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Early Access/Kickstarter funded games. Good or bad?

OhhPaigeyOhhPaigey Member RarePosts: 1,517
edited November 2016 in Polls
How do you feel about the whole early access/kickstarter craze that happened a couple of years ago?

Has it benefited gamers, or has it just taken a lot of our money for empty promises?
When all is said and done, more is always said than done.
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Comments

  • OhhPaigeyOhhPaigey Member RarePosts: 1,517
    edited November 2016
    I will be voting bad, due to the reason there's been a LOT more garbage half finished games that never went anywhere, than there were good games that people loved.
    When all is said and done, more is always said than done.
  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004
    It could have been good, but i think the problem is that its too open to exploitation, it is literally gambling with your money whether or not you will see anything in return for it.
  • BarbieBoyBarbieBoy Member UncommonPosts: 85
    First of all early access usually have a lot of bugs and they still need people to try it out before releasing it to the whole public incase some of them want to go F2P. So basically we are paying for early access to test out bugs that got through the close beta test. In reality they should be the one paying us for trying their game. 
  • ShaighShaigh Member EpicPosts: 2,100
    • Darkest dungeon is my favorite game of 2016 so far.
    • Pillars of eternity was my favorite game of 2015.
    • I loved undertale
    • Dreamfall the longest journey was a game that was stuck in the middle of nothing, even though it took a long time until it finished we did get an ending.
    • Kentucky Route Zero is a really interesting game even though its taking forever for them to finish the game
    • I liked divinity: original sin
    • I liked the shadowrun games, without shadorun returns i doubt we would have had shadowrun: dragonfall that was the best in the series.
    • I enjoyed wasteland 2.
    • Jotun was alright.
    • Banner saga was enjoyable.
    • Grim dawn wasn't my kind of game but without kickstarter it probably wouldn't have happened.
    Sure there are plenty of games that turns out badly so that's why I use the following guidelines.
    • If a game sounds too good to be true its not going to deliver.
    • If a developer think they can deliver a AAA quality game on a small budget they will fail.
    • If a developer say that their mmorpg will be done within two years they are lying.
    • If the reviewer keep mentioning how the early access games have a lot of potential its not a good game right now.
    • If its a survival sandbox game its going to spend an eternity in early access
    • If the developer have a well defined plan on what they want to achieve and that their plans sounds reasonable I'm interested. 
    • If they can show gameplay that looks interesting I will pledge for the game.
    • I'm going to wait for a 50-75% discount before I spend money on a steam early access game.
    Iselin: And the next person who says "but it's a business, they need to make money" can just go fuck yourself.
  • RelampagoRelampago Member UncommonPosts: 411
    Good, especially as people become more discerning and better able at evaluating them in the future before plopping dowm their cash.  Think of what PoE did for a good developer who was on their last leg, they are now revitalized and i will continue to get some RPG goodness because of it.

    Most of my Kickstarter picks have panned out well so far.
  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 8,973
    I think ultimately it's a good thing but people have to do their homework.  Just like buying a car you can't just go by what the dealer tells you.  You have to do your research on the creator of the kickstart and find out as much as you can about the project.  This does allow the little guy with a dream a way to make that dream come true and provide an even playing field against the AAA power houses to present their projects to the masses. 

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 15,693
    I definitely would not put early access and kickstarter in the same category. I have never spent a penny on any kickstarter campaign but OTOH, I have had a good experience with several early access games I've bought.

    As always, choose wisely.
    "I don't wait for games. Games wait for me."
    -- CHUCK NORRIS

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • VesaviusVesavius Member RarePosts: 7,908
    Some of my favourite single player games of the last few years have been KSed.

    I have yet to play a MMORPG that has launched using the model exclusively, so have my doubts as to it's suitable for that genre, but seeing as we have little choice going forward... I hope that one will be delivered for me soon.
  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,768
    OhhPaigey said:
    I will be voting bad, due to the reason there's been a LOT more garbage half finished games that never went anywhere, than there were good games that people loved.

