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  • VucarVucar Member UncommonPosts: 311
    So much misinformation, its like half of you guys use picture books to inform yourselves of the world around you.

    1) Magic is supposed to be crazy rare, there's no guarantee that "mage" burning down the town will even be a player. It could be an NPC that needs to be defeated.

    2) Its a 5% chance to get a talent. Within that 5%, a subset is magic. That means less than 5% will get magic. Of that subset, there is no guarantee the magic you get will be combat oriented. That means only a subset of a subset of 5% of player characters could even have the POTENTIAL for combat magic, if it even exists.

    3) Because of the above, playing a "mage class" in this game is not a God-given right like it is in World of Warcraft. Coming into this game with your past schemas of what you think you are entitled to play as will not pan out.

    3) Talents die with your characters, not with souls.

    4) There is no point in "re-rolling" to get talents because talents must be triggered and discovered. Given how many potential talent types there might be, you could spend months trying to find a talent on a character and still miss it. Its like throwing away christmas present boxes before you open them because you don't think the wrapping paper suggests there's a puppy inside.

    5) The talent system is not a means to monetize the game further. If you want a talent and haven't triggered one yet, your best bet is to participate in the overarcing story. A better plan would be play without any expectation of having a talent and be happily surprised if you ever get one.

  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,174
    Nanfoodle said:
    Nanfoodle said:
    Love the heading for Magic. So on char creation you have a 5% chance you can roll a magic user when thats added to the game. Sorry if I wanna roll a healer or a wizard, I dont want a 5% chance the soul I bought will be able to do what I want. 
    And I can understand that. However there is certainly no shortage of other MMOs where you can go out and create a character with exactly those freedoms. 
    So you like the idea of not picking what your char is skilled at? Decide you want to roll a 2h sword warrior to find out its good at magic. Or you want to roll a bard to find out its skilled at farming. Or that you decide to play that warrior anyways knowing that facing someone who has that boost to using swords, you just wont stand up as good as them in combat, thats something you like?
    The "souls" are like lock boxes in other games.  You get 3 to choose from with your initial spark.   5% chance at magic means the power games will be "re-rolling" to unlock.  This means more revenue for the company.  At least that's the theory.

    That seams horrible to me at least in SWG the Jedi alpha class had to be unlocked and you couldn't pay for a chance at it. I guess Pay 2 King is going to be Pay 2 Magic as well.

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

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  • holdenfiveholdenfive Member UncommonPosts: 170
    Vucar said:
    So much misinformation, its like half of you guys use picture books to inform yourselves of the world around you.

    1) Magic is supposed to be crazy rare, there's no guarantee that "mage" burning down the town will even be a player. It could be an NPC that needs to be defeated.

    2) Its a 5% chance to get a talent. Within that 5%, a subset is magic. That means less than 5% will get magic. Of that subset, there is no guarantee the magic you get will be combat oriented. That means only a subset of a subset of 5% of player characters could even have the POTENTIAL for combat magic, if it even exists.

    3) Because of the above, playing a "mage class" in this game is not a God-given right like it is in World of Warcraft. Coming into this game with your past schemas of what you think you are entitled to play as will not pan out.

    3) Talents die with your characters, not with souls.

    4) There is no point in "re-rolling" to get talents because talents must be triggered and discovered. Given how many potential talent types there might be, you could spend months trying to find a talent on a character and still miss it. Its like throwing away christmas present boxes before you open them because you don't think the wrapping paper suggests there's a puppy inside.

    5) The talent system is not a means to monetize the game further. If you want a talent and haven't triggered one yet, your best bet is to participate in the overarcing story. A better plan would be play without any expectation of having a talent and be happily surprised if you ever get one.

    That is what they're telling you, for now. I'm aware of all that I just don't readily accept everything Im told is fact. For most of us this isn't our first rodeo, hence we can have plausible discussions about where things might lead. That's what forums are for. If it were for regurgitating dev rhetoric verbatim, there is a game info page for that. Regardless, you -will- be able to buy talents. Whether it is directly from the developer or on ebay. Did this even occur to you, with your extensive non-illustrated knowledge of the world?
  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko Member EpicPosts: 6,916
    Vucar said:
    So much misinformation, its like half of you guys peasants use picture books to inform yourselves of the world around you.

    ...

    "Yes, m'lord !"
    "As you say, m'lord..."

