back around 2004 or so

delete5230

Years ago, I loved mmos.

I started around 2004, so I can only use that time frame as a reference. I came about during the second wave, Vanilla WoW, CoH, and EQ2 days.  Sure, its controversial  of what was better the first wave EQ1, FF11, DAOC or even UO or the second wave.

But either way, Back around 2004 or so, the players of mmos only had one thing in mind,

" MMOs could only get better "..........Then you had, LOTRO, then you had Vanguard, early flop or not they tried to advance the mmo to the next level.

Would it have ever entered your mind that mmos would have taken a turn for the worst ?

Regress ?

Back years ago, we had many Asian grinders like 9 Dragons, they were laughable cash shop games.  No one ever played them unless you had nothing to do, or you were curious.  The Asian games were not really terrible, but they didn't fit into our culture.  Now it's the norm even......It's amazing what Western Marketing can do.

My first flop was Warhammer, I was floored that an mmo can flop, then AoC.  What's worst nothing else ever came out that was any good.  

IT JUST STOPPED !!

Thank God, will have Pantheon    

delete5230

For you that miss mmos

 I'm talking about MMOs, not single player cash shops, with scripted developers content.  That's a different topic all together !!

Golelorn

Yep, my brother and I were discussing this yesterday. 
Developers lost sight of what a MMO really was. A themepark on rails to get everyone to a raid stage portion of the game? Is that what made EQ great? Is that what made UO  or  DAoC great? No, to all them. It was player interaction.

Now, these games are all about getting that cash. Create a shallow game, that you can level up in. Restrict content, classes, inventory, looting capability, pets, mounts, etc, and put it all in a cash shop, so players will spend hundreds of dollars before they realize the game is shallow and lacks any sort of long term play.
I've been playing EQ for 17 years off and on.... How sad is it that a game hasn't come along to steal my attention longer than a month?

This genre is hurting, because of the all cash shops antics and lazy raid mentality. You can argue that all day long I'm wrong. But look how many games exist. Look at how empty these games are. People now expect a game to decline after its first month. It used to be games actually grew in player numbers. EQ, DAoC, WoW, even DDO made a huge comeback in 2009 only to fall on its face after it tried to turn itself into a raid game.

If players keep falling for the cash shop gimmick, and devs still think we are all looking to get max levl ASAP so we can raid and have zero community this genre will continue to be underwhelming. 

Distopia

As a person who started in '02, I feel the darkest period for MMOrpg's was mid 2004 to funnily enough when AOC released. Which was the first "themepark" MMO I could enjoy. Between AOC, TSW, ESO, SWTOR and even WAR (with it's PVP focus).. These were the only themeparks I felt were worth playing.

Wizardry

Back  starting with EQ1 then FFXI mmorpg's advanced greatly, leaps and bounds over previous work and this continued for a bit with EQ2 and Wow and Vanguard but then game creation just staggered and in the majority of cases is going backwards.
Not only are we going backwards,devs are also aiming for backwards budgets right to the point of building a game for FREE with OUR money.So there is no commitment or risk for developers,they are trying to sell us third rate game design not nearly good enough to be called second rate.

NOBODY is selling us triple A ,i don't care what anyone says.It takes WAY more effort,cost to turn a single player game into a fully fledged mmorpg ,instead devs are trying to sell us 1980/90s rpg's but with a login screen,thinking that login screen makes it a mmo...sigh.

Basically right now the industry is completely stagnant,even the highest technical game right now in the rpg series FFXV is still cutting corners in a lot of ways,so the very top end game is still B rated and not Triple  A.

mrrshann618

Golelorn said:

Developers lost sight of what a MMO really was. A themepark on rails to get everyone to a raid stage portion of the game? Is that what made EQ great? Is that what made UO  or  DAoC great? No, to all them. It was player interaction.

Now, these games are all about getting that cash.
*snip*

Developers have never lost sight or changed the end result. It has always been about the cash. What has changed is that the Developers no longer attempt to put in longevity or actual gameplay.

Everyone is on the search for the "best game ever" and will gladly plunk down hundreds of dollars to see if every release is that one thing they have been searching for. Sadly Developers and backers have figured this out. In order to produce the next "Wow Killer" they need to invest billions. Why invest billions when you can invest a measly million and get large instant returns thanks to the average content locust?

Investors do not want the 10 year 30% return when they can get a 2 year 60% return. (Yes I'm pulling hypothetical numbers out of a hat like Bullwinkle)

Have I played games that have flopped, sure I have. However Several of those flopped games were not due to player interest or population. Those games flopped due to the all mighty developer/publisher greed (I'm staring at you NcSoft)

Phaserlight

I've been playing a certain single MMORPG since '03 (alpha) that launched in '04.  Couldn't be happier.

Rather than expecting the genre to constantly come out with new games, I've been expecting (and satisfied) to watch the game I've chosen to continuously improve in a "kaizen" manner.

Letsinod

delete5230 said:

Years ago, I loved mmos.

I started around 2004, so I can only use that time frame as a reference. I came about during the second wave, Vanilla WoW, CoH, and EQ2 days.  Sure, its controversial  of what was better the first wave EQ1, FF11, DAOC or even UO or the second wave.

But either way, Back around 2004 or so, the players of mmos only had one thing in mind,

" MMOs could only get better "..........Then you had, LOTRO, then you had Vanguard, early flop or not they tried to advance the mmo to the next level.

Would it have ever entered your mind that mmos would have taken a turn for the worst ?

Regress ?

Back years ago, we had many Asian grinders like 9 Dragons, they were laughable cash shop games.  No one ever played them unless you had nothing to do, or you were curious.  The Asian games were not really terrible, but they didn't fit into our culture.  Now it's the norm even......It's amazing what Western Marketing can do.

My first flop was Warhammer, I was floored that an mmo can flop, then AoC.  What's worst nothing else ever came out that was any good.  

IT JUST STOPPED !!

Thank God, will have Pantheon    

How exactly did Vanguard advance MMO's to the next level?  The game changed 180 degrees from the original plan.  I know, I was in the earliest betas.  If you are seriously believing that Pantheon is some saving grace you are in for a massive let down.  You sound like you have been let down many times and I have no doubt you will again.  If you are truly looking for a good group game then I suggest you start following Saga of Lucimia.

fodell54

delete5230 said:

Years ago, I loved mmos.

I started around 2004, so I can only use that time frame as a reference. I came about during the second wave, Vanilla WoW, CoH, and EQ2 days.  Sure, its controversial  of what was better the first wave EQ1, FF11, DAOC or even UO or the second wave.

But either way, Back around 2004 or so, the players of mmos only had one thing in mind,

" MMOs could only get better "..........Then you had, LOTRO, then you had Vanguard, early flop or not they tried to advance the mmo to the next level.

Would it have ever entered your mind that mmos would have taken a turn for the worst ?

Regress ?

Back years ago, we had many Asian grinders like 9 Dragons, they were laughable cash shop games.  No one ever played them unless you had nothing to do, or you were curious.  The Asian games were not really terrible, but they didn't fit into our culture.  Now it's the norm even......It's amazing what Western Marketing can do.

My first flop was Warhammer, I was floored that an mmo can flop, then AoC.  What's worst nothing else ever came out that was any good.  

IT JUST STOPPED !!

Thank God, will have Pantheon    

So you sat around playing game that you didn't enjoy for 9 years because nothing was "good." Alright.... Congrats I guess.