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  • IceAgeIceAge Member EpicPosts: 2,510
    Babuinix said:
    It is CIG money. Backers pledge their money to CIG it becomes part of CIG budget.
    You are the perfect exemple of a "believer sheep" which CIG is looking for. And your avatar is ..man! Its just like you !

    Congratz ...dude!  :) 
    kikoodutroa8Darkpigeon

    Reporter: What's behind Blizzard success, and how do you make your gamers happy?
    Blizzard Boss: Making gamers happy is not my concern, making money.. yes!

  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 3,039
    edited February 2018
    A gamer that knows exactly what he signed up for and who's happy to follow the game's development up-close, test early builds, report bugs?

    Yup that's me alright, sorry if that rubs salt in your wounds but like I said, nobody is forced to pledge or even click on Star Citizen related stuff. :)


    ErillioncjmarshZandogDarkpigeon
  • sgelsgel Member EpicPosts: 2,197
    Babuinix said:

    Most reasonable people realized this, but there are some who don't understand what funding a game entails. They seem to expect money in product out.


    If it wasn't already clear before this should help.

    You are making a PLEDGE

    Click to confirm your ORDER

    Items PURCHASED using store credits

    (TLDR courtesy of SA)


    CIG is so full of shit :)

    IceAgerpmcmurphyZandog

    ..Cake..

  • Turrican187Turrican187 Member UncommonPosts: 787
    sgel said:
    Babuinix said:

    Most reasonable people realized this, but there are some who don't understand what funding a game entails. They seem to expect money in product out.


    If it wasn't already clear before this should help.

    You are making a PLEDGE

    Click to confirm your ORDER

    Items PURCHASED using store credits

    (TLDR courtesy of SA)


    CIG is so full of shit :)

    As long as the "pledge" contains a digital asset it is a sale.
    If it wouldn't be regulated this way it would be a cheap way to avoid taxes.
    "I give you this car for free if you pledge me $30k"

    The fact that they insist on the "pledging" is a bit worrying because it blurs out the intention of this for-profit company.
    sgelcjmarsh

    When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it.
    The cake is a lie.

  • KefoKefo Member EpicPosts: 4,229
    sgel said:
    Babuinix said:

    Most reasonable people realized this, but there are some who don't understand what funding a game entails. They seem to expect money in product out.


    If it wasn't already clear before this should help.

    You are making a PLEDGE

    Click to confirm your ORDER

    Items PURCHASED using store credits

    (TLDR courtesy of SA)


    CIG is so full of shit :)

    As long as the "pledge" contains a digital asset it is a sale.
    If it wouldn't be regulated this way it would be a cheap way to avoid taxes.
    "I give you this car for free if you pledge me $30k"

    The fact that they insist on the "pledging" is a bit worrying because it blurs out the intention of this for-profit company.
    http://www.kotaku.co.uk/2018/02/01/zx-spectrum-vega-plus-backer-wins-refund-in-court

    Person who pledged 100 on Indiegogo got their money back as the judge said this is was an order placed and a contract of sale was created. Now I suppose it’s all in the wording but there’s now precedent in the UK for crowdfunded campaigns to make it easier to get their money back if someone fails to deliver.
    Turrican187
  • PhaserlightPhaserlight Member EpicPosts: 3,002
    edited February 2018
    Babuinix said:
    It is CIG money. Backers pledge their money to CIG it becomes part of CIG budget.
    As odiferous as I find @Babuinix to be, in this particular instance he is correct; when you pledge to this project it is no longer "your" money, it is CIGs.

    It is now on CIG to be responsible with that money and uphold their end of the contract. If they don't, there is recourse regardless what it says in the TOS (consumer protection laws trump corporate policy).

    Edit: read the TOS anyway. Carefully.  Even if it wouldn't hold up in court (hypothetically) you have to know what you are getting into at the time of the transaction.  This is assumed.

    I am not a lawyer, but I do have a M.B.A.  My tip is don't spend anything on this you aren't 100% willing and ready to lose. 

