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Guild Wars 2 - Bill Murphy - ArenaNet and the Wisdom of Not Doing Anything - MMORPG.com

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  • learis1learis1 Member UncommonPosts: 96
    You may view as a blunder. But it appears 99% of the posts here which represent the consumer side view it as the right thing to do.

    But I will say this though. I'm glad she got fired, but I don't know about the other guy. If all he did was just agree with her, then I don't think he should have been fired.
    Warhawke80

    Mend and Defend

  • mmrvmmrv Member RarePosts: 282
    SBFord said:
    Not offering a single opinion about this, but it's interesting and should offer some more fodder for the discussion:

    https://www.gameworkersunite.org/blog/statement-on-the-arenanet-firings

    Regardless of how one feels about Price's actions and regardless of where one draws the line between rudeness and exasperation in Price's tweets, the fact of the matter is that there is an entire spectrum of responses ArenaNet could have taken, but chose not to. The company could have done anything from pulling their employee aside and discussing their behavior, to giving them an internal reprimand and offered them additional training. Instead, ArenaNet, under the clearly inadequate leadership of Mike O'Brien, made the knee-jerk reaction to fire a member of their team. No dialogue, no nuance, no empathy.

    The unethical firings of Price and Fries, together with the reactions of toxic individuals inside and outside of the Guild Wars player community, have had a chilling effect across the industry. Countless workers have been harassed over social media and many are concerned about the implications of this event, some going so far as to delete their personal social media accounts in fear of similar retaliation from hostile players and bosses. ArenaNet has signaled to the entire industry that our job security can be, and almost certainly will be, imperiled by the most vitriolic and volatile players. This event carries echoes of Gamergate, and will only embolden harassers further.
    LOL WUT?? Nothing but hypocritical word smithing to fabricate victimhood and you should be ashamed to be pushing it as something as value to think about.

    a) it clearly wasn't unethical
    b) she wasnt in anyway harassed by the person she verbally assaulted with her own bigotry.
    c) It was far beyond "rude" even after the person died from cancer she has to press the attack one final time  informing the world of her glee that some innocent person was finally dead.
    d) it was not the first time she treated others like this.

    Yet maybe the worst part of the sewage you tossed into the fray is the fact they try to speak out against social media bully DEFENDING THE PERSON WHO WAS THE PERPETRATOR OF THE BULLYING. Price is the DEFINITION OF TOXIC.

    It was interesting....interesting how someone could be so delusional as to defend her actions and have the gall to pretend she was a victim somehow. The only chilling effect is that somehow these insidious individuals have managed to integrate themselves into the power structure of our world and even have tangible influence...truly frightening.
    JackDundeemarganculosYashaXCaffynatedThahar
  • XasapisXasapis Member RarePosts: 6,295
    SBFord said:
    Not offering a single opinion about this, but it's interesting and should offer some more fodder for the discussion:

    https://www.gameworkersunite.org/blog/statement-on-the-arenanet-firings

    Regardless of how one feels about Price's actions and regardless of where one draws the line between rudeness and exasperation in Price's tweets, the fact of the matter is that there is an entire spectrum of responses ArenaNet could have taken, but chose not to. The company could have done anything from pulling their employee aside and discussing their behavior, to giving them an internal reprimand and offered them additional training. Instead, ArenaNet, under the clearly inadequate leadership of Mike O'Brien, made the knee-jerk reaction to fire a member of their team. No dialogue, no nuance, no empathy.

    The unethical firings of Price and Fries, together with the reactions of toxic individuals inside and outside of the Guild Wars player community, have had a chilling effect across the industry. Countless workers have been harassed over social media and many are concerned about the implications of this event, some going so far as to delete their personal social media accounts in fear of similar retaliation from hostile players and bosses. ArenaNet has signaled to the entire industry that our job security can be, and almost certainly will be, imperiled by the most vitriolic and volatile players. This event carries echoes of Gamergate, and will only embolden harassers further.


    You know, that is interesting that you brought up gamergate (I wasn't aware of it until years). One of the /r/guildwars2 threads I was reading there was a person questioning whether gamergate was right on its assessment regarding gaming press, considering how falsely and on a script the whole situation with guildwars2 is portrait.

