That's why you need to have someone with a strong will and isn't afraid to tell the boss they are making stupid decisions. Unfortunately it doesn't look like there is anyone like that to bring Chris into line
there might be tons of people telling him that but is he listening is the question.
Its a delicate balance but in general its good to have a PM with position to keep the creatives in line but not be to restrictive all at the same time. Being a PM for a creative project is an art.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
My guess is that most of the so-called "haters" dont hate the game and dont think Chris Roberts is doing this to scam anyone. I think many people feel that what Chris initially posted back in 2012 about transparency and every dollar going to game development went out the window when Chris realized how much money he was sitting on.
We are going to get a game, there is no scam. But the game we are going to get is YEARS behind what was promised. Instead of putting out the base game in 2014 and then adding modules like the original plan stated, we are now waiting until at least 2017 to get a playable version of the game that includes what was promised. We were told two years to make the game, a year in we were told stretch goals would NOT delay that plan and then once the "big" money started rolling in, it wall went to hell in a hand-basket.
I also think some people are disappointed that the game seems to be moving in a pay2win direction. Someone who dropped a few thousand bucks in a capital ship crewed with their friends will be unstoppable come the actual launch. To make matters worse, they wont care about losing their ship because they have free lifetime insurance so they can lose it over and over again without any care. Will the upgrades cost them to replace? Yes, but how much easier will it be for them to grind out cash in a mammoth capital ship?
At no point did I ever feel this was a scam but I do feel after looking at both sides that this project has been heavily mismanaged and I dont think the finished product will live up to expectations most people have for this project.
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
My guess is that most of the so-called "haters" dont hate the game and dont think Chris Roberts is doing this to scam anyone. I think many people feel that what Chris initially posted back in 2012 about transparency and every dollar going to game development went out the window when Chris realized how much money he was sitting on.
We are going to get a game, there is no scam. But the game we are going to get is YEARS behind what was promised. Instead of putting out the base game in 2014 and then adding modules like the original plan stated, we are now waiting until at least 2017 to get a playable version of the game that includes what was promised. We were told two years to make the game, a year in we were told stretch goals would NOT delay that plan and then once the "big" money started rolling in, it wall went to hell in a hand-basket.
I also think some people are disappointed that the game seems to be moving in a pay2win direction. Someone who dropped a few thousand bucks in a capital ship crewed with their friends will be unstoppable come the actual launch. To make matters worse, they wont care about losing their ship because they have free lifetime insurance so they can lose it over and over again without any care. Will the upgrades cost them to replace? Yes, but how much easier will it be for them to grind out cash in a mammoth capital ship?
At no point did I ever feel this was a scam but I do feel after looking at both sides that this project has been heavily mismanaged and I dont think the finished product will live up to expectations most people have for this project.
In fact, what you said is a scam anyway. What people fail to understand is that Star Citizen could be the best game ever... let's say, released in 2020... still... would or could be made in ways that people were scammed... like, they spending 100 million dollars and pocketing another 100, making it disappear. Or getting the people's money under several false premises (As you pointed wisely) and then disrespecting that premisse because others were ok that the premisse was disrespected.
For example. If I made a show and sell 10k tickets, but my place supports just 7k, 3k people will be unable to enter and enjoy the show... The majority enjoyed, but 3k were just conned. Should be fair to claim that is not a scam just because "the majority enjoyed and had an awesome show with 10/10 in the reviews"?
I hope you got my point, because legally, is that how it works.
Scam/consumer fraud is not simply getting your money and producing nothing
That been said. Star Citizen scammed people. Star Citizen... the project that people gave their money at the moment... in the end of the day, taking out the blablabla and advertising, puffery... is a "deal".
And everyone were scammed in this deal. No exception. Some just decided to accept because are convinced that its for the best or will argue that "knew". But some don't. But it does not change the fact that the deal, which is this relationship between company x consumer through a contract was bogus and people were scammed. You can accept a company conning people because you don't care. But you have no right to say that they are wrong, because the fact remains. The rest is puffery... excuses. It does not matter, because are subjective.
There is a major incentive to not releasing the game. So far, the money is pouring in like crazy for them. If they launch and the game fails, the money could stop in a matter of days.
Like I already said, delaying the release is intentional.
This one has a different subject but if you read through the 26 pages of the other thread you more or less have said the same thing. Was it really necessary to make another thread on the same shit? You didn't find the answer you were looking for or state your opinion enough within that 26 pages?
"Thus I take it on faith that he is just a little misguided on the projects scope and how to make it happen but he has honest intentions in trying to make it happen."
IF your wife come late and tell you that had to work until late, you will believe on her, despite the fact that you had make a call to the office and nobody was there, except someone who attended the call and said to you that everyone left, including your wife. It has been a similar scenario here with people hoping for the success of this game, categorizing themselves as fans, or neutral, it does not matter. It's a unparallel level of denial, despite all evidences.
Roberts purposefully lied to people in some occasions and tried to mislead the current public and even the press, while accusing the press of lying, about what he actually promised in the past to people. You know what I am talking about, since I proved this in another thread.