    "The simple is the seal of the true and beauty is the splendor of truth" -Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar
    Authored 139 missions in Vendetta Online and 6 tracks in Distance

  • cjmarshcjmarsh Member UncommonPosts: 299
    I just wish they would make the MMO already and quit spamming my inbox with offers to buy more ships (already backed the kickstarter and got one, tyvm now finish my game). And what is with the shooter they randomly pulled out anyways? Decided they had too much money and decided to push back development even more by making some random stuff with it?
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,229
    cjmarsh said:
    I just wish they would make the MMO already and quit spamming my inbox with offers to buy more ships (already backed the kickstarter and got one, tyvm now finish my game). And what is with the shooter they randomly pulled out anyways? Decided they had too much money and decided to push back development even more by making some random stuff with it?
    If you do not like the messages, why not switch them off ? You do have that option. It only spams your inbox if you want to have it that way.


    Have fun
  • cjmarshcjmarsh Member UncommonPosts: 299
    Erillion said:
    cjmarsh said:
    I just wish they would make the MMO already and quit spamming my inbox with offers to buy more ships (already backed the kickstarter and got one, tyvm now finish my game). And what is with the shooter they randomly pulled out anyways? Decided they had too much money and decided to push back development even more by making some random stuff with it?
    If you do not like the messages, why not switch them off ? You do have that option. It only spams your inbox if you want to have it that way.


    Have fun
    Because I want to know when the game I paid for actually gets finished.
    IceAgeZandog
  • rpmcmurphyrpmcmurphy Member EpicPosts: 3,497
    Kefo said:
    sgel said:
    Babuinix said:

    Most reasonable people realized this, but there are some who don't understand what funding a game entails. They seem to expect money in product out.


    If it wasn't already clear before this should help.

    You are making a PLEDGE

    Click to confirm your ORDER

    Items PURCHASED using store credits

    (TLDR courtesy of SA)


    CIG is so full of shit :)

    As long as the "pledge" contains a digital asset it is a sale.
    If it wouldn't be regulated this way it would be a cheap way to avoid taxes.
    "I give you this car for free if you pledge me $30k"

    The fact that they insist on the "pledging" is a bit worrying because it blurs out the intention of this for-profit company.
    http://www.kotaku.co.uk/2018/02/01/zx-spectrum-vega-plus-backer-wins-refund-in-court

    Person who pledged 100 on Indiegogo got their money back as the judge said this is was an order placed and a contract of sale was created. Now I suppose it’s all in the wording but there’s now precedent in the UK for crowdfunded campaigns to make it easier to get their money back if someone fails to deliver.
    And this is where CIG think they are being clever. Because they aren't giving dates anymore they act like they can't be held to anything...
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,229
    cjmarsh said:
    Erillion said:
    cjmarsh said:
    I just wish they would make the MMO already and quit spamming my inbox with offers to buy more ships (already backed the kickstarter and got one, tyvm now finish my game). And what is with the shooter they randomly pulled out anyways? Decided they had too much money and decided to push back development even more by making some random stuff with it?
    If you do not like the messages, why not switch them off ? You do have that option. It only spams your inbox if you want to have it that way.


    Have fun
    Because I want to know when the game I paid for actually gets finished.
    And you think you will miss that announcement ?

    Really ?!

    Have fun
    Zandog
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    Kefo said:
    sgel said:
    Babuinix said:

    Most reasonable people realized this, but there are some who don't understand what funding a game entails. They seem to expect money in product out.


    If it wasn't already clear before this should help.

    You are making a PLEDGE

    Click to confirm your ORDER

    Items PURCHASED using store credits

    (TLDR courtesy of SA)


    CIG is so full of shit :)

    As long as the "pledge" contains a digital asset it is a sale.
    If it wouldn't be regulated this way it would be a cheap way to avoid taxes.
    "I give you this car for free if you pledge me $30k"

    The fact that they insist on the "pledging" is a bit worrying because it blurs out the intention of this for-profit company.
    http://www.kotaku.co.uk/2018/02/01/zx-spectrum-vega-plus-backer-wins-refund-in-court

    Person who pledged 100 on Indiegogo got their money back as the judge said this is was an order placed and a contract of sale was created. Now I suppose it’s all in the wording but there’s now precedent in the UK for crowdfunded campaigns to make it easier to get their money back if someone fails to deliver.
    Maybe. However the judge spoke from the position that the backer was a consumer and so was protected by consumer protection rights. After that it was just a case of sorting through the small print which attempted to insulate the company against consumer protection laws (aimed at stopping people being ripped off).