    Gaming press has indeed lost considerable relevance over the years, exactly because they chose to push ideology over the facts.

    The reaction towards both your editorial pieces should be an indication on how people that are not necessarily invested in Anet feel. The same contrast is there between the reaction of Guildwars2 players and the gaming press.

    The bottom line was that the CEO of Anet had to choose between appeasing the players or the press. I think he made the right choice, but time will tell.
    AeandermarganculosYashaXCaffynated
  • SBFordSBFord Associate Editor - News ManagerMMORPG.COM Staff LegendaryPosts: 33,120
    edited July 2018
    Xasapis said:

    You know, that is interesting that you brought up gamergate (I wasn't aware of it until years). One of the /r/guildwars2 threads I was reading there was a person questioning whether gamergate was right on its assessment regarding gaming press, considering how falsely and on a script the whole situation with guildwars2 is portrait.

    Gaming press has indeed lost considerable relevance over the years, exactly because they chose to push ideology over the facts.

    The reaction towards both your editorial pieces should be an indication on how people that are not necessarily invested in Anet feel. The same contrast is there between the reaction of Guildwars2 players and the gaming press.

    The bottom line was that the CEO of Anet had to choose between appeasing the players or the press. I think he made the right choice, but time will tell.
    I didn't write that. I simply posted quotes from the link provided in the response I made. It's an interesting side light to the overall discussion. The people who wrote that article are not games press. 

    I don't have an opinion so let's not sling shade please. It's been a very reasonable discussion and I hope it stays that way. 

    @mmrv Again - I did NOT write that, simply provided a link and two quotes from the larger piece. Keep it civil, please. Whether we like it or not, people have a variety of opinions on the subject, so seeing all sides is a benefit to all of us even if we disagree.
    YashaX


    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


  • lahnmirlahnmir Member EpicPosts: 2,561
    SBFord said:
    Xasapis said:

    You know, that is interesting that you brought up gamergate (I wasn't aware of it until years). One of the /r/guildwars2 threads I was reading there was a person questioning whether gamergate was right on its assessment regarding gaming press, considering how falsely and on a script the whole situation with guildwars2 is portrait.

    Gaming press has indeed lost considerable relevance over the years, exactly because they chose to push ideology over the facts.

    The reaction towards both your editorial pieces should be an indication on how people that are not necessarily invested in Anet feel. The same contrast is there between the reaction of Guildwars2 players and the gaming press.

    The bottom line was that the CEO of Anet had to choose between appeasing the players or the press. I think he made the right choice, but time will tell.
    I didn't write that. I simply posted quotes from the link provided in the response I made. It's an interesting side light to the overall discussion. The people who wrote that article are not games press. 

    I don't have an opinion so let's not sling shade please. It's been a very reasonable discussion and I hope it stays that way.
    Agreed. But I can understand his frustration. It seems like some kind of reversed bizarro world. I think the only real discussion should be about whether or not Anet punished her appropriately and if Piers was just collateral damage.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    SBFord
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 4,315
    SBFord said:
    Xasapis said:

    You know, that is interesting that you brought up gamergate (I wasn't aware of it until years). One of the /r/guildwars2 threads I was reading there was a person questioning whether gamergate was right on its assessment regarding gaming press, considering how falsely and on a script the whole situation with guildwars2 is portrait.

    Gaming press has indeed lost considerable relevance over the years, exactly because they chose to push ideology over the facts.

    The reaction towards both your editorial pieces should be an indication on how people that are not necessarily invested in Anet feel. The same contrast is there between the reaction of Guildwars2 players and the gaming press.

    The bottom line was that the CEO of Anet had to choose between appeasing the players or the press. I think he made the right choice, but time will tell.
    I didn't write that. I simply posted quotes from the link provided in the response I made. It's an interesting side light to the overall discussion. The people who wrote that article are not games press. 

    I don't have an opinion so let's not sling shade please. It's been a very reasonable discussion and I hope it stays that way. 

