Btw: it's just poor judging people on their nationality
I don't think it's about judging people on their nationality in this case. Different countries have different laws. We can't ignore that kind of hard fact just for the sake of being polite.
The law is the law, so whatever SBS wrote in their ToS doesn't matter.
What DOES matter is the law. Many but not all countries' laws allow refunds if the product hasn't been delivered yet. EU in particular is that you can get a refund for up to two weeks AFTER delivery. It's actually extremely rare for a country to disallow refunds for a product that hasn't been delivered yet, and in most countries a pledge package for a profit venture counts as a presale of a product.
Technically what you're supposed to do is request your refund politely first. In Star Citizen's case, they got slapped with the FDCC going after them for denying refunds so now they have to give any refund requested. Thus when CiG of Star Citizen initially rejects the refund by giving a tl;dr letter that boils down to "You sure?" but seems much more affirmative to try to dissuade the refund, all you have to do is keep politely replying that you want a refund and you'll get it eventually. I've yet to hear a story of someone absolutely getting refused the refund.
SBS, however, has not caught the FDCC's eyes yet. So they'll probably be stupid enough to reject the refund outright. If they do, you can either go to paypal and/or your credit card company for a charge back on the refund you are legally entitled to, or keep on politely requesting your refund from SBS until you get fed up and threaten small claims court action. Either one is supposed to work, although things don't always work like they're supposed to.
The law may be the Law, and a large part of the law is You being 100% liable for any contract You sign.
So yes, what they say in the ToS (That you legally agreed to, and thus are legally bound it) does matter.
In the case with things like Kickstarter where they say, the only condition by which they will give a refund is if the Goal was not met, by the legally binding contract you signed with Kickstarter, you are no longer entitled to a refund from Kickstarter if the goal was met, no matter what else happens.
Do me a favour. Go get some really high quality paper, something with a smooth finish as it will come in handy in a moment. Now go print off that TOS on the paper and admire it for a second. Now I want you to go take a huge shit and wipe your ass with the freshly printed TOS. That's about how meaningful it is.
The law is the law, so whatever SBS wrote in their ToS doesn't matter.
What DOES matter is the law. Many but not all countries' laws allow refunds if the product hasn't been delivered yet. EU in particular is that you can get a refund for up to two weeks AFTER delivery. It's actually extremely rare for a country to disallow refunds for a product that hasn't been delivered yet, and in most countries a pledge package for a profit venture counts as a presale of a product.
Technically what you're supposed to do is request your refund politely first. In Star Citizen's case, they got slapped with the FDCC going after them for denying refunds so now they have to give any refund requested. Thus when CiG of Star Citizen initially rejects the refund by giving a tl;dr letter that boils down to "You sure?" but seems much more affirmative to try to dissuade the refund, all you have to do is keep politely replying that you want a refund and you'll get it eventually. I've yet to hear a story of someone absolutely getting refused the refund.
SBS, however, has not caught the FDCC's eyes yet. So they'll probably be stupid enough to reject the refund outright. If they do, you can either go to paypal and/or your credit card company for a charge back on the refund you are legally entitled to, or keep on politely requesting your refund from SBS until you get fed up and threaten small claims court action. Either one is supposed to work, although things don't always work like they're supposed to.
The law may be the Law, and a large part of the law is You being 100% liable for any contract You sign.
So yes, what they say in the ToS (That you legally agreed to, and thus are legally bound it) does matter.
In the case with things like Kickstarter where they say, the only condition by which they will give a refund is if the Goal was not met, by the legally binding contract you signed with Kickstarter, you are no longer entitled to a refund from Kickstarter if the goal was met, no matter what else happens.
Do me a favour. Go get some really high quality paper, something with a smooth finish as it will come in handy in a moment. Now go print off that TOS on the paper and admire it for a second. Now I want you to go take a huge shit and wipe your ass with the freshly printed TOS. That's about how meaningful it is.
