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Only took a few things to kill this game

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  • AzothAzoth Member UncommonPosts: 840
    Vardahoth said:
    Bad.dog said:
    From your experience in game can you tell me the difference between good stat and poor stat rng increases ...What type of % difference are we looking at ?
    The game doesn't even let you know your stats except for hp and mp. And from that I can tell you I have seen two level 55's same (everything), and one has 1600hp and the other has 1400hp. And the 1400hp guy also has less mp too.

    Only way I was able to tell is when one guildie was able to oneshot another while clearly it should have been the other way around.
    Could you ask those guys for screenshots ? Both guys naked, no crystals, no costumes on. So we can start talking about facts. I can provide for level 52 wizard if anyone else got it.
  • ShaighShaigh Member RarePosts: 2,010
    edited April 2016
    Shaigh said:
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out.
    Seriously?
    Missed that math class?
    If you add a random number between 1 and 5 each levels, the more levels you will have, the less difference between the characters there will be, and the sum added will at the end tend to the average between 1 and 5 which is 3.
    Unless, of course, your random function is bugged and isn't really random, which would result in the values not being evenly distributed.
    There's a difference between average and distribution. Random numbers don't average out, if they do your random function is bugged and not actually random. However, the more times you do them, the closer they will be to the average. You will still have a variation and its among that variation that you find power differences.

    While its extremely unlikely that you will find someone that gets max on all 50 rolls with your example you are bound to have results at 2.7 or 3.3, meaning 10% stronger than the average.
    The cynic knows the price of everything and the value of nothing.
  • VardahothVardahoth Member RarePosts: 1,472
    edited April 2016
    Vardahoth said:

    Only way I was able to tell is when one guildie was able to oneshot another while clearly it should have been the other way around.
    One shot because of a difference of 200hp, 1400 vs 1600?



    The 200hp were most likely part of a massive gear difference that caused the one shooting. If that one shooting ever happened, of course.
    I know the idea is hard for you to grasp, but it's not just hp...


    Shaigh said:
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out. 
    Seriously?
    Missed that math class?
    If you add a random number between 1 and 5 each levels, the more levels you will have, the less difference between the characters there will be, and the sum added will at the end tend to the average between 1 and 5 which is 3.
    Unless, of course, your random function is bugged and isn't really random, which would result in the values not being evenly distributed.

    I take it you failed statistics. Look up probabilities with rolling dice.

    I Quit.

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/436845/page/1 -> http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/436845/what-killed-mmorpgs-for-you/p1

    http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2316034
    .............
    Retired Gamer: all MMORPG's have been destroyed by big business, marketing of false promises, unprofessional game makers, and a generation of "I WIN and GIVE ME NOW" (brought to you by pokeman).

  • VardahothVardahoth Member RarePosts: 1,472
    Kyleran said:
    Shaigh said:
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out.

    While you won't notice that much difference between the 90% close to the average values you will have a significant difference between the 5% that got lucky compared to the 5% of the unlucky. It gets even more obvious for 1% and with 0.1% you get very extreme results.

    Given that their plan is for black desert to sell 1M copies in the west this means that 5% is 50k players, 1% is 10k players, 0.1% is 1k players.
    Statistically speaking I wonder what the odds are of someone getting 55 maximum gain (or loss ) rolls in both HP and MP?

    Unless the RNG is bugged my guess is almost near zero, probably have better luck flipping a coin, letting it hit the floor, and have it come to rest on its edge.

    Regardless I'm positive it won't be anywhere near 5 or 10%

    Over the long haul it will most likely balance itself out, but even if it didn't the odds of running into your perfect twin in terms of gear, levels, skill, numbers and in a PVP situation are equally slim.

    FInal analysis, you are not likely to ever run into a situation where it occurs or even matters, and even if it does, you'll never know.

    The CM said something about rolling a 20 every level. The community isn't sure if that means 20 hp. But someone is working on gathering data:

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/18YB-Ykh4UEOp7uh6eCR8xnK9ZfJJTsaE69snfGKhZBc/edit#gid=291962526

    I Quit.

