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A prime candidate for the new king of powerful hardware is now available

QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 22,622
We're talking about power supplies, of course.  For the uninitiated, electricity comes from the wall at 120 V AC (or possibly some other voltage, depending on where you live), and computer components need power at much lower voltages and DC.  A power supply does the conversion for you (or at least AC to DC with some voltages), and a computer needs to have one in order to work.

And more to the point, a computer needs a good power supply if you want it to reliably keep working.  Some vendors will have high end power supplies that they send out for reviews to try to establish a good reputation, and also sell much cheaper power supplies that are a danger to fry your system.

The occasion for today's post is that Seasonic has launched a new flagship, the PRIME Titanium (their caps, not mine).  Seasonic is not one of those vendors who will sell you junk, as even their low end stuff is decent.  But for several generations now, from their X-series to their Platinum series to last year's Snow Silent, their top end power supplies have been arguably the best consumer power supplies on the market.

The industry has recently moved from 80 PLUS Platinum (92% efficient) to Titanium (94% efficient) as the top end energy efficiency in power supplies, and a number of other vendors got units out before Seasonic:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&IsNodeId=1&N=100007657 601115166

But while some of those are nice, others have only excellent energy efficiency to go with less then excellent voltage regulation and ripple suppression.  No matter how efficient it is, a power supply that delivers unstable enough voltages to damage other hardware is junk.  Now, I don't know if any of the other Titanium power supplies are that bad, but merely staying in spec isn't enough to justify a premium price tag.

So while Seasonic wasn't the first with a Titanium power supply (nor Platinum), they did take the time to do it right.  Behold the glowing Hard OCP review:

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2016/07/21/seasonic_flagship_prime_750w_power_supply_review#.V5ORv1KEB10

It sports voltages that basically don't budge as the load changes, ripple that is barely there, efficiency that touches 94.9% at 120 V, and a high quality fan that you can't even hear.  Back it all by a 10 year warranty and make it fully modular, and what's not to like?  In this season of paper launches of hardware, it's even available today as the first reviews go up:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151158

Oh, right, that's what's not to like:  the price tag.  $160 plus shipping for a 650 W power supply.  But at least they did make a 650 W version appropriate for gaming rigs rather than starting at something ridiculous like 1200 W.  You can get a pretty good power supply for half that price, but that price tag is just about the only real reason to get anything else.
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Comments

  • Mtibbs1989Mtibbs1989 Member UncommonPosts: 3,161
    ad much.

    image

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  • DarLorkarDarLorkar Member UncommonPosts: 1,082
    ad much.



    I really like reading quizz's posts. Not all, but most have some decent info.
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 22,622
    We talk about video card and processor launches all the time.  Why not power supplies?  Think of this as the new generation Titan or Core i7 or whatever of power supplies:  a very nice product that's out of the budget for most people.
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,140
    edited July 2016
    If HardOCP is gushing over it, it's worth gushing over. They beat the snot out of PSUs during their testing. There are a lot of PSUs that don't even pass their tests, let alone win awards over there.
  • dmm02dmm02 Member UncommonPosts: 40
    ad much.

    Its been awhile since I have done any research into power supplies pretty much since my last build. I found the post interesting and informing 
    Thanks Quizzical!
  • HulluckHulluck Member UncommonPosts: 830
    Truthfully. While $165 is expensive in general.  Comparing to Seasonic prices of their other PSU's it isnt bad.  Especially if it performs better. My 660 plat was $130 ithink. Have not read the hardocp review yet. If my build was going over $1000 (which they do),  i would go on and spend the extra for a great psu.  Have had psu problems in the past. Which is why.  If i had a tight budget. I probably wouldnt.
  • SlyLoKSlyLoK Member RarePosts: 2,698
    I have never paid more than $100 for my PSUs and I never will. No point in it when you can get great ones for ~$80 and sometimes less. 
  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,321
    edited July 2016
    There is no point spending more than $70-80 on PSU for a home/gaming computer...$50 unit will do just fine vast majority of times.

    /shrugs
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,140
    No, this isn't the power supply you drop in on a tight budget. You probably aren't looking at any Platinum or Titanium-level power supplies though. Your looking Bronze level.

