ASUS Turbo 1070 GTX

cheyane

So sorry to bother you all with another hardware problem so soon after my son's PC questions.

I have a GTX 770 in my Alienware  Aurora R4 that uses a blower style cooling. I read that I have to find a suitable card with the same type of blower system since the computer supports that type of card as another cooling system might cause a build up. This was from the community Dell
http://en.community.dell.com/owners-club/alienware/f/3746/t/19983786

Also since the video card has a hinged door that closes over the card before the side panel of the computer slots in the card I can manage to put seems restricted to these measurements. 10.5", 4.3 ", 1.5" or 11.1cm, 26.7cm, 3.5cm so I can only put in the reference founder's card or ASUS Turbo 1070 GTX 
https://www.amazon.it/Asus-GeForce-GTX-1070-TURBO-GTX1070-8G/dp/B01IF66QAI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1487677233&sr=8-1&keywords=asus+turbo+1070

The Alienware has 875 watts PSU.

My question is the new AMD graphics cards RX 490 will be competing with the 1080 GTX if I am not mistaken so how likely are the prices of the 1070 GTX to drop?  If it did drop by how much would it be around 10% or so about 40 Euros or less. If it is less then 30 Euros I might as well buy the card now. I want to be ready for Mass Effect Andromeda . 

laserit

Looking at pictures of the Aurora,  It looks like it will take a gtx 1070.  I don't think prices will change much unless Vega knocks our socks off.

Does this look like your beast

  

filmoret

Any new video card will easily fit in that slot.  Wow that is one massive GPU.

If you want to be safe you can get the 1070 mini.  Its a lot smaller and will definitely fit.

Vrika

cheyane said:

My question is the new AMD graphics cards RX 490 will be competing with the 1080 GTX if I am not mistaken so how likely are the prices of the 1070 GTX to drop?  If it did drop by how much would it be around 10% or so about 40 Euros or less. If it is less then 30 Euros I might as well buy the card now. I want to be ready for Mass Effect Andromeda . 

The price drop should be more than 10%, but if you start waiting you might have to wait until summer for AMD's release and the price drop.

If you need a new graphic card now, just upgrade now.

filmoret

Vrika said:

cheyane said:

My question is the new AMD graphics cards RX 490 will be competing with the 1080 GTX if I am not mistaken so how likely are the prices of the 1070 GTX to drop?  If it did drop by how much would it be around 10% or so about 40 Euros or less. If it is less then 30 Euros I might as well buy the card now. I want to be ready for Mass Effect Andromeda . 

The price drop should be more than 10%, but if you start waiting you might have to wait until summer for AMD's release and the price drop.

If you need a new graphic card now, just upgrade now.

Its not an easy question to answer honestly.  Look at the prices for the Raedon HD video cards.  They never dropped even though they are outdated and over the hill.

cheyane

Yes the case is heavy and big but because of that swinging cover you can see it in the second shot @laserit put up. Someone who put in a Titan in that slot had to saw  that door off. No sawing off it will void my 4 year guarantee so that is why I am trying to stay within the measurements.

Thanks but you know the 770 GTX is still doing okay and if it is beyond 10% then I'll wait. Thank you for all the help you have given me.

filmoret

If you aren't overclocking the cpu.   Then you can just discard that blower mounted next to the GPU.  Thats if it gets in the way.

filmoret

filmoret said:

If you aren't overclocking the cpu.   Then you can just discard that blower mounted next to the GPU.  Thats if it gets in the way.

Nevermind I'm looking at the case and I'm wondering where the heck the air leaves the case.  That is one horrible design.

Jamar870

Off topic, Filmoret, what does the "jail" door mean? I seen others have it now and then.

filmoret

Jamar870 said:

Off topic, Filmoret, what does the "jail" door mean? I seen others have it now and then.

I said something I shouldn't have and got penalty for a while.

cheyane

It gets blown out the back you can see the holes and so far card has not gone above 70 degrees celcius in summer. It's around 30 when not playing anything.

filmoret

Just trying to figure out if that arm thing that swings back and covers the GPU has a purpose.  Looks like it has something to do with directing airflow.

cheyane

Yes that is what it does it directs the flow. Which is why you need both a blower type card and not remove that door as it dumps all the hot air inside without it. 

Quizzical

If your GPU upgrade options are really that limited, then the case is terrible.  That's the sort of thing that I'd expect from trying to upgrade a computer that someone bought for $300 at Wal-Mart.  Though it wouldn't surprise me if Dell would try that, as they love vendor lock-in.

