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12 sales in 15 months, 0 maps in 6 months, LOL

slagathoreslagathore Member UncommonPosts: 31

They have been able to put together promotions 12 out of the last 15 months (all of which is beyond when they said they would continue with the store), yet they can't launch a map selection system even 6 months after their initial projections.

How is this not criminal at this point?

Gdemami
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Comments

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,505
    They get bonus points for sincerely trying? 

    Goodwill is a funny thing to understand sometimes
    slagathoreGaladournMrMelGibson

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 16,985

    They have been able to put together promotions 12 out of the last 15 months (all of which is beyond when they said they would continue with the store), yet they can't launch a map selection system even 6 months after their initial projections.

    How is this not criminal at this point?

    As long as people are silly enough to support Caspien's attempt at having his team Roleplay as Developers I guess I do not blame him for milking them for as much as he can.  Hell, if people would pay $6M so I can just fart around wasting time and money for years with zero accountability I'd be silly to turn it down.

    So I think it's ridiculous, but it takes two to tango.   Some people waste money on hookers and drugs.  Some people want to fund Caspien's fantasy...  I stopped trying to understand why people do things.


    But if I were them (I'm not), I wouldn't be as worried about the money that was raised, or the money that was left, but rather how much more time and cash will their pockets get fleeced to get this thing "launched".
    slagathoreMendelGdemamiGaladournAethaeryn

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Member LegendaryPosts: 8,505

    They have been able to put together promotions 12 out of the last 15 months (all of which is beyond when they said they would continue with the store), yet they can't launch a map selection system even 6 months after their initial projections.

    How is this not criminal at this point?

    As long as people are silly enough to support Caspien's attempt at having his team Roleplay as Developers I guess I do not blame him for milking them for as much as he can.  Hell, if people would pay $6M so I can just fart around wasting time and money for years with zero accountability I'd be silly to turn it down.

    So I think it's ridiculous, but it takes two to tango.   Some people waste money on hookers and drugs.  Some people want to fund Caspien's fantasy...  I stopped trying to understand why people do things.


    But if I were them (I'm not), I wouldn't be as worried about the money that was raised, or the money that was left, but rather how much more time and cash will their pockets get fleeced to get this thing "launched".
    Hey now, hookers buy things they need with that money, and they actually provide the service as advertised with full disclosure of what you're getting, so honestly, I think the hooker transaction is more honest.  That's..  Sad to say.
    slagathoreMendel[Deleted User]GaladournMrMelGibson[Deleted User]

    image
  • MendelMendel Member LegendaryPosts: 5,609

    They have been able to put together promotions 12 out of the last 15 months (all of which is beyond when they said they would continue with the store), yet they can't launch a map selection system even 6 months after their initial projections.

    How is this not criminal at this point?

    As long as people are silly enough to support Caspien's attempt at having his team Roleplay as Developers I guess I do not blame him for milking them for as much as he can.  Hell, if people would pay $6M so I can just fart around wasting time and money for years with zero accountability I'd be silly to turn it down.

    So I think it's ridiculous, but it takes two to tango.   Some people waste money on hookers and drugs.  Some people want to fund Caspien's fantasy...  I stopped trying to understand why people do things.


    But if I were them (I'm not), I wouldn't be as worried about the money that was raised, or the money that was left, but rather how much more time and cash will their pockets get fleeced to get this thing "launched".
    Hey now, hookers buy things they need with that money, and they actually provide the service as advertised with full disclosure of what you're getting, so honestly, I think the hooker transaction is more honest.  That's..  Sad to say.
    Can we all agree that missed delivery dates are the undisclosed STDs of game development?



    Dhamon99AnOldFartMadFrenchieGaladournAmathe[Deleted User]

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 16,985
    I also like the way the Ivory Tower has convinced themselves and the developers that the “stick your head in the sand” mentality is the best option to address their massive schedule and budget overruns.

    Just don’t mention it anymore!   If you don’t give new dates you can’t miss them!  Genius!

    It would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.
    Gdemami

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,505
    edited May 2019
    I also like the way the Ivory Tower has convinced themselves and the developers that the “stick your head in the sand” mentality is the best option to address their massive schedule and budget overruns.

    Just don’t mention it anymore!   If you don’t give new dates you can’t miss them!  Genius!

    It would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.
    Clearly for some backers no news is better than bad news...

    Which is a bit weird when you think of it.
    Slapshot1188

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • TorrskTorrsk Member UncommonPosts: 295
    I also like the way the Ivory Tower has convinced themselves and the developers that the “stick your head in the sand” mentality is the best option to address their massive schedule and budget overruns.

    Just don’t mention it anymore!   If you don’t give new dates you can’t miss them!  Genius!

