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Self-evident,yet ignored
delete5230
Member EpicPosts: 7,081
The obvious, people are starving for a good mmorpg
The obvious, very very few are happy with current choices
The obvious, happiness polls spring to life often here and ALWAYS shows negative results
The obvious, F2P ALWAYS angers players
The obvious, every mmorpg release attracts EVERYONE if its advertised properly
Every day, day in and day out, posters contradict themselves sticking up for current choices, yet other post they complain about the OBVIOUS. For some reason posters squish negativity, yet they have MUCH negativity themselves in other post.
Negativity doesn't always make a person negative.... It could be justified if something is wrong.
Prof that people are unhappy have been proven so many times it would be hard to count, YET IGNORED over and over. People will vote then turn around and say the opposite of how they voted !
Recently a topic was made "POLL: What is your favorite MMORPG of all time?"
Results: 53.22% voted for classics. Every other choice votes were spread negligible. Infact It was surprising how little the supposed popular current were 0% !
Highest votes:
EverQuest 1, EverQuest 2, Dark Age of Camelot, Asherons Call, Starwars Galaxies, Lord of the Rings, Vanguard.
They are classics ? My only opinion on all this.... its not because their classics, but the STYLE in witch they were created.
How are facts so ignored ?
The obvious, very very few are happy with current choices
The obvious, happiness polls spring to life often here and ALWAYS shows negative results
The obvious, F2P ALWAYS angers players
The obvious, every mmorpg release attracts EVERYONE if its advertised properly
Every day, day in and day out, posters contradict themselves sticking up for current choices, yet other post they complain about the OBVIOUS. For some reason posters squish negativity, yet they have MUCH negativity themselves in other post.
Negativity doesn't always make a person negative.... It could be justified if something is wrong.
Prof that people are unhappy have been proven so many times it would be hard to count, YET IGNORED over and over. People will vote then turn around and say the opposite of how they voted !
Recently a topic was made "POLL: What is your favorite MMORPG of all time?"
Results: 53.22% voted for classics. Every other choice votes were spread negligible. Infact It was surprising how little the supposed popular current were 0% !
Highest votes:
EverQuest 1, EverQuest 2, Dark Age of Camelot, Asherons Call, Starwars Galaxies, Lord of the Rings, Vanguard.
They are classics ? My only opinion on all this.... its not because their classics, but the STYLE in witch they were created.
How are facts so ignored ?
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Comments
Good observation though, has been my experience on these forums games (or gameplay) that exist largely in players memories are the most popular.
This is closely followed by games not yet created, the less actual information known about them the better they rate in many cases.
Always at the bottom are games currently available, which many play because...I dunno why, boredom maybe, too much disposable income, masochistic tendencies?
No game does well in the harsh, cold light of present day reality but don't worry, 10 years from now many will be remembered far more fondly than they deserve, same was true for classic games.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I'm not looking for the exact same games that I used to play 20 years ago neither. Yeah oldschool was the best school, and I was the fucking headmaster. But I don't want to go backwards. I guess when it comes down to MMOs only a virtual world - in every sense of the word - would get me excited. Until then I'm done with the genre for good.
I don't have the time I used to. Nor do the people I played with "back then". So playing DAOC or CoX now wouldn't be the same experience as it was then.
So, I answer "What's your favourite MMORPG of all time?" with "DAoC", as that is the MMO I have the most great memories from. WoW, ESO, or any other MMO launched in the last 10 years doesn't register as a favourite as the playing experience wasn't as good as my time DAoC. Not because the games themselves were necessarily bad, but because my life was different.
HELLLLL NO. You can do your best to advertise anything and I still won't be suckered in if its not my style of game.
The obvious, very very few are happy with current choices
The obvious, happiness polls spring to life often here and ALWAYS shows negative results
The obvious, F2P ALWAYS angers players
The obvious, every mmorpg release attracts EVERYONE if its advertised properly
How are facts so ignored ?
There are literally MILLIONS of gamer's out there playing and enjoying both old and new MMORPG's.
This place is a small (tiny) piece of the puzzle. And one that seems to me to be of a certain age/type of people that are mostly older, as you noticed on what games they liked in the poll. And some (most?) quite set in what they like and will most likely never find again.
It is a generational thing. Our generation of games were games that new gamer's may never like or care about.
No game, past, present, or future, will make the people here on this place all happy, let alone all the rest of gamer's out there that are quite happy where they are and with what they are playing.
Your dream of one great game to rule them all is just that, a dream:)
That you don't have a game to pick from?
Your problem in your post is that it's full of absolutes.
Thus you are simply wrong.
I'm not starving for a good MMORPG. I have a decent one.
I'm relatively happy with it too. Is it the best I ever played? No, but it's solid.
Your 3rd statement is something I don't even know how to respond to. I mean, it's a poll, So yeah, it has negative options. Polls are skewed if they don't pose both ends of the spectrum.
Your next 2 are stated as absolutes, and therefore they are factually incorrect.
I mean....I believe what you are trying to say is that you want to see the genre move back to it's origins in game design? But your approach is all wrong.
I would say i am starving for a new mmropg,.i have one i still love and still play it off/on after 15 years.
However in saying that,i fully expected the genre to get BETTER,by that i mean every single aspect of design and add MANY new ideas that should be there in a living breathing world.
So who comes along...Blizzard..WOW,gives us NOTHING but the same old in an easier more shallow package.
So then what has the market offered us since then?Well VG but trying to add a HQ game with high end graphics was just bogging down machines causing strife and gained a bad rep.
