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Only took a few things to kill this game

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  • GorweGorwe Member EpicPosts: 6,307
    maple2 said:
    Vardahoth said:
    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/74624-20-horse-exp-on-the-new-costume/&page=7
    Game is now confirmed pay to win

    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/43010-hp-per-level-seems-to-be-random/
    perma forced rng on your character stats upon level up, dumbest design I have ever heard for an open world mmorpg competitive pvp game.
    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/73595-voting-forced-perma-rng-in-stat-increase-upon-level/&page=2

    Game has only been out for a few months. That didn't take long.

    Next!
    sorry but i have to laugh at you..

    exp for horse isnt P2W lol.. how dumb can u be? u dont gain anything by leveling a horse..

    so what if the stats are RNG? just be a better player since 100 hp doesnt make any difference.

    the game isnt even close to dead its still full in the weekdays and weekends.

    the game is awesome and has alot of things you can do and even more coming soon.

    new classes already.

    so just get your really annoying and stupid mentallity out of here
    100HP isn't a difference?

    That's simply not true. Everyone who ever played a MOBA on any level higher than Gold(top 5%) knows that it's this precise mechanic that causes huge imbalances. Yes, it does keep game fresh and whatnot, but it does add a huge imbalance as well. Simply put, if 2 equal solo tops(say in a blind pick) like Garen vs Garen went one vs another and one had 100hp more...which one do you think would win? Given ~ skill levels of players present.

    These small increments don't seem like a difference, but trust me, they are the worst kind of imbalance: capillary imbalance or in other, more familiar words: POWER CREEP. The more you know.
  • DeltoisDeltois Member UncommonPosts: 384
    edited April 2016
    How can an even small amount of HP gain , in a pvp game not matter. Of course it does.
  • DKLondDKLond Member RarePosts: 2,231
    Excession said:
    DKLond said:
    It only took people waking up ;)
    If only the same could be said for a certain game someone white knights for......
    You mean the game you want to kill before it's released?

    Interesting agenda. Is that black knighting? ;)
  • SwampDragonsSwampDragons Member UncommonPosts: 349
    Rng on stats increase on lvls made me laugh hard :D Most stupid thing I heard.
  • ExcessionExcession Member RarePosts: 709
    edited April 2016
    DKLond said:
    Excession said:
    DKLond said:
    It only took people waking up ;)
    If only the same could be said for a certain game someone white knights for......
    You mean the game you want to kill before it's released?

    Interesting agenda. Is that black knighting? ;)
    Where have I said I want to kill the game? 

    When did I say that was my agenda?

    Oh yea, that's right, I did not.
    Gorwe said:
    100HP isn't a difference?

    That's simply not true. Everyone who ever played a MOBA on any level higher than Gold(top 5%) knows that it's this precise mechanic that causes huge imbalances. Yes, it does keep game fresh and whatnot, but it does add a huge imbalance as well. Simply put, if 2 equal solo tops(say in a blind pick) like Garen vs Garen went one vs another and one had 100hp more...which one do you think would win? Given ~ skill levels of players present.

    These small increments don't seem like a difference, but trust me, they are the worst kind of imbalance: capillary imbalance or in other, more familiar words: POWER CREEP. The more you know.
    100 HP difference when you are level 50+ in BDO is nothing, definitely not the "huge imbalance" you claim it to be.

    A creative person is motivated by the desire to achieve, not the desire to beat others.

  • DKLondDKLond Member RarePosts: 2,231
    You didn't have to say more than you did ;)

    Anyway, off-topic.
  • fed79fed79 Member UncommonPosts: 31
    Rusque said:
    What happened? I thought this game was the best game ever because you could fish and craft and not even bother doing anything in the game? So what are you saying? AFK fishing isn't fun a month later? Sending workers to gather mats for your isn't holding your interest? Come on, that's masterpiece quality right there. You can even breed horses! Like, how is that not the best thing ever month after month? You can't possibly be tired of it, no way.

