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The problem with PC gaming isn't the games, it's the people

VhayneVhayne Member UncommonPosts: 632
Let me explain by throwing out this link....

https://store.steampowered.com/stats/Steam-Game-and-Player-Statistics?l=english)


The imbalance of players per game is crazy.  PUBG, DOTA2, and CS:GO together make up more playerbase than all of other games combined.  New games, good games, it doesn't matter.  These 3 are always like this, daily.


So the question is....Why?


My theory is that it's all "sports" based and popularity.  The players of these games are the same people that actually WATCH other people play games, like the popular youtubers.  I don't understand this concept, really.  I mean, I understand watching someone drive a racecar or whatever because it's something that YOU personally cannot do usually.  But all of these games can be played by everyone at any time.  So you watch them?  Maybe you can watch others read a book too sometime.  

Anyway, because those games are now "popular" because some dude on youtube plays them, means that everyone else wants to be like them or something.  So they have to play the same games.  Regardless of whether there are other, newer, or even better games out there to play.  

Maybe the word is "trendy"?  



The whole point is that companies see these numbers, and see how freaking OLD these games are, and they aren't encouraged to create anything new.  I mean, what's the point when the players don't care, obviously.  Let's just make another MOBA, or Battle Royale, or competitive E-Sports game to try and get some of those players.  

It just seems like a sickness these people have or something.  Don't they want to play new games?  Aren't they sick of playing the same game for 5+ years?  No wonder more companies aren't taking chances anymore.  When you see numbers so severely skewed as that, I'd be wary as well.

PhrykertinRhygarthceh4304507KodiumGdemamiMaurgrimPrecusor
«13

Comments

  • H0urg1assH0urg1ass Member EpicPosts: 2,380
    There will always, always be something in every genre that dominates the others.

    In tabletop miniatures it's Warhammer 40k.  If you buy a WH40K army, then you can take it to any city and find players, but if you buy Flames of War or Warmachine/Hordes or any other game out there, then it will be very regional and very hit or miss on whether anyone else plays it.  Trust me, I moved all over the country/world as a soldier and the only thing popular everywhere was WH40K.

    The same with pen and paper RPG's.  If you know how to play, and own D&D books, then you'll be able to find a group to play with in any city.  But if you're a huge fan of, in my case, Shadowrun, then you might find yourself being the GM almost everywhere you go and training new players.

    I'm also a fan of racing, and worldwide, the ultimate form of racing is Formula 1.  F1 is watched 10:1 by more people than any of the other series such as GP2, GP3 or even Formula E.

    The point is, that something always dominates.  But the great thing about video games is that unlike a lot of other things, they have worldwide accessibility.  I need a 40K army to play in most cities, but in the digital age, I can play any video game I want and find others playing it too.

    Honestly, I don't think it hurts innovation too much.  I think that it stifles it a little because as soon as something hits it big, then literally all of the AAA studios try to copy it.  But then again, the majority of AAA studios aren't really innovating to begin with, they're just dropping their next release of Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Borderlands, Metal Gear... etc to begin with.

    ... and no, most people really do find a game they like and stick with it.  It's actually more rare for  people to play dozens of different games a year.  My son for instance plays whatever Call of Duty is out 80% of the time, but he'll pick up 3-4 other games during the year too like Red Dead Redemption to play when his CoD buddies aren't online.
    AlBQuirkyKyleranOctagon7711MadFrenchieMrMelGibson
  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,420
    To sum it up: I don't really understand why other people choose certain games to play, but I dislike their choices. They are a problem.
    HatefullPhryAlBQuirkyJean-Luc_PicardkertinOctagon7711RhygarthnewbismxBeezerbeezIselin
     
  • rojoArcueidrojoArcueid Member EpicPosts: 10,401
    When people become the problem, they become the problem on all platforms, not just PC.

