Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Groundbreaking AI is in!!!

145679

Comments

  • laseritlaserit Member LegendaryPosts: 7,591
    edited August 2018
    How long does a game get to be in alpha before it becomes ridiculous and warranting of jokes and memes? That's a better conversation to be had. It forces everyone to come out of the hyperbole bubble and have to put some logical skin into the conversation. 

    Can we do that (so I can get a few more pages of laughs at least)

    Alpha should be [insert time frame] -> Beta should be [insert time frame] -> Early Access should be [insert time frame]

    Do you think we need a Gamma Testing phase? Discuss.
    That really depends on what your building.

    And it's something you really can't judge until it's done
    Post edited by laserit on
    Babuinix

    "Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee

  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Member EpicPosts: 3,967
    MaxBacon said:
    I thought so...

    As you all were.  :D

    Your argument wasn't reasonable at all, that's just a next level arm-chair developer right there, you'd have to be a professional game dev to have one informed view on how long it is reasonable a game to take, and you can't have any numbers like it's some sort of "industry standard" because there's no such thing.
    If you can go to a restaurant and know how long you're willing to sit down for a meal before you're annoyed and walk out you should be capable of knowing when you're frustrated with the wait time on anything else.

    It's a simple inquiry unless you're a shill/cult member, or some who is "hating for no reason". These types of people don't like being reasonable they're just ideologues.
    Babuinix
    "As far as the forum code of conduct, I would think it's a bit outdated and in need of a refre *CLOSED*" 

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 3,965
    I guess being frustrated is kinda different of being reasonable, hence the arguing lol

    All comes from people having different concepts of what crowdfunding and game development are (or should be).

    Makes for a fun discussion, useless but fun.  :D
    ErillionpostlarvalKyleran
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,254
    >>>
    If you can go to a restaurant and know how long you're willing to sit down for a meal
    >>>

    Is it a crowdfunded restaurant that needs to be build first ? Chefs hired ? Materials ordered ? Recipes devised ? Cuttlery bought ? Menus printed ?  Food cooked ?

    I would be prepared to wait quite a while.


    Have fun

  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 3,965
    Crowdfunding the Best Damn Meal Ever!

    We already have the proceduraly eggs and the Idris messhall going on right  :D
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,254
    Babuinix said:
    Crowdfunding the Best Damn Meal Ever!

    We already have the proceduraly eggs and the Idris messhall going on right  :D
    And a meal preparation and drink mixing mini game for the cruise liner ship ;-) 


    Have fun
    Babuinix
  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,523
    Erillion said:
    >>>
    If you can go to a restaurant and know how long you're willing to sit down for a meal
    >>>

    Is it a crowdfunded restaurant that needs to be build first ? Chefs hired ? Materials ordered ? Recipes devised ? Cuttlery bought ? Menus printed ?  Food cooked ?

    I would be prepared to wait quite a while.


    Have fun

    Well buckle up because they have been saying the Grand Opening would be coming for four years now but don't worry you can buy pictures of the meal you will get to eat when it's done.

    The real picture painted here is a bunch of people staring at .jpgs licking their lips in anticipation. Don't you dare question how good that picture of a meal might actually be... or heaven forbid when the Grand Opening might actually happen.

    Can't wait best meal evar totally happening soon.

    Made by new robot chefs programmed by the AI team behind Star Citizen.
    [Deleted User]

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer

    Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/ 

  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member LegendaryPosts: 7,610
    If you can go to a restaurant and know how long you're willing to sit down for a meal before you're annoyed and walk out you should be capable of knowing when you're frustrated with the wait time on anything else.

    It's a simple inquiry unless you're a shill/cult member, or some who is "hating for no reason". These types of people don't like being reasonable they're just ideologues.
    Come to this forum complaining every day the game isn't released yet I don't see it contributing to anything either, we all know it isn't out and we all know it doesn't have a release date, if people really care then level their frustration directly at CIG because on random internet forums this is just noise.
  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Member EpicPosts: 3,967
    Hi. I can not say how long it takes for me to be frustrated when waiting on a game to be developed that I already paid for. I can't reveal how long I personally think a game should be in an alpha, beta, closed beta, open beta, early access state because it would crash my operating system. My developers did not code me with this response.