FF a few years ,we get FFXIV,fails bad out of the gate as i predicted before it was released.Does a rebuild and does quite well.Now the game does advance the genre in a few ways but overall game play is still imo very shallow with instance type boss fights,hand holding markers that remove immersion and realism etc etc.
So since 2002 or perhaps you can say from 1999 we really have seen VERY little improvement or systems to bring these worlds closer to realistic looking worlds.Gameplay has become so superficial it is a turnoff,END GAME and Raids is the only thing mentioned as being worthy content.
Long winded point,i don't NEED a new game so badly that i'll buy every new game that comes out and claim it is a GREAT game,but i feel we SHOULD be seeing much better games and yes i would love to play a much better game.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I will say this: Even though I remember nearly game breaking bugs, terrible balance, incomplete systems, and a myriad of other issues, SWG is still my favorite game released to date. Why? Because despite all of the issues it was still one of the best-designed games (up to CU) I have played thus far, it was by far the most engaging game I have played to date, and I have never had a more positive community experience than I did in SWG.
I well remember being so mad I would log out, I well remember being stuck in constant loops waiting for planets to load, I remember all of that crap, it is just that the good far outweighed the bad for me in that game.
Others can disagree, you can put whatever spin on it you feel you want to. But being honest with myself, these are my feelings.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
Further proof, went on a 10 day vacation and left the gaming laptop at home. ...and I didn't miss gaming.
Heck I even downloaded a game on the iPAD but never even opened it, was content to surf the net and watch Netflix instead.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
/Cheers,
Lahnmir
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
All of my memories of the genre good and bad came at the hand of interactions with players. I can barely remember what I quests about over the years.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Let me break those 2 down:
EQ1: I would probably call this my favorite MMO because I had the best memories of it. That was largely because it was the first one I really spent much (way too much) time in, and because of the people I was playing it with. But, in reality, the game itself wasn't overly impressive. I mean, if that game launched today, it probably would have died in the first year. The combat alone made the game downright horrible and tedious in a lot of ways, depending on the class you chose. Playing a melee, for instance, was pretty horrible. You basically stood there with auto-attack on and mashed 1 button over and over every six seconds.
WoW: I spent a lot of time in this game largely because of the friends that carried over from EQ1. TBH, I never did like Vanilla WoW. It was a broken game in a lot of ways from the start. It took them several years to actually fix some of the core problems -- like useless talent trees, etc.
I quit and returned to WoW several times simply because I had friends who kept playing it. Honestly, I never genuinely felt a fondness to the game in any way like some of the other MMOs I've played.
I guess I "liked" it enough to tolerate it and play it for broken periods of time, but I never really got into it the way a lot of people seemed to. It had too many features I just didn't like.
The combat was really fluid and well-done though.
Point being, I spent a lot of time playing both of those games, and neither was an amazing game at its core. I would probably even argue that WoW was a better game in several ways. Yet, I would tell people that I loved EQ and was just "eh" on WoW.
I really don't think either was just an amazing "game", but they were amazing "experiences" for myself and other folks.
As far as the games go, I'd probably rather see someone design a game more like UO/SWG/AC/ArcheAge, etc, than like the game I loved most. What does that tell you?
So, yeah, it's self evident that we loved those old games more, but most people probably realize how dated and tedious and raw they were, in a lot of ways. I could write pages of issues and flaws the old games had.
I, for one, am glad that they evolved beyond what they started as, though, I wish they wouldn't have removed all the decent aspects when they tossed out the bad ones. Everything always gets taken from one extreme to the other.
And, since we all know Delete only thinks of Pantheon
At the end of the day, most of us want a fun game(I assume!) to go along with it, rather than just a chatroom with minor game elements.
I have a good mmorpg I'm reasonably happy with.
"The simple is the seal of the true and beauty is the splendor of truth" -Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar
Authored 139 missions in Vendetta Online and 6 tracks in Distance
The changes had to happen. No question about it. People say they should have left SWG alone.
But they couldn't. It was fundamentally flawed.....Game-breakingly so.
The Jedi destroyed it. Too many padawans made the game top heavy and it's player based economy could no longer be supported by the sheer number of people shifting to the Jedi.
When I left the game, it was starting to show the signs. That was when everyone and their brother were talking about "The Village" in the exact same context as we did in WoW doing "dailys"
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
you are not part of the Asian markets nor the mobile market, thus publishers do not care.
With that poll people voted for all the classics they had fond memories of 1999. No one would want to play severely broken games today. However they spent a lot of time in them because of the "community style"...… That particular poll is not a good one for happiness level of todays games, BUT many happiness polls were conducted and every time they were negative.
One major element that surprised even me.
0% for anything new !
More the point of the OP was people here contradict themselves.
This always happens in two ways:
1) they vote negatively in polls, yet they post that everything is fine.
2) they post saying one thing, yet the same poster tells a different story in another.
You claimed in general terms that people overwhelmingly are dissatisfied with the state of mmorpgs today citing the availability of negative poll options as evidence (I don't recall reading about the results of these polls in any sort of statistical analysis but never mind). Your argument was regarding a population, not individuals.
It was brought up that polls sometimes need negative options or else they are skewed. Now you are saying individual posters here contradict themselves w.r.t. whether or not they are satisfied.
...which is it?
edit: I feel I've been pretty consistent in my posting, in case It weren't obvious.
"The simple is the seal of the true and beauty is the splendor of truth" -Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar
Authored 139 missions in Vendetta Online and 6 tracks in Distance
I love the classics the best, but OPs observation doesn't truly support the market unfortunately.