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Pre-Alpha Starts Today!

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  • LasterbaLasterba Member UncommonPosts: 135
    $350 is acceptable for a decent size TV, ridiculous to beta test a game...I remember when we were doing them the favor to test their games for free, now they want to charge an arm and a leg for us to test bad games.
    You guys are looking at this all wrong.  This is a crowdfunding campaign to raise money for development.  VR is not EA.  They don't have infinite pools of money.  The company has been very up front and exceedingly clear about this.  It's essentially a Kickstarter.  At $350 one of the backer rewards you get is Alpha/Beta access.

    If you don't want to pay it, fine lol.  No one is forcing you.  Let the people with money to burn pay for the development so that you get a better game at launch.
    KumaponDullahanMrMelGibsonKilsindcutbi001chocolate42069
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,528
    Lasterba said:
    Raxeon said:
    what an absurd price to get into pre alpha
    This is basically a long term kickstarter reward.  At the $1000 tier you get access to pre-alpha.



    Good job Lasterba, 

    It seems people are thinking greedy  "here's my money, give me everything in return"  


    By giving a $1000 your saying  "I believe in your cause, here's some money, I'll help you make a game" 



    Access to pre-alpha is a SMALL GIFT in return !!! 
    It's no different than giving large sums of money to a charity and they give you a small red plastic flower that you could pin on your jacket.... meaning thank you ! 




    People here seem to look at it this way "here's a $1000, give me a $1000 back"
  • XthosXthos Member UncommonPosts: 2,734
    DMKano said:
    Lasterba said:
    $350 is acceptable for a decent size TV, ridiculous to beta test a game...I remember when we were doing them the favor to test their games for free, now they want to charge an arm and a leg for us to test bad games.
    You guys are looking at this all wrong.  This is a crowdfunding campaign to raise money for development.  VR is not EA.  They don't have infinite pools of money.  The company has been very up front and exceedingly clear about this.  It's essentially a Kickstarter.  At $350 one of the backer rewards you get is Alpha/Beta access.

    If you don't want to pay it, fine lol.  No one is forcing you.  Let the people with money to burn pay for the development so that you get a better game at launch.

    VR also raised series A funding in April 2017

    They are going to be doing series B funding soon.

    So they are rasing money in addition to crowdfunding
    I am glad they are, if they didn't find someone to do this stuff, the game may never get done, and if it did, it would probably be horrible.  I just hope they can raise enough to give us a quality finished product that runs good (so it doesn't scare people off, it is hard to fix and keep customers...aka Vanguard).
  • tdawg26tdawg26 Member UncommonPosts: 24
    Is it still possible to get into the alpha ? I am craving a mmorpg and cannot find one to fill the void. 
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 28,760
    edited January 2018
    tdawg26 said:
    Is it still possible to get into the alpha ? I am craving a mmorpg and cannot find one to fill the void. 
    Honestly, this isn't a "get into alpha" scenario. It's a "I believe in the game and want to see it succeed so I am giving them money. A perk is that I can get into Alpha and help test and give my feedback along the way ..."

    So yes You can give money and get into Alpha once they actually have an Alpha testing phase. There is no date for that.

    But if you are just looking to play a game, save your money until the time comes when the game has beta, and launch set.
    KilsinKefoKyleranMrMelGibsondcutbi001
  • ThebeastttThebeasttt Member RarePosts: 1,130
    It's not an accident a sizable chunk of the prealpha folks are in the RMT Agnarr poopsock guild Faceless Empire, and it's not to make the game a better place. Every item that matters will be mapped out and permacamped before the game even launches.
  • KefoKefo Member EpicPosts: 4,229
    It's not an accident a sizable chunk of the prealpha folks are in the RMT Agnarr poopsock guild Faceless Empire, and it's not to make the game a better place. Every item that matters will be mapped out and permacamped before the game even launches.
    You know this for a fact or are you just pulling things from your behind? 
  • MensurMensur Member RarePosts: 932
    I would give my left hand for a video leak :D 

    Proud MMORPG.com member since 2009! 