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/436845/page/1 -> http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/436845/what-killed-mmorpgs-for-you/p1

    http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2316034
    .............
    Retired Gamer: all MMORPG's have been destroyed by big business, marketing of false promises, unprofessional game makers, and a generation of "I WIN and GIVE ME NOW" (brought to you by pokeman).

  • VardahothVardahoth Member RarePosts: 1,472
    Azoth said:
    Vardahoth said:
    Bad.dog said:
    From your experience in game can you tell me the difference between good stat and poor stat rng increases ...What type of % difference are we looking at ?
    The game doesn't even let you know your stats except for hp and mp. And from that I can tell you I have seen two level 55's same (everything), and one has 1600hp and the other has 1400hp. And the 1400hp guy also has less mp too.

    Only way I was able to tell is when one guildie was able to oneshot another while clearly it should have been the other way around.
    Could you ask those guys for screenshots ? Both guys naked, no crystals, no costumes on. So we can start talking about facts. I can provide for level 52 wizard if anyone else got it.
    I already left game/guild. We were in discord when it happened, I don't remember the exact amount, but it was a 200hp difference. Here is some sample data from another source so you can see the difference...


    I Quit.

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/436845/page/1 -> http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/436845/what-killed-mmorpgs-for-you/p1

    http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2316034
    .............
    Retired Gamer: all MMORPG's have been destroyed by big business, marketing of false promises, unprofessional game makers, and a generation of "I WIN and GIVE ME NOW" (brought to you by pokeman).

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 34,368
    edited April 2016
    Vardahoth said:
    Kyleran said:
    Shaigh said:
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out.

    While you won't notice that much difference between the 90% close to the average values you will have a significant difference between the 5% that got lucky compared to the 5% of the unlucky. It gets even more obvious for 1% and with 0.1% you get very extreme results.

    Given that their plan is for black desert to sell 1M copies in the west this means that 5% is 50k players, 1% is 10k players, 0.1% is 1k players.
    Statistically speaking I wonder what the odds are of someone getting 55 maximum gain (or loss ) rolls in both HP and MP?

    Unless the RNG is bugged my guess is almost near zero, probably have better luck flipping a coin, letting it hit the floor, and have it come to rest on its edge.

    Regardless I'm positive it won't be anywhere near 5 or 10%

    Over the long haul it will most likely balance itself out, but even if it didn't the odds of running into your perfect twin in terms of gear, levels, skill, numbers and in a PVP situation are equally slim.

    FInal analysis, you are not likely to ever run into a situation where it occurs or even matters, and even if it does, you'll never know.

    The CM said something about rolling a 20 every level. The community isn't sure if that means 20 hp. But someone is working on gathering data:

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/18YB-Ykh4UEOp7uh6eCR8xnK9ZfJJTsaE69snfGKhZBc/edit#gid=291962526
    Let's try a fun experiment.

    Get yourself 3 colors of socks, black, white and gray.

    Assume White equals the top end of the rolls, maybe 16-20, Black the bottom end, 0-5, and the gray 6-15

    Now, put 1 White/Black sock in a bag, along with 2 gray ones, mix them all together and with your eyes closed pull one sock out of the bag and record the results.  So you have a 1/4 chance of a great or terrible outcome, and a 2/4 chance you will get something "average"

    Now, repeat the experiment 10 times, recording the results, and if you are a die hard, do it 55 times to simulate the leveling process.

    Let me know how many iterations it will take you to pull 55 White socks in a row?  55 Black ones?  Bet it won't ever happen in your lifetime, unless you cheat somehow.

    Likely you will have a greater number of gray socks, with a scattering of Black and White socks that largely equal themselves out.  The only real variance will be how many more of one vs the either you have.

    Sure, you can take this model to extreme, get yourself 20 unique items (if the spread is that large) and again, repeat and see how often you pull each one.  Still guessing you'll never pull the 20 (or 1) marble 55 times in a row, no matter how many iterations you try.