You can believe that.. but even from people on your side who are against TO's agreements and being bound by them.. I'll leave you with this to keep in mind.
courts have routinely upheld clickwrap agreements. The enforceability of these agreements turns not on the label of “clickwrap” but rather whether the party had constructive notice of the terms of the agreement and thus agreed to be bound by them. A Tenth Circuit decision from 2012, Hancock v. American Telephone & Telegraph Co.,
You can thank @Slapshot1188 for the Legal information. Keep in mind.. as long as you knew what you were signing, you are bound by it.. welcome to real life, it's not a fantasy game that you just get to win by pressing buttons and being a jerk.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Except as we stated... Kickstarter is Browsewrap. Love how your whole argument collapsed and your ignored that
Also- Common sense (which seems not to be so common) also says that contracts work 2 ways. The Kickstarter had an estimated delivery date. Missing that date by 2+ years is not reasonable. They also said that SpatialOS was the fabric they were building the game on. They now pulled that. So yeah, a TOS does not just give a company the right to change product specs, content, delivery at whim with no repercussions.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Except as we stated... Kickstarter is Browsewrap. Love how your whole argument collapsed and your ignored that
Also- Common sense (which seems not to be so common) also says that contracts work 2 ways. The Kickstarter had an estimated delivery date. Missing that date by 2+ years is not reasonable. They also said that SpatialOS was the fabric they were building the game on. They now pulled that. So yeah, a TOS does not just give a company the right to change product specs, content, delivery at whim with no repercussions.
That's a damn good point, they put a date and need to meet that date. End of discussion. They have to provide what they said they said they would provide, 100% correct, contracts work both ways.
Now, I am pretty sure they explained what they were to provide by that date to meet their obligations. This counts as a legally binding agreement between you both., funny how that works, you don't want to bound, but I am gonna guess you love the idea that they are bound.
With that Said:
I have heard some conflicting shit about CoE. I don't really know, but, I have heard that their KS Date was not a Release date of a completed game, but the date by which they would have some kind of mock-up made to present to a high end backer, to be able to eventually make this dream game a reality sometime in the future.
Now, I'll admit, I don't know what the Kickstarter project said, and I don't care either, not my money in this case, But, if it was.. you're damn right I would know exactly what I was buying and have read every line of the advertisement and contract, and not be wallowing around on a forum, wondering what TF I actually paid for. (just making that clear)
So with that said, maybe they already met their obligations to the KS promise they made, maybe they haven't.
If it was a mock-up then it was done, they have a working system they are using to get a real backer, done deal. I don't know what they promised you, but I am sure they know exactly what they promised you, and given your floundering.. I am gonna bet.. you don't.
If they haven't, they should refund your money.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Except as we stated... Kickstarter is Browsewrap. Love how your whole argument collapsed and your ignored that
Also- Common sense (which seems not to be so common) also says that contracts work 2 ways. The Kickstarter had an estimated delivery date. Missing that date by 2+ years is not reasonable. They also said that SpatialOS was the fabric they were building the game on. They now pulled that. So yeah, a TOS does not just give a company the right to change product specs, content, delivery at whim with no repercussions.
That's a damn good point, they put a date and need to meet that date.
But, they also I am sure they explained what they were to provide by that date. This counts as their legal obligation to you.
Case in point, with CoE, I have heard some conflicting terms, I don't really know, but, I have heard that their KS Date was not the Release date of a completed game, but the date by which they would have some kind of mock-up made to present to a high end backer, to be able to eventually make the game a reality sometime in the future.
Now, I'll admit, I don't know what the Kickstarter project said, and I don't care either, not my money in this case, But, if it was.. you're damn right I would know exactly what I was buying and have read every line of the advertisement and contract, and not be wallowing around on a forum, wondering what TF I actually paid for. (just making that clear)
So with that said, maybe they already met their obligations to the KS promise they made, maybe they haven't. if it was a mock-up then it was done, they have a working system they are using to get a real backer, done deal. I don't know what they promised you, but I am sure they know exactly what they promised you, and given your floundering.. I am gonna bet.. you don't.
I never gave them a cent.
Feel free to go check out the Kickstarter and show me where it says they were only going to deliver a "mock up" by Dec 2017. I'll wait.