  • Nightbringe1Nightbringe1 Member UncommonPosts: 1,335
    It's not an accident a sizable chunk of the prealpha folks are in the RMT Agnarr poopsock guild Faceless Empire, and it's not to make the game a better place. Every item that matters will be mapped out and permacamped before the game even launches.

    Hopefully VR takes a more direct approach towards moderating gameplay and community standards.

    Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
    Benjamin Franklin

  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,124
    Lasterba said:
    Raxeon said:
    what an absurd price to get into pre alpha
    This is basically a long term kickstarter reward.  At the $1000 tier you get access to pre-alpha.



    Good job Lasterba, 

    It seems people are thinking greedy  "here's my money, give me everything in return"  


    By giving a $1000 your saying  "I believe in your cause, here's some money, I'll help you make a game" 



    Access to pre-alpha is a SMALL GIFT in return !!! 
    It's no different than giving large sums of money to a charity and they give you a small red plastic flower that you could pin on your jacket.... meaning thank you ! 




    People here seem to look at it this way "here's a $1000, give me a $1000 back"
    That's about as believable as a prostitute who sells $1000 dollar pens with a "FREE GIFT" saying nobody did it for the sex.
    MrMelGibson

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer



  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,479
    Disclosure - I am not in pre-alpha.

    If I were, I expect what would be happening right now is that I would log in where I was told to log in, and would be doing whatever they told me to do. Roll this class. Chop down a tree. Go fishing. Fight goblins today. Comment on some issue in a forum. Something like that. Because they are still making the game! And the point is to test it (realizing there is not yet enough of it to advance to alpha).

    Some people seem to think pre-alpha is folks running around playing the game in advance of everyone else, getting some major leg up on their "competition." I don't think that is the case. Plus, since the game will change over time, a lot of things they encounter will change before launch. 

    I don't see a reason to get worked up about it. 
    jpedrote52Kilsindrivendawn

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 28,760
    edited January 2018
    Nilden said:
    Lasterba said:
    Raxeon said:
    what an absurd price to get into pre alpha
    This is basically a long term kickstarter reward.  At the $1000 tier you get access to pre-alpha.



    Good job Lasterba, 

    It seems people are thinking greedy  "here's my money, give me everything in return"  


    By giving a $1000 your saying  "I believe in your cause, here's some money, I'll help you make a game" 



    Access to pre-alpha is a SMALL GIFT in return !!! 
    It's no different than giving large sums of money to a charity and they give you a small red plastic flower that you could pin on your jacket.... meaning thank you ! 




    People here seem to look at it this way "here's a $1000, give me a $1000 back"
    That's about as believable as a prostitute who sells $1000 dollar pens with a "FREE GIFT" saying nobody did it for the sex.
    what a skewed outlook on life that you have.

    In any case, if one were to give to the Lyric stage you would get benefits:

    https://www.lyricstage.com/support/benefits.cfm

    If I give to the Huntington Theater I get benefits:

    https://www.huntingtontheatre.org/support/benefits/

    If I give to the Boston Symphony I can get benefits. And on the 4k level:

    https://www.bso.org/brands/bso/contribute/info-for-current-donors/donor-events.aspx

    "What?!?!? 4k for just a dinner!!!! Outrageous!"

    or you can pick your donation and also get perks:

    https://www.bso.org/Forms/Donation?fund=81
    Kilsindcutbi001
  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,124
    edited January 2018
    Oh gee if I go to the Pantheon page the $1000 dollar tier is the top seller.

    Probably because people are buying pre-alpha for $1000 dollars.

    https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/

    Actually it looks like on the website only the $10,000 package includes pre-alpha. Anyone else see that?

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer



  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 28,760
    Nilden said:
    Oh gee if I go to the Pantheon page the $1000 dollar tier is the top seller.

    Probably because people are buying pre-alpha for $1000 dollars.

    https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/

    Just like I'm buying a dinner for 4k.