    But yeah, if your looking at a bigger budget, if your spending $500+ on a GPU or CPU, or gunning for a high overclock with a $100+ cooling setup and top-end motherboard, wouldn't you want the little bit of insurance that your PSU isn't going to fry it and can reliably provide clean power? Sure, any PSU can fail, but a higher quality one lowers that chance by a lot.

    I have 450W Seasonic Gold in my rig right now, and it's a champ, running a 4790k and a 980. I did it because a lot of people were saying "You need a bigger PSU", and all my math kept turning up saying "No you don't". So I decided to put my money where my mouth is. Rig runs great, even with mild overclocks. I push 375-400W routinely out of the 450 capacity, and can even brush against 450 at the wall if I push an overclock, but this psu hasn't had an issue with it at all, and it's been running for almost 2 years now.

    I've used a lot of Seasonic Bronzes in builds as well - and just looking at the two from the outside you'd be hard pressed to notice a difference. Even running, the biggest difference between the two (apart from modular cables) is that the Gold runs a bit quieter and cooler than the Bronze level PSUs.
  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,321
    edited July 2016
    Ridelynn said:
    Sure, any PSU can fail, but a higher quality one lowers that chance by a lot.
    Compared to $70 units, or even $50 units, they don't.
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,140
    edited July 2016
    Well... if a good $50 unit has a 0.2% chance to fail, and a $80 unit has a 0.1% chance to fail, and a $180 unit has a 0.05% chance to fail... those are all really small numbers and pretty close to each other.

    But you can also look at it in a different light...

    Each time you have cut in half the number of failures. If you say that the $50 is twice as likely to fail as the $80 unit, which is twice as likely to fail as a $180 unit - then it has a bit of a different context.

    Do you ~need~ to spend more on a PSU? No. Just like you don't need to get an i7 over an i5 (or i3, some may say) most of the time. Or you don't ~need~ any graphics over integrated graphics, most of the time.

    In full disclosure, I totally made up all those numbers to create an example. I don't actually have any numbers for PSU failure rates. I would like to think they are in the ballpark, but if anyone has actual numbers (like we have for hard drives, for instance), I'd love to see them.
  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,768
    Ridelynn said:
    No, this isn't the power supply you drop in on a tight budget. You probably aren't looking at any Platinum or Titanium-level power supplies though. Your looking Bronze level.

    But yeah, if your looking at a bigger budget, if your spending $500+ on a GPU or CPU, or gunning for a high overclock with a $100+ cooling setup and top-end motherboard, wouldn't you want the little bit of insurance that your PSU isn't going to fry it and can reliably provide clean power? Sure, any PSU can fail, but a higher quality one lowers that chance by a lot.

    I have 450W Seasonic Gold in my rig right now, and it's a champ, running a 4790k and a 980. I did it because a lot of people were saying "You need a bigger PSU", and all my math kept turning up saying "No you don't". So I decided to put my money where my mouth is. Rig runs great, even with mild overclocks. I push 375-400W routinely out of the 450 capacity, and can even brush against 450 at the wall if I push an overclock, but this psu hasn't had an issue with it at all, and it's been running for almost 2 years now.

    I've used a lot of Seasonic Bronzes in builds as well - and just looking at the two from the outside you'd be hard pressed to notice a difference. Even running, the biggest difference between the two (apart from modular cables) is that the Gold runs a bit quieter and cooler than the Bronze level PSUs.

    There is another way of looking at it.  Look at military electronics and their power supplies.  They often have power supplies that can handle a lot more.  Like 1000w vs your 450 if it were a pc.  Operating near the top of the wattage is "as-if" you are running a car in the red line.  It is a longer view of looking at it.
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  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,321
    Ridelynn said:
    Well... if a good $50 unit has a 0.2% chance to fail, and a $80 unit has a 0.1% chance to fail, and a $180 unit has a 0.05% chance to fail... those are all really small numbers and pretty close to each other.
    It is not the failure rate itself, it is failures that caused damage to other components in the process.

    I can't really think of a purpose and justification of such PSU besides enthusiasm.


  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,140
    Gdemami said:
    Ridelynn said:
    Well... if a good $50 unit has a 0.2% chance to fail, and a $80 unit has a 0.1% chance to fail, and a $180 unit has a 0.05% chance to fail... those are all really small numbers and pretty close to each other.
    It is not the failure rate itself, it is failures that caused damage to other components in the process.

    I can't really think of a purpose and justification of such PSU besides enthusiasm.


