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Why does ESO have such a horrible patch process? :(

YanocchiYanocchi Member UncommonPosts: 677
It took a long time to download the most recent 6 GB patch. At the last second of patching the game notified about some manifest data error. Now I have to download everything all over again.

I've encountered this problem at least 5-7 times over the past 3-4 years. During the first two times it was probably related to insufficient free hard drive space. I freed enough space but the problem still occurs now and then and you never know when it occurs or what causes it.

I'll try to patch one more time and then my patience with this game will run out for the last time. They'll have to implement something amazingly spectacular in the future to get me even slightly interested in ESO again.

Fortunately for me, Elder Scrolls Legends is still entertaining enough and maybe we'll see Elder Scrolls VI next year.
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Comments

  • YanocchiYanocchi Member UncommonPosts: 677
    Anyway, it is a big problem for people who want to play the game once in a while and for whom ESO is not the main game. You just want to fire up the game and play it a bit but you're welcomed with a failing patching process that lasts many hours. That leaves a very bad impression.
    Baldur's Gate Online - Video Trailer
    * more info, screenshots and videos here

  • mmoloummolou Member UncommonPosts: 256
    Because ESO is the first online game in the history of online games to have any kind of issue with patching, ever....
    It is a funny world we live in.
    We had Empires run by Emperors, we had Kingdoms run by Kings, now we have Countries...
  • YanocchiYanocchi Member UncommonPosts: 677
    edited May 2019
    Nowadays all other games can at least patch properly. Sometimes there are minor problems but not of this magnitude. I can't imagine how bad it would be for users with limited bandwith (pay-per-X-GB) to go through 12 GB of data to try patch the game without any certainty that it won't fail again.
    Baldur's Gate Online - Video Trailer
    * more info, screenshots and videos here

  • mmoloummolou Member UncommonPosts: 256
    Maybe it is just you?
    You already said you had an issue that was entirely caused by you.
    I personally have never had a problem patching ESO, but I have had problems patching LoTRO, for example.
    Did not feel the need to lambast them on a forum over it though.
    YanocchiPhry
    It is a funny world we live in.
    We had Empires run by Emperors, we had Kingdoms run by Kings, now we have Countries...
  • YanocchiYanocchi Member UncommonPosts: 677
    Hmm, interesting. Maybe it affects only a minority of people but I'm certainly not the only one with the problem. People have wondered about this issue in the past too.
    Baldur's Gate Online - Video Trailer
    * more info, screenshots and videos here

  • mmoloummolou Member UncommonPosts: 256
    It is the same with in game bugs, some people are affected by a certain bug, other's are not, but they may be affected by a different bug.
    Could be due to hardware differences, or interaction with other software installed on the PC, or it could just be that time of the month.
    I know it can be a pain, but have you tried a completely new, clean install?
    Last time I had a patching issue with LoTRO, I completely removed it, did a clean install, not had a problem since.
    It is a funny world we live in.
    We had Empires run by Emperors, we had Kingdoms run by Kings, now we have Countries...
  • YanocchiYanocchi Member UncommonPosts: 677
    I did try that once. ESO launcher offers a repair function and I've had to use it sometimes in the past to fix the issue. Sometimes it takes 4-6 hours, though. :( It usually goes through all the files and re-downloads and applies a lot of different patches. Sometimes the manifest data error doesn't hinder launching the game. It's also not that great that ESO requires 80 GB of additional free space. That's 85 GB + 80 GB in total. The manifest data eror in the patching process is sensitive to how much free space remains on the disk. The requirements are rather steep for an average casual player with an average 250 GB SSD computer.
    Baldur's Gate Online - Video Trailer
    * more info, screenshots and videos here

  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Torval said:
    No, it's not the OP, their patch process is ass.
    Always has been.
    [Deleted User]gervaise1
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • HarikenHariken Member EpicPosts: 2,680
    Torval said:
    No, it's not the OP, their patch process is ass.
    Yeah, I was going t say the same thing.
    [Deleted User]gervaise1
  • NorseGodNorseGod Member EpicPosts: 2,654
    Never noticed.

    When I patch or install any game, it's before bed, leaving for work, or watching a movie with the wife.

