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Star Citizen, I am disappointed.

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  • maskedweaselmaskedweasel Member EpicPosts: 10,713
    I don't know how many of you have baked cakes before...  it doesn't seem like very many...   

    but in general when you bake a cake, even if it's half baked, or not baked at all, it still generally tastes good, hence why so many people enjoy eating cake batter.  

    That being said, this analogy only really works with cakes...  as "half baked" games are usually pretty bad, nor do they taste good.

    Without any real metrics or target dates to determine what condition a game should be in, it's tough to say if something is in "good condition" at this current stage.  Then again, with their primary funding being expansive and nobody really holding them accountable, they can screw off as much as they like too.

    So basically nothing matters. 



  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member EpicPosts: 7,275
    I don't know how many of you have baked cakes before...  it doesn't seem like very many...   

    but in general when you bake a cake, even if it's half baked, or not baked at all, it still generally tastes good, hence why so many people enjoy eating cake batter.  

    That being said, this analogy only really works with cakes...  as "half baked" games are usually pretty bad, nor do they taste good.

    Without any real metrics or target dates to determine what condition a game should be in, it's tough to say if something is in "good condition" at this current stage.  Then again, with their primary funding being expansive and nobody really holding them accountable, they can screw off as much as they like too.

    So basically nothing matters. 
    I think depends on the cake, the cake usually has the Sugar factor to it so it always tastes good.

    But it never applies to games because the nature of things like bugs, lack of content and performance are usually the factors that would affect that "taste".

    I think Star Citizen 3.0 is a good release, it does need fixing and optimizing because its problem is not the fact what they have done feature-wise is bad, is simply because from the low FPS servers to the breaking bugs it easily disrupts your play session.

    So aside from those issues, Star Citizen 3.0 is a "tasty cake", this of course considering that SC is a simulation game and that is not everyone's cake by default.
  • KezBotKezBot Member UncommonPosts: 19
    I have learned something very important about myself as a backer of SC.    I like playing games but I really don’t want to invest myself in learning about the details of game development.
    OrinoriErillionArglebargleMrMelGibson
  • OrinoriOrinori Member RarePosts: 751
    KezBot said:
    I have learned something very important about myself as a backer of SC. 
    This thread seems to be getting to me, I read that as 'baker of SC'.
    EponyxDamorKezBotMrMelGibson
  • laseritlaserit Member LegendaryPosts: 6,371
    edited January 2018
    I spent $60 on SC back in 2013

    I've played around with v3.0 for about 6 hours in total.

    I'm heavy into flight sims.

    My rig used is an I7 7700k @4.96ghz, HT_on, GTX-1080TI, 64gigs of hi end Gskill ram Asus Maximus mb, SSD drives etc. etc.

    I've had very fluid and responsive frame rates with hiccups here and there, nothing game killing.

    Flight feels really good. Had to stop thinking like an airplane. Being able to exit my ship anywhere and float around in space is pretty cool. You can float onto asteroids, grab interactive objects and bring them back into your ship. Graphics are absolutely gorgeous.

    Have I ran into bugs? you bet. One of the biggest ones so far seems to be that I can't seem to find a way to enter my Hornet. My freelancer is just fine and very fun to fly.

    My thoughts

    I hope the road blocks are pretty much taken care of. There is a hell of a lot of work left to do. Developing moons is very easy compared to developing whole planets with live weather and atmosphere's.

    What I did experience was very good.

    There is definitely a fun game/sim in the making here.

    Having experienced the last almost 40 years of  desktop flight simulator evolution. I can appreciate the task and the time in development that SC has ahead of it.

    Do I regret spending the $60?

    Nope


    OrinoriErillionMaxBaconArglebarglegervaise1MrMelGibson

    "Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee

  • KefoKefo Member EpicPosts: 4,229
    MaxBacon said:
    Kefo said:
    Lol people like me. You mean people who call out the bullshit of the creator when it happens and then get labelled a hater because people don’t like being told they keep falling for the same crap?

    No sorry the fans hyped the 3.0 patch as the big patch that would prove us haters wrong, Derek Smart called it the Jesus patch and it stuck. Of course when 3.0 came out it was more like the marshmallow peep patch and not the Jesus patch.
    hmmm :p those people!

    The fans hyped 3.0. 

    3.0 is the biggest patch the game has gotten.

    3.0 proves the haters wrong in its way, the biggest argument as usual, and same as your biggest argument "things aren't real until they are released" to dismiss the demoed gameplay, now it is released, it is there, independent of bugs/fps.