    @mmrv Again - I did NOT write that, simply provided a link and two quotes from the larger piece. Keep it civil, please.
    The problem is that the article that you provided was yet another biased and poorly researched outside perspective of the situation which pushes the same incorrect narrative that these threads have attempted to push in their OP's. 

    If you had wanted an actual neutral, comprehensive, level-headed analysis of the situation, you would have linked Woodenpotatoes' 57 minute video on the topic.
    JackDundeeYashaXCaffynatedThahar
  • MisterZebubMisterZebub Member LegendaryPosts: 3,539
    SBFord said:
    Not offering a single opinion about this, but it's interesting and should offer some more fodder for the discussion:

    https://www.gameworkersunite.org/blog/statement-on-the-arenanet-firings

    Regardless of how one feels about Price's actions and regardless of where one draws the line between rudeness and exasperation in Price's tweets, the fact of the matter is that there is an entire spectrum of responses ArenaNet could have taken, but chose not to. The company could have done anything from pulling their employee aside and discussing their behavior, to giving them an internal reprimand and offered them additional training. Instead, ArenaNet, under the clearly inadequate leadership of Mike O'Brien, made the knee-jerk reaction to fire a member of their team. No dialogue, no nuance, no empathy.

    The unethical firings of Price and Fries, together with the reactions of toxic individuals inside and outside of the Guild Wars player community, have had a chilling effect across the industry. Countless workers have been harassed over social media and many are concerned about the implications of this event, some going so far as to delete their personal social media accounts in fear of similar retaliation from hostile players and bosses. ArenaNet has signaled to the entire industry that our job security can be, and almost certainly will be, imperiled by the most vitriolic and volatile players. This event carries echoes of Gamergate, and will only embolden harassers further.


    I wouldn't personally call their firings unethical, but they were certainly abrupt. And in my not so humble opinion, completely justified. A company can fire you instantly for any offense they deem severe enough. And I feel the massive negative PR campaign these employees created through their negligent actions warranted immediate termination. And while I agree this has caused a major shitstorm and made a mess of things in the industry fomenting fear and paranoia, the problem there is that would have happened regardless of the treatment/punishment of these two developers. Much like as far as I can tell the whole Gamergate fiasco was touched off by one asshole trying to get public revenge against his ex-girlfriend that caused the internet to then go full retard. Yes it sucks that the internet lynch mob exists. It sucks some developers now fear the use of social media. However that's the reality of the situation and there isn't much we can do about it as that ship has sailed.

    That said we must not lose sight of exactly who is at fault for this flame fest happening in the first place. And that blame lies directly on the shoulders of one developer with a massively overinflated sense of her own self worth, and an apparent blindness to her own culpability.

    As Will Smith once said, "If you didn't start shit, there wouldn't be shit."

    SBFordWarhawke80

    "You can go to land of make believe and you can pretend
    But in the end you still have no friends"

  • blamo2000blamo2000 Member RarePosts: 822
    First five points (of seven). I think point two encapsulates the majority opinion of the people defending this lady's behavior or trying to manipulate the narrative. Other than the person who responded wasn't an enemy, but was perceived as one for daring to try and start a conversation.

    ---Paxton, author of several books, including "The Anatomy of Fascism" (Vintage, 2005), said fascism is based more on feelings than philosophical ideas. In his 1988 essay "The Five Stages of Fascism," published in 1998 in the Journal of Modern History, he defined seven feelings that act as "mobilizing passions" for fascist regimes. They are:
    1 - The primacy of the group. Supporting the group feels more important than maintaining either individual or universal rights.
    2 - Believing that one's group is a victim. This justifies any behavior against the group's enemies.
    3 - The belief that individualism and liberalism enable dangerous decadence and have a negative effect on the group.
    4 - A strong sense of community or brotherhood. This brotherhood's "unity and purity are forged by common conviction, if possible, or by exclusionary violence if necessary."
    5 - Individual self-esteem is tied up in the grandeur of the group. Paxton called this an "enhanced sense of identity and belonging."---

    BuccaneermmrvFairlyRattled
  • WarlyxWarlyx Member RarePosts: 2,816

    Zenislav said:

    Woman is psycho that brings her own personal agenda and political opinions where she should not. What is deal with all this white knighting? Would media be this vocal if man was fired for similar reasons?



    yep i have been wondering the same thing....and we all know the answer.
  • XasapisXasapis Member RarePosts: 6,295
    I would understand if the article was about Fries. There you'd have a case where he may have enabled her bad behaviour and gave the impression that it was normalised, but at least he was not outright aggressive towards the players.