    Kinda glad I don't sit there waiting now.
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  • DvoraDvora Member UncommonPosts: 499
    edited May 2019
    Better question, why do they rape you so much for "expansions" that are one tiny new zone.  New class ya sure... but the amount of new content is a complete ripoff.

    Not to mention that all their zones are all boring as shit and look like some kid was randomly plopping assets down with no artistic sense at all,
    mmolou
  • NorseGodNorseGod Member EpicPosts: 2,654
    edited May 2019
    Dvora said:
    Better question, why do they rape you so much for "expansions" that are one tiny new zone.  New class ya sure... but the amount of new content is a complete ripoff.

    Not to mention that all their zones are all boring as shit and look like some kid was randomly plopping assets down with no artistic sense at all,
    Even better question, Who's forcing you to buy it?

    You see, people not living on food stamps and section 8 housing, require what is known as currency, generally in the form of "cash", as I do not want to pay my bills with, for example, chickens. Chickens are harder to transport and store than "cash".

    Cash fits in my pocket, chickens do not. And what if the service provider doesn't want my chickens? What if they want cows? How many chickens do I have to trade for cows? But what if the person with cows, will only trade corn for their cows? 

    In what is called an ""employer/employee" relationship", cash is exchanged for services from the "employer" to the "employee". In this case, the service provided is writing code.

    The employer then sells a final product in it's totality of services provided by the employee to create more cash to pay for the employees, pay for materials and utilities, and to create even more products and grow, sometimes resulting in hiring additional employees, who all need to be paid with currency in exchange for their services.

    The employer needs the employees to keep creating products. The employees needs the employer to stay in and grow the need for the service the employee is providing.

    The employees are then free to use that currency any way they want. Some choose to waste it. Some make the choice to better themselves. Most all, like the employer, have obligations to pay for services as well.

    The consumer (you) also plays a part in this. You transfer currency in exchange for services.

    The employer needs consumers to purchase these products to get this currency so that they can transfer that currency for services provided by employees and to grow their business.

    *Note NOT paying currency in exchange for services is known as slavery.

    **Also note, we live in a free market society. That means, we are not forced by law (people with guns will come to your home) to participate in consuming services for whatever reason.

    ***Also note, "rape" is illegal in some countries (with a few exceptions). If you have been raped, you should report it to law enforcement.

    I hope that helps. You may have to look into this further as I tried to keep this as short as possible.


    mmolouIselingervaise1Nepheth
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  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    NorseGod said:
    Dvora said:
    Better question, why do they rape you so much for "expansions" that are one tiny new zone.  New class ya sure... but the amount of new content is a complete ripoff.

    Not to mention that all their zones are all boring as shit and look like some kid was randomly plopping assets down with no artistic sense at all,
    Even better question, Who's forcing you to buy it?

    You see, people not living on food stamps and section 8 housing, require what is known as currency, generally in the form of "cash", as I do not want to pay my bills with, for example, chickens. Chickens are harder to transport and store than "cash".

    Cash fits in my pocket, chickens do not. And what if the service provider doesn't want my chickens? What if they want cows? How many chickens do I have to trade for cows? But what if the person with cows, will only trade corn for their cows? 

    In what is called an ""employer/employee" relationship", cash is exchanged for services from the "employer" to the "employee". In this case, the service provided is writing code.

    The employer then sells a final product in it's totality of services provided by the employee to create more cash to pay for the employees, pay for materials and utilities, and to create even more products and grow, sometimes resulting in hiring additional employees, who all need to be paid with currency in exchange for their services.

    The employer needs the employees to keep creating products. The employees needs the employer to stay in and grow the need for the service the employee is providing.

    The employees are then free to use that currency any way they want. Some choose to waste it. Some make the choice to better themselves. Most all, like the employer, have obligations to pay for services as well.

    The consumer (you) also plays a part in this. You transfer currency in exchange for services.

    The employer needs consumers to purchase these products to get this currency so that they can transfer that currency for services provided by employees and to grow their business.

    *Note NOT paying currency in exchange for services is known as slavery.

    **Also note, we live in a free market society. That means, we are not forced by law (people with guns will come to your home) to participate in consuming services for whatever reason.

    ***Also note, "rape" is illegal in some countries (with a few exceptions). If you have been raped, you should report it to law enforcement.

    I hope that helps. You may have to look into this further as I tried to keep this as short as possible.