    It would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.
    Which one is the lesser evil. Them saying dates and missing them by months or them not saying anything? 

    I would rather something like the SC timeline "This is what we were working on, this is what we have finished. This is what's next in line". Then showing off whatever was completed. Would seem like true progress was getting made. 

    Whichever way you pick from above, nothing is shown off either way. Well the only time anything is shown off, is through the promos. 
    AnOldFartStaalBurgher
  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,671
    After they said that the KS money was to fund a prototype in order to get 'real investors' 3-4 years ago, I pretty much knew there would never be a game. But hey, maybe it was worth paying to play this MUD all these years.
    Gdemami
  • ConstantineMerusConstantineMerus Member EpicPosts: 3,338

    They have been able to put together promotions 12 out of the last 15 months (all of which is beyond when they said they would continue with the store), yet they can't launch a map selection system even 6 months after their initial projections.

    How is this not criminal at this point?

    As long as people are silly enough to support Caspien's attempt at having his team Roleplay as Developers I guess I do not blame him for milking them for as much as he can.  Hell, if people would pay $6M so I can just fart around wasting time and money for years with zero accountability I'd be silly to turn it down.

    So I think it's ridiculous, but it takes two to tango.   Some people waste money on hookers and drugs.  Some people want to fund Caspien's fantasy...  I stopped trying to understand why people do things.


    But if I were them (I'm not), I wouldn't be as worried about the money that was raised, or the money that was left, but rather how much more time and cash will their pockets get fleeced to get this thing "launched".
    I'm not sure how one can waste money on hookers or drugs. What else do you consider as waste, rent? Food?
    [Deleted User]MadFrenchieOGDeathRow
    Constantine, The Console Poster

    • "One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
  • AnOldFartAnOldFart Member RarePosts: 562
    I also like the way the Ivory Tower has convinced themselves and the developers that the “stick your head in the sand” mentality is the best option to address their massive schedule and budget overruns.

    Just don’t mention it anymore!   If you don’t give new dates you can’t miss them!  Genius!

    It would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.
    This is taken out of context slapshot and you know it. 
    People have asked that SBS stop giving dates out until the feature is ready so that they stop missing them.

    I agree with torrsk's suggestion, give a general idea of what is being worked on since it is better to not give a target date, than to give one and miss it. 
    Scot
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 16,985
    AnOldFart said:
    I also like the way the Ivory Tower has convinced themselves and the developers that the “stick your head in the sand” mentality is the best option to address their massive schedule and budget overruns.

    Just don’t mention it anymore!   If you don’t give new dates you can’t miss them!  Genius!

    It would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.
    This is taken out of context slapshot and you know it. 
    People have asked that SBS stop giving dates out until the feature is ready so that they stop missing them.

    I agree with torrsk's suggestion, give a general idea of what is being worked on since it is better to not give a target date, than to give one and miss it. 
    It’s not out of context at all.
    And Star Citizen does actually post a timeline by quarter: https://www.robertsspaceindustries.com/roadmap/board/1-Star-Citizen
    That somewhat works for SC because all backers have been playing the game for years. Will CoE allow all backers into the game tomorrow to see their “progress”?

    But do we really want to use StarCitizen as the model to follow?  Seriously?

    The point is that when a company that has taken your money (and refuses to refund it even though they are years late) continues to miss their own dates even when given just 7 days lead time, some people see the solution as simply not giving dates.  That’s a suggestion to help prevent PR blowback, but does not address the root issue which is their fucked up planning and development schedule.
    Gdemami

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • GaladournGaladourn Member RarePosts: 1,813
    what's wrong with hookers and drugs?
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 22,966
    Come on guys where would we go if we did not have Prince Caspian to entertain us? This is the only MMO in development I follow, its like Basil Fawlty's younger American cousin decided to make a MMO. :)

    Still and as always, I hope we get a good game out of this in spite of the management, I am sure the guys on the shop floor are doing their bit.
  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,342
    AnOldFart said:
    This is taken out of context slapshot and you know it. 
    ...is there a chance you starting to realize slowly he really is a troll afterall?
    bcbully
  • RidrithRidrith Member RarePosts: 808
    This is just embarrassing at this point. I'm hoping that CoE dies swiftly or they cancel it soon. It's so painful to watch. Caspian is a god-awful "developer". He's the reason why companies don't need idea guys. Anyone can have a good idea, but the ability to be able to manage and execute it are entirely different things.
    Gdemami
    I like to complain about games.
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 16,985
    Ridrith said:
    This is just embarrassing at this point. I'm hoping that CoE dies swiftly or they cancel it soon. It's so painful to watch. Caspian is a god-awful "developer". He's the reason why companies don't need idea guys. Anyone can have a good idea, but the ability to be able to manage and execute it are entirely different things.
    Do you blame Caspien or the people that continue to enable his behavior and even fund it?  