    Game can't be p2w because there's nothing to win. What are you going to win? A grinding spot? More horses? AFK fishing spot? Best game ever is best game ever. Confirmed.
    Lol dude, best post ever on these forums.  Slowly the players start waking up haha
  • fs23otmfs23otm Member UncommonPosts: 503
    BOO HOO, OP!

    Good riddance... I say...

  • Viper482Viper482 Member EpicPosts: 2,786
    Vardahoth said:
    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/74624-20-horse-exp-on-the-new-costume/&page=7
    Game is now confirmed pay to win

    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/43010-hp-per-level-seems-to-be-random/
    perma forced rng on your character stats upon level up, dumbest design I have ever heard for an open world mmorpg competitive pvp game.
    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/73595-voting-forced-perma-rng-in-stat-increase-upon-level/&page=2

    Game has only been out for a few months. That didn't take long.

    Next!
    What?! The game is dead?! Omg!! Why didn't anyone tell me!? I'm going to log on right now and check this out, I call BS.
    Make MMORPG's Great Again!
  • BurntCabbageBurntCabbage Member UncommonPosts: 482
    either ppl havent really gotten into the pvp or are null to the fact that this game is hidden behind a huge paywall..this is just another "pretty" Korean mmorpg grind fest with a paywall..the combat and combo system is horrifying ..we will see how great it is in a couple of months..glad i only spent  30$ ...common CU i cant wait any longer!
  • pantheronpantheron Member UncommonPosts: 256
    either ppl havent really gotten into the pvp or are null to the fact that this game is hidden behind a huge paywall..this is just another "pretty" Korean mmorpg grind fest with a paywall..the combat and combo system is horrifying ..we will see how great it is in a couple of months..glad i only spent  30$ ...common CU i cant wait any longer!
    Whats the huge paywall? what all did you think you had to buy to play and enjoy the game? 

    I play MMOs for the Forum PVP

  • MardukkMardukk Member RarePosts: 2,213
    edited April 2016
    alakram said:
    the lack of variety in the appearance of the equipment did it for me. It's a pity the game has so much potential is fun.
    Man good luck to OP and this quoted poster.  You guys are going to be looking for an MMO to play for a very long time.  Sometimes you have to take the good with the bad and the good in this game far outweighs the bad.
  • Azaron_NightbladeAzaron_Nightblade Member EpicPosts: 4,740
    Gorwe said:
    maple2 said:
    Vardahoth said:
    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/74624-20-horse-exp-on-the-new-costume/&page=7
    Game is now confirmed pay to win

    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/43010-hp-per-level-seems-to-be-random/
    perma forced rng on your character stats upon level up, dumbest design I have ever heard for an open world mmorpg competitive pvp game.
    http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/73595-voting-forced-perma-rng-in-stat-increase-upon-level/&page=2

    Game has only been out for a few months. That didn't take long.

    Next!
    sorry but i have to laugh at you..

    exp for horse isnt P2W lol.. how dumb can u be? u dont gain anything by leveling a horse..

    so what if the stats are RNG? just be a better player since 100 hp doesnt make any difference.

    the game isnt even close to dead its still full in the weekdays and weekends.

    the game is awesome and has alot of things you can do and even more coming soon.

    new classes already.

    so just get your really annoying and stupid mentallity out of here
    100HP isn't a difference?

    That's simply not true. Everyone who ever played a MOBA on any level higher than Gold(top 5%) knows that it's this precise mechanic that causes huge imbalances. Yes, it does keep game fresh and whatnot, but it does add a huge imbalance as well. Simply put, if 2 equal solo tops(say in a blind pick) like Garen vs Garen went one vs another and one had 100hp more...which one do you think would win? Given ~ skill levels of players present.

    These small increments don't seem like a difference, but trust me, they are the worst kind of imbalance: capillary imbalance or in other, more familiar words: POWER CREEP. The more you know.
    I'm not a fan of the random numbers... but... as I said on another thread, there's no guarantee that the person getting lucky with the HP is even going to -be- one of the PvPers. The biggest carebear could end up being the server's HP monster. xD

    I'll admit that if I was actually playing for the PvP, I'd likely be even more annoyed by it... but... I'm not bothering with that aspect of the game. To be competitive, I'd have to mindlessly farm 24/7, and the mere thought of that makes me want to puke. On any game, not just BDO.

