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So the story begins

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  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,189
    Shaigh said:
    So we will have people with a monetary interest for hyping the game. This will never end up well.
    We know how this one ends...

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,189
    edited February 2017
    Leiloni said:


    Now can we get back to discussing the game for it's actual design ideas instead of this BS?
    If they weren't looking for crowdfunding sure.  If you are going to solicit donations AND have a strong link to MLM they are going to get scrutinized.   Lots of games talk great "ideas". Maybe it's time to start weighing their ability to deliver those.

    Really looking forward to the manifestation of new accounts to Hype the game.  Since you brought up Amazon you should know all about how they were overtaken by fake or paid product reviews. They also specifically banned incentivized reviews on their website to combat this and have even sued over 1000 defendants over this.

    https://techcrunch.com/2016/10/27/amazon-sues-more-sellers-for-buying-fake-reviews/

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 17,847
    edited February 2017
    Not exactly sure where the op's idea for this post comes from but on the two topics mentioned ,they are easy to answer.

    1 You EARN the right to have your game noticed and liked,it is not as simple as sending in to a website and you both exchange profits from it.

    2 Just because something might be common place in this world does not in any fashion make it right or better said morally correct.See point #1 to understand this.

    The reason law has started to enter into gaming is because it wants a FAIR market place,it does not want businesses influencing people by money and NOT by the product.Just look at Blizzard,we saw it here recently and a LOT,they like to brag about money and numbers instead of promoting the actual product.

    The bottom line at least for me is that if you put out at least a DECENT looking product ,i will take notice and give you a fair chance to convince me.However convince is not really a good term because i use my OWN judgement ,i am not to be convinced of anything.You can however at least convince me to take notice.

    I feel this game looks good enough that i have taken notice and this does not happen often,i am not profiting like websites where i have to say every single game is great,i am an unbiased opinion.So i think what i am trying to say OP,is that a hardened vet that is not easily pleased has taken notice,likely many others will as well so no worries there.




    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • ConstantineMerusConstantineMerus Member EpicPosts: 2,697
    Can't expect to visit mmorpg.com without a bit of roleplaying going on. 
    Constantine, The Console Poster

    • "One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
    • Song of the Week: Blackfield by Blackfield from Blackfield (2005)
    • Currently Playing: Devil May Cry 1
    • Favorite Drink: Bruichladdich Black Art 5th 1992
    • Gaming Timeline: Arcade, Commodore 64, Amiga 500, SEGA, IBM, PS, PC, PS2, More PCs, PS3, Giant PC, PS4, No More PCs, PS4 Pro.
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,357
    edited February 2017
    @Slapshot1188
    Did you make your money through MLM?
     Though my primary sources of income are real-estate and investments.

    Why are you Crowdfunding?  Is it because you need the money or is it because you want to leverage it for marketing?
    Well to be fair, we have not started crowdfunding yet.  When we reach certain development milestones with the game, we will likely move to a crowdsourcing platform.  There are several reasons for this; First, crowdsourcing allows us to pull necessary capital to create the game without appealing to industry publishers who have led the MMORPG genre to it's current state. We are fully aware and agree that the downfall of many of the MMO’s that have come out recently are a result of flagrant pay2win strategies from their monetization process. We will not follow in those footsteps. Second, there is no more involved and dedicated community than those who arise from crowdsourcing.  It is a reciprocal relationship between our studios depending on the necessary testing and development of early backers, and being able to have that dialogue with people who are as invested as we are in the success of the project. Third, We want to be able to offer people who see our project early and decide to back it with unique in-game cosmetics and alpha/beta access.
    What is the budget for the game?  What are the planned sources (% self funded/crowdfunded/other investors)

    Our budget is not yet determined. We plan to fund the project from Self-funding, Crowdsourcing, and private investors.

    How much of that do you have in hand today?

    Alot.

    These are the questions and answers I care about.

    I don't build games, but I have observed their creation and have been delivering software since 1990. 

    It has been my experience MMORPGs are expensive to make. The more features they add, the costlier they get.

    So I've taken a real skeptical approach to the many crowdfunded efforts promising to deliver functionality and features which equal or far exceed anything seen before today, all on shoestring budget.

    Chris Roberts is allegedly making something fabulous with SC, I have some doubts but at least he has $100M plus to work with, so it is possible.

