He judges a game based on fighting a few mobs: "I fought some mobs, they easy so game is shallow".
Complex crafting, trading, farming/breeding, weather, housing, pvp, world building, exploration, combat system? "So what, game is like shallow bro".
Go? "Black and white circles on a board, shallow. Get me some chess with dem knights and shit".
I get everything you are saying but I don't really think the crafting is complex. A lot of what you listed are cool and it does create a more diverse and vibrant experience but I wouldn't go on about how complex they are.
I think the game looks beautiful and the combat is a breath of fresh air compared to what you normally see. I do, however, have some realconcerns on the economic side of things but we'll see if they make some tweaks.
Black Desert is nice, but I can't do the kooky Asian stuff anymore. The horrid storyline, girly men, silly music, and sassy clothes just gets to me after a while.
I don't really see how it is shallow as there is a lot to do. Crafting, making items better, trading, breeding horses and mules, the leveling isn't just about leveling "level" but one must do different things to raise health, stamina and strength, one must have many conversations with npc's in order to open up quests or get items.
The fighting is based off of combos and the state of your enemy (down, up, stationary) can affect how much damage your attacks do.
That is nice it has some depth in it's systems but sometimes even that can be done badly.
I have seen tons of combo systems in my days most if not all are SOLO combos never utilizing the so called MMO world it is suppose to be.
Mentioning many conversations with npc's....well if that involves markers over their heads and arrows flashing in the air that completely ruins immersion of the systems and becomes more a single player game of connect the dots.
Hand holding needs to disappear from games,where in life have we ever seen some magical entity guiding us where to go and what to do every step of the way?The closest thing we have is stop lights telling us when to stop and go or a school bell telling you when to be in class or get the heck out of class :P
.Matter of FACT ,i bet if in real life your parent/s were tagging along with you telling you what to do every second you would freak out and lose it.NOBODY ever wants to be hand held to a direct path,people like to do their own thing and it is far worse when that linear path of hand holding is identical for every single player.It 100% ruins the immersion of being in a living world living YOUR own game.
Point being it is one thing to at least attempt some nice graphics,some depth ,some systems,but if you do it badly or just not very well,it ruins the entire atmosphere of the game and for some they see it in the first hour some take a month or so then begin to wonder why the world doesn't feel as immersive as it once did.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Black Desert is nice, but I can't do the kooky Asian stuff anymore. The horrid storyline, girly men, silly music, and sassy clothes just gets to me after a while.
The anime clothing style is quite toned down in BDO. Additionally, there are a good deal of calls to add cash-shop costumes to bring a more realistic look to some armor sets.
The worst ones', in my eyes, are probably the Ranger and Tamer. Most of the other sets are rather reserved.
I can simply point to NWO ,how many thought that world was nice looking and immersive with npc's wandering around?That game has combos as well,it even claimed to improve questing !!
Well how many still find that game as intriguing as the first few weeks you played it?Many of you are not even playing it anymore right?That is what i mean by initial feeling of a new game,it all appears great then nobody cares a couple months later.How about AION,remember the BUZZ over that game,looks amazing great game "WE LOVE" attitude was everywhere,well how many even care about that game now or play it ?
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I can simply point to NWO ,how many thought that world was nice looking and immersive with npc's wandering around?That game has combos as well,it even claimed to improve questing !!
Well how many still find that game as intriguing as the first few weeks you played it?Many of you are not even playing it anymore right?That is what i mean by initial feeling of a new game,it all appears great then nobody cares a couple months later.How about AION,remember the BUZZ over that game,looks amazing great game "WE LOVE" attitude was everywhere,well how many even care about that game now or play it ?
1, what the heck is nwo
2, I still play Aion though I don't like some of the things that NC Soft did with it.
