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Trion to rip gamers off with founders pack for Devilian.

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Comments

  • holdenhamletholdenhamlet Member EpicPosts: 3,766
    Trion is becoming a very bad company cash grabbing money mongers. 
    QFT.
  • stio89stio89 Member UncommonPosts: 85
    edited November 2015
    I'm not a fan of Trion, But Trove is the great example of how F2P should be, I hope it lasts. I used to think Rift was good F2P until they became greedy/fixated with the cash shop.
  • madazzmadazz Member RarePosts: 2,042
    olepi said:
    The real problem comes in when you buy a founder's pack for a game, and then when the game comes out, it is completely different. Or the founder's pack is in the cash shop for cheap after release. Or you buy a lifetime sub, and in 6 months it goes F2P.
    This happened to me with Albion Online. I purchased a founders pack based upon their original vision for it to be the second coming of UO. Instead, they lost their ways and bent to the community to sell said founders packs. Now the game is a mish mash of mods. It's not a seamless world. Its all zones. Lots and lots of safe zones. They even created private dungeons... so many things have strayed that they have even removed all of (maybe I missed one) the text that states they were inspired by UO and that was what they were aiming for. A place for UO vets to go.

    Now its a standard MMO that is cross-platform.

    I voiced how I was upset on the forums for being had. I didn't request any money back. I just shared how I was very disappointed regarding how they sold out so fast.
  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Member UncommonPosts: 253
    mgilbrtsn said:
    How can this be a ripoff.  You know what you get, and you can opt not to get it.  I understand, you don't like Trion.  At least make accurate statements.
    I'm going to play Devil's Advocate for a second, because...why not?

    Let's say you love yourself a nice hamburger, but you're completely incapable of making one yourself or learning how to make one.  McDonald's, in their infinite wisdom, starts charging $40+ for a fast food hamburger.  No problem, you decide.  McDonald's isn't the only burger joint in town.  I'll just go to Burger King.  You've made a perfectly reasonable and valid decision to opt out of paying $40+ for a McDonald's hamburger - fair enough.  So you stroll into Burger King ready to bite into the juiciest Whopper you've had in your life, and you see that the entire Burger King menu is now $40+.  "When...why did this happen," you ask.  The clerk explains (because in this universe every cashier at Burger King understands business decisions) that McDonald's started charging $40+ for every burger on their menu, and believe it or not some clowns were buying them.  Management decided that if McDonald's could charge $40+ for their burgers, then Burger King is just as qualified and capable.

    No problem, you think.  Not everyone is falling for this madness.  I'm going to go to Wendy's.  And now they're charging $40+ for their burgers.  So is every other burger joint in town for that matter.  And every clerk in every restaurant explains that it started with some clowns buying $40+ burgers from McDonald's.

    You can see the problem here.  The business of hamburgers wasn't influenced by your decision to not buy as much as it was influenced by other people making the decision to buy.  This is largely the way business decisions seem to be made.  People talk about "speaking with your wallet", but that's sort of a mixed position to take.  In truth not buying something is not speaking with your wallet, and if you're not speaking then nobody is listening to you.  Businesses make a decision and then seek out positive validation for their decisions.  They have a confirmation bias.

    In the above example it might have been perfectly acceptable to say you disliked McDonald's and not the practice of $40+ burgers when McDonald's was the only place doing it.  Once it became a common business practice it was no longer about a dislike of McDonald's though.  It became something bigger.
  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Member UncommonPosts: 253
    madazz said:
    ...they have even removed all of (maybe I missed one) the text that states they were inspired by UO and that was what they were aiming for. A place for UO vets to go.
    Not to say that it's definitely the case, because you're quite possibly right.  On the other hand, this may have been a legal issue and EA may have threatened them.
  • AkulasAkulas Member RarePosts: 2,659
    Don't buy founders pack.

    This isn't a signature, you just think it is.

  • LoveRemovalMachineLoveRemovalMachine Member UncommonPosts: 213
    edited November 2015
    [mod edit]
    [mod edit]
    I was so happy that I bought AA founders pack with paypal. I got my money back that I paid to Trion from Paypal after the 'Bait and switch' and all the other shit that happened.

    This was the first time I ever did such a thing but Trion took it to a level that I had no choice to get a refund.

    It was a trap and they tricked me!
    Post edited by Amana on
    We are always in a race what our intelligence can do for us and what our intelligence does to us.

  • SnoepieSnoepie Member UncommonPosts: 482
    trion ripped off players by making this pile of crap is a better topic lol
  • jitter77jitter77 Member UncommonPosts: 344
    I think it all boils down to jealousy and people's greed.  "Its not fair that Johnny can play early and I cant."  "Its not fair johnny has a uber epic sword and I dont."  Like many have said you are not forced to buy founders packs or beta / alpha access. I think most people who beta test do it just to play the game early, not to actually test / report on things.  If you cant control your urges enough to wait a few weeks or months to play a game and spend  $150 to play it NOW! that is on you not the company.  I just do not understand how people can complain about the prices.  I want to buy a mansion that costs $10 million dollars, but because I want it so bad and dont have the money I think they should give it to me for free.  I think it is a problem with society in general now everyone feels like they are entitled to everything instead of having to work / earn it.