For someone who has no idea on the backstory you have a lot of input... just saying...you may want to get informed before jumping in.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Except as we stated... Kickstarter is Browsewrap. Love how your whole argument collapsed and your ignored that
Also- Common sense (which seems not to be so common) also says that contracts work 2 ways. The Kickstarter had an estimated delivery date. Missing that date by 2+ years is not reasonable. They also said that SpatialOS was the fabric they were building the game on. They now pulled that. So yeah, a TOS does not just give a company the right to change product specs, content, delivery at whim with no repercussions.
That's a damn good point, they put a date and need to meet that date.
But, they also I am sure they explained what they were to provide by that date. This counts as their legal obligation to you.
Case in point, with CoE, I have heard some conflicting terms, I don't really know, but, I have heard that their KS Date was not the Release date of a completed game, but the date by which they would have some kind of mock-up made to present to a high end backer, to be able to eventually make the game a reality sometime in the future.
Now, I'll admit, I don't know what the Kickstarter project said, and I don't care either, not my money in this case, But, if it was.. you're damn right I would know exactly what I was buying and have read every line of the advertisement and contract, and not be wallowing around on a forum, wondering what TF I actually paid for. (just making that clear)
So with that said, maybe they already met their obligations to the KS promise they made, maybe they haven't. if it was a mock-up then it was done, they have a working system they are using to get a real backer, done deal. I don't know what they promised you, but I am sure they know exactly what they promised you, and given your floundering.. I am gonna bet.. you don't.
I never gave them a cent.
Feel free to go check out the Kickstarter and show me where it says they were only going to deliver a "mock up" by Dec 2017. I'll wait.
For someone who has no idea on the backstory you have a lot of input... just saying...you may want to get informed before jumping in.
How many times do I need to say I don't give a shit.. for it to sink in?
The fact that you missed that the first dozen times, tells me that you don't pay a bit of attention to what you are reading.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Except as we stated... Kickstarter is Browsewrap. Love how your whole argument collapsed and your ignored that
Also- Common sense (which seems not to be so common) also says that contracts work 2 ways. The Kickstarter had an estimated delivery date. Missing that date by 2+ years is not reasonable. They also said that SpatialOS was the fabric they were building the game on. They now pulled that. So yeah, a TOS does not just give a company the right to change product specs, content, delivery at whim with no repercussions.
That's a damn good point, they put a date and need to meet that date.
But, they also I am sure they explained what they were to provide by that date. This counts as their legal obligation to you.
Case in point, with CoE, I have heard some conflicting terms, I don't really know, but, I have heard that their KS Date was not the Release date of a completed game, but the date by which they would have some kind of mock-up made to present to a high end backer, to be able to eventually make the game a reality sometime in the future.
Now, I'll admit, I don't know what the Kickstarter project said, and I don't care either, not my money in this case, But, if it was.. you're damn right I would know exactly what I was buying and have read every line of the advertisement and contract, and not be wallowing around on a forum, wondering what TF I actually paid for. (just making that clear)
So with that said, maybe they already met their obligations to the KS promise they made, maybe they haven't. if it was a mock-up then it was done, they have a working system they are using to get a real backer, done deal. I don't know what they promised you, but I am sure they know exactly what they promised you, and given your floundering.. I am gonna bet.. you don't.
I never gave them a cent.
Feel free to go check out the Kickstarter and show me where it says they were only going to deliver a "mock up" by Dec 2017. I'll wait.
For someone who has no idea on the backstory you have a lot of input... just saying...you may want to get informed before jumping in.
How many times do I need to say I don't give a shit.. for it to sink in?
The fact that you missed that the first dozen times, tells me that you don't pay a bit of attention to what you are reading.
I don’t care if you give a shit. I care that you jump into a thread you don’t give a shit about, on a topic you don’t understand and throw wild and off tangent trash into them. I love informed debate but when you admit you have no info on what you are discussing you don’t add anything.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
For those lacking of reading skills, _AGAIN_ my point was about being aware of the contracts you sign, and not being a dumb ass about it.
Realizing that you are liable for what you agree to, and that, you can't go though your life with your head up ass thinking that the law does not apply to you, and that you won't be held liable for your own stupidity.
What you signed be it buying a video game that does not exist yet or a car, is not relevant to me.