    I am voting bad for similar reasons.  Ultimately it is about the ends which haven't paid off for me.
    http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2010/QBlog190810A.html  

    Epic Music:   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1

    https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1

    Kyleran:  "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."

    John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."

    FreddyNoNose:  "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."

    LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"




  • ShaighShaigh Member EpicPosts: 2,100
    Iselin said:
    I definitely would not put early access and kickstarter in the same category. I have never spent a penny on any kickstarter campaign but OTOH, I have had a good experience with several early access games I've bought.

    As always, choose wisely.
    For me its the opposite, found plenty of nice kickstarter games but haven't played any games during early access phase, including games that I kickstarted. What games have you enjoyed during early access?
    Iselin: And the next person who says "but it's a business, they need to make money" can just go fuck yourself.
  • jimmywolfjimmywolf Member UncommonPosts: 283
    their been much more good from KS existence  then trash, i have got short end of the stick on couple games that sounded promising but went south.  C wars is one an project phoenix....


    but am very happy KS exist just will use it much more rarely versus a early access or normal release. also  KS really just need get off their money bags an enforce more fair rights to consumers  to prevent scams or lazy incomplete designs  of games or other products.


    i think a very fair exchange is they don't see a dime in till the project is fully complete as promised not when a KS ends, that way when it "fails" they lose out too an can join us when things go south an people say sucks to be you i never back anything.





  • BeyornBeyorn Member UncommonPosts: 345
    I had a great experience with Darkest Dungeon and Pillars of Eternity but the last three I have bought have been garbage.  Sadly I vote no ;(
  • vonryan123vonryan123 Member UncommonPosts: 277
    Almost everything I have KS has failed only 2 have come through with what they promised 4 haven't even released a demo and 5 of them are now POOF! into the ether.

    image
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 15,693
    Shaigh said:
    Iselin said:
    I definitely would not put early access and kickstarter in the same category. I have never spent a penny on any kickstarter campaign but OTOH, I have had a good experience with several early access games I've bought.

    As always, choose wisely.
    For me its the opposite, found plenty of nice kickstarter games but haven't played any games during early access phase, including games that I kickstarted. What games have you enjoyed during early access?
    Off the top of my head... Divinity original Sin, Wasteland 2, Crypt of the Necrodancer, Grim Dawn, Darkest Dungeon.


    "I don't wait for games. Games wait for me."
    -- CHUCK NORRIS

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • KilraneKilrane Member UncommonPosts: 322
    Sure, there are a handful of gems, yet most of the games under the crowd funded and early access umbrella are horrible, if they even see the light of day. 
  • ThaneThane Member EpicPosts: 3,522
    OhhPaigey said:
    I will be voting bad, due to the reason there's been a LOT more garbage half finished games that never went anywhere, than there were good games that people loved.
    well, let's face it, having indi devs able to create their games without big publishers weighting in. surely good.

    you think it's bad bc games end up half finished? that has NOTHING to do with kickstarter. there were enough games unfinished before kickstarter, you might have missed em, but those were no small titles.

    biggest examples are surely all points bulletin and warhammer online, both released WAY too early, bc of publishers, money, and the system they were made in.

    both games had a really nice potential, which got raped really hard by the publishers decision to have it released when they said and not the devs.

    it's surely a good thing people can now at least TRY to make games without EA :)

    "I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"

  • H0urg1assH0urg1ass Member EpicPosts: 2,380
    I've said this around here until I'm blue in the face, but I'll repeat it every time it's brought up.

    You invest in an idea.  You pay for a product.  


    The point here is that Kickstarter is specifically designed to get people to pay for ideas.  It's not an investment.  Your money will reward you a copy of the product or some other perks, but those are shit rewards if it turns the designer into a millionaire.  They got free money to make themselves rich, and you get a box copy of the game.  Gee.  Thanks.