    I rather think the biggest problem in PC gaming is the outrageous hardware prices.
    Harikenvanderghastpierth




  • FonclFoncl Member UncommonPosts: 347
    I can tell from your post OP that you don't know much about DotA and Counter-Strike, two games I've played since early in their first iterations. Those are competitive games, how "new" the game is and how great the graphics are doesn't matter nearly as much as the quality of gameplay to people who play them. I find it hilarious that you claim these games to be "trendy" while at the same time complain about how "OLD" they are and that players of these games "don't want to play new games". Your claims contradict eachother.

    Why are you so obsessed with playing something new? You sound like the dream customer for a company like EA which releases pretty much the same game year after year, with some small tweaks here and there and charge full price for it. That practice is not bringing much new and interesting to the world of gaming. 

    Compare the first iteration of DotA with DotA2 and then do the same with Counter-Strike compared to Counter-Strike: Global Offensive and you will see massive improvements in most aspects of those games. People who play these games are not interested in a new game every year with some small tweaks, they want some significant improvements if they are to switch games.

    Those who play these games would never accept any form pay-to-win, the biggest sickness in gaming in my opinion, a practice that seems to be somewhat accepted in other gaming genres.

    deniterAlBQuirkyTokkenKylerank61977Rhygarth
  • Asch126Asch126 Member RarePosts: 542
    Vhayne said:
    Let me explain by throwing out this link....

    https://store.steampowered.com/stats/Steam-Game-and-Player-Statistics?l=english)


    The imbalance of players per game is crazy.  PUBG, DOTA2, and CS:GO together make up more playerbase than all of other games combined.  New games, good games, it doesn't matter.  These 3 are always like this, daily.


    So the question is....Why?


    My theory is that it's all "sports" based and popularity.  The players of these games are the same people that actually WATCH other people play games, like the popular youtubers.  I don't understand this concept, really.  I mean, I understand watching someone drive a racecar or whatever because it's something that YOU personally cannot do usually.  But all of these games can be played by everyone at any time.  So you watch them?  Maybe you can watch others read a book too sometime.  

    Anyway, because those games are now "popular" because some dude on youtube plays them, means that everyone else wants to be like them or something.  So they have to play the same games.  Regardless of whether there are other, newer, or even better games out there to play.  

    Maybe the word is "trendy"?  



    The whole point is that companies see these numbers, and see how freaking OLD these games are, and they aren't encouraged to create anything new.  I mean, what's the point when the players don't care, obviously.  Let's just make another MOBA, or Battle Royale, or competitive E-Sports game to try and get some of those players.  

    It just seems like a sickness these people have or something.  Don't they want to play new games?  Aren't they sick of playing the same game for 5+ years?  No wonder more companies aren't taking chances anymore.  When you see numbers so severely skewed as that, I'd be wary as well.

    It's almost sad how wrong you are.

    You REALLY think that games like PUBG, Overwatch, Fortnite, CS:GO, etc, got popular because random Youtubers and streamers played them? Advertising, gameplay, the fun factor, the competitive scene, THAT is what attracted people into these games.
    AlBQuirkyKyleranRhygarth
  • lahnmirlahnmir Member LegendaryPosts: 3,660
    Asch126 said:
    Vhayne said:
    Let me explain by throwing out this link....

    https://store.steampowered.com/stats/Steam-Game-and-Player-Statistics?l=english)


    The imbalance of players per game is crazy.  PUBG, DOTA2, and CS:GO together make up more playerbase than all of other games combined.  New games, good games, it doesn't matter.  These 3 are always like this, daily.


    So the question is....Why?


    My theory is that it's all "sports" based and popularity.  The players of these games are the same people that actually WATCH other people play games, like the popular youtubers.  I don't understand this concept, really.  I mean, I understand watching someone drive a racecar or whatever because it's something that YOU personally cannot do usually.  But all of these games can be played by everyone at any time.  So you watch them?  Maybe you can watch others read a book too sometime.  

    Anyway, because those games are now "popular" because some dude on youtube plays them, means that everyone else wants to be like them or something.  So they have to play the same games.  Regardless of whether there are other, newer, or even better games out there to play.  

    Maybe the word is "trendy"?  



    The whole point is that companies see these numbers, and see how freaking OLD these games are, and they aren't encouraged to create anything new.  I mean, what's the point when the players don't care, obviously.  Let's just make another MOBA, or Battle Royale, or competitive E-Sports game to try and get some of those players.  

