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100% PvP, I can't justify it's not

delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 5,632
I understand on paper it's both PvP and PvE. I understand with the node system, the rewards for good PvP is more PvE content and more territory.

BUT heres how it will play out (real time) : 
Ashes is really built for PvP players.  But EVERYONE will play it simply because its new and EVERYONE is starving for a new mmorpg.  The PvE players will continuously get their hopes and dreams crushed with forced PvP.

Given some time the PvE players will move on and away from the game.  This will make it even stronger for the PvP player, making it 100% PvP....... I give the PvE players 30 days.



If I were to play, I'll be cheating the system..... I'll bunny hop servers until I'm on the winning side.
Why will I cheat ?......I want PvE content.

After all who want's to walk in on the loosing side and stay with it, definitely not the PvE player and thats me.



This game will be a text book example of what sounds good on paper is not how it will play out !
TokkenGdemamiLiquidRidertweedledumb99Maurgrim
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Comments

  • RhoklawRhoklaw Member EpicPosts: 6,308
    Isn't this what happens with 90% of PvP focused MMOs? They start off great until the PvE players realize their content is limited due to forced PvP.

    Nope, if it has any kind of open / forced PvP, it has a very limited success rate. I think Black Desert Online is one of the only PvP games out there with any sort of following ( for Western games ).
    delete5230LiquidRider

  • AlexanderVendiAlexanderVendi Member UncommonPosts: 282
    There's huge rewards in the form of adrenaline rush when overcoming odds... i don't know anything about the game but if it provides means for small skirmishes to take on bigger groups then it's going to succeed.
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 11,335
    I am hoping their mix of gameplay works, we need something different from PVE and FFA PvP.

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  • bcbullybcbully Member RarePosts: 9,650
    edited June 2
    Idgaf what the game is. I give Delete and the rest like him 30 days or less until they say “there’s not enough content”. Lmao

    Stop plying the victim. Where’s what’s his name, Get Gud!” Better yet get a new hobbie. 

    Why arent you playing WoW classic? 
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 5,632
    bcbully said:
    Idgaf what the game is. I give Delete and the rest like him 30 days or less until they say “there’s not enough content”. Lmao

    Stop plying the victim. Where’s what’s his name, Get Gud!” Better yet get a new hobbie. 

    Why arent you playing WoW classic? 
    Victim ?.. what does this topic have to do with being a victim ?

    Your strictly a PvP player, by you being here proves this will be a pure PvP game. 

    WoW classic ?....... I've been playing Vanilla WOW all along, never stopped !.... After all the years of playing this great game, I'm finally getting sick of it. 
  • btdtbtdt Member RarePosts: 496
    PVE players need to realize that PVP is nothing more than fighting additional mobs that don't have limited aggro ranges... behave erratically... and more often than not, work together in groups.

    PVPers seek out adventure just like PVErs do.  The content is no more gated for them than it is for you.  If you play like a wounded animal, don't expect nature to be kind.  Head out with your friends with players on the look out for potential attacks around every corner.   If you can learn not to stand in fire... you can learn not to be a victim.

    It's not much different than learning a raid strategy... only the strategy is ever evolving.  An MMO without PVP is a single player game... because that is exactly how it gets played... solo.  An MMO with PVP is a multi-player game... because you can't have PVP without opponents.  

    Change the way you play games instead of being the square peg trying to force itself into the round hole.  All the content you want and more is awaiting you.  YOU only need to learn to play the game the right way.

    GaladournKyleranbcbullyScotjdlamson75gunklacker
  • TheocritusTheocritus Member EpicPosts: 6,878
    If the PVP is completely seperate then fine, but I have no interest getting killed by other players while trying to play the game.
    delete5230bcbullyLiquidRiderOctagon7711
  • goboygogoboygo Member RarePosts: 1,992
    Probably correct, pretty much how all open world PvP games work.  Starts with everyone, ends with only PvP'rs then placed on life support.
    delete5230Octagon7711gunklacker
  • goboygogoboygo Member RarePosts: 1,992
    btdt said:
    PVE players need to realize that PVP is nothing more than fighting additional mobs that don't have limited aggro ranges... behave erratically... and more often than not, work together in groups.