    On top of that, the game is set up in such a way that you will -never- catch up to the most hardcore players (unless they quit). So why even bother? I'll focus on playing it the way -I- enjoy it.

    My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)

    https://www.ashesofcreation.com/ref/Callaron/

  • spikers14spikers14 Member UncommonPosts: 531
    The game is far from dead, but OP is apparently distraught. 
  • VardahothVardahoth Member RarePosts: 1,472
    Bad.dog said:
    From your experience in game can you tell me the difference between good stat and poor stat rng increases ...What type of % difference are we looking at ?
    The game doesn't even let you know your stats except for hp and mp. And from that I can tell you I have seen two level 55's same (everything), and one has 1600hp and the other has 1400hp. And the 1400hp guy also has less mp too.

    Only way I was able to tell is when one guildie was able to oneshot another while clearly it should have been the other way around.

    I Quit.

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/436845/page/1 -> http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/436845/what-killed-mmorpgs-for-you/p1

    http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2316034
    .............
    Retired Gamer: all MMORPG's have been destroyed by big business, marketing of false promises, unprofessional game makers, and a generation of "I WIN and GIVE ME NOW" (brought to you by pokeman).

  • VardahothVardahoth Member RarePosts: 1,472

    Kane72 said:
    RNG means no two characters are the same.  Guess what, so two people are the same either.  More realistic.
    Right, because video games should be like real life. It's not like some of us don't play games to get away from real life and have some fun.

    I Quit.

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/436845/page/1 -> http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/436845/what-killed-mmorpgs-for-you/p1

    http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2316034
    .............
    Retired Gamer: all MMORPG's have been destroyed by big business, marketing of false promises, unprofessional game makers, and a generation of "I WIN and GIVE ME NOW" (brought to you by pokeman).

  • VardahothVardahoth Member RarePosts: 1,472
    Rng on stats increase on lvls made me laugh hard :D Most stupid thing I heard.
    It's even dumber that so many people white-knight it.

    I Quit.

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/436845/page/1 -> http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/436845/what-killed-mmorpgs-for-you/p1

    http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2316034
    .............
    Retired Gamer: all MMORPG's have been destroyed by big business, marketing of false promises, unprofessional game makers, and a generation of "I WIN and GIVE ME NOW" (brought to you by pokeman).

  • VardahothVardahoth Member RarePosts: 1,472

    Mardukk said:
    alakram said:
    the lack of variety in the appearance of the equipment did it for me. It's a pity the game has so much potential is fun.
    Man good luck to OP and this quoted poster.  You guys are going to be looking for an MMO to play for a very long time.  Sometimes you have to take the good with the bad and the good in this game far outweighs the bad.
    I've been waiting 10 years for an mmorpg. I don't mind waiting longer. I would rather spend my time on something I enjoy than crap.

    I Quit.

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/436845/page/1 -> http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/436845/what-killed-mmorpgs-for-you/p1

    http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2316034
    .............
    Retired Gamer: all MMORPG's have been destroyed by big business, marketing of false promises, unprofessional game makers, and a generation of "I WIN and GIVE ME NOW" (brought to you by pokeman).

  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,064
    edited April 2016
    Vardahoth said:

    Only way I was able to tell is when one guildie was able to oneshot another while clearly it should have been the other way around.
    One shot because of a difference of 200hp, 1400 vs 1600?



    The 200hp were most likely part of a massive gear difference that caused the one shooting. If that one shooting ever happened, of course.
    "The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn in Star Wars.
    After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that nor does the ability to write.
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  • ShaighShaigh Member RarePosts: 2,012
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out.

    While you won't notice that much difference between the 90% close to the average values you will have a significant difference between the 5% that got lucky compared to the 5% of the unlucky. It gets even more obvious for 1% and with 0.1% you get very extreme results.