    It just seems like a sickness these people have or something.  Don't they want to play new games?  Aren't they sick of playing the same game for 5+ years?  No wonder more companies aren't taking chances anymore.  When you see numbers so severely skewed as that, I'd be wary as well.

    It's almost sad how wrong you are.

    You REALLY think that games like PUBG, Overwatch, Fortnite, CS:GO, etc, got popular because random Youtubers and streamers played them? Advertising, gameplay, the fun factor, the competitive scene, THAT is what attracted people into these games.
    These days Youtubers and streamers are a MASSIVE factor for games and their succes, especially competitive games like all the ones mentioned. It is a part of the advertising (they get paid to play these games and thereby expose them to their audience) and for more and more people watching IS part of the gameplay, the fun.

    Five to ten years ago you might have been right, brushing it aside in the current climate is really ignorant.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    CazrielAlBQuirkyKyutaSyuko
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...



    'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless. 

    It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.

    It is just huge resource waste....'

    Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer

  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004
    lahnmir said:
    Asch126 said:
    Vhayne said:
    Let me explain by throwing out this link....

    https://store.steampowered.com/stats/Steam-Game-and-Player-Statistics?l=english)


    The imbalance of players per game is crazy.  PUBG, DOTA2, and CS:GO together make up more playerbase than all of other games combined.  New games, good games, it doesn't matter.  These 3 are always like this, daily.


    So the question is....Why?


    My theory is that it's all "sports" based and popularity.  The players of these games are the same people that actually WATCH other people play games, like the popular youtubers.  I don't understand this concept, really.  I mean, I understand watching someone drive a racecar or whatever because it's something that YOU personally cannot do usually.  But all of these games can be played by everyone at any time.  So you watch them?  Maybe you can watch others read a book too sometime.  

    Anyway, because those games are now "popular" because some dude on youtube plays them, means that everyone else wants to be like them or something.  So they have to play the same games.  Regardless of whether there are other, newer, or even better games out there to play.  

    Maybe the word is "trendy"?  



    The whole point is that companies see these numbers, and see how freaking OLD these games are, and they aren't encouraged to create anything new.  I mean, what's the point when the players don't care, obviously.  Let's just make another MOBA, or Battle Royale, or competitive E-Sports game to try and get some of those players.  

    It just seems like a sickness these people have or something.  Don't they want to play new games?  Aren't they sick of playing the same game for 5+ years?  No wonder more companies aren't taking chances anymore.  When you see numbers so severely skewed as that, I'd be wary as well.

    It's almost sad how wrong you are.

    You REALLY think that games like PUBG, Overwatch, Fortnite, CS:GO, etc, got popular because random Youtubers and streamers played them? Advertising, gameplay, the fun factor, the competitive scene, THAT is what attracted people into these games.
    These days Youtubers and streamers are a MASSIVE factor for games and their succes, especially competitive games like all the ones mentioned. It is a part of the advertising (they get paid to play these games and thereby expose them to their audience) and for more and more people watching IS part of the gameplay, the fun.

    Five to ten years ago you might have been right, brushing it aside in the current climate is really ignorant.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    Youtubers, although now so many are moving to platforms like Minds and Bitchute i am not sure how long before they are called something else  ;)
     and Twitch streamers play lots of different games, they don't make the games popular,  its not so much that they are 'steering' but 'going with the flow', the most 'popular' streamers etc. can have a huge audience regardless of whatever game they are playing as its a personality thing.
    Thats not to say that they have no impact on sales, as its often their demonstration of the gameplay that can affect whether or not viewers buy the game, or warn them off as we saw recently with FO76, because unfortunately for games publishers, while Youtubers and Streamers make money from doing so, its not from publishers, its from the viewers, while advertising can be a part of this, the advertising on streams and youtube videos is often unrelated to whatever game they are playing at the time and that is assuming they make any from advertising at all, because todays Youtubers/Twitch Streamers tend to make money from channel subscriptions, patreon donations and superchats etc.
    Youtube has become a minefield, demonetisation by Youtube happens far too easily and to such a degree that the number of Youtube channels that don't make any revenue from advertising is rather large, perhaps it should be no surprise then that bad games get utterly destroyed by Youtubers who are only beholden to their viewers and not publishers or advertisers who might prefer they take a less 'honest' look at their game, its all rather fun really :p
    ConstantineMerusAlBQuirky
  • RhoklawRhoklaw Member EpicPosts: 7,127
    What the OP is saying is that you, I and every other gamer out there don't have a mind of our own. That we sheepishly follow the youtube gods on a quest to play shitty games promoted by shill people. No offense, but I only watch game reviews to see if a game is something I'd enjoy, not if 100 million others would enjoy it. I play games for my own personal entertainment.
    PhryScotExistentialistAlBQuirkybartoni33HarikenTindale111

