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Fallout 76 you cannot get a refund even if you wanted one

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  • OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Member EpicPosts: 2,277
    Thane said:
    https://comicbook.com/gaming/2018/11/22/bethesda-offering-refunds-fallout-76-pc/

    not gonna get any deeper into this "discussion" you refund kids have here.

    uh, and the real "irony here" is people buying games thinking they can just pretend those are fucking demos.
    Sell me a broken car, I can get a refund.

    Sell me a broken piece of tech, I can get a refund.

    Sell me a broken game, "It's not a demo! No refunds!"
    SailorMomrasgan514


    MMORPG.COM took away my swinging cheerleader butt .gif.

  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,268
    edited November 2018
    Vrika said:
    Hultay said:

    14 days to cancel and return purchases made outside shops (online, by phone or mail order)

    In the EU you have the right to return these purchases within 14 days for a full refund. You can do so for any reason – even if you simply changed your mind.

    Doesnt matter if they they want it or not if you are EU citizen then they got no other choice.

    False. That provision does not apply to online content once you've connected to the service, or sealed digital content once you've broken its seal.

    Basically it's right to refund for physical items, but not for software, music or movies.
    I'd have to double check but I'm pretty sure U.S. consumer protection laws make refunds within a certain period of time mandatory for any business that operates in the states.  Even an 'as is' policy can be challenged and won if the policy was shown to be unjust or unfair.  Most businesses get around it by making arbitration mandatory first, and making sure the arbitrator leans towards the business and not the consumer, or they never go with that arbitrator again.  Most people don't want to go through the hassle and just take the loss.
    Hulray is actually right in regards to EU with their provisions extending to virtual goods as well (although this was amended within recent years). Unfortunately US laws currently exempt virtual goods.

    Lol anyone else remember this:

    #SavePlayer1




  • TokkenTokken Member RarePosts: 2,515
    It's hard to feel sorry for the people who want to have a refund when all the signs were there that it was gonna be a bad game to begin with.   Impulse buying and joining the hype train sucks.   It's best to listen to all the reviews and, wait and see how it plays out after a few weeks after release.
    JemAs666AlBQuirkyThahar
    Make PvE GREAT Again!
  • PhaserlightPhaserlight Member EpicPosts: 3,002
    I paid full price and feel like it was worth it. I'll be playing it for the foreseeable future. I feel bad for those who can't get into FO76. It's not like there are a ton of other games out there for us starving MMO fans these days. 
    Sure there are.

    I'm glad you're enjoying FO76 though.

    "The simple is the seal of the true and beauty is the splendor of truth" -Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar
    Authored 139 missions in Vendetta Online and 6 tracks in Distance

  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,268
    Dont worry guys, Anthem is right around the corner and it will sa......sorry I couldn't complete that without laughing my ass off.
    JeffSpicoliOG_ZorvanOctagon7711anemoXarkoAlBQuirkyThaharTacticalZombeh
  • cheyanecheyane Member EpicPosts: 7,209
    edited November 2018
    Tokken said:
    It's hard to feel sorry for the people who want to have a refund when all the signs were there that it was gonna be a bad game to begin with.   Impulse buying and joining the hype train sucks.   It's best to listen to all the reviews and, wait and see how it plays out after a few weeks after release.
    People also claim these games can be patched up. Can we really blame the consumer instead of  the company that released the game in a state people are flocking to ask for refunds of the amount they paid. Come on surely they bear some responsibility but does it abrogate their rights?

    However changing your refund policy because you're having to refund too many returns is so dodgy it might actually mean that they released the game fully knowing how shitty it was.

    No Man's Sky was released on Steam and they suffered from many refunds because people found that there was no multiplayer as was advertised by the creator on a whimsical video. At least they released it on steam so that people could actually get a refund unlike Bethesda here who decided to control the refunds themselves. A prescient move or a calculated one?
    Tokken
    Martens: "With all due respect, madam, where are you going with this?"
    Avasarala: "Wherever I goddamn like."
  • SeelinnikoiSeelinnikoi Member RarePosts: 1,355
    They had the best IP to make a game similar to Fallen Earth (an old school survival MMO) and they blew it big time!

    Hell, they could even make something similar to Rust and it would be amazing based on the IP alone.

    But no, they made Fallout 76 which is now considered the worst Fallout in the series.