    PVPers seek out adventure just like PVErs do.  The content is no more gated for them than it is for you.  If you play like a wounded animal, don't expect nature to be kind.  Head out with your friends with players on the look out for potential attacks around every corner.   If you can learn not to stand in fire... you can learn not to be a victim.

    It's not much different than learning a raid strategy... only the strategy is ever evolving.  An MMO without PVP is a single player game... because that is exactly how it gets played... solo.  An MMO with PVP is a multi-player game... because you can't have PVP without opponents.  

    Change the way you play games instead of being the square peg trying to force itself into the round hole.  All the content you want and more is awaiting you.  YOU only need to learn to play the game the right way.

    Just change your PVE play style to be just like a PVP play style then you'll have fun getting killed by other players.

    Okay.

    That's kind of a delusional statement.  They are two different elements because they are two COMPLETELY different play styles based on two completely different emotional states.

    You would have to be apathetic to not be able to separate the two.
    KyleranOctagon7711Soybeandragonlee66
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 10,706
    18 months
    ConstantineMerus

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

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  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 32,968
    edited June 2
    goboygo said:
    btdt said:
    PVE players need to realize that PVP is nothing more than fighting additional mobs that don't have limited aggro ranges... behave erratically... and more often than not, work together in groups.

    PVPers seek out adventure just like PVErs do.  The content is no more gated for them than it is for you.  If you play like a wounded animal, don't expect nature to be kind.  Head out with your friends with players on the look out for potential attacks around every corner.   If you can learn not to stand in fire... you can learn not to be a victim.

    It's not much different than learning a raid strategy... only the strategy is ever evolving.  An MMO without PVP is a single player game... because that is exactly how it gets played... solo.  An MMO with PVP is a multi-player game... because you can't have PVP without opponents.  

    Change the way you play games instead of being the square peg trying to force itself into the round hole.  All the content you want and more is awaiting you.  YOU only need to learn to play the game the right way.

    Just change your PVE play style to be just like a PVP play style then you'll have fun getting killed by other players.

    Okay.

    That's kind of a delusional statement.  They are two different elements because they are two COMPLETELY different play styles based on two completely different emotional states.

    You would have to be apathetic to not be able to separate the two.
    All part of the mind games / BS people try to peddle when encouraging "others" to learn how to play properly. 

    See, the thing is, they need sheep to believe it so there's someone to feed upon, last thing many really want is a fair fight, and they deliberately and intelligently make sure to take actions to ensure they win more often than not.

    IMO, CCP is one of the very few devs who came even close to understanding how this needs to work, perhaps the folks who made BDO also.

    skadadgunklackerSoybean

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing POE at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

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  • parrotpholkparrotpholk Member EpicPosts: 4,602
    btdt said:
    PVE players need to realize that PVP is nothing more than fighting additional mobs that don't have limited aggro ranges... behave erratically... and more often than not, work together in groups.




    Lets not romanticize or make pvp something that it is generally not.

    Bunny hopping, group zergs, and circle strafing is not some great component of gameplay.  Lets not forget griefing and just general overall asshat behavior that happens.

    I like pvp and it brings a nice added dimension to games but lets not make it out to be something it is not.  Very rarely you get competitive or balanced pvp.  Mostly it is what I already described.  If 100% pvp was such a great option then there would be more games that do it.  And do not try to use the excuse that developers just have not done it right yet.  It has been done every way possible and people still at the end of the day prove that people come on launch day and overwhelmingly are gone after 6 months to a year.
    delete5230bcbullyskadadAzothgunklacker
  • k61977k61977 Member RarePosts: 1,215
    I just don't understand someone who is a PVE player griping about PVP.  I am a PVE player mostly because I have health issues that limit my PVP stuff.  Don't play a game designed around something you don't want, then complain about it.  It is the same thing as a PVP player jumping in a PVE based game and griping about the PVP.