    So if a crowd funded campaign came out asking for $20M (my personal benchmark to create a solid MMORPG on a budget) I might agree that its enough to fund a game with a reasonable feature set.

    Mark Jacobs is creating CU and it is more of a limited feature RVR focused MMO and will eschew much of the more expensive PVE content. He has confirmed his doubts of reaching $20M in total funding (KS raised $2M) and my guess is the title will deliver for around $10M, possible given the feature set.

    When Ashes was first discussed, people raised the financial acumen/resources of the founder. (that would be you @Ashes_Steven ?) 

    I counter, if the founders have the money to invest why the need for crowdfunding especially if the target amount is negligible in comparison to the overall project cost?

    What I've take so far from your responses is the founders have invested their money to hire people to get things rolling.

    They do not have the money to complete the game as currently envisioned, and how much will be delivered is TBC pending how much funding can be raised from crowd funding and yet to be secured private investors, large unknowns at this point.

    This approach pretty much mirrors the previous plan of most indie efforts and many of those have either flamed out or failed to meet expectations for the most part. (or are yet to deliver because MMOS take a long time)

    So my recommendation, keep the promised feature set realistic and achievable. Be careful not to include mechanics that are extraordinary and previously undelivered in the market place without a solid explanation of how a newly formed team with limited funding will somehow pull it off.

    Also, be honest with proposed delivery dates, these are 4 year efforts so any talk of allowing alpha access in a year or two (to paid backers only if course) looks to be a scheme to raise funds to finish the game which so far has failed to work except for a couple of titles.

    While I play games with magic in them, I do not believe in it with regards to software delivery and funding. ;)




    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,189
    @Kyleran I agree with everything you said (well I also have other concerns about the marketing scheme).  I think much of this goes away if theyguarantee to return the money if they don't deliver.  Steven's best answer was the one he didn't try to wordsmith. He simply said "yes" on that topic.  So that gives me hope. 

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • ScorchienScorchien Member LegendaryPosts: 7,368
    Spider senses tingling everytime i read up on this one .. I dont see anyway they deliver what they say on the Finaces they Claim , in any reasonable time frame , If at all .. I wouldnt be surprised at all to be sitting here in 14 -16 months , reading a thread about AoCreation folded up
  • AethaerynAethaeryn Member RarePosts: 3,103
    ScottB2J said:
    Lol. This slap shot guy is something else
    See. . clearly with your low post count and monetary incentive you are a paid White Knight.  kidding. . seriously

    Slapshot is very skeptical but is generally correct.  Even if the posts lean to the negative it is because there has been so much trash touted as the next coming.  Anytime a game offers referral links etc. and someone defends the game it always puts the defense into question.  "This game is awesome and these guys are haters. . here. . try it out with my link and I'll send you in game currency".

    Personally, I just wait until games are finished now to make judgments.   I did spend a long time trying to warn people about possible scams.  The one I was the most wrong and correct about would have been Xsyon.  It wasn't a scam. . in that I was wrong. . but it also dried up pre-beta.  Mortal Online. . etc. etc.  

    I think using referrals are okay and help to get word out but it can work to trigger red flags for people in an area that is pretty heavy with empty promises.  My guess is that the benefits will outweigh the negatives, so from a company stand-point I could see still using it.  Then if the game is good the skeptics will give it a try.

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,189
    Aethaeryn said:
    ScottB2J said:
    Lol. This slap shot guy is something else
     Anytime a game offers referral links etc. and someone defends the game it always puts the defense into question. 
    "This game is awesome and these guys are haters. . here. . try it out with my link and I'll send you in game currency".
    Read more at http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/461165/so-the-story-begins/p2#XJ5osOvFpHzB1LjU.99
     
    What's even more concerning to me is that this is NOT just in game currency.  It's REAL LIFE CASH!  I can never buy the game, but simply write a great piece on it and have a link at the bottom.  For every person that clicks the link I get 15% of what they spend... forever!  According to their forums these links are already active.  So if I get someone to use my link to make an account and they go to Kickstarter (or whatever) and plop $1000 down... I get a smooth $150 in cash.  If I simply get 10 people to buy the game (guess $50) and 1 year sub (guess $15) then I get $345 as my "share'.

    Those numbers are made up for example purposes... but this is FAR beyond giving you a nice sparkly pony if you get a friend to join the game.