3, you assume quite a bit (see #2)
4, I will say that people need to try Black Desert before buying or they might be disappointed. Either that or read everything they can and be very clear what the game offers, what it doesn't, be very clear what "they" the player have patience for and can "forgive" or "don't mind" and be very educated on the game.
edit: I'll add that I do agree with you on one thing. Other than having basic systems explained, I don't want to have big lights on a map or quest markers everywhere.
One of the reasons I love Morrowind.
Post edited by Sovrath on
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I think a lot of people assume the game is shallow when they just follow the main easily obtainable quests. If you do the NPC conversations and check the box that lets you receive all quest types you gets lots of other type quests that show you the sandbox aspect of the world. But if you are just questing and grinding to hit 50 to PVP of course you are going to be bored.
I played in CB1, and I made a remarkable observation.
The graphics are good, but not that much better than some other games out there. Just so you all understand, I have a fairly high end computer that was near state of the art for a single GPU system three years ago, so during this test I was able to keep very acceptable framerates, mostly in the 50+ range. I fired up ESO (my current game of choice) and put the graphics at utter maximum. Then I took a few screen shots and then compared them to some CB1 screenshots, with graphics also at maximum.
Environmentally, some things are better in ESO, and some things are better in BDO. That surprised me. On highest settings, water and grass looks better in ESO. Sky and mountains look better in BDO. The ground is a tossup, roads look better in BDO, the grass and rocks to the sides of the road look better in ESO. Items, such as boxes and vases are better in BDO, but the tables these things sit on look better in ESO.
BDO has better character models, hands down. It's not even close. But when you are staring at their butts for long periods of time (and not seeing those faces you put considerable time into customizing), this advantage becomes negligible.
So IMO, any advantage BDO has graphics wise will be long gone over the next few months as new games release. I give the BDO developers kudos for making such a beautiful game that does not require a horse of a computer to run at near maximum graphics.
So, now that I see that BDO's graphics advantage is minimal and will be surpassed by the next generation fairly soon, it is time to look at gameplay. ESO has far, far more depth of story than BDO. It is way ahead, with a well developed lore that is individual for each of the races in the game. BDO is good, and I liked the quest system up to level 20 (as far as I got) just fine. But it is obvious that ESO has better depth of story.
Combat is a mixed bag. Solo combat with the streamlined combos is more fun with BDO. Group combat is better in ESO. Both games have entertaining combat that makes the points where you are grinding for long periods of time a lot more tolerable. It would be nice if they had a 2nd taskbar that used ALT + number to activate, just to add powers you don't use much but still need readily available.
PvP - hmm, not sure about this. In ESO the servers are all PvE with a very large PvP zone, Cyrodil. I go into that zone a lot, and my friends and I have lots of fun there, but we know that when we leave the zone we don't have to worry about gankers. This is not so in BDO, but it is not a game breaker for me. I have 22+ years of PvP under my belt, including 7 consecutive years where I never played a non-PvP game. Being in an open world does give you the ability to 'punish' someone that is stealing your grind spot or the boss you have been waiting 20+ minutes to spawn or whatever. But it also means you get to deal with gankers...
All things considered, the beautiful graphics are not enough for me just yet. I'll probably play this game in the future, but I'll wait for my friends to get tired of ESO first and then we will all join together. Unless another game catches our eye in the meantime ...
The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!
The only advantage a game has over another is being newer than the other. That's why most don't release on the same day and are offset. B&S is due to go live in January. Everyone will play it because it's new, not because it's any different than the scores of MMOs already out there. They will have their fun and move on to the next new thing like they have with every other new release. Why? Because they can. BDO will have the same response as will any other title due to come out. Heck even Legion will garner it's usual influx of players... all because the content is new compared to WoD. Pretty much everyone on this site has hopped from game to game and complained that there is nothing to play (when in fact there are lots of games to play, just not new to them).
Enjoy BDO for what it is. It's worth the ~$30 hands down. It's not like you have anything better to do when it releases and you know it.
After reading through all the post, all I got to say is "man there are a lot of jaded and grumpy gamers in the mmo community".