  • ConstantineMerusConstantineMerus Member EpicPosts: 2,697
    That's like saying Soccer is popular because all the famous teams play it and there's a World Cup. It's the other way around. 

    20 years ago when there was no Twitch or YouTube, if you walked in any gaming cafe you'd find most people were playing Counter Strike, Unreal Tournament, Quake, Warcraft, etc. Competitive gaming has always been popular. Same reason competitive sport is. And that's how eSports became a thing. 

    I play Tennis. I am actually quite good, really good. But I still enjoy watching a Tennis match between professionals, heck it is even more enjoyable because I can appreciate the game I play personally more than others who don't. I don't watch sports because I can't do it myself, I don't believe that's the main motivator. When there's skill involved a lot of other factors makes watching someone else play a sport or a game enjoyable. Comparing that to watching someone else read a book is just silly. 

    Play watch streamers for a lot of reasons. For the community, for the interaction, to better themselves, to enjoy their narration of a game, they can't afford to buy a game or their toaster cannot run the said game anymore, etc. 

    But all of this hasn't stopped developers to create other types of games and make a lot of money. The singleplayer games are growing every year, and getting better every year. When was it better than now? If problem is lack of MMOs, that's a very different story. MMOs were always a niche market in the west, WoW changed it, then WoW got old and no one else could replicate the same success, not even Blizzard. 
    PhryAlBQuirkybartoni33
    Constantine, The Console Poster

    • "One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
    • Song of the Week: Blackfield by Blackfield from Blackfield (2005)
    • Currently Playing: Devil May Cry 1
    • Favorite Drink: Bruichladdich Black Art 5th 1992
    • Gaming Timeline: Arcade, Commodore 64, Amiga 500, SEGA, IBM, PS, PC, PS2, More PCs, PS3, Giant PC, PS4, No More PCs, PS4 Pro.
  • ConstantineMerusConstantineMerus Member EpicPosts: 2,697
    lahnmir said:
    Asch126 said:
    Vhayne said:
    Let me explain by throwing out this link....

    https://store.steampowered.com/stats/Steam-Game-and-Player-Statistics?l=english)


    The imbalance of players per game is crazy.  PUBG, DOTA2, and CS:GO together make up more playerbase than all of other games combined.  New games, good games, it doesn't matter.  These 3 are always like this, daily.


    So the question is....Why?


    My theory is that it's all "sports" based and popularity.  The players of these games are the same people that actually WATCH other people play games, like the popular youtubers.  I don't understand this concept, really.  I mean, I understand watching someone drive a racecar or whatever because it's something that YOU personally cannot do usually.  But all of these games can be played by everyone at any time.  So you watch them?  Maybe you can watch others read a book too sometime.  

    Anyway, because those games are now "popular" because some dude on youtube plays them, means that everyone else wants to be like them or something.  So they have to play the same games.  Regardless of whether there are other, newer, or even better games out there to play.  

    Maybe the word is "trendy"?  



    The whole point is that companies see these numbers, and see how freaking OLD these games are, and they aren't encouraged to create anything new.  I mean, what's the point when the players don't care, obviously.  Let's just make another MOBA, or Battle Royale, or competitive E-Sports game to try and get some of those players.  