    Of course, now you spin your argument to be about something else, and I predicted this here many months ago "once 3.0 releases and the things that were demoed are there, the argument will be about its bugs and issues"; and here we are.

    This became so predictable now these discussions are just meh.
    3.0 doesn’t prove the haters wrong just like it didn’t prove the white knights correct. They promised netcode, made a big production of it and hyping it up and then fell flat on their face. And yeah I stick by it’s not real until it’s released for backers to play, especially when we are talking about SC. Defend it all you want you know they make promises that they break and falling for the hype is just stupid at this point with their history. 

    I dont spin spin my argument to be about something else. I point out the crap that they hype and fail to deliver and since they constantly do that my argument is always the same. If I think they did something well I might agree with one of you but don’t expect me to post about it because someone else has it covered.

    And can I face palm here? I’ve always posted about the bugs and issues so congratulations on predicting I (or others) will keep posing about the bugs and issues?

    If the the discussions are so meh then I have to ask why you bother posting at all or is it you feel some need to defend SC against everyone’s opinion if it doesn’t paint it in a favourable light?  
    MaxBacon
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member EpicPosts: 7,275
    edited January 2018
    laserit said:
    My thoughts

    I hope the road blocks are pretty much taken care of. There is a hell of a lot of work left to do. Developing moons is very easy compared to developing whole planets with live weather and atmosphere's.

    What I did experience was very good.

    There is definitely a fun game/sim in the making here.

    Having experienced the last almost 40 years of  desktop flight simulator evolution. I can appreciate the task and the time in development that SC has ahead of it.

    Do I regret spending the $60?

    Nope
    Yeah same opinion, one that around here is treated like it's heresy but do what, that push to paint all things SC in a bad light is just the standard around here, the 3.0 failure of an update narrative, those who like it (the overall of the backers) of course do not matter to the narrative unless when someone has something bad to say. :/
  • ArglebargleArglebargle Member RarePosts: 2,894
    Erillion said:
    >>>
    Man eats half baked cake then complains 'it don't taste good'.
    >>>

    THIS.


    Have fun

    Yeah, you should never have the expectation of anything but an unfinished cake when it comes from a baker noted for half baked cakes.   
    Kefo

    If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,235
    Erillion said:
    >>>
    Man eats half baked cake then complains 'it don't taste good'.
    >>>

    THIS.


    Have fun

    Yeah, you should never have the expectation of anything but an unfinished cake when it comes from a baker noted for half baked cakes.   
    One should always have the expectation of something good when it comes from a baker noted for Hall of Fame cakes.

    http://www.darkstation.com/features/features/hall-of-fame-wing-commander-iv-the-price-of-freedom

    "...Chris Roberts, whose crowd-fundedStar Citizen project continues to make headlines, crafted a war torn universe worthy of Lucas and Roddenberry in which humans battle against the relentless Kilrathi Empire in a decades long conflict. ..."


    Have fun


    Orinori
  • KefoKefo Member EpicPosts: 4,229
    Erillion said:
    Erillion said:
    >>>
    Man eats half baked cake then complains 'it don't taste good'.
    >>>

    THIS.


    Have fun

    Yeah, you should never have the expectation of anything but an unfinished cake when it comes from a baker noted for half baked cakes.   
    One should always have the expectation of something good when it comes from a baker noted for Hall of Fame cakes.

    http://www.darkstation.com/features/features/hall-of-fame-wing-commander-iv-the-price-of-freedom

    "...Chris Roberts, whose crowd-fundedStar Citizen project continues to make headlines, crafted a war torn universe worthy of Lucas and Roddenberry in which humans battle against the relentless Kilrathi Empire in a decades long conflict. ..."


    Have fun


    Comes from someone who had someone else above him calling the shots and reigning him in, something the person himself has admitted is a fault of his. Does that cheapen the achievement? No it doesn’t but it does point to a massive character flaw that should not be in someone with complete control. So allow me to edit your post slightly

    One should always have the expectation of something good when it comes from a baker noted for Hall of Fame cakes when he is told what to do and how to get there.
    MaxBaconcmacq
  • TalulaRoseTalulaRose Member RarePosts: 1,247
    Erillion said:
    Erillion said:
    >>>
    Man eats half baked cake then complains 'it don't taste good'.
    >>>

    THIS.