    Yet we see article after article about Price. Makes you wonder how privileged and pandered female developers are (as opposed to the narrative), to be such a horrible person and horrible at your work and still get defended for it.

    MisterZebubmarganculosYashaXCaffynatedThahar
  • SBFordSBFord Associate Editor - News ManagerMMORPG.COM Staff LegendaryPosts: 33,120
    edited July 2018
    Aeander said:
    SBFord said:
    Xasapis said:

    You know, that is interesting that you brought up gamergate (I wasn't aware of it until years). One of the /r/guildwars2 threads I was reading there was a person questioning whether gamergate was right on its assessment regarding gaming press, considering how falsely and on a script the whole situation with guildwars2 is portrait.

    Gaming press has indeed lost considerable relevance over the years, exactly because they chose to push ideology over the facts.

    The reaction towards both your editorial pieces should be an indication on how people that are not necessarily invested in Anet feel. The same contrast is there between the reaction of Guildwars2 players and the gaming press.

    The bottom line was that the CEO of Anet had to choose between appeasing the players or the press. I think he made the right choice, but time will tell.
    I didn't write that. I simply posted quotes from the link provided in the response I made. It's an interesting side light to the overall discussion. The people who wrote that article are not games press. 

    I don't have an opinion so let's not sling shade please. It's been a very reasonable discussion and I hope it stays that way. 

    @mmrv Again - I did NOT write that, simply provided a link and two quotes from the larger piece. Keep it civil, please.
    The problem is that the article that you provided was yet another biased and poorly researched outside perspective of the situation which pushes the same incorrect narrative that these threads have attempted to push in their OP's. 

    If you had wanted an actual neutral, comprehensive, level-headed analysis of the situation, you would have linked Woodenpotatoes' 57 minute video on the topic.
    I wasn't LOOKING for a neutral, unbiased article. I posted the link to yet another piece of the puzzle that has interesting discussion opportunities within its words. I like to read all sides of any argument. That makes me informed.

    Just stop.
    HexedprojektYashaXTorvalThahar


    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


  • LeiloniLeiloni Member RarePosts: 1,257
    What I think is really interesting in all of this is that here as well as on other sites, what I'm seeing is fans are almost entirely in agreement in that Jessica was in the wrong, her past behavior has shown this to be a pattern, and the firing was either expected or appropriate.

    The only people that are a) making this a big deal, and b) think this is a huge PR nightmare and that ArenaNet is wrong in some ways and that Jessica is right in some ways, are gaming journalists. Again not just the writers on this site but on numerous others.

    I don't know the reasons for this difference but it is striking to me.
    SBFordlearis1laxieEponyxDamorYashaXCaffynatedThahar
  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 5,232
    I read the series of e-mails and my take-aways were:

    1. I get how having some random person stopping by your twitter feed to suggest how you should do your job is irritating. Of course, the employee did create that Twitter feed and listed her role at AN on it.

    2. I also get that people talking to Devs about what they should be doing differently is nothing new, nothing wrong, and happens constantly. So a Dev has to either hide from people (thinking of you Sean Spicer) or be able to play nice when they are questioned.

    3. AN could have suspended these employees for a week and avoided a lot of this bad press. Maybe with some anger management required. Maybe requiring an apology.
    SBFord

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • Warhawke80Warhawke80 Member UncommonPosts: 181
    edited July 2018
    SBFord said:
    Not offering a single opinion about this, but it's interesting and should offer some more fodder for the discussion:

    https://www.gameworkersunite.org/blog/statement-on-the-arenanet-firings

    Regardless of how one feels about Price's actions and regardless of where one draws the line between rudeness and exasperation in Price's tweets, the fact of the matter is that there is an entire spectrum of responses ArenaNet could have taken, but chose not to. The company could have done anything from pulling their employee aside and discussing their behavior, to giving them an internal reprimand and offered them additional training. Instead, ArenaNet, under the clearly inadequate leadership of Mike O'Brien, made the knee-jerk reaction to fire a member of their team. No dialogue, no nuance, no empathy.