    I do have a sub-routine that allows me to press "LOL" on anything that we disagree with though.

    I am happy. I am happy. I am happy.

    Reclaiming my time.

    ScotchUp
    "As far as the forum code of conduct, I would think it's a bit outdated and in need of a refre *CLOSED*" 

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member LegendaryPosts: 7,610
    edited August 2018

    Reclaiming my time.

    So trolling it is! Okay let's start creating a thread every day raging that SC isn't out yet, this is what this forum was made for :D 

    This has to have some use after all!
    postlarval
  • ArglebargleArglebargle Member EpicPosts: 3,167
    The Big Chef is a pompous micromanager who has to check  and approve every single thing in the kitchen. 

    Why right now he's discovered the carrots are the wrong shade of orange.  Pulls carrots from the recipes.  Orders new carrots.  Decides to paint the carrots the proper shade of orange.  Discovers that his chosen orange paint is not edible.  Orders carrots all washed off, then painted with proper, edible paint.  Decides textures are wrong on the new painted carrots, orders them washed again, tells team to make proper textured, proper colored paint, then redo all carrots.

    Halfway through this decides to replace carrots with a souffle.   In the middle of the baking, notices that the souffles are turning out the wrong color......

    If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.

  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Member EpicPosts: 5,521
    Shaigh said:
    Erillion said:
    I don't see why developers don't finish the base game that was originally promised then in an update OR expansion start adding these extras.
    Chris Roberts is the main reason.  Plus, as long as they keep rolling in cash he has no incentive to release the game and cut off any new features.
    One cannot treat the basic game functionality like network container streaming like a downloadable DLC. That is not the way the cookie crumbles. 

    And the backers were the ones to demand an increase in scope and voted with their wallets to make it happen. That "2014" date was already obsolete in Nov 2012 at the end of kickstarter and everyone knows it. But that date and argument is being necro-ed over and over again without context. For pure agitprop propaganda value only. 


    Have fun

    Sure, they already increased the scope in 2014.

    However, the star citizen date of 2016 that he gave at the speech in january 2015 was dead long before Chris Roberts opened his mouth and it had nothing to do with scope. The Squadron 42 date of 2016 that he gave at end of 2015 was total bullshit as they couldn't even show more gameplay during 2016.

    It has nothing to do with increasing the scope, its about them having no idea how much it takes to deliver on all their promises.
    The one thing I cut them slack on is the fact that they need to work on an engine that works for both SQ42 and multiplayer.  That makes complete sense.  I also cut them some slack on cry-engine and outsourcing issues.  But that slack time period is long gone now and the feature creep continues.
  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Member EpicPosts: 3,967
    MaxBacon said:

    Reclaiming my time.

    So trolling it is! Okay let's start creating a thread every day raging that SC isn't out yet, this is what this forum was made for :D 
    I made a simple inquiry to both opposing sides of the debate, a reasonable one that requires a direct response.

    No hyperbole, no talking points, no copying and pasting from the developer or disgruntled youtube videos.

    It's entertaining watching the cult members operating systems crash talking around it though.

    Perpetuity it is! This is what games aren't made for.  :D
    "As far as the forum code of conduct, I would think it's a bit outdated and in need of a refre *CLOSED*" 

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 3,965
    The chef as been giving tidbits for it's daring guests to enjoy for 5 years now and they keep coming back for more and calling friends to join lol

    Since no other chef seems to be able to provide bit's and bites as tasty as CIG I'd say they are in the right track B) 

    The interest around Star Citizen is a constant and ever growing, there's released well oiled and polished games who could only hope for so much interest and investment from it's players lol
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member LegendaryPosts: 7,610
    It's entertaining watching the cult members operating systems crash talking around it though.
    This parts of your posts should feel a little less forced, doesn't blend well, it's like your forcing a smile or fake-laughing when you say it O_o
  • ArglebargleArglebargle Member EpicPosts: 3,167
    edited August 2018
    Babuinix said:
    Crowdfunding the Best Damn Meal Ever!

    We already have the proceduraly eggs and the Idris messhall going on right  :D
    Minimum Viable Produce!

    At maximum overdrive.

    If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,254
    The Big Chef is a pompous micromanager who has to check  and approve every single thing in the kitchen. 