    Have fun

    Yeah, you should never have the expectation of anything but an unfinished cake when it comes from a baker noted for half baked cakes.   
    One should always have the expectation of something good when it comes from a baker noted for Hall of Fame cakes.

    http://www.darkstation.com/features/features/hall-of-fame-wing-commander-iv-the-price-of-freedom

    "...Chris Roberts, whose crowd-fundedStar Citizen project continues to make headlines, crafted a war torn universe worthy of Lucas and Roddenberry in which humans battle against the relentless Kilrathi Empire in a decades long conflict. ..."


    Have fun


    You really think CR has the same body of work as Star Wars and Star trek and everything that has spun out of them for the last 51 years? 

    I laugh at the delusions of the SC fanatics.
    MaxBaconpantaroNilden
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member EpicPosts: 7,275
    You really think CR has the same body of work as Star Wars and Star trek and everything that has spun out of them for the last 51 years? 

    I laugh at the delusions of the SC fanatics.
    He made the "star wars of pc gaming" before it was cool.

    And that sir, is Wing Commander, not a delusion. lol
  • TalulaRoseTalulaRose Member RarePosts: 1,247
    MaxBacon said:
    You really think CR has the same body of work as Star Wars and Star trek and everything that has spun out of them for the last 51 years? 

    I laugh at the delusions of the SC fanatics.
    He made the "star wars of pc gaming" before it was cool.

    And that sir, is Wing Commander, not a delusion. lol

    Film[edit]

    Main article: Wing Commander (film)

    In 1999, Wing Commander hit the big screen with the film of the same name. It was directed by Chris Roberts, the creator of the game series, and stars Freddie Prinze, Jr.Saffron BurrowsMatthew LillardTchéky KaryoJürgen Prochnow, and David Warner. The film diverged significantly from the established Wing Commander universe, and was a critical and commercial failure.


    And that sir, is Wing Commander, not a delusion. lol

    pantaroTalonsinKefomaskedweaselNildenMrMelGibsonMaxBacon
  • OrinoriOrinori Member RarePosts: 751
    edited January 2018
    Kefo said:
    Erillion said:
    Erillion said:
    >>>
    Man eats half baked cake then complains 'it don't taste good'.
    >>>

    THIS.


    Have fun

    Yeah, you should never have the expectation of anything but an unfinished cake when it comes from a baker noted for half baked cakes.   
    One should always have the expectation of something good when it comes from a baker noted for Hall of Fame cakes.

    http://www.darkstation.com/features/features/hall-of-fame-wing-commander-iv-the-price-of-freedom

    "...Chris Roberts, whose crowd-fundedStar Citizen project continues to make headlines, crafted a war torn universe worthy of Lucas and Roddenberry in which humans battle against the relentless Kilrathi Empire in a decades long conflict. ..."


    Have fun


    Comes from someone who had someone else above him calling the shots and reigning him in, something the person himself has admitted is a fault of his. Does that cheapen the achievement? No it doesn’t but it does point to a massive character flaw that should not be in someone with complete control. So allow me to edit your post slightly

    One should always have the expectation of something good when it comes from a baker noted for Hall of Fame cakes when he is told what to do and how to get there.
    Reigning him in was always for the benefit of the investors in order to try to achieve maximum profit in cheapest turn around possible. Reigning in was never and will NEVER be for the benefit of providing the fans of the game a more awesome experience. 



    Erillion
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member EpicPosts: 7,275

    And that sir, is Wing Commander, not a delusion. lol

    I said the Star Wars of PC Gaming.

    That was the games under Wing Commander with their well known movie-like approach back then.
  • GatheredMystGatheredMyst Member UncommonPosts: 11
    Looking at this objectively, I think the concerning bits are not even being pointed out here.

    In an MMO like this, what is typically the most expensive and time consuming piece to add to a game like this?

    Content.

    What is this game seemingly seriously lacking?  Content.

    They've got the technology down.  The game looks good.  Flight feels good.  All of the bits and bobs that you would expect from a flight sim are there... but that's just the overall shell of the game.

    What's missing?  The thing that will take the longest amount of time, and the most amount of money, to develop:  the stuff that FILLS that universe.

    And considering they are already 5 years down the pipe, and millions of dollars down, THAT is the most concerning piece of this thing.  It really does make you stop and wonder where all the money and time has gone.
    pantaroPingu2012
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member EpicPosts: 7,275
    edited January 2018
    Looking at this objectively, I think the concerning bits are not even being pointed out here.

    In an MMO like this, what is typically the most expensive and time consuming piece to add to a game like this?