If you've got a few decent case fans, then you should be fine on heat.  The way most gaming rigs work is that the video card fans are responsible for getting heat off of the video card, and then the case fans are responsible for getting that hot air out of the case entirely.  A pair of 120 mm case fans in reasonable locations should handle an internal exhaust card just fine.

The other issue is whether the card will physically fit.  Dell can be creatively stupid here, but if one long card fits, another probably should, too.  The most important exception is for extra narrow cases, e.g., 4 inches wide rather than 7, in which case, you'll be stuck with a half-height card.  Sometimes if something is in a stupid place blocking longer video cards, you can unscrew it and remove it to get it out of the way.

filmoret

Yea look at that case design.  Its a really bad design and thats why she has such a problem getting a GPU.  Here's a picture of what you see when opening the case.



All that crap supposively gives a duct for the hot air from the GPU to exit the system.  Because there's no vents on the side to let air in or out.  So that is either a duct for intake or outtake  idk which because well I dont have the system in front of me to figure it out.  The intake is maybe on top and outtake is back where the cpu cooler is.  Or vise versa.

Cleffy

I doubt nVidia will drop prices too much if AMD releases a competing part against the GTX 1070/1080. I imagine AMD will be releasing 2 new parts with Vega initially. One that has performance slightly below the 1080 slotted in at $399. Another competing against the Titan slotted in around $699.
GPU prices tend not to drop much until a whole 'nother generation comes around. Something like Volta being released should lower prices by about half as we saw with the GTX 980ti and Fury X.
AMD makes up for losses on their CPU business through GPU sales. The cost difference of manufacturing an AMD gpu and nVidia gpu is not that much anymore. So it's doubtful they will attempt a price war as they did with the HD3870 and HD4870.

As for what cooler design to look for, I think all that matters is which way the cooling fins are pointed. ASUS has 3 cooler designs. 1 exhausts out the back, 1 exhausts out the front and back, and 1 exhausts out the sides. The sides will probably offer the better cooling, but only when side vents are present. It gives an escape for the hot air. With the ASUS Dual design, it will push the air from the memory into the case and the air over the GPU out the back with some back into the case. It's more ideal than the reference cooler that pushes air over the memory then the GPU. We have had different cooler designs for over a decade, and there aren't many coolers that fail to cool a GPU in badly ventilated cases so I would not worry too much about it.

If you are worried, there are the hybrid cooled designs which will dissipate heat the best outside of a dedicated water cooled setup. However, you would need to make sure the GPU radiator would fit.

As for the case, it does some things well and some things poorly. A compartmentalized design is actually pretty good for cooling. With liquid cooled setups it prevents water from going into the PSU. It makes the cable management look good. It isolates a heat source and cooling. Personally I am not thrilled about the liquid cooled CPU. In recent years we are seeing the auxiliary chips in a mobo not being cooled properly. These would typically be cooled by a stock CPU cooler and exit out the rear exhaust.

filmoret

Well the issue is...... Nvidia is coming out with the 20 series cards probably around second quarter of this year.  Not very smart for people to assume they aren't doing anything with their huge development budget.

Vrika

Cleffy said:

GPU prices tend not to drop much until a whole 'nother generation comes around. Something like Volta being released should lower prices by about half as we saw with the GTX 980ti and Fury X.

I think in this case there's a good chance for NVidia dropping their prices when AMD makes their release. They likely have GTX 1080 Ti coming out at the same time with AMD's releases, which should mean price drops for both GTX 1070 and 1080.

Also this far GTX 1070 and 1080 haven't had any serious competition, which has allowed NVidia to charge premium price for them. They should have a lot of room to drop their price.

filmoret

Vrika said:

Cleffy said:

GPU prices tend not to drop much until a whole 'nother generation comes around. Something like Volta being released should lower prices by about half as we saw with the GTX 980ti and Fury X.

I think in this case there's a good chance for NVidia dropping their prices when AMD makes their release. They likely have GTX 1080 Ti coming out at the same time with AMD's releases, which should mean price drops for both GTX 1070 and 1080.

Also this far GTX 1070 and 1080 haven't had any serious competition, which has allowed NVidia to charge premium price for them. They should have a lot of room to drop their price.

Nvidia knows that 4k is the future and they been working on the 20series for over a year now.  They just don't be as public about things like other companies.  The price of 1080 might drop because the nextgen cards are almost here.   I mean you had a demo from the AMD cards a year ago showing it matching the 1080.  Yes Nvidia is going to counter that with something stronger.  You can bet on that .


http://www.tweaktown.com/news/53121/nvidias-next-gen-volta-architecture-arrive-2017/index.html

Rumor is somewhere around May we will see the nvidia Volta series cards.