    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • ConstantineMerusConstantineMerus Member EpicPosts: 2,697
    Aethaeryn said:
    ScottB2J said:
    Lol. This slap shot guy is something else
     Anytime a game offers referral links etc. and someone defends the game it always puts the defense into question. 
    "This game is awesome and these guys are haters. . here. . try it out with my link and I'll send you in game currency".
    Read more at http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/461165/so-the-story-begins/p2#XJ5osOvFpHzB1LjU.99
     
    What's even more concerning to me is that this is NOT just in game currency.  It's REAL LIFE CASH!  I can never buy the game, but simply write a great piece on it and have a link at the bottom.  For every person that clicks the link I get 15% of what they spend... forever!  According to their forums these links are already active.  So if I get someone to use my link to make an account and they go to Kickstarter (or whatever) and plop $1000 down... I get a smooth $150 in cash.  If I simply get 10 people to buy the game (guess $50) and 1 year sub (guess $15) then I get $345 as my "share'.

    Those numbers are made up for example purposes... but this is FAR beyond giving you a nice sparkly pony if you get a friend to join the game.


    This practice has been going on for a while. But companies go through a third-party. It seems these gents are planning to do it themselves because of their experience and are being open about it. 

    I remember leaving a TSW referral link on one my outlets and made ~$600 during pre-order phase. Funcom (of course via a 3rd party) used to pay $2.8 per purchase. 

    You have to criticize reviewers whom would sell out their integrity to deceit people into purchasing a falsely advertised product. But if someone does a fair and honest review, what's wrong with making cash from their referral program?
    Constantine, The Console Poster

    • "One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
    • Song of the Week: Blackfield by Blackfield from Blackfield (2005)
    • Currently Playing: Devil May Cry 1
    • Favorite Drink: Bruichladdich Black Art 5th 1992
    • Gaming Timeline: Arcade, Commodore 64, Amiga 500, SEGA, IBM, PS, PC, PS2, More PCs, PS3, Giant PC, PS4, No More PCs, PS4 Pro.
  • francis_baudfrancis_baud Member RarePosts: 242
    edited February 2017
    Aethaeryn said:
    ScottB2J said:
    Lol. This slap shot guy is something else
     Anytime a game offers referral links etc. and someone defends the game it always puts the defense into question. 
    "This game is awesome and these guys are haters. . here. . try it out with my link and I'll send you in game currency".
    Read more at http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/461165/so-the-story-begins/p2#XJ5osOvFpHzB1LjU.99
     
    What's even more concerning to me is that this is NOT just in game currency.  It's REAL LIFE CASH!  I can never buy the game, but simply write a great piece on it and have a link at the bottom.  For every person that clicks the link I get 15% of what they spend... forever!  According to their forums these links are already active.  So if I get someone to use my link to make an account and they go to Kickstarter (or whatever) and plop $1000 down... I get a smooth $150 in cash.  If I simply get 10 people to buy the game (guess $50) and 1 year sub (guess $15) then I get $345 as my "share'.

    Those numbers are made up for example purposes... but this is FAR beyond giving you a nice sparkly pony if you get a friend to join the game.


    I wonder what you find particularly scandalous about this though.

    Someone spends time advertising the game (whether it's a fan or a not) and gets money in return.

    How is that different than purchasing a sponsored article here on MMORPG? Or begging for money on Kickstarter? Or paying a marketing firm to place ads on gaming news websites?

    Maybe what troubles you is that the person can pretend to be a fan but don't give a F about the game and just want the money? So is what you find scandalous the hypocrisy of certain people pretending being AoC fans?
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,189


    How is that different than purchasing a sponsored article here on MMORPG?
    Sponsored articles are in fact labeled "Sponsored"...

    If the HYPE had a similar disclaimer they would be comparable. 


    Speaking of HYPE... a game that was announced 9 weeks ago (per the CEO in this thread) and who's CEO admitted they don;t even know what features will be in the game or what the budget will be has magically appeared as the Most Hyped Game on MMORPG.COM.

    Seems legit :)

    Am I overly skeptical?  Maybe.. but I think there is a LOT of legitimate reason to be skeptical here.