    If someone actually manages to do either, they are likely to be a true purple squirrel, one of the few, if not only ones in the game...unless of course, the RNG counter is influenced by other factors, like perhaps say, how much you spend in the cash shop.  :p






    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing POE at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

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  • VardahothVardahoth Member RarePosts: 1,472
    edited April 2016
    Kyleran said:
    Vardahoth said:
    Kyleran said:
    Shaigh said:
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out.

    While you won't notice that much difference between the 90% close to the average values you will have a significant difference between the 5% that got lucky compared to the 5% of the unlucky. It gets even more obvious for 1% and with 0.1% you get very extreme results.

    Given that their plan is for black desert to sell 1M copies in the west this means that 5% is 50k players, 1% is 10k players, 0.1% is 1k players.
    Statistically speaking I wonder what the odds are of someone getting 55 maximum gain (or loss ) rolls in both HP and MP?

    Unless the RNG is bugged my guess is almost near zero, probably have better luck flipping a coin, letting it hit the floor, and have it come to rest on its edge.

    Regardless I'm positive it won't be anywhere near 5 or 10%

    Over the long haul it will most likely balance itself out, but even if it didn't the odds of running into your perfect twin in terms of gear, levels, skill, numbers and in a PVP situation are equally slim.

    FInal analysis, you are not likely to ever run into a situation where it occurs or even matters, and even if it does, you'll never know.

    The CM said something about rolling a 20 every level. The community isn't sure if that means 20 hp. But someone is working on gathering data:

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/18YB-Ykh4UEOp7uh6eCR8xnK9ZfJJTsaE69snfGKhZBc/edit#gid=291962526

    If someone actually manages to do either, they are likely to be a true purple squirrel, one of the few, if not only ones in the game...unless of course, the RNG counter is influenced by other factors, like perhaps say, how much you spend in the cash shop.  :p


    I've already explained before why I don't do rng (and why i stay away from games with forced perma rng):



    As for BDO, I bought a +11, and 65 black stones to enchant with. 59 failed before going to +12. I won't play a game with forced rng period, it's not for me. I've never been lucky with rng and that is why I stay away from casino's. I would be the guy who pulls nothing but grey socks 55 times. So yes, I am that purple squirrel.

    I Quit.

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/436845/page/1 -> http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/436845/what-killed-mmorpgs-for-you/p1

    http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2316034
    .............
    Retired Gamer: all MMORPG's have been destroyed by big business, marketing of false promises, unprofessional game makers, and a generation of "I WIN and GIVE ME NOW" (brought to you by pokeman).

  • fs23otmfs23otm Member UncommonPosts: 503
    edited April 2016
    Vardahoth said:

    As for BDO, I bought a +11, and 65 black stones to enchant with. 59 failed before going to +12. I won't play a game with forced rng period, it's not for me. I've never been lucky with rng and that is why I stay away from casino's. I would be the guy who pulls nothing but grey socks 55 times. So yes, I am that purple squirrel.
     Well you are either A ) lying or B ) lack any intellegence...

     If you are talking a +11 weapon.... depending on weapon can be 5-8 million...

     65 weapon stones... at a low end 350k ... would be 22.75 million... you could of bought a +15 for that

     If you are talking armor... +11 depends on piece but still in the 5-7 mil range...

     65 armor stones at 250k ... is 16.75 million... you still could of bought a +15 piece...

     So like I said... either a liar or a fool 
  • VardahothVardahoth Member RarePosts: 1,472
    edited April 2016
    fs23otm said:
    Vardahoth said:

    As for BDO, I bought a +11, and 65 black stones to enchant with. 59 failed before going to +12. I won't play a game with forced rng period, it's not for me. I've never been lucky with rng and that is why I stay away from casino's. I would be the guy who pulls nothing but grey socks 55 times. So yes, I am that purple squirrel.
     Well you are either A ) lying or B ) lack any intellegence...

     If you are talking a +11 weapon.... depending on weapon can be 5-8 million...

     65 weapon stones... at a low end 350k ... would be 22.75 million... you could of bought a +15 for that

     If you are talking armor... +11 depends on piece but still in the 5-7 mil range...

     65 armor stones at 250k ... is 16.75 million... you still could of bought a +15 piece...