    It's a different story when a dev sells a game on the idea that it is for everyone an then does things like forced PVP to do anything at max level where you didn't have to PVP at all till that point.  When you run into those things yeah you have a reason to gripe. 
  • parrotpholkparrotpholk Member EpicPosts: 4,602
    k61977 said:


    It's a different story when a dev sells a game on the idea that it is for everyone an then does things like forced PVP to do anything at max level where you didn't have to PVP at all till that point.  When you run into those things yeah you have a reason to gripe. 
    This is the problem in that developers are trying to sell to everyone saying that it is all things to all people. 

    I am not a fan in the least of SoL but at least they know what they want to build and market to those types of people.  I can respect they are targeting a small niche and trying to be the best for that niche.  If you try and make something for everyone then you really have nothing for anyone.
    delete5230
  • TokkenTokken Member RarePosts: 2,111
    edited June 2
    Where are all the new PvE games that need to come out?  PvE players are starved! Seems like everything is PvP based. 
    I can only go back to WOW so much... I'm sick of it.   lol. 
    For me, it's either quit MMORPG's alltogether or go to MMO survival games or start doing PVP games...... right now I am focused on playing MMO survival games on PVE servers or PVP games.  I've played BDO and currently Albion Online. I'm not much of a PVP player, but I'm trying.
    delete5230bcbullyScot
    Make PvE GREAT Again!
  • LiquidRiderLiquidRider Member CommonPosts: 5
    edited June 5
    There are so many self-entitled PVE comments in this thread it is hilarious. Especially the OP. 

    Maybe just maybe we should trust what the developers are trying to do instead of making assumptions... especially to those that guarantee the demise of a game because it may or may not have PVP

     
    In all honesty, I am just sick of the PVE vs PVP with every single MMO. 


    But this comment right here speaks volume to the kind of person you are. Sounds like you want easy-mode.  
    If I were to play, I'll be cheating the system..... I'll bunny hop servers until I'm on the winning side. 

    Why will I cheat ?......I want PvE content. 

    After all who want's to walk in on the loosing side and stay with it, definitely not the PvE player and thats me. 

    Read more at https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/481648/100-pvp-i-cant-justify-its-not#5uOwAOdE3ISkk3Dj.99



    Timukas
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 32,968
    edited June 5
    There are so many self-entitled PVE comments in this thread it is hilarious. Especially the OP. 

    Maybe just maybe we should trust what the developers are trying to do instead of making assumptions... especially to those that guarantee the demise of a game because it may or may not have PVP

     
    In all honesty, I am just sick of the PVE vs PVP with every single MMO. 


    But this comment right here speaks volume to the kind of person you are. Sounds like you want easy-mode.  
    If I were to play, I'll be cheating the system..... I'll bunny hop servers until I'm on the winning side. 

    Why will I cheat ?......I want PvE content. 

    After all who want's to walk in on the loosing side and stay with it, definitely not the PvE player and thats me. 

    Read more at https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/481648/100-pvp-i-cant-justify-its-not#5uOwAOdE3ISkk3Dj.99



    Your post speaks volumes as well, I'm sensing ganker mentality.

    :D
    Gdemamigunklackerdragonlee66

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing POE at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

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  • esc-joconnoresc-joconnor Member RarePosts: 1,070
    btdt said:
    PVE players need to realize that PVP is nothing more than fighting additional mobs that don't have limited aggro ranges... behave erratically... and more often than not, work together in groups.

    PVPers seek out adventure just like PVErs do.  The content is no more gated for them than it is for you.  If you play like a wounded animal, don't expect nature to be kind.  Head out with your friends with players on the look out for potential attacks around every corner.   If you can learn not to stand in fire... you can learn not to be a victim.

