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And the other shoe drops. Win 10 Enterprise becomes a subscription service with a monthly charge

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  • vonryan123vonryan123 Member UncommonPosts: 277
    I will still be sticking with windows 7 till 2020 when they stop security updates and support. Microcrap can eat a fat one for the shit show that is windows 10......From stats I was presented in college most big companies are still using 7 and earlier some even using nt server packages. The end result here is anyone that knows their way around a PC knows windows 10 is crap and most people should already know NOTHING is free.....

    The software race and hardware race that has become the current status quo is total bs and nothing short of a straight cash grab.....most of the software used by the average joe can't even utilize most of current gen hardware hell even windows 10 isn't up to snuff with the speed of new hardware.

     Do what you want with your PC's and $$ but as of 2020 my house with be linux based with maybe an old air-gap windows 7 pc around...just my opinion.

    image
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,631
    First, a lot of Enterprise level pricing already works this way with Microsoft's Volume Licensing program. It has worked like this for a really long time now. The idea of that model creeping into the business sector isn't a surprise.

    Enterprise, depending on the licensing, offers some interesting perks like greater control over updates and more freedom with license install configuration. You can choose your Windows and Server versions (within the supported pool), what gets installed where and how you manage images and updates.

    It does seem like every piece of software wants at least an annual contract now. I'm not sure how I feel about paying for Windows that way as a Home and Pro user. I pay for Office 365 and like it. I can install it on 5 machines. My wife and kids can install it. We each get a terabyte of online storage with that along with the Office suite. For $10 a month that's a deal that works for me right now. Windows would need to offer more than just OS usage for that kind of money.

    I'm not worried about it because I could easily see switching to OSX if the future didn't work out using Microsoft. If all else fails I can always use Linux.
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

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  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 29,200
    DMKano said:
    Nanfoodle said:
    Nicely played MS. Maybe it's time to switch to Apple. 
    Good luck finding many MMOs to play -  the one that comes off the top of my head is Trove, it  does have a mac client

    Also WoW, GW2, DDO, Lotro and Diablo 3 all have mac clients

    And Elder Scrolls Online!
  • snowman22snowman22 Member UncommonPosts: 54
    and subbing for consumers who pay payment plans on a $900 iphone every 2 years is different how? the subscription model is great when applied to MS office. i use all keys i have and happily pay $99 a yr for lifetime upgrades to newest versions. instead of paying $300 every two years 5 times over. if MS guarantees me 5 keys forever that will be upgraded til MS goes out of business i would pay them yearly 
  • snowman22snowman22 Member UncommonPosts: 54
    Torval said:
    First, a lot of Enterprise level pricing already works this way with Microsoft's Volume Licensing program. It has worked like this for a really long time now. The idea of that model creeping into the business sector isn't a surprise.

    Enterprise, depending on the licensing, offers some interesting perks like greater control over updates and more freedom with license install configuration. You can choose your Windows and Server versions (within the supported pool), what gets installed where and how you manage images and updates.

    It does seem like every piece of software wants at least an annual contract now. I'm not sure how I feel about paying for Windows that way as a Home and Pro user. I pay for Office 365 and like it. I can install it on 5 machines. My wife and kids can install it. We each get a terabyte of online storage with that along with the Office suite. For $10 a month that's a deal that works for me right now. Windows would need to offer more than just OS usage for that kind of money.

    I'm not worried about it because I could easily see switching to OSX if the future didn't work out using Microsoft. If all else fails I can always use Linux.
    but the OS model would work like the office Model. you would never have to buy a new key ever again as long as you only used up to 5 keys a time. as of right now the only legal way to install a new Mobo is to buy another windows key. now of course most people call in and give some blahblah my mobo died and i need another key BS and MS gives it to you. but thats a dirty secret. 
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,143
    A lot of people have called me crazy because I've been a big supporter of gaming on OS X. 