     So like I said... either a liar or a fool 
    I didn't buy the stones all at once, I saved them incrementally (before using them), because I knew it would take a lot for me to succeed. I actually only probably bought around 20-30, rest was all found from killing monsters over a period of 3 weeks.

    BTW, the +15 weapons were 38mil last I checked.

    And making money in this game isn't hard. I know guildies who were making 7mil a day just from raising sunflowers and trading (not even including the money they made from fishing at the same time).

    I Quit.

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/436845/page/1 -> http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/436845/what-killed-mmorpgs-for-you/p1

    http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2316034
    .............
    Retired Gamer: all MMORPG's have been destroyed by big business, marketing of false promises, unprofessional game makers, and a generation of "I WIN and GIVE ME NOW" (brought to you by pokeman).

  • fs23otmfs23otm Member UncommonPosts: 503
    Vardahoth said:
    fs23otm said:
    Vardahoth said:

    As for BDO, I bought a +11, and 65 black stones to enchant with. 59 failed before going to +12. I won't play a game with forced rng period, it's not for me. I've never been lucky with rng and that is why I stay away from casino's. I would be the guy who pulls nothing but grey socks 55 times. So yes, I am that purple squirrel.
     Well you are either A ) lying or B ) lack any intellegence...

     If you are talking a +11 weapon.... depending on weapon can be 5-8 million...

     65 weapon stones... at a low end 350k ... would be 22.75 million... you could of bought a +15 for that

     If you are talking armor... +11 depends on piece but still in the 5-7 mil range...

     65 armor stones at 250k ... is 16.75 million... you still could of bought a +15 piece...

     So like I said... either a liar or a fool 
    I didn't buy the stones all at once, I saved them incrementally (before using them), because I knew it would take a lot for me to succeed. I actually only probably bought around 20-30, rest was all found from killing monsters over a period of 3 weeks.

    BTW, the +15 weapons were 38mil last I checked.

    And making money in this game isn't hard. I know guildies who were making 7mil a day just from raising sunflowers and trading (not even including the money they made from fishing at the same time).
     Nope... +15 weapons go from 24 mil - 31 mil ....

    Also you said you bought a +11 and 65 stones... 
  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,060
    edited April 2016
    fs23otm said:

     So like I said... either a liar or a fool 
    Considering the poster's history, I vote for option number one.
    Just the 59 stones story is fairy tale.
    "The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn in Star Wars.
    After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that nor does the ability to write.
    CPU: Core I7 9700k (4.90ghz) - GPU: Gigabyte GTX 980 Ti G1 Gaming - RAM: 16GB Kingston HyperX Savage DDR4 3000 - Motherboard: Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Ultra - PSU: Antec TruePower New 750W - Storage: Kingston KC1000 NVMe 960gb SSD and 2x1TB WD Velociraptor HDDs (Raid 0) - Main display: Philips 40PUK6809 4K 3D TV - Second display: Philips 273v 27" gaming monitor - VR: Pimax 8K headset and Razer Hydra controllers - Soundcard: Sony STR-DH550 AV Receiver HDMI linked with the GPU and the TV, with Jamo S 426 HS 3 5.0 speakers and Pioneer S-21W subwoofer - OS: Windows 10 Pro 64 bits.

  • TillerTiller Member EpicPosts: 8,154
    Vardahoth said:
    fs23otm said:
    Vardahoth said:

    As for BDO, I bought a +11, and 65 black stones to enchant with. 59 failed before going to +12. I won't play a game with forced rng period, it's not for me. I've never been lucky with rng and that is why I stay away from casino's. I would be the guy who pulls nothing but grey socks 55 times. So yes, I am that purple squirrel.
     Well you are either A ) lying or B ) lack any intellegence...

     If you are talking a +11 weapon.... depending on weapon can be 5-8 million...

     65 weapon stones... at a low end 350k ... would be 22.75 million... you could of bought a +15 for that

     If you are talking armor... +11 depends on piece but still in the 5-7 mil range...

     65 armor stones at 250k ... is 16.75 million... you still could of bought a +15 piece...