    It's not much different than learning a raid strategy... only the strategy is ever evolving.  An MMO without PVP is a single player game... because that is exactly how it gets played... solo.  An MMO with PVP is a multi-player game... because you can't have PVP without opponents.  

    Change the way you play games instead of being the square peg trying to force itself into the round hole.  All the content you want and more is awaiting you.  YOU only need to learn to play the game the right way.

    What a bunch of nonsense. You can never really win at open world PvP. And games are never designed with mobs that are a-holes. Any PvP players that play MMORPGs shouldn't be surprised if someone thinks you just want to be a ganking punk that gets pleasure out of others misery. If you wanted a fair battle MMORPGs are not really the place to look. If 100% of PvP players were considerate good sportsmen 100% of PvE players would be happy to play with them. But that is far from the case.
    GdemamiOctagon7711bcbullydragonlee66
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 10,706
    btdt said:
    PVE players need to realize that PVP is nothing more than fighting additional mobs that don't have limited aggro ranges... behave erratically... and more often than not, work together in groups.

    PVPers seek out adventure just like PVErs do.  The content is no more gated for them than it is for you.  If you play like a wounded animal, don't expect nature to be kind.  Head out with your friends with players on the look out for potential attacks around every corner.   If you can learn not to stand in fire... you can learn not to be a victim.

    It's not much different than learning a raid strategy... only the strategy is ever evolving.  An MMO without PVP is a single player game... because that is exactly how it gets played... solo.  An MMO with PVP is a multi-player game... because you can't have PVP without opponents.  

    Change the way you play games instead of being the square peg trying to force itself into the round hole.  All the content you want and more is awaiting you.  YOU only need to learn to play the game the right way.

    What a bunch of nonsense. You can never really win at open world PvP. And games are never designed with mobs that are a-holes. Any PvP players that play MMORPGs shouldn't be surprised if someone thinks you just want to be a ganking punk that gets pleasure out of others misery. If you wanted a fair battle MMORPGs are not really the place to look. If 100% of PvP players were considerate good sportsmen 100% of PvE players would be happy to play with them. But that is far from the case.
    You can never win at open world PvP?  That is nonsense.
    And you know what 100% of PvE players would do? That is also nonsense 

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • Torin_KhaosTorin_Khaos Member UncommonPosts: 18
    edited June 6
    I am really hoping for a good mix. I dont really want to pvp and as long as its not a 24/7 gank feast it will work out just fine. I expect pvpers will find a way to game the karma system in the first couple months but after the that i expect that the loss of subscriptions and lack of free to play , players will motivate the developer to fix the system enough pve'ers dont just quit.
    So my prediction is Subscriptions will win over A$$hole gankers pvp brings. Heck that might be such a win it will remind of you of the DAOC days where pve'ers would pvp certain events.
  • esc-joconnoresc-joconnor Member RarePosts: 1,070
    btdt said:
    PVE players need to realize that PVP is nothing more than fighting additional mobs that don't have limited aggro ranges... behave erratically... and more often than not, work together in groups.

    PVPers seek out adventure just like PVErs do.  The content is no more gated for them than it is for you.  If you play like a wounded animal, don't expect nature to be kind.  Head out with your friends with players on the look out for potential attacks around every corner.   If you can learn not to stand in fire... you can learn not to be a victim.

    It's not much different than learning a raid strategy... only the strategy is ever evolving.  An MMO without PVP is a single player game... because that is exactly how it gets played... solo.  An MMO with PVP is a multi-player game... because you can't have PVP without opponents.  

    Change the way you play games instead of being the square peg trying to force itself into the round hole.  All the content you want and more is awaiting you.  YOU only need to learn to play the game the right way.