He purposefully changed the deal, unilaterally, without 100% of his backers, and then shielded himself behind a pool, voted by a minority of the public, and with votes saying No, which cannot be valid in the circumstances of a deal made with individuals. He deliberately lied to the press saying that "the backers wanted", ignoring those backers who said No and the contract/deal where he made a promise to deliver the full game on or before the estimate delivery date. It's not a matter of been late. He promised to show good faith on not been late and what he did, was ignore this promise and, in a shady, breaching the contract considering the nature of the deal, he made whatever, that was not part of the deal. At the same time, he wants to use the deal that he changed, disrespected, breach, to deny refunds. Like he can enforce rules while breaching others. A one-street road contract. This is not honesty. He is not a retard. A newbie. This is clearly an attitude of bad faith with the consumers who bought believing in his words. and promises and warranties.
He deliberately changed a clause in the TOS, with the sole purpose of denying refunds to people, when that was an warranty that he game, in contract, to people who pledged earlier. And he, then, obligates people to accept they quit of such warranty, if they want to play the game, at the same time that transforming that clause in a bait... that simply will be changed adding time, as it moves along.
These are examples of a man, a veteran of the game industry and movie industry, around 30 years as a professional with good part of that as a CEO of companies. And you claim that he is "misguided" and has "honest" intention. Poor Paladin of Honesty.
How can you claim that he has honest intentions when he is got lying, been deceptive both to press and people, at the same time that creating the most ridiculous theories, without nothing to back him up, to accuse press and others of lying?
You think that he has honest intentions, but you cant be sure, and the evidences shown the contrary. Someone with honest intentions does not lie in the face of people and press, regularly, while accusing them of lying without any evidence, just a ridiculous conspiracy theory. And showing an incredible party of contradictions in his statements, first saying that they shouldn't be employees, but Derek Smart, then saying that should be employees angry. Seriously.
This guy already proven again and again that his word has no value and he will do and say whatever is necessary to get your money. He does not care with public satisfaction. He now based his entire business on making baits to get whales, ignoring how bad will be the experience for the rest, the long wait, at the same time creating all kinds of incentives for whales and hampering, making it harder to anyone else to have fun, encouraging them to pay more and more, to risk more and more of their money, while showing no respect to his words and promises, and wasting money with a lot of embezzlment , fancy offices and stuff like that.
And please, do not pretend that I am saying that he is deceptive because he is late, because that is not what I am saying. If you interpreted in such way, again, please re-read 10 times what I wrote before replying.
I am sorry but as I read your post each new comma chipped away at your credibility until all that was left was the ravings of a lunatic fanboy turned hater.
Comments
Its a delicate balance but in general its good to have a PM with position to keep the creatives in line but not be to restrictive all at the same time. Being a PM for a creative project is an art.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
We are going to get a game, there is no scam. But the game we are going to get is YEARS behind what was promised. Instead of putting out the base game in 2014 and then adding modules like the original plan stated, we are now waiting until at least 2017 to get a playable version of the game that includes what was promised. We were told two years to make the game, a year in we were told stretch goals would NOT delay that plan and then once the "big" money started rolling in, it wall went to hell in a hand-basket.
I also think some people are disappointed that the game seems to be moving in a pay2win direction. Someone who dropped a few thousand bucks in a capital ship crewed with their friends will be unstoppable come the actual launch. To make matters worse, they wont care about losing their ship because they have free lifetime insurance so they can lose it over and over again without any care. Will the upgrades cost them to replace? Yes, but how much easier will it be for them to grind out cash in a mammoth capital ship?
At no point did I ever feel this was a scam but I do feel after looking at both sides that this project has been heavily mismanaged and I dont think the finished product will live up to expectations most people have for this project.
In fact, what you said is a scam anyway. What people fail to understand is that Star Citizen could be the best game ever... let's say, released in 2020... still... would or could be made in ways that people were scammed... like, they spending 100 million dollars and pocketing another 100, making it disappear. Or getting the people's money under several false premises (As you pointed wisely) and then disrespecting that premisse because others were ok that the premisse was disrespected.
For example. If I made a show and sell 10k tickets, but my place supports just 7k, 3k people will be unable to enter and enjoy the show... The majority enjoyed, but 3k were just conned. Should be fair to claim that is not a scam just because "the majority enjoyed and had an awesome show with 10/10 in the reviews"?
I hope you got my point, because legally, is that how it works.
Scam/consumer fraud is not simply getting your money and producing nothing
That been said. Star Citizen scammed people. Star Citizen... the project that people gave their money at the moment... in the end of the day, taking out the blablabla and advertising, puffery... is a "deal".
And everyone were scammed in this deal. No exception. Some just decided to accept because are convinced that its for the best or will argue that "knew".
But some don't. But it does not change the fact that the deal, which is this relationship between company x consumer through a contract was bogus and people were scammed. You can accept a company conning people because you don't care. But you have no right to say that they are wrong, because the fact remains. The rest is puffery... excuses. It does not matter, because are subjective.
Like I already said, delaying the release is intentional.
This one has a different subject but if you read through the 26 pages of the other thread you more or less have said the same thing. Was it really necessary to make another thread on the same shit? You didn't find the answer you were looking for or state your opinion enough within that 26 pages?
Deth to you ALL!