    The unethical firings of Price and Fries, together with the reactions of toxic individuals inside and outside of the Guild Wars player community, have had a chilling effect across the industry. Countless workers have been harassed over social media and many are concerned about the implications of this event, some going so far as to delete their personal social media accounts in fear of similar retaliation from hostile players and bosses. ArenaNet has signaled to the entire industry that our job security can be, and almost certainly will be, imperiled by the most vitriolic and volatile players. This event carries echoes of Gamergate, and will only embolden harassers further.


    Yeah I read that article (Which once again @SBFORD did not write ) and it made me think of an old saying I learned in Poland that translates roughly as.... "The people that control you are the ones you aren't allowed to criticize."

    And lets face it JP pretty much obviously thinks any time anyone with a penis speaks to her, they are exerting power over her and should not be allowed to do that, and so do the good folks at Polygon and RPS.

    That isn't equality or leveling the playing field.... At best it's a very authoritarian tactic of division by allowing (And if you have ever lived in a communist country you know this) the pendulum to swing in wide arcs on both sides, (which keeps division which is needed)  at worst it's evil exploitation of a worthy cause by a very unethical person.

    Regardless.....it's just wrong, also I really don't know about the throngs of developers she claims are supporting her, but every single female I know personally in the industry from corporations like Daybreak, Cryptic, and Bethesda thinks she's an asshole that isn't helping equality one iota.

    In short, no matter how much big brother is trying to spin this, most gamers male or female aren't buying it.

    So they do what they do best and lament the toxic industry/consumer that are made up of evil, evil males.


    SBFord
  • lahnmirlahnmir Member EpicPosts: 2,561
    Leiloni said:
    What I think is really interesting in all of this is that here as well as on other sites, what I'm seeing is fans are almost entirely in agreement in that Jessica was in the wrong, her past behavior has shown this to be a pattern, and the firing was either expected or appropriate.

    The only people that are a) making this a big deal, and b) think this is a huge PR nightmare and that ArenaNet is wrong in some ways and that Jessica is right in some ways, are gaming journalists. Again not just the writers on this site but on numerous others.

    I don't know the reasons for this difference but it is striking to me.
    Perhaps there is a larger divide between "the industry" and "the players" then we assumed there was? I do not think it is intentional however, not like a cover up or sticking up for your colleagues.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    SBFord
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
  • SephirosoSephiroso Member RarePosts: 2,019
    edited July 2018
    SBFord said:
    Aeander said:
    SBFord said:
    Xasapis said:

    You know, that is interesting that you brought up gamergate (I wasn't aware of it until years). One of the /r/guildwars2 threads I was reading there was a person questioning whether gamergate was right on its assessment regarding gaming press, considering how falsely and on a script the whole situation with guildwars2 is portrait.

    Gaming press has indeed lost considerable relevance over the years, exactly because they chose to push ideology over the facts.

    The reaction towards both your editorial pieces should be an indication on how people that are not necessarily invested in Anet feel. The same contrast is there between the reaction of Guildwars2 players and the gaming press.

    The bottom line was that the CEO of Anet had to choose between appeasing the players or the press. I think he made the right choice, but time will tell.
    I didn't write that. I simply posted quotes from the link provided in the response I made. It's an interesting side light to the overall discussion. The people who wrote that article are not games press. 

    I don't have an opinion so let's not sling shade please. It's been a very reasonable discussion and I hope it stays that way. 

    @mmrv Again - I did NOT write that, simply provided a link and two quotes from the larger piece. Keep it civil, please.
    The problem is that the article that you provided was yet another biased and poorly researched outside perspective of the situation which pushes the same incorrect narrative that these threads have attempted to push in their OP's. 