    You don't really get out much do you?
  • CrazKanukCrazKanuk Member EpicPosts: 6,130
    Glad to see the game progressing! Very cool!
    Kilsin

    Crazkanuk

    ----------------
    Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
    Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
    Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
    Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
    Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
    ----------------

  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,124
    Sovrath said:
    Nilden said:
    Oh gee if I go to the Pantheon page the $1000 dollar tier is the top seller.

    Probably because people are buying pre-alpha for $1000 dollars.

    https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/

    Just like I'm buying a dinner for 4k.

    You don't really get out much do you?
    No you're not buying a dinner for 4k you are just donating because you be such a good person, who believes in  the cause.

    Also checking the webpage I'm sure it only lists the $10,000 tier as pre-alpha. Anyone else confirm?

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer



  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 28,760
    Nilden said:
    Sovrath said:
    Nilden said:
    Oh gee if I go to the Pantheon page the $1000 dollar tier is the top seller.

    Probably because people are buying pre-alpha for $1000 dollars.

    https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/

    Just like I'm buying a dinner for 4k.

    You don't really get out much do you?
    No you're not buying a dinner for 4k you are just donating because you be such a good person, who believes in  the cause.

    Also checking the webpage I'm sure it only lists the $10,000 tier as pre-alpha. Anyone else confirm?
    Then I'm not clear on your stance for this. Same with Pantheon, you aren't givign 1000k for alpha you believe in the cause.
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,152
    Sovrath said:
    Nilden said:
    Lasterba said:
    Raxeon said:
    what an absurd price to get into pre alpha
    This is basically a long term kickstarter reward.  At the $1000 tier you get access to pre-alpha.



    Good job Lasterba, 

    It seems people are thinking greedy  "here's my money, give me everything in return"  


    By giving a $1000 your saying  "I believe in your cause, here's some money, I'll help you make a game" 



    Access to pre-alpha is a SMALL GIFT in return !!! 
    It's no different than giving large sums of money to a charity and they give you a small red plastic flower that you could pin on your jacket.... meaning thank you ! 




    People here seem to look at it this way "here's a $1000, give me a $1000 back"
    That's about as believable as a prostitute who sells $1000 dollar pens with a "FREE GIFT" saying nobody did it for the sex.
    what a skewed outlook on life that you have.

    In any case, if one were to give to the Lyric stage you would get benefits:

    https://www.lyricstage.com/support/benefits.cfm

    If I give to the Huntington Theater I get benefits:

    https://www.huntingtontheatre.org/support/benefits/

    If I give to the Boston Symphony I can get benefits. And on the 4k level:

    https://www.bso.org/brands/bso/contribute/info-for-current-donors/donor-events.aspx

    "What?!?!? 4k for just a dinner!!!! Outrageous!"

    or you can pick your donation and also get perks:

    https://www.bso.org/Forms/Donation?fund=81
    Aren't those non-profits or not-for-profits where your donation is tax deductible? It's not the same thing at all.

    It doesn't matter what you call it, that's just semantics. They're selling something for a price, what they use it for is irrelevant.

    One could point out that all those places you donate too aren't viable products on their own. They have to solicit funds from donating "whales" to survive. Whatever they produce isn't financially viable thus they need donations for continued existence.

    If any of these indie game devs operate that way they're screwed. A whale isn't just about people buying advantage and "winning". A whale is someone who can afford to dump and pump vastly larger sums of money into a game for rewards a "typical spender" couldn't achieve. That is exactly what's happening here with some semantical smoke and mirrors to shape it in a more PR friendly package.

    I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with patronizing an art or project, but I do think there is something wrong with trying to pass it off as something different.

    The honest reality is that VR is funding their game with and only wants whales participating at this time. Because a $1k buy-in for a game is squarely in whale territory. I sort of feel like even the $135 pre-alpha buy in for Ashes I did starts to hit "whale" territory and I'm concerned that this is creating a problem in a genre whose strength is built on social inclusion.

    It's one thing, and still possibly adverse, for big spenders to support a game. It's another if all of our indie games are being built, designed, and guided by big spenders. I honestly think this was a big, if not the biggest, factor in the downfall of Shroud. I see this same pattern in every single indie game being made including Pantheon, Camelot, Lucimia, Elyria, and Ashes. None of them are immune and I think that should be concerning.