    /touchesforelock

    :D
  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,847
    edited July 2016
    Vucar said:
    So much misinformation, its like half of you guys use picture books to inform yourselves of the world around you.

    1) Magic is supposed to be crazy rare, there's no guarantee that "mage" burning down the town will even be a player. It could be an NPC that needs to be defeated.

    2) Its a 5% chance to get a talent. Within that 5%, a subset is magic. That means less than 5% will get magic. Of that subset, there is no guarantee the magic you get will be combat oriented. That means only a subset of a subset of 5% of player characters could even have the POTENTIAL for combat magic, if it even exists.

    3) Because of the above, playing a "mage class" in this game is not a God-given right like it is in World of Warcraft. Coming into this game with your past schemas of what you think you are entitled to play as will not pan out.

    3) Talents die with your characters, not with souls.

    4) There is no point in "re-rolling" to get talents because talents must be triggered and discovered. Given how many potential talent types there might be, you could spend months trying to find a talent on a character and still miss it. Its like throwing away christmas present boxes before you open them because you don't think the wrapping paper suggests there's a puppy inside.

    5) The talent system is not a means to monetize the game further. If you want a talent and haven't triggered one yet, your best bet is to participate in the overarcing story. A better plan would be play without any expectation of having a talent and be happily surprised if you ever get one.

    Misinformation? 
    About what? An undeveloped concept? There has been no development. Only what SB tells us, and as in the case of the official web site, shows us what they intend to do. A picture is worth a thousand words in this situation.
     And that is a picture of mage casting a powerful spell, NOT misinformation.

    And yes, I know you can explain it based on what SB has said in the past. But my point is........
    For any of the uninitiated who find their way to COE, what do you think they will suppose seeing this Front page? 

    "Oh don't mind the Front page artwork, this isn't a High Fantasy game."?

  • GrumpyHobbitGrumpyHobbit Member RarePosts: 1,220

     And that is a picture of mage casting a powerful spell, NOT misinformation.

    To me that looked like a guy overlooking a city being bombarded by siege weapons.

    I matter of perspective I guess. 

    2 ways to look at it...
    1 - You can read the info about the game where it says magic is rare and then interpret the picture to totally contradict it and grab your 'I told ya' moment. 
    2 - You can read the info about the game where it says magic is rare and then interpret the picture to just be a nice picture and not jump to conclusions bases on an assumption that goes against what the game design has stated EVERY time it has been discussed. 

    So while you can argue 'misinformation' I would argue your interpretation of the picture is the problem and by stating without doubt what you THINK the picture is will lead to misinformation. 

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,847
    edited July 2016

     And that is a picture of mage casting a powerful spell, NOT misinformation.

    To me that looked like a guy overlooking a city being bombarded by siege weapons.

    I matter of perspective I guess. 

    2 ways to look at it...
    1 - You can read the info about the game where it says magic is rare and then interpret the picture to totally contradict it and grab your 'I told ya' moment. 
    2 - You can read the info about the game where it says magic is rare and then interpret the picture to just be a nice picture and not jump to conclusions bases on an assumption that goes against what the game design has stated EVERY time it has been discussed. 

    So while you can argue 'misinformation' I would argue your interpretation of the picture is the problem and by stating without doubt what you THINK the picture is will lead to misinformation. 

    Siege weapons?


  • DakeruDakeru Member EpicPosts: 3,797
    To me that looked like a guy overlooking a city being bombarded by siege weapons.

    I matter of perspective I guess. 
    Yeah.. that guy with the glowing staff is just raising the staff and his hand to show off.
    That damn poser!
    Harbinger of Fools
  • NycteliosNyctelios Member EpicPosts: 3,827
    edited July 2016
    @Slapshot1188 your souls bonuses don't limit your character progression. It's just which skills are a little better for you at the start. As far I know, you'll be able to raise other skills by using them just as many mmo's did to this date. 

    The same way you can play Dungeons and Dragons Fifth Edition and make a dwarven mage or dwarven thief. You'll start with bonuses that are not optimized for that class/role but it doesn't mean in the long run you could not be as good as any other race.

    Having 5 points in, for the sake of argument let's say, skinning, won't make you worst at swordplay than somebody else if you both have like Skill Level 20 on it.

    I dig the concept, I also dig that you buy souls the same way you buy coins to play in an arcade machine. I think if done right it's a clever way to cash your game without p2w elements. I don't see how slightly higher "digging skill" on your character is a problem, your starting stats doesn't define your role - your story does. That's the entire concept of the game. 