  • holdenhamletholdenhamlet Member EpicPosts: 3,766
    Just because you have the option to not buy something doesn't mean it's not a rip-off.

    If that were the case then nothing but food or shelter could be considered a rip-off.
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 19,987
    Just because you have the option to not buy something doesn't mean it's not a rip-off.

    If that were the case then nothing but food or shelter could be considered a rip-off.
    That's true, but they lay out what they offer for the price. They're not making a quality claim. It's just a package of stuff. That makes the rip off part harder to claim. How exactly are they ripping people off? Rip off carries the connotation that someone didn't get what they paid for or got an unfair deal. I'm not seeing that here.
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

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  • holdenhamletholdenhamlet Member EpicPosts: 3,766
    Torval said:
    Just because you have the option to not buy something doesn't mean it's not a rip-off.

    If that were the case then nothing but food or shelter could be considered a rip-off.
    That's true, but they lay out what they offer for the price. They're not making a quality claim. It's just a package of stuff. That makes the rip off part harder to claim. How exactly are they ripping people off? Rip off carries the connotation that someone didn't get what they paid for or got an unfair deal. I'm not seeing that here.
    "Rip off" can also just mean something is grossly overpriced.  I guess you could say the deceit part of it is the game looks like crap and probably won't do well, and probably Trion knows this and is, as per the Trion way- grabbing cash where they can.

  • AthisarAthisar Member UncommonPosts: 666
    Trion knows it can charge stupid money for crap and people will pay for it. Those who think this is a terrible way to do business will continue thinking that and not spend money, those who think Trion can do no wrong will continue to suck up to them.

    Simply put, Trion doesn't really lose anything -- their reputation is already poor, but they keep cashing in on this stuff.
  • BigRamboBigRambo Member UncommonPosts: 191
    I'll never forgive Trion for kicking Petroglyph out of the End of Nations project.  May they one day shut down in eternal hell ! (I hate them even more than EA)  :) 
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 19,987
    Torval said:
    Just because you have the option to not buy something doesn't mean it's not a rip-off.

    If that were the case then nothing but food or shelter could be considered a rip-off.
    That's true, but they lay out what they offer for the price. They're not making a quality claim. It's just a package of stuff. That makes the rip off part harder to claim. How exactly are they ripping people off? Rip off carries the connotation that someone didn't get what they paid for or got an unfair deal. I'm not seeing that here.
    "Rip off" can also just mean something is grossly overpriced.  I guess you could say the deceit part of it is the game looks like crap and probably won't do well, and probably Trion knows this and is, as per the Trion way- grabbing cash where they can.

    The game looks like rubbish to me as well along with the standard end game raiding trope that is so overdone it's been overdone and overdone again. It's still not a rip off to me. You can see up front that the graphics are as presented. You know the end game is crap and it's a heavily monetized version of F2P. Overpriced is really subjective. I get what you're saying, but I just don't agree. To me a $40k Taurus or any Mercedes aren't worth the price charged, but I don't consider them rip offs.

    To me rip off means cheap low quality imitation or a deceitful business transaction. I can get where you're coming from though.
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • olepiolepi Member RarePosts: 1,441
    Trion is probably trying to rip off gamers again, but nobody has to fall for it.

    ------------
    2020: 43 years on the Net.


  • Vermillion_RaventhalVermillion_Raventhal Member EpicPosts: 4,099
    Some people have a strange view on ripping people off.  To me its being sold something that's misrepresented.  If you bought a car that broke down at 37k miles and was told the cars last 200k.  Everyones car broke down at 200k and the company knew this would happen. Its a rip off.  

    Bad video games are almost always a rip off.  The people who make the games know they're bad majority of the time and try to make them seem better in advertising.  

    For me a clear rip off game was Sim City 2013.  That game restricted play time until release so you couldn't see the horrible flaws it had.  This effect most players and reviewers. 
  • WarlyxWarlyx Member RarePosts: 3,047
    edited November 2015
    mgilbrtsn said:
    How can this be a ripoff.  You know what you get, and you can opt not to get it.  I understand, you don't like Trion.  At least make accurate statements.
    I'm going to play Devil's Advocate for a second, because...why not?

    Let's say you love yourself a nice hamburger, but you're completely incapable of making one yourself or learning how to make one.  McDonald's, in their infinite wisdom, starts charging $40+ for a fast food hamburger.  No problem, you decide.  McDonald's isn't the only burger joint in town.  I'll just go to Burger King.  You've made a perfectly reasonable and valid decision to opt out of paying $40+ for a McDonald's hamburger - fair enough.  So you stroll into Burger King ready to bite into the juiciest Whopper you've had in your life, and you see that the entire Burger King menu is now $40+.  "When...why did this happen," you ask.  The clerk explains (because in this universe every cashier at Burger King understands business decisions) that McDonald's started charging $40+ for every burger on their menu, and believe it or not some clowns were buying them.  Management decided that if McDonald's could charge $40+ for their burgers, then Burger King is just as qualified and capable.