But by all means.. tell me I am wrong.. and please go though life thinking that you are beyond reproach and immune from any agreements or contracts. Life is gonna be Fun for you.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Except as we stated... Kickstarter is Browsewrap. Love how your whole argument collapsed and your ignored that
Also- Common sense (which seems not to be so common) also says that contracts work 2 ways. The Kickstarter had an estimated delivery date. Missing that date by 2+ years is not reasonable. They also said that SpatialOS was the fabric they were building the game on. They now pulled that. So yeah, a TOS does not just give a company the right to change product specs, content, delivery at whim with no repercussions.
That's a damn good point, they put a date and need to meet that date. End of discussion. They have to provide what they said they said they would provide, 100% correct, contracts work both ways.
Now, I am pretty sure they explained what they were to provide by that date to meet their obligations. This counts as a legally binding agreement between you both., funny how that works, you don't want to bound, but I am gonna guess you love the idea that they are bound.
With that Said:
I have heard some conflicting shit about CoE. I don't really know, but, I have heard that their KS Date was not a Release date of a completed game, but the date by which they would have some kind of mock-up made to present to a high end backer, to be able to eventually make this dream game a reality sometime in the future.
Now, I'll admit, I don't know what the Kickstarter project said, and I don't care either, not my money in this case, But, if it was.. you're damn right I would know exactly what I was buying and have read every line of the advertisement and contract, and not be wallowing around on a forum, wondering what TF I actually paid for. (just making that clear)
So with that said, maybe they already met their obligations to the KS promise they made, maybe they haven't.
If it was a mock-up then it was done, they have a working system they are using to get a real backer, done deal. I don't know what they promised you, but I am sure they know exactly what they promised you, and given your floundering.. I am gonna bet.. you don't.
If they haven't, they should refund your money.
If you couldn't take the time to even read the KS campaign, what are you doing here commenting about it?
Your hypotheticals, "if they did this, then that" nonsense isn't adding any value to the conversation.
For those lacking of reading skills, _AGAIN_ my point was about being aware of the contracts you sign, and not being a dumb ass about it.
Realizing that you are liable for what you agree to, and that, you can't go though your life with your head up ass thinking that the law does not apply to you, and that you won't be held liable for your own stupidity.
What you signed be it buying a video game that does not exist yet or a car, is not relevant to me.
But by all means.. tell me I am wrong.. and please go though life thinking that you are beyond reproach and immune from any agreements or contracts. Life is gonna be Fun for you.
You're bemoaning positions not taken. Slap's not saying he's above the law, or beyond reproach or immune to agreements.
He's speaking to shades of grey, and you keep screaming "the world's not so black and white!!!" Which... Isn't being debated.
Feel free to go check out the Kickstarter and show me where it says they were only going to deliver a "mock up" by Dec 2017.
Umm .I just went and looked them up... and, wow, you're right, it's December 2017 .. which is 2 months ago.. not 2+ years, I got that you can't read, you can't math either?
Maybe the world is a better place if people like you just don't have credit cards.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Except as we stated... Kickstarter is Browsewrap. Love how your whole argument collapsed and your ignored that
Also- Common sense (which seems not to be so common) also says that contracts work 2 ways. The Kickstarter had an estimated delivery date. Missing that date by 2+ years is not reasonable. They also said that SpatialOS was the fabric they were building the game on. They now pulled that. So yeah, a TOS does not just give a company the right to change product specs, content, delivery at whim with no repercussions.
That's a damn good point, they put a date and need to meet that date. End of discussion. They have to provide what they said they said they would provide, 100% correct, contracts work both ways.
Now, I am pretty sure they explained what they were to provide by that date to meet their obligations. This counts as a legally binding agreement between you both., funny how that works, you don't want to bound, but I am gonna guess you love the idea that they are bound.
With that Said:
I have heard some conflicting shit about CoE. I don't really know, but, I have heard that their KS Date was not a Release date of a completed game, but the date by which they would have some kind of mock-up made to present to a high end backer, to be able to eventually make this dream game a reality sometime in the future.
Now, I'll admit, I don't know what the Kickstarter project said, and I don't care either, not my money in this case, But, if it was.. you're damn right I would know exactly what I was buying and have read every line of the advertisement and contract, and not be wallowing around on a forum, wondering what TF I actually paid for. (just making that clear)
So with that said, maybe they already met their obligations to the KS promise they made, maybe they haven't.