     So like I said... either a liar or a fool 
    I didn't buy the stones all at once, I saved them incrementally (before using them), because I knew it would take a lot for me to succeed. I actually only probably bought around 20-30, rest was all found from killing monsters over a period of 3 weeks.

    BTW, the +15 weapons were 38mil last I checked.

    And making money in this game isn't hard. I know guildies who were making 7mil a day just from raising sunflowers and trading (not even including the money they made from fishing at the same time).
    The market is over saturated with sunflowers and carrots; at this point it takes a few days to sell them off even at lowest price.


  • odinthor021odinthor021 Member UncommonPosts: 40
    After all these statistics you do realize that the characters astrological sign figures into the equation.
    If you are playing Black Desert for end game then you are playing for the wrong reason.
    Why not enjoy it for the adventure it was meant to be. Seek out the Vagabond on the mountain tops and the story of Black Desert will be revealed to you.
  • GestankfaustGestankfaust Member UncommonPosts: 1,989
    After all these statistics you do realize that the characters astrological sign figures into the equation.
    If you are playing Black Desert for end game then you are playing for the wrong reason.
    Why not enjoy it for the adventure it was meant to be. Seek out the Vagabond on the mountain tops and the story of Black Desert will be revealed to you.
    You mean.....take your time and see the world for what it is? Not dash to the end?

    You speak heresy!

    "This may hurt a little, but it's something you'll get used to. Relax....."

  • laseritlaserit Member LegendaryPosts: 6,157
    After all these statistics you do realize that the characters astrological sign figures into the equation.
    If you are playing Black Desert for end game then you are playing for the wrong reason.
    Why not enjoy it for the adventure it was meant to be. Seek out the Vagabond on the mountain tops and the story of Black Desert will be revealed to you.
    This makes no sense for a Min-Max-er

    It is not logical.

    Live long and Prosper

    "Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee

  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 13,082
    fs23otm said:

     So like I said... either a liar or a fool 
    Considering the poster's history, I vote for option number one.
    Just the 59 stones story is fairy tale.
    I don't think it's an either or kind of thing.
    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED
  • Tiamat64Tiamat64 Member RarePosts: 1,526
    Vardahoth said:

    Only way I was able to tell is when one guildie was able to oneshot another while clearly it should have been the other way around.
    One shot because of a difference of 200hp, 1400 vs 1600?



    The 200hp were most likely part of a massive gear difference that caused the one shooting. If that one shooting ever happened, of course.
    Well, if one person does 1,400 damage in one hit, it would one-shot the 1,400 HP guy but not the 1,600 HP guy.

    I can think of tons of times in many MMOs (and games in general, really) were I survived with only 5% of my health, giving me the chance to recuperate and pull off a win.  Certainly I wouldn't call it a common occurrence, but it's far from unheard of.
  • scorpex-xscorpex-x Member RarePosts: 1,030
    Vardahoth said:
    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/74624-20-horse-exp-on-the-new-costume/&page=7
    Game is now confirmed pay to win

    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/43010-hp-per-level-seems-to-be-random/
    perma forced rng on your character stats upon level up, dumbest design I have ever heard for an open world mmorpg competitive pvp game.
    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/73595-voting-forced-perma-rng-in-stat-increase-upon-level/&page=2

    Game has only been out for a few months. That didn't take long.

    Next!
    There is no next, well maybe Bless but you'll hate that too.  Then there will be nothing next.
  • Tiamat64Tiamat64 Member RarePosts: 1,526
    Kyleran said:
    Vardahoth said:
    Kyleran said:

    Let's try a fun experiment.

    Get yourself 3 colors of socks, black, white and gray.

    Assume White equals the top end of the rolls, maybe 16-20, Black the bottom end, 0-5, and the gray 6-15

    Now, put 1 White/Black sock in a bag, along with 2 gray ones, mix them all together and with your eyes closed pull one sock out of the bag and record the results.  So you have a 1/4 chance of a great or terrible outcome, and a 2/4 chance you will get something "average"

    Now, repeat the experiment 10 times, recording the results, and if you are a die hard, do it 55 times to simulate the leveling process.