    This is what happens when Executives tell Devs how to make games, as I really believe the Devs (if true gamers) would see this game would stink a mile away!
    JeffSpicoli
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  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,268
    edited November 2018
    cheyane said:
    Tokken said:
    It's hard to feel sorry for the people who want to have a refund when all the signs were there that it was gonna be a bad game to begin with.   Impulse buying and joining the hype train sucks.   It's best to listen to all the reviews and, wait and see how it plays out after a few weeks after release.
    People also claim these games can be patched up. Can we really blame the consumer instead of  the company that released the game in a state people are flocking to ask for refunds of the amount they paid. Come on surely they bear some responsibility but does it abrogate their rights?

    However changing your refund policy because you're having to refund too many returns is so dodgy it might actually mean that they released the game fully knowing how shitty it was.

    No Man's Sky was released on Steam and they suffered from many refunds because people found that there was no multiplayer as was advertised by the creator on a whimsical video. At least they released it on steam so that people could actually get a refund unlike Bethesda here who decided to control the refunds themselves. A prescient move or a calculated one?
    I'll say consumers should be blamed equally with bethesda when it comes to their products, simply because it goes back to what you first said, people expect bethesda games to be modded over a period of time etc to become a better experience. Now with this game in particular, I'll honestly put more blame on the consumer simply because the game did have a beta period (all-bit-it brief and too close to launch) which logic should've told anyone who participated that this it was what you were gonna get upon release. If people didn't refund after partaking in it just because they thought it was going to be fixed later down the line, they only have themselves to blame for that level of thinking. We can't think of consumers as these little babies that can't use logic or do a simple google search yet its okay to allow these drones to use money.
    ragebulletTokken
  • cheyanecheyane Member EpicPosts: 7,209
    Look it is my honest opinion that developers are not taking responsibility for their fuckups. They are trying to slink about and mince their way into profits with minimal effort. This is an example of that and I think players should punish them so that these practices will not be rewarded. 

    Unfortunately the Fallout name alone is enough to make people buy the game. Perhaps if more scorn is heaped on them for this disgraceful refusal to refund the loss of profit will make a difference even if the tarnishing of the name of the franchise does not.
    Martens: "With all due respect, madam, where are you going with this?"
    Avasarala: "Wherever I goddamn like."
  • OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Member EpicPosts: 2,277
    I wonder, could they have made a shit game on purpose? Maybe they needed a big write-off on their taxes.


    MMORPG.COM took away my swinging cheerleader butt .gif.

  • ragebulletragebullet Member UncommonPosts: 49
    Albatroes said:
    cheyane said:
    Tokken said:
    It's hard to feel sorry for the people who want to have a refund when all the signs were there that it was gonna be a bad game to begin with.   Impulse buying and joining the hype train sucks.   It's best to listen to all the reviews and, wait and see how it plays out after a few weeks after release.
    People also claim these games can be patched up. Can we really blame the consumer instead of  the company that released the game in a state people are flocking to ask for refunds of the amount they paid. Come on surely they bear some responsibility but does it abrogate their rights?

    However changing your refund policy because you're having to refund too many returns is so dodgy it might actually mean that they released the game fully knowing how shitty it was.

    No Man's Sky was released on Steam and they suffered from many refunds because people found that there was no multiplayer as was advertised by the creator on a whimsical video. At least they released it on steam so that people could actually get a refund unlike Bethesda here who decided to control the refunds themselves. A prescient move or a calculated one?
    I'll say consumers should be blamed equally with bethesda when it comes to their products, simply because it goes back to what you first said, people expect bethesda games to be modded over a period of time etc to become a better experience. Now with this game in particular, I'll honestly put more blame on the consumer simply because the game did have a beta period (all-bit-it brief and too close to launch) which logic should've told anyone who participated that this it was what you were gonna get upon release. If people didn't refund after partaking in it just because they thought it was going to be fixed later down the line, they only have themselves to blame for that level of thinking. We can't think of consumers as these little babies that can't use logic or do a simple google search yet its okay to allow these drones to use money.
    i agree consumers should do more research on games before taking the plunge, but....should developers be making half baked games at 60 dollar price tag? both perspectives are shit lol
  • PiscorePiscore Member UncommonPosts: 263
    kitarad said:
    https://www.spieltimes.com/news/bethesda-promised-refund-on-fallout-76-then-bailed-out-the-next-day/


    No wonder they were afraid to put it on Steam. They would have faced an avalanche of refund requests they cannot refuse because of Steam's policy on refunds. Bunch of thieves.