    Content.

    What is this game seemingly seriously lacking?  Content.

    They've got the technology down.  The game looks good.  Flight feels good.  All of the bits and bobs that you would expect from a flight sim are there... but that's just the overall shell of the game.

    What's missing?  The thing that will take the longest amount of time, and the most amount of money, to develop:  the stuff that FILLS that universe.

    And considering they are already 5 years down the pipe, and millions of dollars down, THAT is the most concerning piece of this thing.  It really does make you stop and wonder where all the money and time has gone.
    What has been taking the time is not the creation of content, the creation of the underlying tech and game systems that support all the content is what takes most time (otherwise you're creating content over placeholder code).

    The content is the easier part really, no technical challenges and most about the work of artists once they have the tools to work with, that goes from creating a mission to creating a new moon or even a planet.


    Let me give you an easy to get example:
    • Say when they created the first moons, it was not just the content, they had to create the tech, then atmospheric flight models, then make planets rotate and orbit, and transition with their own gravity and a ton of nuances and requirements to make it work.
    • Say, after have all that, when you make your second planet you don't need to develop that tech that makes it rotate, and have gravity, etc... etc.. Focusing the work on the art and content side of it; that's why it's much faster.

    So that's not concerning for who understands how this works, in easy words, content it's pretty much a template that is replicated once you have it working.
    Orinori
  • TheocritusTheocritus Member EpicPosts: 7,799
    Are there actually playable avatars in this one or is it going to be like Eve and we just sit in a spaceship all the time?
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member EpicPosts: 7,275
    edited January 2018
    Are there actually playable avatars in this one or is it going to be like Eve and we just sit in a spaceship all the time?
    It is really heavily about your character in first person, hence the FPS mechanics merged in with the rest, even inside ships.
  • DAS1337DAS1337 Member UncommonPosts: 2,610
    Typical for most people, I mean blind followers of the game, to bash this article.  Completely missing the point that they made.  Not because there wasn't a point, but because, how dare someone make perfectly valid points that reflect negatively on your religion that is Star Citizen.

    I remember logging in, well over a year ago.  Barely anything to actually do in the game.  After a few days, I uninstalled due to frame rate issues.  Fast forward to now.  I've kept up with the game.  I've seen the additions that they have made, and what do I hear?  Still frame rate issues. 

    That is the point.  Despite the content added and promise shown for the future, the game is still not fun.  You can't enjoy, even what little that is there, because the netcode, or whatever it is that ails them is so poor, that people can't even play at 30fps. 

    For PC gamers, 60fps is a minimum for a lot of people.  I LOVE the idea of Star Citizen.  But I won't spend a dime and I won't play the game until I know that I can actually play it without having a seizure.  I'm not sure how new most people here are to alphas and betas, but I have quite a bit of experience with them.  And very, very rarely does a game have these performance issues for this long. 

    I think it's perfectly reasonable, at this point, after this much time, to be a bit disappointed with their performance issues.  And as the author stated.  We're not talking about handling thousands of clients.  We're talking about 50 or less.  This game will NEVER make it as long as it can't fix that problem. 

    If it does?  I'll be jumping in with the rest of you.
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Member EpicPosts: 7,275
    edited January 2018
    DAS1337 said:
    Typical for most people, I mean blind followers of the game, to bash this article.  Completely missing the point that they made.  Not because there wasn't a point, but because, how dare someone make perfectly valid points that reflect negatively on your religion that is Star Citizen.

    I remember logging in, well over a year ago.  Barely anything to actually do in the game.  After a few days, I uninstalled due to frame rate issues.  Fast forward to now.  I've kept up with the game.  I've seen the additions that they have made, and what do I hear?  Still frame rate issues. 

    That is the point.  Despite the content added and promise shown for the future, the game is still not fun.  You can't enjoy, even what little that is there, because the netcode, or whatever it is that ails them is so poor, that people can't even play at 30fps. 

    For PC gamers, 60fps is a minimum for a lot of people.  I LOVE the idea of Star Citizen.  But I won't spend a dime and I won't play the game until I know that I can actually play it without having a seizure.  I'm not sure how new most people here are to alphas and betas, but I have quite a bit of experience with them.  And very, very rarely does a game have these performance issues for this long. 

    I think it's perfectly reasonable, at this point, after this much time, to be a bit disappointed with their performance issues.  And as the author stated.  We're not talking about handling thousands of clients.  We're talking about 50 or less.  This game will NEVER make it as long as it can't fix that problem. 