    It just seems like a sickness these people have or something.  Don't they want to play new games?  Aren't they sick of playing the same game for 5+ years?  No wonder more companies aren't taking chances anymore.  When you see numbers so severely skewed as that, I'd be wary as well.

    It's almost sad how wrong you are.

    You REALLY think that games like PUBG, Overwatch, Fortnite, CS:GO, etc, got popular because random Youtubers and streamers played them? Advertising, gameplay, the fun factor, the competitive scene, THAT is what attracted people into these games.
    These days Youtubers and streamers are a MASSIVE factor for games and their succes, especially competitive games like all the ones mentioned. It is a part of the advertising (they get paid to play these games and thereby expose them to their audience) and for more and more people watching IS part of the gameplay, the fun.

    Five to ten years ago you might have been right, brushing it aside in the current climate is really ignorant.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    I'm not sure what you mean by "they get paid to play these games and thereby expose them to their audience" - as in sercet? would you care to elaborate on that mate? 
    Constantine, The Console Poster

    • "One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
    • Song of the Week: Blackfield by Blackfield from Blackfield (2005)
    • Currently Playing: Devil May Cry 1
    • Favorite Drink: Bruichladdich Black Art 5th 1992
    • Gaming Timeline: Arcade, Commodore 64, Amiga 500, SEGA, IBM, PS, PC, PS2, More PCs, PS3, Giant PC, PS4, No More PCs, PS4 Pro.
  • CryomatrixCryomatrix Member EpicPosts: 2,958
    Twitch isnt watching someone play a game. It is watching a personality of a person play the game with commentary.

    I havent watched twitch much, but a few times, ive seen myself unable to shutoff certain people just by how good the conversation is. This happened on games i'd never play in a million years. 

    The female ones are intoxicating when they arent slutting themselves, which many do. 

    If i could play regular hours and had privacy, i'd stream too. 

    PhryConstantineMerusAlBQuirkyJeffSpicoli
    Catch me streaming at twitch.tv/cryomatrix
    You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations. 
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 13,302
    edited November 2018
    So console games are not like this? I really don't see the difference.

     25 Agrees

    You received 25 Agrees. You're posting some good content. Great!

    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    Now Doesn't That Make You Feel All Warm And Fuzzy Inside? :P

  • lahnmirlahnmir Member LegendaryPosts: 3,660
    edited November 2018
    lahnmir said:
    Asch126 said:
    Vhayne said:
    Let me explain by throwing out this link....

    https://store.steampowered.com/stats/Steam-Game-and-Player-Statistics?l=english)


    The imbalance of players per game is crazy.  PUBG, DOTA2, and CS:GO together make up more playerbase than all of other games combined.  New games, good games, it doesn't matter.  These 3 are always like this, daily.


    So the question is....Why?


    My theory is that it's all "sports" based and popularity.  The players of these games are the same people that actually WATCH other people play games, like the popular youtubers.  I don't understand this concept, really.  I mean, I understand watching someone drive a racecar or whatever because it's something that YOU personally cannot do usually.  But all of these games can be played by everyone at any time.  So you watch them?  Maybe you can watch others read a book too sometime.  

    Anyway, because those games are now "popular" because some dude on youtube plays them, means that everyone else wants to be like them or something.  So they have to play the same games.  Regardless of whether there are other, newer, or even better games out there to play.  

    Maybe the word is "trendy"?  



    The whole point is that companies see these numbers, and see how freaking OLD these games are, and they aren't encouraged to create anything new.  I mean, what's the point when the players don't care, obviously.  Let's just make another MOBA, or Battle Royale, or competitive E-Sports game to try and get some of those players.  

    It just seems like a sickness these people have or something.  Don't they want to play new games?  Aren't they sick of playing the same game for 5+ years?  No wonder more companies aren't taking chances anymore.  When you see numbers so severely skewed as that, I'd be wary as well.

    It's almost sad how wrong you are.