Quizzical

filmoret said:

Vrika said:

Cleffy said:

GPU prices tend not to drop much until a whole 'nother generation comes around. Something like Volta being released should lower prices by about half as we saw with the GTX 980ti and Fury X.

I think in this case there's a good chance for NVidia dropping their prices when AMD makes their release. They likely have GTX 1080 Ti coming out at the same time with AMD's releases, which should mean price drops for both GTX 1070 and 1080.

Also this far GTX 1070 and 1080 haven't had any serious competition, which has allowed NVidia to charge premium price for them. They should have a lot of room to drop their price.

Nvidia knows that 4k is the future and they been working on the 20series for over a year now.  They just don't be as public about things like other companies.  The price of 1080 might drop because the nextgen cards are almost here.   I mean you had a demo from the AMD cards a year ago showing it matching the 1080.  Yes Nvidia is going to counter that with something stronger.  You can bet on that .


http://www.tweaktown.com/news/53121/nvidias-next-gen-volta-architecture-arrive-2017/index.html

Rumor is somewhere around May we will see the nvidia Volta series cards.

Your link is so old that the Pascal architecture doesn't even exist on the roadmap.  I might be able to dig up some really old stuff that had AMD Zen arriving in 2015, but that doesn't mean it's still likely to happen.

filmoret

Quizzical said:

filmoret said:

Vrika said:

Cleffy said:

GPU prices tend not to drop much until a whole 'nother generation comes around. Something like Volta being released should lower prices by about half as we saw with the GTX 980ti and Fury X.

I think in this case there's a good chance for NVidia dropping their prices when AMD makes their release. They likely have GTX 1080 Ti coming out at the same time with AMD's releases, which should mean price drops for both GTX 1070 and 1080.

Also this far GTX 1070 and 1080 haven't had any serious competition, which has allowed NVidia to charge premium price for them. They should have a lot of room to drop their price.

Nvidia knows that 4k is the future and they been working on the 20series for over a year now.  They just don't be as public about things like other companies.  The price of 1080 might drop because the nextgen cards are almost here.   I mean you had a demo from the AMD cards a year ago showing it matching the 1080.  Yes Nvidia is going to counter that with something stronger.  You can bet on that .


http://www.tweaktown.com/news/53121/nvidias-next-gen-volta-architecture-arrive-2017/index.html

Rumor is somewhere around May we will see the nvidia Volta series cards.

Your link is so old that the Pascal architecture doesn't even exist on the roadmap.  I might be able to dig up some really old stuff that had AMD Zen arriving in 2015, but that doesn't mean it's still likely to happen.

how is this  24 hours ago.


http://www.kitguru.net/components/graphic-cards/matthew-wilson/first-traces-of-volta-spotted-in-new-nvidia-driver/

Cleffy

Showing up is not important. Releasing information is. AMD started releasing information on Vega half a year ago. They are preparing for a launch almost a year later. You can't simply take something that is not finished yet and throw it straight into production. It needs time to finalize, spin, and let your board partners develop. I would guess Volta will be a late 2017 early 2018 product.

filmoret

Cleffy said:

Showing up is not important. Releasing information is. AMD started releasing information on Vega half a year ago. They are preparing for a launch almost a year later. You can't simply take something that is not finished yet and throw it straight into production. It needs time to finalize, spin, and let your board partners develop. I would guess Volta will be a late 2017 early 2018 product.

I don't feel like doing the research right now.  But is it normal for nvidia to anounce their cards a year ahead of schedule?  I mean if it is normal then I'll stop.  But if it isnt normal then well they probably got it up their sleeve and we will see.  Ther'es more links btw just google Nvidia Volta

Quizzical

filmoret said:

Cleffy said:

Showing up is not important. Releasing information is. AMD started releasing information on Vega half a year ago. They are preparing for a launch almost a year later. You can't simply take something that is not finished yet and throw it straight into production. It needs time to finalize, spin, and let your board partners develop. I would guess Volta will be a late 2017 early 2018 product.