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • SlyLoKSlyLoK Member RarePosts: 2,698
    Aethaeryn said:
    ScottB2J said:
    Lol. This slap shot guy is something else
     Anytime a game offers referral links etc. and someone defends the game it always puts the defense into question. 
    "This game is awesome and these guys are haters. . here. . try it out with my link and I'll send you in game currency".
    Read more at http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/461165/so-the-story-begins/p2#XJ5osOvFpHzB1LjU.99
     
    What's even more concerning to me is that this is NOT just in game currency.  It's REAL LIFE CASH!  I can never buy the game, but simply write a great piece on it and have a link at the bottom.  For every person that clicks the link I get 15% of what they spend... forever!  According to their forums these links are already active.  So if I get someone to use my link to make an account and they go to Kickstarter (or whatever) and plop $1000 down... I get a smooth $150 in cash.  If I simply get 10 people to buy the game (guess $50) and 1 year sub (guess $15) then I get $345 as my "share'.

    Those numbers are made up for example purposes... but this is FAR beyond giving you a nice sparkly pony if you get a friend to join the game.


    This practice has been going on for a while. But companies go through a third-party. It seems these gents are planning to do it themselves because of their experience and are being open about it. 

    I remember leaving a TSW referral link on one my outlets and made ~$600 during pre-order phase. Funcom (of course via a 3rd party) used to pay $2.8 per purchase. 

    You have to criticize reviewers whom would sell out their integrity to deceit people into purchasing a falsely advertised product. But if someone does a fair and honest review, what's wrong with making cash from their referral program?
    Outlets? From the sound of it what you did was completely different.

    It is wrong because only positive reviews will be rewarded which will lead to everything being sugar coated and worded in a way to lead people to use the referral link. Negative but true reviews will be few and far between even if the game turns out to be garbage.
  • XodicXodic Member EpicPosts: 1,138
    edited February 2017
    Money is every where. You just have to be willing to bend down low enough to pick it up.

    If you don't mind the gaming industry having the stigma of law firms and title pawns, then stand by and let it happen. 
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,357
    edited February 2017
    Aethaeryn said:
    ScottB2J said:
    Lol. This slap shot guy is something else
     Anytime a game offers referral links etc. and someone defends the game it always puts the defense into question. 
    "This game is awesome and these guys are haters. . here. . try it out with my link and I'll send you in game currency".
    Read more at http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/461165/so-the-story-begins/p2#XJ5osOvFpHzB1LjU.99
     
    What's even more concerning to me is that this is NOT just in game currency.  It's REAL LIFE CASH!  I can never buy the game, but simply write a great piece on it and have a link at the bottom.  For every person that clicks the link I get 15% of what they spend... forever!  According to their forums these links are already active.  So if I get someone to use my link to make an account and they go to Kickstarter (or whatever) and plop $1000 down... I get a smooth $150 in cash.  If I simply get 10 people to buy the game (guess $50) and 1 year sub (guess $15) then I get $345 as my "share'.

    Those numbers are made up for example purposes... but this is FAR beyond giving you a nice sparkly pony if you get a friend to join the game.


    Wait, this will result in real life cash payouts?

    Guys, forget everything I just said..... Going to be the greatest thing ever....watch for my upcoming infomercial, think I'll call it "Ashes to Cashes"  :p

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • ShaighShaigh Member RarePosts: 2,058


    How is that different than purchasing a sponsored article here on MMORPG?
    Sponsored articles are in fact labeled "Sponsored"...

    If the HYPE had a similar disclaimer they would be comparable. 


    Speaking of HYPE... a game that was announced 9 weeks ago (per the CEO in this thread) and who's CEO admitted they don;t even know what features will be in the game or what the budget will be has magically appeared as the Most Hyped Game on MMORPG.COM.

    Seems legit :)

    Am I overly skeptical?  Maybe.. but I think there is a LOT of legitimate reason to be skeptical here.

    You don't need a conspiracy for a new game becoming the most hyped game around here. You always got a bunch of people hyping that new game they barely know with a 10 and there aren't that many people that downvote things. For a long time Divergence online was #3, even after the game was officially dead.


    The cynic knows the price of everything and the value of nothing.
  • francis_baudfrancis_baud Member RarePosts: 242


    How is that different than purchasing a sponsored article here on MMORPG?
    Sponsored articles are in fact labeled "Sponsored"...

    If the HYPE had a similar disclaimer they would be comparable. 