    You REALLY think that games like PUBG, Overwatch, Fortnite, CS:GO, etc, got popular because random Youtubers and streamers played them? Advertising, gameplay, the fun factor, the competitive scene, THAT is what attracted people into these games.
    These days Youtubers and streamers are a MASSIVE factor for games and their succes, especially competitive games like all the ones mentioned. It is a part of the advertising (they get paid to play these games and thereby expose them to their audience) and for more and more people watching IS part of the gameplay, the fun.

    Five to ten years ago you might have been right, brushing it aside in the current climate is really ignorant.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    I'm not sure what you mean by "they get paid to play these games and thereby expose them to their audience" - as in sercet? would you care to elaborate on that mate? 
    I am pretty certain quite a few youtubers and streamers get paid to play certain games at release, that way developers reach those audiences too.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...



    'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless. 

    It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.

    It is just huge resource waste....'

    Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer

  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,512
    When people become the problem, they become the problem on all platforms, not just PC.

    I rather think the biggest problem in PC gaming is the outrageous hardware prices.
    I'm not sure this is the main problem, but it is a BIG PROBLEM. 

    As long as software is getting more taxing, home hardware needs to handle it. 
    It's like a battle between the software engineers and the hardware engineers, is it's a win-win for both.  Also the larger companies because the small guy companies don't stand a chance.  

    Their for Monopoly !! 
    Their for people across the world on a budget loose out !! 


    Note: 
    mmorpgs need to concentrate on world design but the people insist on graphics, CAN'T HAVE BOTH.
  • BananableBananable Member UncommonPosts: 194
    "The problem with PC gaming isn't the games..."

    Yeah! Because there are none.

    ...it's the people."

    Yes! Blame those lousy people. Why nobody esle thought about that? I wish all those PC players just have...

    phones.  :P


    AlBQuirky
  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004
    lahnmir said:
    lahnmir said:
    Asch126 said:
    Vhayne said:
    Let me explain by throwing out this link....

    https://store.steampowered.com/stats/Steam-Game-and-Player-Statistics?l=english)


    The imbalance of players per game is crazy.  PUBG, DOTA2, and CS:GO together make up more playerbase than all of other games combined.  New games, good games, it doesn't matter.  These 3 are always like this, daily.


    So the question is....Why?


    My theory is that it's all "sports" based and popularity.  The players of these games are the same people that actually WATCH other people play games, like the popular youtubers.  I don't understand this concept, really.  I mean, I understand watching someone drive a racecar or whatever because it's something that YOU personally cannot do usually.  But all of these games can be played by everyone at any time.  So you watch them?  Maybe you can watch others read a book too sometime.  

    Anyway, because those games are now "popular" because some dude on youtube plays them, means that everyone else wants to be like them or something.  So they have to play the same games.  Regardless of whether there are other, newer, or even better games out there to play.  

    Maybe the word is "trendy"?  



    The whole point is that companies see these numbers, and see how freaking OLD these games are, and they aren't encouraged to create anything new.  I mean, what's the point when the players don't care, obviously.  Let's just make another MOBA, or Battle Royale, or competitive E-Sports game to try and get some of those players.  

    It just seems like a sickness these people have or something.  Don't they want to play new games?  Aren't they sick of playing the same game for 5+ years?  No wonder more companies aren't taking chances anymore.  When you see numbers so severely skewed as that, I'd be wary as well.

    It's almost sad how wrong you are.

    You REALLY think that games like PUBG, Overwatch, Fortnite, CS:GO, etc, got popular because random Youtubers and streamers played them? Advertising, gameplay, the fun factor, the competitive scene, THAT is what attracted people into these games.
    These days Youtubers and streamers are a MASSIVE factor for games and their succes, especially competitive games like all the ones mentioned. It is a part of the advertising (they get paid to play these games and thereby expose them to their audience) and for more and more people watching IS part of the gameplay, the fun.