    "My name is John, and I was a farmer when someone asked me to kill a drunk knight who raped my neighbor daughter... So my story begins" . What's the problem with that?

    They are trying to approach some realism level on this. Even if I disagree with royal titles purchase I think it makes sense so the game has already some community and society before it starts (or it would be complete chaos) - and I just think it's ok because the person who bought the title can lose it

    If it would be an eternal advantage then I wouldn't even touch that game... Maybe I'll never will - This project seems utopia to me.
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  • GrumpyHobbitGrumpyHobbit Member RarePosts: 1,220
    Dakeru said:
    To me that looked like a guy overlooking a city being bombarded by siege weapons.

    I matter of perspective I guess. 
    Yeah.. that guy with the glowing staff is just raising the staff and his hand to show off.
    That damn poser!
    Yeah well while people are raging about magic they all seem to ignore the text that goes with that picture...

    "There are legends of powerful magic existing in the world of Elyria long ago, but no one has seen or heard of it for thousands of years..."

    So yeah, to me this is a siege because magic does not exist...yet.

    I wonder, how would a low fantasy game with no magic but a small chance for characters to be magically adept grow into a game that will eventually be high fantasy...
  • holdenfiveholdenfive Member UncommonPosts: 170

     And that is a picture of mage casting a powerful spell, NOT misinformation.

    To me that looked like a guy overlooking a city being bombarded by siege weapons.

    I matter of perspective I guess. 

    2 ways to look at it...
    1 - You can read the info about the game where it says magic is rare and then interpret the picture to totally contradict it and grab your 'I told ya' moment. 
    2 - You can read the info about the game where it says magic is rare and then interpret the picture to just be a nice picture and not jump to conclusions bases on an assumption that goes against what the game design has stated EVERY time it has been discussed. 

    So while you can argue 'misinformation' I would argue your interpretation of the picture is the problem and by stating without doubt what you THINK the picture is will lead to misinformation. 

    Or you can look at it as once again the devs have no god damned clue what theyre doing and jump all up in their grill about it. Since the devs love to portray this "Im infallible, Im going to offer the internet the perfect game" vibe, I would assume they're cool with us eating their lunch over them fucking up what little they've actually done so far. After all, we'll be quite bored when the perfection thing starts to become the norm.
  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,174
    Meh, its crap. I mean how is their website any different than any other game's website? Its just yet again another HTML clicker with some java thrown in. Yawn. Its shameless lazy copycatting is what I'd call it. And besides the EQ website did it all better years ago.  :p
    Well forget Murphy's Law, it's just crap.

    Check out some of these cool website designs.
    http://www.ebizmba.com/articles/best-html5-websites

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer



  • cyranacyrana Member UncommonPosts: 197
    edited July 2016
    Does it work on a Mac with Safari for anyone?   I just get an error that 'Safari Web Content quit unexpectedly' and then a reload page option.  This is my work Macbook air, and the page does work in Chrome.  Still, I've literally never seen this on another website...

    Ningen wa ningen da.
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  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 8,968

     And that is a picture of mage casting a powerful spell, NOT misinformation.

    To me that looked like a guy overlooking a city being bombarded by siege weapons.

    I matter of perspective I guess. 

    2 ways to look at it...
    1 - You can read the info about the game where it says magic is rare and then interpret the picture to totally contradict it and grab your 'I told ya' moment. 
    2 - You can read the info about the game where it says magic is rare and then interpret the picture to just be a nice picture and not jump to conclusions bases on an assumption that goes against what the game design has stated EVERY time it has been discussed. 

    So while you can argue 'misinformation' I would argue your interpretation of the picture is the problem and by stating without doubt what you THINK the picture is will lead to misinformation. 

    That picture is pretty clear.  You have a character in a traditional wizard outfit with a traditional glowing magic staff with his hands up while aoe fireballs rain down on a city.  I don't see any siege weapons in that picture.  It could be someone crying out because God is raining down destruction but there's nothing in the picture that supports that reasoning.

    I understand wanting to attract people but think about the message you're putting out.


    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • GrumpyHobbitGrumpyHobbit Member RarePosts: 1,220


    That picture is pretty clear.  You have a character in a traditional wizard outfit with a traditional glowing magic staff with his hands up while aoe fireballs rain down on a city.  I don't see any siege weapons in that picture.  It could be someone crying out because God is raining down destruction but there's nothing in the picture that supports that reasoning.

