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No evidence video games cause mass shootings

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  • Tiamat64Tiamat64 Member RarePosts: 1,528
    edited August 2019
    FAKE NEWS.  ~Donald Trump
    Blaze_RockerAxxar
  • bwwianakievbwwianakiev Member UncommonPosts: 82
    There's more evidence that government hypnosis causes mass shootings than video games.
    Blaze_RockerRoinRellzRueTheWhirl
  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 5,112
    I've certainly never heard of mass murder being committed with a used copy of Call of Duty. 
    Kylerankenguru23Rich84Rellz
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 34,911
    Couldnt be due to racist hate speech,  easier to purchase firearms than alcohol, or broken moral fiber, has to be violent entertainment for sure, video games being the worst of course.

    Sometimes I think the Purge movies are ever closer to becoming a reality.


    AeanderCaffynatedTorvalAxxarultimateduckklash2def

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing POE at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • tawesstawess Member EpicPosts: 4,179
    edited August 2019
    It is a easy scapegoat for cheap points... As always. 

    You can bet that the gaming industry like it tho... A easy way to galvanize people against a outward threat. A quick shift away from the fact that gaming as a industry is as rotten if not worse so than the rest. Now they can play the victim card. 

    No one that can rub two brain cells together think that games are the problem... Much as rock, pop, ballroom dancing, tv, video or... well... education... 

    That being said... we are still pack animals and as such prone to overreacting and.. well.. blindly following... 

    So people will people as usual... 
    TorvalAxxarArglebargle

    Tawess gaming

    Tawess soapbox

    This have been a good conversation

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,802
    edited August 2019
    Why on earth would you ever blame the shooter?
    That's such a waste of a political narrative that you can push to violate the 1st and 2nd amendments.
    BellomoAeanderultimateduck
  • BellomoBellomo Member UncommonPosts: 182
    edited August 2019
    https://time.com/5647269/california-stabbing-rampage/


    We need common sense knife laws and knife registration

    Aeander
  • anemoanemo Member RarePosts: 1,821
    You're being played for arguing this.

    The video game industry is larger than the film industry.  Quite simply put that money will speak enough to get the politicians to shut up.

    Likewise while everyone is arguing about this.  Actual video game issues like loot boxes are being pretty much ignored by political and news reporting bodies. 

    Along with politicians knowing they won't need to argue about mental health policy or having to go against NRA wallets.  For as long as they can froth at the mouth about video games .
    Gdemami

    Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.

    "At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."

  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 5,112
    Kyleran said:
    Couldnt be due to racist hate speech,  easier to purchase firearms than alcohol, or broken moral fiber, has to be violent entertainment for sure, video games being the worst of course.

    Sometimes I think the Purge movies are ever closer to becoming a reality.


    With this administration, we've already seen Back to the Future and Indiocracy go from satire to documentary. Why not add the Purge?  :|
    CaffynatedAxxar
  • Prime_DirectivePrime_Directive Member EpicPosts: 1,919
    edited August 2019
    I'm not sure if people are tone deaf or just blinded by reports on the game. Of course is not the game, it is the people in the game playing that continually share dehumanizing content to people they don't even know. 

    Lets do this way, sit a person with mental health issues and sit them down to play hello kitty online. 

    Now introduce toxic entity that only sole purpose is to  inflammatory dehumanizing rhetoric for a year. 

    The mental health person starts showing sign of aggravation , unable to cope with the overwhelming level of toxicity. 

    Is it the game, or game community. 

    How do I know this, because BDO last year drove me to insane high levels of stresss and anger in the amount of time I had to put into blocking people. I was angry, it overflowed in other areas, it cost me friends, itr cost me contacts. 

     I beleive the amount of dehumanizing toxity by other humans in chat and voip effect in a game community that can lead to mass shooting. I got help, the shooters don't. 

    I will also add, it just isn't games, it is unpoliced forums, chatrooms , places where low lifes sit and pretend their ideology is normal and everyone else is wrong. It needs to be addressed and new ;laws need implemented in fixing toxicity in online culture as a whole/
    ragebullet
    There is a multiverse inside our minds which millions live.
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 21,455
    Video games don't cause people to go on violent rampages.  Games that simulate a violent rampage (even with a storyline where you're killing people or monsters that need to be killed) may make it so that when someone does go on a violent rampage, he is better at it (and thus kills more people before he gets stopped) because he's had practice.
    Aeander
  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 6,398
    Video games do not incite violence. They incite people to come onto mmorpg.com and bitch about video games.
    AeanderCaffynatedKumaponAxxarragebullet

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 5,112
    edited August 2019
    Quizzical said:
    Video games don't cause people to go on violent rampages.  Games that simulate a violent rampage (even with a storyline where you're killing people or monsters that need to be killed) may make it so that when someone does go on a violent rampage, he is better at it (and thus kills more people before he gets stopped) because he's had practice.
    Care to back up that claim? Go play Call of Duty for a few hundred hours, then join the Army and see how well that "practice" translates to boot camp, much less an actual combat situation.