    Given that their plan is for black desert to sell 1M copies in the west this means that 5% is 50k players, 1% is 10k players, 0.1% is 1k players.
    The cynic knows the price of everything and the value of nothing.
  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,064
    Shaigh said:
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out.
    Seriously?
    Missed that math class?
    If you add a random number between 1 and 5 each levels, the more levels you will have, the less difference between the characters there will be, and the sum added will at the end tend to the average between 1 and 5 which is 3.
    Unless, of course, your random function is bugged and isn't really random, which would result in the values not being evenly distributed.
    "The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn in Star Wars.
    After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that nor does the ability to write.
    CPU: Core I7 9700k (4.90ghz) - GPU: Gigabyte GTX 980 Ti G1 Gaming - RAM: 16GB Kingston HyperX Savage DDR4 3000 - Motherboard: Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Ultra - PSU: Antec TruePower New 750W - Storage: Kingston KC1000 NVMe 960gb SSD and 2x1TB WD Velociraptor HDDs (Raid 0) - Main display: Philips 40PUK6809 4K 3D TV - Second display: Philips 273v 27" gaming monitor - VR: Pimax 8K headset and Razer Hydra controllers - Soundcard: Sony STR-DH550 AV Receiver HDMI linked with the GPU and the TV, with Jamo S 426 HS 3 5.0 speakers and Pioneer S-21W subwoofer - OS: Windows 10 Pro 64 bits.

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 34,490
    Shaigh said:
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out.

    While you won't notice that much difference between the 90% close to the average values you will have a significant difference between the 5% that got lucky compared to the 5% of the unlucky. It gets even more obvious for 1% and with 0.1% you get very extreme results.

    Given that their plan is for black desert to sell 1M copies in the west this means that 5% is 50k players, 1% is 10k players, 0.1% is 1k players.
    Statistically speaking I wonder what the odds are of someone getting 55 maximum gain (or loss ) rolls in both HP and MP?

    Unless the RNG is bugged my guess is almost near zero, probably have better luck flipping a coin, letting it hit the floor, and have it come to rest on its edge.

    Regardless I'm positive it won't be anywhere near 5 or 10%

    Over the long haul it will most likely balance itself out, but even if it didn't the odds of running into your perfect twin in terms of gear, levels, skill, numbers and in a PVP situation are equally slim.

    FInal analysis, you are not likely to ever run into a situation where it occurs or even matters, and even if it does, you'll never know.

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

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    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing POE at the moment.

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  • josko9josko9 Member RarePosts: 577
    The game is already dying, but that has nothing to do with p2w. This game has much bigger problems with it's core design, something that can't be fixed anymore.
  • someforumguysomeforumguy Member RarePosts: 4,042
    edited April 2016
    Shaigh said:
    The random stat thing will even out over 50+ levels to the average value of the random function's minimum and maximum value. The end difference will be minimal.
    Random stats don't even out.
    Seriously?
    Missed that math class?
    If you add a random number between 1 and 5 each levels, the more levels you will have, the less difference between the characters there will be, and the sum added will at the end tend to the average between 1 and 5 which is 3.
    Unless, of course, your random function is bugged and isn't really random, which would result in the values not being evenly distributed.
    You confuse the average stats of all players combined and the actual stats of an individual player. 50ish levels are too few for what you think will happen. Because of the 100k's of players you will have enough players close to min stat gain to be really pissed if they like pvp. And a group to be close to max gain. And the more players you have, the larger the group (nominal, not relative) that will be close to maximum gain (and a group close to minimum gain ofc).

    But all this depends on how large the difference in stats can be. I agree with others, it is a silly mechanic, no matter how large the effect is. Your example of 1 to 5 each lvl would be very very bad with just 50ish levels.
  • linadragonlinadragon Member RarePosts: 581
    either ppl havent really gotten into the pvp or are null to the fact that this game is hidden behind a huge paywall..this is just another "pretty" Korean mmorpg grind fest with a paywall..the combat and combo system is horrifying ..we will see how great it is in a couple of months..glad i only spent  30$ ...common CU i cant wait any longer!
    There is no "pay wall" ohh yay an extra 100 stamina (half a dodge etc) and some extra exp... You can catch up just earning money in game. There is no pay wall just time investments...
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