    I understand wanting to attract people but think about the message you're putting out.


    And yet the text that goes with the picture is ignored so it is worth repeating: -

    "There are legends of powerful magic existing in the world of Elyria long ago, but no one has seen or heard of it for thousands of years..."
  • VucarVucar Member UncommonPosts: 311
    That is what they're telling you, for now. I'm aware of all that I just don't readily accept everything Im told is fact. For most of us this isn't our first rodeo, hence we can have plausible discussions about where things might lead. That's what forums are for. If it were for regurgitating dev rhetoric verbatim, there is a game info page for that.
    Misinformation? 
    About what? An undeveloped concept? There has been no development. Only what SB tells us, and as in the case of the official web site, shows us what they intend to do. 

    This forum is for discussing a game in development, the only thing we can discuss is what has been said. There are no people playing who can chime in and say "well actually magic is more common and overpowered than you think". 

    By posting on this subforum, you implicitly assume that the game you are discussing is the same game SBS is making and is in fact the same game they have described to us thus far. I could go onto any other subforum for any other in-development game on mmorpg.com and say "but what if they lie about this that and the other" and it would be just as hollow as your post here. 

    holdenfive said:
    Regardless, you -will- be able to buy talents. Whether it is directly from the developer or on ebay. Did this even occur to you, with your extensive non-illustrated knowledge of the world?

    Of course players will put unlocked-talented characters on player auctions, ebay, in some shady back-alley on the street, and where ever else they can. No game has ever been able to stop 100% of players selling accounts. What do you add to this conversation by stating the obvious?


    For any of the uninitiated who find their way to COE, what do you think they will suppose seeing this Front page? 

    "Oh don't mind the Front page artwork, this isn't a High Fantasy game."?

    I know your picture-book education has done well by you so far in life, but i promise the rest of the world is doing a lot better by reading. I highly recommend it.
  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Member LegendaryPosts: 9,062
    edited July 2016


    That picture is pretty clear.  You have a character in a traditional wizard outfit with a traditional glowing magic staff with his hands up while aoe fireballs rain down on a city.  I don't see any siege weapons in that picture.  It could be someone crying out because God is raining down destruction but there's nothing in the picture that supports that reasoning.

    I understand wanting to attract people but think about the message you're putting out.


    And yet the text that goes with the picture is ignored so it is worth repeating: -

    "There are legends of powerful magic existing in the world of Elyria long ago, but no one has seen or heard of it for thousands of years..."
    It also says...



    "There are whispers of Magic Use, the ability to Travel, Shapeshifting, Healing, Animal Speak, Planes Walking, and many other things, but they are quite rare, affecting less than 5% of players"

    With that picture its clear. So keep rolling souls your 5% can get you a soul that can Travel, Shapeshifting, Healing, Animal Speak, Planes Walking, and many other things. Bothers me for two reasons. Its connected to the monetization and this will become like cash shops with lock boxes where people spend a fortune to get the char they want.  
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,532


    That picture is pretty clear.  You have a character in a traditional wizard outfit with a traditional glowing magic staff with his hands up while aoe fireballs rain down on a city.  I don't see any siege weapons in that picture.  It could be someone crying out because God is raining down destruction but there's nothing in the picture that supports that reasoning.

    I understand wanting to attract people but think about the message you're putting out.


    And yet the text that goes with the picture is ignored so it is worth repeating: -

    "There are legends of powerful magic existing in the world of Elyria long ago, but no one has seen or heard of it for thousands of years..."
    Speaking of ignoring text... this is what follows:

    "There are whispers of Magic Use, the ability to Travel, Shapeshifting, Healing, Animal Speak, Planes Walking, and many other things, but they are quite rare, affecting less than 5% of players. "

    So roughly 1 of every 20 characters created will have Magic Use.   

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  • ZultraZultra Member UncommonPosts: 363
    Wasn't there a massive thread about how talents (magic) could be easily monetized by the developer and how they may succumb to community pressure to make it more available,or at least something that could be purchased? To which the community of CoE and the lead dev emphatically denied as even within the real of possibilities, cause the OP was an idiot and was wrong? 

    Now many months later this is basically common reasoning when talking about the game, which hasnt even been developed yet, and magic is heavily featured on their website. 

    Just lol. We'll see.
    Well, in all honesty, it probably comes down to your own personal bias.

    Some will say it was designed that way to "encourage" players to keep buying soul-packs until they got a "good roll".