    No problem, you think.  Not everyone is falling for this madness.  I'm going to go to Wendy's.  And now they're charging $40+ for their burgers.  So is every other burger joint in town for that matter.  And every clerk in every restaurant explains that it started with some clowns buying $40+ burgers from McDonald's.

    You can see the problem here.  The business of hamburgers wasn't influenced by your decision to not buy as much as it was influenced by other people making the decision to buy.  This is largely the way business decisions seem to be made.  People talk about "speaking with your wallet", but that's sort of a mixed position to take.  In truth not buying something is not speaking with your wallet, and if you're not speaking then nobody is listening to you.  Businesses make a decision and then seek out positive validation for their decisions.  They have a confirmation bias.

    In the above example it might have been perfectly acceptable to say you disliked McDonald's and not the practice of $40+ burgers when McDonald's was the only place doing it.  Once it became a common business practice it was no longer about a dislike of McDonald's though.  It became something bigger.
    thats true until u notice u sell 10 hamburges instead of 1M ..... losing tons of meat wasted , paying bills and employers for 10 burguers...

    Mcdonalds and the like sell TONS of cheap food thats how they make money
  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Member UncommonPosts: 253
    Skuall said:
    thats true until u notice u sell 10 hamburges instead of 1M ..... wasting meat and paying employs that are there for 10 persons....
    It's not a perfect analogy for a lot of reasons.  I couldn't think of a perfect analogy, and seeing as how it was more playing Devil's Advocate than a legitimate belief I didn't want to spend forever agonizing over the holes.

    To your point, though, these founders packs are selling.  Like it or hate it, people are buying them.  Some people will continue to buy them, and nobody's opinions or beliefs or ideas about it will change that.  I'm pretty indifferent to be honest.  I've never bought a founders pack for any MMO, and I never intend to buy one.  I have better things to do with my money than pay $150+ for early access to an unfinished game plus gain a few nonsense fringe benefits that will either be available or negated by the cash shop for much less than half the price.  It doesn't matter if they sell 10 founders packs or thousands.  Much like the hamburger analogy, all that matters is that they sell enough to change the standard practice - and they have to a large extent done so.
  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,768
    Just because you have the option to not buy something doesn't mean it's not a rip-off.

    If that were the case then nothing but food or shelter could be considered a rip-off.

    The point is you would be stupid to buy it if you aren't certain of what you are getting.  Being a lazy consumer is not an excuse.  Having to have the game right now is not an excuse.
    http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2010/QBlog190810A.html  

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  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Member UncommonPosts: 253
    Some people have a strange view on ripping people off.  To me its being sold something that's misrepresented.  If you bought a car that broke down at 37k miles and was told the cars last 200k.  Everyones car broke down at 200k and the company knew this would happen. Its a rip off.  

    Bad video games are almost always a rip off.  The people who make the games know they're bad majority of the time and try to make them seem better in advertising.  

    For me a clear rip off game was Sim City 2013.  That game restricted play time until release so you couldn't see the horrible flaws it had.  This effect most players and reviewers. 
    Bad games are just bad games.  They prove that marketing works.  The question is to what extent marketers have an obligation to honestly reflect the product being sold.  The line between company/marketing responsibility and consumer responsibility is a very, very blurry line.  At what point should consumers be held accountable for falling for deceptive marketing?  At what point is marketing too deceptive?  These are big questions, and they require a total evaluation of the purpose, intent, goals, and methods of marketing to truly resolve.
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 17,863
    I would like someone to ask these Publishers/developers ,what the heck is the meaning of an "Early access"?

    To me it would sound like a game not finished ,you are joining in the early stages,but we all know this is not true,these games seldom see but a whimper of improvement beyond the initial cash grabs.

    Early access simply means you get in before others and to do that you have to pay,i see no plausible reasoning for setting up such a money grab.To me it is like we have to start paying to be first into Wallmart...Oh wait a minute,you didn't pay me,wait outside the doors until paid people get in.


    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Member UncommonPosts: 253
    Wizardry said:
    I would like someone to ask these Publishers/developers ,what the heck is the meaning of an "Early access"?

    To me it would sound like a game not finished ,you are joining in the early stages,but we all know this is not true,these games seldom see but a whimper of improvement beyond the initial cash grabs.

    Early access simply means you get in before others and to do that you have to pay,i see no plausible reasoning for setting up such a money grab.To me it is like we have to start paying to be first into Wallmart...Oh wait a minute,you didn't pay me,wait outside the doors until paid people get in.
    Early access invites early adopters.  That way the early adopters have already played the game and evangelized it by the release date so that (hopefully) there will be mass market anticipation by launch day.
  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,277
    Wizardry said:
    I would like someone to ask these Publishers/developers ,what the heck is the meaning of an "Early access"?

    To me it would sound like a game not finished ,you are joining in the early stages,but we all know this is not true,these games seldom see but a whimper of improvement beyond the initial cash grabs.

    Early access simply means you get in before others and to do that you have to pay,i see no plausible reasoning for setting up such a money grab.To me it is like we have to start paying to be first into Wallmart...Oh wait a minute,you didn't pay me,wait outside the doors until paid people get in.


    Why ask a question you just answered? Money....
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