    Five to ten years ago you might have been right, brushing it aside in the current climate is really ignorant.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    I'm not sure what you mean by "they get paid to play these games and thereby expose them to their audience" - as in sercet? would you care to elaborate on that mate? 
    I am pretty certain quite a few youtubers and streamers get paid to play certain games at release, that way developers reach those audiences too.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    The few that do, have to state up front that they received the game from the publisher and whether or not they are being paid to play the game, most Youtubers and Streamers are not paid by the games publisher etc. they have paid for the games they are playing themselves.
    Its a truism that the views of those who are not being paid by a publisher etc. are more reliable (read that as truthful) than those that have been paid to do so, its such an issue that most will state up front and as clearly as possible that they have been paid to play that game to ensure that it doesn't negatively affect those video's they put up that were not. :p
    ConstantineMerus
  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 6,234
    lahnmir said:
    lahnmir said:
    Asch126 said:
    Vhayne said:
    Let me explain by throwing out this link....

    https://store.steampowered.com/stats/Steam-Game-and-Player-Statistics?l=english)


    The imbalance of players per game is crazy.  PUBG, DOTA2, and CS:GO together make up more playerbase than all of other games combined.  New games, good games, it doesn't matter.  These 3 are always like this, daily.


    So the question is....Why?


    My theory is that it's all "sports" based and popularity.  The players of these games are the same people that actually WATCH other people play games, like the popular youtubers.  I don't understand this concept, really.  I mean, I understand watching someone drive a racecar or whatever because it's something that YOU personally cannot do usually.  But all of these games can be played by everyone at any time.  So you watch them?  Maybe you can watch others read a book too sometime.  

    Anyway, because those games are now "popular" because some dude on youtube plays them, means that everyone else wants to be like them or something.  So they have to play the same games.  Regardless of whether there are other, newer, or even better games out there to play.  

    Maybe the word is "trendy"?  



    The whole point is that companies see these numbers, and see how freaking OLD these games are, and they aren't encouraged to create anything new.  I mean, what's the point when the players don't care, obviously.  Let's just make another MOBA, or Battle Royale, or competitive E-Sports game to try and get some of those players.  

    It just seems like a sickness these people have or something.  Don't they want to play new games?  Aren't they sick of playing the same game for 5+ years?  No wonder more companies aren't taking chances anymore.  When you see numbers so severely skewed as that, I'd be wary as well.

    It's almost sad how wrong you are.

    You REALLY think that games like PUBG, Overwatch, Fortnite, CS:GO, etc, got popular because random Youtubers and streamers played them? Advertising, gameplay, the fun factor, the competitive scene, THAT is what attracted people into these games.
    These days Youtubers and streamers are a MASSIVE factor for games and their succes, especially competitive games like all the ones mentioned. It is a part of the advertising (they get paid to play these games and thereby expose them to their audience) and for more and more people watching IS part of the gameplay, the fun.

    Five to ten years ago you might have been right, brushing it aside in the current climate is really ignorant.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    I'm not sure what you mean by "they get paid to play these games and thereby expose them to their audience" - as in sercet? would you care to elaborate on that mate? 
    I am pretty certain quite a few youtubers and streamers get paid to play certain games at release, that way developers reach those audiences too.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    Many do, yes. They are called "sponsored streams." Twitch now has what they call a "bounty board" where streamers can visit a site that lists games, length of playtime, and how much they'll pay you.

    To the OP:
    Others have said it better than I but wow... Can a person get more narrow-minded? "I don't get it. It must be evil!"
    ConstantineMerusPhry

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • VhayneVhayne Member UncommonPosts: 632
    Let me further explain a bit on the "streamers" thing.  

    First, you have the streamer.  I mean, he/she sits at home (or wherever) loads up a game, camera, and mic and begins "streaming".  He gets money, popularity, and acceptance from this.  This makes sense to him, as it's allowing him to further expand his hobby of gaming.  It's a lot easier to understand than this next part...


    The "viewer".  And yes, I'm going to call them a sheep.  Let's pretend that I want to all of a sudden become a sheep too.  So I get on twitch, find a popular streamer and begin watching.  This one action is questionable.  Why am I doing this?  Is it because I cannot afford to pay for that particular game?  Is it because I'm too lazy to actually play it myself?  Is it because I have to be surrounded by a crowd of like-minded people (the viewers and streamer) to enjoy something?  Is it because that particular person streaming has such a great personality and is just so dang funny that I MUST watch him play?  