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
After reading through all the post, all I got to say is "man there are a lot of jaded and grumpy gamers in the mmo community".
True that! You can't even make a suggestion with some MMO-hipster waiting to give his opinion. Note, hipsters suck in real life with their tattoos, vinyl records, and leather jackets(I'm joking of course).
In the past 15 years every single MMORPG I've played had something I enjoyed! Most of the games I played were given a second chance. I can honestly say that only 3 were played longer than a year which was Asheron's Call, World of Warcraft, and The Elder Scrolls Online.
There is one game I did not recommend upon it's release and that was Vanguard: Saga of Heroes. The best thing about that game was the diplomacy system, but other than that it was a mess.
EDIT: I thought I type up something that was more than a tangent. But I'm really looking forward to jumping into CBT2. When someone mentioned a seamless open-world and no instant dungeons, of course I'm going to be very curious.
I also saw another user in this topic say BDO makes you feel more like a resident. I think that's absolutely amazing. In The Old Republic my Jedi Knight was the hero of the galaxy, I stopped Molag Bal(sort of) from fully taking over Tamriel in ESO, and I can't really tell much about my hero in Tera because I was just smashing everything with my new Brawler.
While I love those games for specific reasons I never felt like I fully lived in them. Many of the "quality of life" changes brought by WoW and improved by others games made MMORPGs more accessible to me as I became an adult with responsibility. But overtime diminished the sense of community while playing these games.
I'm not saying that Black Desert Online doesn't have the same problem. But there just seems to be a lot of great ideas(I think) that remind me of the honeymoon period I had with some earlier MMORPGs. I wasn't just playing the game, I was temporarily living in another world.
Comments
I think the game looks beautiful and the combat is a breath of fresh air compared to what you normally see. I do, however, have some real concerns on the economic side of things but we'll see if they make some tweaks.
I have seen tons of combo systems in my days most if not all are SOLO combos never utilizing the so called MMO world it is suppose to be.
Mentioning many conversations with npc's....well if that involves markers over their heads and arrows flashing in the air that completely ruins immersion of the systems and becomes more a single player game of connect the dots.
Hand holding needs to disappear from games,where in life have we ever seen some magical entity guiding us where to go and what to do every step of the way?The closest thing we have is stop lights telling us when to stop and go or a school bell telling you when to be in class or get the heck out of class :P
.Matter of FACT ,i bet if in real life your parent/s were tagging along with you telling you what to do every second you would freak out and lose it.NOBODY ever wants to be hand held to a direct path,people like to do their own thing and it is far worse when that linear path of hand holding is identical for every single player.It 100% ruins the immersion of being in a living world living YOUR own game.
Point being it is one thing to at least attempt some nice graphics,some depth ,some systems,but if you do it badly or just not very well,it ruins the entire atmosphere of the game and for some they see it in the first hour some take a month or so then begin to wonder why the world doesn't feel as immersive as it once did.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
The worst ones', in my eyes, are probably the Ranger and Tamer. Most of the other sets are rather reserved.
Well how many still find that game as intriguing as the first few weeks you played it?Many of you are not even playing it anymore right?That is what i mean by initial feeling of a new game,it all appears great then nobody cares a couple months later.How about AION,remember the BUZZ over that game,looks amazing great game "WE LOVE" attitude was everywhere,well how many even care about that game now or play it ?
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
2, I still play Aion though I don't like some of the things that NC Soft did with it.
3, you assume quite a bit (see #2)
4, I will say that people need to try Black Desert before buying or they might be disappointed. Either that or read everything they can and be very clear what the game offers, what it doesn't, be very clear what "they" the player have patience for and can "forgive" or "don't mind" and be very educated on the game.
edit: I'll add that I do agree with you on one thing. Other than having basic systems explained, I don't want to have big lights on a map or quest markers everywhere.
