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Blizzard should remove levels entirely - Here is why

TheScavengerTheScavenger Member EpicPosts: 3,321
For example.

Doing low level quests. A great example is the one in Durotar where you have to destroy attack plans.

Except, these mobs are super weak and low level. How are they in anyway going to attack level 80+ level guards at Orgrimmar? This is the least immersive thing possible in any game.

Another example are orcs invading that human starter area. Except there are super high level guards patrolling Elwynn...they can go in and kill them all in one hit. Why don't they? Stormwind guards are super tough...one guard can one hit kill all of them.

See the above doesn't work with levels now does it?

On top of that, levels cause more problems than the positives of leveling. For examples...

No levels means you can go anywhere at any time. But with levels you are limited to where you can go. Sure level scaling helps, and that was a good way forward...but lets go all the way. Buy an expansion but dont have a max level character? Well doesnt matter because you can now do that expansions content at any time. Otherwise why buy the expansion if cant use it anyway?

No levels means you never have to worry about grinding 10 levels of every expansion...and there are now 20 levels where you gain no abilities or talents or anything. Imagine next expansion? Azerites will be removed and it'll be 20 levels of literally nothing. NOTHING. N.O.T.H.I.N.G. And its very possible it'll end up 30 levels since blizzard only removes abilities, doesn't give abilities

PvP wise, max level characters are gimped compared to low level characters. This solves this problem right away by having no levels. The only thing left is gear, where the max level character has the advantage...like its always been.

And finally...how would Blizzard benefit from this? Having an easier time of porting WoW to consoles (which they've doing every expansion by having less and less abilities and buttons to press). Many console players wont want to grind for (currently) 120 levels...and many console players wont want to grind 20 levels after BFA is over and literally get nothing since azerite traits will be removed (how do I know? Because they did it to legion artifacts). Console players arent that dumb to grind so much time for literally nothing for it. 

And the second benefit...suddenly blizzard has so much less to balance. This saves time, money and manpower....win/win for blizzard and the players

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Comments

  • TheScavengerTheScavenger Member EpicPosts: 3,321
    Also for those who may post "then what would the point of grinding be? This takes out a huge part of the game"

    Except it doesn't. You can then go to any zone in the game and do quests in whatever zone you want.

    Also for grinding...end up doing the same things you do at level 120...but with even MORE options because the entire game is open.

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  • deniterdeniter Member RarePosts: 1,371
    Why would you even do quests if you could run all dungeons from get go? I mean, you would effectively skip the questing part and move straight to the max level gearing up process for raiding. Quests only have one purpose and it's to level up.

    Unless content was gated by using quests as a gearing up process for regular dungeons, but even then the quests would have iLvL requirement instead of exp level.
    Kyleran
  • laxielaxie Member RarePosts: 1,071
    What if games did "Complete 50 quests to unlock X content"?
    Would that work? It is equivalent to doing 50 quests worth of level-up content, except you can choose which ones to do entirely.

    Just crossed my mind as a wild idea. What are the flaws with this?
  • MeleconMelecon Member UncommonPosts: 74
    Only issue I see in this is that No levels = no quests we are all agreed with that. BUT, no quests = no story or lore there is no real reason to grind up the gear to progress in the raids when there is no reason to be there. You can do story based dungeons that build up to the raids but that would have to be a lot of story and cut scenes in them to get that across much like SWTOR and well we all know how that turned out... was good on paper practice was a little different cause you got the kiddies that wanted to jump the cut scenes cause they "did it like a Zillion times already cum on hurry".
  • Soki123Soki123 Member RarePosts: 2,558
    Lol, ok , no , dumb idea. 
    DeadSpockbwwianakiev
  • hallucigenocidehallucigenocide Member RarePosts: 1,015
    they should do something..  having 120+ levels doesn't really resonate with modern gamers and blizzard are terrible at tuning as you can see by how they treat item levels. it's always huge leaps between tiers when it doesn't have to be resulting in insane numbers and them having to prune them over and over again. just stahp!

    I had fun once, it was terrible.

  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,174
    A MMORPG needs to be designed from the ground up to not have levels. 

    If Blizzard actually did this it would be a game killing, idiotic move of Titanic proportions.

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

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  • TheScavengerTheScavenger Member EpicPosts: 3,321
    Nilden said:
    A MMORPG needs to be designed from the ground up to not have levels. 

    If Blizzard actually did this it would be a game killing, idiotic move of Titanic proportions.
    What is the point of levels though, if you get literally nothing for 20 levels? Azerite traits are temporary, so once that is over...its 110-130 of nothingness. Whats the point of that? Thats worse than having no levels at all.

    My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB: 

    https://www.moddb.com/mods/skyrim-anime-overhaul



  • TheScavengerTheScavenger Member EpicPosts: 3,321
    Nilden said:
    A MMORPG needs to be designed from the ground up to not have levels. 