    If you had wanted an actual neutral, comprehensive, level-headed analysis of the situation, you would have linked Woodenpotatoes' 57 minute video on the topic.
    I wasn't LOOKING for a neutral, unbiased article. I posted the link to yet another piece of the puzzle that has interesting discussion opportunities within its words. I like to read all sides of any argument. That makes me informed.

    Just stop.
    To me, saying there's multiple sides of this particular argument is like saying there's multiple sides to the argument that the Earth is flat or not. ....There isn't. One side is clearly wrong.

    The only thing there's multiple sides to is the firing of Fries, and most people agree that was definitively gray area and maybe a bit heavy handed. But on the matter of JP....just no.
    Aeandersimsalabim77EponyxDamorYashaXThahar

    image
    Be the Ultimate Ninja! Play Billy Vs. SNAKEMAN today!

  • DakeruDakeru Member EpicPosts: 3,710
    SBFord said:
    Not offering a single opinion about this, but it's interesting and should offer some more fodder for the discussion:

    https://www.gameworkersunite.org/blog/statement-on-the-arenanet-firings

    Regardless of how one feels about Price's actions and regardless of where one draws the line between rudeness and exasperation in Price's tweets


    This is yet again just asking to ignore everything she said.
    I'm sorry but is this some kind of new offensive meme from gamer sites?

    'Price did nothing wrong'
    Warhawke80JackDundeeYashaXThahar
    Harbinger of Fools
  • SBFordSBFord Associate Editor - News ManagerMMORPG.COM Staff LegendaryPosts: 33,120
    edited July 2018
    Sephiroso said:

    To me, saying there's multiple sides of this particular argument is like saying there's multiple sides to the argument that the Earth is flat or not. ....There isn't. One side is clearly wrong.

    The only thing there's multiple sides to is the firing of Fries, and most people agree that was definitively gray area and maybe a bit heavy handed. But on the matter of JP....just no.
    I'm always interested in all sides, even those that disagree with my personal opinion. By reading everything that's out there, all of the thoughts even if they're in opposition to what I believe, I get to hear other voices on this topic and every other. It's what makes me comfortable offering my opinions when I feel like giving them -- because I know I've done my research.
    YashaXRain_Deathraven


    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


  • Warhawke80Warhawke80 Member UncommonPosts: 181
    edited July 2018
    SBFord said:
    I'm always interested in all sides, even those that disagree with my personal opinion. By reading everything that's out there, all of the thoughts even if they're in opposition to what I believe, I get to hear other voices on this topic and every other. It's what makes me comfortable offering my opinions when I feel like giving them -- because I know I've done my research.
    Pity more people on both sides of the argument don't have this common sense view. I think some people feel like they need to rah rah for their side even if deep down they feel like some of the diametric viewpoint could be or is valid.

    In the end all we can really say for sure is "For reasons this isn't helping the equality debate."
    SBFord
  • celtwulfceltwulf Member UncommonPosts: 61
    You're actually trying to look at it from all sides? Because all everyone here can see is an attempt to discredit someone on ONE side. I will bring politics into it because I don't care what anyone else thinks & it doesn't hurt my feelings at all if they don't like what I believe. I am a Democrat & have been since I understood the politics of this country & yes I think she went WAY TO FAR. She threw a temper tantrum & brought gender into a situation where it was not needed AT ALL. Personally I can't stand the alt-right at all but all this white knight crap from the regressive left is just as bad. "This woman is being attacked we must rush to her aide" No she attacked & guess what? People attacked back. This is just like all the writers who was defending Manveer Heir at Bioware who was making racist remarks EVERY SINGLE WEEK. At one point he even said: "All white people should be herded & culled" & then everyone keeps wondering why people turn from the left. This ignorant white knighting hurts liberalism.
    Warhawke80LeiloniJackDundeeYashaXblamo2000CaffynatedThahar
  • EponyxDamorEponyxDamor Member RarePosts: 726
    edited July 2018
    There isn't much to add that I haven't already said in other threads. However, I will say that while I appreciate Mark O'Brien's swift and decisive action, I do not feel that it was necessary to post publicly that the employees were fired; eventually, "the internet" would have figured it out as Fries removed his title from his bio and Price went squealing about injustice to the press. That was a small misstep in his decision making process.