One of the reasons I love Morrowind.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
The graphics are good, but not that much better than some other games out there. Just so you all understand, I have a fairly high end computer that was near state of the art for a single GPU system three years ago, so during this test I was able to keep very acceptable framerates, mostly in the 50+ range. I fired up ESO (my current game of choice) and put the graphics at utter maximum. Then I took a few screen shots and then compared them to some CB1 screenshots, with graphics also at maximum.
Environmentally, some things are better in ESO, and some things are better in BDO. That surprised me. On highest settings, water and grass looks better in ESO. Sky and mountains look better in BDO. The ground is a tossup, roads look better in BDO, the grass and rocks to the sides of the road look better in ESO. Items, such as boxes and vases are better in BDO, but the tables these things sit on look better in ESO.
BDO has better character models, hands down. It's not even close. But when you are staring at their butts for long periods of time (and not seeing those faces you put considerable time into customizing), this advantage becomes negligible.
So IMO, any advantage BDO has graphics wise will be long gone over the next few months as new games release. I give the BDO developers kudos for making such a beautiful game that does not require a horse of a computer to run at near maximum graphics.
So, now that I see that BDO's graphics advantage is minimal and will be surpassed by the next generation fairly soon, it is time to look at gameplay. ESO has far, far more depth of story than BDO. It is way ahead, with a well developed lore that is individual for each of the races in the game. BDO is good, and I liked the quest system up to level 20 (as far as I got) just fine. But it is obvious that ESO has better depth of story.
Combat is a mixed bag. Solo combat with the streamlined combos is more fun with BDO. Group combat is better in ESO. Both games have entertaining combat that makes the points where you are grinding for long periods of time a lot more tolerable. It would be nice if they had a 2nd taskbar that used ALT + number to activate, just to add powers you don't use much but still need readily available.
PvP - hmm, not sure about this. In ESO the servers are all PvE with a very large PvP zone, Cyrodil. I go into that zone a lot, and my friends and I have lots of fun there, but we know that when we leave the zone we don't have to worry about gankers. This is not so in BDO, but it is not a game breaker for me. I have 22+ years of PvP under my belt, including 7 consecutive years where I never played a non-PvP game. Being in an open world does give you the ability to 'punish' someone that is stealing your grind spot or the boss you have been waiting 20+ minutes to spawn or whatever. But it also means you get to deal with gankers...
All things considered, the beautiful graphics are not enough for me just yet. I'll probably play this game in the future, but I'll wait for my friends to get tired of ESO first and then we will all join together. Unless another game catches our eye in the meantime
The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!
Enjoy BDO for what it is. It's worth the ~$30 hands down. It's not like you have anything better to do when it releases and you know it.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
In the past 15 years every single MMORPG I've played had something I enjoyed! Most of the games I played were given a second chance. I can honestly say that only 3 were played longer than a year which was Asheron's Call, World of Warcraft, and The Elder Scrolls Online.
There is one game I did not recommend upon it's release and that was Vanguard: Saga of Heroes. The best thing about that game was the diplomacy system, but other than that it was a mess.
EDIT: I thought I type up something that was more than a tangent. But I'm really looking forward to jumping into CBT2. When someone mentioned a seamless open-world and no instant dungeons, of course I'm going to be very curious.
I also saw another user in this topic say BDO makes you feel more like a resident. I think that's absolutely amazing. In The Old Republic my Jedi Knight was the hero of the galaxy, I stopped Molag Bal(sort of) from fully taking over Tamriel in ESO, and I can't really tell much about my hero in Tera because I was just smashing everything with my new Brawler.
While I love those games for specific reasons I never felt like I fully lived in them. Many of the "quality of life" changes brought by WoW and improved by others games made MMORPGs more accessible to me as I became an adult with responsibility. But overtime diminished the sense of community while playing these games.
I'm not saying that Black Desert Online doesn't have the same problem. But there just seems to be a lot of great ideas(I think) that remind me of the honeymoon period I had with some earlier MMORPGs. I wasn't just playing the game, I was temporarily living in another world.