    If Blizzard actually did this it would be a game killing, idiotic move of Titanic proportions.
    What is the point of levels though, if you get literally nothing for 20 levels? Azerite traits are temporary, so once that is over...its 110-130 of nothingness. Whats the point of that? Thats worse than having no levels at all.
    To keep people playing the game long enough to turn a profit off of their investment. That is the curse of the MMORPG genre, and the exact reason they are being abandoned in favor of other game types. Remove the grind and you have very little game left. 
    Well, as seen in BFA, people are already getting tired of grinding for nothing and getting things taken away.

    No one wants to grind for nothing. The point of any game is to progress, get better, better items, better skills, better anything. But WoW does the exact opposite.

    I'm not aware of another MMO where they have done so much pruning and removal of abilities, even downgrading what you get each expansion.

    But again, all that wouldn't matter if there was no levels.

    My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB: 

    https://www.moddb.com/mods/skyrim-anime-overhaul



  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 37,003
    edited September 2018
    edit
    Post edited by Kyleran on

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  • LawlmonsterLawlmonster Member UncommonPosts: 1,085
    Personally, I like the grind with certain exceptions. I'm not even sure why you'd play an MMO if grinding wasn't at least a somewhat attractive way to spend your time. It's certainly done well in some instances, the leveling in Kul Tiras through each zone is pretty spectacular. The reputation grind is atrocious. The difference between the two is pacing and presentation.


    TheScavenger said:
    Nilden said:
    A MMORPG needs to be designed from the ground up to not have levels. 

    If Blizzard actually did this it would be a game killing, idiotic move of Titanic proportions.
    What is the point of levels though, if you get literally nothing for 20 levels? Azerite traits are temporary, so once that is over...its 110-130 of nothingness. Whats the point of that? Thats worse than having no levels at all.

    I think what you're discussing here could very easily be fixed by revisiting their talent system. It's true, it feels like your characters makes very little progression or growth that isn't directly attached to gear, which has always been the case but not as drastically. You could argue that Azerite creates new talents, but they aren't representative of character growth. If you earned a new talent every other level, or every five levels even, I think that problem could be addressed. The other problem, of course, is a Blizzard development team deciding that a simplification of systems wasn't the most appropriate way to handle talents, and to abandon those simplifications for a talent system that will, inevitably, take more effort to balance.

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  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Member EpicPosts: 4,837
    didn't read - you make too many threads
    cielyMightyUncleanScorchien
  • k61977k61977 Member RarePosts: 1,336
    Personally I enjoy leveling, that is my favorite part.  It would kill the game for me if they removed leveling.  I normally stop playing once I stop getting levels or roll a new alt.  Leveling isn't for everyone but there are some who enjoy it.
    SBFord
  • Mors.MagneMors.Magne Member UncommonPosts: 1,549
    edited September 2018
    It depends on the context. For example, how many times have you done the starting areas? (Are you bored of them?). Has the game/story been designed to not have levels?

    If you're bored of the starting areas, then perhaps there's a different way of getting XP?
  • speedbuspeedbu Member CommonPosts: 2
    edited September 2018
    No I LOVE to level up :(
    DeadSpock

    I love to find new fast ways to level up in WoW! Check out the best WoW addons for this year. Find the in-depth reviews of the top 2 picks here: Dugi Guides review & Dynasty WoW addons review

  • AkulasAkulas Member RarePosts: 2,697
    They should remove end game and add more levels.

    This isn't a signature, you just think it is.

  • Gobstopper3DGobstopper3D Member RarePosts: 882
    Nilden said:
    A MMORPG needs to be designed from the ground up to not have levels. 

    If Blizzard actually did this it would be a game killing, idiotic move of Titanic proportions.
    What is the point of levels though, if you get literally nothing for 20 levels? Azerite traits are temporary, so once that is over...its 110-130 of nothingness. Whats the point of that? Thats worse than having no levels at all.
    To keep people playing the game long enough to turn a profit off of their investment. That is the curse of the MMORPG genre, and the exact reason they are being abandoned in favor of other game types. Remove the grind and you have very little game left. 
    Well, as seen in BFA, people are already getting tired of grinding for nothing and getting things taken away.

    No one wants to grind for nothing. The point of any game is to progress, get better, better items, better skills, better anything. But WoW does the exact opposite.

    I'm not aware of another MMO where they have done so much pruning and removal of abilities, even downgrading what you get each expansion.

    But again, all that wouldn't matter if there was no levels.
    The game wouldn't matter if there were no levels.  If you want a game without restrictions on where you can go, play ESO.  Sounds like it's right up your ally.

    I agree I don't like the way it's set up with BFA, but I will take that over ESO any day.  At least it feels like there is some progression instead of none.

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  • TaishiFoxTaishiFox Member RarePosts: 980
    I do agree with removing zone level restrictions like how alot of other games are doing that these days, ie ESO, but removing leveling completely just won't work and wouldn't be near as fun overall.  ESO has removed restrictions but still allows you to level up and improve your character, that mechanic to me is near perfect. Guild Wars 2 works on a similar principle. This to me is a better idea as it allows players to mingle more and get into content they would generally enjoy vs the boring low level stuff.  Have to say though I do take my hat off to Blizzard for trying to improve low level content as well as dishing out the high end stuff, not many developers seem to care about that.

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