If it was a mock-up then it was done, they have a working system they are using to get a real backer, done deal. I don't know what they promised you, but I am sure they know exactly what they promised you, and given your floundering.. I am gonna bet.. you don't.
If they haven't, they should refund your money.
If you couldn't take the time to even read the KS campaign, what are you doing here commenting about it?
Your hypotheticals, "if they did this, then that" nonsense isn't adding any value to the conversation.
The KS is over and I didn't give them money.. why the hell would I need to know what they said. The only thing I was saying was.. contracts you sign are binding,and it seems that was too hard a concept for some people on these forums.
I have to agree with another topic, that Kickstarter is a bad medium for game development, too many stupid that can't read trying to play big shots.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Yah.. been trying to tell you that about contracts you sign without reading.. but you're hell bent to disagree with that.. see.. no one likes people like that.. no one.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
For those lacking of reading skills, _AGAIN_ my point was about being aware of the contracts you sign, and not being a dumb ass about it.
Realizing that you are liable for what you agree to, and that, you can't go though your life with your head up ass thinking that the law does not apply to you, and that you won't be held liable for your own stupidity.
What you signed be it buying a video game that does not exist yet or a car, is not relevant to me.
But by all means.. tell me I am wrong.. and please go though life thinking that you are beyond reproach and immune from any agreements or contracts. Life is gonna be Fun for you.
You're bemoaning positions not taken. Slap's not saying he's above the law, or beyond reproach or immune to agreements.
He's speaking to shades of grey, and you keep screaming "the world's not so black and white!!!" Which... Isn't being debated.
I am "bemoaning" the position of don't fuck yourself over by being clueless about what you agreed to.. yes.. how wrong of me..
I am gonna stop. Maybe I should point and laugh at the butthurt.. might not help any. but at least it would be more fun for me.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
For those lacking of reading skills, _AGAIN_ my point was about being aware of the contracts you sign, and not being a dumb ass about it.
Realizing that you are liable for what you agree to, and that, you can't go though your life with your head up ass thinking that the law does not apply to you, and that you won't be held liable for your own stupidity.
What you signed be it buying a video game that does not exist yet or a car, is not relevant to me.
But by all means.. tell me I am wrong.. and please go though life thinking that you are beyond reproach and immune from any agreements or contracts. Life is gonna be Fun for you.
You're bemoaning positions not taken. Slap's not saying he's above the law, or beyond reproach or immune to agreements.
He's speaking to shades of grey, and you keep screaming "the world's not so black and white!!!" Which... Isn't being debated.
I am "bemoaning" the position of don't fuck yourself over by being clueless about what you agreed to.. yes.. how wrong of me..
I am gonna stop. Maybe I should point and laugh at the butthurt.. might not help any. but at least it would be fun for me.
It's quite apparent Slap isn't clueless about the TOS included or the project.
For those lacking of reading skills, _AGAIN_ my point was about being aware of the contracts you sign, and not being a dumb ass about it.
Realizing that you are liable for what you agree to, and that, you can't go though your life with your head up ass thinking that the law does not apply to you, and that you won't be held liable for your own stupidity.
What you signed be it buying a video game that does not exist yet or a car, is not relevant to me.
But by all means.. tell me I am wrong.. and please go though life thinking that you are beyond reproach and immune from any agreements or contracts. Life is gonna be Fun for you.
You're bemoaning positions not taken. Slap's not saying he's above the law, or beyond reproach or immune to agreements.
He's speaking to shades of grey, and you keep screaming "the world's not so black and white!!!" Which... Isn't being debated.
I am "bemoaning" the position of don't fuck yourself over by being clueless about what you agreed to.. yes.. how wrong of me..
I am gonna stop. Maybe I should point and laugh at the butthurt.. might not help any. but at least it would be fun for me.
It's quite apparent Slap isn't clueless about the TOS included or the project.
I'd be inclined to disagree, given he cited the release date as December 2017, and fussed the game was 2+ years past due.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
For those lacking of reading skills, _AGAIN_ my point was about being aware of the contracts you sign, and not being a dumb ass about it.