    My primary gaming computer is Windows. But my work computer has been OS X for a very long time now.  I won't say  it's better or worse than Windows, but I will say that I prefer working with it - but most of that comes from being more familiar with Unix/Linux.

    I buy copies of games that release on OS X just to support the platform a lot of times. Particularly the MMOs. It's true that Apple costs a lot more, and performance isn't as good, and Apple locks down driver updates, and you have a lot fewer options when it comes to hardware. All of those are very good points.
  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,768
    Ridelynn said:
    A lot of people have called me crazy because I've been a big supporter of gaming on OS X. 

    My primary gaming computer is Windows. But my work computer has been OS X for a very long time now.  I won't say  it's better or worse than Windows, but I will say that I prefer working with it - but most of that comes from being more familiar with Unix/Linux.

    I buy copies of games that release on OS X just to support the platform a lot of times. Particularly the MMOs. It's true that Apple costs a lot more, and performance isn't as good, and Apple locks down driver updates, and you have a lot fewer options when it comes to hardware. All of those are very good points.

    I don't believe I called you crazy...for that.
    http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2010/QBlog190810A.html  

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  • RPGMASTERGAMERRPGMASTERGAMER Member UncommonPosts: 516
    edited July 2016
    Grunty said:
    http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2016/07/14/microsoft-confirms-windows-10-new-monthly-charge/#2649f6dfab3f

    "That cost will be $7 per user per month but the good news is it only applies to enterprises, for now. The new pricing tier will be called “Windows 10 Enterprise E3” and it means Windows has finally joined Office 365 and Azure as a subscription service."

    Most services these days are heading in that direction. The software has just gotten too expensive and consumers are much happier to pay a smaller frequent payment than they are a one off payment.

    Adobe, Office, Windows, all services using this. Its the new norm.
    sorry but i have just LOL at the ''the software has just gotten too expensive''  ... do you know how much profit they make just curently ???

    let help the poor dev behind microsoft... humm wait... that billgate ?? the guys who got so much money already.... guess? ho okay.... he need make everything more expensive, how else he can pay pay his poor worker ?? they want food to eat ??!!

    here you go customer, pay for it !!

    honestly, i totaly dont agree with you !!! im a customer and im much more happy to pay for something only one time and own it !! with subcription based it become way more expensive realy soon.... i used window xp for almost 8 years and im curently on window 7 and will stay there, until they force me !! my window xp would be like 4x more expensive using this model...
    sorry but that bullshit

    small off payment are usualy way worst that pay something one time.
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,143
    edited July 2016
    I think subs make sense for things that require continual updates, like Operating Systems.

    $84/yr, I don't know if that's the magic number, but I don't expect my software to be free. And something like an Operating System, I don't expect to pay for it once and have it supported and updated forever.

    I prefer the Apple model - your OS license comes as part of the cost of your hardware, and they will keep supporting that as long as they keep supporting your particular hardware for no additional charge. Microsoft is ~almost~ there with OEMs... except they make you buy periodic "Updates" for major revisions. 

    If Windows 10 really is the last big edition of Windows, and it's all smaller incremental updates from here on out, I'm perfectly ok with that, and I think the subscription model works well for that kind of software development cycle. As long as you have the option to stop paying, and you stop getting updates and maybe some optional services, but not that your entire computer bricks. In fact, I think it would be perfectly fine if MS put out the OS "for free", but required that you have a valid subscription if you wanted to connect to the internet. That way they know they have the avenue to push updates, they have the funds to provide the updates, and those people that absolutely don't want the updates won't be exposed to a lot of the problems those updates are supposed to fix.
  • AllerleirauhAllerleirauh Member UncommonPosts: 496
    edited July 2016
    DMKano said:
    Nanfoodle said:
    Nicely played MS. Maybe it's time to switch to Apple. 
    Good luck finding many MMOs to play -  the one that comes off the top of my head is Trove, it  does have a mac client