    (Hint - not well.)
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 21,455
    Aeander said:
    Quizzical said:
    Video games don't cause people to go on violent rampages.  Games that simulate a violent rampage (even with a storyline where you're killing people or monsters that need to be killed) may make it so that when someone does go on a violent rampage, he is better at it (and thus kills more people before he gets stopped) because he's had practice.
    Care to back up that claim? Go play Call of Duty for a few hundred hours, then join the Army and see how well that "practice" translates to boot camp, much less an actual combat situation.

    (Hint - not well.)
    Will it be as good as having actual military training?  Of course not.  Not even close.  But for someone who has barely touched a gun in his life, hundreds of hours of playing Call of Duty would probably be better practice than if he had never played a video game in his life.
  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 5,112
    Quizzical said:
    Aeander said:
    Quizzical said:
    Video games don't cause people to go on violent rampages.  Games that simulate a violent rampage (even with a storyline where you're killing people or monsters that need to be killed) may make it so that when someone does go on a violent rampage, he is better at it (and thus kills more people before he gets stopped) because he's had practice.
    Care to back up that claim? Go play Call of Duty for a few hundred hours, then join the Army and see how well that "practice" translates to boot camp, much less an actual combat situation.

    (Hint - not well.)
    Will it be as good as having actual military training?  Of course not.  Not even close.  But for someone who has barely touched a gun in his life, hundreds of hours of playing Call of Duty would probably be better practice than if he had never played a video game in his life.
    Guns in these games are quite explicitly designed to feel different from real guns. They're "immersive" but by a different standard (even a different "canon") than real guns. Such things as recoil, loudness, etc. are toned down for the player experience.

    Furthermore, and more importantly, even the most brutal or realistic video game deaths do not measure up to sight of actual death. Jim Sterling has shown this in action by airing a recording of a sudden, televised suicide on his channel. To say that his gaming audience was shocked and distressed is putting it lightly.


    Anyway, mass shooters have actually been shown to have lower than average interest in video games than the overall population on average. And those that do like video games often have quite unrelated tastes (or should we start banning Dance Dance Revolution because it happened to be the hobby of a mass shooter?). Indeed, a mass shooter is more likely to have a military background than a video gaming one.
    Gdemami
  • blamo2000blamo2000 Member RarePosts: 973
    I was an infantryman for half a decade.  I filled all positions besides platoon sergeant (was temp line squad leader and perm weapon squad leader).  At some point I was a regular rifleman, on the SAW, 203, was Assistant Gunner, Ammo Bearer, and M60 Gunner and then the 240b when that replaced the 60.  I also was trained and certified on the javelin and the dragon when in weapon squad.  

    There is zero crossover between video games and real life.  Has any video game ever had anyone zero a weapon?  Even laser sites require zeroing.  Does a video game show you how to clear a jam or any malfunction?  Etc, etc, etc.

    And people grouping all military together is silly.  I don't know if it changed but when I was in there was like 16 pogues to every combat arms.  Like 30 or 40 something pogues to one infantryman.  

    My military training never helped me once in a video game, and playing video games never helped me one iota when I served.

    I was born as a non-white in the ghetto to immigrant parents.  I got in tons of fights every year.  I played video games as an escape from real violence.  I like rpgs so the games I played were grind killing everything that moved.  I still play video games to escape life.  That's how I recharge from work, or fighting with my wife, etc.  Video games make me less violent.  If I didn't have video games to retreat to when I need to relax I probably would have murderer my wife a decade or longer ago.  


    Also, what should be the master stroke for this argument but no one ever mentions - all the countries with the highest murder rates per capita have almost no common or easy access to video games.  The countries with the most video game penetration per household have very low murder rates comparatively.  This is from a study I saw about 15 years ago before phones also played video games, so I don't know how that factors in.
    Axxar
  • blamo2000blamo2000 Member RarePosts: 973
    No one blames violent movies for violence. And there are some pretty brutal, very bloody, very violent, movies that exist that are often worse than most "violent" games.

    I wish that were true.  I see a lot of people blaming violent movies, or grouping Hollywood in with games (and violent music), saying its a culture of violence.  

    I like asking these people about Macbeth and other very violent plays, or violent literary works like the Iliad.  Hell, Hercules killed his whole family.  