    Others will say that buying multiple soul-packs is cheating and manipulating the system, because the semi-random results from the soul-pack is supposed to encourage diversity.

    Way back in StarWars:Galaxies, you were only allowed 1 character per server. That meant you had to make hard choices about which skills you would be using. Most people stuck to 1 account and picked their skills wisely. Some bought a second account...
    You do not know if a Soul/Character has a talent till it is (ever) unlocked.
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  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Member LegendaryPosts: 9,062
    Zultra said:
    Wasn't there a massive thread about how talents (magic) could be easily monetized by the developer and how they may succumb to community pressure to make it more available,or at least something that could be purchased? To which the community of CoE and the lead dev emphatically denied as even within the real of possibilities, cause the OP was an idiot and was wrong? 

    Now many months later this is basically common reasoning when talking about the game, which hasnt even been developed yet, and magic is heavily featured on their website. 

    Just lol. We'll see.
    Well, in all honesty, it probably comes down to your own personal bias.

    Some will say it was designed that way to "encourage" players to keep buying soul-packs until they got a "good roll".

    Others will say that buying multiple soul-packs is cheating and manipulating the system, because the semi-random results from the soul-pack is supposed to encourage diversity.

    Way back in StarWars:Galaxies, you were only allowed 1 character per server. That meant you had to make hard choices about which skills you would be using. Most people stuck to 1 account and picked their skills wisely. Some bought a second account...
    You do not know if a Soul/Character has a talent till it is (ever) unlocked.
    Understand not of much spoke there. 
  • GrumpyHobbitGrumpyHobbit Member RarePosts: 1,220
    Nanfoodle said:

    It also says...



    "There are whispers of Magic Use, the ability to Travel, Shapeshifting, Healing, Animal Speak, Planes Walking, and many other things, but they are quite rare, affecting less than 5% of players"

    With that picture its clear. So keep rolling souls your 5% can get you a soul that can Travel, Shapeshifting, Healing, Animal Speak, Planes Walking, and many other things. Bothers me for two reasons. Its connected to the monetization and this will become like cash shops with lock boxes where people spend a fortune to get the char they want.  

    Speaking of ignoring text... this is what follows:

    "There are whispers of Magic Use, the ability to Travel, Shapeshifting, Healing, Animal Speak, Planes Walking, and many other things, but they are quite rare, affecting less than 5% of players. "

    So roughly 1 of every 20 characters created will have Magic Use.   
    So with talents not unlocked till it's discovery and discovery not being something to look up on Google how exactly would you sell me a character with a talent? Of course you might be able to sell a character once you make the discovery but magic is going to be a subset of that 5%. 

    So now that you have discovered a character with a talent you then have to hope that the discovery is made early in life because upon death that talent is gone. And remember, while you are trying to discover if a character has a talent you are aging, even while offline...so better hope you don't die before you sell it.

    Compared to other games the lengths someone would have to go through to get a magic user or buy one I doubt it will be big business lol.
  • GrumpyHobbitGrumpyHobbit Member RarePosts: 1,220
    Nanfoodle said:

    You do not know if a Soul/Character has a talent till it is (ever) unlocked.
    Understand not of much spoke there. 
    He made perfect sense. I still have to take my time reading what you wrote to understand it....unless you are making a Yoda reference...but I have no idea why
  • GrumpyHobbitGrumpyHobbit Member RarePosts: 1,220

    Speaking of ignoring text... this is what follows:

    "There are whispers of Magic Use, the ability to Travel, Shapeshifting, Healing, Animal Speak, Planes Walking, and many other things, but they are quite rare, affecting less than 5% of players. "

    So roughly LESS than 1 of every 20 characters created MIGHT have Magic Use.   
    Fixed.
  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,368
    edited July 2016
    I dont really want to pay someone to play a real life simulator. Right out the gate I have a random chance to be at an advantage or disadvantage? Thought most of us played games to escape real life lol
  • GrumpyHobbitGrumpyHobbit Member RarePosts: 1,220
    Albatroes said:
    I dont really want to pay someone to play a real life simulator. Right out the gate I have a random chance to be at an advantage or disadvantage? Thought most of us played games to escape real life lol
    Pokemon GO is a smash hit. Doesn't interest me in the slightest. 

    I see little point going into a thread about that game and telling everyone there why I don't like it and it honestly puzzles me why people feel they have to do it here or about any game in general. 




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