    Also WoW, GW2, DDO, Lotro and Diablo 3 all have mac clients

    You can add Second Life to this list as well; Second Life was created with a Mac and has a Mac client. I use Windows like most people; I know that some people swear by Macs, but I was never one of them. I was skeptical about upgrading to Windows 10. However; if you are on Windows 7 Microsoft can and will end support, eventually. If you are using Windows 8, then I would highly suggest an upgrade. Windows 8 was designed for touchscreen computers and how many of us use those? Windows 8 was a stupid idea; I definitely suggest Windows 8 users upgrade (if they haven't already). I don't like the idea of a "subscription"; I don't even play games that have a subscription. I only play games that I can buy or free to play games; that's it! So let's hope this will not affect consumers; particularly those that have already upgraded, or it will be worth giving Apple a second thought. However, I highly doubt they would do a risky move like that; they don't know the personal limits of most consumers.
    Post edited by Allerleirauh on
    Currently Playing: Path of Exile

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  • HrimnirHrimnir Member RarePosts: 2,415
    Why is anyone surprised about this? It's Enterprise, not pro, not home, enterprise.

    "The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

    - Friedrich Nietzsche

  • maskedweaselmaskedweasel Member EpicPosts: 10,792
    Knew it was coming for enterprise, not really phased by it.  Probably would start cutting into work if it hit Pro.  But as we usually use volume licensing with MS for some things, we're already kind of used to it, and, besides, it's not that big of an issue.

    What I do see happening in the future... isn't MONTHLY payments from microsoft,  but I do see a yearly update charge on the horizon.  Not this year, not next year...  Microsoft will be pushing windows 10 quite a bit more until they hit that 1 Billion mark they've eluded to worldwide.

    Once they get there... which.. won't take too long..  but probably by 2018, they'll start launching major update packages that require a yearly fee.  Maybe its 15 dollars a year.. maybe its 50 dollars a year... 

    It will probably be one of those things that if you don't get the update package, you'll have to hear about it in the annoying way that Windows 10 ads popped up all the time if you didn't upgrade.

    Thats just my take on it...  seems like an easy way for Microsoft to make money if this truly is the operating system they're betting the farm on for all devices in the future.



  • coretex666coretex666 Member EpicPosts: 3,911
    Will there be cash shop as well? :)
  • ReizlaReizla Member RarePosts: 4,091
    DMKano said:
    Microsoft is pretty much switching to license focused pay model for the entire enterprise line - look at upcoming 2016 server products - all are licensed per core - here is an article on the licensing changes:

    http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-windows-server-2016-to-move-to-per-core-licensing/
    Did you read the article? There are several statements by Micro$oft that it'll be implemented for Home/Pro versions of Windows 10 later on as well: "The good news is Microsoft has gone on record to say it is not being passed down to consumers at this stage" and "consumers would get 17 and 28 months use out of Windows 10 Home and Windows 10 Pro respectively. This isn’t a great deal".

    It's like I've said before on other Windows 10 topics - THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS FREE, certainly when a big corporation like Micro$oft makes something 'free'.

    I'm still on Windows 7 Ultimate x64 and will stay on it till it's on end of service. After that I'll either switch to Linux or Mac OSX (does mean I need an Intel machine though), but I certainly will not give my money to Micro$oft for an OS subscription!

    And for games..? I've been playing (and buying) less and less games already and am focusing on programming more and more. Using the Unity3D engine I'm not bound to stick with Windows at all since it has both OSX (from where it originates BTW) and Linux clients already. Only problem is that not all of the support software I use is available on both platforms (most on OSX though). On the other hand, those few tools that are still Windows only at that time, I'll just use on my laptop (which has Windows 7 Home and will then no longer be connected to the internet).
  • HrimnirHrimnir Member RarePosts: 2,415
    Will never happen.  They'll try it and consumers will tell them to eat dicks and they'll go out of business or change back to a standard model.