    Yes, employees have to be paid and companies need to turn a profit - thanks for stating the obvious.

    Thing is that when ESO dropped the mandatory sub they went to a system where you either bought the DLCs or you optionally subbed and got access to all DLC with your sub... simple.

    But then they decided that not only were they going to go from 2 or 3 good size DLC per year + a minor one to 1 good size one and 3 minor ones. They then decide to change the name of the good sized one to a "chapter" and charge extra for that one - sub or no sub. In other words they went to a lesser DLC per year cadence and simultaneously upped the price.

    They got away with it because that first "chapter" was Morrowind and they hyped the shit out of it and got people to believe that "chapters" were something bigger than DLCs. It was a classic case of "Hey, look over here!" sleight of hand marketing.

    So now we've had 3 "chapters" and it's pretty obvious to anyone who has been there from the start and has paid attention that none of the chapters are any bigger or more awesome than the Orsinium DLC they released way back when DLCs were included in the sub or Craglorn which was the first new zone added when the sub was still mandatory.

    So Dvora's crude hyperboles notwithstanding, he is not entirely wrong if you know the historical context.
    gervaise1[Deleted User]
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

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    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • YanocchiYanocchi Member UncommonPosts: 677
    I can't believe it. It finally went through.

    I tried three times with 18 gigabytes of downloaded patch files. After the first and second times I tried deleting some stuff free more hard drive space. That didn't help. Then I ran the repair process. Many hours and more gigabytes later it finally succeeded.
    gervaise1[Deleted User]
    Baldur's Gate Online - Video Trailer
    * more info, screenshots and videos here

  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Yanocchi said:
    I can't believe it. It finally went through.

    I tried three times with 18 gigabytes of downloaded patch files. After the first and second times I tried deleting some stuff free more hard drive space. That didn't help. Then I ran the repair process. Many hours and more gigabytes later it finally succeeded.
    You might want to go into your Documents > Elder Scrolls Online > Live folder and rename the user.txt file and let the game rebuild a new one when it next launches. I have found over the years that this fixes all kinds of weird issues in ESO.
    Yanocchigervaise1[Deleted User]
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 9,002
    I've never had an update problem with the game yet.  Run it off a second drive used for games.  I always make sure I have enough drive space available.  I do general drive maintenance from time to time.  Been with the game off and on since launch.  

    Every game has it's good and bad aspects.  Good luck with the game Yanocchi.
    Yanocchigervaise1

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • AbimorAbimor Member RarePosts: 887
    ya Iselin makes a good point I quit after the last expansion I do not mind paying the sub and I do not mind buying expansions what really did me in is them calling it something different so they could charge for it. If you want to charge for that stuff just come out and say hey we like cash were going to charge extra for it. Instead they tried to wordsmith their way around it and just look greedy. On topic While I have never had a eso patch problem I recently had to delete ddo and start over for some random patch error chalk it up to computers being weird I agree the data limit thing could be painful and expensive. sorry you have had so much trouble with it.  I hope you get a ton of enjoyment from the game it was fun.   
    Yanocchigervaise1
  • YanocchiYanocchi Member UncommonPosts: 677
    Do you mean UserSettings.txt file? I went to check and discovered that I tried fiddling with that file already five years ago when I had some other issues in the game. :hushed:

    The official ESO helpdesk instructions suggest to empty ESO folders from patch files when encountering the patch manifest error 206. Those instructions don't help at all because there are no residue temporary files remaining when the patch fails. They also suggest checking anti-virus software but in my case that's not the issue. Sometimes the error occurs when there is insufficient hard drive space. At least once or twice the error occured because there were problems with the server and it resolved over time when they fixed or tweaked something server-side. I also noticed that error 206 is not the only one related to patch manifest problems.

    The problem mainly occurs when they release really big expansions. It doesn't happen as often with smaller patches.
    gervaise1
    Baldur's Gate Online - Video Trailer
    * more info, screenshots and videos here

  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Yanocchi said:
    Do you mean UserSettings.txt file? I went to check and discovered that I tried fiddling with that file already five years ago when I had some other issues in the game. :hushed:

    Yeah that's the file I meant.
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • YanocchiYanocchi Member UncommonPosts: 677
    edited May 2019
    Thanks to everyone for the discussion. :smile:

    My conclusion is that the game can't patch properly when there is only 80-100 GB of free space on the drive where the game is installed. Running the repair process allows the game to handle the verification and patching process in smaller chunks and 80-100 GB of free space becomes enough to complete it. People who wrote that they've never had issues with it probably have a lot more than 100 GB of free space available on their drive. I've rarely seen games requiring so much free hard drive space for patching processes.

