own thing and mind my own business - I'm more likely to leave another player alone or help them out. With that said, I like the ability to make things happen when they need to - like if someone moves into a spot and starts taking resources/mobs that I have been actively hunting, they are going to move on or they are going to die. I also enjoy the element of danger that comes with open pvp, settling into a grind spot and never having to look over my shoulder for threats is horribly boring.
Comments
I'll pass.
As you noted, SWG is a great idea of a sandbox style game which never went with the gank box model, though unfortunately the game failed for other reasons.
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
i hope its not a carebear shit show
There is also the "open world" PvP - which still, it seems, exists in whatever form. Presumably this could be more in terms of player numbers; albeit some different form of PvP.
People are acting like they completely removed pvp because they added a toggle; it's so asinine lol. Obviously it effected gameplay for enough people in beta they changed it. Most likely it's small vocal group of asshats and sploiters who loose their wad ganking low levels all day. They still have large scale pvp battles and that's all I would need to get my pvp fix, plus I'm sure you can still sneak around looking for flagged people if you need your adrenaline fix.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
That was when it was going to be f2p.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Originally I thought the setting and theme really made for something interesting, but what I saw during the Alpha process left me feeling like it was a rehash of things that had been done before. Sure, it may try some different combinations. Unfortunately I think it'll be a niche game, and I'm sure people will enjoy it, but based on what I experienced, definitely not for me.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
And I am going to be honest, I never liked MMO PvP, because the balance was always ass off. The games were all about mixing the right class/race/gear, and if you follow some meta formula, you were going to have a direct better than P2W advantage in a fight, and if I didn't want to play that style of build, I was flat out SOL.
Every MMO was like this, there was always going to be that one build that was going to just have the advantage over everyone else, and any claims of "Oh it's rock-paper-scissors" was total crap, and what it was, "This one Scissor build kicks the crap out of everything else, and if you wanted to play a Rock, you're basically screwed, as you will never beat this build, even if you think you are supposed to, you won't"
But then, OMG, I played Fortnight, and that whole idea of everyone starts on an even footing was some sweet dope game play. Yah, I sucked, I mean like. OMG, I was bad, but at least, we were balanced, they beat me because they were better than I was, and that is such a better feeling than some putz using a munchkin build to give themselves a stupidly OP edge in a fight.
So from there I started to get into Arena games, and learned to really enjoy PvP, and one thing I also learned.. I hated dealing with PvE in my PvP games. When I played Arena games, we all walked in realy to kick ass and die trying, there was no ganking, there was just a front on fight, and there was a beautiful respect in that.
So yah.. anyway.. New World, if they manage to somehow merge Arena/BR style balanced combat with an MMO, this game could be amazing, but I am going to bet, it will fall into the same traps many other MMO's have fallen into with huge balance issues.
We shall see.. but this topic did get me to look into the game, and it looks.. well.. to be honest, I haven't seen any gameplay, and the Trailer was, well not really informative. So.. for now, I can't say I am excited, but I can say, I am going to keep an eye on this game and see what becomes of it.
Good MMO PvP was never about that and it's why it's best suited to large scale engagements where the individual class, level and build disparities are secondary to group strategy and tactics.
No one would have confused the two types of PvP until WOW decided to import shooter game play into small scale arenas that have always and will always suck precisely because small scale emphasizes all those class, level and build disparities.
But since WOW did it and practically everyone else followed suit, some players now associate that type of PvP with MMOs. Real MMO PvP as done in DAoC, GW2 WvWvW, ESO Cyrodiil AvAvA, etc. is still just as much fun now as it was 20 years ago.
All the other types of MMO PvP, arenas with scoreboards, OW PvP ganking and all that small scale stuff is still just shit like it always was for the reasons you stated.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
So.. kudos, we have something we agree upon.
It does sound like it could be a fun game.
The trojan horse cash shop doesn't bother me that much, I've played W101 since beta.
Best part of this is, they do actually have a real set date of release! cant wait
So What Now?