    "The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

    - Friedrich Nietzsche

  • snowman22snowman22 Member UncommonPosts: 54
    Hrimnir said:
    Will never happen.  They'll try it and consumers will tell them to eat dicks and they'll go out of business or change back to a standard model.
    but it worked so well for office. it will work for OS. for those who do not cheat the system having an lifetime key to microsoft OS's that can be used for ever by yourself is worth $50 to $100 a yr. i already buy office. i would subscribe to windows for $50 a yr if i can deactivate and activate on unlimited amounts of new PCs. right now it is whats holding me back from making a new one. i would have to buy a $200 key for my new pc. while the key i have on this pc will just die in a storage room.

    I rebuild and install a new Mobo every other refresh. and jump intel to amd and back every forth build.. 
  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko Member EpicPosts: 6,916
    Hrimnir said:
    Why is anyone surprised about this? It's Enterprise, not pro, not home, enterprise.
    And it wouldn't surprise me if Microsoft keeps the "home edition" of Windows 10 completely free. It acts as a "gateway drug", getting users hooked on their home PC's and then they demand to use the same OS on their work PC's.

    IIRC that was why MS never went after illegal Office and Windows users in the home. They even made it easier to pirate Office for private use by removing any form of DRM decades ago.

    The real money for MS is in licensing business users. Those are easier to police and far more lucrative to sue on a per-case basis.
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,143
    Will there be cash shop as well? :)
    It's called the Windows Store
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,143
    Hrimnir said:
    Why is anyone surprised about this? It's Enterprise, not pro, not home, enterprise.
    And it wouldn't surprise me if Microsoft keeps the "home edition" of Windows 10 completely free. It acts as a "gateway drug", getting users hooked on their home PC's and then they demand to use the same OS on their work PC's.

    IIRC that was why MS never went after illegal Office and Windows users in the home. They even made it easier to pirate Office for private use by removing any form of DRM decades ago.

    The real money for MS is in licensing business users. Those are easier to police and far more lucrative to sue on a per-case basis.
    I think this is pretty close to the mark. If you buy a PC from an OEM - odds are it will come loaded with an Office trial- which is really 30 days for free on the subscription service. They are really pushing you to start your Microsoft account and start linking stuff to through that.
  • XxPriestxXXxPriestxX Member UncommonPosts: 133
    Why is everyone debating using Enterprise Win 10 in here when 99.99999999% of you won't. Ever. It's the corporate business solution, not the home solution, not even the small business solution. All they're doing is trying to play catch up with Redhat and SuSE linux enterprise, which has followed this model for years. Only difference is that their 'home'/testing versions of their software are free, whereas M$ still wants you to pay for it.

    And for those that want to keep saying how difficult or archaic linux is to use... I'd recommend you to my 83+ year old grandparents that use it daily with zero problems and are happy as hell not to have to call me almost weekly to come fix X or Y windoze problem.
    Trolling, being trolled, getting banned, yelling at mods, getting perma banned, making new accounts, and still trolling this site since 2004 =D
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,631
    Knew it was coming for enterprise, not really phased by it.  Probably would start cutting into work if it hit Pro.  But as we usually use volume licensing with MS for some things, we're already kind of used to it, and, besides, it's not that big of an issue.

    What I do see happening in the future... isn't MONTHLY payments from microsoft,  but I do see a yearly update charge on the horizon.  Not this year, not next year...  Microsoft will be pushing windows 10 quite a bit more until they hit that 1 Billion mark they've eluded to worldwide.

    Once they get there... which.. won't take too long..  but probably by 2018, they'll start launching major update packages that require a yearly fee.  Maybe its 15 dollars a year.. maybe its 50 dollars a year... 

    It will probably be one of those things that if you don't get the update package, you'll have to hear about it in the annoying way that Windows 10 ads popped up all the time if you didn't upgrade.