    Still, quite annoying that the game can't do a preliminary check first and it notifies you at the last second when there is only 0.2 megabytes left to patch. After that, it deletes the 6 GB patch and it has to download it all over again when you try again.


    [Deleted User]
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    * more info, screenshots and videos here

  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    Abimor said:
    ya Iselin makes a good point I quit after the last expansion I do not mind paying the sub and I do not mind buying expansions what really did me in is them calling it something different so they could charge for it. If you want to charge for that stuff just come out and say hey we like cash were going to charge extra for it. Instead they tried to wordsmith their way around it and just look greedy. On topic While I have never had a eso patch problem I recently had to delete ddo and start over for some random patch error chalk it up to computers being weird I agree the data limit thing could be painful and expensive. sorry you have had so much trouble with it.  I hope you get a ton of enjoyment from the game it was fun.   
    I think ZoS discovered what I call "subscription freeloaders". 

    What a sub allows is for people to join a game (any streaming service) for a month or whatever, consume "all" the content and then unsub. As far as ESO goes maybe they revert to the PvP or switch to another game.  

    So instead of the optional sub being "extra" revenue - on top of the b2p revenue they expected to get for new content - they determined from an examination of customer behaviour that it was costing them money or not generating what they expected. The irony! And so now there are "chapters". 

    The alternative is that ZoS are simply "squeezing" to see how far they can push things so as to make more money.

    Maybe both.
    Abimor
  • NorseGodNorseGod Member EpicPosts: 2,654
    Yanocchi said:
    Thanks to everyone for the discussion. :smile:

    My conclusion is that the game can't patch properly when there is only 80-100 GB of free space on the drive where the game is installed. Running the repair process allows the game to handle the verification and patching process in smaller chunks and 80-100 GB of free space becomes enough to complete it. People who wrote that they've never had issues with it probably have a lot more than 100 GB of free space available on their drive. I've rarely seen games requiring so much free hard drive space for patching processes.

    Still, quite annoying that the game can't do a preliminary check first and it notifies you at the last second when there is only 0.2 megabytes left to patch. After that, it deletes the 6 GB patch and it has to download it all over again when you try again.


    Cool!

    So when are you fixing your problem by getting a bigger HD? I suggest getting an SSD and keeping games on that. Works great.
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  • MuktukMuktuk Member UncommonPosts: 84
    Not only does their patching suck, but when you're finally done you'll discover that almost none of your addons work.

    By the time all your addons get patched you'll typically have ~2-3 weeks until the next patch gets released...

    Makes the game feel like its consistently in a broken state.
    mmolou
  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 9,002
    Muktuk said:
    Not only does their patching suck, but when you're finally done you'll discover that almost none of your addons work.

    By the time all your addons get patched you'll typically have ~2-3 weeks until the next patch gets released...

    Makes the game feel like its consistently in a broken state.
    I just got my add-ons working again.  The problem for me were the dependency files.  If you click on the add-on that's not working (when in game hit escape, then click on add-ons to see the list) you will see a brief description followed by the dependent library files that it uses, white is working properly and red means the file is missing or needs to be updated.  I just D/L the files in red using minion and my lorebooks, skyshards, and a few other things are now working again.  It will probably take awhile to get all the updates for the new content but it's slowly coming in. 

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • NorseGodNorseGod Member EpicPosts: 2,654
    Muktuk said:
    Not only does their patching suck, but when you're finally done you'll discover that almost none of your addons work.

    By the time all your addons get patched you'll typically have ~2-3 weeks until the next patch gets released...

    Makes the game feel like its consistently in a broken state.
    >HD too small on MY 9 year old computer
    >third-party add-ons are out of date, third-party
    >blames Zenimax

    At what point do people take personal responsibility?

    At what point do these concern threads sound like irrelevant GW2/FF players trolling?
    Nephethmmolou
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