    If you had any confidence in your product you should allow refunds. 

    And another price drop

    https://www.pcgamer.com/fallout-76-drops-in-price-again-to-dollar35/
    That's because the game is not release on Steam ;)

    l2p

  • OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Member EpicPosts: 2,277
    Albatroes said:
    cheyane said:
    Tokken said:
    It's hard to feel sorry for the people who want to have a refund when all the signs were there that it was gonna be a bad game to begin with.   Impulse buying and joining the hype train sucks.   It's best to listen to all the reviews and, wait and see how it plays out after a few weeks after release.
    People also claim these games can be patched up. Can we really blame the consumer instead of  the company that released the game in a state people are flocking to ask for refunds of the amount they paid. Come on surely they bear some responsibility but does it abrogate their rights?

    However changing your refund policy because you're having to refund too many returns is so dodgy it might actually mean that they released the game fully knowing how shitty it was.

    No Man's Sky was released on Steam and they suffered from many refunds because people found that there was no multiplayer as was advertised by the creator on a whimsical video. At least they released it on steam so that people could actually get a refund unlike Bethesda here who decided to control the refunds themselves. A prescient move or a calculated one?
    I'll say consumers should be blamed equally with bethesda when it comes to their products, simply because it goes back to what you first said, people expect bethesda games to be modded over a period of time etc to become a better experience. Now with this game in particular, I'll honestly put more blame on the consumer simply because the game did have a beta period (all-bit-it brief and too close to launch) which logic should've told anyone who participated that this it was what you were gonna get upon release. If people didn't refund after partaking in it just because they thought it was going to be fixed later down the line, they only have themselves to blame for that level of thinking. We can't think of consumers as these little babies that can't use logic or do a simple google search yet its okay to allow these drones to use money.
    i agree consumers should do more research on games before taking the plunge, but....should developers be making half baked games at 60 dollar price tag? both perspectives are shit lol
    Part of the problems is gamers themselves. For every person who says they're waiting for reviews before they buy a game, you have another right there ready to tell them "Why do you need other people to tell you if the game is good or not? Buy it and find out for yourself!!".
    Kyleran


    MMORPG.COM took away my swinging cheerleader butt .gif.

  • rojoArcueidrojoArcueid Member EpicPosts: 10,401
    edited November 2018
    Forgrimm said:
    That's why this guy wrecked a gamestop

    People still go to Gamestop? WoW! :neutral:
    I prefer to buy my games/hardware from Amazon but i do go to GS when they happen to have a better deal. In 2016 i bought a brand new WiiU for $160 at gamestop when Amazon sellers had it for like $300 still.

    As for Fallout 76, just like all mmos it makes zero sense to get it in physical form unless you want a collectors edition.
    Post edited by rojoArcueid on




  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,268
    edited November 2018
    cheyane said:
    Look it is my honest opinion that developers are not taking responsibility for their fuckups. They are trying to slink about and mince their way into profits with minimal effort. This is an example of that and I think players should punish them so that these practices will not be rewarded. 

    Unfortunately the Fallout name alone is enough to make people buy the game. Perhaps if more scorn is heaped on them for this disgraceful refusal to refund the loss of profit will make a difference even if the tarnishing of the name of the franchise does not.
    I'm not saying your opinion is wrong (it is your opinion after all), all I'm saying is it was people didn't go in blind with this title like they did with say No Man's Sky. People were able to test the game (although you had to pre-order to get someone with a code) and/or see beta footage then make decisions accordingly (which honestly a lot of games have been doing less and less this past decade).

    Now if there wasn't any public testing, then I'd go back to what I said earlier and blame them both equally since bethesda has been known to always launch poor quality titles from a technical perspective. As a developer, should they be doing this? No. But its something the people have been okay for around a decade, so what exactly is the incentive for them to change. I mean Todd even said it himself that their creation engine was utilized with modders in mind (which is unfortunate that TES6 is confirmed to be on this "amazing" engine as well).

    Now people thinking Bethesda wouldnt honestly release something with little/to no effort on purpose and try to profit, just think back to them trying to charge for mods. They've honestly never been the 'stand-up' guys for the gaming genre.