    Thats just my take on it...  seems like an easy way for Microsoft to make money if this truly is the operating system they're betting the farm on for all devices in the future.
    I wouldn't mind if they offered this for small and medium businesses as well for the Pro version. I would love if we had a pool of WIndows 10 and Server licences we could draw from. I have 3 virtual machine images I work with daily - Win7, Win10, and Server 2012. I would love to update my server license to R2 or newer. I would love to update the Win7 license at some point when I've finally rolled through all the projects that I still need it for.

    Managing my VM licenses and the rest of the desktop licenses in the shop are a pain in the ass. If there was a cost effective way to streamline that I would love it.
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

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  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004
    Why is everyone debating using Enterprise Win 10 in here when 99.99999999% of you won't. Ever. It's the corporate business solution, not the home solution, not even the small business solution. All they're doing is trying to play catch up with Redhat and SuSE linux enterprise, which has followed this model for years. Only difference is that their 'home'/testing versions of their software are free, whereas M$ still wants you to pay for it.

    And for those that want to keep saying how difficult or archaic linux is to use... I'd recommend you to my 83+ year old grandparents that use it daily with zero problems and are happy as hell not to have to call me almost weekly to come fix X or Y windoze problem.
    I think its got people concerned because it could very easily migrate to other versions of Win10. There is even some indication that Win10 Home Edition will eventually require some form of subscription, and now i am seriously considering wiping my HD and reinstalling Win7/64.

    I don't disagree about Linux being easy to use, it is, i've used Ubuntu in the past and its perfectly fine, the problem has always been lack of support from developers, if that ever changes, then i could quite happily turn my back on MS forever, until then though, i think its going to have to be Win 7.

  • GladDogGladDog Member RarePosts: 1,073
    This looks like a win for a lot of businesses.  Companies don't like upgrading software because of the cost and some compatibility issues.  This system is like a car lease.  In three years, when the next version of Windows releases, they just change the wording of the lease to get the new version, but the cost is the same.  There is plenty of time between beta versions and release for companies to test for software compatibility.  And since the cost is spread out and uniform, it is easy to budget.

    Now, if they go beyond that and put Home or Pro on subscription, they could open a HUGE can of worms...


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  • XxPriestxXXxPriestxX Member UncommonPosts: 133
    Phry said:
    Why is everyone debating using Enterprise Win 10 in here when 99.99999999% of you won't. Ever. It's the corporate business solution, not the home solution, not even the small business solution. All they're doing is trying to play catch up with Redhat and SuSE linux enterprise, which has followed this model for years. Only difference is that their 'home'/testing versions of their software are free, whereas M$ still wants you to pay for it.

    And for those that want to keep saying how difficult or archaic linux is to use... I'd recommend you to my 83+ year old grandparents that use it daily with zero problems and are happy as hell not to have to call me almost weekly to come fix X or Y windoze problem.
    I think its got people concerned because it could very easily migrate to other versions of Win10. There is even some indication that Win10 Home Edition will eventually require some form of subscription, and now i am seriously considering wiping my HD and reinstalling Win7/64.

    I don't disagree about Linux being easy to use, it is, i've used Ubuntu in the past and its perfectly fine, the problem has always been lack of support from developers, if that ever changes, then i could quite happily turn my back on MS forever, until then though, i think its going to have to be Win 7.

    The way I figured it long ago is that, while linux has been slooooooowly gaining ground with game developers, there's still consoles. Windoze is just a glorified xbox, games are the only thing it does well vs. any other OS. But in a business, or as I'd noted, a granny's home, linux will do nearly everything windows will do, much cheaper, and have far less problems (keeping in mind in both of those scenarios, there's not some windoze kiddie that has to have ALL the latest updates for no reason other than they're there... *nix tends to work best for people that KNOW how to run a computer, not let some corporate entity dictate how they should run it).
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  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 8,968
    They want everyone to rent the OS.  They're just doing it a little at a time.  It's a price hike.

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

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