I don't feel like doing the research right now.  But is it normal for nvidia to anounce their cards a year ahead of schedule?  I mean if it is normal then I'll stop.  But if it isnt normal then well they probably got it up their sleeve and we will see.  Ther'es more links btw just google Nvidia Volta

You know that ancient roadmap you linked to where Pascal didn't even exist?  Volta is on it.  Meanwhile, AMD announced last year that not only is Vega coming, but it will be followed by Navi.  That didn't mean that Volta or Navi were imminent then, nor today.  And there have been a lot of strings that showed up in drivers but never turned into released products.  I certainly believe that Volta will launch eventually, but it's not automatic that a GV100 chip will exist beyond an internal test product (there is no commercial card based on a GK100 or GM100), nor that Volta will launch anytime soon.

If Volta is still on 16 nm, it's not clear whether they can make it meaningfully better than Pascal.  It's also not clear whether Vega will be better or worse for gaming than Pascal.  Look at how Intel has gone from Broadwell to Sky Lake to Kaby Lake on the same process node, and while Kaby Lake is better than Broadwell, there's no dire need for someone with a Broadwell system to upgrade.

While I'd somewhat expect a GeForce 1100 or 2000 series to launch this year, that doesn't automatically mean Volta.  There have been plenty of "new" series that were mostly or entirely rebrands, respins, or new bins of old GPUs.

And even if Volta does launch, that doesn't necessarily mean a big GPU that you'd be interested in for gaming.  Remember GM107?  It was about seven months from the launch of the first Maxwell GPU to the launch of the first Maxwell that was an interesting option for desktop gamers.  The desktop versions of GM107 (GeForce GTX 750 Ti and GTX 750) were stupidly overpriced and never interesting to buy; it was more interesting as a laptop card where it's energy efficiency was a big deal.

filmoret

Quizzical said:

filmoret said:

Cleffy said:

Showing up is not important. Releasing information is. AMD started releasing information on Vega half a year ago. They are preparing for a launch almost a year later. You can't simply take something that is not finished yet and throw it straight into production. It needs time to finalize, spin, and let your board partners develop. I would guess Volta will be a late 2017 early 2018 product.

I don't feel like doing the research right now.  But is it normal for nvidia to anounce their cards a year ahead of schedule?  I mean if it is normal then I'll stop.  But if it isnt normal then well they probably got it up their sleeve and we will see.  Ther'es more links btw just google Nvidia Volta

You know that ancient roadmap you linked to where Pascal didn't even exist?  Volta is on it.  Meanwhile, AMD announced last year that not only is Vega coming, but it will be followed by Navi.  That didn't mean that Volta or Navi were imminent then, nor today.  And there have been a lot of strings that showed up in drivers but never turned into released products.  I certainly believe that Volta will launch eventually, but it's not automatic that a GV100 chip will exist beyond an internal test product (there is no commercial card based on a GK100 or GM100), nor that Volta will launch anytime soon.

If Volta is still on 16 nm, it's not clear whether they can make it meaningfully better than Pascal.  It's also not clear whether Vega will be better or worse for gaming than Pascal.  Look at how Intel has gone from Broadwell to Sky Lake to Kaby Lake on the same process node, and while Kaby Lake is better than Broadwell, there's no dire need for someone with a Broadwell system to upgrade.

While I'd somewhat expect a GeForce 1100 or 2000 series to launch this year, that doesn't automatically mean Volta.  There have been plenty of "new" series that were mostly or entirely rebrands, respins, or new bins of old GPUs.

And even if Volta does launch, that doesn't necessarily mean a big GPU that you'd be interested in for gaming.  Remember GM107?  It was about seven months from the launch of the first Maxwell GPU to the launch of the first Maxwell that was an interesting option for desktop gamers.  The desktop versions of GM107 (GeForce GTX 750 Ti and GTX 750) were stupidly overpriced and never interesting to buy; it was more interesting as a laptop card where it's energy efficiency was a big deal.

Well the thing is.  We have a video about a year old showing Zen as an equal to the 1080.  So naturally any company would develop something to counter that.  There is no reason to believe nvidia ignored that threat.

Quizzical

filmoret said:

Well the thing is.  We have a video about a year old showing Zen as an equal to the 1080.  So naturally any company would develop something to counter that.  There is no reason to believe nvidia ignored that threat.

I don't believe that Nvidia is scared of Zen.  In about the same manner, I don't believe that Nvidia is scared of Seasonic power supplies or Samsung SSDs.

It takes about three years to create a new chip if all goes well.  So if Nvidia had a brilliant idea for a new GPU a year ago, they'd be lucky to get it out in 2019.  Whatever they launch this year has been in the works for a long, long time, at least other than new bins of old GPUs.  That's not to say that Nvidia won't launch anything nifty this year, but only that if they do, they'll have started work on it long before they had any clue how Vega would perform.