    If it does?  I'll be jumping in with the rest of you.
    Not bashing the article, just saying the bashing the game over performance issues is quite petty because the game is one alpha (I know saying this word here is considered whiteknighting lol), there are things to expect and end up implied and that is one of the standard problems people who play games early on face.  You don't have to be a "blind follower" to point that out; it's about expectations, especially as to when they are going to seriously focus on performance/stability.

    Different games have different issues, remember Planetside 2? And that wasn't one alpha yet a released game, took years until they did that overhaul and from sudden, the game became properly playable.

    So if you want to actually read about the performance topic, you can check this out: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/forum/1/thread/star-citizen-alpha-3-0-performance-tidbits
    pantaro
  • k61977k61977 Member RarePosts: 1,330
    The thing that amazes me is if this was before crowd funding, and this age of playing testing phase games because you paid to get in, none of this would even matter.  It took Blizzard how long to make Wow?  It took many, many years to make quality games and still does, with the average being 5-7 years from start to completion and release for a MMO.  That is a valid time frame for any game that has a large scope. 

    Do I really give a damn about where he has spent the money nope I don't because I am not stupid enough to put money into something that isn't finished or at least pretty far along in the beta phase, unless I ever know the developer or have a long history of playing games made by the developer. 

    I sit back an laugh ever time I see a thread about this game because there are only three responses every time.  First a player that backed the game defends the game.  Second players that backed the game feel regret for backing and complain or ones that didn't back complain just because.  Third players like myself that don't really care other that looking for something to laugh at sit back and laugh at both one and two fighting each other over a game that isn't even completed.


  • laseritlaserit Member LegendaryPosts: 6,371
    Are there actually playable avatars in this one or is it going to be like Eve and we just sit in a spaceship all the time?
    Completely playable avatars. First or third person

    Seems to be completely free roaming.

    I just did an experiment that disappointed me :( 

     I flew out of port with my Freelancer, turned on full afterburner. Once I hit my top speed of 1004 meters per second, I got out of my seat walked to the back of the ship. I opened the rear cargo door and the spaceport I just left was not visible. I  jumped out of the rear cargo door and immediately the spaceport became visible and my Freelancer and I were stationary and not moving.

    I was hoping that my spaceship and I would of been separately hurtling through space.

    Maybe my Freelancer is like one of those Bombardier jet skis and has one of those safety keys that stops the vehicle when you fall overboard ;)
    Pingu2012

    "Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee

  • OrinoriOrinori Member RarePosts: 751
    laserit said:
    I was hoping that my spaceship and I would of been separately hurtling through space.

    Maybe my Freelancer is like one of those Bombardier jet skis and has one of those safety keys that stops the vehicle when you fall overboard ;)
    A personal kind of related pet peeve of mine, there was a time that floating in space was actually floating in space and I loved it, now your suit auto steadies your position in space and brings you to a stand still. For ship movement you can override this with decoupled mode. I am hoping at some point they give your suit the same option through the mobi glass.
    laserit
  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Member LegendaryPosts: 8,505
    Orinori said:
    Kefo said:
    Erillion said:
    Erillion said:
    >>>
    Man eats half baked cake then complains 'it don't taste good'.
    >>>

    THIS.


    Have fun

    Yeah, you should never have the expectation of anything but an unfinished cake when it comes from a baker noted for half baked cakes.   
    One should always have the expectation of something good when it comes from a baker noted for Hall of Fame cakes.

    http://www.darkstation.com/features/features/hall-of-fame-wing-commander-iv-the-price-of-freedom

    "...Chris Roberts, whose crowd-fundedStar Citizen project continues to make headlines, crafted a war torn universe worthy of Lucas and Roddenberry in which humans battle against the relentless Kilrathi Empire in a decades long conflict. ..."


    Have fun


    Comes from someone who had someone else above him calling the shots and reigning him in, something the person himself has admitted is a fault of his. Does that cheapen the achievement? No it doesn’t but it does point to a massive character flaw that should not be in someone with complete control. So allow me to edit your post slightly

    One should always have the expectation of something good when it comes from a baker noted for Hall of Fame cakes when he is told what to do and how to get there.
    Reigning him in was always for the benefit of the investors in order to try to achieve maximum profit in cheapest turn around possible. Reigning in was never and will NEVER be for the benefit of providing the fans of the game a more awesome experience. 



    No, it's to ensure the fans get an actual game experience in the first place.

    image
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