    Let me know how many iterations it will take you to pull 55 White socks in a row?  55 Black ones?  Bet it won't ever happen in your lifetime, unless you cheat somehow.

    Likely you will have a greater number of gray socks, with a scattering of Black and White socks that largely equal themselves out.  The only real variance will be how many more of one vs the either you have.

    Sure, you can take this model to extreme, get yourself 20 unique items (if the spread is that large) and again, repeat and see how often you pull each one.  Still guessing you'll never pull the 20 (or 1) marble 55 times in a row, no matter how many iterations you try.

    If someone actually manages to do either, they are likely to be a true purple squirrel, one of the few, if not only ones in the game...unless of course, the RNG counter is influenced by other factors, like perhaps say, how much you spend in the cash shop.  :p


    Black Desert has like, 400k players (well, sold 400k copies.  Probably 100k-200k players given typical MMO retention rates)

    That's a lot of sock rolls.
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 13,082
    Shaigh said:
     Random numbers don't average out, if they do your random function is bugged and not actually random. However, the more times you do them, the closer they will be to the average. You will still have a variation and its among that variation that you find power differences.

    While its extremely unlikely that you will find someone that gets max on all 50 rolls with your example you are bound to have results at 2.7 or 3.3, meaning 10% stronger than the average.
    Cool theory... except you're correct, it really isn't random.

    1. There is an identical base set + amount of HP/MP added each level.
    2. There is ALSO a bonus + amount added that is weighted and only semi random. 0 and +1 are common and each + higher than that becomes more rare with +5 being extremely rare.

    I assume I don't have to explain how that leads to even more clumping around a +1 average than what you would see with a truly random system clumping around +3 average.

    The only valid criticism of this system is that it's meaningless fluff for flavor only.


    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED
  • ShaighShaigh Member RarePosts: 2,010
    Kyleran said:
    Vardahoth said:
    Kyleran said:
    Shaigh said:
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out.

    While you won't notice that much difference between the 90% close to the average values you will have a significant difference between the 5% that got lucky compared to the 5% of the unlucky. It gets even more obvious for 1% and with 0.1% you get very extreme results.

    Given that their plan is for black desert to sell 1M copies in the west this means that 5% is 50k players, 1% is 10k players, 0.1% is 1k players.
    Statistically speaking I wonder what the odds are of someone getting 55 maximum gain (or loss ) rolls in both HP and MP?

    Unless the RNG is bugged my guess is almost near zero, probably have better luck flipping a coin, letting it hit the floor, and have it come to rest on its edge.

    Regardless I'm positive it won't be anywhere near 5 or 10%

    Over the long haul it will most likely balance itself out, but even if it didn't the odds of running into your perfect twin in terms of gear, levels, skill, numbers and in a PVP situation are equally slim.

    FInal analysis, you are not likely to ever run into a situation where it occurs or even matters, and even if it does, you'll never know.

    The CM said something about rolling a 20 every level. The community isn't sure if that means 20 hp. But someone is working on gathering data:

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/18YB-Ykh4UEOp7uh6eCR8xnK9ZfJJTsaE69snfGKhZBc/edit#gid=291962526
    Let's try a fun experiment.

    Get yourself 3 colors of socks, black, white and gray.

    Assume White equals the top end of the rolls, maybe 16-20, Black the bottom end, 0-5, and the gray 6-15

    Now, put 1 White/Black sock in a bag, along with 2 gray ones, mix them all together and with your eyes closed pull one sock out of the bag and record the results.  So you have a 1/4 chance of a great or terrible outcome, and a 2/4 chance you will get something "average"

    Now, repeat the experiment 10 times, recording the results, and if you are a die hard, do it 55 times to simulate the leveling process.

    Let me know how many iterations it will take you to pull 55 White socks in a row?  55 Black ones?  Bet it won't ever happen in your lifetime, unless you cheat somehow.

    Likely you will have a greater number of gray socks, with a scattering of Black and White socks that largely equal themselves out.  The only real variance will be how many more of one vs the either you have.