    Why right now he's discovered the carrots are the wrong shade of orange.  Pulls carrots from the recipes.  Orders new carrots.  Decides to paint the carrots the proper shade of orange.  Discovers that his chosen orange paint is not edible.  Orders carrots all washed off, then painted with proper, edible paint.  Decides textures are wrong on the new painted carrots, orders them washed again, tells team to make proper textured, proper colored paint, then redo all carrots.

    Halfway through this decides to replace carrots with a souffle.   In the middle of the baking, notices that the souffles are turning out the wrong color......
    Aaahhh, now i understand whom you are taking about.


    His attention to detail got him into the highest ranks of his profession, to worldwide renown.



    Have fun
    Babuinix
  • ArglebargleArglebargle Member EpicPosts: 3,167
    Erillion said:
    The Big Chef is a pompous micromanager who has to check  and approve every single thing in the kitchen. 

    Why right now he's discovered the carrots are the wrong shade of orange.  Pulls carrots from the recipes.  Orders new carrots.  Decides to paint the carrots the proper shade of orange.  Discovers that his chosen orange paint is not edible.  Orders carrots all washed off, then painted with proper, edible paint.  Decides textures are wrong on the new painted carrots, orders them washed again, tells team to make proper textured, proper colored paint, then redo all carrots.

    Halfway through this decides to replace carrots with a souffle.   In the middle of the baking, notices that the souffles are turning out the wrong color......
    Aaahhh, now i understand whom you are taking about.


    His attention to detail got him into the highest ranks of his profession, to worldwide renown.



    Have fun
    Hasn't cooked a meal in 20 years.  Ran his first restaurant into the ground without producing any dinner.   The pictures of the meals-to-be are great though.  And occasionally you get to eat some chips and salsa.  But delivered erratically.

    He may, however, go into the marketing hall of fame.  I will give you that.

    If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.

  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Member EpicPosts: 3,967
    MaxBacon said:
    It's entertaining watching the cult members operating systems crash talking around it though.
    This parts of your posts should feel a little less forced, doesn't blend well, it's like your forcing a smile or fake-laughing when you say it O_o
    You mean like how you're being forced to skip and ignore everything previous to "this parts".

    Whatever you say.


    "As far as the forum code of conduct, I would think it's a bit outdated and in need of a refre *CLOSED*" 

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member LegendaryPosts: 7,610
    You mean like how you're being forced to skip and ignore everything previous to "this parts".

    Whatever you say.


    Yes, the parts were you mention how much fun you're having look like vaporware, scripted demos, damn CR! :D 

    Also I'm a real boy.
  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 3,965
    edited August 2018
    Babuinix said:
    You can't estimate the time to do something that has never been done.


    Explain that to the people that did it... the developers, and stop blaming the customers for believing them.  They set the expectations, and the revised expectations, and the ones after that.

    There is no going back in time, but you have to acknowledge that the expectations were set by the developers. There are very few bigger CR/Wing Commander fans than I am.  But guys like you who refuse to even acknowledge that the devs make mistakes just piss me off.  It makes me question who is real and who is actually a Goon role playing a cartoon character.
    Oh I don't need to explain professional dev's about the hardships of their craft. They know it well enough, that's why they also know how and when to hype their projects lol

    You have 3 "wrongs" in your "frustration" imo:

    1st : You fail to acknowledge that you misunderstood what putting money on a Kickstarter project entailed.

    Any project on Kickstarter to be approved has to fill several pieces of info, one of them is to provide a "Estimated Delivery" date, it's obligatory.

    All dev's know damn well that date will probably slip but they want to give their lowest possible date because it will increase the success in getting the needed funds to get the project started. It's a do or die thing.

    Check the amount of kickstarted games that missed their "Estimated Delivery" date.

    2nd: You seem to think that kickstarting the idea of a game you automatically become a customer who bought a defined product.

    That's not how crowdfunding works, you didn't pre-ordered a specific and established item, you backed an idea from someone. You don't get to decide what that idea will turn out. You are not an investor or shareholder. You have no say above the idea man.