    Oh well, I guess we'll see how it all rolls out.
    Mendel
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 17,972
    They are not investors,nobody should be calling them that.

    They are suckers,giving their money up so someone they don't even know can build a game.

    You want to build a game,go right ahead but your not getting my money to do it.Furthermore,if you need free handouts,then it is quite likely,you cannot afford to build a game properly,so expect that type of result.
    People left and complained about Vanguard,this will be even smaller and likely heavily instanced.
    It is nice to dream...hope...pray this game will turn out to be something decent and playable but common sense should say ,wait and see but don't get your hopes up.
    I am expecting a 6/10,if it turns out to be a 7 great,but i am not so sure it can be that good.
    When i watched their stream,i was falling asleep,i was even skeptical as to why Kohn was involved,what i saw gave me little hope.
    Mendeldrivendawndcutbi001

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 28,760
    Torval said:
    Sovrath said:
    Nilden said:
    Lasterba said:
    Raxeon said:
    what an absurd price to get into pre alpha
    This is basically a long term kickstarter reward.  At the $1000 tier you get access to pre-alpha.



    Good job Lasterba, 

    It seems people are thinking greedy  "here's my money, give me everything in return"  


    By giving a $1000 your saying  "I believe in your cause, here's some money, I'll help you make a game" 



    Access to pre-alpha is a SMALL GIFT in return !!! 
    It's no different than giving large sums of money to a charity and they give you a small red plastic flower that you could pin on your jacket.... meaning thank you ! 




    People here seem to look at it this way "here's a $1000, give me a $1000 back"
    That's about as believable as a prostitute who sells $1000 dollar pens with a "FREE GIFT" saying nobody did it for the sex.
    what a skewed outlook on life that you have.

    In any case, if one were to give to the Lyric stage you would get benefits:

    https://www.lyricstage.com/support/benefits.cfm

    If I give to the Huntington Theater I get benefits:

    https://www.huntingtontheatre.org/support/benefits/

    If I give to the Boston Symphony I can get benefits. And on the 4k level:

    https://www.bso.org/brands/bso/contribute/info-for-current-donors/donor-events.aspx

    "What?!?!? 4k for just a dinner!!!! Outrageous!"

    or you can pick your donation and also get perks:

    https://www.bso.org/Forms/Donation?fund=81
    Aren't those non-profits or not-for-profits where your donation is tax deductible? It's not the same thing at all.

    It doesn't matter what you call it, that's just semantics. They're selling something for a price, what they use it for is irrelevant.


    Yes they are not for profit.

    I still see it as the same thing because though Pantheon will be a for profit game/endeavor, it's creation is up in the air. For those who believe in it they can give money. If they really believe in it they can become actual investors.

    And if one gives money why shouldn't they get some sort of perks?
  • KumaponKumapon Member RarePosts: 1,346
    edited January 2018
    Nilden said:
    Sovrath said:
    Nilden said:
    Oh gee if I go to the Pantheon page the $1000 dollar tier is the top seller.

    Probably because people are buying pre-alpha for $1000 dollars.

    https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/

    Just like I'm buying a dinner for 4k.

    You don't really get out much do you?
    No you're not buying a dinner for 4k you are just donating because you be such a good person, who believes in  the cause.

    Also checking the webpage I'm sure it only lists the $10,000 tier as pre-alpha. Anyone else confirm?
    The pre-alpha for $1000, and $3000 was for a limited time only. VR took the offer down around Christmas time. 

    So your right, the only way to get into pre-alpha now is to buy the $10,000 option. 
    Nilden
  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,124


    Took a screen shot. Anyway check the website, sure it's the $10,000 that gets pre-alpha.

    As for my stance it can be both, but let's not pretend people are not buying into pre-alpha.

    I'm sure there are nice guys who just want to buy $1000 dollar pens and skip the "free gift" as well.
    MrMelGibson

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer



  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 28,760
    Nilden said:


    Took a screen shot. Anyway check the website, sure it's the $10,000 that gets pre-alpha.