Realizing that you are liable for what you agree to, and that, you can't go though your life with your head up ass thinking that the law does not apply to you, and that you won't be held liable for your own stupidity.
What you signed be it buying a video game that does not exist yet or a car, is not relevant to me.
But by all means.. tell me I am wrong.. and please go though life thinking that you are beyond reproach and immune from any agreements or contracts. Life is gonna be Fun for you.
You're bemoaning positions not taken. Slap's not saying he's above the law, or beyond reproach or immune to agreements.
He's speaking to shades of grey, and you keep screaming "the world's not so black and white!!!" Which... Isn't being debated.
I am "bemoaning" the position of don't fuck yourself over by being clueless about what you agreed to.. yes.. how wrong of me..
I am gonna stop. Maybe I should point and laugh at the butthurt.. might not help any. but at least it would be fun for me.
It's quite apparent Slap isn't clueless about the TOS included or the project.
I'd be inclined to disagree, given he cited the release date as December 2017, and fussed the game was 2+ years past due.
Ladies and Gentlemen of the Jury.... I rest my case
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
For those lacking of reading skills, _AGAIN_ my point was about being aware of the contracts you sign, and not being a dumb ass about it.
Realizing that you are liable for what you agree to, and that, you can't go though your life with your head up ass thinking that the law does not apply to you, and that you won't be held liable for your own stupidity.
What you signed be it buying a video game that does not exist yet or a car, is not relevant to me.
But by all means.. tell me I am wrong.. and please go though life thinking that you are beyond reproach and immune from any agreements or contracts. Life is gonna be Fun for you.
You're bemoaning positions not taken. Slap's not saying he's above the law, or beyond reproach or immune to agreements.
He's speaking to shades of grey, and you keep screaming "the world's not so black and white!!!" Which... Isn't being debated.
I am "bemoaning" the position of don't fuck yourself over by being clueless about what you agreed to.. yes.. how wrong of me..
I am gonna stop. Maybe I should point and laugh at the butthurt.. might not help any. but at least it would be fun for me.
It's quite apparent Slap isn't clueless about the TOS included or the project.
I'd be inclined to disagree, given he cited the release date as December 2017, and fussed the game was 2+ years past due.
"If you sign a contract you're bound to it", thanks "ungodly" for your INVALUABLE insight.
Since you don't have any knowledge on the specifics of this KS or game, it looks you're job is now done here.
I have no idea who Ungodly is.. but now I know why I could not get that name, LOL.
And yah, you're right, it's really a no brainer, what I said was almost stupid to even have to say it.. and yet people disagreed with me.
I laughed...and with that. I'll leave you all to your petty bickering.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Btw: it's just poor judging people on their nationality
I don't think it's about judging people on their nationality in this case. Different countries have different laws. We can't ignore that kind of hard fact just for the sake of being polite.
That was my point, if he was from a country that did not have the same consumer protection laws as those in the US or EU, then it might explain how XSolla was able to decline his request in a matter of days, if not hours.
If I used my credit card to pay for something like this it would take weeks if not months to get a final decision.
I had never heard of XSolla before he mentioned it, so in looking it up it said it was originally a Russian based firm who relocated to the US but still specialized in handling payment transactions in Russia, hence why I asked the question.
What country are you from @Phobos40, and how did you pay XSolla for this tranaction?
If it was by creditcard then the next step is to call them and ask them to chargeback XSolla.
If you sent XSolla cash, then probably out of luck.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Comments
https://chroniclesofelyria.com/forum/topic/18405/beware-tips-for-xsolla
Btw: it's just poor judging people on their nationality
Do me a favour. Go get some really high quality paper, something with a smooth finish as it will come in handy in a moment. Now go print off that TOS on the paper and admire it for a second. Now I want you to go take a huge shit and wipe your ass with the freshly printed TOS. That's about how meaningful it is.