    Speaking of HYPE... a game that was announced 9 weeks ago (per the CEO in this thread) and who's CEO admitted they don;t even know what features will be in the game or what the budget will be has magically appeared as the Most Hyped Game on MMORPG.COM.

    Seems legit :)

    Am I overly skeptical?  Maybe.. but I think there is a LOT of legitimate reason to be skeptical here.

    Ok, so if the person posting the referral link mentions that he will get a % of the purchases made on the accounts created via this link, this is ok with you?
    JamesGoblin
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,189


    How is that different than purchasing a sponsored article here on MMORPG?
    Sponsored articles are in fact labeled "Sponsored"...

    If the HYPE had a similar disclaimer they would be comparable. 


    Speaking of HYPE... a game that was announced 9 weeks ago (per the CEO in this thread) and who's CEO admitted they don;t even know what features will be in the game or what the budget will be has magically appeared as the Most Hyped Game on MMORPG.COM.

    Seems legit :)

    Am I overly skeptical?  Maybe.. but I think there is a LOT of legitimate reason to be skeptical here.

    Ok, so if the person posting the referral link mentions that he will get a % of the purchases made on the accounts created via this link, this is ok with you?
    Sure.  That's called full disclosure.   It's why people that write articles about stocks put a disclaimer at the bottom or top describing if they have any holdings related to the article.  

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,175
    Ashes_Steven said:
    Ah gotcha!  Well either way I am now on MMORPG.com and able to answer questions that people have :)
    Your first mistake...
  • ConstantineMerusConstantineMerus Member EpicPosts: 2,697
    Kyleran said:
    Aethaeryn said:
    ScottB2J said:
    Lol. This slap shot guy is something else
     Anytime a game offers referral links etc. and someone defends the game it always puts the defense into question. 
    "This game is awesome and these guys are haters. . here. . try it out with my link and I'll send you in game currency".
    Read more at http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/461165/so-the-story-begins/p2#XJ5osOvFpHzB1LjU.99
     
    What's even more concerning to me is that this is NOT just in game currency.  It's REAL LIFE CASH!  I can never buy the game, but simply write a great piece on it and have a link at the bottom.  For every person that clicks the link I get 15% of what they spend... forever!  According to their forums these links are already active.  So if I get someone to use my link to make an account and they go to Kickstarter (or whatever) and plop $1000 down... I get a smooth $150 in cash.  If I simply get 10 people to buy the game (guess $50) and 1 year sub (guess $15) then I get $345 as my "share'.

    Those numbers are made up for example purposes... but this is FAR beyond giving you a nice sparkly pony if you get a friend to join the game.


    Wait, this will result in real life cash payouts?

    Guys, forget everything I just said..... Going to be the greatest thing ever....watch for my upcoming infomercial, think I'll call it "Ashes to Cashes"  :p
    :))))) man I can't stop giggling. I think they really should use "Ashes to Cashes" for their referral program and of course, pay you for the copyright.


    Constantine, The Console Poster

    • "One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
    • Song of the Week: Blackfield by Blackfield from Blackfield (2005)
    • Currently Playing: Devil May Cry 1
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  • Ashes_StevenAshes_Steven Member UncommonPosts: 28
    edited February 2017
    @Kyleran

    Hi Kyle! I appreciate your post, and let me start by saying I also appreciate a skeptic.  I myself, as an mmorpg gamer, am a skeptic.  Not because I want to be, but because my past experiences with developers in this genre have led me to be. Which is partly the reason why I took it upon myself to make an mmorpg.

    So I've taken a real skeptical approach to the many crowdfunded efforts promising to deliver functionality and features which equal or far exceed anything seen before today, all on shoestring budget.
    My studios does not have a "shoestring" budget.  I'm not sure what I said earlier to make you think that, but the amount of resources at my disposal when making this MMO are large.  Comparable to other MMOs that have been made by AAA studios.

    I counter, if the founders have the money to invest why the need for crowdfunding especially if the target amount is negligible in comparison to the overall project cost?
    I believe I gave this answer in an earlier post, you may have missed it.