    As for my stance it can be both, but let's not pretend people are not buying into pre-alpha.

    I'm sure there are nice guys who just want to buy $1000 dollar pens and skip the "free gift" as well.
    So you really think people are buying into pre-alpha because they want an awesome gaming experience as opposed to wanting to support the game?

    Well, glass half full/half empty I suppose.
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,152
    Sovrath said:
    Torval said:
    Sovrath said:
    Nilden said:
    Lasterba said:
    Raxeon said:
    what an absurd price to get into pre alpha
    This is basically a long term kickstarter reward.  At the $1000 tier you get access to pre-alpha.



    Good job Lasterba, 

    It seems people are thinking greedy  "here's my money, give me everything in return"  


    By giving a $1000 your saying  "I believe in your cause, here's some money, I'll help you make a game" 



    Access to pre-alpha is a SMALL GIFT in return !!! 
    It's no different than giving large sums of money to a charity and they give you a small red plastic flower that you could pin on your jacket.... meaning thank you ! 




    People here seem to look at it this way "here's a $1000, give me a $1000 back"
    That's about as believable as a prostitute who sells $1000 dollar pens with a "FREE GIFT" saying nobody did it for the sex.
    what a skewed outlook on life that you have.

    In any case, if one were to give to the Lyric stage you would get benefits:

    https://www.lyricstage.com/support/benefits.cfm

    If I give to the Huntington Theater I get benefits:

    https://www.huntingtontheatre.org/support/benefits/

    If I give to the Boston Symphony I can get benefits. And on the 4k level:

    https://www.bso.org/brands/bso/contribute/info-for-current-donors/donor-events.aspx

    "What?!?!? 4k for just a dinner!!!! Outrageous!"

    or you can pick your donation and also get perks:

    https://www.bso.org/Forms/Donation?fund=81
    Aren't those non-profits or not-for-profits where your donation is tax deductible? It's not the same thing at all.

    It doesn't matter what you call it, that's just semantics. They're selling something for a price, what they use it for is irrelevant.


    Yes they are not for profit.

    I still see it as the same thing because though Pantheon will be a for profit game/endeavor, it's creation is up in the air. For those who believe in it they can give money. If they really believe in it they can become actual investors.

    And if one gives money why shouldn't they get some sort of perks?
    You're framing this as a donation, which it isn't, but barring that I agree that if an exchange of currency takes place (business transaction) then it should be beneficial to both parties.

    The problem is that a small demographic can afford to partake in this thereby disenfranchising the larger demographic. This is problematic for a game genre built on social inclusion. It needlessly adds to social stratification and boundaries.

    Even in the arts this is a problem isn't it? Fine arts like to project that they are culturally refined and exclusive. Thus they must rely on people who fit that and are rich thereby excluding more of the paying masses.

    A long time ago everyone loved theatre and opera. Long before movies came along and took the blame for stealing crowds, it was the social elite that squeezed the commoner from the opera, from the arts. Now classical music, opera, and the fine arts have a reputation and in practice are for the upper class.

    This sort of virtual gentrification is bad for our genre in my opinion. We're creating more walls, more barriers, and promoting social castes and for what purpose? To get a game made that couldn't otherwise? Is that really a direction we want to take as a larger community? We should ask ourselves these questions.
    EponyxDamorMendelGyva02dcutbi001
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,124
    Sovrath said:
    Nilden said:


    Took a screen shot. Anyway check the website, sure it's the $10,000 that gets pre-alpha.

    As for my stance it can be both, but let's not pretend people are not buying into pre-alpha.

    I'm sure there are nice guys who just want to buy $1000 dollar pens and skip the "free gift" as well.
    So you really think people are buying into pre-alpha because they want an awesome gaming experience as opposed to wanting to support the game?

    Well, glass half full/half empty I suppose.
    Their are people who believe they are donating to help the cause and people who believe they are buying into pre-alpha. Hell with some of the mental gymnasts around here there are probably people who believe both at the same time.

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer



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