- courts have routinely upheld clickwrap agreements. The enforceability of these agreements turns not on the label of “clickwrap” but rather whether the party had constructive notice of the terms of the agreement and thus agreed to be bound by them. A Tenth Circuit decision from 2012, Hancock v. American Telephone & Telegraph Co.,
You can thank @Slapshot1188 for the Legal information. Keep in mind.. as long as you knew what you were signing, you are bound by it.. welcome to real life, it's not a fantasy game that you just get to win by pressing buttons and being a jerk.Also- Common sense (which seems not to be so common) also says that contracts work 2 ways. The Kickstarter had an estimated delivery date. Missing that date by 2+ years is not reasonable. They also said that SpatialOS was the fabric they were building the game on. They now pulled that. So yeah, a TOS does not just give a company the right to change product specs, content, delivery at whim with no repercussions.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
That's a damn good point, they put a date and need to meet that date. End of discussion. They have to provide what they said they said they would provide, 100% correct, contracts work both ways.
Now, I am pretty sure they explained what they were to provide by that date to meet their obligations. This counts as a legally binding agreement between you both., funny how that works, you don't want to bound, but I am gonna guess you love the idea that they are bound.
With that Said:
I have heard some conflicting shit about CoE. I don't really know, but, I have heard that their KS Date was not a Release date of a completed game, but the date by which they would have some kind of mock-up made to present to a high end backer, to be able to eventually make this dream game a reality sometime in the future.
Now, I'll admit, I don't know what the Kickstarter project said, and I don't care either, not my money in this case, But, if it was.. you're damn right I would know exactly what I was buying and have read every line of the advertisement and contract, and not be wallowing around on a forum, wondering what TF I actually paid for. (just making that clear)
So with that said, maybe they already met their obligations to the KS promise they made, maybe they haven't.
If it was a mock-up then it was done, they have a working system they are using to get a real backer, done deal. I don't know what they promised you, but I am sure they know exactly what they promised you, and given your floundering.. I am gonna bet.. you don't.
If they haven't, they should refund your money.
Feel free to go check out the Kickstarter and show me where it says they were only going to deliver a "mock up" by Dec 2017. I'll wait.
For someone who has no idea on the backstory you have a lot of input... just saying...you may want to get informed before jumping in.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
The fact that you missed that the first dozen times, tells me that you don't pay a bit of attention to what you are reading.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Realizing that you are liable for what you agree to, and that, you can't go though your life with your head up ass thinking that the law does not apply to you, and that you won't be held liable for your own stupidity.
What you signed be it buying a video game that does not exist yet or a car, is not relevant to me.
But by all means.. tell me I am wrong.. and please go though life thinking that you are beyond reproach and immune from any agreements or contracts. Life is gonna be Fun for you.
Your hypotheticals, "if they did this, then that" nonsense isn't adding any value to the conversation.
He's speaking to shades of grey, and you keep screaming "the world's not so black and white!!!" Which... Isn't being debated.
Umm .I just went and looked them up... and, wow, you're right, it's December 2017 .. which is 2 months ago.. not 2+ years, I got that you can't read, you can't math either?
Maybe the world is a better place if people like you just don't have credit cards.
The last piece of info I will give you is that the COMPANY published an update showing the game will now not be delivered for another roughly 2 years.
Get a clue before you jump knee deep into conversations and discussion. Ignorance is NOT bliss.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I have to agree with another topic, that Kickstarter is a bad medium for game development, too many stupid that can't read trying to play big shots.
I am gonna stop. Maybe I should point and laugh at the butthurt.. might not help any. but at least it would be more fun for me.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Since you don't have any knowledge on the specifics of this KS or game, it looks you're job is now done here.
edit: sorry wrong name, fixed
And yah, you're right, it's really a no brainer, what I said was almost stupid to even have to say it.. and yet people disagreed with me.
I laughed...and with that. I'll leave you all to your petty bickering.
If I used my credit card to pay for something like this it would take weeks if not months to get a final decision.
I had never heard of XSolla before he mentioned it, so in looking it up it said it was originally a Russian based firm who relocated to the US but still specialized in handling payment transactions in Russia, hence why I asked the question.
What country are you from @Phobos40, and how did you pay XSolla for this tranaction?
If it was by creditcard then the next step is to call them and ask them to chargeback XSolla.
If you sent XSolla cash, then probably out of luck.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon