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On becoming a backer

d_20d_20 Member RarePosts: 1,878
I never really got to play old school games. I started with WoW in 2007, moved on to Darkfall 2008-2009, and then played all the usual suspects since that time. But the more I learn about Pantheon, the more interested I get to give it a try. This type of game would be a totally new experience for me, not a nostalgia trip.

My only concern is do you think there is enough interest in this game to make it financially viable in the long run? I look at other games like Darkfall: Rise of Agon (nostalgia project, imo) and see the struggle they are having [ https://www.riseofagon.com/news/official-updates/our-first-anniversary/ ]. I wonder if there will be enough players to sustain Pantheon as it's envisioned now.

Are any of you guys backers and what do you think about the prospects of Pantheon?



«13

Comments

  • MendelMendel Member LegendaryPosts: 5,512
    I think the real danger is having several of these 'nostalgia projects' actually launch.  They are all targeting the 'niche' market.  If more than one of these makes a release, the competition between them could be fierce.  There's a distinct chance that this 'niche' market may not be sufficient to keep any one game financially solvent, much less several.

    Pantheon does seem much more likely to actually release as a product.  I can't say the same for their competition.  That, and Pantheon's focus on PvE, may be the saving grace to keep their company alive for awhile.  The bigger challenge that VR is likely to face will be trying to retain all those customers that curiosity and newness are probably going to draw.




    d_20Octagon7711dcutbi001Gyva02Scot

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 30,960
    edited May 2018
    d_20 said:
    I never really got to play old school games. I started with WoW in 2007, moved on to Darkfall 2008-2009, and then played all the usual suspects since that time. But the more I learn about Pantheon, the more interested I get to give it a try. This type of game would be a totally new experience for me, not a nostalgia trip.

    My only concern is do you think there is enough interest in this game to make it financially viable in the long run? I look at other games like Darkfall: Rise of Agon (nostalgia project, imo) and see the struggle they are having [ https://www.riseofagon.com/news/official-updates/our-first-anniversary/ ]. I wonder if there will be enough players to sustain Pantheon as it's envisioned now.

    Are any of you guys backers and what do you think about the prospects of Pantheon?


    There are no guarantees in life. All you can do is dive in and enjoy the moment.

    If it launches then great, have fun! If it doesn't then it was a good try.

    I add say I'm a backer backer but only for $100. Not a lot of money, but enough to bu in and support them as part of an "every drop fills the bucket" idea.
    d_20Octagon7711
    Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb." 

    Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w


    Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547

    Try the "Special Edition." 'Cause it's "Special." https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/64878/?tab=description

    Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo 
  • d_20d_20 Member RarePosts: 1,878
    edited May 2018
    I'm leaning toward backing. Essentially, you're right. There are no guarantees. This thread, which I didn't read (because the title didn't catch my interest) before is essentially dealing with the same question: https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/comment/7325829/#Comment_7325829

    The views expressed there on both sides (faith v reason) are basically what I've gone back and forth with in my my own thinking about Pantheon. 

    I hope it works (not faith), but I don't really believe it will grow a big enough community to keep the game alive over the long haul, growing, and keeping the devs at work. 

    What I've seen in recent streams looks really nice, though. I may wind up backing the game just on general principle.


  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,671
    edited May 2018
    Consider it a donation and move on. If it gains traction, great. If not, again consider it a donation and tell yourself you did your good deed for the month/year/etc.
    d_20Sovrath[Deleted User]KyleranacidbloodPottedPlant22
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 30,960
    edited May 2018
    stlfinder said:

    Ya esta chaval, Sovrath "sumergirte y disfrutar el momento", palabras sabias tío, como poder luchar contra el tiempo, solo dejaos al día por día y se feliz vale. Por acá también os dejo algo de gran ayuda para los software, modelos y plantillas para impresoras 3D,
    Nice of you to say but I don't like that you are leaving a link to sell something/lure people to your site off my post. Fishing is fishing. Flagged.


    blueturtle13Kyleran
    Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb." 

    Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w


    Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547

    Try the "Special Edition." 'Cause it's "Special." https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/64878/?tab=description

    Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo 
  • VrikaVrika Member LegendaryPosts: 7,589
    I'd advice against backing a this point in time: Even their cheapest game package costs $50, and it doesn't come with any special goodies.

    Usually games give you more for your money if you buy years in advance of getting to actually play the game, but Pantheon does not. It looks like they've got funding from other sources so they don't really need your backing, and since they aren't giving any good discounts or goodies you don't need to back now either.

    It's better to just wait and see and make your decisions later.
    KyleranMadFrenchie
     
  • svannsvann Member RarePosts: 2,230
    As an investment its a long shot.  I may donate a reasonable amount if it lets me playtest.  Id see that as a purchase of a playtest slot though and not as an investment.
  • Kayo83Kayo83 Member UncommonPosts: 399
    Yah I wouldnt get the pledges now either. I mean unless you have a friend or partner to give the extra copy to, then I guess the $100 is worth it. Its basically just a pre-order. Its odd how their $50 pledge, which is pretty much a preorder at this point, doesnt have beta access. Pretty much every other MMO pre-order bonus ever offers beta to preorders. 

    I got mine about 2 years ago with alpha access (which im still waiting for, btw! -_- ) ... still glad I did. It was never a high hopes thing anyway and it was kind of "fun" to join the crowdfunding thing once. Plus they seemed to have the right idea at least, and still do. I never played EQ, closest was CoH or FFXI and even so they didnt hold me for long... but I do want something more engaging, more immersive and less mindless than most MMOs today.
    Sovrath
  • TamanousTamanous Member RarePosts: 3,025
    I have to believe in the developers first and foremost and/or see a very respectable prove of concept prior to backing a project. I've only backed 2.

    One main issue for many of these projects is their entry fee. I am ok with exploring additional donations later (not that I have upped any pledges thus far yet) but many of entry points these days start at $100 or more which is too high until I know the game is for real. I am ok with covering the price of the base game at perhaps a collectors level but not more.

    I sure as SHIT won't buy ships worth hundreds of dollars for digital property. That is a level of materialistic bullshit I am morally against at a fundamental humanistic perspective. Those idiots are part of a greater problem that goes far beyond video games. I could go on and say far, far harsher things but I think my point has been made.
    MendelFangrimdragonlee66

    You stay sassy!

  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    I have spent considerable sums of money on dates (dinner, clubs, drinks) that could potentially lead to something fun. Sometimes it did, and sometimes it didn't. Donating to an indy game is kind of like that. You may have an epic time, or you may go home alone. 
    pooh2309

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • Jawbreaker23Jawbreaker23 Member UncommonPosts: 20
    Vrika said:
    I'd advice against backing a this point in time: Even their cheapest game package costs $50, and it doesn't come with any special goodies.

    Usually games give you more for your money if you buy years in advance of getting to actually play the game, but Pantheon does not. It looks like they've got funding from other sources so they don't really need your backing, and since they aren't giving any good discounts or goodies you don't need to back now either.

    It's better to just wait and see and make your decisions later.

    The $50.00 pledge comes with a digital copy of the game, early name reservation and an ingame title - essentially a deluxe edition pre order yes, but one that helps further development of the game.  They stated they have an angel investor, which they have had from the start, but the game is still 100% crowdfunded, so yeah they need your backing. 
  • VrikaVrika Member LegendaryPosts: 7,589
    edited May 2018
    Vrika said:
    I'd advice against backing a this point in time: Even their cheapest game package costs $50, and it doesn't come with any special goodies.

    Usually games give you more for your money if you buy years in advance of getting to actually play the game, but Pantheon does not. It looks like they've got funding from other sources so they don't really need your backing, and since they aren't giving any good discounts or goodies you don't need to back now either.

    It's better to just wait and see and make your decisions later.

    The $50.00 pledge comes with a digital copy of the game, early name reservation and an ingame title - essentially a deluxe edition pre order yes, but one that helps further development of the game.  They stated they have an angel investor, which they have had from the start, but the game is still 100% crowdfunded, so yeah they need your backing. 
    Early name reservation and one in-game title would be essentially the worst deluxe edition ever.
    Mendel
     
  • WellspringWellspring Member EpicPosts: 1,464
    Vrika said:
    Vrika said:
    I'd advice against backing a this point in time: Even their cheapest game package costs $50, and it doesn't come with any special goodies.

    Usually games give you more for your money if you buy years in advance of getting to actually play the game, but Pantheon does not. It looks like they've got funding from other sources so they don't really need your backing, and since they aren't giving any good discounts or goodies you don't need to back now either.

    It's better to just wait and see and make your decisions later.

    The $50.00 pledge comes with a digital copy of the game, early name reservation and an ingame title - essentially a deluxe edition pre order yes, but one that helps further development of the game.  They stated they have an angel investor, which they have had from the start, but the game is still 100% crowdfunded, so yeah they need your backing. 
    Early name reservation and one in-game title would be essentially the worst deluxe edition ever.
    Well, I like it. Better than a deluxe edition that includes in-game p2w or cosmetic cash shop items. 

    The Pantheon subscription model and no cash shop is  what has me most excited about this game. 
    Gyva02
    --------------------------------------------
  • CacolacoCacolaco Member UncommonPosts: 97
    I was in the Vanguard: SoH beta before Sony came into the picture. The druid class on there was my favorite. Of course, the early launch killed that, and they made the druid a little more conventional, which really ruined my interest. I'd love to play a game that McQuaid and co. are actually able to complete before launch.

    I'm so tempted to back this. I just don't want to wait until Beta 2 (or whatever is included in the $50 pledge) to give it a try, as there are other upcoming games that I'm interested in that I'll actually be able to play sometime this year, and I can't afford to back every game that comes along...

    I'm just waiting for a F2P overhyped sandbox WoW clone with full PVP, epic raid bosses, instanced group content, and Crysis-quality graphics to come out. That, or something fun.

  • VrikaVrika Member LegendaryPosts: 7,589
    Cacolaco said:

    I'm so tempted to back this. I just don't want to wait until Beta 2 (or whatever is included in the $50 pledge) to give it a try, as there are other upcoming games that I'm interested in that I'll actually be able to play sometime this year, and I can't afford to back every game that comes along...
    There is no beta access included in the $50 pledge.

    As Jawbreaker23 mentioned earlier in this thread, you'll get to reserve your character name before launch and a title once the game launches.
     
  • VrikaVrika Member LegendaryPosts: 7,589
    edited May 2018
    Vrika said:

    Early name reservation and one in-game title would be essentially the worst deluxe edition ever.
    Well, I like it. Better than a deluxe edition that includes in-game p2w or cosmetic cash shop items. 

    The Pantheon subscription model and no cash shop is  what has me most excited about this game. 
    All the higher pledge tiers include some in-game items. So it's not like they aren't giving any items out, it's just that your so-called deluxe edition is so basic it won't include any of them.
     
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 30,960
    Cacolaco said:
    I was in the Vanguard: SoH beta before Sony came into the picture. The druid class on there was my favorite. Of course, the early launch killed that, and they made the druid a little more conventional, which really ruined my interest. I'd love to play a game that McQuaid and co. are actually able to complete before launch.

    I'm so tempted to back this. I just don't want to wait until Beta 2 (or whatever is included in the $50 pledge) to give it a try, as there are other upcoming games that I'm interested in that I'll actually be able to play sometime this year, and I can't afford to back every game that comes along...
    But that's the thing "there is nothing to try".

    It's not going to be like a good amount of "betas" where the game is finished and they just have polishing to do or a stress test.

    This beta is clearly going to be a beta.

    So if you want to try the game as a game then just wait until they do their stress test or they have an invite to players. I believe the first 10 levels are going to be free so you can't beat that as far as "trying the game out".

    Don't spend a cent to "try the game" as you are only going to end up in disappointment. Wait until they finish.
    Octagon7711KyleranFangrim
    Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb." 

    Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w


    Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547

    Try the "Special Edition." 'Cause it's "Special." https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/64878/?tab=description

    Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo 
  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 9,000
    edited May 2018
    So this is to be a mostly PvE game with a few PvP servers at the start.  Open sandbox world.  With separate balancing of skills in PvE and PvP.  Basically an updated version of EQ1.

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • TwoTubesTwoTubes Member UncommonPosts: 328
    edited May 2018
    The niche game that Pantheon was marketed as a few years back is totally out the window at this point.  It is full on main stream.

    The original budget was thought to be enough with a much smaller playerbase than what the game will have on release so that gives me hope.  I'm guessing after a few months a lot of people leave because they don't like a game with harsh penalties.  Most people who didn't play mmos heavily prior to 2004 haven't had the chance to play a slow paced game with harsh penalties.  It won't be for everyone and I believe many will realize its not for them a couple months in and there will be a mass exodus.  Hopefully the niche group that is left will be enough to sustain the game.  It was thought to be enough 4-5 years ago in early development.
  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 9,000
    edited May 2018
    DMKano said:
    So this is to be a mostly PvE game with a few PvP servers at the start.  Open sandbox world.  With separate balancing of skills in PvE and PvP.  Basically an updated version of EQ1.

    Open sandbox world? - uhmm no.

    Where are you even getting this info that Pantheon is an open sandbox world game?

    EQ1 wasn't an open sandbox world game - just because the game doesn't have npcs with ! and 1000s of quests, it doesn't make it a sandbox game.

    heh

    What exactly was sandbox about EQ1? Linear level progression, linear skill progression, linear crafting progression...


    I read it on their site or here as reviewed by staff, I'll see if I can find it again.

    I found it on this site on the review page.
    https://www.mmorpg.com/pantheon-rise-of-the-fallen

    FEATURES
    • Intensely Social | Pantheon is heavily focused on group play and social interaction, where players will be able to enjoy an epic experience rather than rush through a game.
    • Open 'sandbox' style gameplay |Players make their own experience rather than being ushered along in a linear progression.
    • Reactive Strategic Combat | Players need to think, plan and execute every enemy encounter as there are no "ability rotations".
    • Meaningful Interaction | Every action and interaction in the world has intent and purposeful design in accordance to making the experience feel more like a real world instead of a video game.
    • Harnessing System | Find and learn spells and abilities not just from exploration, but also from lost relics of fallen heroes to learn their ancient powers and potentially acquire unique characteristics of the ancient heroes themselves.

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • volttvoltt Member UncommonPosts: 432
    if you ask me sandbox more means that the player can shape the world in one of or the other, neither eq1 or pantheon IMO are sandboxes, themepark?? 

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    The ONLY sandbox game i have ever played is UnrealTournament.You can shape every single last piece of the game into something you want.
    This is why Epic became so famous,they did not cheap out like Blizzard has with Overwatch,they gave us the tools,they gave EVERYONE free access to their game engine and tools,they allowed the community to become fully active with mods and mapping etc etc.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 9,000
    edited May 2018
    DMKano said:
    DMKano said:
    So this is to be a mostly PvE game with a few PvP servers at the start.  Open sandbox world.  With separate balancing of skills in PvE and PvP.  Basically an updated version of EQ1.

    Open sandbox world? - uhmm no.

    Where are you even getting this info that Pantheon is an open sandbox world game?

    EQ1 wasn't an open sandbox world game - just because the game doesn't have npcs with ! and 1000s of quests, it doesn't make it a sandbox game.

    heh

    What exactly was sandbox about EQ1? Linear level progression, linear skill progression, linear crafting progression...


    I read it on their site or here as reviewed by staff, I'll see if I can find it again.

    I found it on this site on the review page.
    https://www.mmorpg.com/pantheon-rise-of-the-fallen

    FEATURES
    • Intensely Social | Pantheon is heavily focused on group play and social interaction, where players will be able to enjoy an epic experience rather than rush through a game.
    • Open 'sandbox' style gameplay |Players make their own experience rather than being ushered along in a linear progression.
    • Reactive Strategic Combat | Players need to think, plan and execute every enemy encounter as there are no "ability rotations".
    • Meaningful Interaction | Every action and interaction in the world has intent and purposeful design in accordance to making the experience feel more like a real world instead of a video game.
    • Harnessing System | Find and learn spells and abilities not just from exploration, but also from lost relics of fallen heroes to learn their ancient powers and potentially acquire unique characteristics of the ancient heroes themselves.


    I am not holding my breath "open sandbox-STYLE" gameplay - style being the key word there.

    So they might offer some variance where you can level up - EQ1 had like a dozen starting zones but the higher level you got the fewer options there were. At max level there were like 3 zones. IMO this isnt really sandbox play.

    - a true sandbox would allow players to build their characters, skills and gear in lots of different ways, and truly choose a path for their character - Pantheon will be highly limited - set classes, set skills, set gear etc....


    Actually sandbox is emphasized as the key word.  Time will tell. Perhaps it will be Themebox or Sandpark game as someone in the forum suggested.  :smile:

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,537
    DMKano said:
    DMKano said:
    So this is to be a mostly PvE game with a few PvP servers at the start.  Open sandbox world.  With separate balancing of skills in PvE and PvP.  Basically an updated version of EQ1.

    Open sandbox world? - uhmm no.

    Where are you even getting this info that Pantheon is an open sandbox world game?

    EQ1 wasn't an open sandbox world game - just because the game doesn't have npcs with ! and 1000s of quests, it doesn't make it a sandbox game.

    heh

    What exactly was sandbox about EQ1? Linear level progression, linear skill progression, linear crafting progression...


    I read it on their site or here as reviewed by staff, I'll see if I can find it again.

    I found it on this site on the review page.
    https://www.mmorpg.com/pantheon-rise-of-the-fallen

    FEATURES
    • Intensely Social | Pantheon is heavily focused on group play and social interaction, where players will be able to enjoy an epic experience rather than rush through a game.
    • Open 'sandbox' style gameplay |Players make their own experience rather than being ushered along in a linear progression.
    • Reactive Strategic Combat | Players need to think, plan and execute every enemy encounter as there are no "ability rotations".
    • Meaningful Interaction | Every action and interaction in the world has intent and purposeful design in accordance to making the experience feel more like a real world instead of a video game.
    • Harnessing System | Find and learn spells and abilities not just from exploration, but also from lost relics of fallen heroes to learn their ancient powers and potentially acquire unique characteristics of the ancient heroes themselves.


    I am not holding my breath "open sandbox-STYLE" gameplay - style being the key word there.

    So they might offer some variance where you can level up - EQ1 had like a dozen starting zones but the higher level you got the fewer options there were. At max level there were like 3 zones. IMO this isnt really sandbox play.

    - a true sandbox would allow players to build their characters, skills and gear in lots of different ways, and truly choose a path for their character - Pantheon will be highly limited - set classes, set skills, set gear etc....


    Actually sandbox is emphasized as the key word.  Time will tell. Perhaps it will be Themebox or Sandpark game as someone in the forum suggested.  :smile:
    You are relying on this site to properly classify a game? 

    They barely understand what MMO means, sandbox style is way beyond them.

    ;)
    [Deleted User]MendelVynt

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    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

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  • LackingMMOLackingMMO Member RarePosts: 662

    Game Features


    • Enjoy a Lore-rich and deeply complex world where environmental storytelling is central.
    • Immerse yourself in group-focused, intensely social game play using classes that complement each other, encouraging teamwork.
    • Make use of Colored Mana to give your spells flavor and variety.
    • Battle the harsh climates of the world—it can, and will, affect your character.
    • Play classes that have meaningful and defined roles such as Tank, Healer, DPS or Utility (crowd and encounter control). Class identity and group interdependence is key!
    • Choose from a variety of races to play, delve into their epic back-stories and learn of the Celestials who may have been brought to Terminus with them.
    • Discover meaningful questing that is optional, not the primary means of character advancement.
    • Watch the population evolve around you as different NPCs and beasts may change depending on your past actions.
    • Carry on your legacy with progeny—retire a character and have his or her child resume the adventure
    • Rely on your senses as your character’s own intuition may lead you to important discoveries.
    • Learn that limited and class based teleportation may get you close, but in order to reach many destinations you will have to traverse the realm-scarred lands of Terminus through the use of your own two feet, on the back of your mighty steed or even across the seas themselves.
    • Quickly equip situational gear as you move from one climate to the next.
    • Take part in an economy that is largely player driven.
    • Find convenience in dual targeting. Attack your target while healing your allies.
    • Respect your surroundings—succumbing to death has its consequences.
    http://pantheonmmo.com/game/game_features/

    where is sandbox again?

    [Deleted User]
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