    These folks were literally in a frenzy frenzy to spend MORE money to move up the list so that they could pick their non-existent virtual land parcel before the other people. Think about that, they were and are throwing money to get higher on the selection list when the land they want to select not only doesn’t exist in game, but not even on a map yet!  

    I said it before but if people want wanted to pay $6M to me so I could spend it with no oversight or accountability I’d have sales every week.   Looking at the above title I’d say 12 sales in 15 months means Caspien left 3 months of sales on the table.

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • AnOldFartAnOldFart Member RarePosts: 562
    Gdemami said:
    AnOldFart said:
    This is taken out of context slapshot and you know it. 
    ...is there a chance you starting to realize slowly he really is a troll afterall?
    He isn't a troll, alot of points he makes are actually valid. 
    But occasionally he does take something out of context to help validate his point even if that's wrong. This is a rarity but in this case I feel it need to be brought up.

    You see in this case he claims its the Ivory Tower wanting to Bury their head in the sand where actually its nothing to do with that.

    All those that called for dates to be only announced when the work was finished are calling for it because
    1) alot took time off work for their selection
    2) they are sick of unrealistic deadlines
    GdemamiScot
  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    They should make a release date a purchasable item in their cash shop. Imagine how much money that would rake in.
    Slapshot1188slagathoreNildenStaalBurgher

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 16,985
    AnOldFart said:
    Gdemami said:
    AnOldFart said:
    This is taken out of context slapshot and you know it. 
    ...is there a chance you starting to realize slowly he really is a troll afterall?
    He isn't a troll, alot of points he makes are actually valid. 
    But occasionally he does take something out of context to help validate his point even if that's wrong. This is a rarity but in this case I feel it need to be brought up.

    You see in this case he claims its the Ivory Tower wanting to Bury their head in the sand where actually its nothing to do with that.

    All those that called for dates to be only announced when the work was finished are calling for it because
    1) alot took time off work for their selection
    2) they are sick of unrealistic deadlines
    Not giving dates is simply treating the symptom not the actual issue.  
    As I said earlier, people are asking them to follow Star Citizen.  Setting aside the whole absurdity of using SC as a model for anything other than raising money, even Star Citizen gives a very detailed quarterly roadmap.  The most important part of that is the first column which shows what was actually released to the players. Every backer gets to play the game as it exists and has for years. Is CoE going to do the same?

    Simply not releasing dates with no other actions is exactly like putting your head in the sand.  And just as useful when it comes to getting this thing to release. I’d argue it actually hurts because now it removes what little pressure there was to get this thing done.

    Gdemami

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • slagathoreslagathore Member UncommonPosts: 31
    A dateless roadmap is the easiest solution for them at this point.  List a feature in as much or little detail they feel comfortable with and check things off when they get done. No dates (specific dates, quarterly goals, nothing), just checklists.  Viewers will see things getting done and they don't commit to dates. Stupid simple solution that I've seen many indies do. It's not perfect but it works.

    That said SBS can't use my suggestion because it would reveal just how slow they are progressing. They only have, what, 175 features to design, code, make artwork for, implement, and test, right?
    Gdemami
  • Tiamat64Tiamat64 Member RarePosts: 1,545
    edited May 2019
    (Some) Drugs are bad because they are addicting and can ruin your body.

    (Legal) Hookers is just honest entertainment business as old as time, though.

    CoA meanwhile is just an illusion scamming (even if probably not on purpose) people out of their money for something that will (highly probably) never come to fruition (and the guys roleplaying as developers probably realize this but hey, people keep giving them money so...).
  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,342
    edited May 2019
    A dateless roadmap is the easiest solution for them at this point.
    ...doubt it.

    You will just get people ranting/trolling how long x feature takes to make or how long since last feature was finished, how progress is slow etc. etc.


    You can't stop human beings from being self entitled idiots....
  • GutlardGutlard Member RarePosts: 1,019
    Well, since actions speak louder than words, if they did go the 'no dates' route, as a way to keep the fan base updated they could release continuous game play/screen shots of actual work progress being done.

    See, we started with stick figures here, but 6 months later, we've added hair. Our plan within the next 6 months is to add a sword belt, but we're not going to promise anything at this early point. Stay tuned!

    Gut Out!
    AnOldFart

    What, me worry?

  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Member EpicPosts: 3,967
    Legend has it, if you accidentally desecrate the burial ground of games that have bad development cycles LOLBOT will appear before you. Tread carefully. The LOL button is it's only doorway into this world.


    DakeruScotNildenGaladournBaalzharon[Deleted User]
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    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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