    Now, as I'm trying to get used to being like a sheep I notice something else.  Well 2 somethings actually.  I see this chat window - or as I'd rather call it - a suck-up tickertape of sliced comments, scrolling by.  This thing moves so fast that each entire screen of it is refreshed twice a second.  So the text that these sheep are leaving behind aren't even going to be read.  It's obviously just a mess.  So, exactly what is the point of this thing?  It's like everyone is just trying to get noticed.  


    Then an even more confusing thing happens.  With some sound effect and simple graphic, we (the sheeple viewers) are notified that one of the idiots on the asskisser ticker has decided to donate money to the dude/girl that is streaming.  What motivated that person to decide, "hey, I'm going to give this guy some money."?  



    Maybe I'm old.  Maybe I just don't get it.  Or maybe, this whole thing is just weird AF.



  • VhayneVhayne Member UncommonPosts: 632
    The point I'm trying to make for you hard-heads is the possible correlation between Streamers, Viewers, and Developers.  Why would a developer want to make a game, especially one that is truly innovative, if it isn't "Stream-worthy"? 

    I obviously have no idea because I don't watch that crap.  But I'm sure that RDR2 was/is being streamed somewhere.  Well, that will end within a year or less because the game is finite.  (amazing game btw)  Then it's back to the usual e-sports stuff that has been out for a decade, or the newer ones that replace them (where the combined ingenuity of great developers are being led).  


    Case in point -- Fallout 4, probably not such a great streaming game as it has an ending.  So what does Bethesda do?  They make Fallout 76.  I'm sure in the developer's minds it would have been a great game to stream (making it popular, thereby raising sales).  Obviously that didn't pan out.  But the point of the matter is still there.


    The behavior of the masses is what dictates the current climate of development in games.  The sheep are happy and content in this flat, fenced in field.  There is no need for us to build multiple levels with slides on top of it, to make it more fun for them.  


  • HarikenHariken Member EpicPosts: 2,510
    Rhoklaw said:
    What the OP is saying is that you, I and every other gamer out there don't have a mind of our own. That we sheepishly follow the youtube gods on a quest to play shitty games promoted by shill people. No offense, but I only watch game reviews to see if a game is something I'd enjoy, not if 100 million others would enjoy it. I play games for my own personal entertainment.
    I also found it funny that most people here didn't get what the OP was saying. It flew right over their head.
    Rhoklaw
  • parrotpholkparrotpholk Member EpicPosts: 4,611
    Vhayne said:



    The behavior of the masses is what dictates the current climate of development in games.  The sheep are happy and content in this flat, fenced in field.  There is no need for us to build multiple levels with slides on top of it, to make it more fun for them.  


    I generally do not like streamers or any of that either.

    I also do not like some decisions made such as the concentration on mobile games as playing a game on my 6" phone screen does not excite me.

    That being said you go into business to make money.  Sometimes you can appeal to a certain niche and do very well ie. EVE.  

    Also this points out that if a game is fun then people will play it for years such as Counterstrike or hell even EQ and both of those are old enough to need depends diapers in gaming age.

    Games do move forward and evolve but the movement is incremental because outside of AI it has pretty much been done at this point.  Only improvements and refinements can be made.
  • H0urg1assH0urg1ass Member EpicPosts: 2,380
    I'm starting to think that you're just extremely jealous that some people can make money while engaging in their hobby and you're not.
  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,364
    What I think is becoming apparent is that the PvP market has been underserved, and the market for games that require a significant time investment to play has been overserved. 

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,348
    Vhayne said:
    What motivated that person to decide, "hey, I'm going to give this guy some money."?  



    Maybe I'm old.  Maybe I just don't get it.  Or maybe, this whole thing is just weird AF.
    If we were playing charades someone would have touched their nose just now. 

     :D 

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • parrotpholkparrotpholk Member EpicPosts: 4,611
    Amathe said:
    What I think is becoming apparent is that the PvP market has been underserved, and the market for games that require a significant time investment to play has been overserved. 
    How has the PvP market been underserved exactly.  Even the OP has pointed out all the esports titles released in recent years which all serve the pvp crowd.  
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