    When we reach certain development milestones with the game, we will likely move to a crowdsourcing platform.  There are several reasons for this; First, crowdsourcing allows us to pull necessary capital to create the game without appealing to industry publishers who have led the MMORPG genre to it's current state. We are fully aware and agree that the downfall of many of the MMO’s that have come out recently are a result of flagrant pay2win strategies from their monetization process. We will not follow in those footsteps. Second, there is no more involved and dedicated community than those who arise from crowdsourcing.  It is a reciprocal relationship between our studios depending on the necessary testing and development of early backers, and being able to have that dialogue with people who are as invested as we are in the success of the project. Third, We want to be able to offer people who see our project early and decide to back it with unique in-game cosmetics and alpha/beta access.

    What I've take so far from your responses is the founders have invested their money to hire people to get things rolling.
    I'm sorry again you have been given this impression.  Ashes of Creation will be completed and has the funding to do so.

    They do not have the money to complete the game as currently envisioned, and how much will be delivered is TBC pending how much funding can be raised from crowd funding and yet to be secured private investors, large unknowns at this point.
    Again, I am not sure what gave you this impression.  There are not any "large unknowns" for us.  We have funding :)

    So my recommendation, keep the promised feature set realistic and achievable. Be careful not to include mechanics that are extraordinary and previously undelivered in the market place without a solid explanation of how a newly formed team with limited funding will somehow pull it off.
    Thanks!

    While I play games with magic in them, I do not believe in it with regards to software delivery and funding.
    I think our team of veteran MMORPG developers understands this ;)






    Again, I am not on MMORPG.com to change the minds of skeptics.  Our game will do that on its own.  I am just here to answer questions about our game and be involved in the community.  As a gamer, I always wished that the developers were more interactive with the community, so that is what I intend on doing :)




    Happy to be with you fine ladies and gentlemen on MMORPG.com, hope to participate in healthy discussions about our favorite genre.

    Founder/Creative Director @ Intrepid Studios
    Building upcoming MMORPG  Ashes of Creation
    Discord

  • MaurgrimMaurgrim Member RarePosts: 1,271
    edited February 2017
    Wait 2 years then some of you posters in this thread can heckle it all you want if it didn't follow the original feature list and in the meantime either follow it loosely or just let it go, doing a 3rd degree on a dev of the game gives you absolute nothing just a toxic environment.
  • GaendricGaendric Member UncommonPosts: 623
    That has to be applied to both sides though.
    If one side starts claiming stuff, ofcourse those who don't agree will react.

  • MendelMendel Member EpicPosts: 3,903
    Okay a question.   Who is doing the lead game system development, and what are their credentials?

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,189
    Mendel said:
    Okay a question.   Who is doing the lead game system development, and what are their credentials?
    Looks like:

    Jeffrey Bard – Lead Game Designer

    I’m the resident bard, a jack-of-all trades who wears a bunch of hats (even that one, sitting on your head, right now). I write lore and fix our internet when it needs fixing, troubleshoot the untroubleshootable, and make sure that our game actually runs when it doesn’t want to. But primarily, I’m working on making Ashes of Creation. I’ve been doing most of the scripting to get our core systems up and running, as well as carefully curating our lore and storylines. Game design is something I’ve been doing in one way or another since I was six, when I ran my first Dungeons and Dragons campaign. I’m all grown up now though, having worked on some amazing projects with some amazing people. That trend continues with Ashes of Creation and this group we have here at Intrepid Studios – the talent is off the charts, and I’m already amazed at everything we’ve built so far. I cannot wait to share this project with the world.


    LinkedIn last job:

    Game Designer

    Company NameSony Online Entertainment

    Dates EmployedAug 2013 – Apr 2015

    Employment Duration1 yr 9 mos

    LocationSan Diego

    Content Designer for EverQuest II. Primary accomplishments include: successfully evangelizing for new narrative techniques and story hooks, writing over 350 pages of dialog for 200+ quests, and blending those narratives with meaningful mechanical implementation. Deep scripting experience in LUA, including missions, quests, abilities, and encounters, all with a multiplayer (MMO) focus. Worked closely with art and code in the design and implementation of zones and direction of play. 

    Launched Expansion Titles:
    - EverQuest II: Tears of Veeshan
    - EverQuest II: Altar of Mailice

    Launched Game Updates:
    - Darkness Dawns
    - Ages End

    Value Adds: 
    Voice-over work for H1Z1.
    Performance art for SOE Live's fan festival, see link below! (Written and performed by me).

     

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