    What a bunch of nonsense. You can never really win at open world PvP. And games are never designed with mobs that are a-holes. Any PvP players that play MMORPGs shouldn't be surprised if someone thinks you just want to be a ganking punk that gets pleasure out of others misery. If you wanted a fair battle MMORPGs are not really the place to look. If 100% of PvP players were considerate good sportsmen 100% of PvE players would be happy to play with them. But that is far from the case.
    You can never win at open world PvP?  That is nonsense.
    And you know what 100% of PvE players would do? That is also nonsense 

    Really, so when do you win? When are you done with an opponent in PvP? Can you tell me that moment with absolute surety now? And when you quit playing the game may be an answer, but not a winning scenario for sure. I know for PvE it's when I beat the mob and leave the area. It's not going to comeback from the dead over and over and track me down. He's not going to tell his buddies to be on the lookout for me. He's not going to wait until I'm doing something else and try to be annoying.
    And yeah, that was hyperbole, but do you not get what I'm saying? In MMORPGs pvp is a crapshoot. Without much shoot.
    Gdemamigunklacker
  • jahlonjahlon Member UncommonPosts: 282
    I understand on paper it's both PvP and PvE. I understand with the node system, the rewards for good PvP is more PvE content and more territory.

    BUT heres how it will play out (real time) : 
    Ashes is really built for PvP players.  But EVERYONE will play it simply because its new and EVERYONE is starving for a new mmorpg.  The PvE players will continuously get their hopes and dreams crushed with forced PvP.

    Given some time the PvE players will move on and away from the game.  This will make it even stronger for the PvP player, making it 100% PvP....... I give the PvE players 30 days.



    If I were to play, I'll be cheating the system..... I'll bunny hop servers until I'm on the winning side.
    Why will I cheat ?......I want PvE content.

    After all who want's to walk in on the loosing side and stay with it, definitely not the PvE player and thats me.



    This game will be a text book example of what sounds good on paper is not how it will play out !

    I failed to see anything that looked like an argument for why PvE players would quit?


    Jahlon The Legendary Clicker
    Founder of the Paradox Gaming Network
    Paradox Gaming Network
    Paradox YouTube Channel 
  • esc-joconnoresc-joconnor Member RarePosts: 1,070
    jahlon said:
    I understand on paper it's both PvP and PvE. I understand with the node system, the rewards for good PvP is more PvE content and more territory.

    BUT heres how it will play out (real time) : 
    Ashes is really built for PvP players.  But EVERYONE will play it simply because its new and EVERYONE is starving for a new mmorpg.  The PvE players will continuously get their hopes and dreams crushed with forced PvP.

    Given some time the PvE players will move on and away from the game.  This will make it even stronger for the PvP player, making it 100% PvP....... I give the PvE players 30 days.



    If I were to play, I'll be cheating the system..... I'll bunny hop servers until I'm on the winning side.
    Why will I cheat ?......I want PvE content.

    After all who want's to walk in on the loosing side and stay with it, definitely not the PvE player and thats me.



    This game will be a text book example of what sounds good on paper is not how it will play out !

    I failed to see anything that looked like an argument for why PvE players would quit?


    So . . . you . . . like games . . . that crush your hopes and dreams?!?! o_O
    Gdemamigunklacker
  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 8,755
    The thing is most players are not 100% PvP or PvE.  Everyone likes to do different things from time to time.  Just gotta wait and see the dynamics of the game and how well player styles are managed and balanced by Devs.
    bcbully

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 5,632
    edited June 10
    The thing is most players are not 100% PvP or PvE.  Everyone likes to do different things from time to time.  Just gotta wait and see the dynamics of the game and how well player styles are managed and balanced by Devs.
    This is the on paper version I talked about... This would be nice.  I've seen a lot of stuff on paper that never worked out.  I my self had created things on paper in life where I completely convinced it would work and don't.  I'm a technician, I fix things and make things.  I've been making things for 40 years.

    This is a very large expensive project..... I really really hope it does work out.  And thats for both them and us.... In this case I hope I'm wrong because we need a game.
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