    Albatroes said:
    cheyane said:
    Tokken said:
    It's hard to feel sorry for the people who want to have a refund when all the signs were there that it was gonna be a bad game to begin with.   Impulse buying and joining the hype train sucks.   It's best to listen to all the reviews and, wait and see how it plays out after a few weeks after release.
    People also claim these games can be patched up. Can we really blame the consumer instead of  the company that released the game in a state people are flocking to ask for refunds of the amount they paid. Come on surely they bear some responsibility but does it abrogate their rights?

    However changing your refund policy because you're having to refund too many returns is so dodgy it might actually mean that they released the game fully knowing how shitty it was.

    No Man's Sky was released on Steam and they suffered from many refunds because people found that there was no multiplayer as was advertised by the creator on a whimsical video. At least they released it on steam so that people could actually get a refund unlike Bethesda here who decided to control the refunds themselves. A prescient move or a calculated one?
    I'll say consumers should be blamed equally with bethesda when it comes to their products, simply because it goes back to what you first said, people expect bethesda games to be modded over a period of time etc to become a better experience. Now with this game in particular, I'll honestly put more blame on the consumer simply because the game did have a beta period (all-bit-it brief and too close to launch) which logic should've told anyone who participated that this it was what you were gonna get upon release. If people didn't refund after partaking in it just because they thought it was going to be fixed later down the line, they only have themselves to blame for that level of thinking. We can't think of consumers as these little babies that can't use logic or do a simple google search yet its okay to allow these drones to use money.
    i agree consumers should do more research on games before taking the plunge, but....should developers be making half baked games at 60 dollar price tag? both perspectives are shit lol
    Unfortunately, this is the reality we live in now. People find paying for alphas/betas perfectly fine. Companies think they are the savior of the industry if they dont have lootboxes but just micro-transactions. Its sad to see now that its so rare to find a game that even gives you alternative costumes for 'free' just by playing the game and doing challenges within the game. But the main reason we're in a world like this is because people accepted it. Supply can't work that well if there isn't a demand.

    ragebullet
  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Member EpicPosts: 3,967
    Go get your refunds but I agree with people who are saying stop being impulsive buyers.

    If a developer/publisher wants your money that fast they'll do a better job of providing/marketing the features that will drive the demand.

    I looked at Fallout 76, saw how it COULD be a good thing but there wasn't enough evidence for me to join the stampede. If it was that good I would have found out 2-3 days later. Being a tempered skeptic never hurt ANYBODY.

    These companies live and die by their metrics now. So consumers have to  start understanding the whole "just try it" approach is negative reinforcement. Force them to market better, make them do better. Stop falling for the awesome trailer/sh!##y movie big Hollywood studio tricks. Getting accountability while they already have your money doesn't work.

    They'll take the money, take the sign-ups, laugh, run the game into the ground. Then they'll fire the talented, sell the company, make more money, and the next publisher gets to molest the next round of unknowing consumers. They do this until there's nothing left. It's happened so many times for so long the players have to start being smarter. That won't make us "entitled", or "snowflakes", or "spoiled millennials". It makes us wise consumers who prefer solid products with proper feature marketing.

    Who's with me!?  :D


    TorvalragebulletMadFrenchiemaskedweaselTacticalZombeh
    "As far as the forum code of conduct, I would think it's a bit outdated and in need of a refre *CLOSED*" 

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,420
    OG_Zorvan said:

    Oh, and before anyone says "Metacritic scores don't matter!!", well it sure mattered when Bethesda used the Metacritic score to deny Obsidian their New Vegas bonuses. Can't have it both ways. :smile:
    False. Bethesda denied Obsidian their bonus because they had an agreement where bonus was tied to Metacritic score, but they do not have any similar agreement with Fallout 76 buyers. You can have it both ways simply by making different agreements.
     
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 17,835
    kitarad said:
    https://www.spieltimes.com/news/bethesda-promised-refund-on-fallout-76-then-bailed-out-the-next-day/


    No wonder they were afraid to put it on Steam. They would have faced an avalanche of refund requests they cannot refuse because of Steam's policy on refunds. Bunch of thieves.

    If you had any confidence in your product you should allow refunds. 

    And another price drop

    https://www.pcgamer.com/fallout-76-drops-in-price-again-to-dollar35/
    I knew before it launched that it looked crap so i didn't pay much attention to if it launched on Steam but this makes a lot of sense.I mean how many devs have we seen of late all heading to Steam,even games dying out are still trying Steam in hopes of a rebound.