    Nope.  No way.  Give me some stock to buy in your company or use an equity crowdfunding site like Fig and then I'll invest in your dreams.  The best part is that when I'm invested in your dreams, they become my dreams too and I won't go around shit-mouthing your game when it misses deadlines like Star Citizen.  In fact, I'll talk about it everywhere and defend it until my dollars come rolling back to me.
  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,872
    edited November 2016
    Used to be that successful game companies created good games.

    Now a game company can be successful by having a good Kickstarter or Early Access launch, then abandoning the project in favor of next project they can crowdfund or launch into Early Access.


    There have been some really good Kickstarter or Early Access games, but at the same time I feel there are too many Kickstarters and Early Accesses that are run just so that you'll get funding to look for your next source of funding. Creating a good game has become secondary over being skilled in looking for funding to your game.
     
  • BruceYeeBruceYee Member EpicPosts: 2,352
    I went undecided b/c there are some games I really like that used ks for funding like Stash & Grim Dawn.

    There are also other games that met or exceeded their mark and seem to be in "extended development". Who knows if they'll ever be released or if they were just scams to begin with.
  • sayuusayuu Member RarePosts: 761
    Call me an old timer, but I remember a time when game companies used to actually pay people to beta thier product. . .


    Thane said:
    OhhPaigey said:
    I will be voting bad, due to the reason there's been a LOT more garbage half finished games that never went anywhere, than there were good games that people loved.
    well, let's face it, having indi devs able to create their games without big publishers weighting in. surely good.

    you think it's bad bc games end up half finished? that has NOTHING to do with kickstarter. there were enough games unfinished before kickstarter, you might have missed em, but those were no small titles.

    biggest examples are surely all points bulletin and warhammer online, both released WAY too early, bc of publishers, money, and the system they were made in.

    both games had a really nice potential, which got raped really hard by the publishers decision to have it released when they said and not the devs.

    it's surely a good thing people can now at least TRY to make games without EA :)
    oh yeah buddy preach it!

    I mean the vast uptick in half-finished games in the last 5 years is clearly not because these so called "indie" developers are doing exactly what you vilify big name publishers over. . .

    . . .oh wait it is. . . 
  • AeliousAelious Member RarePosts: 3,521
    I say good if only because it has produced some variety. Looking at the final product, big name titles and thinking these would be the only ones available to play would be pretty boring. I'd rather contribute to a vision of something that seems like a great final product and have it fall a little short than not see it at all. Whenever I do spend on KS/EA I figure min/max money vs entertainment value. If I think I'll get enough out of the point of purchase build I see no reason to turn it down.
  • RamajamaRamajama Member UncommonPosts: 271
    I vote GOOD, because we have couple of gems that we wouldn't have. Having to dig through pile of garbage looking for one, is half the fun! 
  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004
    Ramajama said:
    I vote GOOD, because we have couple of gems that we wouldn't have. Having to dig through pile of garbage looking for one, is half the fun! 
    So, you equate it with Dumpster Diving? i won't say your wrong, because i think you are spot on in that you really have to sort through all the garbage to find those 'gems'.
    Difference is i think thats a bad thing, not a good thing.
  • kjempffkjempff Member RarePosts: 1,690
    Both good and bad. Adding to some of the points made already..

    A project that is crowdfunded have more pressure to bend their vision to a few loud backers, which can be bad for a game. It is a two-edged sword to "listen" to your community, and for an unexperienced developer it is easy to loose focus and direction (vision).

    For a mmorpg which is a monumental project, crowdfunding can be a great way to get a vertical slice running that can attract investors, and also show investors that there is concrete interest in buying the finished product. A few make it with only crownfunding, but usually investors are not a bad thing, it shows the product has potential and there is confidence in the team to deliver. Also that investors money can be what takes the project from small to medium size content wise and raise the overall quality, both very very important for a mmorpg to survive.

  • bcbullybcbully Member EpicPosts: 10,353
    Terrible. They NEVER leave beta.

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