    That's a better case for paying more for a lower failure rate though...
  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,321
    Ridelynn said:
    That's a better case for paying more for a lower failure rate though...
    No, it isn't.
  • blueturtle13blueturtle13 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,695
    I paid $100 for my Corsair RMx 750 Watt
    Awesome PSU and $100 is pretty cheap compared to the other prices of components in my case. Hell my case was $100

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  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,321
    I paid $100 for my Corsair RMx 750 Watt
    Awesome PSU and $100 is pretty cheap compared to the other prices of components in my case. Hell my case was $100
    Yeah, that is what I was pointing at - lack of financial intelligence...
  • blueturtle13blueturtle13 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,695
    Gdemami said:
    I paid $100 for my Corsair RMx 750 Watt
    Awesome PSU and $100 is pretty cheap compared to the other prices of components in my case. Hell my case was $100
    Yeah, that is what I was pointing at - lack of financial intelligence...
    Huh? What kind of insult is that? Why?

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  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004
    Gdemami said:
    I paid $100 for my Corsair RMx 750 Watt
    Awesome PSU and $100 is pretty cheap compared to the other prices of components in my case. Hell my case was $100
    Yeah, that is what I was pointing at - lack of financial intelligence...
    You get what you pay for, most of the time. I paid a bit over £100 for my PSU, a Corsair 750hxi.
    If you have expensive components in your PC, it doesn't make sense to cut corners on your PSU, particularly if doing so could put those components at risk.
  • MendelMendel Member EpicPosts: 4,226
    I was hoping that Quiz had heard about a desktop version of a Cray CM at some ridiculously affordable price ($817 retail).  Back to my dreams, I guess.

    Nice power supply, though.  However, I expect all PC components will be substantially improved and cheaper by the time I'm in the market for a new rig.

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • blueturtle13blueturtle13 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,695
    Phry said:
    Gdemami said:
    I paid $100 for my Corsair RMx 750 Watt
    Awesome PSU and $100 is pretty cheap compared to the other prices of components in my case. Hell my case was $100
    Yeah, that is what I was pointing at - lack of financial intelligence...
    You get what you pay for, most of the time. I paid a bit over £100 for my PSU, a Corsair 750hxi.
    If you have expensive components in your PC, it doesn't make sense to cut corners on your PSU, particularly if doing so could put those components at risk.
    Agreed. I don't think $100 USD for a power supply is too much and I believe it a prudent thing to invest in considering the price of the CPU, RAM,Motherboard,Drives and GPU. The power supply is, to me, the foundation of the whole computer.
    I do more than just game on mine and I have no issues paying for quality.


     

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  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,321
    blueturtle13 said:
    Huh? What kind of insult is that? Why?
    What insult? I was just pointing out that it does not make sense economically - you pay hefty price tag for mitigating already miniscule chance that your PSU will damage other components.
  • blueturtle13blueturtle13 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,695
    Gdemami said:
    blueturtle13 said:
    Huh? What kind of insult is that? Why?
    What insult? I was just pointing out that it does not make sense economically - you pay hefty price tag for mitigating already miniscule chance that your PSU will damage other components.
    You said there is no point in spending more than $70 to $80 on a PSU.
     I spent $100 and use my computer for more than gaming and you claim it is not financially intelligent?
    It does make sense economically for me. Perhaps for you it does not.

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  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 22,622
    This is the sort of power supply that you buy if you want the best of everything and don't mind spending $3000 for a computer to get it.  It's not something I'd recommend on a $1000 budget, or even a $1500 budget.
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,605
    Gdemami said:
    blueturtle13 said:
    Huh? What kind of insult is that? Why?
    What insult? I was just pointing out that it does not make sense economically - you pay hefty price tag for mitigating already miniscule chance that your PSU will damage other components.
    Maybe if it's just for gaming and web browsing, but if you want additional reliability you pay for it. It shouldn't be much more expensive but it is.

    Want ECC? It can be factors more expensive. Want enterprise workstation grade drives? They can be factors more expensive as well. Paying a little more for added reliability in a power supply doesn't show lack of intelligence to me.

    If a component fails me at work I can lose hours or days of productivity and that costs a lot of money. If I beat the odds then it makes sense to cheap out. If I don't and could have possibly avoided a costly time sucking problem then it doesn't make sense.

    In a top end system an extra $20 - $80 isn't that much. It's not a very expensive component anyway.
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