    The fucking pearl-clutching hippies on all sides try to ban everything they don't like.  A world in which the Predator isn't considered the greatest movie masterpiece ever made is a world that deserves to end in nuclear holocaust.  
  • CaffynatedCaffynated Member RarePosts: 587
    While I wouldn't say that vidya causes or motivates shootings, I don't think it's accurate to say they haven't contributed somewhat to them. 

    After WW2 the military did a study of the willingness of soldiers to shoot to kill and found that a very small percentage actually bothered to aim at an enemy and attempt to hit them. It was determined that most people find killing abhorrent and even on a battlefield are not comfortable with intentionally taking a life. 

    Following the results of this study they began training programs designed to lesson this the effects of this innate reaction and normalize shooting another human being. They've refined the training (one might call it brain washing) down to the point where nearly 100% of trained soldiers shoot to kill. 

    Lindybeige did an episode on this, and it's worth watching:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zViyZGmBhvs

    How does this relate to games? We're undergoing that same normalization process. It may even be more intense and effective than what the military has done, as we're often shooting at human characters controlled by real people. 

    To stress the point, no I'm not saying games cause or motivate shootings. But it's inaccurate to say they haven't contributed at all. You combine someone who is angry or psychotic enough to commit mass murder, with the normalization of killing from hours of gaming and you have a recipe for disaster. Does that mean we should ban games? Not any more than we should ban human shaped range targets. 
    Hawkaya399
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,781
    Democrats/republicans both always blame video games, the two party system is junk. Be better for a europe multi-party system (or australia is a bit similar too) with coalition possibilities where even a small party can win and have a say in the election. Not get screwed over by racist democrats (democrats are as racist as republicans) and racist republicans that both parties hate everyone.

    But I remember obama, bush and clinton all always blamed video games. 

    Except recently there was a stabbing spree in california, but no one is asking to ban knives. Or last year a whole bunch of people (100s) got ran over by a van in the UK and no one wants to ban vans. Or the acid that always gets thrown on people in the UK and that gets ignored.
    It wasn't hundreds dead but a van was used in an act of terror. As were other motor vehicles in France, the US, Germany etc. ditto planes in 9/11.

    Steps have been taken against these "isolated" acts.  To make such acts harder going forward.

    And therein lie the key differences.
    1. Gun violence - in the US: common its not isolated. (Mass shootings in 2019 i.e. 4 or more deaths are currently running at c. 1.5 a day in the US).
    2. Action taken: play a blame game. Forgetting that the rest of the world plays video games, has cases of bad parenting etc etc etc .  


    Axxar
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,781
    Various university studies - and there are links out there! - looked deeper and basically what they found was that violence "doesn't matter". The key, they reported, was frustration.

    If a game winds people up because its to hard that can be linked to a rise in tension and the potential for violence etc. They checked this against a variety of games including such pillars of violence as FIFA and Tetris. Yes Tetris! (They tweaked the games to wind people up as part of the testing.)

    Conversely people who were mowing down monsters, enemy soldiers, tearing through other sports teams etc etc - working off the frustrations of the day basically - were less inclined to tension, the potential for violence.

    To me this seems to tie in with reality. After a hard day you just want to "mindlessly chill" - whether that is playing Sudoku or whatever.
  • alyndalealyndale Member UncommonPosts: 932
    Maybe we should consider the gamers rather than the games.

    Aeander

    All I want is the truth
    Just gimme some truth
    John Lennon

  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,781
    alyndale said:
    Maybe we should consider the gamers rather than the games.

    Why?

    Gamers exist all over the world; gun violence not so much.

    Are US gamers "different"?  Do they all wear special caps with wires directly connected to the brain stem? Pray tell.
    Axxar
  • Blaze_RockerBlaze_Rocker Member UncommonPosts: 364
    edited August 2019

    You can't believe everything you hear from the left-wing-agenda lamestream media.

    Check out the best selling book 'The True Story of Fake News' by Mark Dice. It was so good I bought two more to give as gifts.

    --- Edit ---

    Nearly everyone I try to tell about the biased, propaganda media laughs and calls me crazy. Just compare Mark's book to anything Jim Acosta has written. Check out the sales and reviews on Amazon. You might be surprised, and if you read the book you might just get an education as to how the biggest names in media have been manipulated and controlled for more than forty years. Mark cites his sources for his talking points ... all eight hundred eighty-one of them.

    The True Story of Fake News is one of the best books I've read in the past fifteen years. Now when I see the so-called news from NBC, MSNBC, ABC, CBS and the Clown News Network (aka: CNN) I just roll my eyes and shake my head.

    There cannot be bias in real journalism. Real journalism is about the facts, all the facts, whether you like them or not.

    Post edited by Blaze_Rocker on
    AeanderDvora

    I've got a feevah, and the only prescription... is more cowbell.

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