    3rd: You ignore the fact that CIG received more money than anyone could ever imagine and that allowed for the increase of the scope. If the community gave him 10's of millions he's not gonna delivery a game of a couple of millions lol

    So your frustration basically comes from your eagerness for playing a game like Star Citizen while not understanding what crowdfunding entailed or the hardships of game development, it's all on you because nobody forced you to give money in advance for an idea, even if that's harder to admit than blaming others lol
    OG_Zorvan said:
    Babuinix said:
    I guess that explains why after 4 years Star Citizen keeps getting more players, more money and no competition in sight that comes close to it's ambition scale and scope lol

    Welcome to the Verse of the 1%'ers  :D
    Hard to compete with something that only exist on paper, and in the fevered delusions of those desperate to justify the money they've wasted on a pipe dream.
    Oh only on paper? Does this seem like "Papers Please" to you?  :D


    Post edited by Babuinix on
    MadFrenchie
  • kenguru23kenguru23 Member UncommonPosts: 49
    MaxBacon said:
    It's entertaining watching the cult members operating systems crash talking around it though.
    This parts of your posts should feel a little less forced, doesn't blend well, it's like your forcing a smile or fake-laughing when you say it O_o
    You mean like how you're being forced to skip and ignore everything previous to "this parts".

    Whatever you say.


    Sorry offtopic but where is that .gif from? :open_mouth:
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member LegendaryPosts: 7,610
    kenguru23 said:
    Sorry offtopic but where is that .gif from? :open_mouth:
    Westworld.
    kenguru23
  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 3,965
    Erillion said:
    The Big Chef is a pompous micromanager who has to check  and approve every single thing in the kitchen. 

    Why right now he's discovered the carrots are the wrong shade of orange.  Pulls carrots from the recipes.  Orders new carrots.  Decides to paint the carrots the proper shade of orange.  Discovers that his chosen orange paint is not edible.  Orders carrots all washed off, then painted with proper, edible paint.  Decides textures are wrong on the new painted carrots, orders them washed again, tells team to make proper textured, proper colored paint, then redo all carrots.

    Halfway through this decides to replace carrots with a souffle.   In the middle of the baking, notices that the souffles are turning out the wrong color......
    Aaahhh, now i understand whom you are taking about.


    His attention to detail got him into the highest ranks of his profession, to worldwide renown.



    Have fun
    Hasn't cooked a meal in 20 years.  Ran his first restaurant into the ground without producing any dinner.   The pictures of the meals-to-be are great though.  And occasionally you get to eat some chips and salsa.  But delivered erratically.

    He may, however, go into the marketing hall of fame.  I will give you that.
    That will be Sandi in the Marketing Hall of Fame not Chris Roberts B)

    Chris already got enough accolades with it's spot in the Game Dev Hall of Fame


    Erillionpostlarval
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    MaxBacon said:
    gervaise1 said:
    The good news for SC is that RSI seem to have learnt / evolved / matured. Maybe coupled with having enough money to finish. Unless anyone believes they are operating exactly as they did last year things have changed.

    As evidenced by 3.1 and 3.2. With no sign that 3.3. won't happen.
    Simply because they decided to do these short and medium term roadmaps public and commit with quarterly releases.

    Now they will no longer commit with longer-term estimates because those estimates will be ignored the moment they either want to work more on something, refactor it, develop new tech, whatever it is, they have that maneuverability.

    Their fail was ever giving release dates and then when they wanted to expand the scope and take more time developing technology and so forth (such as achieving procedural planets to what was once small maps in on-rails loadings), their estimates went down the drain.
    I am not quite sure what point you are making about "simply because they have decided to do these short and medium term roadmaps".

    They planned to do that after 1.0 was released - they "failed" to follow through.

    3.0 was supposed to be a short to medium term release - CR's brief was only to include stuff that could be released by the end-June so about 5-months max? And we know the trials and tribulations that followed.

    This is not about how hard what is being done is it is about the process they follow to do it.

    And today - at last! - there is evidence of a process for creating and maintaining a drumbeat. A pipeline that is delvering quarterly updates. Yes some things slip but as I said that happened with 3.0 and they couldn't cope with the slippage. 

    It may look easy and inconsequential. Its not. And everything points to them having learnt - probably the hard way - how to do that! And its to their credit that they have "matured". 
    Slapshot1188Darkpigeon
Sign In or Register to comment.