    I also found it VERY odd how after the original backlash,every streamer who got a free copy made sure to put some form of a title to state they were exploring and not worried about content.
    I don't but if i was to stream a game,i don't tell HOW i am playing,i would simply state the game and let people watch.

    Gaming has just gone so south it is sad to see this all unfold.Streamers are soooo protective of their money maker they make sure nobody says anything about their game that might jeopardize $$ in any way.

    For years all we heard was FUN FUN FUN,geesh we still hear that word but all i see is partnerships and sponsors and $$$.

    That Pirates game from Microsoft was one of the worst releases at an unreal price i have ever seen in gaming.This Fallout is not THAT BAD if i compare it to that Pirates game but being slightly better than garbage is still crap.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 19,941
    Thane said:
    https://comicbook.com/gaming/2018/11/22/bethesda-offering-refunds-fallout-76-pc/

    not gonna get any deeper into this "discussion" you refund kids have here.

    uh, and the real "irony here" is people buying games thinking they can just pretend those are fucking demos.

    Read that thread and see how many people can't read and comprehend a simple Steam store entry. They asked a question to play wordsmith lawyer games. These are the same kind of people that bought No Man's Sky and nerd-raged. These are the same kind of people who bought Fallout 76 and then nerd-raged because they couldn't wait a few weeks.

    It's a self-centered entitlement mentality. They don't listen though. This isn't new. Many of us have been saying for years, don't buy into crowd-funded, early access, pre-release, or "beta" games if this sort of thing bothers you. They have no self-control and we're supposed to feel sorry for them.

    The industry isn't any better and Bethesda took the low road too. I don't have sympathy for either side. Mess with the bull, you get the horns.
    ragebulletKyleranMadFrenchieGobstopper3DThahar
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    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • linadragonlinadragon Member RarePosts: 589
    Game is actually fairly fun *shrugs*. People need to actually play it and try it before judging it. So much of the crap on metacritic is people that didn't play or are just people that want a very specific experience cuz of the name. It has its problems, but it is still a fun game. 
  • AlverantAlverant Member RarePosts: 1,207
    I have to roll my eyes when people say "do your research". In this post-truth era where people just cry "fake news" when presented with inconvenient facts, how can you trust what is being said? Game companies use NDAs and gag orders to keep bad news away and if a reviewer dares to give anything less than a perfect score they risk being shut out of the next release. Give a game a bad score and people will call you a "hater". Give it a good score and get called a "shill".

    No business deserves our trust because their profits depend on us buying their product. They are not our friends and we shouldn't treat them that way.
    Tokken
  • Vermillion_RaventhalVermillion_Raventhal Member EpicPosts: 4,099
    Going to pick up when it's cheap cheap.
    Octagon7711anemoTokken
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,348
    Game is actually fairly fun *shrugs*. People need to actually play it and try it before judging it. So much of the crap on metacritic is people that didn't play or are just people that want a very specific experience cuz of the name. It has its problems, but it is still a fun game. 
    It seems to me quite a few people went into this title knowing what it was likely to be like, and wanting to hate it for "reasons."

    How could it do anything but "meet" such expectations?  

     :D 

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

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  • btdtbtdt Member RarePosts: 523
    Used to be if you bought a video game, the moment you broke the seal on the plastic wrap, you could no longer return it for a refund.  Exchange it for the same item yes, but refund in cash?  Not on your life.

    Do I care that you can't get a refund on a video game?  Not one bit.

    Maybe next time wait until the game is actually a game... you keep throwing money at these silly games like you're on crack... expect to get rolled.
    maskedweaselAlBQuirky
  • k61977k61977 Member RarePosts: 1,324
    edited November 2018
    Unfortunately the US works differently than most of the world on refunds.  The laws benefit the companies more than the customer and every state is different in regards to what can an can't be done.  Digital goods are still a gray area for a lot of states.  Things like does the state you live when you bought the good have the power or is it the state where the company is located are things that are still being worked out.  The federal government doesn't really come in to play when it comes to return policies and laws here more than not it is state laws that set the precedence.  We have the federal buyers remorse law (cooling down) but digital goods do not fall into that range I believe I could be wrong.  Here is just a simple list showing how some of the states differ on this.  https://consumer.findlaw.com/consumer-transactions/customer-returns-and-refund-laws-by-state.html

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