    However, I wholly disagree with the conclusion @BillMurphy came to:

    "Mike O’Brien ... has instead given his employees targets on their backs – a notice that says, 'Go head, kick me and abuse me. I can’t do anything if I want to keep my job.'"

    If anything, it sends a message to other developers/employees to not attack fans via social media with the company name listed in your bio. Its as simple as that. How anyone can fathom that attacking fans/customers on social media and holding an innocent company partner up as a punching bag (don't pretend JP's clapback at Deroir's initial tweet was anything less) wouldn't end poorly is beyond me.

    (EDIT: Kudos to MMORPG.com for hosting and keeping a civil conversation about this topic. Seriously. Thank you.)
    MadFrenchieWarhawke80Leiloni
  • jmcdermottukjmcdermottuk Member RarePosts: 1,567
    I agree 100% with Bill. I'm sick to the back teeth with all the PC bullshit we get force fed day in and day out. What happened to free speech? What happened to being entitled to an opinion?

    If people are offended by something someone says they can either respond with a counter argument, ignore it, or just toughen the fuck up and stop whining about the mean person who said something nasty.

    So tired of all these whining fucktards. And for someone to be fired over something so trivial speaks volumes about how far PC has gone beyond the bounds of sanity.
    MadFrenchieEponyxDamorWarhawke80Buccaneerceltwulfvandal5627laxieZenJellyJackDundeeDakeruand 3 others.
  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Member LegendaryPosts: 8,483
    I agree 100% with Bill. I'm sick to the back teeth with all the PC bullshit we get force fed day in and day out. What happened to free speech? What happened to being entitled to an opinion?

    If people are offended by something someone says they can either respond with a counter argument, ignore it, or just toughen the fuck up and stop whining about the mean person who said something nasty.

    So tired of all these whining fucktards. And for someone to be fired over something so trivial speaks volumes about how far PC has gone beyond the bounds of sanity.
    Which is exactly what Deroir did (he responded amicably even in the face of a wholly unwarranted attack from Price).  Price tried to put him on blast publicly, and she paid the price for doing so to someone who didn't deserve it.

    As Price said herself, freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from the consequences of your speech.
    EponyxDamorWarhawke80vandal5627LeiloniDakeruYashaXblamo2000Rain_DeathravenThahar

    image
  • MacAllenMacAllen Member UncommonPosts: 63
    This is the real world. In the real world, if you act like a jackass in social media *AND* advertise that you "represent" a company, that company will very likely fire you. This isn't unique to the gaming industry, every industry does this, and most of them make it clear. If they acted like an ass in public, they have to be disciplined in public. Too many companies did the opposite and, to the public, it looked like the company openly supports being an ass. Not rocket science, not something new.

    Bottom line, if you work for a company, you advertise that you work for that company, and you participate in social media with that company's name or logo anywhere connected to your social media, don't act like an ass.
    EponyxDamorWarhawke80vandal5627Leiloniblamo2000Thahar
  • cronius77cronius77 Member UncommonPosts: 1,634
    I agree 100% with Bill. I'm sick to the back teeth with all the PC bullshit we get force fed day in and day out. What happened to free speech? What happened to being entitled to an opinion?

    If people are offended by something someone says they can either respond with a counter argument, ignore it, or just toughen the fuck up and stop whining about the mean person who said something nasty.

    So tired of all these whining fucktards. And for someone to be fired over something so trivial speaks volumes about how far PC has gone beyond the bounds of sanity.
    you do realize you just described exactly what happened except you took the opposite stance? She's the one that got all butthurt because someone criticized her work. She's the one then that lashed out and attacked some guy and turned it into some sort of sexism argument. She got fired for taking it to an entirely new level by name calling. If she would of kept it civil, heated or not she would probably still have a job. She also made a nasty comment about being glad someone was dead so I'm not sure how you can argue this woman didn't deserve to be fired when she has arenanet plastered on her twitter account talking all her garbage.
    Warhawke80celtwulfRidelynnEponyxDamorvandal5627LeiloniDakerublamo2000Thahar
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