    Sure, you can take this model to extreme, get yourself 20 unique items (if the spread is that large) and again, repeat and see how often you pull each one.  Still guessing you'll never pull the 20 (or 1) marble 55 times in a row, no matter how many iterations you try.

    If someone actually manages to do either, they are likely to be a true purple squirrel, one of the few, if not only ones in the game...unless of course, the RNG counter is influenced by other factors, like perhaps say, how much you spend in the cash shop.  :p
    While getting max results will be unheard of you don't need max results, you only need 10% more to have a significant advantage.

    If we go by the lazy way of saying white is 3 (average of 1-5), grey is 10.5 and black is 18 and go 10 times you find yourself at an average at 105. Rolling a white and a black evens out at 10.5. To get a significant advantage (above 116) you would have to roll 2 more blacks than white. If we go for 50 rolls, average is 525, significant advantage is 577.5 and for that to happen you need 7 more blacks than white.

    With that said, if you look for fair competitive gaming you shouldn't be playing a korean mmorpg to begin with.
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  • ceratop001ceratop001 Member RarePosts: 1,588
    laserit said:
    After all these statistics you do realize that the characters astrological sign figures into the equation.
    If you are playing Black Desert for end game then you are playing for the wrong reason.
    Why not enjoy it for the adventure it was meant to be. Seek out the Vagabond on the mountain tops and the story of Black Desert will be revealed to you.
    This makes no sense for a Min-Max-er

    It is not logical.

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  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,060
    Shaigh said:
    Shaigh said:
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out.
    Seriously?
    Missed that math class?
    If you add a random number between 1 and 5 each levels, the more levels you will have, the less difference between the characters there will be, and the sum added will at the end tend to the average between 1 and 5 which is 3.
    Unless, of course, your random function is bugged and isn't really random, which would result in the values not being evenly distributed.
    There's a difference between average and distribution. Random numbers don't average out, if they do your random function is bugged and not actually random. However, the more times you do them, the closer they will be to the average. You will still have a variation and its among that variation that you find power differences.

    While its extremely unlikely that you will find someone that gets max on all 50 rolls with your example you are bound to have results at 2.7 or 3.3, meaning 10% stronger than the average.
    Pretty much what I've said, with different words. Arguing for the sake of arguing ?
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  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 13,082
    Shaigh said:

    While getting max results will be unheard of you don't need max results, you only need 10% more to have a significant advantage.

    If we go by the lazy way of saying white is 3 (average of 1-5), grey is 10.5 and black is 18 and go 10 times you find yourself at an average at 105. Rolling a white and a black evens out at 10.5. To get a significant advantage (above 116) you would have to roll 2 more blacks than white. If we go for 50 rolls, average is 525, significant advantage is 577.5 and for that to happen you need 7 more blacks than white.

    With that said, if you look for fair competitive gaming you shouldn't be playing a korean mmorpg to begin with.
    10% of what? Of the 20% potential maximum difference since only that portion of the total HP pool is subject to the bonus roll? That would make it a 2% max difference if it was truly random with a roll of 0 and a roll of 5 having an equal chance... and they don't.

    And... "fair competitive" in something that is not an e-sport MOBA? Lol. Care to tell us about that 100% fair and balanced Western MMORPG? And yeah it's a trick question because as soon as you name one someone will link to some of the ubiquitous "X needs a buff... nerf Y" threads about it.
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  • PottedPlant22PottedPlant22 Member RarePosts: 800
    After all these statistics you do realize that the characters astrological sign figures into the equation.
    If you are playing Black Desert for end game then you are playing for the wrong reason.
    Why not enjoy it for the adventure it was meant to be. Seek out the Vagabond on the mountain tops and the story of Black Desert will be revealed to you.
    You mean.....take your time and see the world for what it is? Not dash to the end?

    You speak heresy!
    Nah.  Some people need a website that tells them everything they will get before they play the game to make sure they are exactly like everyone else.  They NEED to be exactly like everyone else.  They have to be.  If it's one point off and they don't have as much, the world is over.  Which is why my constant reminder to those players is that this is not a MOBA.  They don't even think or factor in RPG of the MMORPG as something that could impact variances.  
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