    @Turrican187 has already posted the applicable EU wording on this so I suspect the outcome was never in doubt.
  • kikoodutroa8kikoodutroa8 Member RarePosts: 560
    cjmarsh said:
    Erillion said:
    cjmarsh said:
    I just wish they would make the MMO already and quit spamming my inbox with offers to buy more ships (already backed the kickstarter and got one, tyvm now finish my game). And what is with the shooter they randomly pulled out anyways? Decided they had too much money and decided to push back development even more by making some random stuff with it?
    If you do not like the messages, why not switch them off ? You do have that option. It only spams your inbox if you want to have it that way.


    Have fun
    Because I want to know when the game I paid for actually gets finished.
    2014.
    cjmarshIceAge
  • KefoKefo Member EpicPosts: 4,229
    gervaise1 said:
    Kefo said:
    sgel said:
    Babuinix said:

    Most reasonable people realized this, but there are some who don't understand what funding a game entails. They seem to expect money in product out.


    If it wasn't already clear before this should help.

    You are making a PLEDGE

    Click to confirm your ORDER

    Items PURCHASED using store credits

    (TLDR courtesy of SA)


    CIG is so full of shit :)

    As long as the "pledge" contains a digital asset it is a sale.
    If it wouldn't be regulated this way it would be a cheap way to avoid taxes.
    "I give you this car for free if you pledge me $30k"

    The fact that they insist on the "pledging" is a bit worrying because it blurs out the intention of this for-profit company.
    http://www.kotaku.co.uk/2018/02/01/zx-spectrum-vega-plus-backer-wins-refund-in-court

    Person who pledged 100 on Indiegogo got their money back as the judge said this is was an order placed and a contract of sale was created. Now I suppose it’s all in the wording but there’s now precedent in the UK for crowdfunded campaigns to make it easier to get their money back if someone fails to deliver.
    Maybe. However the judge spoke from the position that the backer was a consumer and so was protected by consumer protection rights. After that it was just a case of sorting through the small print which attempted to insulate the company against consumer protection laws (aimed at stopping people being ripped off).

    @Turrican187 has already posted the applicable EU wording on this so I suspect the outcome was never in doubt.
    Oh I know it was never in doubt but this just cements it further into the territory that no matter how hard crowdfunded campaigns try to weasel out of refunds they will get slapped
  • KefoKefo Member EpicPosts: 4,229
    Kefo said:
    sgel said:
    Babuinix said:

    Most reasonable people realized this, but there are some who don't understand what funding a game entails. They seem to expect money in product out.


    If it wasn't already clear before this should help.

    You are making a PLEDGE

    Click to confirm your ORDER

    Items PURCHASED using store credits

    (TLDR courtesy of SA)


    CIG is so full of shit :)

    As long as the "pledge" contains a digital asset it is a sale.
    If it wouldn't be regulated this way it would be a cheap way to avoid taxes.
    "I give you this car for free if you pledge me $30k"

    The fact that they insist on the "pledging" is a bit worrying because it blurs out the intention of this for-profit company.
    http://www.kotaku.co.uk/2018/02/01/zx-spectrum-vega-plus-backer-wins-refund-in-court

    Person who pledged 100 on Indiegogo got their money back as the judge said this is was an order placed and a contract of sale was created. Now I suppose it’s all in the wording but there’s now precedent in the UK for crowdfunded campaigns to make it easier to get their money back if someone fails to deliver.
    And this is where CIG think they are being clever. Because they aren't giving dates anymore they act like they can't be held to anything...
    Judge will just hold them to the original Kickstarter date then
    ScotchUp
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