Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

No Map!

jgn77jgn77 Member UncommonPosts: 18
One thing that would really help this game from an exploration standpoint is the lack of a detailed map. I know its very expected in games these days but not having a great map makes you really on paying attention to the world around you and landmarks and pathways. It also lends excitement to exploration as you are always wondering if you are going to be able to remember how to get back to town.

One of the best things a game like Morrowind had going for it from an exploration standpoint was the lack of a detailed quality world map. 

*Edit* I am relatively new to following this game and I noticed the map issue is already discussed at length. I am firmly in the no map camp :)
Gyva02delete5230ZenJellyGdemamiDullahanThupliAvanah
«13

Comments

  • TamanousTamanous Member RarePosts: 3,021
    The thing is that humans ALWAYS map shit ... it's sort of our thing. It also makes no sense that maps won't exist in game when the first thing players will do is to externally create online resources or even addons that could do it.

    The best course of action is to have something like CU is doing where cartography exists to some degree based on active exploration but would become less accurate over time anyway related to how dynamic the world is. The impact of this is larger in a game like CU where maps locations and who controls them can vary wildly.

    I certainly agree though that the more that remains hidden and changing from maps benefits the game more than openly revealing every location eventually.
    [Deleted User]dcutbi001jimmywolf

    You stay sassy!

  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 8,973
    edited April 2018
    I don't remember ever seeing a game that became popular that didn't have maps added by players and by extension waypoints and points of interest.  I think the days of drawing your own maps in a notebook are long gone.
    Post edited by Octagon7711 on
    KyleranIselin[Deleted User]jimmywolf

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,736
    I don't remember ever seeing a game that began popular that didn't have maps added by players and by extension waypoints and points of interest.  I think the days of drawing your own maps in a notebook are long gone.

    The more and more I think about it, no maps.... I'm looking forward to drawing my own map :)
    ZenJelly
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 38,222
    I'm in the give me a good map camp, I hate being "lost" in video games.

    Its weird too, I can easily become disoriented in game worlds, but in real life it never happpens, I have an extraordinary sense of direction. 

    Lets put it this way, if those people in the Blair Witch had me with them, it would have been a very short, and unexciting adventure.

    ;)
    BeezerbeezKajidourdenAsheramOctagon7711[Deleted User]dcutbi001jimmywolfMidPrincessAdamantine

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing ESO - Blackwood at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 3,026
    Maps will exist no matter what.  They will be on a third party site in a week or less.  

    If the vocal minority don't want a map....just turn it off/don't use it.  Problem solved.
    AsheramTillerPhryDullahanjimmywolfMidPrincess
  • nk362ynk362y Member UncommonPosts: 29
    jgn77 said:
    One thing that would really help this game from an exploration standpoint is the lack of a detailed map. I know its very expected in games these days but not having a great map makes you really on paying attention to the world around you and landmarks and pathways. It also lends excitement to exploration as you are always wondering if you are going to be able to remember how to get back to town.

    One of the best things a game like Morrowind had going for it from an exploration standpoint was the lack of a detailed quality world map. 

    *Edit* I am relatively new to following this game and I noticed the map issue is already discussed at length. I am firmly in the no map camp :)
    There is no map in game and plans for a map. The only thing we will get is a compass that will only be accurate with an increase in a skill (has not been decided on what that skill is) we may also get the option to draw our own maps or download them 
    KyleranOctagon7711Thupli
  • jpedrote52jpedrote52 Member UncommonPosts: 112
    nk362y said:
    jgn77 said:
    One thing that would really help this game from an exploration standpoint is the lack of a detailed map. I know its very expected in games these days but not having a great map makes you really on paying attention to the world around you and landmarks and pathways. It also lends excitement to exploration as you are always wondering if you are going to be able to remember how to get back to town.

    One of the best things a game like Morrowind had going for it from an exploration standpoint was the lack of a detailed quality world map. 

    *Edit* I am relatively new to following this game and I noticed the map issue is already discussed at length. I am firmly in the no map camp :)
    There is no map in game and plans for a map. The only thing we will get is a compass that will only be accurate with an increase in a skill (has not been decided on what that skill is) we may also get the option to draw our own maps or download them 
    Correct, although there will be an ingame atlas, that tells your rough position in the world, something like this " https://pantheonmmo.com/images/atlas-hd.jpg
  • DaikuruDaikuru Member RarePosts: 797
    I dont understand the problem with maps, no one forces someone to use a map, you need to press a button to look on the world map and i guess you can hide the minimap in most games somehow, so you can play without a map.
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

    - Albert Einstein


  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    I would like a map that shows where I have already been, not where I may go. But I'm not expecting I will get one.
    dcutbi001

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • MendelMendel Member EpicPosts: 4,607
    DMKano said:
    This is pretty silly.

    EQ1 had no in game map - didnt take much time for sites like EQAtlas to post maps of every zone.


    There will be maps for Pantheon, the only difference is who makes them - devs or some 3rd party site

    Here is an opportunity for VR to do something different.  Instead of needing to resort to 3rd party sites for maps, have maps be a completely in-game experience.  Quality of professional art and convenience of having the map immediately available.  Make the game as self-contained as possible, without requiring spoiler sites to supply basic information.

    It would be really simple to have a Pin-and-Sticky-note system imposed over a static map, requiring an in-game face-to-face transaction to share or exchange maps.  In a game purporting a social experience, increasing the number of times players need to interact with one another seems like a very desirable thing.  And finally, no more 'how do I download the maps' questions.




    Thuplijimmywolf

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 3,026
    edited April 2018
    Mendel said:
    DMKano said:
    This is pretty silly.

    EQ1 had no in game map - didnt take much time for sites like EQAtlas to post maps of every zone.


    There will be maps for Pantheon, the only difference is who makes them - devs or some 3rd party site

    Here is an opportunity for VR to do something different.  Instead of needing to resort to 3rd party sites for maps, have maps be a completely in-game experience.  Quality of professional art and convenience of having the map immediately available.  Make the game as self-contained as possible, without requiring spoiler sites to supply basic information.

    It would be really simple to have a Pin-and-Sticky-note system imposed over a static map, requiring an in-game face-to-face transaction to share or exchange maps.  In a game purporting a social experience, increasing the number of times players need to interact with one another seems like a very desirable thing.  And finally, no more 'how do I download the maps' questions.





    Except people will just create maps and upload them to websites and everyone will download them. 

    There is no way to prevent this, maps will be available for anyone to use in some form and people will use them.

    If VR doesn't want to make a map/mini-map system so be it, I will have one no matter what though so they're wasting their time.

    I can see a benefit to not having to do any of that work though, could free up time to work on other things. 

    Like I said, no matter what they do I (and everyone else) will a have map, so...feel free to waste time trying to avoid it I guess?
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,281
    Yep and i agree.

    Playing FFXI i often found some of the maps tough to figure out,so i had to visually learn them and my surroundings.It paid off in the long run,i didn't even need a map after awhile.

    Just look at real life,do we walk around with a magical map all day long,no of course not ,we learn our surroundings.
    Yes it also helps in the discovery aspect.IDK how anyone would be like WHOA there is the Empire State building...Well yeah Joe it says right there on the map Empire State building,what did you expect to find there McDonalds?
    However if you had no map and stumbled onto a great site,then it would much more exciting than seeing McDonalds on a map.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 38,222
    edited April 2018
    Isn't the real issue not about in game maps so much as not providing a pointer on them as to where you exactly are on them?

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing ESO - Blackwood at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • Kayo83Kayo83 Member UncommonPosts: 399
    Nah I want maps... unless they plan on having actual cartography in the game where players can draw their own and sell it. Even so im a little uneasy about relying on the general population to do it right or not maliciously screw people over. Zero faith in humanity.

    GPS pointers letting you know precisely where you are and where you need to go are terrible. Removing maps entirely in any setting advanced enough to make them (like ... ink and parchment!) is deliberately left out to artificially delay players.
    Kyleran
  • Panther2103Panther2103 Member EpicPosts: 5,659
    I enjoyed playing EQ without good maps. 

    Actually I didn't realize the lack of maps is usually something I enjoy until this post.

    Etrian Odyssey on the DS had the ability to grid out your own map on the second screen and I loved that aspect of the dungeon crawl. It really adds to the whole idea of exploration.  
  • Gyva02Gyva02 Member RarePosts: 499
    edited April 2018
    DMKano said:
    This is pretty silly.

    EQ1 had no in game map - didnt take much time for sites like EQAtlas to post maps of every zone.


    There will be maps for Pantheon, the only difference is who makes them - devs or some 3rd party site
    sadly you are correct, maps will exist in one way or another. If its 3rd party you have to go through the hassle of bringing them up in another window but people will still do it. I'm against maps in game but I am for different classes having their own awesome group utility's. A really cool idea is if scouts where the map makers if they had the ability and they had previously been there before. If they had a map already made and if you grouped up with said scout this map then showed up on everyone's screen. Maybe higher the mapping skill the more clear the map appeared to everyone or something. I would be ok with something like that.  

    Edit: Group with them and also be in close proximity. 
    SovrathAmatheAsheram
  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 3,026
    Gyva02 said:
    DMKano said:
    This is pretty silly.

    EQ1 had no in game map - didnt take much time for sites like EQAtlas to post maps of every zone.


    There will be maps for Pantheon, the only difference is who makes them - devs or some 3rd party site
    sadly you are correct, maps will exist in one way or another. If its 3rd party you have to go through the hassle of bringing them up in another window but people will still do it. I'm against maps in game but I am for different classes having their own awesome group utility's. A really cool idea is if scouts where the map makers if they had the ability and they had previously been there before. If they had a map already made and if you grouped up with said scout this map then showed up on everyone's screen. Maybe higher the mapping skill the more clear the map appeared to everyone or something. I would be ok with something like that.  

    Edit: Group with them and also be in close proximity. 

    The 100% crystal clear maps will be available for free.  Again, there is no way around this lol.
    Phrydcutbi001
  • AsheramAsheram Member EpicPosts: 4,924
    Maps will exist no matter what.  They will be on a third party site in a week or less.  

    If the vocal minority don't want a map....just turn it off/don't use it.  Problem solved.
    I am with you on that. Its like all the "I dont want fast travel in a game" types of people. All they have to do just not use it and wala they have "no fast travel". I dont know if it's a "I dont want it so I dont want others to have it either" thing or a lack of will power to resist opening the map or using the fast travel thing.
    Kyleranjimmywolf
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 29,952
    edited April 2018
    Asheram said:
    Maps will exist no matter what.  They will be on a third party site in a week or less.  

    If the vocal minority don't want a map....just turn it off/don't use it.  Problem solved.
    I am with you on that. Its like all the "I dont want fast travel in a game" types of people. All they have to do just not use it and wala they have "no fast travel". I dont know if it's a "I dont want it so I dont want others to have it either" thing or a lack of will power to resist opening the map or using the fast travel thing.
    You guys really don't understand the concept of games do you?

    I suppose I get where you are coming from if you come from the point of view that "every game should have every option completely optional for me and everyone gets to choose what their difficulty is and where they can all go and how easy/hard getting places and whether or not they can have pvp or not etc, etc etc"

    But the idea behind games is really about the shared experience, confronting the same obstacles and because of this sometimes requiring the help of other players in order to make strides toward personal goals as well as group goals.

    And it certainly is about having uniform rules for everyone.

    Does there have to be fast travel? Yes and No. But "pick one and move on". Does there have to be pvp? Yes and No. Pick one and move on.

    Map? Same thing.

    by putting limitations on players you also challenge them to be clever and creative and to create unique experiences both personally and socially.

    Uniform rules for everyone also creates larger meaning when x player can down y boss solo or Z guild can make their way through X dungeon better than anyone.

    And that creates possible goals for people to strive for and possibly attain or even beat if it makes sense to do so.


    Dullahanjimmywolf
  • Gyva02Gyva02 Member RarePosts: 499
    Asheram said:
    Maps will exist no matter what.  They will be on a third party site in a week or less.  

    If the vocal minority don't want a map....just turn it off/don't use it.  Problem solved.
    I am with you on that. Its like all the "I dont want fast travel in a game" types of people. All they have to do just not use it and wala they have "no fast travel". I dont know if it's a "I dont want it so I dont want others to have it either" thing or a lack of will power to resist opening the map or using the fast travel thing.
    By implementing fast travel for all you are taking away some serious utility from the two classes that could port in classic EQ. It's all about interdependence, not convenience that made classic EQ so great. 
  • Gyva02Gyva02 Member RarePosts: 499
    Gyva02 said:
    DMKano said:
    This is pretty silly.

    EQ1 had no in game map - didnt take much time for sites like EQAtlas to post maps of every zone.


    There will be maps for Pantheon, the only difference is who makes them - devs or some 3rd party site
    sadly you are correct, maps will exist in one way or another. If its 3rd party you have to go through the hassle of bringing them up in another window but people will still do it. I'm against maps in game but I am for different classes having their own awesome group utility's. A really cool idea is if scouts where the map makers if they had the ability and they had previously been there before. If they had a map already made and if you grouped up with said scout this map then showed up on everyone's screen. Maybe higher the mapping skill the more clear the map appeared to everyone or something. I would be ok with something like that.  

    Edit: Group with them and also be in close proximity. 

    The 100% crystal clear maps will be available for free.  Again, there is no way around this lol.
    Maybe the scout's map will show you in real time wandering mob placement? Maybe this is really sketchy and crappy until they get a high enough skill? There's way to make this an awesome class utility. Maybe just one of the scout classes gets it, maybe we'll throw the Ranger a bone on this one :) haha... 
    Kyleran
  • TillerTiller Member LegendaryPosts: 9,407
    Daikuru said:
    I dont understand the problem with maps, no one forces someone to use a map, you need to press a button to look on the world map and i guess you can hide the minimap in most games somehow, so you can play without a map.
    It's just some weird masochistic shit a few people want to force on everyone else as they get some twisted enjoyment out of the fact that being constantly lost will be a pain shared by all. Even in the stone age they used landmarks, stars and possibly maps. Humans just don't like to be lost.
    KyleranGyva02jimmywolf
    SWG Bloodfin vet
    Elder Jedi/Elder Bounty Hunter
     
  • Gyva02Gyva02 Member RarePosts: 499
    Tiller said:
    Daikuru said:
    I dont understand the problem with maps, no one forces someone to use a map, you need to press a button to look on the world map and i guess you can hide the minimap in most games somehow, so you can play without a map.
    It's just some weird masochistic shit a few people want to force on everyone else as they get some twisted enjoyment out of the fact that being constantly lost will be a pain shared by all. Even in the stone age they used landmarks, stars and possibly maps. Humans just don't like to be lost.
    Wow, interdependence and giving classes their own unique group helping abilities is "weird masochistic shit" now?



    Don't worry little buddy, I'll hold you hand in the dark scary forest and tell you everything's going to be ok... :) 
    delete5230Phry
  • TheocritusTheocritus Member EpicPosts: 8,442
    While I dont enjoy drawing up maps, there was something very fun about trying to find your way around in classic EQ....It forced the player to learn things instead of having the game do everything for them.
    Gyva02Dullahan[Deleted User]
  • AethaerynAethaeryn Member RarePosts: 3,149
    Yeah , someone will map it. . sure you could not look it up. . but you could always not press 'm' either.  Having it in game is a convenience..  If they had an in game map that filled out as you explored. . that I like.  Otherwise it just comes down to self control.  Don't remove the map when someone can google it in 20 seconds or the people that want it will just be inconvenienced. . Don't press 'm' if you want to explore.  Me. . I am so directionally challenged that a map doesn't even help :)  I am always exploring. . it's not all you think it is :P

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

Sign In or Register to comment.